Dominion Strategy Forum
Miscellaneous => Forum Games => Mafia Game Threads => Topic started by: faust on May 17, 2018, 09:00:06 am
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Welcome to RMM48: Cancer Mafia!
Mod: faust
This is a semi-closed game for 14 players. Roles will be relatively simple (for RMM standards). Some more information will be provided in the next post.
Players:
1. EFHW
2. gkrieg13
3. iguanaiguana
4. Eevee
5. Awaclus
6. LaLight
7. SpaceAnemone
8. Hydrad
9. Jimmmmm
10. mcmcsalot
11. Robz888
12. DatSwan
13. Galzria
14. IDontPlayThisGame
Spectators tagged: 2.71828....., chairs
Day starts/ends:
General rules
Changes to the usual rule sets are marked in olive.
The Golden Rule:
Please remember that this is a game and your main objective is to have fun! Be considerate of each other, don’t get personal, and enjoy the game. Please read The Civility Pledge (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7695.0) before signing up for any mafia game on this site. If you have not /pledged there, you cannot play. Excessive personal attacks or uncivil behavior may be dealt with by modifiers or modkills.
1. General Gameplay and Etiquette:
1. You may not quote information (either real or fabricated) from any game-related source other than the thread you are posting in. This means no quotes from PMs and no quotes from QTs in the main thread or in another QT. Paraphrasing is acceptable. If you are unsure whether a post is legal, please ask the moderator before posting.
2. There is to be NO personal communication outside of the forum postings and the QTs specifically designed for this purpose.
3. As a general rule you should aim for one post every 12 hours, minimum, to keep the game moving.
2. Voting, Deadlines, and Player Death:
1. Day phases will last 7 days, Night lasts at least 48 hours. Night action deadline is 36 hours after night start.
2. A simple majority (rounded up) of all living members must agree on one person for a lynch to occur prior to deadline.
3. Once you have reached a simple majority no further unvoting will change someone’s fate. Further votes will also be ignored.
4. Once a player is lynched, the game enters twilight until the mod locks the thread; all players including the one who was lynched may continue to post during twilight.
5. If the deadline is hit without a player reaching the majority of votes, there will be no lynch.
6. Please submit votes as: Vote: PlayerName. Votes in another format may or may not be counted. This is up to the mod's discretion. Obvious abbreviations or nicknames will be counted so long as they are unambiguous.
7. Please submit vote revocations Unvote. Unvotes are not necessary before changing votes.
8. You may Vote: No Lynch - a simple majority of these vote types are required to send the game to Night phase without a lynch.
9. The third time town fails to lynch in a row, scum wins.
10. Any time you are dead (either via lynch or night kill) you may no longer post in the game or in shared Quicktopics. This means that you do not even get a “Bah” post. The dead in this game are silent.
11. If the thread is locked, you may not post. Threads can be locked for various reasons, but no matter what the reason, you may not post. The mod may forget to lock the thread, but if they say it is locked, it is still locked.
3. Miscellaneous/Mechanics:
1. Bold, olive text is reserved for the mod. No invisible/small text is allowed, nor is cryptography.
2. If you have an issue/problem with the game, please discuss this in your role QT. Do not post issues/complaints in the game thread.
3. The Mods may make mistakes - please point out any mistakes gently. Mistakes will be corrected where possible, but sometimes mistakes are made that cannot be reversed. These will stand as final to be commiserated over after the game.
4. Please bold all requests to the Mods so that they don’t get missed.
5. Prods of missing players may be issued after 24 hours of no activity. A prodded player has 24 hours to respond or risks replacement. A player who has been prodded 2 times is subject to replacement under rule 3.9 without further notice. Players with announced VLA are exempt from this rule the first time it happens.
6. If you anticipate being unavailable for more than a 48-hour period please post a notice to that effect in the thread. Treat this game as a commitment. Be considerate – don’t leave us hanging. Players who fail to post for 48 hours without an announcement risk being subject to replacement and/or being modkilled without further notice.
7. Please do not discuss ongoing games, it can unintentionally affect the other game. Do not discuss this game in any thread that is not directly related to it.
8. Rule violations will be dealt with according to their severity, which may include modkill(s) if needed.
9. Players who discover they are too busy to play in a game or want to leave the game for civility issues are not allowed to officially /out in the thread. A request to /out must only be done via a post in the role QT. Please do not use this as a manipulation technique. (Note players may continue to threaten to /out or imply that they might as long as it does not include an official request). Requests to /out are final once submitted. There will be no /outing and then /inning back into the game so make sure that when you /out you have thought it through and really want to do it. Players that can't be replaced will simply be mod-killed. Whether your request to /out will lead to replacement or a modkill is up to the mod's discretion.
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Setup Info
This game has exactly 2 factions, mafia and town. The mafia consists of 4 players.
The mafia has a special ability on top of their factional kill: Each time a member of the mafia successfully performs the factional kill, their role changes to the role of their victim (but the alignment stays the same). This is not optional. The role changes at the end of the night, after the resolution phase, but before day start.
Players flip with their flavor and role name. Role names have been kept close to standard nomenclature whenever possible. Mafia will only flip with their original role, not any one they may have received due to their special ability.
Mafia does not have daychat.
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/in
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/in
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/in
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In
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/in
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/in
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/in :-)
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/in
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In
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/in
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/out
Sorry
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/in
Setup sounds really fun
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/in
(Robz is in for RM, what?????)
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/in
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Note: I am travelling over the weekend, so likely this game will not start before Tuesday.
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Tentative /in - I want to play, but my activity will be chairs-style low-posting, probably. If that's ok I'll join.
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Considering.
My work crisis has been temporarily averted... at least until July/August.
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Considering.
My work crisis has been temporarily averted... at least until July/August.
Do it! Joining this game is a huuuuuuuuuuuuge mistake for me professionally, but YOLO/FOMO.
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I am giving all floater a heads up, this ends in a XXR hammer if it goes past Wednesday :P
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/in again if that's okay. I didn't want to play two games at once and, well, now I'm not.
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/In I suppose.
Is that hammer?
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Tentative /in - I want to play, but my activity will be chairs-style low-posting, probably. If that's ok I'll join.
Rules are thus:
3. As a general rule you should aim for one post every 12 hours, minimum, to keep the game moving.
5. Prods of missing players may be issued after 24 hours of no activity. A prodded player has 24 hours to respond or risks replacement. A player who has been prodded 2 times is subject to replacement under rule 3.9 without further notice. Players with announced VLA are exempt from this rule the first time it happens.
6. If you anticipate being unavailable for more than a 48-hour period please post a notice to that effect in the thread. Treat this game as a commitment. Be considerate – don’t leave us hanging. Players who fail to post for 48 hours without an announcement risk being subject to replacement and/or being modkilled without further notice.
If you think you can manage this without risk of being force-replaced, feel free to join. Otherwise, I would offer the slot to someone else. [i.e. Galzria]
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/tag
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Since chairs has not replied, I will give the spot to Galzria. PMs will be released in some hours.
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PMs going out now! Thread locked except for tags.
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Night 0 begins now and lasts 24 hours.
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Alex hadn't been feeling very well for the best part of a week. First it was just bellyache, which they chalked down to some less-than-fresh leftover food, but then came nausea, and recently they found that their urine took a strange reddish color. Given all that, they decided it would probably be best to see a doctor.
Day 1 begins!
Vote Count 1.0
Not Voting (14): EFHW, gkrieg13, iguanaiguana, Eevee, Awaclus, LaLight, SpaceAnemone, Hydrad, Jimmmmm, mcmcsalot, Robz888, DatSwan, Galzria, IDontPlayThisGame
With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day 1 ends May 31, 2018, 06:00:00 am
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First!
And now bed. It's 3:30am.
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vote: Galzria for not voting this close to deadline.
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And just a heads up, I will not be around for said deadline.
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Day 1 ends May 31, 2018, 06:00:00 am
Thanks, man, I appreciate that a lot.
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Things aren't looking good for Alex.
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Heyoo! I’ve played with everyone before (great group of players btw!), which ought to make day 1 easier. I’m excited for this game!
That’s probably a tough deadline for the americans? I can make it on.
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That’s probably a tough deadline for the americans? I can make it on.
It's only fair. Most of the deadlines have been bad for Europe.
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Yea deadline is interesting but shouldn't be a huge problem I should be able to make it if absolutely needed but we should just try to be proactive.
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Ya definitely won’t make that deadline. More of an early bird here. I wonder if Alex is a boy or a girl.
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First RMM game in a looooooooooong time. It's permissible to just act crazy and post nonsense, yes?
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Ya definitely won’t make that deadline. More of an early bird here. I wonder if Alex is a boy or a girl.
Isn't the deadline early? 6am forum time, unless you are on the west coast or something.
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First RMM game in a looooooooooong time. It's permissible to just act crazy and post nonsense, yes?
No massclaim comment? vote: robz
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This is true, Vote: Robz
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Ya definitely won’t make that deadline. More of an early bird here. I wonder if Alex is a boy or a girl.
Isn't the deadline early? 6am forum time, unless you are on the west coast or something.
I am on the west coast or something... I also didn't notice that faust had used the [time] tag, so I assumed that it was midnight my time...
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Also vote: Robz. This quick lynching thing works more often than it doesn't!
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Gkrieg thirsty for blood right out of the gate!
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Hi All!
Vote: Eevee because I haven't been in a game with him in ages :-)
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Ya definitely won’t make that deadline. More of an early bird here. I wonder if Alex is a boy or a girl.
Isn't the deadline early? 6am forum time, unless you are on the west coast or something.
I am on the west coast or something... I also didn't notice that faust had used the [time] tag, so I assumed that it was midnight my time...
Awaclus was lobbying for the use of something other than "forum time" somewhere else recently, but think there's a non-zero chance that the use of the [time] tag will generate more collective confusion elsewhere than it solves for Awclus. Unless we talk lots about the fact faust's using it, in which case people will have no excuse for not being around at such a refreshingly normal deadline time :-)
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I think it's pretty easy to notice the usage of the [time] tag from the fact that it uses hh:mm:ss, whereas people only ever use hh:mm or just hh.
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Also vote: Robz. This quick lynching thing works more often than it doesn't!
Wagons!
vote: Robz L-4
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As for the time, I'm glad someone brought it up because I missed it (people tend to use forum time which is also my timezone). Hopefully it won't cause issues now that everyone knows about it.
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Hey everyone, good to be back again and not finally be scum. vote: idptg
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Having a pretty rough day... :(
Some of you are probably scum. Maybe like 4 or so
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Why is it 6:00:00 for everyone? Do i not understand how the tag’s working?
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Hihi.
Vote: gkrieg
For obvious reasons.
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As for the time, I'm glad someone brought it up because I missed it (people tend to use forum time which is also my timezone). Hopefully it won't cause issues now that everyone knows about it.
We could try to put deadlines at 6-8 pm forum time. Given the frequent propensity for late hours among our group, that might catch almost everyone awake. Jimmmmm would have to get up in the morning.
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I can get on for that time too.
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Why is it 6:00:00 for everyone? Do i not understand how the tag’s working?
Wait is is not 06:00:00 for you? If so I am guessing the tag makes the time show up as whatever time zone you are in. If it is 06:00:00 for everyone that is just forum time.
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Yeah, the tag shows it in your timezone. If your timezone is forum time, it shows it in forum time. It shows 13:00:00 for me.
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Yeah, the tag shows it in your timezone. If your timezone is forum time, it shows it in forum time. It shows 13:00:00 for me.
Oh cool, that makes sense. I'm on forum time so I didn't notice a difference but I like the idea.
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Hey Everyone!
Gonna be a little absent-y today/tomorrow (girlfriend is graduating), but I will read along and be back after Saturday afternoon.
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Yeah, the tag shows it in your timezone. If your timezone is forum time, it shows it in forum time. It shows 13:00:00 for me.
Oh cool, that makes sense. I'm on forum time so I didn't notice a difference but I like the idea.
I'm not on forum time, but it shows 6:00am for me.
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Yeah, the tag shows it in your timezone. If your timezone is forum time, it shows it in forum time. It shows 13:00:00 for me.
Oh cool, that makes sense. I'm on forum time so I didn't notice a difference but I like the idea.
I'm not on forum time, but it shows 6:00am for me.
So is it 6:00am FT or 9:00am FT?
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Yeah, the tag shows it in your timezone. If your timezone is forum time, it shows it in forum time. It shows 13:00:00 for me.
Oh cool, that makes sense. I'm on forum time so I didn't notice a difference but I like the idea.
I'm not on forum time, but it shows 6:00am for me.
So is it 6:00am FT or 9:00am FT?
It is 6 am forum time. You can set your time zone under Profile -> Modify Profile -> Look and Layout -> Time Offset.
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Also vote: Robz. This quick lynching thing works more often than it doesn't!
Wagons!
vote: Robz L-4
It's actually L-3 because if I get to L-1 Galz will auto-hammer me.
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Also vote: Robz. This quick lynching thing works more often than it doesn't!
Wagons!
vote: Robz L-3 (it'd be 4 but Galz is in the game)
Fixed
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Also vote: Robz. This quick lynching thing works more often than it doesn't!
Wagons!
vote: Robz L-4
It's actually L-3 because if I get to L-1 Galz will auto-hammer me.
You don't think he's learned his lesson there?
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I’m missing all these references! What game has Robz been bad in?
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Also vote: Robz. This quick lynching thing works more often than it doesn't!
Wagons!
vote: Robz L-4
It's actually L-3 because if I get to L-1 Galz will auto-hammer me.
You don't think he's learned his lesson there?
Wanna test?
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I’m missing all these references! What game has Robz been bad in?
I've auto hammered every chance I've had in M113, M114 & M115. The first two I was town. The most recent I was scum. In 115 I was more or less policy lynched for it. But mileage obviously varies, sooo...
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Why are you doing that?
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Yeah, the tag shows it in your timezone. If your timezone is forum time, it shows it in forum time. It shows 13:00:00 for me.
Oh cool, that makes sense. I'm on forum time so I didn't notice a difference but I like the idea.
I'm not on forum time, but it shows 6:00am for me.
So is it 6:00am FT or 9:00am FT?
It is 6 am forum time. You can set your time zone under Profile -> Modify Profile -> Look and Layout -> Time Offset.
Yeah, but who would want to do that? It's super-useful to have forum time showing as the timestamp in the top right corner of the page, because every other game I've ever seen has given times in FT :-P
Now you're just sounding like one of those people arguing for keeping the imperial system.
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As for the time, I'm glad someone brought it up because I missed it (people tend to use forum time which is also my timezone). Hopefully it won't cause issues now that everyone knows about it.
We could try to put deadlines at 6-8 pm forum time. Given the frequent propensity for late hours among our group, that might catch almost everyone awake. Jimmmmm would have to get up in the morning.
8pm forum time is 1am in the UK, and faust, Awaclus and LL (and Eevee?) are all one or two hours ahead of me... I think even 6pm is a bit late for a convenient our side of the pond.
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I’m missing all these references! What game has Robz been bad in?
Galz was bad. Robz has been on good behavior.
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I’m missing all these references! What game has Robz been bad in?
I've auto hammered every chance I've had in M113, M114 & M115. The first two I was town. The most recent I was scum. In 115 I was more or less policy lynched for it. But mileage obviously varies, sooo...
Thats an interesting strategy. I'll have to remember that this game so i don't accidentally lynch someone at L-1.
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Now I'm curious. would you auto hammer yourself Galz?
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Now I'm curious. would you auto hammer yourself Galz?
Lets see vote: galz
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Why are you doing that?
Situations have varied. In the two town games it was a combination of either being close to a deadline, or legitimately finding the player scummy and not wanting them to slip the noose. In the scum game it was a combination of both mimicry towards my town games, as well as the fact that it placed us into MyLo.
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Now I'm curious. would you auto hammer yourself Galz?
Of course not. The hammers haven't been arbitrary - each one had a legitimate reasoning behind it. Self hammering is just silly.
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Now I'm curious. would you auto hammer yourself Galz?
Of course not. The hammers haven't been arbitrary - each one had a legitimate reasoning behind it. Self hammering is just silly.
Ok thats fair.
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Heh, I must admit I thought Galzria had gone silly. The actual explanation is pretty fun too.
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Now I'm curious. would you auto hammer yourself Galz?
Lets see vote: galz
Last I heard, Galz was against self-hammers on the grounds that hammering an IC isn't a good idea.
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Deadline is fine for me. Vote: Awaclus
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can't tell if we are just complaining about the DL or trying to do something. consider me down for whatever the majority wants. I have weird work/sleep hours so it is hard to pick bad for me.
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OK so who wants to massclaim?
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Vote Count 1.1
Robz888 (3): Robz888, gkrieg13, IDontPlayThisGame
Eevee (1): SpaceAnemone
IDontPlayThisGame (1): LaLight
gkrieg13 (1): Hydrad
Galrzia (1): mcmcsalot
Awaclus (1): Jimmmmm
Not Voting (6): EFHW, iguanaiguana, Eevee, Awaclus, DatSwan, Galzria
With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day 1 ends May 31, 2018, 06:00:00 am
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OK so who wants to massclaim?
Probably Robz (but not MC)... oh and probably skum
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OK so who wants to massclaim?
Not me!
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Vote: McMc "for reactions"
DatSwan seems a little town so far
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I’m missing all these references! What game has Robz been bad in?
Robz has been trash town (like most everyone else tbh) and we keep lynching him thinking he is scum trying to emulate his trash town meta thats in his signature and he keeps flipping town. It is awful
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I’m missing all these references! What game has Robz been bad in?
Robz has been trash town (like most everyone else tbh) and we keep lynching him thinking he is scum trying to emulate his trash town meta thats in his signature and he keeps flipping town. It is awful
I'm here to reverse the curse!
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I’m missing all these references! What game has Robz been bad in?
Robz has been trash town (like most everyone else tbh) and we keep lynching him thinking he is scum trying to emulate his trash town meta thats in his signature and he keeps flipping town. It is awful
I'm here to reverse the curse!
Me too!
!esruc
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I would very much like to vote: Eevee
Call it gut
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I’m missing all these references! What game has Robz been bad in?
Robz has been trash town (like most everyone else tbh) and we keep lynching him thinking he is scum trying to emulate his trash town meta thats in his signature and he keeps flipping town. It is awful
I'm here to reverse the curse!
Someone has been watching Survivor!
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I would very much like to vote: Eevee
Call it gut
Good gut or scum gut?`
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I’m missing all these references! What game has Robz been bad in?
Robz has been trash town (like most everyone else tbh) and we keep lynching him thinking he is scum trying to emulate his trash town meta thats in his signature and he keeps flipping town. It is awful
I'm here to reverse the curse!
Someone has been watching Survivor!
No spoilers! I'm half a season behind.
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I would very much like to vote: Eevee
Call it gut
Can you spell out the gut feeling?
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I would very much like to vote: Eevee
Call it gut
Can you spell out the gut feeling?
inb4 awaclus "t-h-e-g-u-t-f-e-e-l-i-n-g"
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I would very much like to vote: Eevee
Call it gut
More survivor references!
Vote: LL Why would town vote for me, right?
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I’m missing all these references! What game has Robz been bad in?
Robz has been trash town (like most everyone else tbh) and we keep lynching him thinking he is scum trying to emulate his trash town meta thats in his signature and he keeps flipping town. It is awful
I'm here to reverse the curse!
Someone has been watching Survivor!
No spoilers! I'm half a season behind.
That one person gets voted out and it's epic!!!!
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vote: eevee for omgus
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I would very much like to vote: Eevee
Call it gut
More survivor references!
So if town wins, does Alex survive?
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I wonder if Alex is a boy or a girl?
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I wonder if Alex is a boy or a girl?
Alex might not be either.
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I wonder if Alex is a boy or a girl?
Alex might not be either.
Very true!
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I wonder if Alex is a boy or a girl?
Alex might not be either.
On that note, does anyone know why when specifying which pronouns a person uses why they say both the subjective and the objective pronoun? Like why use he/him, or she/her, or they/them instead of just saying he, or she, or they? This came up in Gloomhaven the other day where one of the classes is genderless and uses it as a pronoun, which in the form people usually give their pronouns in is it/it, which doesn't seem right.
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I wonder if Alex is a boy or a girl?
Alex might not be either.
On that note, does anyone know why when specifying which pronouns a person uses why they say both the subjective and the objective pronoun? Like why use he/him, or she/her, or they/them instead of just saying he, or she, or they? This came up in Gloomhaven the other day where one of the classes is genderless and uses it as a pronoun, which in the form people usually give their pronouns in is it/it, which doesn't seem right.
I don't think this is really the place for a prolonged discussion on this, but in my experience part of it is making life easier for people ("here are my pronouns" rather than "this is one of my pronouns, you know the others") when you're asking them to respect your identity and sometimes people don't use the "standard" three (i.e. he/him/theirs). For example, I use he/him/his but dislike being called Mr. (although I don't ask that people use Ms.). Also, stating the full three explicitly tells people what you would like them to use so there isn't any doubt ("oh, I used he but Alex asked me to use her, does that apply to the other pronouns as well?").
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wait what if we claimed VT or not VT.
Do we thing VT's even exist in this RMM game?
I don't know but either way most people will probably have a role right? So its not like scum can really pick the powerful role by us claiming. Plus that means if we do get to claiming scum can't back out of a claim by saying they are VT if they can't think of a good fakeclaim. (I know I suck at fakeclaiming).
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I wonder if Alex is a boy or a girl?
I think that was left purposely ambiguous. They could be neither.
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wait what if we claimed VT or not VT.
Do we thing VT's even exist in this RMM game?
I don't know but either way most people will probably have a role right? So its not like scum can really pick the powerful role by us claiming. Plus that means if we do get to claiming scum can't back out of a claim by saying they are VT if they can't think of a good fakeclaim. (I know I suck at fakeclaiming).
What would the benefit be?
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wait what if we claimed VT or not VT.
Do we thing VT's even exist in this RMM game?
I don't know but either way most people will probably have a role right? So its not like scum can really pick the powerful role by us claiming. Plus that means if we do get to claiming scum can't back out of a claim by saying they are VT if they can't think of a good fakeclaim. (I know I suck at fakeclaiming).
vote: Hydrad I don't see how claiming anything helps town.
I wonder if Alex is a boy or a girl?
I think that was left purposely ambiguous. They could be neither.
Definitely.
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VT/not VT would tell scum where to direct their kills, we don’t want that. Bad plans come from town more often than not though.
Long live Alex.
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Bad plans come from town more often than not though.
....which makes proposing bad plans great for scum.
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Bad plans come from town more often than not though.
....which makes proposing bad plans great for scum.
I'm not that high level.
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Although I still think its a fine plan. But I guess I didn't really expect it to go through.
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I have no idea what is happening in this game.
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I have no idea what is happening in this game.
nothing really yet.
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VT/not VT would tell scum where to direct their kills, we don’t want that. Bad plans come from town more often than not though.
Long live Alex.
I'm developing a pet peeve about "town does this" statements. I find it odd that anyone!Hydrad would suggest this.
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Bad plans come from town more often than not though.
....which makes proposing bad plans great for scum.
I'm not that high level.
Please show me a grouping of three people in this game (not including yourself, obviously) where none of the players are at whatever level you think is sufficient for coming up with the idea to push a bad plan.
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Although I still think its a fine plan. But I guess I didn't really expect it to go through.
If you think it's a good plan, why wouldn't you expect people to recognize that it's a good plan and make it happen? Do you have that little faith in us? Which is odd considering you're claiming not to be, "that high level".
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Although I still think its a fine plan. But I guess I didn't really expect it to go through.
If you think it's a good plan, why wouldn't you expect people to recognize that it's a good plan and make it happen? Do you have that little faith in us? Which is odd considering you're claiming not to be, "that high level".
Because I'm usually pro claim many times. But it almost always gets shot down. So while I am always fine with it I realize that most other people aren't willing to do it.
But I still like to ask and see if people will do it.
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Although I still think its a fine plan. But I guess I didn't really expect it to go through.
If you think it's a good plan, why wouldn't you expect people to recognize that it's a good plan and make it happen? Do you have that little faith in us? Which is odd considering you're claiming not to be, "that high level".
Because I'm usually pro claim many times. But it almost always gets shot down. So while I am always fine with it I realize that most other people aren't willing to do it.
But I still like to ask and see if people will do it.
You still haven't said what benefits you see in the plan.
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On that note, does anyone know why when specifying which pronouns a person uses why they say both the subjective and the objective pronoun?
Not sure, though I'd guess it's to help people understand how the cases go. There are some spivak-type pronouns that differ in the possessive part, but I don't know of ones where the objective case isn't uniquely defined by the subjective.
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Presumably, the main things governing whether people want to claim are how much they like solving setups (rather that just trying to catch people out for "sounding scummy"), and how much extra information they feel their role gives them compared to what they think the average role will have.
Scum is clearly at an advantage for the latter point, because they get to know what the roles of themselves and their three buddies are, assuming they're all in a faction QT. Though 4/14 scums seems pretty strong, especially when they can essentially eat the roles of the rest of us, so I wonder whether any of them start out with nerfs. Still, with them able to eat our roles, I don't think letting on the relative strengths of our powers is a good idea even if we have a decent level of protection available to help us keep strong town roles in alive townies' hands, because I don't think faust would design a game that could be easily solved by town just by revealing stuff.
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I agree with Space. Any kind of claiming is just giving scum more direction.
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Presumably, the main things governing whether people want to claim are how much they like solving setups (rather that just trying to catch people out for "sounding scummy"), and how much extra information they feel their role gives them compared to what they think the average role will have.
Scum is clearly at an advantage for the latter point, because they get to know what the roles of themselves and their three buddies are, assuming they're all in a faction QT. Though 4/14 scums seems pretty strong, especially when they can essentially eat the roles of the rest of us, so I wonder whether any of them start out with nerfs. Still, with them able to eat our roles, I don't think letting on the relative strengths of our powers is a good idea even if we have a decent level of protection available to help us keep strong town roles in alive townies' hands, because I don't think faust would design a game that could be easily solved by town just by revealing stuff.
Good post, this is my thoughts on claiming as well.
I’m out of access for the next 36-48 hours.
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Presumably, the main things governing whether people want to claim are how much they like solving setups (rather that just trying to catch people out for "sounding scummy"), and how much extra information they feel their role gives them compared to what they think the average role will have.
Scum is clearly at an advantage for the latter point, because they get to know what the roles of themselves and their three buddies are, assuming they're all in a faction QT. Though 4/14 scums seems pretty strong, especially when they can essentially eat the roles of the rest of us, so I wonder whether any of them start out with nerfs. Still, with them able to eat our roles, I don't think letting on the relative strengths of our powers is a good idea even if we have a decent level of protection available to help us keep strong town roles in alive townies' hands, because I don't think faust would design a game that could be easily solved by town just by revealing stuff.
Ok. that makes sense.
Ya I guess I didn't factor in the fact that scum steals the roles they kill this time. But I wouldn't be surprised if even if they didn't steal the roles that we shouldn't claim.
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I’ve fallen behind already, sorry! I should have some time for this later, if boozy brunch doesn’t take me out of commission.
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I'm off work tomorrow and Monday without any real plans, so I'll be back in the action then.
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Presumably, the main things governing whether people want to claim are how much they like solving setups (rather that just trying to catch people out for "sounding scummy"), and how much extra information they feel their role gives them compared to what they think the average role will have.
Scum is clearly at an advantage for the latter point, because they get to know what the roles of themselves and their three buddies are, assuming they're all in a faction QT. Though 4/14 scums seems pretty strong, especially when they can essentially eat the roles of the rest of us, so I wonder whether any of them start out with nerfs. Still, with them able to eat our roles, I don't think letting on the relative strengths of our powers is a good idea even if we have a decent level of protection available to help us keep strong town roles in alive townies' hands, because I don't think faust would design a game that could be easily solved by town just by revealing stuff.
Ok. that makes sense.
Ya I guess I didn't factor in the fact that scum steals the roles they kill this time. But I wouldn't be surprised if even if they didn't steal the roles that we shouldn't claim.
What benefits did you see to the plan that offset scum knowing which PRs to snipe/play around?
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vote: hydrad
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Presumably, the main things governing whether people want to claim are how much they like solving setups (rather that just trying to catch people out for "sounding scummy"), and how much extra information they feel their role gives them compared to what they think the average role will have.
Scum is clearly at an advantage for the latter point, because they get to know what the roles of themselves and their three buddies are, assuming they're all in a faction QT. Though 4/14 scums seems pretty strong, especially when they can essentially eat the roles of the rest of us, so I wonder whether any of them start out with nerfs. Still, with them able to eat our roles, I don't think letting on the relative strengths of our powers is a good idea even if we have a decent level of protection available to help us keep strong town roles in alive townies' hands, because I don't think faust would design a game that could be easily solved by town just by revealing stuff.
Ok. that makes sense.
Ya I guess I didn't factor in the fact that scum steals the roles they kill this time. But I wouldn't be surprised if even if they didn't steal the roles that we shouldn't claim.
What benefits did you see to the plan that offset scum knowing which PRs to snipe/play around?
Kinda what I said before. The fact that scum probably has scummy roles so they either have to think of a fake claim that sounds believable or claim VT. And I guess I was basing it on my experiences but me personally. I can never think of good fakeclaims at all and when I attempt to fakeclaim it either is seen through right away or I claim VT and people narrow it down to me.
But I'm not sure if thats a common problem for other people or if its just me.
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vote: hydrad
Unfortunate
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Well, we don't have any idea how good massclaim is because we don't know what the setup is, beyond what we know about our own roles. So we can't really make an informed decision. Scum is able to make a slightly more informed decision. That's why I think that if we just decide normally, scum is able to influence that decision, and then we make the decision that's most beneficial for scum, whichever it is. Instead, I think we should just decide it randomly with a 50/50 chance.
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Well, we don't have any idea how good massclaim is because we don't know what the setup is, beyond what we know about our own roles. So we can't really make an informed decision. Scum is able to make a slightly more informed decision. That's why I think that if we just decide normally, scum is able to influence that decision, and then we make the decision that's most beneficial for scum, whichever it is. Instead, I think we should just decide it randomly with a 50/50 chance.
Can you please point me to a game where a massclaim caught scum?
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Well, we don't have any idea how good massclaim is because we don't know what the setup is, beyond what we know about our own roles. So we can't really make an informed decision. Scum is able to make a slightly more informed decision. That's why I think that if we just decide normally, scum is able to influence that decision, and then we make the decision that's most beneficial for scum, whichever it is. Instead, I think we should just decide it randomly with a 50/50 chance.
Can you please point me to a game where a D1 massclaim caught scum?
Fixed a thing
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Well, we don't have any idea how good massclaim is because we don't know what the setup is, beyond what we know about our own roles. So we can't really make an informed decision. Scum is able to make a slightly more informed decision. That's why I think that if we just decide normally, scum is able to influence that decision, and then we make the decision that's most beneficial for scum, whichever it is. Instead, I think we should just decide it randomly with a 50/50 chance.
Can you please point me to a game where a D1 massclaim caught scum?
Fixed a thing
Why do you think this game is like other games? The setup is closed and it's an RMM.
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Well, we don't have any idea how good massclaim is because we don't know what the setup is, beyond what we know about our own roles. So we can't really make an informed decision. Scum is able to make a slightly more informed decision. That's why I think that if we just decide normally, scum is able to influence that decision, and then we make the decision that's most beneficial for scum, whichever it is. Instead, I think we should just decide it randomly with a 50/50 chance.
Can you please point me to a game where a D1 massclaim caught scum?
Fixed a thing
Why do you think this game is like other games? The setup is closed and it's an RMM.
Are you saying this game of mafia is entirely unlike any other game of mafia?
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Well, we don't have any idea how good massclaim is because we don't know what the setup is, beyond what we know about our own roles. So we can't really make an informed decision. Scum is able to make a slightly more informed decision. That's why I think that if we just decide normally, scum is able to influence that decision, and then we make the decision that's most beneficial for scum, whichever it is. Instead, I think we should just decide it randomly with a 50/50 chance.
Can you please point me to a game where a D1 massclaim caught scum?
Fixed a thing
Why do you think this game is like other games? The setup is closed and it's an RMM.
Are you saying this game of mafia is entirely unlike any other game of mafia?
No, I'm saying that we don't know what it's like.
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Well, we don't have any idea how good massclaim is because we don't know what the setup is, beyond what we know about our own roles. So we can't really make an informed decision. Scum is able to make a slightly more informed decision. That's why I think that if we just decide normally, scum is able to influence that decision, and then we make the decision that's most beneficial for scum, whichever it is. Instead, I think we should just decide it randomly with a 50/50 chance.
Can you please point me to a game where a D1 massclaim caught scum?
Fixed a thing
Why do you think this game is like other games? The setup is closed and it's an RMM.
Are you saying this game of mafia is entirely unlike any other game of mafia?
No, I'm saying that we don't know what it's like.
I think we do know what it's like, given that it's labelled RMM instead of M, BM, or Z and the set-up is semiclosed, not closed.
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Well, we don't have any idea how good massclaim is because we don't know what the setup is, beyond what we know about our own roles. So we can't really make an informed decision. Scum is able to make a slightly more informed decision. That's why I think that if we just decide normally, scum is able to influence that decision, and then we make the decision that's most beneficial for scum, whichever it is. Instead, I think we should just decide it randomly with a 50/50 chance.
Can you please point me to a game where a D1 massclaim caught scum?
Fixed a thing
Why do you think this game is like other games? The setup is closed and it's an RMM.
Are you saying this game of mafia is entirely unlike any other game of mafia?
No, I'm saying that we don't know what it's like.
I think we do know what it's like, given that it's labelled RMM instead of M, BM, or Z and the set-up is semiclosed, not closed.
No, it's closed. Semi means that the mod gives a list of possible roles that the actual setup is randomized from.
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Eh, I guess faust says it's "semi-closed" in the OP. The actual setup is still pretty much just closed though.
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Oh hey, I exist. I should post a vla
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Eh, I guess faust says it's "semi-closed" in the OP. The actual setup is still pretty much just closed though.
I agree it is much closer to closed.
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vote: hydrad
I can’t decide if this fits your town meta or not.
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Vote: gkrieg13
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Vote: gkrieg13
Based on what?
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Vote: gkrieg13
Based on what?
I don't like the feeling I'm getting from him.
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Hmm actually I guess its partly to do with how I feel hes been almost keeping most his comments in RVS I guess?
just feels odd.
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Hmm actually I guess its partly to do with how I feel hes been almost keeping most his comments in RVS I guess?
just feels odd.
You voted him right after he made an on task post.
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Hydrad seems towny. His contemplation reads genuine to me.
Also, I'm back!
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@Awaclus, your suggestion appeared to be that we should massclaim with a 50% chance. Do you believe that your plan has at least a 50% chance of being beneficial to town?
@mcmc, is gkrieg scummy?
@Robz, how boozy was the brunch that you haven't resurfaced yet?
@Jimmmmm, do you still exist?
@Eevee, yay, you still exist, and not much has happened while you were out. Any feelings from you on who's being weird or scummy?
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@Awaclus, your suggestion appeared to be that we should massclaim with a 50% chance. Do you believe that your plan has at least a 50% chance of being beneficial to town?
Compared to what?
Compared to not massclaiming: I don't know, I don't know the setup.
Compared to massclaiming: I don't know, I don't know the setup.
Compared to letting scum influence our decision based on the information that they have: Yes.
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I don't have any substantial reads yet, unfortunately. I didn't even remember Jimmm was in the game (hi!).
I don't think we are going to get enough people to agree to a massclaim. It would be an interesting, different day 1, but I never quite feel like doing it "in this particular game" when I'm actually playing. I don't know why.
The more I think about this, the more I feel like it might be really fun. I'm in for Awaclus's plan.
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@Jimmmmm, do you still exist?
I like to think so.
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@Awaclus, your suggestion appeared to be that we should massclaim with a 50% chance. Do you believe that your plan has at least a 50% chance of being beneficial to town?
@mcmc, is gkrieg scummy?
@Robz, how boozy was the brunch that you haven't resurfaced yet?
@Jimmmmm, do you still exist?
@Eevee, yay, you still exist, and not much has happened while you were out. Any feelings from you on who's being weird or scummy?
I think this is townie from Space.
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@Awaclus, your suggestion appeared to be that we should massclaim with a 50% chance. Do you believe that your plan has at least a 50% chance of being beneficial to town?
Compared to what?
Compared to not massclaiming: I don't know, I don't know the setup.
Compared to massclaiming: I don't know, I don't know the setup.
Compared to letting scum influence our decision based on the information that they have: Yes.
How do I know that your 50/50 plan isn't scum influencing our decision based on information you have?
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The more I think about this, the more I feel like it might be really fun. I'm in for Awaclus's plan.
Obviously, I'm not.
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How do I know that your 50/50 plan isn't scum influencing our decision based on information you have?
What information do you think I have that makes it most beneficial for me to have a 50/50 random chance?
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How do I know that your 50/50 plan isn't scum influencing our decision based on information you have?
What information do you think I have that makes it most beneficial for me to have a 50/50 random chance?
The understanding that a 50% chance of something happening that you want to happen is better than 0%.
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How do I know that your 50/50 plan isn't scum influencing our decision based on information you have?
What information do you think I have that makes it most beneficial for me to have a 50/50 random chance?
The understanding that a 50% chance of something happening that you want to happen is better than 0%.
And worse than 100%.
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How do I know that your 50/50 plan isn't scum influencing our decision based on information you have?
What information do you think I have that makes it most beneficial for me to have a 50/50 random chance?
The understanding that a 50% chance of something happening that you want to happen is better than 0%.
And worse than 100%.
If you thought you could force something 100%, you wouldn't propose a 50/50.
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How do I know that your 50/50 plan isn't scum influencing our decision based on information you have?
What information do you think I have that makes it most beneficial for me to have a 50/50 random chance?
The understanding that a 50% chance of something happening that you want to happen is better than 0%.
And worse than 100%.
If you thought you could force something 100%, you wouldn't propose a 50/50.
And what do you think I would force?
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How do I know that your 50/50 plan isn't scum influencing our decision based on information you have?
What information do you think I have that makes it most beneficial for me to have a 50/50 random chance?
The understanding that a 50% chance of something happening that you want to happen is better than 0%.
And worse than 100%.
If you thought you could force something 100%, you wouldn't propose a 50/50.
And what do you think I would force?
Whichever you think is better for you.
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How do I know that your 50/50 plan isn't scum influencing our decision based on information you have?
What information do you think I have that makes it most beneficial for me to have a 50/50 random chance?
The understanding that a 50% chance of something happening that you want to happen is better than 0%.
And worse than 100%.
If you thought you could force something 100%, you wouldn't propose a 50/50.
And what do you think I would force?
Whichever you think is better for you.
Which is?
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How do I know that your 50/50 plan isn't scum influencing our decision based on information you have?
What information do you think I have that makes it most beneficial for me to have a 50/50 random chance?
The understanding that a 50% chance of something happening that you want to happen is better than 0%.
And worse than 100%.
If you thought you could force something 100%, you wouldn't propose a 50/50.
And what do you think I would force?
Whichever you think is better for you.
Which is?
Depends on whether you're scum.
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How do I know that your 50/50 plan isn't scum influencing our decision based on information you have?
What information do you think I have that makes it most beneficial for me to have a 50/50 random chance?
The understanding that a 50% chance of something happening that you want to happen is better than 0%.
And worse than 100%.
If you thought you could force something 100%, you wouldn't propose a 50/50.
And what do you think I would force?
Whichever you think is better for you.
Which is?
Depends on whether you're scum.
Aren't you working under the assumption that I am?
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How do I know that your 50/50 plan isn't scum influencing our decision based on information you have?
What information do you think I have that makes it most beneficial for me to have a 50/50 random chance?
The understanding that a 50% chance of something happening that you want to happen is better than 0%.
And worse than 100%.
If you thought you could force something 100%, you wouldn't propose a 50/50.
And what do you think I would force?
Whichever you think is better for you.
Which is?
Depends on whether you're scum.
Aren't you working under the assumption that I am?
Where did I say that?
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vote: Awaclus.
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How do I know that your 50/50 plan isn't scum influencing our decision based on information you have?
What information do you think I have that makes it most beneficial for me to have a 50/50 random chance?
The understanding that a 50% chance of something happening that you want to happen is better than 0%.
And worse than 100%.
If you thought you could force something 100%, you wouldn't propose a 50/50.
And what do you think I would force?
Whichever you think is better for you.
Which is?
Depends on whether you're scum.
Aren't you working under the assumption that I am?
Where did I say that?
How do I know that your 50/50 plan isn't scum influencing our decision based on information you have?
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Why the vote on Awaclus, EFHW?
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@mcmc, is gkrieg scummy?
So far I lean town and also lean town on you.
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How do I know that your 50/50 plan isn't scum influencing our decision based on information you have?
What information do you think I have that makes it most beneficial for me to have a 50/50 random chance?
The understanding that a 50% chance of something happening that you want to happen is better than 0%.
And worse than 100%.
If you thought you could force something 100%, you wouldn't propose a 50/50.
And what do you think I would force?
Whichever you think is better for you.
Which is?
Depends on whether you're scum.
Aren't you working under the assumption that I am?
Where did I say that?
How do I know that your 50/50 plan isn't scum influencing our decision based on information you have?
That's the question you still haven't answered.
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@Awaclus, your suggestion appeared to be that we should massclaim with a 50% chance. Do you believe that your plan has at least a 50% chance of being beneficial to town?
Compared to what?
Compared specifically to not following through on the plan you propose, since I think in general we need town consensus before a massclaim happens.
What I'm driving at is this: you're sort of correct in that we don't know anything about this set-up except for our individual roles. The only extra info we have is that faust has designed the game to be balanced, and my belief is that he wouldn't make a game that's too breakable or too swingy, or too far from what any of us expects as an RMM. I think mods typically like running games because they like players enjoying their construct, and get something out of contributing to the community of mafia players here. So, I think faust's game is reasonably close to other types of RMM games.
This is where IDP's question at #133/#134 is relevant: do we as a group believe that massclaiming D1 is ever good for town? I'm not convinced the answer is yes, and even if there was one pathological game you could cite, we'd still be left with the question of whether faust would offer up such a game to us now. So I think the chance of any random RMM game being constructed such that a D1 massclaim is good for town is lower than 5%. Yes, we don't know the specifics of this game, so it's fair for you to cite that you can't know what's going on, but it's also shortsighted because we can use prior information to make better judgements than random.
Anyway, I'm sure I'll regret trying to waid in with logic when you and IDP are having so much fun swamping the thread with chit-chat, but your attitude is irritating enough that I'm sorely tempted to join EFHW on the Awaclus train just now.
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Note to the other townies out there: almost 31% of the other people in this game are scums. That's a pretty high percentage, meaning that having a morale-boosting D1 scum lynch is more feasible than the average game, especially if we can get everyone talking. Not engaging with other people should not be an options for townies here.
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The more I think about this, the more I feel like it might be really fun. I'm in for Awaclus's plan.
I think I need you to show your working on that one. Maybe start by explaining what your understanding of Awaclus's plan is, then say why it's not a terrible idea...
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So I am catching up now, but just because it somehow seems to be a topic - I don't really get how Mass Claim in a closed set up like this could be beneficial for us. I mean... Skum can just like make up.... whatever they want right? It's not like they are going to "claim VT" or something.
It also then makes them choosing a NK like shooting power role fish in a barrel.
I think Space is towny. Driving the game well at this point.
I think Awaclus' theory on random claim is bad, but not necessarily skummy (mainly because I don't see how skum in this game would ever think they have a chance at pushing a claim through).
Not really a super lot more to comment on at this point. Probably due to the holiday weekend in the states.
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That's the question you still haven't answered.
What information do you think I have that makes it most beneficial for me to have a 50/50 random chance?
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So I am catching up now, but just because it somehow seems to be a topic - I don't really get how Mass Claim in a closed set up like this could be beneficial for us. I mean... Skum can just like make up.... whatever they want right? It's not like they are going to "claim VT" or something.
No, they can't claim whatever they want. They have to claim something that will be indistinguishable from their actual role as far as town can tell, which can get quite tricky especially because their actual role can suddenly change to something unpredictable.
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The more I think about this, the more I feel like it might be really fun. I'm in for Awaclus's plan.
I think I need you to show your working on that one. Maybe start by explaining what your understanding of Awaclus's plan is, then say why it's not a terrible idea...
An early massclaim would make for a different kind of day 1, certainly create a lot of action. Very tough to say what the odds of it helping/hurting us are, but you could easily see it just auto-losing the game for us.. so probably not such a fun idea after all.
Certainly would make more sense in some other game than this. The statistic about the number of scum is a hopeful one indeed!
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No, they can't claim whatever they want. They have to claim something that will be indistinguishable from their actual role as far as town can tell, which can get quite tricky especially because their actual role can suddenly change to something unpredictable.
You make it sound like a scum player can expect to wake up with a totally unexpected role at the start of the day! That's not it at all. The way I understand it, their roles only change if they perform the NK. Now, given that massclaim means that scums know exactly what all the townie roles are (except if we lie, which I don't think is something you're suggesting), they would just need to pick one of their group to wake up with a known role they can plan in advance.
I realise I'm getting perilously close to offering advice to the scumteam, but I feel we're still in pretty obvious territory here. And advice for town: until we have useful PR-derived game information that we can all share and act upon, I think going into any significant detail about our roles isn't a good idea. Of course, I have no idea what other roles are out there, so maybe some of you do have reasons to want to share.. I'm not stopping you, but I'm not going to make my own role easy or convenient for scum to take.
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So I am catching up now, but just because it somehow seems to be a topic - I don't really get how Mass Claim in a closed set up like this could be beneficial for us. I mean... Skum can just like make up.... whatever they want right? It's not like they are going to "claim VT" or something.
No, they can't claim whatever they want. They have to claim something that will be indistinguishable from their actual role as far as town can tell, which can get quite tricky especially because their actual role can suddenly change to something unpredictable.
right which kind of brings me to my second point which is - to do a mass claim successfully in this set up wouldn't we need to agree to mass claim like... every day? Or at least every day that follows a NK?
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So I am catching up now, but just because it somehow seems to be a topic - I don't really get how Mass Claim in a closed set up like this could be beneficial for us. I mean... Skum can just like make up.... whatever they want right? It's not like they are going to "claim VT" or something.
No, they can't claim whatever they want. They have to claim something that will be indistinguishable from their actual role as far as town can tell, which can get quite tricky especially because their actual role can suddenly change to something unpredictable.
which, I believe is ridiculous.
right which kind of brings me to my second point which is - to do a mass claim successfully in this set up wouldn't we need to agree to mass claim like... every day? Or at least every day that follows a NK?
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Why the vote on Awaclus, EFHW?
Cluttering the thread. IDPTG is equally guilty, but Awaclus knows better.
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Hydrad seems towny. His contemplation reads genuine to me.
Also, I'm back!
Welcome back. I have a town read on you since you find me towny
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Awaclus seems normal. But that goes for both town and scum.
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I don’t support a mass claim.
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That's the question you still haven't answered.
What information do you think I have that makes it most beneficial for me to have a 50/50 random chance?
You asking what information I think you have does not tell me how I know that you're not scum.
Although enough people have stated they're against claiming that I'm pretty done with that conversation.
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Vote Count 1.2
Robz888 (2): Robz888, gkrieg13
Eevee (2): SpaceAnemone, LaLight
gkrieg13 (1): Hydrad
Awaclus (2): Jimmmmm, EFHW
mcmcsalot (1): iguanaiguana
LaLight (1): Eevee
Hydrad (2): IDontPlayThisGame, mcmcsalot
Not Voting (3): Awaclus, DatSwan, Galzria
With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day 1 ends May 31, 2018, 06:00:00 am
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I am against mass claiming for now. Scum will know who to kill to get a cool role.
I lean scum on EFHW for voting for Awaclus, I don't think he's scum. And whether he's cluttering the thread or not, if he's town we shouldn't vote him. Also, @SA, how exactly do we know 31% of people are scums? Maybe here's only one scum and the setup is still balanced? Looks like a scumslip to me
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Setup Info
This game has exactly 2 factions, mafia and town. The mafia consists of 4 players.
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No, they can't claim whatever they want. They have to claim something that will be indistinguishable from their actual role as far as town can tell, which can get quite tricky especially because their actual role can suddenly change to something unpredictable.
You make it sound like a scum player can expect to wake up with a totally unexpected role at the start of the day! That's not it at all. The way I understand it, their roles only change if they perform the NK. Now, given that massclaim means that scums know exactly what all the townie roles are (except if we lie, which I don't think is something you're suggesting), they would just need to pick one of their group to wake up with a known role they can plan in advance.
That's assuming scum gets to claim last, which might not be the case, and they can't just pick one of their group because they don't have daytalk so they can't coordinate that. And I'm not suggesting that town shouldn't lie under any circumstances, people have fakeclaimed as town before and it has worked out.
right which kind of brings me to my second point which is - to do a mass claim successfully in this set up wouldn't we need to agree to mass claim like... every day? Or at least every day that follows a NK?
No, why? If we redo the massclaim after a NK, scum will just claim the same roles again because claiming a different role would be outing yourself as scum.
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You asking what information I think you have does not tell me how I know that you're not scum.
It's not supposed to do that, it's supposed to demonstrate to everyone else that your argument is wrong and ridiculous.
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god why is it like every time I read the setup it lacks some info that is added later so I always don't know something about it
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SA feels more assertive and leader-y than I remember (it's appreciated!). While someone being "different" is always cause for some alertness, this feels towny to me, because it's useful and generally high quality posting.
The Awaclus vote doesn't really make sense to me. Is it because you think Awaclus is scum and cluttering the thread to distract us, or more of a emotional or policy vote? It sounds like the latter. I think scum often does these votes where they have a plausible explanation they can hide behind, even if it's not really related to alignment.
Fwiw, I thought Awaclus was scummier before he started "cluttering the thread". I'm not any sort of authority in reading Awaclus though, you guys have played more with him than I have.
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I'm not any sort of authority in reading Awaclus though, you guys have played more with him than I have.
No one is actually.
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For Massclaim:
Awaclus
Eevee for a hot sec
Against Massclaim:
IDP
Space
Mcmc
Datswan
Gkrieg
Lalaight
End of conversation about massclaiming.
I get what you are saying awaclus where a 50/50 is better than anything potentially influenced by scum because scum has more info. But I think you are not taking into account the "more" info they have is just a few roles, we have our info and there are more town then scum so a mutually agreed upon thing is more beneficial to town then a random thing.
Also the whole proposed claim by awaclus is null because his style creates a frustratingly awful meta to read.
Eevee did you really think through the claim and think it was good or just fun?
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Just fun.
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I get what you are saying awaclus where a 50/50 is better than anything potentially influenced by scum because scum has more info. But I think you are not taking into account the "more" info they have is just a few roles, we have our info and there are more town then scum so a mutually agreed upon thing is more beneficial to town then a random thing.
Each townie has so little info that it's practically just a 50/50 anyway, and scum's influence makes it worse. A mutually agreed upon thing can't possibly be better than a random thing.
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I get what you are saying awaclus where a 50/50 is better than anything potentially influenced by scum because scum has more info. But I think you are not taking into account the "more" info they have is just a few roles, we have our info and there are more town then scum so a mutually agreed upon thing is more beneficial to town then a random thing.
Each townie has so little info that it's practically just a 50/50 anyway, and scum's influence makes it worse. A mutually agreed upon thing can't possibly be better than a random thing.
But currently we've massclaimed a grand total of 0 times. Clearly at least our collective thinking is that it isn't a 50-50 shot, or we'd be doing it day 1 at least sometimes.
Worth noting: This is essentially just a discussion of the timing of our mass claim. Surely we'd do it when we reach lylo the latest. Shouldn't the eqution be the benefits of doing it now vs the benefits of doing it later?
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But currently we've massclaimed a grand total of 0 times. Clearly at least our collective thinking is that it isn't a 50-50 shot, or we'd be doing it day 1 at least sometimes.
Yeah, but that's based on playing WIFOM against the mod, which I think is a bad idea.
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End of conversation about massclaiming.
You listed six "no" votes in a game of 14 players.. that's not even a majority! :-)
I mean, I agree we absolutely definitely shouldn't massclaim, but I disagree with your presumption that you get to have the authority to close down a whole conversation that is useful in working out who has what understanding of the game. It's a habit you have overall, and it's not one I think is very alignment-indicative for you, but it is quite unhelpful for town when you end up scumreading people who get something out of a conversation you're bored of.
Plus, you end your post with a question to Eevee on the the massclaim topic anyway... so you're not even ending the conversation!
PPE: more massclaiming conversation posts! :-P
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Awaclus, would you say the same "better to it random so scum cant influence us" argument works for lynching? Having people do things that either help or hurt us and then keeping them accountable for their actions is the essence of the game!
Mcmc, who is scummy?
Galzria, any reads?
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Awaclus, would you say the same "better to it random so scum cant influence us" argument works for lynching? Having people do things that either help or hurt us and then keeping them accountable for their actions is the essence of the game!
That would be true if we couldn't get better than a full random chance of figuring out who's scum.
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Awaclus, would you say the same "better to it random so scum cant influence us" argument works for lynching? Having people do things that either help or hurt us and then keeping them accountable for their actions is the essence of the game!
Mcmc, who is scummy?
Galzria, any reads?
You
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Caught up. Only thing that stuck out to me was this post by Space:
Presumably, the main things governing whether people want to claim are how much they like solving setups (rather that just trying to catch people out for "sounding scummy"), and how much extra information they feel their role gives them compared to what they think the average role will have.
Scum is clearly at an advantage for the latter point, because they get to know what the roles of themselves and their three buddies are, assuming they're all in a faction QT. Though 4/14 scums seems pretty strong, especially when they can essentially eat the roles of the rest of us, so I wonder whether any of them start out with nerfs. Still, with them able to eat our roles, I don't think letting on the relative strengths of our powers is a good idea even if we have a decent level of protection available to help us keep strong town roles in alive townies' hands, because I don't think faust would design a game that could be easily solved by town just by revealing stuff.
I bolded the suspicious part. I mean, this is a valid theory, but it's a possibility that wouldn't really have immediately occurred to me. I think a scum who does indeed have a nerf , or is on a team with a nerf'd scum, is likely to think of it, though!
Vote: Space
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Vote: Robz
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I mean, this is a valid theory, but it's a possibility that wouldn't really have immediately occurred to me. I think a scum who does indeed have a nerf , or is on a team with a nerf'd scum, is likely to think of it, though!
My Space Alert game (RMM42) was a 14-person 4-scum set-up. That felt like a lot of scums, but silver had suggested those number for balance after we'd talked over possible game configurations.
It's definitely a higher scum ratio than normal, so it's worth town being aware of that. LL has already tried scumreading me for having read that part of the setup ;-)
Four scums here feels like a lot, too, but I trust faust to have put an appropriate level of thought into balancing it. Almost all the useful conversation so far in-thread seem to have been about what roles might be in the game, so it's hardly surprising that I'm contemplating how it's all set up and balanced.
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The Awaclus vote doesn't really make sense to me. Is it because you think Awaclus is scum and cluttering the thread to distract us, or more of a emotional or policy vote? It sounds like the latter. I think scum often does these votes where they have a plausible explanation they can hide behind, even if it's not really related to alignment.
My Awaclus vote was for both reasons. I have other scumreads but I'm keeping them to myself for now.
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Nobody likes my Space case, huh? (Harlan Band is sad.)
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I'm off work tomorrow and Monday without any real plans, so I'll be back in the action then.
Request prod on Galz.
Some of us are at the end of Monday already, and he's barely said anything all game...
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Nobody likes my Space case, huh? (Harlan Band is sad.)
I'll be happier if you make cases on scums, really :-P
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I don't know it's scummy for Eevee to vote me--presumably over my case--offer no explanation, and vanish, but it sure is annoying!
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Nobody likes my Space case, huh? (Harlan Band is sad.)
I guess for me I don't like it because I also kinda considered that option. So it doesn't seem that scummy to me.
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When I get to reading this maybe I will skip over every post with mass claim in it.
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When I get to reading this maybe I will skip over every post with mass claim in it.
But thats like half the game :P
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Nobody likes my Space case, huh? (Harlan Band is sad.)
I'll keep note of it for future days, but the part you bolded is a natural progression from thinking about the power-absorbing bit of the set-up which I think is fairly NAI for Space.
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Caught up. Only thing that stuck out to me was this post by Space:
Presumably, the main things governing whether people want to claim are how much they like solving setups (rather that just trying to catch people out for "sounding scummy"), and how much extra information they feel their role gives them compared to what they think the average role will have.
Scum is clearly at an advantage for the latter point, because they get to know what the roles of themselves and their three buddies are, assuming they're all in a faction QT. Though 4/14 scums seems pretty strong, especially when they can essentially eat the roles of the rest of us, so I wonder whether any of them start out with nerfs. Still, with them able to eat our roles, I don't think letting on the relative strengths of our powers is a good idea even if we have a decent level of protection available to help us keep strong town roles in alive townies' hands, because I don't think faust would design a game that could be easily solved by town just by revealing stuff.
I bolded the suspicious part. I mean, this is a valid theory, but it's a possibility that wouldn't really have immediately occurred to me. I think a scum who does indeed have a nerf , or is on a team with a nerf'd scum, is likely to think of it, though!
Vote: Space
Makes sense to me!
Vote: Space
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As for the time, I'm glad someone brought it up because I missed it (people tend to use forum time which is also my timezone). Hopefully it won't cause issues now that everyone knows about it.
I actually think this post is super scummy. Why would you care about the timezone thing if forum time is your timezone anyway? This sounds like a fake "Go Town!" post.
Vote: IDPTG
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Also, @SA, how exactly do we know 31% of people are scums? Maybe here's only one scum and the setup is still balanced? Looks like a scumslip to me
Not knowing the setup is scummy.
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As for the time, I'm glad someone brought it up because I missed it (people tend to use forum time which is also my timezone). Hopefully it won't cause issues now that everyone knows about it.
I actually think this post is super scummy. Why would you care about the timezone thing if forum time is your timezone anyway? This sounds like a fake "Go Town!" post.
Vote: IDPTG
I care because deadlines are important and it's good if people aren't confused about when they are. I don't understand how my time and forum time being the same means I shouldn't care about potential confusion for other players. I'd rather have a fair game (as either alignment) where everyone knows when the deadline is than get a cheap win because a tag threw someone off and they weren't around to coordinate/defend themself/whatever.
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I'm off work tomorrow and Monday without any real plans, so I'll be back in the action then.
Request prod on Galz.
Some of us are at the end of Monday already, and he's barely said anything all game...
Prod sent.
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Holiday weekend, sorry. Been reading, if not contributing.
The nonsense about claiming was pointless and cluttered the thread while providing almost less content than I have been. Not only has my time been limited for the weekend, I simply have had no desire to participate in such drivel. It's a closed setup for all intents and purposes - scum has no basis of an idea for who to kill to a) hurt town and b) steal their powers. Why the heck would we want to tell them?
As for what little else there's been since I last posted, Robz' point on Space is the only thing that's carried merit, albeit not much.
Mcmc hasn't been pushing the way I'm used to him pushing - via words, cases, questions, interrogations etc - he's seemed to be casting his vote wherever the wind has been blowing, and doing little individual thinking and constructing of his own.
Everything else thusfar... meh.
vote: mcmc
Gotta go check our deadline to see if I can try to get votes here, or if we should be looking to consolidate.
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Looks like there's still time, so I'm content with that vote for now.
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I like that Galzria post.
@Robz
Space is the kind of analytical person who would think that. Also scum self-censors things like that, certainly doesn’t tend to tip their hand off. I could buy it if it was someone less experienced, but not when you’re talking about Space.
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FWIW I joined the game thinking that the point is that town have roles that are negative utility for scum, and then scum has to receive those whenever they kill someone.
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FWIW I joined the game thinking that the point is that town have roles that are negative utility for scum, and then scum has to receive those whenever they kill someone.
That’s a fun idea for a game, although probably swingy and tough to balance .
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FWIW I joined the game thinking that the point is that town have roles that are negative utility for scum, and then scum has to receive those whenever they kill someone.
That’s a fun idea for a game, although probably swingy and tough to balance .
I still think that's the point of this game.
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Mcmc hasn't been pushing the way I'm used to him pushing - via words, cases, questions, interrogations etc - he's seemed to be casting his vote wherever the wind has been blowing, and doing little individual thinking and constructing of his own.
Everything else thusfar... meh.
vote: mcmc
Gotta go check our deadline to see if I can try to get votes here, or if we should be looking to consolidate.
This is due to the fact that I have vastly less time to dedicate to the game then I did previously. You can check the games que thread to see that I have moved recently and started at a new office, so my time at home has been spent unpacking/building a chicken coup and my time at work has been working and learning new things instead of running things about mafia through my head. So I am keeping up and reading similarly but just don't have the time to create more thought out posts like I normally do. Good post though I definitely understand I look different then normal.
What do you think about eevee? He feels really scummy to me.
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Vote: mcmc
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FWIW I joined the game thinking that the point is that town have roles that are negative utility for scum, and then scum has to receive those whenever they kill someone.
That’s a fun idea for a game, although probably swingy and tough to balance .
I still think that's the point of this game.
This feels like Awaclus trying to signal subtly that he's not a good NK target... which kind of feels townie because scum would have no reason to benefit from sending those signals. That is, except to emulate what they think town would do, but how likely is it that scum!Awaclus would think that some town roles might be negative-utility for scum?
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how likely is it that scum!Awaclus would think that some town roles might be negative-utility for scum?
I already said I thought that before I even joined the game.
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reading Galz's post I am starting to notice mcmc is not really his town!self... I think mcmc and Eevee are scummy
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reading Galz's post I am starting to notice mcmc is not really his town!self... I think mcmc and Eevee are scummy
Explain why you think I am not my “town” self? I pointed out the reason I look different then previous mcmc but I don’t see the conflation to why I am specifically not my town self.
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I can vouch for the fact that mcmc has a ton of real life stuff going on, at least.
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vote: mcmcsalot
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re
Vote: gkrieg13
to me he just feels very different from his normal self. I dunno why. but I'm guessing its because hes probably scum.
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Explain why you think I am not my “town” self? I pointed out the reason I look different then previous mcmc but I don’t see the conflation to why I am specifically not my town self.
Explain why you think you are your "town" self.
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Building a chicken coup is amazing and possibly towny.
I feel I’m always scummy these days, at least day 1. Feeling better of my game as the game progresses, though I’ve definitely had to accept I’m quite the casual player these days. Maybe I always was.
I see what you guys mean with mcmc not seeming himself, but same could be said for Galzria at least. Having higher standards for some people due to amazing earlier performances and punishing them for failing to meet them when whey have more real life responsibilities feels icky to me.
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Vote: gkrieg sounds good to me. He's been much less of a factor than I would expect.
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Vote: gkrieg sounds good to me. He's been much less of a factor than I would expect.
This happens to me nearly every D1. I'm just not very active D1.
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Mcmc hasn't been pushing the way I'm used to him pushing - via words, cases, questions, interrogations etc - he's seemed to be casting his vote wherever the wind has been blowing, and doing little individual thinking and constructing of his own.
Everything else thusfar... meh.
vote: mcmc
Gotta go check our deadline to see if I can try to get votes here, or if we should be looking to consolidate.
This is due to the fact that I have vastly less time to dedicate to the game then I did previously. You can check the games que thread to see that I have moved recently and started at a new office, so my time at home has been spent unpacking/building a chicken coup and my time at work has been working and learning new things instead of running things about mafia through my head. So I am keeping up and reading similarly but just don't have the time to create more thought out posts like I normally do. Good post though I definitely understand I look different then normal.
What do you think about eevee? He feels really scummy to me.
bolded is why I voted for mcmcsalot. Just seems like a scummy statement to just say someone feels scummy and floating it out there.
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Vote: gkrieg sounds good to me. He's been much less of a factor than I would expect.
This happens to me nearly every D1. I'm just not very active D1.
Okay, I can relate.
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Mcmc hasn't been pushing the way I'm used to him pushing - via words, cases, questions, interrogations etc - he's seemed to be casting his vote wherever the wind has been blowing, and doing little individual thinking and constructing of his own.
Everything else thusfar... meh.
vote: mcmc
Gotta go check our deadline to see if I can try to get votes here, or if we should be looking to consolidate.
This is due to the fact that I have vastly less time to dedicate to the game then I did previously. You can check the games que thread to see that I have moved recently and started at a new office, so my time at home has been spent unpacking/building a chicken coup and my time at work has been working and learning new things instead of running things about mafia through my head. So I am keeping up and reading similarly but just don't have the time to create more thought out posts like I normally do. Good post though I definitely understand I look different then normal.
What do you think about eevee? He feels really scummy to me.
bolded is why I voted for mcmcsalot. Just seems like a scummy statement to just say someone feels scummy and floating it out there.
To be fair, he was responding to me asking who he finds scummy. I think there was at least one other person who similarly called me scummy without really putting forth any reasons, when I reread I'll try to find it and contrast who said it first and who might be scum trying to subtly nudge that person towards lynching me.
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Mcmc hasn't been pushing the way I'm used to him pushing - via words, cases, questions, interrogations etc - he's seemed to be casting his vote wherever the wind has been blowing, and doing little individual thinking and constructing of his own.
Everything else thusfar... meh.
vote: mcmc
Gotta go check our deadline to see if I can try to get votes here, or if we should be looking to consolidate.
This is due to the fact that I have vastly less time to dedicate to the game then I did previously. You can check the games que thread to see that I have moved recently and started at a new office, so my time at home has been spent unpacking/building a chicken coup and my time at work has been working and learning new things instead of running things about mafia through my head. So I am keeping up and reading similarly but just don't have the time to create more thought out posts like I normally do. Good post though I definitely understand I look different then normal.
What do you think about eevee? He feels really scummy to me.
bolded is why I voted for mcmcsalot. Just seems like a scummy statement to just say someone feels scummy and floating it out there.
To be fair, he was responding to me asking who he finds scummy. I think there was at least one other person who similarly called me scummy without really putting forth any reasons, when I reread I'll try to find it and contrast who said it first and who might be scum trying to subtly nudge that person towards lynching me.
It looks like he was responding to galzria. Why are you trying to defend him?
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I don't mean to defend him, and he probably doesn't need my defense really. Was just trying to provide context.
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Mcmc hasn't been pushing the way I'm used to him pushing - via words, cases, questions, interrogations etc - he's seemed to be casting his vote wherever the wind has been blowing, and doing little individual thinking and constructing of his own.
Everything else thusfar... meh.
vote: mcmc
Gotta go check our deadline to see if I can try to get votes here, or if we should be looking to consolidate.
This is due to the fact that I have vastly less time to dedicate to the game then I did previously. You can check the games que thread to see that I have moved recently and started at a new office, so my time at home has been spent unpacking/building a chicken coup and my time at work has been working and learning new things instead of running things about mafia through my head. So I am keeping up and reading similarly but just don't have the time to create more thought out posts like I normally do. Good post though I definitely understand I look different then normal.
What do you think about eevee? He feels really scummy to me.
bolded is why I voted for mcmcsalot. Just seems like a scummy statement to just say someone feels scummy and floating it out there.
I can elaborate. Eevee's musings about the claim seemed all to be that claiming would be bad and then as time went on he all the sudden thought it would be fun which seemed really off to me and scummy. I was curious how galz felt about eevee for multiple reasons (his read on me and that hes played with eevee lots). So that's why I asked.
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Changed my profile pic, just so people know.
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Changed my profile pic, just so people know.
who are you
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Mcmc hasn't been pushing the way I'm used to him pushing - via words, cases, questions, interrogations etc - he's seemed to be casting his vote wherever the wind has been blowing, and doing little individual thinking and constructing of his own.
Everything else thusfar... meh.
vote: mcmc
Gotta go check our deadline to see if I can try to get votes here, or if we should be looking to consolidate.
This is due to the fact that I have vastly less time to dedicate to the game then I did previously. You can check the games que thread to see that I have moved recently and started at a new office, so my time at home has been spent unpacking/building a chicken coup and my time at work has been working and learning new things instead of running things about mafia through my head. So I am keeping up and reading similarly but just don't have the time to create more thought out posts like I normally do. Good post though I definitely understand I look different then normal.
What do you think about eevee? He feels really scummy to me.
I can, obviously, relate to being quite busy in real life and having it impact my game time/effort. Acknowledging that you're not your normal town!self however, how would YOU read you? That is, take any other player, recognize they aren't playing their normal town game, and where does that lead you?
This forum is full of meta-reads. It's usually where I'm strongest (that and vote analysis) - but as Awaclus likes to make note, it's a faulty system. "TownMeta!Mcmc" does not equal "Town!Mcmc", because it's exactly what "Scum!Mcmc" would be attempting to emulate. One could argue the fact that you're NOT acting like "TownMeta!Mcmc" might mean, in fact, that you're probably town because of the bolded part above. In the end, it's all just a rabbit hole of WIFOM.
So instead, for my read on you, focus less on the "He's not acting like I've seen town!Mcmc act". That's a bad line of reasoning. What I haven't liked from your play, particularly and solely relating to this game, is how loose your voting pattern has appeared. It's been very... "Where are others looking/voting/suspecting right now" - that is, it's felt like opportunistic voting, rather than based on your own personal reads.
Regarding Eevee:
I don't think I've ever, in over 30 games played with him, had a scum read on him. His posting style is always so upbeat and cheery that it's hard for me to think he could be up to nefarious deeds. In regards to the discussion on massclaiming, his being against it to begin with is more out-of-line for Eevee as I remember him than is his "Let's do it because it sounds fun". He definitely backpeddaled quickly and changed position on it.... but I don't see why scum would do so publicly and quickly - it's not as if there was an obvious shift in group opinion from the other people in the game that he would've felt he needed to gel with them.
Now, he IS being rather talkative overall (compared to how I recall him being), but that may be a bias I'm having due to the general lack of activity from everyone else. Eevee, as I've seen him as scum, tends to try harder than his normal town self. He comes across as forced because he wants to be read as town. This "try harder" attitude often manifests itself in a higher-than-average post count, as well as him town-reading everybody, not wanting to commit to scum reads because he's scared (maybe not the right word) of OMGUS and drawing attention to himself. He's hedgy as scum, and always, always, always (as is his nature) suuuuuuper polite and nice.
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Mcmc hasn't been pushing the way I'm used to him pushing - via words, cases, questions, interrogations etc - he's seemed to be casting his vote wherever the wind has been blowing, and doing little individual thinking and constructing of his own.
Everything else thusfar... meh.
vote: mcmc
Gotta go check our deadline to see if I can try to get votes here, or if we should be looking to consolidate.
This is due to the fact that I have vastly less time to dedicate to the game then I did previously. You can check the games que thread to see that I have moved recently and started at a new office, so my time at home has been spent unpacking/building a chicken coup and my time at work has been working and learning new things instead of running things about mafia through my head. So I am keeping up and reading similarly but just don't have the time to create more thought out posts like I normally do. Good post though I definitely understand I look different then normal.
What do you think about eevee? He feels really scummy to me.
I can, obviously, relate to being quite busy in real life and having it impact my game time/effort. Acknowledging that you're not your normal town!self however, how would YOU read you? That is, take any other player, recognize they aren't playing their normal town game, and where does that lead you?
This forum is full of meta-reads. It's usually where I'm strongest (that and vote analysis) - but as Awaclus likes to make note, it's a faulty system. "TownMeta!Mcmc" does not equal "Town!Mcmc", because it's exactly what "Scum!Mcmc" would be attempting to emulate. One could argue the fact that you're NOT acting like "TownMeta!Mcmc" might mean, in fact, that you're probably town because of the bolded part above. In the end, it's all just a rabbit hole of WIFOM.
So instead, for my read on you, focus less on the "He's not acting like I've seen town!Mcmc act". That's a bad line of reasoning. What I haven't liked from your play, particularly and solely relating to this game, is how loose your voting pattern has appeared. It's been very... "Where are others looking/voting/suspecting right now" - that is, it's felt like opportunistic voting, rather than based on your own personal reads.
Regarding Eevee:
I don't think I've ever, in over 30 games played with him, had a scum read on him. His posting style is always so upbeat and cheery that it's hard for me to think he could be up to nefarious deeds. In regards to the discussion on massclaiming, his being against it to begin with is more out-of-line for Eevee as I remember him than is his "Let's do it because it sounds fun". He definitely backpeddaled quickly and changed position on it.... but I don't see why scum would do so publicly and quickly - it's not as if there was an obvious shift in group opinion from the other people in the game that he would've felt he needed to gel with them.
Now, he IS being rather talkative overall (compared to how I recall him being), but that may be a bias I'm having due to the general lack of activity from everyone else. Eevee, as I've seen him as scum, tends to try harder than his normal town self. He comes across as forced because he wants to be read as town. This "try harder" attitude often manifests itself in a higher-than-average post count, as well as him town-reading everybody, not wanting to commit to scum reads because he's scared (maybe not the right word) of OMGUS and drawing attention to himself. He's hedgy as scum, and always, always, always (as is his nature) suuuuuuper polite and nice.
And of course, this all devolved back into a meta-analysis on Eevee, which, while perhaps useful, can also be completely worthless (as noted by the opening with regards to you). It's "good analysis based on a faulty system" - seems to be the best I can put it.
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Changed my profile pic, just so people know.
who are you
I'm the cragheart from Gloomhaven.
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Vote Count 1.3
Eevee (2): SpaceAnemone, LaLight
gkrieg13 (2): Hydrad, Eevee
Awaclus (1): EFHW
mcmcsalot (4): iguanaiguana, Galzria, Awaclus, gkrieg13
Hydrad (2): IDontPlayThisGame, mcmcsalot
SpaceAnemone (1): Robz888
IDontPlayThisGame (1): Jimmmmm
Not Voting (1): DatSwan
With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day 1 ends May 31, 2018, 06:00:00 am. That is in 40 hours.
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vote: mcmc though
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vote: mcmc though
Though? This vote feels scummy in its timing, like LL is joining the biggest wagon to encourage its going through. I guess mcmc might be a little different, but has he done anything actually scummy?
vote: Lalight
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vote: mcmc though
Though? This vote feels scummy in its timing, like LL is joining the biggest wagon to encourage its going through. I guess mcmc might be a little different, but has he done anything actually scummy?
vote: Lalight
Yes.
So instead, for my read on you, focus less on the "He's not acting like I've seen town!Mcmc act". That's a bad line of reasoning. What I haven't liked from your play, particularly and solely relating to this game, is how loose your voting pattern has appeared. It's been very... "Where are others looking/voting/suspecting right now" - that is, it's felt like opportunistic voting, rather than based on your own personal reads.
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I looked for that, couldn't see it. I'll look again later, or you can point me to the relevant votes.
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I looked for that, couldn't see it. I'll look again later, or you can point me to the relevant votes.
Looking back, it's more subtle than I think I'm making it sound. The initial vote on Robz is just RVS (I think?), but the vote on me right after I was actively talking and being questioned by Hydrad felt jumpy, and the following vote on Eevee was a similar situation where it was right after Eevee had been talking - and followed a vote by LaLight. I think part of it is that there hasn't been any real thought behind the votes (at least, presented), and most votes have come after a spike in activity by the voted player. I'll admit it's probably less concrete than it had appeared in my head reading it through the first time, but gut reads aren't bad reads, and yeah, he's felt opportunistic and jumpy without any support for his reads.
Also, Prod Datswan
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I looked through again. I think his vote on you was a joke. I agreed with the vote on Hydrad. So for me the only jumpy one is the vote on Eevee, which he did give a reason for.
It's weird having both you and Hydrad in the game after the last one.
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Been busy, will post tomorrow
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Prod Datswan
Sent.
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Sorry guys gimme a few minutes to read up and I’ll post some content
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Ok it’s like 130am here and i Am halfway done with reads- summary so far would be:
(Surprise) i think Galz is skummy. Not enough too much outside influence to his posts. That being said- only game i have played with him where he flipped skum he was afk for most and subbed out so gonna keep an eye on how that progresses.
Awaclus challenging the randomness here (kill me) actually feels towny? If he were skum he already has the perfect meta set up - he can just say one liners for 3 days before anyone brings him up.
Mcmc feels like lynch bait.
As previously mentioned space seems towny.
Eevee also seems towny. Don’t really get the hate on this one - thier responses thus far seem to be driving conversation.
Robz still reading
I have a late start day tomorrow so i will expand and post then.
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First RMM game in a looooooooooong time. It's permissible to just act crazy and post nonsense, yes?
No massclaim comment? vote: robz
This vote was on the basis that robz has had some early mass claim posts that were tied to his alignment and I intended to get a reaction from robz that I might be able to begin a read from.
Now I'm curious. would you auto hammer yourself Galz?
Lets see vote: galz
This vote was intended to rile galz up as it is of course a bad vote checking for scummy over defensiveness.
vote: eevee for omgus
Similar to he galz vote, wanted to check if eevee would defend his jokey lalight vote if I took it more seriously and called it omgus.
vote: hydrad
Legitimate vote due to the fact that he proposed we claim vt/not vt in a game where scum wants to hit pr’s more than others.
Also going back to galz point. I guess I was trying to hit both point with my one statement and didn’t articulate well. I am not typical town me because of my busier schedule and that is manifesting in such a way that instead of being able to make my own long form case posts and pursuadibg others to join me I am following and looking at what others are saying and trying my best to create interactions and get reactions with my votes.
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Regarding Eevee:
I don't think I've ever, in over 30 games played with him, had a scum read on him. His posting style is always so upbeat and cheery that it's hard for me to think he could be up to nefarious deeds. In regards to the discussion on massclaiming, his being against it to begin with is more out-of-line for Eevee as I remember him than is his "Let's do it because it sounds fun". He definitely backpeddaled quickly and changed position on it.... but I don't see why scum would do so publicly and quickly - it's not as if there was an obvious shift in group opinion from the other people in the game that he would've felt he needed to gel with them.
Now, he IS being rather talkative overall (compared to how I recall him being), but that may be a bias I'm having due to the general lack of activity from everyone else. Eevee, as I've seen him as scum, tends to try harder than his normal town self. He comes across as forced because he wants to be read as town. This "try harder" attitude often manifests itself in a higher-than-average post count, as well as him town-reading everybody, not wanting to commit to scum reads because he's scared (maybe not the right word) of OMGUS and drawing attention to himself. He's hedgy as scum, and always, always, always (as is his nature) suuuuuuper polite and nice.
Going off of this (which I agree with for the most part), I think some of eevee's comments so far have felt like scum!eevee. Underlined felt scummy to me in the first place, you add to it that it could be eevee pivoting in an attempt to look more towny because there isn't a game related reason for pivoting. Italicised I also agree with but its a pretty slippery slope because I want to encourage posting as much as possible and could be he is just energized. Bolded is actually the best point and it feels like his defense of me was an awkward attempt to subtly buddy me into losing my slight scum read on him.
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reading Galz's post I am starting to notice mcmc is not really his town!self... I think mcmc and Eevee are scummy
Explain why you think I am not my “town” self? I pointed out the reason I look different then previous mcmc but I don’t see the conflation to why I am specifically not my town self.
I would still like lalight specifically to answer this. Especially seeing as he feels it strongly enough now to vote for me.
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how likely is it that scum!Awaclus would think that some town roles might be negative-utility for scum?
I already said I thought that before I even joined the game.
You said that a few posts earlier, but you said nothing that I can see before the game started.. meaning you could easily lie about your previous belief if you think it will benefit you here.
As it is, you're arguing against me suggesting you could feasibly be slightly townie for a certain statement, which pretty much tells us all that you'll argue semantics about anything. Sure, I'm happy to admit that I'm trying to reason with probabilities and likelihoods, and that some of it will probably be incorrect. That isn't going to stop me sharing observations in case they're useful for other people's reasoning.
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As it is, you're arguing against me suggesting you could feasibly be slightly townie for a certain statement, which pretty much tells us all that you'll argue semantics about anything.
No, I just think that it's not great to have misinformation about me going around and I don't see the benefit in someone townreading me for the wrong reasons (I think they're pretty likely to change that read if it's not based on real reasons).
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I know mcmc and I are very different players, but I've been aware in my own scum games that I feel guilt and don't commit as much, and then I'm more likely to use being unusually busy as an excuse for not posting. Annoyingly, it's also perfectly possible to be busy town not posting, especially because we're all pretty lax about posting requirements at times.
I have a bit of a habit of scumreading mcmc anyway. And his defensive responses lately haven't felt overtly townie, but he is at least offering up an alternative wagon in the form of Eevee, though he's not voting for Eevee right now, which is a negative. Argh, I'm in two minds about mcmc, and this was only meant to be a super-brief though to post in between tasks at work..
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When I get to reading this maybe I will skip over every post with mass claim in it.
But thats like half the game :P
You're right. I showed up, and read everything.
Here's some people we shouldn't lynch today:
SpaceAnemone
Eevee
Hydrad
IDontPlayThisGame (because he's obv!town... although he does say mislynching him D1 = a town victory.)
DatSwan
Galzria (just a D1 pass for him)
Lalight
Iguana
Here's some people we maybe should lynch:
McMcsalot
Awaclus
Jimmmmm
The other people that I'm not sure about are:
gkrieg
EFHW
Robz888
Lots of townreads seems like a good thing. Let's lynch in that bottom six, but really in that middle three.
FWIW in recent game's I've modded or co-modded I have seen mass claims either happen late in the game and be somewhat beneficial or I've seen them early giving scum way more information that town would have thought possible while telling town basically nothing. In Super Smash Bros mafia, an early partial mass claim gave scum tons of info and told town absolutely nothing, and the game was a cakewalk for scum.
So no mass claim. I'm a town saying it, influencing it in the interest of town, uh, probably.
Anyway I'm voting McMc for the reasons Galzria laid out more or less, and didn't move it because nothing changed all game and he's still the best vote I think. I noticed the jumpy voting on his first jump and then when he ignored my "vote for reactions" thing and did a few more jumps it seemed worse. I know he's busy. But this being a potential mercy kill with a good chance of hitting scum doesn't bother me in the least.
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oh we doing reads now?
I wanna do reads also.
0=scum, 4-6 is pretty neutral, 10 = town.
1. EFHW (5.9) you're close to being town. but not quiet there.
2. gkrieg13 (2.4) You're a scum
3. iguanaiguana (6.2) I like you last post but since there isn't a ton to go off of this could change fast
4. Eevee (6.7) I like you
5. Awaclus (5.9) I'm leaning closer to town on you for some reason. hurrah.
6. LaLight (3.5) I don't know why I have this feeling on you. but here you are.
7. SpaceAnemone (6.5) I kinda like you also
8. Hydrad (1241242) yes
9. Jimmmmm (5) I can't read you usually so you just get to exist for now
10. mcmcsalot (4.1) kinda scummy, but I also feel like some of the reason hes scummy is that hes busier then normal, so would lynch but not top priority
11. Robz888 (5.6) sure
12. DatSwan (3.8) slight scum
13. Galzria (6) I don't know why you are here but here you are!
14. IDontPlayThisGame (4.5) basically neutral
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I want to lynch Lalight. He has 9 posts total, some of which are off-task. This post reads as illogical=scummy to me. Of course we shouldn't lynch town, but the point is we don't know if he is or not. That bit of reasoning seems unnecessary and like scum trying to look like town:
I am against mass claiming for now. Scum will know who to kill to get a cool role.
I lean scum on EFHW for voting for Awaclus, I don't think he's scum. And whether he's cluttering the thread or not, if he's town we shouldn't vote him. Also, @SA, how exactly do we know 31% of people are scums? Maybe here's only one scum and the setup is still balanced? Looks like a scumslip to me
He never answered this question:
I would very much like to vote: Eevee
Call it gut
Can you spell out the gut feeling?
And his mcmc vote timing was scummy, as I mentioned recently.
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Anyway I'm voting McMc for the reasons Galzria laid out more or less, and didn't move it because nothing changed all game and he's still the best vote I think. I noticed the jumpy voting on his first jump and then when he ignored my "vote for reactions" thing and did a few more jumps it seemed worse. I know he's busy. But this being a potential mercy kill with a good chance of hitting scum doesn't bother me in the least.
Hahahaha, you think it's scummy of me to ignore your post that was literally "vote: mcmc for reaction", but you also think my jumpy votes robz for not mentioning massclaim, on galz for being hammer happy and on eevee for omgus (which as I have explained were to get reactions) is also scummy. Are robz and galz and eevee scummy for ignoring my votes on them...no the votes just didn't accomplish what I wanted hence moving them, yours didn't accomplish what you wanted but now you have conveniently turned it into a sheep vote while adding nothing to the case.
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I want to wait for his response before I place my vote but I agree lalight isn't looking very towny.
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oh we doing reads now?
I wanna do reads also.
0=scum, 4-6 is pretty neutral, 10 = town.
1. EFHW (5.9) you're close to being town. but not quiet there.
2. gkrieg13 (2.4) You're a scum
3. iguanaiguana (6.2) I like you last post but since there isn't a ton to go off of this could change fast
4. Eevee (6.7) I like you
5. Awaclus (5.9) I'm leaning closer to town on you for some reason. hurrah.
6. LaLight (3.5) I don't know why I have this feeling on you. but here you are.
7. SpaceAnemone (6.5) I kinda like you also
8. Hydrad (1241242) yes
9. Jimmmmm (5) I can't read you usually so you just get to exist for now
10. mcmcsalot (4.1) kinda scummy, but I also feel like some of the reason hes scummy is that hes busier then normal, so would lynch but not top priority
11. Robz888 (5.6) sure
12. DatSwan (3.8) slight scum
13. Galzria (6) I don't know why you are here but here you are!
14. IDontPlayThisGame (4.5) basically neutral
Hydrad I know this is a thing you do but I would refrain from doing it so early and so specifically. All this really accomplishes is letting scum know exactly how easy it is to get you to lynch people. This coming from someone who was really in favor of early and often reads lists until I realized how nice it was for scum.
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Super early post count
31 - idontplaythisgame (3)
29 - Awaclus (1)
27 - Eevee (1)
22 - mcmcsalot (1)
19 - EFHW (1)
19 - Gkrieg (1)
18 - SpaceAnemone (1)
14 - Hydrad (1)
14 - Galzria (2)
9 - Robz (2)
8 - Lalight (1)
8 - Datswan (2)
6 - iguanauiguana (1)
6 - Jimmmm (1)
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Accrued votes(in order):
EFHW
gkrieg13: Hydrad, Hydrad(2), eevee
iguanaiguana
Eevee: spaceanemone, lalight, mcmc
Awaclus: Jimm, EFHW
LaLight: eevee, EFHW
SpaceAnemone: Robz, Jimm
Hydrad: IDP, mcmc
Jimmmmm
mcmcsalot: iguana, Galz, awaclus, gkrieg, lalight
Robz888: mcmc, robz, gkrieg, IDP, eevee
DatSwan
Galzria: IDP, mcmc
IDontPlayThisGame: Lalight, Jimm
Placed votes(not in order):
EFHW: Awaclus, Lalight
gkrieg13: mcmc
iguanaiguana: mcmc
Eevee: gkrieg, lalight, robz
Awaclus: mcmc
LaLight: eevee, mcmc, IDP
SpaceAnemone: eevee
Hydrad: Gkrieg(3)
Jimmmmm: awaclus, space
mcmcsalot: eevee, hydrad, robz, glaz
Robz888: Space, Robz
DatSwan
Galzria: mcmc
IDontPlayThisGame: hydrad, robz, galz
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Anyway I'm voting McMc for the reasons Galzria laid out more or less, and didn't move it because nothing changed all game and he's still the best vote I think. I noticed the jumpy voting on his first jump and then when he ignored my "vote for reactions" thing and did a few more jumps it seemed worse. I know he's busy. But this being a potential mercy kill with a good chance of hitting scum doesn't bother me in the least.
Hahahaha, you think it's scummy of me to ignore your post that was literally "vote: mcmc for reaction", but you also think my jumpy votes robz for not mentioning massclaim, on galz for being hammer happy and on eevee for omgus (which as I have explained were to get reactions) is also scummy. Are robz and galz and eevee scummy for ignoring my votes on them...no the votes just didn't accomplish what I wanted hence moving them, yours didn't accomplish what you wanted but now you have conveniently turned it into a sheep vote while adding nothing to the case.
Galzria is sheeping me, is what I am saying. He just had time to textdump before I did.
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oh we doing reads now?
I wanna do reads also.
0=scum, 4-6 is pretty neutral, 10 = town.
1. EFHW (5.9) you're close to being town. but not quiet there.
2. gkrieg13 (2.4) You're a scum
3. iguanaiguana (6.2) I like you last post but since there isn't a ton to go off of this could change fast
4. Eevee (6.7) I like you
5. Awaclus (5.9) I'm leaning closer to town on you for some reason. hurrah.
6. LaLight (3.5) I don't know why I have this feeling on you. but here you are.
7. SpaceAnemone (6.5) I kinda like you also
8. Hydrad (1241242) yes
9. Jimmmmm (5) I can't read you usually so you just get to exist for now
10. mcmcsalot (4.1) kinda scummy, but I also feel like some of the reason hes scummy is that hes busier then normal, so would lynch but not top priority
11. Robz888 (5.6) sure
12. DatSwan (3.8) slight scum
13. Galzria (6) I don't know why you are here but here you are!
14. IDontPlayThisGame (4.5) basically neutral
Hydrad I know this is a thing you do but I would refrain from doing it so early and so specifically. All this really accomplishes is letting scum know exactly how easy it is to get you to lynch people. This coming from someone who was really in favor of early and often reads lists until I realized how nice it was for scum.
You just have to keep changing your reads every few hours. Problem solved.
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IDontPlayThisGame (because he's obv!town... although he does say mislynching him D1 = a town victory.)
Catching up, but I wanted to address this first. Iguana...please don't ever misquote me like that again. It's very misleading and dishonest and it contributes to confusion. I never said that mislynching me D1 is a guarantee of a town victory. It's any D1 lynch of me.
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I know mcmc and I are very different players, but I've been aware in my own scum games that I feel guilt and don't commit as much, and then I'm more likely to use being unusually busy as an excuse for not posting. Annoyingly, it's also perfectly possible to be busy town not posting, especially because we're all pretty lax about posting requirements at times.
I have a bit of a habit of scumreading mcmc anyway. And his defensive responses lately haven't felt overtly townie, but he is at least offering up an alternative wagon in the form of Eevee, though he's not voting for Eevee right now, which is a negative. Argh, I'm in two minds about mcmc, and this was only meant to be a super-brief though to post in between tasks at work..
This seems pretty scummy from Space. While I can't confirm that mcmc really is busy as I don't know him IRL, trying to call him out as scum for it sounds like building a case where there isn't one. Our lives outside of mafia continue regardless of our alignment and I believe that people don't try to use IRL excuses to lurk as scum, much like people don't strategically declare V/LAs to attempt to dodge lynches (my memory is that V/LA people usually aren't lynched).
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Hydrad I know this is a thing you do but I would refrain from doing it so early and so specifically. All this really accomplishes is letting scum know exactly how easy it is to get you to lynch people. This coming from someone who was really in favor of early and often reads lists until I realized how nice it was for scum.
interesting. i'll keep that in mind
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vote: LaLight. EFHW makes a good case.
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vote: LaLight. EFHW makes a good case.
I keep thinking that faust is posting in his own game because of the color scheme in your new avatar.
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@iguana’s most recent post. Keep in mind I have no v/la thread post which I believe we have discussed in the past is morally incorrect to lie about and use to benefit. It is 100% fine for me to lie in thread about being busy.
I think the important thing is my posts aren’t less as I am not v/la. My schedule has just changed as such I do not have the extremely large periods of time I had before to formulate and make cases/arguments against people like I did before and am instead trying to create interactions and gain reads that way while still keeping up. The key would be not to think is mcmc active or not, it’s is his activity scummy or not. Which is why my most recent defense explained my reasons for the votes and posts i have been making and why I think that is still townie just a different style of townie then y’all are used to from me.
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vote: LaLight. EFHW makes a good case.
I keep thinking that faust is posting in his own game because of the color scheme in your new avatar.
Sorry about that!
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Vote Count 1.4
Eevee (1): SpaceAnemone
gkrieg13 (2): Hydrad, Eevee
mcmcsalot (4): iguanaiguana, Galzria, Awaclus, LaLight
Hydrad (2): IDontPlayThisGame, mcmcsalot
SpaceAnemone (1): Robz888
IDontPlayThisGame (1): Jimmmmm
LaLight (2): EFHW, gkrieg13
Not Voting (1): DatSwan
With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day 1 ends May 31, 2018, 06:00:00 am. That is in less than 16 hours.
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Day 1 ends tomorrow???? We should try to soft deadline tonight then as many people can’t make it on.
vote: lalight he is a better lynch then Hydrad, I agree with much of what efhw said. I would also be open to eevee.
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request prod on robz and jimmm
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Ok it’s like 130am here and i Am halfway done with reads- summary so far would be:
(Surprise) i think Galz is skummy. Not enough too much outside influence to his posts. That being said- only game i have played with him where he flipped skum he was afk for most and subbed out so gonna keep an eye on how that progresses.
Awaclus challenging the randomness here (kill me) actually feels towny? If he were skum he already has the perfect meta set up - he can just say one liners for 3 days before anyone brings him up.
Mcmc feels like lynch bait.
As previously mentioned space seems towny.
Eevee also seems towny. Don’t really get the hate on this one - thier responses thus far seem to be driving conversation.
Robz still reading
I have a late start day tomorrow so i will expand and post then.
Catching up from last night:
This post strikes me as off - Maybe it's that it's 1:30am, but there's nothing really concise here. It's all a lot of generics. DatSwan is right that he -literally- always finds me scummy, but he also always has actual reasons for it, not just "I find him scummy because I always find him scummy".
The read on Mcmc as lynch bait - Why? Just because? It's an arbitrary read. Is Mcmc town and you know this to be a thing so you're trying to paint yourself in a good light? Or do you actually have a basis for your belief here that he's town and thus lynch bait? Are you two scum partners and you're trying to derail votes on him? What's the defense behind this opinion?
I must've missed your Space read from before, so I'll need to go back and look for it. Unless you feel like elaborating?
Why does Eevee seem townie exactly? His responses are "driving conversation" because he's one of the more active players. This results in much of the responses from other players being to and about him. The same can be said for Awaclus (although oddly, not IDPTG, who also has a high post count).
I agree with your Awaclus point lol.
IDK - maybe Datswan just rushed this post - but it feels very "I need to put opinions out there, but I haven't really put any thought into them", which is easier to do as scum knowing alignments than as town.
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First RMM game in a looooooooooong time. It's permissible to just act crazy and post nonsense, yes?
No massclaim comment? vote: robz
This vote was on the basis that robz has had some early mass claim posts that were tied to his alignment and I intended to get a reaction from robz that I might be able to begin a read from.
Now I'm curious. would you auto hammer yourself Galz?
Lets see vote: galz
This vote was intended to rile galz up as it is of course a bad vote checking for scummy over defensiveness.
vote: eevee for omgus
Similar to he galz vote, wanted to check if eevee would defend his jokey lalight vote if I took it more seriously and called it omgus.
vote: hydrad
Legitimate vote due to the fact that he proposed we claim vt/not vt in a game where scum wants to hit pr’s more than others.
Also going back to galz point. I guess I was trying to hit both point with my one statement and didn’t articulate well. I am not typical town me because of my busier schedule and that is manifesting in such a way that instead of being able to make my own long form case posts and pursuadibg others to join me I am following and looking at what others are saying and trying my best to create interactions and get reactions with my votes.
I'm not sold because, well, it's different - and I feel like the catching - and your subsequent acknowledgement and defense - of it definitely gives you a feel that I'm not as familiar and comfortable with. You're a scary player for the opposing faction though, as town or as scum - and on this basis alone I think I'm going to unvote. I've liked your posts and defenses, even if I don't feel comfortable with my read on you... but I think it's a greater mistake to lynch town!Mcmc D1 then it is NOT to lynch scum!Mcmc D1.
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Regarding Eevee:
I don't think I've ever, in over 30 games played with him, had a scum read on him. His posting style is always so upbeat and cheery that it's hard for me to think he could be up to nefarious deeds. In regards to the discussion on massclaiming, his being against it to begin with is more out-of-line for Eevee as I remember him than is his "Let's do it because it sounds fun". He definitely backpeddaled quickly and changed position on it.... but I don't see why scum would do so publicly and quickly - it's not as if there was an obvious shift in group opinion from the other people in the game that he would've felt he needed to gel with them.
Now, he IS being rather talkative overall (compared to how I recall him being), but that may be a bias I'm having due to the general lack of activity from everyone else. Eevee, as I've seen him as scum, tends to try harder than his normal town self. He comes across as forced because he wants to be read as town. This "try harder" attitude often manifests itself in a higher-than-average post count, as well as him town-reading everybody, not wanting to commit to scum reads because he's scared (maybe not the right word) of OMGUS and drawing attention to himself. He's hedgy as scum, and always, always, always (as is his nature) suuuuuuper polite and nice.
Going off of this (which I agree with for the most part), I think some of eevee's comments so far have felt like scum!eevee. Underlined felt scummy to me in the first place, you add to it that it could be eevee pivoting in an attempt to look more towny because there isn't a game related reason for pivoting. Italicised I also agree with but its a pretty slippery slope because I want to encourage posting as much as possible and could be he is just energized. Bolded is actually the best point and it feels like his defense of me was an awkward attempt to subtly buddy me into losing my slight scum read on him.
I agree with the bolded part of your case on Eevee here. That is perhaps the most scum!Eevee thing he's done. For the rest... I just don't feel strongly that you're right or wrong. The argument that the pivot on the underlined part was done by scum!Eevee because it would appear to be a town!Eevee move is just an circular argument. And I abhor the f.ds meta of finding people who are active to be the most scummy (it punishes active play while rewarding lurker-ism).
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I want to lynch Lalight. He has 9 posts total, some of which are off-task. This post reads as illogical=scummy to me. Of course we shouldn't lynch town, but the point is we don't know if he is or not. That bit of reasoning seems unnecessary and like scum trying to look like town:
I am against mass claiming for now. Scum will know who to kill to get a cool role.
I lean scum on EFHW for voting for Awaclus, I don't think he's scum. And whether he's cluttering the thread or not, if he's town we shouldn't vote him. Also, @SA, how exactly do we know 31% of people are scums? Maybe here's only one scum and the setup is still balanced? Looks like a scumslip to me
He never answered this question:
I would very much like to vote: Eevee
Call it gut
Can you spell out the gut feeling?
And his mcmc vote timing was scummy, as I mentioned recently.
I like this post, and this read. After catching up here I'm going to look at LaLight's posts in context (shouldn't take too long if he's only made 9 of them!) to see how I feel about him myself.
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Anyway I'm voting McMc for the reasons Galzria laid out more or less, and didn't move it because nothing changed all game and he's still the best vote I think. I noticed the jumpy voting on his first jump and then when he ignored my "vote for reactions" thing and did a few more jumps it seemed worse. I know he's busy. But this being a potential mercy kill with a good chance of hitting scum doesn't bother me in the least.
Hahahaha, you think it's scummy of me to ignore your post that was literally "vote: mcmc for reaction", but you also think my jumpy votes robz for not mentioning massclaim, on galz for being hammer happy and on eevee for omgus (which as I have explained were to get reactions) is also scummy. Are robz and galz and eevee scummy for ignoring my votes on them...no the votes just didn't accomplish what I wanted hence moving them, yours didn't accomplish what you wanted but now you have conveniently turned it into a sheep vote while adding nothing to the case.
Galzria is sheeping me, is what I am saying. He just had time to textdump before I did.
That's not how sheeping works man. Sure, maybe you voted first, and sure, maybe you had reasons that mirror what I said when I made my case - but without stating those reasons it's just as easy for you to say "Oh, I had them first - I just didn't post them" as it is for you to back-fill reasons for your vote that didn't exist when you made the vote. Scum are perfectly comfortable casting votes around and waiting for others to do their dirty work of making cases for them. If Mcmc gets lynched and flips town, nobody is going to look back and go "Oh, Iguana totally started that wagon on him".
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IDontPlayThisGame (because he's obv!town... although he does say mislynching him D1 = a town victory.)
Catching up, but I wanted to address this first. Iguana...please don't ever misquote me like that again. It's very misleading and dishonest and it contributes to confusion. I never said that mislynching me D1 is a guarantee of a town victory. It's any D1 lynch of me.
If we lynched you today would be be a mislynch?
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Anyway I'm voting McMc for the reasons Galzria laid out more or less, and didn't move it because nothing changed all game and he's still the best vote I think. I noticed the jumpy voting on his first jump and then when he ignored my "vote for reactions" thing and did a few more jumps it seemed worse. I know he's busy. But this being a potential mercy kill with a good chance of hitting scum doesn't bother me in the least.
Hahahaha, you think it's scummy of me to ignore your post that was literally "vote: mcmc for reaction", but you also think my jumpy votes robz for not mentioning massclaim, on galz for being hammer happy and on eevee for omgus (which as I have explained were to get reactions) is also scummy. Are robz and galz and eevee scummy for ignoring my votes on them...no the votes just didn't accomplish what I wanted hence moving them, yours didn't accomplish what you wanted but now you have conveniently turned it into a sheep vote while adding nothing to the case.
Galzria is sheeping me, is what I am saying. He just had time to textdump before I did.
That's not how sheeping works man. Sure, maybe you voted first, and sure, maybe you had reasons that mirror what I said when I made my case - but without stating those reasons it's just as easy for you to say "Oh, I had them first - I just didn't post them" as it is for you to back-fill reasons for your vote that didn't exist when you made the vote. Scum are perfectly comfortable casting votes around and waiting for others to do their dirty work of making cases for them. If Mcmc gets lynched and flips town, nobody is going to look back and go "Oh, Iguana totally started that wagon on him".
Ok, you can have the glory then, sheep.
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Quick look at LaLight:
Post #1:
Hey everyone, good to be back again and not finally be scum. vote: idptg
Was this vote because of IDPTG's quickvote on Robz, or his comment on the deadline? As far as RVS votes go, if it's for the former, that's a decent counter-vote.
Post #2:
Deadline talk. Nothing here.
Post #3:
I would very much like to vote: Eevee
Call it gut
EFHW asked him to expand on this, which I don't believe he's done.
Post #4:
I am against mass claiming for now. Scum will know who to kill to get a cool role.
I lean scum on EFHW for voting for Awaclus, I don't think he's scum. And whether he's cluttering the thread or not, if he's town we shouldn't vote him. Also, @SA, how exactly do we know 31% of people are scums? Maybe here's only one scum and the setup is still balanced? Looks like a scumslip to me
Demonstrative lack of knowledge regarding the setup. Easy to do as town, easy to fake as scum. Regarding the EFHW read - It's weirdly stated. It essentially boils down to "I'm scum reading EFHW because EFHW is scum reading a player I town read" - that's fine, I guess, but the "If he's town we shouldn't vote him" sentiment is definitely off.
Post #5:
In reference to this post:
Setup Info
This game has exactly 2 factions, mafia and town. The mafia consists of 4 players.
"Complains" about setup editing - except I don't believe this was an edited part of the setup - I think faust always had this information publicly stated at the start of the game.
Post #6:
Notes that nobody can read Awaclus
Post #7:
Agrees with my case on Mcmc, also states he finds Eevee scummy - still never responded to EFHW from earlier on, and hasn't elaborated on this read since then. In fact, this is the first he's re-mentioned it since Post #3.
Post #8:
vote: mcmc though
This isn't completely out of the blue as EFHW suggests, as Post #7 said he agreed with my case on Mcmc. There are 21 posts between the two, so it's completely believable that town!LaLight decided he wanted his vote on Mcmc.
And that's pretty much it. Biggest things against LaLight:
1. The vote for Eevee in Post #3 with no expansion on why - despite being asked - and then restating that read 200ish posts later without touching on it at any point in between... and still not giving any details as to why.
2. The odd phrasing on why EFHW is scummy, and that people shouldn't vote for Awaclus.
3. The lack of posts and content overall.
For a D1 lynch approaching deadline (and I will NOT be here for deadline, btw), I'm good with casting my vote here:
Vote: LaLight
I would also be ok with the following (in order):
Datswan
Eevee
Mcmc
PPE - Iguana
For almost everybody else I feel like we would be looking at a crapshoot at best.
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Nah dude, not Lalight.
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Nah dude, not Lalight.
Convince us.
I am not planning to be present at deadline. Sometimes I wake up when I don't want to, so if I'm awake near that time I will check in.
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Ok it’s like 130am here and i Am halfway done with reads- summary so far would be:
(Surprise) i think Galz is skummy. Not enough too much outside influence to his posts. That being said- only game i have played with him where he flipped skum he was afk for most and subbed out so gonna keep an eye on how that progresses.
Awaclus challenging the randomness here (kill me) actually feels towny? If he were skum he already has the perfect meta set up - he can just say one liners for 3 days before anyone brings him up.
Mcmc feels like lynch bait.
As previously mentioned space seems towny.
Eevee also seems towny. Don’t really get the hate on this one - thier responses thus far seem to be driving conversation.
Robz still reading
I have a late start day tomorrow so i will expand and post then.
Catching up from last night:
This post strikes me as off - Maybe it's that it's 1:30am, but there's nothing really concise here. It's all a lot of generics. DatSwan is right that he -literally- always finds me scummy, but he also always has actual reasons for it, not just "I find him scummy because I always find him scummy".
The read on Mcmc as lynch bait - Why? Just because? It's an arbitrary read. Is Mcmc town and you know this to be a thing so you're trying to paint yourself in a good light? Or do you actually have a basis for your belief here that he's town and thus lynch bait? Are you two scum partners and you're trying to derail votes on him? What's the defense behind this opinion?
I must've missed your Space read from before, so I'll need to go back and look for it. Unless you feel like elaborating?
Why does Eevee seem townie exactly? His responses are "driving conversation" because he's one of the more active players. This results in much of the responses from other players being to and about him. The same can be said for Awaclus (although oddly, not IDPTG, who also has a high post count).
I agree with your Awaclus point lol.
IDK - maybe Datswan just rushed this post - but it feels very "I need to put opinions out there, but I haven't really put any thought into them", which is easier to do as scum knowing alignments than as town.
I’m not gonna respond to these one by one becaause the post opens with “here is a summary, more to come”. Pretty sure you’ll find your answers in there.
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Sure I'll
Vote: lalight for now. I'll be on again before deadline at least. But probably not at deadline.
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Nah dude, not Lalight.
Convince us.
I am not planning to be present at deadline. Sometimes I wake up when I don't want to, so if I'm awake near that time I will check in.
Moreso than him not being overwhelmingly scummy, he's easy to read. If he's scum, we will get info to figure that out. A holiday weekend lead to a low activity D1, so I would support lynching a low content, hard to read player. We just don't have that many interactions yet.
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Nah dude, not Lalight.
Convince us.
I am not planning to be present at deadline. Sometimes I wake up when I don't want to, so if I'm awake near that time I will check in.
Moreso than him not being overwhelmingly scummy, he's easy to read. If he's scum, we will get info to figure that out. A holiday weekend lead to a low activity D1, so I would support lynching a low content, hard to read player. We just don't have that many interactions yet.
So who are you proposing? I think LaLight is on the easier side to read as well, but he reads as scummy to me right now. It also wasn't a holiday (probably?) where he lives...
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I propose McMc, Jimmmm or Awaclus.
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I propose mcmc.
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Ugh I've just caught up, had no clue the deadline was tomorrow. I can get on for it as long as I get to sleep soon, but won't be here much before.
I'm a couple drinks in, but I'm definitely ready for some active posting during the night if we could mimic a deadline scramble here now before the Americans go to bed. because that's effectively our sitution. Everyone should be voting now. Going to respond to stuff soon once I get to my computer.
I'll check back to do some rereads, but currently liking the LaLight case a lot. His stance on me seems very scummy, I was posting earlier about someone mucking up the waters regarding me and LL's behavior fits that to the dot.
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Why do you want to lynch Awaclus, Iguana? I would say he has been maybe little less combative than I would expect, but not overly so. I would say that he has a higher post count that I would have guessed, but he hasn't really felt scummy to me at any point.
I don't really like the case on mcmc, I've seen the facebook posts and stuff, him being busier than usual seems to fit this behavior quite well. The only thing giving me pause is that I often develop very early, very strong townreads on mcmc and I feel those have had a pretty high success rate too, and nothing like that is going on here. While I don't like the cases against mcmc so much, it's not because I think he's towny, it's just that I don't think the behavior people are highlighting from him indicates scum to me.
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Reread gkrieg, since that felt like another person I might want to lynch.
Vote: gkrieg sounds good to me. He's been much less of a factor than I would expect.
This happens to me nearly every D1. I'm just not very active D1.
This caught my eye, I feel gkrieg has been pretty active in non-relevant discussions in the thread but the actual game-related posts are few and far between, and pretty short in general.
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I didn't really agree with all of Galzria's meta points regarding me, but it's probably not the most fruitful thing to engage. Everyone's a hero of their own narrative. Galzria probably has a better grasp of how you guys perceive me than I do. The analysis read pretty genuine and insightful to me though, light town points for Galzria (moreso for the fact that long, insightful posts are what I'd expect from townGalz).
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I like lynching lalight or gkrieg. IDTPG also feels off to me, it's always an alarm for me when someone's much higher in the post count that I would have expected.
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I was about to start listing off reads, but mcmc's (right? sorry if it was someone else) point about how helpful it may be for scum is good, although I feel that's more of a factor later in the game when reads are more set in stone and individual people have more say in who we lynch. Like, if I or Hydrad strongly scumreads someone, how big of an impact on the lynch is that going to have in a large game day 1 or 2?
Still, I'll leave it in reserve. I've listed my strongest suspicions already.
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Reread gkrieg, since that felt like another person I might want to lynch.
Vote: gkrieg sounds good to me. He's been much less of a factor than I would expect.
This happens to me nearly every D1. I'm just not very active D1.
This caught my eye, I feel gkrieg has been pretty active in non-relevant discussions in the thread but the actual game-related posts are few and far between, and pretty short in general.
I disagree that I have been active in non-relevant discussions but not active elsewhere. I'm pretty sure my last 10 or so posts have been very game-related.
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I like lynching lalight or gkrieg. IDTPG also feels off to me, it's always an alarm for me when someone's much higher in the post count that I would have expected.
I don't know if I should feel good or bad that we are sharing reads...
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Reread gkrieg, since that felt like another person I might want to lynch.
Vote: gkrieg sounds good to me. He's been much less of a factor than I would expect.
This happens to me nearly every D1. I'm just not very active D1.
This caught my eye, I feel gkrieg has been pretty active in non-relevant discussions in the thread but the actual game-related posts are few and far between, and pretty short in general.
I disagree that I have been active in non-relevant discussions but not active elsewhere. I'm pretty sure my last 10 or so posts have been very game-related.
It's a lot of one sentence posts, not a lot of reasons provided. I guess I'm prone to thinking that random musings regarding the game are towny, since that's what my own process looks like. It's definitely true that your game-related posting has become more frequent as the game has started getting more "serious", though.
@Hydrad
Great minds think alike, perhaps! It's towny of you to worry about that. I hadn't realized our reads were so similar (but since I know I'm not scum who copied yours, I'm not so not worried about that).
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Vote: LaLight
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Why do you want to lynch Awaclus, Iguana? I would say he has been maybe little less combative than I would expect, but not overly so. I would say that he has a higher post count that I would have guessed, but he hasn't really felt scummy to me at any point.
I don't really like the case on mcmc, I've seen the facebook posts and stuff, him being busier than usual seems to fit this behavior quite well. The only thing giving me pause is that I often develop very early, very strong townreads on mcmc and I feel those have had a pretty high success rate too, and nothing like that is going on here. While I don't like the cases against mcmc so much, it's not because I think he's towny, it's just that I don't think the behavior people are highlighting from him indicates scum to me.
Awaclus because the plan he proposed for the mass claim seems like something he migjt try as scum then argue its all jist sound reasoning even though he knows it isn't. Plus, hard to read and always low activity.
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Awaclus because the plan he proposed for the mass claim seems like something he migjt try as scum then argue its all jist sound reasoning even though he knows it isn't.
What part about it is not sound reasoning?
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Why do you want to lynch Awaclus, Iguana? I would say he has been maybe little less combative than I would expect, but not overly so. I would say that he has a higher post count that I would have guessed, but he hasn't really felt scummy to me at any point.
I don't really like the case on mcmc, I've seen the facebook posts and stuff, him being busier than usual seems to fit this behavior quite well. The only thing giving me pause is that I often develop very early, very strong townreads on mcmc and I feel those have had a pretty high success rate too, and nothing like that is going on here. While I don't like the cases against mcmc so much, it's not because I think he's towny, it's just that I don't think the behavior people are highlighting from him indicates scum to me.
Good reasons. I'll tempt the gods: townread on iguana.
Awaclus because the plan he proposed for the mass claim seems like something he migjt try as scum then argue its all jist sound reasoning even though he knows it isn't. Plus, hard to read and always low activity.
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Why do you want to lynch Awaclus, Iguana? I would say he has been maybe little less combative than I would expect, but not overly so. I would say that he has a higher post count that I would have guessed, but he hasn't really felt scummy to me at any point.
I don't really like the case on mcmc, I've seen the facebook posts and stuff, him being busier than usual seems to fit this behavior quite well. The only thing giving me pause is that I often develop very early, very strong townreads on mcmc and I feel those have had a pretty high success rate too, and nothing like that is going on here. While I don't like the cases against mcmc so much, it's not because I think he's towny, it's just that I don't think the behavior people are highlighting from him indicates scum to me.
Awaclus because the plan he proposed for the mass claim seems like something he migjt try as scum then argue its all jist sound reasoning even though he knows it isn't. Plus, hard to read and always low activity.
Good reasons. I'll tempt the gods: townread on iguana.
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Had a crazy day. Need to catchup. Will do do tomorrow first thing. Boozy dungeons and dragons session tonight.
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Had a crazy day. Need to catchup. Will do do tomorrow first thing. Boozy dungeons and dragons session tonight.
9 hours until deadline!!
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Ya I think we really need people to be voting. I think a decent amount of people haven't realized how close deadline is? This could be bad.
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Ya I think we really need people to be voting. I think a decent amount of people haven't realized how close deadline is? This could be bad.
It looks bad.
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Had a crazy day. Need to catchup. Will do do tomorrow first thing. Boozy dungeons and dragons session tonight.
9 hours until deadline!!
This guy is drunk. It's actually 1 hour more than that (9'50left at the time of this post).
We need 8 to lynch, if I counted correctly, LL is at 6 votes and L-2, and the 2nd leading wagon is mcmc at 3 (L-5).
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I'm going to bed, may or may not wake up before deadline.
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Had a crazy day. Need to catchup. Will do do tomorrow first thing. Boozy dungeons and dragons session tonight.
9 hours until deadline!!
This guy is drunk. It's actually 1 hour more than that (9'50left at the time of this post).
We need 8 to lynch, if I counted correctly, LL is at 6 votes and L-2, and the 2nd leading wagon is mcmc at 3 (L-5).
oh i didn't actually realize LL was that close. that makes me feel better. I thought for a second the leading wagon would of been at like 3 or 4
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Had a crazy day. Need to catchup. Will do do tomorrow first thing. Boozy dungeons and dragons session tonight.
drunken jealous furocity swells amongst my chest
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mod prod on thath jimm prod
please vote lalight so we can get a lynch
lalight, noone is going to be on later if you are a strong pr say so now, if not awkwardly avoid this post as we no lynch or go somewhere else
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Guys I am here I am voting off both wagons and I absolutely will be around until deadline, I am finishing reading isos so I can post before action but consider my vote counted in to get a lynch through. #NightOwl
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Guys I am here I am voting off both wagons and I absolutely will be around until deadline, I am finishing reading isos so I can post before action but consider my vote counted in to get a lynch through. #NightOwl
*and girls*
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I will also be more or less around at deadline.
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Will we hear from Lalight before then?
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I will vote for either. Prefer LaLight.
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Vote Count 1.5
Eevee (1): SpaceAnemone
mcmcsalot (3): iguanaiguana, Awaclus, LaLight
Hydrad (1): IDontPlayThisGame
SpaceAnemone (1): Robz888
IDontPlayThisGame (1): Jimmmmm
LaLight (6): EFHW, gkrieg13, mcmcsalot, Galzria, Hydrad, Eevee
Not Voting (1): DatSwan
With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day 1 ends May 31, 2018, 06:00:00 am. That is in about 5 hours.
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Happy to join the LaLight wagon, and intend to do so in the next couple of hours.
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Towny
1) SpaceAnemone(18): Bunch of nonsense about RVS and time zones for a few posts and then at #121 like one of my fave posts in a while (regarding the benefits of claiming based on solving the set up). #174 obv doing good Space game solve with the 31% chance. I have noticed a trend that Skum!Space tends to do less "math" so seeing this early is more town points.
Then, there is this post:
No, they can't claim whatever they want. They have to claim something that will be indistinguishable from their actual role as far as town can tell, which can get quite tricky especially because their actual role can suddenly change to something unpredictable.
You make it sound like a scum player can expect to wake up with a totally unexpected role at the start of the day! That's not it at all. The way I understand it, their roles only change if they perform the NK. Now, given that massclaim means that scums know exactly what all the townie roles are (except if we lie, which I don't think is something you're suggesting), they would just need to pick one of their group to wake up with a known role they can plan in advance.
I realise I'm getting perilously close to offering advice to the scumteam, but I feel we're still in pretty obvious territory here. And advice for town: until we have useful PR-derived game information that we can all share and act upon, I think going into any significant detail about our roles isn't a good idea. Of course, I have no idea what other roles are out there, so maybe some of you do have reasons to want to share.. I'm not stopping you, but I'm not going to make my own role easy or convenient for scum to take.
... which feels off. like I agree with everything she says, but just it almost too helpful. Absolutely choosing to ignore it for now, just want it out in the world.
Finishes with a good interaction with Awaclus as well as Eevee.
Can't remember who suggested it (Robz?) But I really do not think there is a "Space!Case" at this point.
2) Eevee (26): First relevant post is #111 (pointing out issue in the VT/NotVT mass claim idea), in which they make a good point. Next, they also agree with Space's game solve post. Goes VLA for a little bit and then returns now stating that they might actually be on board with the Awaclus claim idea because it would be fun and because of the amount of info it would potentially create - this part feels skummy to me in the sense that they flipped their beliefs on the claim... but also like "can't be skummy" because at this point the only skum reason to agree with it would be to like push for it and we had all pretty much made it clear there was no way it was gonna happen by now.
Then calls Space Town and Awaclus skummy.
And then a good solid post in #199 where they talk about how we should be assessing the pros and cons of the massclaim in regards to "when it is actually going to happen". This is a big reason why they are in my town pool right now.
Then to wrap it up - I just feel like the whole game they have been getting targeted too easily, and are defending themselves in a fine fashion. Town show at this point imo.
2) Awaclus (30): So first off... Awaclus has 30 posts and I think like less than 10 of them have been Awaclus-y. Which while weird... kind of taking the "if it looks like a town, and acts like a town..." approach here. I also stand by what I said before in regards to them pushing the meta discussion regarding the mass claim (that is to say I don't see why Skum!Awaclus would do this in any game, given they have the perfect skum meta to sit back and hide behind). I mean this is like the defn of a volatile read that could flip day to day, but for today, never gonna lynch here just based on the general premise above.
Null/Town
1) EFHW (19): Starts off with the first half + of posts just kind of RVS and asking random questions. Then starts on a (good line of questioning imo) about the relevance of the massclaim plan, instead of focusing on whether or not we should do it. Then jumps Awaclus to LL. Origninal reasoning on LL was based on the word "though" and then follow up reasoning is based on the fact they didn't answer what "gut feeling" means - bad... baaddddd cases. However, everything else feels towny to point for me so I am leaning Null/Town.
2) gkrieg13 (23): First 9 posts have zero content about the game. Opens in post #143 agreeing that the game seems like a closed set up.
Thinks space is town.
Doesn't support a mass claim.
Votes MCMC.
Aknoledges that they always get looked at for not being very active day 1 - which is meh, but also true.
I absolutely agree with his most recent post about how he started non relative and as of late he has been pushing for answers (spec on Galz and Evee). He also switched over to LL somewhere in the end there.
All in all this is just to be referenced later, I don't think I ever could find a GK vote on Day 1 really.
3) Hydrad (27): Opens with the Galz snap hammer conversation.
Then starts the "who wants to Mass Claim" in #84.
Follows that up with the VT/not VT claim idea, which I read as too dumb to be skummy.
#120 points out that there is a difference between getting reactions to claims and actually thinking they will go through.
#184 he finds Eevee towny for finding him towny? that doesn't make sense to me.
#185 he thinks Awaclus is normal thus far this game... which I disagree with. Probably NAI, but just to point it out.
#236 really not giving up on the GK gut feel thing. I am the opposite of most on this I think, I actually think Town tunnels like this more often then Skum.
#270 we get the skum to chum list. I also, think differently than most about the "abbreviated reads list". Most of the time it gets fought that there is not enough reasoning - but a lot of the time it is just town trying to let people know where they stand.
Then he votes LL.
Then he claims to not of known that the wagon was that large on them - I don't know what to make of that. I feel like skum would be very aware of wagon counts all the time, but obv it could be an untrue statement.
All in all Null on the Towny side. Don't like lynching here.
4) mcmcsalot (27): First thing that pings me is the interactions with the time zone stuff and then the joke about G-U-T-F-E-E-L-I-N-G. Skum makes jokes more often in my experience.
#196 shows they are clearly reading along, making a list of for and against mass claim. Weird to note that MCMC is less than usually involved in this convo though.
#204 finds Eevee skummy.
#263 and #264 both are good solid posts. Answers questions and, assuming they are actually busy building coops or whatever, the effort would seem towny.
Trying hard to not read alignment off of #274 - but I disagree with them. I think posts like this are extremely useful to town.
#276 is a good vote accumulation record.
And then the LL vote.
I may be a sucker, but when IRL pop ups tend to make me disregard certain aspects of people's play, especially this early. Example being that I would normally find MCMC veryyyyy off because of their lack of D1 content when they normally are so involved, but idk... shit happens. Going in as Null/Towny for now.
Null/Null
1) IDontPlayThisGame (32): Opens with a Robz vote, which for reasons I am retaining for the time being, I find Towny for IDP.
#110 Calls Hydrad out on the bad idea.
#118 makes like.... a really good point. to the extent that I have used it since I read it in conceptualizing skum connections.
All the way up to #279 is pretty much just him emphasizing the claim thing. In #279 he calls out II on mis quoting him - which is fair.
IDK what to make of the last post regarding Space and VLA stuff.
All in all, IDP hits as the only player in my Null/Null category. Could be standard town, or perfect skum. They are def capable of being either.
Null/Skum
1)Galzria (25+ no UN): After pre-game, RVS, and forum time bs, we start with him regarding his hammer tech recently. First thing that pinged me was how it sounded when Robz brought it up and Galz responded. I think Town!Galz normally lets people talk it out and guess first. That being said, I have no clue what Skum!Galz does so pretty much I am reading this situation as "Different!Galz" which to me, in this set up, is the same as Skum!Galz.
Then he is out for a while before being prodded, and fwiw, I can vouch (as I work alongside him) that work was just a freeking cluster over that time.
#249 - First real post that helped me connect some (what I hope to be) dots. The part about Eevee I am just taking as NAI because my brain will explode trying to figure it out D1, so just like... to be remembered. The top portion though is towny.. but off. And I unfortunately do not have a better explanation than that. It just feels off.
#255 feels overly defensive.
Prod on me - putting all of my effort ever into NAI reading that, because idk what to do with it.
Then there is #289 which I can't bring myself to NAI read. I clearly stated it was late, this was a summary post, and I would expand on it later... and then he kind of lays into me on like exactly those three platforms.
He unvotes in #290, which I am forced to read with either some town cred if MCMC is to ever flip as Town, or it would argue very potential partner liklihood between MCMC and Galz if one ever flips skum.
Then there is the whole "sheeping" convo.
Then he starts to add onto the case he agreed with on LL - to which I gotta say, there is some validity to imo.
He then votes for LL. (off of galz specific read - but he is followed by Eevee and Hydrad who were both on GK). Creates a huge counter/swing wagon for MCMC.
After a brief read last night I found him skummy, and tbh I still think it is skummy, but he is going in my skummy/null section for now because there are so many flips that could happen that would make me second guess myself. Also, the fact there have been ZERO votes for him is weird as hell!
2) Robz888 (7): Opens with a self vote - I always find that skummy.
And then... of thier 7 total posts in the game the rest is a bad case on Space (imo), voting, and saying sorry I will be catching up. Life happens, so he fades my for-sure-skum pool.. but like def not the Town!Robz I am used to. Also he is getting attacked a lot less than I would expect.
Skummy
1) iguanaiguana (15+ no UNtag): Opens with the harsh truth on how the Robz lynches have been going. Then does something I do not really like for the next couple posts (seems he was VLA during this time as well) - but he like just undermines everything to do with the massclaim. Comments on ignoring the mass claim posts in the re read. Just seems odd. At the very least it can be used to generate info/reads as it has been essentially our only topic of real discussion at this point.
Then #269 is the reads list with like 3 nulls and 6 towns, I can't bring myself to like... not find that at least partially skummy, but then again, I am having the same issue making my reads.
Then this weird bit with Galz that kind of seems a little fabricated tbh - Just because of how (just saying) ridiculous the whole bit was.
Then he turns down the LL idea and proposes a new pool [Jim, Awaclus, MCMC] - I think the selection of the pool is skummy as hell. Essentially, takes the leading wagon off the table (LL), while throwing in a lurker (Jim), the previous still there wagon (MCMC), and then Awaclus (which is arguably the easiest case to "fake" at this point). IDK it just pings off to me. In my skum bucket for now.
2) Jimmmm (7): Idk what to say here. Has 7 posts and they all consist of RVS, voting players based on timezones or setup talk, and declaring they will be there for DL. I don't really see the value in a lynch here, but I can't say I don't think they are skummy.
3) LaLight (7): Opens with GK and then switches to Eevee on gut feel.
States they are against mass claiming and questions SA's math on the 31%.
Then they agree with a Galz post and think MCMC and Eevee are skummy.
Then they vote MCMC and disappear.
Skummy. Just Skummy. IDK, call this one my gut feel.
So yeah, sorry that that had to all come out in one post. Promise to be more active going forward, but this is where I am at rn.
I have no problem lynching LL.
Vote: LaLight
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also meant to put this, but I think that is L-1.
Around until DL if anyone wants to talk shit out.
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2) Jimmmm (7): Idk what to say here. Has 7 posts and they all consist of RVS, voting players based on timezones or setup talk, and declaring they will be there for DL.
I legitimately thing IDPTG is scummy and LaLight is kind of scummy.
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2) Jimmmm (7): Idk what to say here. Has 7 posts and they all consist of RVS, voting players based on timezones or setup talk, and declaring they will be there for DL.
I legitimately thing IDPTG is scummy and LaLight is kind of scummy.
Like i believe you... i just don’t know why (or does anyone but you), which is not a strong town tactic
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2) Jimmmm (7): Idk what to say here. Has 7 posts and they all consist of RVS, voting players based on timezones or setup talk, and declaring they will be there for DL.
I legitimately thing IDPTG is scummy and LaLight is kind of scummy.
Like i believe you... i just don’t know why (or does anyone but you), which is not a strong town tactic
I mean I gave reasons - IDPTG had an overly concerned "Go Town" post which often comes from scum. LL didn't know the setup in the OP which is scummy.
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I’m motion detector who’ll know how many motions were there. Also all the reads i always have are gut feelings i can’t really explain with a lot of words and like huge percentage of you is aware of that
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Mcmc doesn’t look townie, as well as Eevee. EFHW though is on townie side now. Mcmc is just more aggressive and less pushing forwarf, post counts and vote counts are easy to do as both alignments. Eevee is overly polite, that’s a scum trait foe him. Schadd knows, but he isn’t here to back me up. I think gkrieg and ii are towns.
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If idp is scum, we’ll know soon enough, same with me, people
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Flavor name’s Skin
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I don't really feel like moving my vote right now.
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I don't really feel like moving my vote right now.
I think everyone’s asleep or pretends to be so we won’t lynch scum toDay
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As it is RMM I think no lynch is not that bad?
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2) Jimmmm (7): Idk what to say here. Has 7 posts and they all consist of RVS, voting players based on timezones or setup talk, and declaring they will be there for DL.
I legitimately thing IDPTG is scummy and LaLight is kind of scummy.
Like i believe you... i just don’t know why (or does anyone but you), which is not a strong town tactic
I mean I gave reasons - IDPTG had an overly concerned "Go Town" post which often comes from scum. LL didn't know the setup in the OP which is scummy.
Fair enough you did. I just didn't read the go town post from IDP as skummy.. he kind of does that a bit.
Where are you at here? I really do not like an MCMC lynch over LL
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I'm happy with an LL lynch.
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I’m motion detector who’ll know how many motions were there. Also all the reads i always have are gut feelings i can’t really explain with a lot of words and like huge percentage of you is aware of that
So this claim is not enough to get me off LL right now, but I should point out they added in the part where they get to know how many motions. Is there any merit in getting them to agree to a full claim tomorrow, and if they are lying about the role we can call them out on the amount of movement?
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I’m motion detector who’ll know how many motions were there. Also all the reads i always have are gut feelings i can’t really explain with a lot of words and like huge percentage of you is aware of that
So this claim is not enough to get me off LL right now, but I should point out they added in the part where they get to know how many motions. Is there any merit in getting them to agree to a full claim tomorrow, and if they are lying about the role we can call them out on the amount of movement?
I feel like this is kind of the problem with RMM. If we let LL off the hook due to the claim, then get say mcmc up to L-1, but he claims some cool PR so we just end up no lynching and have achieved nothing except two claims.
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Also unless I'm missing something Motion Detector is not a super powerful role.
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Vote Count 1.6
Eevee (1): SpaceAnemone
mcmcsalot (3): iguanaiguana, Awaclus, LaLight
Hydrad (1): IDontPlayThisGame
SpaceAnemone (1): Robz888
IDontPlayThisGame (1): Jimmmmm
LaLight (7): EFHW, gkrieg13, mcmcsalot, Galzria, Hydrad, Eevee, DatSwan
Not Voting (0)
With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day 1 ends May 31, 2018, 06:00:00 am. That is in 1 hour.
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I’m motion detector who’ll know how many motions were there. Also all the reads i always have are gut feelings i can’t really explain with a lot of words and like huge percentage of you is aware of that
So this claim is not enough to get me off LL right now, but I should point out they added in the part where they get to know how many motions. Is there any merit in getting them to agree to a full claim tomorrow, and if they are lying about the role we can call them out on the amount of movement?
I feel like this is kind of the problem with RMM. If we let LL off the hook due to the claim, then get say mcmc up to L-1, but he claims some cool PR so we just end up no lynching and have achieved nothing except two claims.
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Here and mostly caught up, except for one of Swan's WoTs, because I may have a meeting starting any moment now...
Vote: LL
Sorry, friend! You're probably what you say you are, but I'm not confident enough to go against town consensus to a no-lynch. Argh. We can sometimes read each other pretty well, and I feel like I'm not getting super scum vibes from you, but OTOH you were scumreading me at some point, and I'm super-townie-Space this time round, so something's at least slightly off :-(
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not sure how it suddenly started to happen that I am mislynched so often... anyway, I am what I said I am. If you didn't lynch me and even had a no lynch, I'd bring some information.
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Day 1 Final Vote Count
mcmcsalot (3): iguanaiguana, Awaclus, LaLight
Hydrad (1): IDontPlayThisGame
SpaceAnemone (1): Robz888
IDontPlayThisGame (1): Jimmmmm
LaLight (8): EFHW, gkrieg13, mcmcsalot, Galzria, Hydrad, Eevee, DatSwan, SpaceAnemone
Not Voting (0)
With 14 alive, it took 8 to lynch.
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That morning, Alex woke up feeling particularly bad. Their skin was itching all over and they could see strange red dots bobbing up on their skin. Alex was happy when they finally sat in the doctor's office. Unfortunately, he seemed at a loss and could not find a fitting diagnosis. A first guess was atopic dermititis, but after some tests it turned out to be wrong, not to mention that it wouldn't account for the rest of Alex's symptoms.
The doctor suggested that Alex should visit a hospital and prescribed some painkillers. Upon arriving at the hospital, Alex was told that they could only take them in in some weeks, when they would have free beds. So there was to be more waiting.
Alex sat at home. The painkillers only helped so much. They knew they weren't supposed to, but they could not stop scratching, scratching, scratching...
LaLight has been lynched! They were the Skin, the Quantitative Motion Detector!
Night 1 begins now. Since I will be at a wedding over the weekend, Night will probably last until Monday. The Night action deadline is extended until June 02, 2018, 12:00:00 pm.
Thread locked!
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Alex was finally admitted to a nearby hospital. They ran some general checks and tried to understand what caused their condition.
One day, a doctor entered Alex's room. "We have found something", she said matter-of-factly. "It does not explain all your symptoms, but definitely would cause some of them. Look here." She showed some pictures taken with MRI. They showed Alex's torso. "See these lumps?" She pointed to several lightly-colored areas. "It is very likely that those are transitional cell carcinoma. That is to say..."
"Cancer", Alex finished. They stared at the pictures in disbelief.
Jimmmmm has been killed! They were the Kidney, the Neighbor/1-shot Bulletproofer!
Day 2 begins!
Vote Count 2.0
Not Voting (12): EFHW, gkrieg13, iguanaiguana, Eevee, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, Hydrad, mcmcsalot, Robz888, DatSwan, Galzria, IDontPlayThisGame
With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Day 2 ends June 11, 2018, 03:30:00 am.
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huh a jimmm kill? interesting. I wonder why they picked that?
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huh a jimmm kill? interesting. I wonder why they picked that?
Probably his neighbor is scum and he told them what his role was.
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Day 1 Wagon
mcmcsalot (3): iguanaiguana, Awaclus, LaLight
Hydrad (1): IDontPlayThisGame
SpaceAnemone (1): Robz888
IDontPlayThisGame (1): Jimmmmm
LaLight (8): EFHW, gkrieg13, mcmcsalot, Galzria, Hydrad, Eevee, DatSwan, SpaceAnemone
Not Voting (0)
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I also think its fairly likely that flavor is tied to role based on the flips we have seen.
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Jimm was a total null factor yesterday. I think the wagon was actually fairly townie.
Lets go with sole pr related stuff then. For starters, I was targeted last night and I'll leave it there for now.
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I think the wagon was actually fairly townie.
Based on the fact that you were on the wagon, I don't.
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Jimm was a total null factor yesterday. I think the wagon was actually fairly townie.
Lets go with sole pr related stuff then. For starters, I was targeted last night and I'll leave it there for now.
Why do you think that wagon was townie?
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Gah, sorry I made the wrong call to hammer LL :-(
Should I have let it run to no-lynch? I'm in the same position at the end of D2, should I do it differently? Given that the next deadline is about 30 minutes before I typically wake up, and that I sleep really badly if I know I have to wake early, I think I'd much prefer not to have to be the lynch safeguard this time round, especially since apparently I suck at it..
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Gah, sorry I made the wrong call to hammer LL :-(
Should I have let it run to no-lynch? I'm in the same position at the end of D2, should I do it differently? Given that the next deadline is about 30 minutes before I typically wake up, and that I sleep really badly if I know I have to wake early, I think I'd much prefer not to have to be the lynch safeguard this time round, especially since apparently I suck at it..
Why all the self recriminations? Hammering was the right move, even though we ended up being wrong
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I also think its fairly likely that flavor is tied to role based on the flips we have seen.
I strongly disagree with this.
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If Jimmmm used his bulletproofer shot, would the mafia that inherited his role from killing him (assuming that is how he died) also get a shot, or would they just be a neighbor?
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Gah, sorry I made the wrong call to hammer LL :-(
Should I have let it run to no-lynch? I'm in the same position at the end of D2, should I do it differently? Given that the next deadline is about 30 minutes before I typically wake up, and that I sleep really badly if I know I have to wake early, I think I'd much prefer not to have to be the lynch safeguard this time round, especially since apparently I suck at it..
We collectively missed the deadline and didn’t have enough players online for any other lynch, no need to blame yourself.
PPE: Took forever to get this posted on a questionable train wifi, slow ponied by EFHW. Space’s tone caught my ear as well.
I’m going to be on somewhat limited availability until friday, visiting my girlfriend who’s doing a uni exchange in rotterdam. :))
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Caught up. Only thing that stuck out to me was this post by Space:
Presumably, the main things governing whether people want to claim are how much they like solving setups (rather that just trying to catch people out for "sounding scummy"), and how much extra information they feel their role gives them compared to what they think the average role will have.
Scum is clearly at an advantage for the latter point, because they get to know what the roles of themselves and their three buddies are, assuming they're all in a faction QT. Though 4/14 scums seems pretty strong, especially when they can essentially eat the roles of the rest of us, so I wonder whether any of them start out with nerfs. Still, with them able to eat our roles, I don't think letting on the relative strengths of our powers is a good idea even if we have a decent level of protection available to help us keep strong town roles in alive townies' hands, because I don't think faust would design a game that could be easily solved by town just by revealing stuff.
I bolded the suspicious part. I mean, this is a valid theory, but it's a possibility that wouldn't really have immediately occurred to me. I think a scum who does indeed have a nerf , or is on a team with a nerf'd scum, is likely to think of it, though!
Vote: Space
Makes sense to me!
Vote: Space
As for the time, I'm glad someone brought it up because I missed it (people tend to use forum time which is also my timezone). Hopefully it won't cause issues now that everyone knows about it.
I actually think this post is super scummy. Why would you care about the timezone thing if forum time is your timezone anyway? This sounds like a fake "Go Town!" post.
Vote: IDPTG
Happy to join the LaLight wagon, and intend to do so in the next couple of hours.
2) Jimmmm (7): Idk what to say here. Has 7 posts and they all consist of RVS, voting players based on timezones or setup talk, and declaring they will be there for DL.
I legitimately thing IDPTG is scummy and LaLight is kind of scummy.
Like i believe you... i just don’t know why (or does anyone but you), which is not a strong town tactic
From these, I would say that IDPTG, Space and Datswan have a low likelihood of being the other neighbor. That just leaves 8 candidates. Interesting how he never really acknowledged the mcmcsalot wagon
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I have no idea what is happening in this game.
nothing really yet.
I know I'm kind of grasping at straws here, but Hydrad also doesn't seem like a neighbor.
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Deadline is fine for me. Vote: Awaclus
Don't know about this RVS. Pretty WIFOM.
Also I guess I'm using the assumption that the neighborhood was open during the day, which isn't necessarily the case.
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If Jimmmm used his bulletproofer shot, would the mafia that inherited his role from killing him (assuming that is how he died) also get a shot, or would they just be a neighbor?
Hold up -
Scum inherit the powers of the night-killed, yes?
So if Jimmm's neighbor is still alive and is town, then would scum have taken Jimmm's place in the neighborhood? --- That is:
If someone were Jimmm's neighbor, and they now have a new person in their QT, that person must be scum...
Right?
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If Jimmmm used his bulletproofer shot, would the mafia that inherited his role from killing him (assuming that is how he died) also get a shot, or would they just be a neighbor?
Hold up -
Scum inherit the powers of the night-killed, yes?
So if Jimmm's neighbor is still alive and is town, then would scum have taken Jimmm's place in the neighborhood? --- That is:
If someone were Jimmm's neighbor, and they now have a new person in their QT, that person must be scum...
Right?
I'd assume so.
But I don't think scum is forced to talk in it to reveal theirself.
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but it would be kinda awkward.
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actually I think that would be kinda hilarious. If I could just talk to scum kinda guessing who they are. I'd enjoy that.
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Also I believe that if Jimmm used his 1-shot then scum wouldn't have their 1-shot either. But we can wait on faust to confirm that
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If Jimmmm used his bulletproofer shot, would the mafia that inherited his role from killing him (assuming that is how he died) also get a shot, or would they just be a neighbor?
Hold up -
Scum inherit the powers of the night-killed, yes?
So if Jimmm's neighbor is still alive and is town, then would scum have taken Jimmm's place in the neighborhood? --- That is:
If someone were Jimmm's neighbor, and they now have a new person in their QT, that person must be scum...
Right?
I assume scum took it from knowing Jimmmm's role, and knew that they would get his bulletproofing capabilities.
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If Jimmmm used his bulletproofer shot, would the mafia that inherited his role from killing him (assuming that is how he died) also get a shot, or would they just be a neighbor?
Scum will inherit any role with however many shot are left. They are not informed how many shots are left.
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I also think its fairly likely that flavor is tied to role based on the flips we have seen.
I strongly disagree with this.
Flavor and role are somewhat related. I came into this game completely against role claiming and asked faust N0 so I wouldn't have to wait for an answer if people brought up flavor claiming.
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I also think its fairly likely that flavor is tied to role based on the flips we have seen.
I strongly disagree with this.
Flavor and role are somewhat related. I came into this game completely against role claiming and asked faust N0 so I wouldn't have to wait for an answer if people brought up flavor claiming.
I guess mine doesn't seem very related, although I guess you could shoehorn it in there.
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I also think its fairly likely that flavor is tied to role based on the flips we have seen.
I strongly disagree with this.
Flavor and role are somewhat related. I came into this game completely against role claiming and asked faust N0 so I wouldn't have to wait for an answer if people brought up flavor claiming.
Why ask faust? Or what? You would know if your flavor matched your role.
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If Jimmmm used his bulletproofer shot, would the mafia that inherited his role from killing him (assuming that is how he died) also get a shot, or would they just be a neighbor?
Hold up -
Scum inherit the powers of the night-killed, yes?
So if Jimmm's neighbor is still alive and is town, then would scum have taken Jimmm's place in the neighborhood? --- That is:
If someone were Jimmm's neighbor, and they now have a new person in their QT, that person must be scum...
Right?
I assume scum took it from knowing Jimmmm's role, and knew that they would get his bulletproofing capabilities.
I do not really agree with this in terms of "because to get his BP ability", just because I don't think a 1 shot BP is really like all that crazy strong - but whatever, not my primary point anyways. Main point would kind of the other side of what Galz pointed out about the Neighbor Changing or whatever.
I am just gonna get ahead of the questions here and say that "my pr is complicated" (or at least it is to me). Specifically, it leads me to believe it is possible that Skum!Neighbor may of had a PR that expires, or is forced to be used at an exact time.
Essentially what I am trying to say that if there was a situation last night where Skum!Nieghbor was "forced" to be the person to carry out the kill - then they would of had to kill Jim right? I am saying this under the assumption they would be removed from the Neighborhood or whatever once that was no longer part of their PR.
Does that make sense? I just re read it and I feel like it follows.
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If Jimmmm used his bulletproofer shot, would the mafia that inherited his role from killing him (assuming that is how he died) also get a shot, or would they just be a neighbor?
Hold up -
Scum inherit the powers of the night-killed, yes?
So if Jimmm's neighbor is still alive and is town, then would scum have taken Jimmm's place in the neighborhood? --- That is:
If someone were Jimmm's neighbor, and they now have a new person in their QT, that person must be scum...
Right?
I assume scum took it from knowing Jimmmm's role, and knew that they would get his bulletproofing capabilities.
I do not really agree with this in terms of "because to get his BP ability", just because I don't think a 1 shot BP is really like all that crazy strong - but whatever, not my primary point anyways. Main point would kind of the other side of what Galz pointed out about the Neighbor Changing or whatever.
I am just gonna get ahead of the questions here and say that "my pr is complicated" (or at least it is to me). Specifically, it leads me to believe it is possible that Skum!Neighbor may of had a PR that expires, or is forced to be used at an exact time.
Essentially what I am trying to say that if there was a situation last night where Skum!Nieghbor was "forced" to be the person to carry out the kill - then they would of had to kill Jim right? I am saying this under the assumption they would be removed from the Neighborhood or whatever once that was no longer part of their PR.
Does that make sense? I just re read it and I feel like it follows.
DAMA,
But no, I don't follow.
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Are you suggesting that if Jimmm's neighbor (scum) had (for some reason) to do the kill for his team last night, then he - by necessity - had to kill Jimmm because by virtue of scum's power changing Jimmm would know that his neighbor was scum?
That seems... convoluted to my drunk state of mind.
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I do agree though that killing Jimmm for his potential power here (If Jimmm used his power last night then scum acquiring it is non-value anyway) seems like a weak play for scum. Unless said scum is inexperienced on playing to a town neighbor, having the town neighbor would be much more valuable to me then potentially gaining Jimmm's role here. One of my favorite (lost) games from way back was getting absolutely owned by scum!Robz in a neighborhood QT - Was it Modern Family, Robz? - because it showed just how powerful that could play in scum's favor.
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My flavour and role don't match up all that well, so add me as a tally to the tally of people who're not totally sure how much to expect role and flavour to be obviously linked.
I like what gkrieg was doing about trying to find Jimmmmm neighbours. I was in the M game that just finished, where Hydrad's neighbourhood was really useful, though of course there was still the problem of making Robz (who was a de facto IC over there, and with whom I shared the neighbourhood after other neighbours had died) believe I was town.. so presumably Jimmmmm wouldn't have believed outright that his neighbour was town on D1, would he?
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Why all the self recriminations? Hammering was the right move, even though we ended up being wrong
Yeah, I rushed in thinking that hammering was really the right answer without thinking much about it beyond that it's usually something we want to do. I'm not generally afraid of overthinking things, but here I took the "normal" option instead of giving LL a fair re-read, so now I feel guilt because I'd have liked to play more with him.
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My thoughts on the Jimmmmm kill were
1. It may point to a commonly NK'd player on the scum team.
2. Maybe scum had some narrative in mind for 'explaining the odd NK' which I guess would point to gkrieg.
I think the neighbor theory gkrieg put up is interesting but not the likeliest thing.
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I do agree though that killing Jimmm for his potential power here (If Jimmm used his power last night then scum acquiring it is non-value anyway) seems like a weak play for scum. Unless said scum is inexperienced on playing to a town neighbor, having the town neighbor would be much more valuable to me then potentially gaining Jimmm's role here. One of my favorite (lost) games from way back was getting absolutely owned by scum!Robz in a neighborhood QT - Was it Modern Family, Robz? - because it showed just how powerful that could play in scum's favor.
Modern Community. I remember it well.
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I am just gonna get ahead of the questions here and say that "my pr is complicated" (or at least it is to me). Specifically, it leads me to believe it is possible that Skum!Neighbor may of had a PR that expires, or is forced to be used at an exact time.
Essentially what I am trying to say that if there was a situation last night where Skum!Nieghbor was "forced" to be the person to carry out the kill - then they would of had to kill Jim right? I am saying this under the assumption they would be removed from the Neighborhood or whatever once that was no longer part of their PR.
Does that make sense? I just re read it and I feel like it follows.
Jimmmmm was the one with the neighbor power, so even if the scum had a time-limited power, it would be something else and Jimmmmm wouldn't know anything. If there was a scum!Neighborizer, they would have their own separate neighborhood.
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I do agree though that killing Jimmm for his potential power here (If Jimmm used his power last night then scum acquiring it is non-value anyway) seems like a weak play for scum. Unless said scum is inexperienced on playing to a town neighbor, having the town neighbor would be much more valuable to me then potentially gaining Jimmm's role here. One of my favorite (lost) games from way back was getting absolutely owned by scum!Robz in a neighborhood QT - Was it Modern Family, Robz? - because it showed just how powerful that could play in scum's favor.
Modern Community. I remember it well.
Modern Community was such a great game. The same thing also happened in Ozle’s first Murder Mystery Mafia. I think it was scumGalzria running circles around me in that game.
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DAMA I feel like I get what Hydrad is saying and that I did good things during the night. If that makes sense to hydrad he should let me know.
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I feel out on the mafia lingo. whats DAMA
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I do agree though that killing Jimmm for his potential power here (If Jimmm used his power last night then scum acquiring it is non-value anyway) seems like a weak play for scum. Unless said scum is inexperienced on playing to a town neighbor, having the town neighbor would be much more valuable to me then potentially gaining Jimmm's role here. One of my favorite (lost) games from way back was getting absolutely owned by scum!Robz in a neighborhood QT - Was it Modern Family, Robz? - because it showed just how powerful that could play in scum's favor.
Yep, that was the one. Great game!
If Jimm was in a neighborhood with scum, I would expect scum to NOT kill him, for this reason. In fact, in the game that just wrapped up, I may the correct assumption that the neighborizer (hydrad) was town, because the guy he neigbhborized Night 1 (WW) was the Night 2 mafia kill.
You should really read M-116, Galz. It's an example of me playing well as town!
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DAMA: Drunk, ask me anything
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My thoughts on the Jimmmmm kill were
1. It may point to a commonly NK'd player on the scum team.
Why?
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DAMA I feel like I get what Hydrad is saying and that I did good things during the night. If that makes sense to hydrad he should let me know.
Ok i'll be honest I have no idea what this is trying to say. So no it does not make sense to me.
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DAMA I feel like I get what Hydrad is saying and that I did good things during the night. If that makes sense to hydrad he should let me know.
Ok i'll be honest I have no idea what this is trying to say. So no it does not make sense to me.
I also have no idea what it was trying to say, although my guess is some kind of letter messenger thing, that hydrad apparently did not receive?
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I also think its fairly likely that flavor is tied to role based on the flips we have seen.
I strongly disagree with this.
Flavor and role are somewhat related. I came into this game completely against role claiming and asked faust N0 so I wouldn't have to wait for an answer if people brought up flavor claiming.
Why ask faust? Or what? You would know if your flavor matched your role.
I wanted to know if it was a coincidence or not since it has implications for flavor claiming.
Oh, and vote: Awaclus
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I am just gonna get ahead of the questions here and say that "my pr is complicated" (or at least it is to me). Specifically, it leads me to believe it is possible that Skum!Neighbor may of had a PR that expires, or is forced to be used at an exact time.
Essentially what I am trying to say that if there was a situation last night where Skum!Nieghbor was "forced" to be the person to carry out the kill - then they would of had to kill Jim right? I am saying this under the assumption they would be removed from the Neighborhood or whatever once that was no longer part of their PR.
Does that make sense? I just re read it and I feel like it follows.
Jimmmmm was the one with the neighbor power, so even if the scum had a time-limited power, it would be something else and Jimmmmm wouldn't know anything. If there was a scum!Neighborizer, they would have their own separate neighborhood.
1. I did not think about how “neighbor” and neighborizor” would flip differently. So - idk what i am not getting here.... if is a skum Neighborizor - why would they ever like use their power just to shoot the neighbor he first chance?
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I am just gonna get ahead of the questions here and say that "my pr is complicated" (or at least it is to me). Specifically, it leads me to believe it is possible that Skum!Neighbor may of had a PR that expires, or is forced to be used at an exact time.
Essentially what I am trying to say that if there was a situation last night where Skum!Nieghbor was "forced" to be the person to carry out the kill - then they would of had to kill Jim right? I am saying this under the assumption they would be removed from the Neighborhood or whatever once that was no longer part of their PR.
Does that make sense? I just re read it and I feel like it follows.
Jimmmmm was the one with the neighbor power, so even if the scum had a time-limited power, it would be something else and Jimmmmm wouldn't know anything. If there was a scum!Neighborizer, they would have their own separate neighborhood.
1. I did not think about how “neighbor” and neighborizor” would flip differently. So - idk what i am not getting here.... if is a skum Neighborizor - why would they ever like use their power just to shoot the neighbor he first chance?
Right, I think this is unlikely.
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Okay so jimm being in a neighborhood I assume is coincidental. He was most likely in a neighborhood with the liver or multiple organs in the abdominal cavity.
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Okay so jimm being in a neighborhood I assume is coincidental. He was most likely in a neighborhood with the liver or multiple organs in the abdominal cavity.
This was most likely an exisiting neighborhood from the beginning of the game with day chat. It potentially had night chat instead but would have been reveled at the beginning. I doubt the kill was to do with his neighborhood. Even if he was in a neighborhood with scum why are we assuming he divulged his role. I mean D1 in an rmm why ever do that.
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DAMA I feel like I get what Hydrad is saying and that I did good things during the night. If that makes sense to hydrad he should let me know.
Ok i'll be honest I have no idea what this is trying to say. So no it does not make sense to me.
OHHH i am talking to datswan, nevermind hydrad.
I do not really agree with this in terms of "because to get his BP ability", just because I don't think a 1 shot BP is really like all that crazy strong - but whatever, not my primary point anyways. Main point would kind of the other side of what Galz pointed out about the Neighbor Changing or whatever.
I am just gonna get ahead of the questions here and say that "my pr is complicated" (or at least it is to me). Specifically, it leads me to believe it is possible that Skum!Neighbor may of had a PR that expires, or is forced to be used at an exact time.
Essentially what I am trying to say that if there was a situation last night where Skum!Nieghbor was "forced" to be the person to carry out the kill - then they would of had to kill Jim right? I am saying this under the assumption they would be removed from the Neighborhood or whatever once that was no longer part of their PR.
Does that make sense? I just re read it and I feel like it follows.
So same to you datswan I think I get what you are saying and that I did good things during the night, if that makes sense let me know
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Jimm was a total null factor yesterday. I think the wagon was actually fairly townie.
Lets go with sole pr related stuff then. For starters, I was targeted last night and I'll leave it there for now.
Why do you think that wagon was townie?
Just getting to this.
Obviously I have bias knowing I am town and I was the alternative wagon day 1, but I also did not feel like many of the votes on wagon were scummily manipulative votes more happy to go along an get a lynch votes
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Hey, robz and efhw whats up?
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OHHH i am talking to datswan, nevermind hydrad.
This seems to be becoming a commonish issue for some reason. I wonder why
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OHHH i am talking to datswan, nevermind hydrad.
This seems to be becoming a commonish issue for some reason. I wonder why
I have no clue, the two of you don't mesh in my mind. I totally misread
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oh buh by
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idp though where you at
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idp though where you at
Work. Other than that, going through a reread of D1.
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idp though where you at
Work. Other than that, going through a reread of D1.
did you find anything?
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idp though where you at
Work. Other than that, going through a reread of D1.
did you find anything?
So far, a reason to vote Awaclus.
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idp though where you at
Work. Other than that, going through a reread of D1.
did you find anything?
So far, a reason to vote Awaclus.
UGHH, one other than him being awaclus?
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idp though where you at
Work. Other than that, going through a reread of D1.
did you find anything?
So far, a reason to vote Awaclus.
UGHH, one other than him being awaclus?
Yes. I'd like to hold onto it for now though, at least until I finish the reread. All I'll say is that it isn't a meta read.
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OHHH i am talking to datswan, nevermind hydrad.
This seems to be becoming a commonish issue for some reason. I wonder why
Right and this one I didn't even like catch. Other game sure - bc you were dead and it was like wtf, but now it is starting to get odd
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Meanwhile, here is some VCA from Day 1 - because IDK where else to start:
Vote Count 1.1
Robz888 (3): Robz888, gkrieg13, IDontPlayThisGame
Eevee (1): SpaceAnemone
IDontPlayThisGame (1): LaLight
gkrieg13 (1): Hydrad
Galrzia (1): mcmcsalot
Awaclus (1): Jimmmmm
Not Voting (6): EFHW, iguanaiguana, Eevee, Awaclus, DatSwan, Galzria
----Obv lots of RVS, so not reading into it a whole hell of a lot at this point. But I just hate it when people self vote, it almost always hits me as skummy---
Vote Count 1.2
Robz888 (2): Robz888, gkrieg13
Eevee (2): SpaceAnemone, LaLight
gkrieg13 (1): Hydrad
Awaclus (2): Jimmmmm, EFHW
mcmcsalot (1): iguanaiguana
LaLight (1): Eevee
Hydrad (2): IDontPlayThisGame, mcmcsalot
Not Voting (3): Awaclus, DatSwan, Galzria
---- Wagon on Robz gets up to L3 I think and then drops off and spreads. Later on who did what at this point may want to be looked back on if we ever see a Robz flip, but before that it is meh----
---- OK this is where it starts to get fun. In between 1.2 and 1.3 this is how it goes down:
Galz moves first from NoVote->MCMC in #222, then Awaclus from NoVote->MCMC in #229, then GK as the only one left on Robz->MCMC in #235. As this happens it creates a MCMC wagon of (4) quickly against the previously leading (2) wagons on Eevee, Awaclus, and Hydrad. After that Eevee then moves off of LL (leaving LL at fucking 0 votes btw)->GK. That brings us to VC 1.3.
Vote Count 1.3
Eevee (2): SpaceAnemone, LaLight
gkrieg13 (2): Hydrad, Eevee
Awaclus (1): EFHW
mcmcsalot (4): iguanaiguana, Galzria, Awaclus, gkrieg13
Hydrad (2): IDontPlayThisGame, mcmcsalot
SpaceAnemone (1): Robz888
IDontPlayThisGame (1): Jimmmmm
Not Voting (1): DatSwan
----We get to 1.4 by LL joining MCMC wagon to make it L-3, EFHW moves to LL, and GK joins LL wagon with EFHW to make it 2 LL vs 4 MCMC----
Vote Count 1.4
Eevee (1): SpaceAnemone
gkrieg13 (2): Hydrad, Eevee
mcmcsalot (4): iguanaiguana, Galzria, Awaclus, LaLight
Hydrad (2): IDontPlayThisGame, mcmcsalot
SpaceAnemone (1): Robz888
IDontPlayThisGame (1): Jimmmmm
LaLight (2): EFHW, gkrieg13
Not Voting (1): DatSwan
---- From here MCMC moves to LL from Hydrad, and Galz switches from MCMC wagon to LL wagon to make it MCMC(3) vs LL(4).
Then Hydrad switches from GK to LL to make it MCMC(3) vs LL(5).
Then Eevee switches from GK to LL making it MCMC(3) vs LL(6). Putting it at L-2. People off the wagon at this point are Space, II, Awaclus, IDP, Robz, Jim, Swan, and of course LL.
This brings us to 1.5.
Vote Count 1.5
Eevee (1): SpaceAnemone
mcmcsalot (3): iguanaiguana, Awaclus, LaLight
Hydrad (1): IDontPlayThisGame
SpaceAnemone (1): Robz888
IDontPlayThisGame (1): Jimmmmm
LaLight (6): EFHW, gkrieg13, mcmcsalot, Galzria, Hydrad, Eevee
Not Voting (1): DatSwan
---- We start from here with me putting LL at L-1. Then Jim makes it clear he will hammer without issue. Space ends up switching off of Eevee to hammer LL. We needed a lynch, so I do not find Space's hammer specifically to be skummy. Especially considering that if Space and Jim are not both skum then why would they kill Jim last night? I was already pretty much there before, but end of day actions pretty much put Space on my non-lynchable list. I am gonna look more into Eevee, Hydrad, Galz, and GK.
going with Vote: GK for the time being.
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Vote: gkrieg
i'm ok with this.
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Vote: gkrieg
i'm ok with this.
Can you just remind me so I don't have to look it up please? Were you the "gut feel" GK vote yesterday or did you have a reason?
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Vote Count 2.1
Awaclus (1): IDontPlayThisGame
gkrieg13 (2): DatSwan, Hydrad
Not Voting (9): EFHW, gkrieg13, iguanaiguana, Eevee, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, mcmcsalot, Robz888, Galzria
With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Day 2 ends June 11, 2018, 03:30:00 am.
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Vote: gkrieg
i'm ok with this.
Can you just remind me so I don't have to look it up please? Were you the "gut feel" GK vote yesterday or did you have a reason?
mainly gut feel I guess. But I just feel like hes different then his usual self in the last couple games i've seen. And I think hes been town in all those games I've seen. So therefore, Gkreig = scum.
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OHHH i am talking to datswan, nevermind hydrad.
This seems to be becoming a commonish issue for some reason. I wonder why
Right and this one I didn't even like catch. Other game sure - bc you were dead and it was like wtf, but now it is starting to get odd
It's your avatars.
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Hey, robz and efhw whats up?
I'm here. Have been posting. No ideas yet about possible scum.
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Oh, and vote: Awaclus
So you're mcmc's scum partner OMGUSing me on his behalf?
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@DatSwan, is your gkrieg vote based on your VCA? Do you draw any conclusions from the BCA? Why did you comment on Eevee leaving LL at 0 votes?
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My thoughts on the Jimmmmm kill were
1. It may point to a commonly NK'd player on the scum team.
Why?
Jimmmm is not a commonly night killed player, so with a reduced pool for that, scum is more likely to shoot Jim
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Okay so jimm being in a neighborhood I assume is coincidental. He was most likely in a neighborhood with the liver or multiple organs in the abdominal cavity.
You know, he flipped as the kidney, not kidneys. Maybe the neighborhood is both kidneys or scum has kidney for a fakeclaim.
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OHHH i am talking to datswan, nevermind hydrad.
This seems to be becoming a commonish issue for some reason. I wonder why
Right and this one I didn't even like catch. Other game sure - bc you were dead and it was like wtf, but now it is starting to get odd
Probably its because you both have a black figure in the center of your avatar. doesn't affect me but others have stated issues telling apart players with similar avatars.
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Oh, and vote: Awaclus
So you're mcmc's scum partner OMGUSing me on his behalf?
Besides that, he could be scum!but!not!McMc's!partner making up a reason to vote you, or town voting for scum!Awaclus after finding you out, or town voting for scum!Awaclus for the wrong reasons, or town voting for town!Awaclus mistakenly, or even McMc's scum partner who voted you for other fake reasons besides OMGUS.
When you weigh all the options, I think it's more likely that he's not actually mcmc's scum partner OMGUSing you on mcmc's behalf, so I wouldn't place a bet on that or anything.
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Awaclus because the plan he proposed for the mass claim seems like something he migjt try as scum then argue its all jist sound reasoning even though he knows it isn't.
What part about it is not sound reasoning?
I think you may know this is not actually sound reasoning:
But currently we've massclaimed a grand total of 0 times. Clearly at least our collective thinking is that it isn't a 50-50 shot, or we'd be doing it day 1 at least sometimes.
Yeah, but that's based on playing WIFOM against the mod, which I think is a bad idea.
One would simply need to look at a sample of past games of mafia played here to see that usually town has more to lose than gain by claiming D1, and that should set the odds of a D1 massclaim here at less than 50% chance of being good. Calling it playing 'wifom against the mod' to set the odds anywhere but 50-50 ignores all the previous evidence we have from previous games of mafia on this site. Add in the information we already know from the setup that scum get a chance to steal town PRs and may want to know all the town PRs in order to steal them, and the fact that we don't know for sure whether or not scum have really solid fake claims, and the odds should be lower than 50% that a D1 massclaim would be good for town.
So what I'm left with are a few possiblities:
1) You're scum, and you were hoping some/all town would claim their roles and give you an advantage.
2) You're town, and you see this logic differently for some reason.
3) You're scum, and you see this logic differently for some reason, so you expected town cred for proposing it.
I guess if you can explain why you see it differently, that would move you back from scummy into null for me.
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I remember Awaclus as scum stating he was changing up his game to become more helpful, which he did, and it turned out it was an act (a successful one, I think). Here he's changing up his game without a pronouncement. I'd like to hear IDPTG's insight about Awaclus.
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vote: LaLight. EFHW makes a good case.
Can you explain why you thought EFHW's case was good? Your switch from McMc to Lalight was pretty pivotal in assuring that Lalight got lynched yesterday.
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Jimm was a total null factor yesterday. I think the wagon was actually fairly townie.
Lets go with sole pr related stuff then. For starters, I was targeted last night and I'll leave it there for now.
gkrieg also prodded mcmc about this. I'm not following this logic either.
If the wagon is townie, do you think that scum were trying to stay off wagon? So you think we'll find a higher percentage of scum in the pool of: Iguana, Awaclus, IDPTG, Robz than we will in the pool of EFHW, gkrieg13, Galzria, Hydrad, Eevee, DatSwan, SpaceAnemone?
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Vote: gkrieg
i'm ok with this.
Can you just remind me so I don't have to look it up please? Were you the "gut feel" GK vote yesterday or did you have a reason?
mainly gut feel I guess. But I just feel like hes different then his usual self in the last couple games i've seen. And I think hes been town in all those games I've seen. So therefore, Gkreig = scum.
I really don’t see how I’m any different this game.
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vote: LaLight. EFHW makes a good case.
Can you explain why you thought EFHW's case was good? Your switch from McMc to Lalight was pretty pivotal in assuring that Lalight got lynched yesterday.
I remember thinking that LaLight makes a lot of effort to not get mislynched. I wanted to put pressure on him so I could see that, but he did t really show up again while I was there, which I though was scummy of him.
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vote: LaLight. EFHW makes a good case.
Can you explain why you thought EFHW's case was good? Your switch from McMc to Lalight was pretty pivotal in assuring that Lalight got lynched yesterday.
I remember thinking that LaLight makes a lot of effort to not get mislynched. I wanted to put pressure on him so I could see that, but he did t really show up again while I was there, which I though was scummy of him.
Did you consider at all how recently he's been mislynched frequently and didn't put up as much of a fight as he used to?
Was there any actual substance to EFHW's case that you agreed with?
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or town voting for scum!Awaclus after finding you out, or town voting for scum!Awaclus for the wrong reasons
Well, it can't be either of those two options.
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I guess if you can explain why you see it differently, that would move you back from scummy into null for me.
It's a closed setup. If you're trying to guess what the setup is, that's playing WIFOM against the mod because it might not be what you think it is.
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I guess if you can explain why you see it differently, that would move you back from scummy into null for me.
It's a closed setup. If you're trying to guess what the setup is, that's playing WIFOM against the mod because it might not be what you think it is.
Don't you think that Faust's past record of creating closed RMM setups where it isn't good to massclaim D1, combined with the small amount of public information, should be used as evidence against a D1 claim in this game?
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Also, how do we flip a coin over the internet in a verifiable way? What was your plan there? If we all agreed, were you planning to flip a coin yourself and report the result?
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I guess if you can explain why you see it differently, that would move you back from scummy into null for me.
It's a closed setup. If you're trying to guess what the setup is, that's playing WIFOM against the mod because it might not be what you think it is.
Don't you think that Faust's past record of creating closed RMM setups where it isn't good to massclaim D1, combined with the small amount of public information, should be used as evidence against a D1 claim in this game?
No.
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Also, how do we flip a coin over the internet in a verifiable way? What was your plan there? If we all agreed, were you planning to flip a coin yourself and report the result?
Like this: Rolled 1d2 : 1, total 1
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I guess if you can explain why you see it differently, that would move you back from scummy into null for me.
It's a closed setup. If you're trying to guess what the setup is, that's playing WIFOM against the mod because it might not be what you think it is.
Don't you think that Faust's past record of creating closed RMM setups where it isn't good to massclaim D1, combined with the small amount of public information, should be used as evidence against a D1 claim in this game?
No.
Why?
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Why?
Because this is not any of his previous games, it's the current game. It may or may not be different.
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I'd like to hear IDPTG's insight about Awaclus.
I missed something. With so little information in the set-up post, I haven't reread it as much as I normally do so I don't remember it as well. unvote
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Oh, and vote: Awaclus
So you're mcmc's scum partner OMGUSing me on his behalf?
Yeah, totally. You caught me. Nice job. Game's over folks, Awaclus for MVP. You too Galz.
If we lynched you today would be be a mislynch?
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Vote: Awaclus I was somewhat townreading him day 1, but what Iguana is so elegantly laying out sounds like a gambit Awaclus would totally go for as scum. You know, some naive person might even agree with him because it sounds fun..
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Vote: gkrieg
i'm ok with this.
Can you just remind me so I don't have to look it up please? Were you the "gut feel" GK vote yesterday or did you have a reason?
mainly gut feel I guess. But I just feel like hes different then his usual self in the last couple games i've seen. And I think hes been town in all those games I've seen. So therefore, Gkreig = scum.
I really don’t see how I’m any different this game.
If you are scum, you are trying not to be any different, so your perspective is not really so relevant for this.
.. but, I think usually people feel different because they’ve gotten less sleep, are tired from doing sports, had a fight/great moment with their significant other, what have you. So many factors go into what we seem like, to me arguments that go further with “and this different is scummy because I’ve seen it before or scum / it benefits scum to do this” are much stronger than just someone posting with a different style. Heck, someone going from computer posting to phone posting would probably seem completely different, right?
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I'd like to hear IDPTG's insight about Awaclus.
I missed something. With so little information in the set-up post, I haven't reread it as much as I normally do so I don't remember it as well. unvote
Idea went poof?
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Vote: gkrieg
i'm ok with this.
Can you just remind me so I don't have to look it up please? Were you the "gut feel" GK vote yesterday or did you have a reason?
mainly gut feel I guess. But I just feel like hes different then his usual self in the last couple games i've seen. And I think hes been town in all those games I've seen. So therefore, Gkreig = scum.
I really don’t see how I’m any different this game.
If you are scum, you are trying not to be any different, so your perspective is not really so relevant for this.
.. but, I think usually people feel different because they’ve gotten less sleep, are tired from doing sports, had a fight/great moment with their significant other, what have you. So many factors go into what we seem like, to me arguments that go further with “and this different is scummy because I’ve seen it before or scum / it benefits scum to do this” are much stronger than just someone posting with a different style. Heck, someone going from computer posting to phone posting would probably seem completely different, right?
What are you trying to say here?
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Vote: Awaclus I was somewhat townreading him day 1, but what Iguana is so elegantly laying out sounds like a gambit Awaclus would totally go for as scum. You know, some naive person might even agree with him because it sounds fun..
Ugh, you just sound like you are trying to buddy me.
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I'd like to hear IDPTG's insight about Awaclus.
I missed something. With so little information in the set-up post, I haven't reread it as much as I normally do so I don't remember it as well. unvote
Idea went poof?
Yeah. Slips aren't slips when they're in the set-up post. I said I had a (1) reason.
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I want to lynch Lalight. He has 9 posts total, some of which are off-task. This post reads as illogical=scummy to me. Of course we shouldn't lynch town, but the point is we don't know if he is or not. That bit of reasoning seems unnecessary and like scum trying to look like town:
I am against mass claiming for now. Scum will know who to kill to get a cool role.
I lean scum on EFHW for voting for Awaclus, I don't think he's scum. And whether he's cluttering the thread or not, if he's town we shouldn't vote him. Also, @SA, how exactly do we know 31% of people are scums? Maybe here's only one scum and the setup is still balanced? Looks like a scumslip to me
He never answered this question:
I would very much like to vote: Eevee
Call it gut
Can you spell out the gut feeling?
And his mcmc vote timing was scummy, as I mentioned recently.
The points she made reminded of me when LaLight was scum in the most recent game I played with him. Voting without giving reasons. I didn't think the knowing there were 4 scums thing was scummy though.
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Vote: Awaclus I was somewhat townreading him day 1, but what Iguana is so elegantly laying out sounds like a gambit Awaclus would totally go for as scum. You know, some naive person might even agree with him because it sounds fun..
Ugh, you just sound like you are trying to buddy me.
Haha, this is what I though of Eevee's most recent reply to my post...
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Vote: Awaclus I was somewhat townreading him day 1, but what Iguana is so elegantly laying out sounds like a gambit Awaclus would totally go for as scum. You know, some naive person might even agree with him because it sounds fun..
Ugh, you just sound like you are trying to buddy me.
Haha, this is what I though of Eevee's most recent reply to my post...
You are all my buddies! You know this.
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Vote: gkrieg
i'm ok with this.
Can you just remind me so I don't have to look it up please? Were you the "gut feel" GK vote yesterday or did you have a reason?
mainly gut feel I guess. But I just feel like hes different then his usual self in the last couple games i've seen. And I think hes been town in all those games I've seen. So therefore, Gkreig = scum.
I really don’t see how I’m any different this game.
If you are scum, you are trying not to be any different, so your perspective is not really so relevant for this.
.. but, I think usually people feel different because they’ve gotten less sleep, are tired from doing sports, had a fight/great moment with their significant other, what have you. So many factors go into what we seem like, to me arguments that go further with “and this different is scummy because I’ve seen it before or scum / it benefits scum to do this” are much stronger than just someone posting with a different style. Heck, someone going from computer posting to phone posting would probably seem completely different, right?
What are you trying to say here?
You seem different is not a great reason to vote for someone on its own.
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Vote: Awaclus I was somewhat townreading him day 1, but what Iguana is so elegantly laying out sounds like a gambit Awaclus would totally go for as scum. You know, some naive person might even agree with him because it sounds fun..
Ugh, you just sound like you are trying to buddy me.
Haha, this is what I though of Eevee's most recent reply to my post...
You are all my buddies! You know this.
It seemed liked scummy/scum buddying though, because I myself don't consider the 'case' to be that elegant or convincing. It was a line of inquiry that I considered worth pursuing because there was some merit in it, but the responses from Awaclus giving no ground whatsoever to my critiques are pretty standard for him.
I do stil think that Awaclus is on the scummier side of null, but now I think you are just as scummy for taking this case and using it as a reason to vote.
In other news, I'm developing a would lynch / won't lynch list, but I'm going to sit on it for a while and see who other people are interested in voting.
No single person right now is scummy enough that I am convinced to vote them, but I'm sure that will change.
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@DatSwan, is your gkrieg vote based on your VCA? Do you draw any conclusions from the BCA? Why did you comment on Eevee leaving LL at 0 votes?
The eevee comment was to timeline the fact that LL went from 0->lynch from that point.
My GK vote is mainly VCA yes.
I am unfamiliar with what BCA is?
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yeah, gkrieg was on every main wagon yesterday it looks like.
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Well, it was elegant to me because you were owning him using awaclusspeak. Really loved it.
And for someone who really prides themselves for being logical, his stance on claiming really made and continues to make no sense. Awaclus doesn’t like how we don’t always lynch people for doing anti-town things. I could see him thinking “well, i can play that game too..”
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yeah, gkrieg was on every main wagon yesterday it looks like.
Is that scummy?
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yeah, gkrieg was on every main wagon yesterday it looks like.
Is that scummy?
I don't know yet, but it's certainly enough of a thing to merit discussion. I want to know particularly why you switched from McMc to Lalight. It seemed like the pivot that ensured Lalight got lynched.
I think I already asked you about this.
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yeah, gkrieg was on every main wagon yesterday it looks like.
Is that scummy?
I don't know yet, but it's certainly enough of a thing to merit discussion. I want to know particularly why you switched from McMc to Lalight. It seemed like the pivot that ensured Lalight got lynched.
I think I already asked you about this.
You did, and I responded to it. I'm also very prone to wagoning D1.
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yeah, gkrieg was on every main wagon yesterday it looks like.
Is that scummy?
I don't know yet, but it's certainly enough of a thing to merit discussion. I want to know particularly why you switched from McMc to Lalight. It seemed like the pivot that ensured Lalight got lynched.
I think I already asked you about this.
You did, and I responded to it. I'm also very prone to wagoning D1.
Ok cool, so who is scummy now?
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yeah, gkrieg was on every main wagon yesterday it looks like.
Is that scummy?
I don't know yet, but it's certainly enough of a thing to merit discussion. I want to know particularly why you switched from McMc to Lalight. It seemed like the pivot that ensured Lalight got lynched.
I think I already asked you about this.
You did, and I responded to it. I'm also very prone to wagoning D1.
Ok cool, so who is scummy now?
I still think Mcmcsalot is scummy, but I haven't really gone back to reread yet.
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@DatSwan, is your gkrieg vote based on your VCA? Do you draw any conclusions from the BCA? Why did you comment on Eevee leaving LL at 0 votes?
The eevee comment was to timeline the fact that LL went from 0->lynch from that point.
My GK vote is mainly VCA yes.
I am unfamiliar with what BCA is?
It's a typo.
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Argh, another busy day. Sorry. I'm also traveling Thursday through Saturday, we will see how much time I have.
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I don't hate the Awaclus lynch idea: I disagreed with his logic on D1 and found his "no second guessing the mod" and "we can't possibly know any single thing about the setup" arguments to be severely lacking in nuance. However I feel like we're regressing a lot to D1 behaviour... don't we have more out there to play with now?
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I don't hate the Awaclus lynch idea: I disagreed with his logic on D1 and found his "no second guessing the mod" and "we can't possibly know any single thing about the setup" arguments to be severely lacking in nuance. However I feel like we're regressing a lot to D1 behaviour... don't we have more out there to play with now?
Is this like super subtly asking for some form of claim? Don’t you think a little early to be outting roles?
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I don't hate the Awaclus lynch idea: I disagreed with his logic on D1 and found his "no second guessing the mod" and "we can't possibly know any single thing about the setup" arguments to be severely lacking in nuance. However I feel like we're regressing a lot to D1 behaviour... don't we have more out there to play with now?
Is this like super subtly asking for some form of claim? Don’t you think a little early to be outting roles?
I don't know whether I think the Awaclus stuff is based on someone pushing it again because of role info, or because arguing with Awaclus is something that just kind of sucks people in. My word of warning was in case of the former, and the "more to play with" is at least stuff like the neighbourhoods discussion.
Personally, I think there's something interesting and discussion-worth there, both in the even itself and how people are reacting to it. Still nobody has come out and claimed to have been in a neighbourhood with Jimmmmm. I don't see many townie reasons to stay quiet in the main thread now that at least one scum has access to the neighbourhood, so I think that means a subset of scum probably have a neighbourhood. The only neighbourhood I've been in was a very useful space in which to daychat with Robz about how to lie to the rest of town and win M116, so two scums having that kind of power is not good. Howcome people aren't talking more about it?
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Sorry all, been more busy than I planned to be yesterday & today. I'm off work tomorrow through Friday though, so should be able to do some rereads - Got some people flying under the radar that I want to take a closer look at (3 in particular, not gonna call 'em out here yet though).
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Personally, I think there's something interesting and discussion-worth there, both in the even itself and how people are reacting to it. Still nobody has come out and claimed to have been in a neighbourhood with Jimmmmm. I don't see many townie reasons to stay quiet in the main thread now that at least one scum has access to the neighbourhood, so I think that means a subset of scum probably have a neighbourhood. The only neighbourhood I've been in was a very useful space in which to daychat with Robz about how to lie to the rest of town and win M116, so two scums having that kind of power is not good. Howcome people aren't talking more about it?
Why do you think there were more than 2 people in the neighborhood?
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It does seem like Jimmmmm's town!neighbor(s) could claim here. They won't be IC though, since they could be scum fake claiming.
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Vote Count 2.2
gkrieg13 (2): DatSwan, Hydrad
Awaclus (1): Eevee
Not Voting (9): EFHW, gkrieg13, iguanaiguana, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, mcmcsalot, Robz888, Galzria, IDontPlayThisGame
With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Day 2 ends June 11, 2018, 03:30:00 am.
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Personally, I think there's something interesting and discussion-worth there, both in the even itself and how people are reacting to it. Still nobody has come out and claimed to have been in a neighbourhood with Jimmmmm. I don't see many townie reasons to stay quiet in the main thread now that at least one scum has access to the neighbourhood, so I think that means a subset of scum probably have a neighbourhood. The only neighbourhood I've been in was a very useful space in which to daychat with Robz about how to lie to the rest of town and win M116, so two scums having that kind of power is not good. Howcome people aren't talking more about it?
Why do you think there were more than 2 people in the neighborhood?
I don't know how many people there were, and didn't mean to imply a particular range or number. It had crossed my mind that a neighbourhood with more than one remaining townie might still be worth keeping hidden, but if it's got a scum in it too, I don't see how useful it can be.
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Jimm was a total null factor yesterday. I think the wagon was actually fairly townie.
Lets go with sole pr related stuff then. For starters, I was targeted last night and I'll leave it there for now.
gkrieg also prodded mcmc about this. I'm not following this logic either.
If the wagon is townie, do you think that scum were trying to stay off wagon? So you think we'll find a higher percentage of scum in the pool of: Iguana, Awaclus, IDPTG, Robz than we will in the pool of EFHW, gkrieg13, Galzria, Hydrad, Eevee, DatSwan, SpaceAnemone?
I guess no, I don't think that. I guess it probably has something to do with the fact that I was the other wagon. So I don't think scum had a preference of pushing the lynch to lalight instead of me. Add the fact that the end of the wagon was due to being close to deadline and needing a lynch it's hard for me to find a scum motivation for joining the lalight wagon. Upon reflection it's not a great point.
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Personally, I think there's something interesting and discussion-worth there, both in the even itself and how people are reacting to it. Still nobody has come out and claimed to have been in a neighbourhood with Jimmmmm. I don't see many townie reasons to stay quiet in the main thread now that at least one scum has access to the neighbourhood, so I think that means a subset of scum probably have a neighbourhood. The only neighbourhood I've been in was a very useful space in which to daychat with Robz about how to lie to the rest of town and win M116, so two scums having that kind of power is not good. Howcome people aren't talking more about it?
Why do you think there were more than 2 people in the neighborhood?
I don't know how many people there were, and didn't mean to imply a particular range or number. It had crossed my mind that a neighbourhood with more than one remaining townie might still be worth keeping hidden, but if it's got a scum in it too, I don't see how useful it can be.
Note that if the other neighbour really is town, scum already knows who they are by having access to the neighbourhood. That means they're already a huge scum target if they are town...
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It does seem like Jimmmmm's town!neighbor(s) could claim here. They won't be IC though, since they could be scum fake claiming.
Maybe theres a chance we could even get info on why they picked jimmmm. I don't really know how though. But ya I guess I'll leave it to Jimmms neighbour (or neighbours) to decide if they should appear.
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I don't hate the Awaclus lynch idea: I disagreed with his logic on D1 and found his "no second guessing the mod" and "we can't possibly know any single thing about the setup" arguments to be severely lacking in nuance. However I feel like we're regressing a lot to D1 behaviour... don't we have more out there to play with now?
Is this like super subtly asking for some form of claim? Don’t you think a little early to be outting roles?
I don't know whether I think the Awaclus stuff is based on someone pushing it again because of role info, or because arguing with Awaclus is something that just kind of sucks people in. My word of warning was in case of the former, and the "more to play with" is at least stuff like the neighbourhoods discussion.
Personally, I think there's something interesting and discussion-worth there, both in the even itself and how people are reacting to it. Still nobody has come out and claimed to have been in a neighbourhood with Jimmmmm. I don't see many townie reasons to stay quiet in the main thread now that at least one scum has access to the neighbourhood, so I think that means a subset of scum probably have a neighbourhood. The only neighbourhood I've been in was a very useful space in which to daychat with Robz about how to lie to the rest of town and win M116, so two scums having that kind of power is not good. Howcome people aren't talking more about it?
I think whether the Neighbors claim depends on the size. However, there's at least one scum in the Neighborhood now, so the list of Neighbors (assuming it's accurate) is a lynch pool almost guaranteed* to contain scum. If we assume Jim was Nk'd because of being a Neighbor, there are probably 2+ scum in the Neighborhood now.
*I say almost because we know next to nothing about this set-up and there are ways someone joined the Neighborhood without NK'ing Jim and there are ways scum NK'd Jim without joining the Neighborhood. However, we don't know if any of those are in this game.
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I think whether the Neighbors claim depends on the size. However, there's at least one scum in the Neighborhood now, so the list of Neighbors (assuming it's accurate) is a lynch pool almost guaranteed* to contain scum. If we assume Jim was Nk'd because of being a Neighbor, there are probably 2+ scum in the Neighborhood now.
*I say almost because we know next to nothing about this set-up and there are ways someone joined the Neighborhood without NK'ing Jim and there are ways scum NK'd Jim without joining the Neighborhood. However, we don't know if any of those are in this game.
From the responses I was able to get from faust in my QT, we know that the scum who killed a neighbour gets to be in the neighbourhood, so let's assume they couldn't have NK'd Jimmmmm and not now be in the neighbourhood. I say "in": they may have reading access and choose not to post, which is the most likely thing if the other user(s) are town.
It's probably true that there may be ways for someone to join the neighbourhood without NKing a member. It's bad for town, and again, if a townie is in a neighbourhood with a scum, they probably ought to say something in-thread so that we know to protect them (if/when possible) from NKs, since those are people scum are going to want to take out. That is, unless there are townies with PGO-type roles :-)
I think it's fair to assume Jimmmmm was killed for being a neighbour with a scum, but it's not a definite given. They could have randomised the kill for all we know. By D3, though, we can be pretty sure they're planning on having a neighbourhood with two scums in, if that's not the situation already.
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It does seem like Jimmmmm's town!neighbor(s) could claim here. They won't be IC though, since they could be scum fake claiming.
Maybe theres a chance we could even get info on why they picked jimmmm.
This part makes it sound like you're in agreement with the stuff EFHW and I were saying about how there's almost certain town benefit if the neighbour claims, and therefore no reason for a townie neighbour not to claim.
But ya I guess I'll leave it to Jimmms neighbour (or neighbours) to decide if they should appear.
... and this part sounds like the least enthusiastic agreement it's possible to make without actively looking like a hedge, being sure to leave lots of wiggle-room for scum to say they just didn't feel like claiming etc.
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I think we can assume that one of the following is true: a) the Neighborhood is entirely scum or b) the remaining town!Neighbor(s) do(es) not know exactly who is in the Neighborhood (and therefore who joined last night).
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Jimm was a total null factor yesterday. I think the wagon was actually fairly townie.
Lets go with sole pr related stuff then. For starters, I was targeted last night and I'll leave it there for now.
gkrieg also prodded mcmc about this. I'm not following this logic either.
If the wagon is townie, do you think that scum were trying to stay off wagon? So you think we'll find a higher percentage of scum in the pool of: Iguana, Awaclus, IDPTG, Robz than we will in the pool of EFHW, gkrieg13, Galzria, Hydrad, Eevee, DatSwan, SpaceAnemone?
I guess no, I don't think that. I guess it probably has something to do with the fact that I was the other wagon. So I don't think scum had a preference of pushing the lynch to lalight instead of me. Add the fact that the end of the wagon was due to being close to deadline and needing a lynch it's hard for me to find a scum motivation for joining the lalight wagon. Upon reflection it's not a great point.
Sorry, I'm tired and not really reading things right, what exactly does this say? He doesn't think that scum were on the wagon, or he does think scum were on the wagon?
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I don't think Neighbors should claim. If a town!Neighbor had something useful to say, they would have said it.
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Wait - are we acting under the assumption that when you are added to or leave a side thread that it is not announced? I have also asked Faust to clarify - but just clarifying that is the mindset everyone speaking is acting under.
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Wait - are we acting under the assumption that when you are added to or leave a side thread that it is not announced? I have also asked Faust to clarify - but just clarifying that is the mindset everyone speaking is acting under.
I am.
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Wait - are we acting under the assumption that when you are added to or leave a side thread that it is not announced? I have also asked Faust to clarify - but just clarifying that is the mindset everyone speaking is acting under.
I am.
Well, either that or the Neighborhood is entirely scum. Otherwise, why wouldn't a town!Neighbor come forward and say, "hey, this person was the only person to join the Neighborhood last night, we should lynch them"? I doubt 3+ people joined, so if two joined, they're either both scum or one scum, one town. So if we lynch both of them, we're guaranteed to hit scum.
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So from people discussing this, I came up with a theory for what Jim's neighborhood was like that also explains why they killed him.
Theory:
Jim had a neighborhood with two players, the two kidneys. Except what he didn't know was that his neighbor was a mafia cancer kidney, not a healthy kidney like him. Maybe he claimed, maybe he didn't. But most likely it had daychat.l Either way, scum killed him for two reasons:
1) Shooting/rolestealing from him gives them a scum only neighborhood where half the team can talk during they day. Maybe the other teammates even have access to read the text if they were allowed to share the link in the mafia factional QT. So basically, they get buffed with daychat.
2) Shooting/rolestealing him is safer than doing it to another random town power. Probably at least some players would be bad to for mafia to shoot, but they know that Jim's main role is neighbor and that's a decent outcome for them.
This would explain why no one is claiming to be Jim's neighbor. Because his neighbor was scum and now there's a scum only neighborhood, probably with daychat.
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It does seem like Jimmmmm's town!neighbor(s) could claim here. They won't be IC though, since they could be scum fake claiming.
Maybe theres a chance we could even get info on why they picked jimmmm.
This part makes it sound like you're in agreement with the stuff EFHW and I were saying about how there's almost certain town benefit if the neighbour claims, and therefore no reason for a townie neighbour not to claim.
But ya I guess I'll leave it to Jimmms neighbour (or neighbours) to decide if they should appear.
... and this part sounds like the least enthusiastic agreement it's possible to make without actively looking like a hedge, being sure to leave lots of wiggle-room for scum to say they just didn't feel like claiming etc.
Hydrad hedges a lot. He doesn't look like scum here though because his activity level is high (for him) and the townie speculative thoughtfulness is there that he has trouble recreating as scum. We were scum together a few times back in 2015 so I feel like I got decently able to read him.
Also I just noticed that you basically laid out the theory I just posted already in a previous post.
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Jimm was a total null factor yesterday. I think the wagon was actually fairly townie.
Lets go with sole pr related stuff then. For starters, I was targeted last night and I'll leave it there for now.
gkrieg also prodded mcmc about this. I'm not following this logic either.
If the wagon is townie, do you think that scum were trying to stay off wagon? So you think we'll find a higher percentage of scum in the pool of: Iguana, Awaclus, IDPTG, Robz than we will in the pool of EFHW, gkrieg13, Galzria, Hydrad, Eevee, DatSwan, SpaceAnemone?
I guess no, I don't think that. I guess it probably has something to do with the fact that I was the other wagon. So I don't think scum had a preference of pushing the lynch to lalight instead of me. Add the fact that the end of the wagon was due to being close to deadline and needing a lynch it's hard for me to find a scum motivation for joining the lalight wagon. Upon reflection it's not a great point.
Sorry, I'm tired and not really reading things right, what exactly does this say? He doesn't think that scum were on the wagon, or he does think scum were on the wagon?
He thinks it's a big wash and scum could be anywhere because "all the wagons were on town."
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So from people discussing this, I came up with a theory for what Jim's neighborhood was like that also explains why they killed him.
Theory:
Jim had a neighborhood with two players, the two kidneys. Except what he didn't know was that his neighbor was a mafia cancer kidney, not a healthy kidney like him. Maybe he claimed, maybe he didn't. But most likely it had daychat.l Either way, scum killed him for two reasons:
1) Shooting/rolestealing from him gives them a scum only neighborhood where half the team can talk during they day. Maybe the other teammates even have access to read the text if they were allowed to share the link in the mafia factional QT. So basically, they get buffed with daychat.
2) Shooting/rolestealing him is safer than doing it to another random town power. Probably at least some players would be bad to for mafia to shoot, but they know that Jim's main role is neighbor and that's a decent outcome for them.
This would explain why no one is claiming to be Jim's neighbor. Because his neighbor was scum and now there's a scum only neighborhood, probably with daychat.
The day chat part is interesting - that kind of makes Skum’s upside to targeting Jim a lot more significant.
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I was typing up this thing on what we should do if it turns out the Neighborhood is told who enters but it relies on a bunch of assumptions so I'm not sure if it's relevant. If people want me to post it, I'll finish it and post, but it basically boiled down to: if there are any town!Neighbors, no more than two people joined last night, and the Neighbors are told who entered, they should claim today since I think it leads to, at worst, one mislynch and one successful lynch. This would have to be done today because tomorrow is MyLo without a scum lynch today so we don't have the luxury of a 1-for-1.
PPE: 4. I was working through it as I typed it and it took a bit.
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It does seem like Jimmmmm's town!neighbor(s) could claim here. They won't be IC though, since they could be scum fake claiming.
Maybe theres a chance we could even get info on why they picked jimmmm.
This part makes it sound like you're in agreement with the stuff EFHW and I were saying about how there's almost certain town benefit if the neighbour claims, and therefore no reason for a townie neighbour not to claim.
But ya I guess I'll leave it to Jimmms neighbour (or neighbours) to decide if they should appear.
... and this part sounds like the least enthusiastic agreement it's possible to make without actively looking like a hedge, being sure to leave lots of wiggle-room for scum to say they just didn't feel like claiming etc.
Ya I guess if I have to take a stance I'm in the I think neighbor should claim spot. I guess the second part was me realizing there could be a some reason the towny didn't need to claim. But I didn't fully consider that its more beneficial for scum most likely then town to not claim there.
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Hydrad hedges a lot. He doesn't look like scum here though because his activity level is high (for him) and the townie speculative thoughtfulness is there that he has trouble recreating as scum. We were scum together a few times back in 2015 so I feel like I got decently able to read him.
Also I just noticed that you basically laid out the theory I just posted already in a previous post.
I seem to be a easyish read while I keep rolling town so that makes these games easier. Although I'm worried about my next scum game then as I doubt I'll be able to keep this up. Ah well thats future me's problem.
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[tt[/tt]
I don't think Neighbors should claim. If a town!Neighbor had something useful to say, they would have said it.
towny
DAMA
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It does seem like Jimmmmm's town!neighbor(s) could claim here. They won't be IC though, since they could be scum fake claiming.
Maybe theres a chance we could even get info on why they picked jimmmm.
This part makes it sound like you're in agreement with the stuff EFHW and I were saying about how there's almost certain town benefit if the neighbour claims, and therefore no reason for a townie neighbour not to claim.
But ya I guess I'll leave it to Jimmms neighbour (or neighbours) to decide if they should appear.
... and this part sounds like the least enthusiastic agreement it's possible to make without actively looking like a hedge, being sure to leave lots of wiggle-room for scum to say they just didn't feel like claiming etc.
Hydrad hedges a lot. He doesn't look like scum here though because his activity level is high (for him) and the townie speculative thoughtfulness is there that he has trouble recreating as scum. We were scum together a few times back in 2015 so I feel like I got decently able to read him.
Also I just noticed that you basically laid out the theory I just posted already in a previous post.
Kinda disagree with this. I don’t have very recent experience, I think there are things that are more pointing towards scumminess.
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Kinda disagree with this. I don’t have very recent experience, I think there are things that are more pointing towards scumminess.
I'm the hedge master
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Posting so I don't get prodded. Swear I'm catching up shortly.
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Kinda disagree with this. I don’t have very recent experience, I think there are things that are more pointing towards scumminess.
I'm the hedge master
Oh, you think hedging is your ally. But you merely adopted the hedge; I was born in it, moulded by it.
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Sorry I'm not saying a lot. I noticed IDPTG has upped his game.
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DAMA I feel like I get what Hydrad is saying and that I did good things during the night. If that makes sense to hydrad he should let me know.
Ok i'll be honest I have no idea what this is trying to say. So no it does not make sense to me.
OHHH i am talking to datswan, nevermind hydrad.
I do not really agree with this in terms of "because to get his BP ability", just because I don't think a 1 shot BP is really like all that crazy strong - but whatever, not my primary point anyways. Main point would kind of the other side of what Galz pointed out about the Neighbor Changing or whatever.
I am just gonna get ahead of the questions here and say that "my pr is complicated" (or at least it is to me). Specifically, it leads me to believe it is possible that Skum!Neighbor may of had a PR that expires, or is forced to be used at an exact time.
Essentially what I am trying to say that if there was a situation last night where Skum!Nieghbor was "forced" to be the person to carry out the kill - then they would of had to kill Jim right? I am saying this under the assumption they would be removed from the Neighborhood or whatever once that was no longer part of their PR.
Does that make sense? I just re read it and I feel like it follows.
So same to you datswan I think I get what you are saying and that I did good things during the night, if that makes sense let me know
So I am reading back and I missed this because of the Swan/Hydrad mix up.
and in a non-sarcastic way... your question is a little hard to follow here? What is it you were asking?
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I don't think Neighbors should claim. If a town!Neighbor had something useful to say, they would have said it.
I agree with this concept, but also acting under the mindset that "they would of said it already" I think it is at least moderately odd to state the above.
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huh a jimmm kill? interesting. I wonder why they picked that?
Probably his neighbor is scum and he told them what his role was.
Who thinks that Town!Jim claimed their role in a Neighborhood thread?
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huh a jimmm kill? interesting. I wonder why they picked that?
Probably his neighbor is scum and he told them what his role was.
Who thinks that Town!Jim claimed their role in a Neighborhood thread?
I think it's very unlikely that he'd have been killed for the bulletproofer side of his role, and very likely indeed that if the nieghbourhood has daychat, a scum neighbour would encourage one of his scum buddies to kill Jimmmmm for the daychat aspect, if the assumption here is that the neighbourhood has daychat.
Depending on the resolution order in the night, it might be that Jimmmmm felt that he was safe revealing the BP side if his role, if he thought he was guaranteed to be able to BP his top townread regardless of whether or not his neighbour(s) was/were scummy. I haven't tried quizzing faust over resolution order things yet, so if someone else wants to ask and then shoot down my supposition if they like :-)
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I don't think Neighbors should claim. If a town!Neighbor had something useful to say, they would have said it.
I agree with this concept, but also acting under the mindset that "they would of said it already" I think it is at least moderately odd to state the above.
How is it "moderately odd" to give my reasoning for a statement?
I agree with Space about Jim almost certainly not being killed for 1-shot BP. It doesn't seem that useful for scum if they're not certain there's a Vig. A mixed Neighborhood could be dangerous for scum in that it could turn into an interrogation where being widely townread in the main game doesn't matter since town can't come to their defense.
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Jimm was a total null factor yesterday. I think the wagon was actually fairly townie.
Lets go with sole pr related stuff then. For starters, I was targeted last night and I'll leave it there for now.
gkrieg also prodded mcmc about this. I'm not following this logic either.
If the wagon is townie, do you think that scum were trying to stay off wagon? So you think we'll find a higher percentage of scum in the pool of: Iguana, Awaclus, IDPTG, Robz than we will in the pool of EFHW, gkrieg13, Galzria, Hydrad, Eevee, DatSwan, SpaceAnemone?
I guess no, I don't think that. I guess it probably has something to do with the fact that I was the other wagon. So I don't think scum had a preference of pushing the lynch to lalight instead of me. Add the fact that the end of the wagon was due to being close to deadline and needing a lynch it's hard for me to find a scum motivation for joining the lalight wagon. Upon reflection it's not a great point.
Sorry, I'm tired and not really reading things right, what exactly does this say? He doesn't think that scum were on the wagon, or he does think scum were on the wagon?
I am saying I don't think it is more likely to find scum off wagon then on wagon. I go on to explain why I made my original statement that the wagon was townie because I couldn't see a strong reason for scum to move off me and onto lalight, as well as the end of the wagon being necessary as deadline approached.
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The mcmc wagon seemed stalled to me, and it is very unlikely all the scum were on it. I think once the LL wagon got to be the same size scum would have been happy to jump on. They had lots of cover.
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Awaclus and Galzria have been prodded.
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sup
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I think it’s noteworthy that Awaclus isn’t voting me back, I’m not 100% but I don’t ever remember him reacting to suspicion like this before. It has usually escalated into a game long disagreement and multiple days of voting each other, so I could see why scumAwaclus would want to try to play it cool and hope it goes away. Especially if his role is important to his team.
Surprised to see Galzria prodded, I didn’t realize he hasn’t been posting. Earlier he had one Galzria-style analysis post I thought looked towny to me, but now that I think of it, it’s noteworthy I haven’t formed more of an opinion one way or another. I rarely read Galzria this null.
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I think it’s noteworthy that Awaclus isn’t voting me back, I’m not 100% but I don’t ever remember him reacting to suspicion like this before. It has usually escalated into a game long disagreement and multiple days of voting each other, so I could see why scumAwaclus would want to try to play it cool and hope it goes away. Especially if his role is important to his team.
Surprised to see Galzria prodded, I didn’t realize he hasn’t been posting. Earlier he had one Galzria-style analysis post I thought looked towny to me, but now that I think of it, it’s noteworthy I haven’t formed more of an opinion one way or another. I rarely read Galzria this null.
Yeah, I'm off most of this week and "technically" have a bunch of free time - but yesterday was filled with getting to meet Katie Ledecky, Ryan Murphy and Cullen Jones (13 Olympic Medals combined) in an extremely closed event (DatSwan, Myself, and 3 of our students).
Today is DatSwan's birthday so we're headed to Napa for the day.
Tomorrow is "sit at home day and recover before the weekend" though... so no excuses for not being caught up by tomorrow!
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I will be pretty busy today and tomorrow. Really want to give this a thorough reread soon.
vote: Mcmcsalot. He still looks scummy from yesterday, but seems to have really dialed back today. That kind of change within a game seems weird to me.
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I will be pretty busy today and tomorrow. Really want to give this a thorough reread soon.
vote: Mcmcsalot. He still looks scummy from yesterday, but seems to have really dialed back today. That kind of change within a game seems weird to me.
I thought he seemed more his usual self today. What do you mean by dialed back?
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I think it’s noteworthy that Awaclus isn’t voting me back, I’m not 100% but I don’t ever remember him reacting to suspicion like this before. It has usually escalated into a game long disagreement and multiple days of voting each other, so I could see why scumAwaclus would want to try to play it cool and hope it goes away. Especially if his role is important to his team.
I can't be voting for you man, there's more important stuff to do. Which, as it turns out, I'm not doing, so let's fix that. Vote: mcmc
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I will be pretty busy today and tomorrow. Really want to give this a thorough reread soon.
vote: Mcmcsalot. He still looks scummy from yesterday, but seems to have really dialed back today. That kind of change within a game seems weird to me.
I thought he seemed more his usual self today. What do you mean by dialed back?
By dialed back, he means that he seems more his usual self today.
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itsa wagon time
Vote: mcmc
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I will be pretty busy today and tomorrow. Really want to give this a thorough reread soon.
vote: Mcmcsalot. He still looks scummy from yesterday, but seems to have really dialed back today. That kind of change within a game seems weird to me.
I thought he seemed more his usual self today. What do you mean by dialed back?
By dialed back, he means that he seems more his usual self today.
When have you ever answered a question for someone else?
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I kinda feel like vote: Space is appropriate here. I get that LaLight and Space are friends, but their interaction towards the end of the day seemed a little too friendly. There's also the beginning of D2 where Space sought validation for hammering a mislynch. I don't know that town!Space would do that. I think set-up talk is NAI for Space since they definitely do it as town and it's not hard to emulate so I don't have anything further to say on that.
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I kinda feel like vote: Space is appropriate here. I get that LaLight and Space are friends, but their interaction towards the end of the day seemed a little too friendly. There's also the beginning of D2 where Space sought validation for hammering a mislynch. I don't know that town!Space would do that. I think set-up talk is NAI for Space since they definitely do it as town and it's not hard to emulate so I don't have anything further to say on that.
I had this same feeling on Space and LaLight. I thought the monologue before they voted seemed a little fake (sorry if it was totally real Space!)
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I will be pretty busy today and tomorrow. Really want to give this a thorough reread soon.
vote: Mcmcsalot. He still looks scummy from yesterday, but seems to have really dialed back today. That kind of change within a game seems weird to me.
I thought he seemed more his usual self today. What do you mean by dialed back?
By dialed back, he means that he seems more his usual self today.
When have you ever answered a question for someone else?
When have I ever not answered a question for someone else?
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I will be pretty busy today and tomorrow. Really want to give this a thorough reread soon.
vote: Mcmcsalot. He still looks scummy from yesterday, but seems to have really dialed back today. That kind of change within a game seems weird to me.
I thought he seemed more his usual self today. What do you mean by dialed back?
By dialed back, he means that he seems more his usual self today.
When have you ever answered a question for someone else?
When have I ever not answered a question for someone else?
Are....are you serious?
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Vote: gkrieg
Here's why.
I think both DatSwan and Hydrad are more likely town than scum. As in, I am townreading them right now based on my read of their play. Also, I think DatSwan's case has some merit, even though he didn't go into a lot of detail about it. Gkrieg's voting positions yesterday have feasible scum motivations.
But really, this is why I started to scumread gkrieg more and more.
If DatSwan is town, and Hydrad is town, and gkrieg is also town, then probably someone on a 4-person scum team would join the wagon and vote for gkrieg also to try to get the wagon going and get a mislynch.
However, if DatSwan is town, and Hydrad is town, and gkrieg is scum, I would expect it to go exactly as it did, with no one joining them and hoping that the wagon would dissipate. Now traction is all sort of moving to Awaclus/McMcsalot.
Scum are 4/12 players right now. The last time we had 4 scum with this few players, I was scum and we made the mistake of bussing and the whole game got impossible. Scum doesn't want to bus here, they want to mislynch a few times and win through sheer force of numbers.
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TLDR: gkrieg is scummy, and we should lynch him, and it has more to do with Hydrad/DatSwan being towny than anything. Let's discuss this and not lynch McMc.
@Hydrad, you should switch back, you had it right the first time, we can sort McMc later.
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Vote Count 2.3
gkrieg13 (2): DatSwan, iguanaiguana
Awaclus (1): Eevee
mcmcsalot (3): gkrieg13, Awaclus, Hydrad
SpaceAnemone (1): IDontPlayThisGame
Not Voting (5): EFHW, SpaceAnemone, mcmcsalot, Robz888, Galzria
With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Day 2 ends June 11, 2018, 03:30:00 am.
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I have not been able to read absolutely everything. Who came up with the idea that scum shot him for the day chat? Because this is something that hadn’t occurred to me, but it’s smart—so smart, in fact, that the person who posed this theory could very well be that scum.
Can someone quickly explain the mcmc case?
I just read iguana’s case on gkrieg, and while I don’t completely follow it, this sounds to me like the town iguana from a few games ago.
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Oh, also I have a gut feeling that Awaclus is town. Eevee is starting to see a little scummy, like the reckless buddying is covering for something.
Vote: Eevee
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I will be pretty busy today and tomorrow. Really want to give this a thorough reread soon.
vote: Mcmcsalot. He still looks scummy from yesterday, but seems to have really dialed back today. That kind of change within a game seems weird to me.
I thought he seemed more his usual self today. What do you mean by dialed back?
By dialed back, he means that he seems more his usual self today.
When have you ever answered a question for someone else?
When have I ever not answered a question for someone else?
I don't know, but this seems like Awaclus trying to be way too meta. I'm pretty sure Awaclus is scum.
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Vote: gkrieg
Here's why.
I think both DatSwan and Hydrad are more likely town than scum. As in, I am townreading them right now based on my read of their play. Also, I think DatSwan's case has some merit, even though he didn't go into a lot of detail about it. Gkrieg's voting positions yesterday have feasible scum motivations.
But really, this is why I started to scumread gkrieg more and more.
If DatSwan is town, and Hydrad is town, and gkrieg is also town, then probably someone on a 4-person scum team would join the wagon and vote for gkrieg also to try to get the wagon going and get a mislynch.
However, if DatSwan is town, and Hydrad is town, and gkrieg is scum, I would expect it to go exactly as it did, with no one joining them and hoping that the wagon would dissipate. Now traction is all sort of moving to Awaclus/McMcsalot.
Scum are 4/12 players right now. The last time we had 4 scum with this few players, I was scum and we made the mistake of bussing and the whole game got impossible. Scum doesn't want to bus here, they want to mislynch a few times and win through sheer force of numbers.
TLDR: gkrieg is scummy, and we should lynch him, and it has more to do with Hydrad/DatSwan being towny than anything. Let's discuss this and not lynch McMc.
@Hydrad, you should switch back, you had it right the first time, we can sort McMc later.
I don't think speculation on other people being townie is a good case on anyone. You don't know their alignments (assuming you're town). Based on pretty much the same logic, Mcmcsalot is scum because his wagon lost steam yesterday (and I could use the same logic that you/Awaclus/Galzria were pretty townie yesterday). Also my voting pattern is only scummy if Mcmcsalot is scum, whose wagon you are actively pushing against.
You can make inferences on peoples' alignment based on their wagons later in the game, but doing it with 12 left alive is much too early.
The thing that really gets me is how hard you start to push the wagon after you say that your case is based more on two players being townie than anything.
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I have not been able to read absolutely everything. Who came up with the idea that scum shot him for the day chat? Because this is something that hadn’t occurred to me, but it’s smart—so smart, in fact, that the person who posed this theory could very well be that scum.
Can someone quickly explain the mcmc case?
I just read iguana’s case on gkrieg, and while I don’t completely follow it, this sounds to me like the town iguana from a few games ago.
For me the mcmcsalot case is that he was doing lots of "pro-town" stuff D1. He was posting wagons, postcounts, discussing mass claim stuff, and he was very active. To me he had a lot less substance than he normally has. Then D2, he is much more laid back (hardly even a presence).
There is also the fact that the LaLight wagon grew so quickly, and many of the people on it were people that weren't on the mcmcsalot wagon. The fast growth must have been in part due to the approaching deadline, but it also makes sense if mcmcsalot is scum.
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Starting my rereads now.
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I have not been able to read absolutely everything. Who came up with the idea that scum shot him for the day chat? Because this is something that hadn’t occurred to me, but it’s smart—so smart, in fact, that the person who posed this theory could very well be that scum.
Can someone quickly explain the mcmc case?
I just read iguana’s case on gkrieg, and while I don’t completely follow it, this sounds to me like the town iguana from a few games ago.
Nice work calling me town and scum in the same post.
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Vote: gkrieg
Here's why.
I think both DatSwan and Hydrad are more likely town than scum. As in, I am townreading them right now based on my read of their play. Also, I think DatSwan's case has some merit, even though he didn't go into a lot of detail about it. Gkrieg's voting positions yesterday have feasible scum motivations.
But really, this is why I started to scumread gkrieg more and more.
If DatSwan is town, and Hydrad is town, and gkrieg is also town, then probably someone on a 4-person scum team would join the wagon and vote for gkrieg also to try to get the wagon going and get a mislynch.
However, if DatSwan is town, and Hydrad is town, and gkrieg is scum, I would expect it to go exactly as it did, with no one joining them and hoping that the wagon would dissipate. Now traction is all sort of moving to Awaclus/McMcsalot.
Scum are 4/12 players right now. The last time we had 4 scum with this few players, I was scum and we made the mistake of bussing and the whole game got impossible. Scum doesn't want to bus here, they want to mislynch a few times and win through sheer force of numbers.
TLDR: gkrieg is scummy, and we should lynch him, and it has more to do with Hydrad/DatSwan being towny than anything. Let's discuss this and not lynch McMc.
@Hydrad, you should switch back, you had it right the first time, we can sort McMc later.
I don't think speculation on other people being townie is a good case on anyone. You don't know their alignments (assuming you're town). Based on pretty much the same logic, Mcmcsalot is scum because his wagon lost steam yesterday (and I could use the same logic that you/Awaclus/Galzria were pretty townie yesterday). Also my voting pattern is only scummy if Mcmcsalot is scum, whose wagon you are actively pushing against.
You can make inferences on peoples' alignment based on their wagons later in the game, but doing it with 12 left alive is much too early.
The thing that really gets me is how hard you start to push the wagon after you say that your case is based more on two players being townie than anything.
I think it's better than your case on McMc!
I'm not decided on McMc, but I can see where he is coming from as town, given that he just moved across the country and he's been very busy but still wanted to play a game. His D1 did look scummy to me in a vacuum, but I could also see him as town feeling like he should participate but not really having time to sit down and properly analyse the game, and therefore just going with gut reads with no explanations and other super quick stuff like that as he read along.
Then D2 after getting some heat he did his best to put up some analysis to prove he can. So yeah, I can see that coming from him as town, but he could also be scum. I'm not decided on him yet. But this weak movement toward him now when the deadline is approaching makes me actually think more towny about him. So yeah, worth defending, and hopefully it doesn't bite me later.
As for you, I guess I should say that my read on DatSwan and Hydrad is pretty strong. Especially Hydrad, I would bet the game on him being town this time. DatSwan has not been AS towny today but I saw a lot of towny content from him yesterday and so he is still one of my strongest townreads.
And I don't have strong scum reads at all. But I know if I am right about DatSwan/Hydrad that you basically should be scum. So yeah, I feel good about the case. I think other people should check it out and maybe do rereads of Hydrad/DatSwan to see where I am coming from with them being towny and you being scummy by PoE.
One more thing, I do think your voting is kinda scummy yesterday even if McMc is town. If McMc is scum and you are scum, that would mean you voted a partner while making sure that a town got lynched instead. If McMc is town though, that means you eagerly voted towns all day, ensuring that both major wagons were on town by the EoD. It's certainly possible for a town to do what you did but the scum motivation is there too and that puts you under suspicion.
If you want me to vote somewhere else, then I guess I need stronger evidence than what I'm seeing to change my mind.
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If you're not interested in voting gkrieg, please at least comment on my case. Thx.
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ok
iguana has swayed me again.
even better because the part about me is true so that helps.
Vote: gkrieg
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I think it's better than your case on McMc!
I obviously disagree.
I'm not decided on McMc, but I can see where he is coming from as town, given that he just moved across the country and he's been very busy but still wanted to play a game. His D1 did look scummy to me in a vacuum, but I could also see him as town feeling like he should participate but not really having time to sit down and properly analyse the game, and therefore just going with gut reads with no explanations and other super quick stuff like that as he read along.
Then D2 after getting some heat he did his best to put up some analysis to prove he can. So yeah, I can see that coming from him as town, but he could also be scum. I'm not decided on him yet. But this weak movement toward him now when the deadline is approaching makes me actually think more towny about him. So yeah, worth defending, and hopefully it doesn't bite me later.
doesn't that mean that everyone who gets a wagon on them right now is townie?
As for you, I guess I should say that my read on DatSwan and Hydrad is pretty strong. Especially Hydrad, I would bet the game on him being town this time. DatSwan has not been AS towny today but I saw a lot of towny content from him yesterday and so he is still one of my strongest townreads.
And I don't have strong scum reads at all. But I know if I am right about DatSwan/Hydrad that you basically should be scum. So yeah, I feel good about the case. I think other people should check it out and maybe do rereads of Hydrad/DatSwan to see where I am coming from with them being towny and you being scummy by PoE.
I fundamentally disagree with you on this one. I don't think that 2 townie people voting for me and scum not jumping on makes me scum. I think scum would certainly jump on me if I were scum (people really like to bus me as scum, something you should know). But either way, this is a very flimsy case, not something that warrants "basically should be scum". Also PoE with 12 people alive where you have 2 town reads and no scum reads? I mean, come on. You can't say PoE as a reason when there are 8 people excluding yourself that you are writing off with no reason.
You can bet the game on Hydrad being town, but that is not what you are doing. You are speculating that scum would jump on my wagon (one with no good reasoning from Hydrad and DatSwan) if I were town. You even said yourself that the other points in your case aren't very strong, and that it almost all hinges on Hydrad and Datswan being townie. That means that they are voting for me with very flimsy evidence in the first place! Maybe that is the reason that no town and no scum have jumped on my wagon. It is definitely a much more likely reason than the one you are giving.
One more thing, I do think your voting is kinda scummy yesterday even if McMc is town. If McMc is scum and you are scum, that would mean you voted a partner while making sure that a town got lynched instead. If McMc is town though, that means you eagerly voted towns all day, ensuring that both major wagons were on town by the EoD. It's certainly possible for a town to do what you did but the scum motivation is there too and that puts you under suspicion.
If you want me to vote somewhere else, then I guess I need stronger evidence than what I'm seeing to change my mind.
I didn't vote for that many people D1, it just happened to be that the people I voted for ended up getting traction from other people. If you look at the timing of my votes (and not just that they were on people who were major wagons at the end of the day), you can see that this theory that I "ensur[ed] that both major wagons were on town by the EoD" is not valid. I didn't know that they would be the major wagons at the end of the day. The cases on both Mcmc and LaLight were good. You yourself were voting for mcmcsalot. You are also implying that scum like to vote for towns and get on major wagons, both of which aren't true. Scum like to stay off of mislynches, because that is where people look for scum the next day.
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ok
iguana has swayed me again.
even better because the part about me is true so that helps.
Vote: gkrieg
What sways you in his argument?
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ok
iguana has swayed me again.
even better because the part about me is true so that helps.
Vote: gkrieg
I guess that part that its hard to get your wagon started even if it feels like mainly town is on it. I also kinda have townreads on dat and iguana, so even if there isn't much i can point out that you might be scummy, the part about if we are all town and your lynch isn't really moving makes me kinda more sure that you are scum.
What sways you in his argument?
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gah quotes
I guess that part that its hard to get your wagon started even if it feels like mainly town is on it. I also kinda have townreads on dat and iguana, so even if there isn't much i can point out that you might be scummy, the part about if we are all town and your lynch isn't really moving makes me kinda more sure that you are scum.
What sways you in his argument?
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minus the
What sways you in his argument?
part. that was gkriegs... i'm good at this.
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I kinda feel like vote: Space is appropriate here. I get that LaLight and Space are friends, but their interaction towards the end of the day seemed a little too friendly. There's also the beginning of D2 where Space sought validation for hammering a mislynch. I don't know that town!Space would do that. I think set-up talk is NAI for Space since they definitely do it as town and it's not hard to emulate so I don't have anything further to say on that.
I had this same feeling on Space and LaLight. I thought the monologue before they voted seemed a little fake (sorry if it was totally real Space!)
It was totally real You've even met me and LL in real life!!
I'm not feeling the scum vibes from you that a bunch of other people seem to have been commenting on. However, I'm curious why you're not engaging with anything that's being said about neighbourhoods now. Early in D2 you did a bit of a vote analysis to try to rule out people that might have been Hydrad's neighbours.
Were you doing that because you figured the neighbour was a likely scum? If so, howcome you haven't said anything about the later discussions? How likely do you think it is that Jimmmmm was picked as the NK because it would open up the neighbourhood to more scums?
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Deadline is basically the end of the weekend.... not ideal at all... but we should keep it in mind.
I will share my thoughts on gkrieg's response later. I want more reactions from people not named gkrieg.
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I kinda feel like vote: Space is appropriate here. I get that LaLight and Space are friends, but their interaction towards the end of the day seemed a little too friendly. There's also the beginning of D2 where Space sought validation for hammering a mislynch. I don't know that town!Space would do that. I think set-up talk is NAI for Space since they definitely do it as town and it's not hard to emulate so I don't have anything further to say on that.
I had this same feeling on Space and LaLight. I thought the monologue before they voted seemed a little fake (sorry if it was totally real Space!)
I'm not feeling the scum vibes from you that a bunch of other people seem to have been commenting on. However, I'm curious why you're not engaging with anything that's being said about neighbourhoods now. Early in D2 you did a bit of a vote analysis to try to rule out people that might have been Hydrad's neighbours.
now I'm just being confused by everyone.
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I wish Jim breadcrumbed his damn neighbor. @hydra Space had you and Jim confused somehow
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oh because you were the neighbor maker last game probably
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I kinda feel like vote: Space is appropriate here. I get that LaLight and Space are friends, but their interaction towards the end of the day seemed a little too friendly. There's also the beginning of D2 where Space sought validation for hammering a mislynch. I don't know that town!Space would do that. I think set-up talk is NAI for Space since they definitely do it as town and it's not hard to emulate so I don't have anything further to say on that.
I had this same feeling on Space and LaLight. I thought the monologue before they voted seemed a little fake (sorry if it was totally real Space!)
It was totally real You've even met me and LL in real life!!
I'm not feeling the scum vibes from you that a bunch of other people seem to have been commenting on. However, I'm curious why you're not engaging with anything that's being said about neighbourhoods now. Early in D2 you did a bit of a vote analysis to try to rule out people that might have been Hydrad's neighbours.
Were you doing that because you figured the neighbour was a likely scum? If so, howcome you haven't said anything about the later discussions? How likely do you think it is that Jimmmmm was picked as the NK because it would open up the neighbourhood to more scums?
I think the speculation on the neighborhoods past what I said is rather unfruitful. I think mafia killed Jim because of the neighborhood and there are only two people in it and the other was scum.
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I think the speculation on the neighborhoods past what I said is rather unfruitful. I think mafia killed Jim because of the neighborhood and there are only two people in it and the other was scum.
It's relevant for stuff like this at least:
Who came up with the idea that scum shot him for the day chat? Because this is something that hadn’t occurred to me, but it’s smart—so smart, in fact, that the person who posed this theory could very well be that scum.
You (gkrieg) were the first one to go looking for neighbours as people who might be responsible for Jimmmmm's death, way before anyone was explicit about any of it...
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I'll read this later. Drunken game night ATM. DAMA, I suppose, but I won't guarantee seeing the question. For those that have played Bang!, we're finally playing with 8.
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it would be super neat to hear from the absent players at some point.
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it would be super neat to hear from the absent players at some point.
Sorry will do soon
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it would be super neat to hear from the absent players at some point.
Sorry will do soon
I've completed my reread and have a series of posts and notes mostly ready - I'm at work until 8:30 FT, but will start posting everything I have when I get home.
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oh because you were the neighbor maker last game probably
Yeah, sorry! Luckily, I think my meaning was clear enough. I don't think Hydrad is that confusable with Jimmmmm otherwise. I do see the Hydrad-Datswan confusion, though for me I think it's just watery associations of "Hydra" and "Swan" rather than direct icon confusion, since Hydrad just looks like a dark grey rectangle, whereas Swan always parses to me as a black-coloured grecian bust against an orange background, though I recognise that if you examine it closely it's actually a dog in a kitchen :-P
There is so little else comment-worthy to talk about just now.. I'm surprised that all but four players have actually posted in the last 24 hours! (The MIAs are EFHW, Eevee, Awaclus and Robz). I posted super-late last night before sleep, and now it's almost bedtime tonight, and there have only been 4 posts in between.
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oh because you were the neighbor maker last game probably
Yeah, sorry! Luckily, I think my meaning was clear enough. I don't think Hydrad is that confusable with Jimmmmm otherwise. I do see the Hydrad-Datswan confusion, though for me I think it's just watery associations of "Hydra" and "Swan" rather than direct icon confusion, since Hydrad just looks like a dark grey rectangle, whereas Swan always parses to me as a black-coloured grecian bust against an orange background, though I recognise that if you examine it closely it's actually a dog in a kitchen :-P
There is so little else comment-worthy to talk about just now.. I'm surprised that all but four players have actually posted in the last 24 hours! (The MIAs are EFHW, Eevee, Awaclus and Robz). I posted super-late last night before sleep, and now it's almost bedtime tonight, and there have only been 4 posts in between.
Why is all my content not comment worthy?
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Why is all my content not comment worthy?
Do you mean your weird tunnel on gkrieg, or something else? I figure gkrieg already pointed out that scum-reading someone from PoE based on the fact you more or less townread some other people people is a super-weak case.
I did go back to check the wagons you described, but I thought your evidence was really quite weak. You say that you think Hydrad and Swan are town and therefore you scumread gkrieg because if he's not scum then you'd expect a scum to vote on his wagon. The wagon in question existed for around 100 posts, but started very early in D2, and imho would have been a really conspicuous place for a scum to join, because it would put a player up to 3 votes while most others are not voting, apart from a couple of singleton votes. I wouldn't think that make gkrieg conf!scum even if Hydrad and Swan were ICs.
If I want to divine stuff from wagons, I'd be more interested in reviewing D1. For instance, at #99, mcmc joins the Eevee wagon, which at that point contains me and LL, so consequently I think it's quite possible that either mcmc or Eevee is scum. If you're a townie, then from your point of view at #289, you and LL area both voting mcmc, as is Awaclus.. so there ought to be an increased chance in your mind that at least one of Awaclus or mcmc is scum, and this is based on concretely-known alignments, not townread guesses.
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I don't really find the case on gkrieg convincing, I think it requires too many things to go right. I'm just not that confident that hydrad and and datswan are both town, just due to the odds.
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I haven't seen anyone other than gkrieg give a reason why he is towny or shouldn't be voted.
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Kind of odd this game is stalling. Iguana seems towny for pushing the case though, seems like a lot of mental hurdles to jump over to fake that. I think if he just wanted to fake a case, he could do it simpler. I'm not super towny on the people currently voting for mcmc, which makes me less interested in that lynch.
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OK all here is the thing, at this point I am liking my GK case more - I get that him not picking up a wagon isn't like exactly indicative of him being skum, but also if someone thinks differently (no offense, but other then GK), could we get some input?
RN there just is like assuredly a decent chunk of skum off the wagon is GK is skum btw. This is just waiting to be set up for a last minute scramble.
I also do not feel the other wagon on MCMC. I feel like their absence has been used against them when they have been more present then half of the field. Relatively to their normal play, they have not been around as much as normal, but I would pretty much rather lynch anyone else not posting at this point over MCMC. Not saying that MCMC couldn't be skum, just that I think GK would be way more likely skum flip at this point.
I do also want to mention that the more GK talks the less I am certain that they are skum. But right now, still my favorite case.
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I guess I'm still here. nothing has really changed for me in the last few posts so I don't really know what to say here.
rerere Vote: gkreig i guess?
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Kind of odd this game is stalling. Iguana seems towny for pushing the case though, seems like a lot of mental hurdles to jump over to fake that. I think if he just wanted to fake a case, he could do it simpler. I'm not super towny on the people currently voting for mcmc, which makes me less interested in that lynch.
There's a bit of a conflation of (at least) three things here.
1) You think the game is stalling in spite of enthusiastic posts.
2) You don't think Iguana is faking his zeal for pushing the gkrieg case.
3) You don't think the people pushing the only alternative wagon are townie.
4) Therefore you don't think the alternative wagon is on a scum.
So are 3 and 4 related in your mind to 1 and 2?
Do you personally think mcmc is scummy (aside from being voted for by allegedly-not-super-townie people)? How about gkrieg?
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Personally, I feel like people are working weirdly hard to divert from the mcmc wagon, and I don't think his behaviour in the game is so super-townie to warrant that.
Vote: mcmc
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OK all here is the thing, at this point I am liking my GK case more - I get that him not picking up a wagon isn't like exactly indicative of him being skum, but also if someone thinks differently (no offense, but other then GK), could we get some input?
I liked what gkrieg was doing looking for possible neighbours of Jimmmmm, and I thought his posts were helpful. I think Jimmmmm being a neighbour is crucially important, either because he had a scum neighbour and the reason he's dead is that the scums wanted an assumed neighbourhood daychat power, or because while his kill was entirely arbitrary, we expect his town buddy in there to die tonight because scums want daychat.
I like that gkrieg was clearly treating the neighbourhood aspect as important, while mcmc was working to downplay it, e.g. at #403 where he says that he thinks Jimmmmm being in a neighbouhood is coincidental, and in #404 where he says that "I doubt the kill was to do with his neighborhood".
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Personally, I think there's something interesting and discussion-worth there, both in the even itself and how people are reacting to it. Still nobody has come out and claimed to have been in a neighbourhood with Jimmmmm. I don't see many townie reasons to stay quiet in the main thread now that at least one scum has access to the neighbourhood, so I think that means a subset of scum probably have a neighbourhood. The only neighbourhood I've been in was a very useful space in which to daychat with Robz about how to lie to the rest of town and win M116, so two scums having that kind of power is not good. Howcome people aren't talking more about it?
Why do you think there were more than 2 people in the neighborhood?
@Awaclus:
1) Could you point to where I actually implied that I thought there might be more than two people?
2) What's your opinion of the gkrieg wagon?
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Request prods on EFHW, gkrieg13, Awaclus, mcmcsalot, Robz, and IDontPlayThisGame.
Note: we have a little over 18 hours till deadline.
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Space Count:
gkrieg13 (3): DatSwan, iguanaiguana, Hydrad
Awaclus (1): Eevee
mcmcsalot (3): gkrieg13, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone
SpaceAnemone (1): IDontPlayThisGame
Eevee (1): Robz888
Not Voting (3): EFHW, mcmcsalot, Galzria
We need 7 to get a lynch, and we only have 8 townies in the game.
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This is totally pathetic. Thanks for prodding everyone Space.
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1) Could you point to where I actually implied that I thought there might be more than two people?
2) What's your opinion of the gkrieg wagon?
1) I'd rather not do that.
2) Not super excited about it.
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OK all here is the thing, at this point I am liking my GK case more - I get that him not picking up a wagon isn't like exactly indicative of him being skum, but also if someone thinks differently (no offense, but other then GK), could we get some input?
RN there just is like assuredly a decent chunk of skum off the wagon is GK is skum btw. This is just waiting to be set up for a last minute scramble.
I also do not feel the other wagon on MCMC. I feel like their absence has been used against them when they have been more present then half of the field. Relatively to their normal play, they have not been around as much as normal, but I would pretty much rather lynch anyone else not posting at this point over MCMC. Not saying that MCMC couldn't be skum, just that I think GK would be way more likely skum flip at this point.
I do also want to mention that the more GK talks the less I am certain that they are skum. But right now, still my favorite case.
Are you going to address anything that Space has said in relation to me? Space has said that the wagon case on me is weak. Also mcmc isn’t posting. His post count today is really low. It’s like you are trying to come up with crappy reasons to keep the vote on me for some reason. Like trying to get other people to say that the wagon case is flimsy instead of trying to find scum elsewhere. Also your point that there is scum off the wagon if I’m scum is the same probability for mcmcsalot, so once again a super flimsy argument.
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Oh didn’t realize that Space and Datswan’s posts were in a different order than I thought. Some of my above post is invalid.
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I haven't seen anyone other than gkrieg give a reason why he is towny or shouldn't be voted.
But no one else has jumped on. You should look elsewhere for scum.
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Dude, scum knows that town needs 7 out of 8 townies to agree to lynch scum. Half the people in the game aren't even really playing. Of course it's going to be near impossible to get a wagon on scum.
there's two wagons here without a lot of traction. I just want people to think about the people voting both sides.
Hydrad/DatSwan/Iguana vs Space/gkrieg/Awaclus. Which side looks townier? Saying that should inform your vote when scum does not want to bus because town basically has to act with one mind is not crazy.
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Both major wagons being on town is really, really common D1. It is maybe THE most common thing. McMc is super absent for IRL reasons, making him unable to defend himself.
Those are good reasons why scum may want to target him for a mislynch if he is town, and if it were not for a few towny people suggesting gkrieg, he would be the only option proposed.
Even if McMc himself isn't super towny the circumstances around his wagon should give people pause.
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vote: mcmc
I strongly prefer the Mcmc lynch to Gkrieg, and for the following reason more than anything else:
f.ds has a bad meta that those who talk the most and participate more are far more likely to be suspected. In a game thread such as this, which has been as dead as it's been (and yes, I've been a contributor to this), scum have very little incentive to participate. They can't go non-existent either mind you, but why draw attention to themselves when there is simply no reason?
And of course, there's the WIFOM that if we "always let those that are participating get a pass" then scum will just post more - but if that's the end result I think we come out with a much better chance of catching them in the long term without having to rely on PR's to get lucky.
Further, in regards to Mcmc, this isn't just a "lynch all lurkers" lynch. He was definitely off D1 - I liked my case on him then, but I'll also admit I liked his defense. Problem I have is that... well, he was the 2nd leading wagon D1 - and it's reasonable to assume that he would come into today taking some heat for avoiding the lynch at LaLight's expense. From that perspective, as scum, I would've done exactly what he's done - meld into the shadows hoping to avoid that heat, but be ready to come up fighting if the pressure gets applied. From a town perspective though, I think I would've come into today with a little extra effort to right the ship, knowing that I was a possible "next-in-line-mislynch".
Gkrieg, on the other hand, is fighting the iguana case, even without a lot of votes (they're building a little bit now, but he's been active since the case was made). He's been active for most of D2, and the primary point against his lynch (that two other players appear townie to iguana) is something I just don't agree with. I think Datswan is scum. His thoughts D1 weren't well thought out or complete, and he's been making statements that to me have felt like he's trying to stay "in-meta" rather than find scum.
Moving down the list, I also think Eevee is scum. AFAIK he has like, no scum reads, and has been town reading almost everybody - a pretty telling scum!Eevee trait in my experience.
I'm also highly (highly) suspicious of Hydrad for reasons that I'm not going to go into right now.
Want to lynch:
Mcmc (Between him and Gkrieg, this is the better lynch)
Datswan (scum scum)
Eevee (scum scum)
Hydrad (scum scum)
Won't lynch:
Space (town tell - not going into more detail)
Iguana
Will lynch to get a lynch through:
Anybody
Don't want to lynch:
Gkrieg (reasons above, plus 2/3 on wagon I believe to be scum (Datswan/Hydrad)
Don't know what to make of:
Robz888 (Bad!Robz usually = Town!Robz though)
IDPTG (Is he even playing this game?)
Awaclus (Hell if I know)
EFHW (She was a stronger presence D1, and I think she'll be later on too - at least enough to get a better read than I have now)
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Both major wagons being on town is really, really common D1. It is maybe THE most common thing. McMc is super absent for IRL reasons, making him unable to defend himself.
Those are good reasons why scum may want to target him for a mislynch if he is town, and if it were not for a few towny people suggesting gkrieg, he would be the only option proposed.
Even if McMc himself isn't super towny the circumstances around his wagon should give people pause.
His wagon is also being fought against very hard by other people. Also your second paragraph is ridiculous. You go out of your way to make it sound like you and Hydrad and Datswan are heroes. Also the fact that wagons D1 are more likely to be town than one scum one town is equally flimsy. Does that just mean we should never lynch someone who had a wagon D1? Why have you done such a 180 on mcmc?
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Galzria's probably right (or scum), let's lynch Eevee though.
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This is going to sound dumb at this point, but I've been turning around on gkrieg. He defended himself really well, reminding me a lot of when I pushed his lynch in jungle oligarchy and I was wrong about him. I'm not 100% he's town and still have a lot of misgivings about how much my tunnel was discredited. But sometimes my reads really do suck so there is that.
Vote: Eevee
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Request prods on EFHW, gkrieg13, Awaclus, mcmcsalot, Robz, and IDontPlayThisGame.
EFHW, Awaclus, mcmc, Robz, Idplay have been prodded.
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Both major wagons being on town is really, really common D1. It is maybe THE most common thing. McMc is super absent for IRL reasons, making him unable to defend himself.
Those are good reasons why scum may want to target him for a mislynch if he is town, and if it were not for a few towny people suggesting gkrieg, he would be the only option proposed.
Even if McMc himself isn't super towny the circumstances around his wagon should give people pause.
His wagon is also being fought against very hard by other people. Also your second paragraph is ridiculous. You go out of your way to make it sound like you and Hydrad and Datswan are heroes. Also the fact that wagons D1 are more likely to be town than one scum one town is equally flimsy. Does that just mean we should never lynch someone who had a wagon D1? Why have you done such a 180 on mcmc?
I haven't done a 180 on him although I see where it looks like that. I just really don't think he's the best lynch today. I just get a vibe from his wagon that he is scum's choice for mislynch today.
Plus there was a lot of value in putting up a wagon and pushing everyone really hard to comment on it.
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A non-McMc wagon that is
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Request prods on EFHW, gkrieg13, Awaclus, mcmcsalot, Robz, and IDontPlayThisGame.
EFHW, Awaclus, mcmc, Robz, Idplay have been prodded.
I already posted though.
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Request prods on EFHW, gkrieg13, Awaclus, mcmcsalot, Robz, and IDontPlayThisGame.
EFHW, Awaclus, mcmc, Robz, Idplay have been prodded.
I am just coming off of an announced VLA, though. I am here now I've read everything since last I posted--I think I missed some posts in there before, though, and probably have to re-read this day, if not the entire game. Needless to say, I'm pretty lost. Sorry for my abysmal performance.
As I mentioned before, I think the effort iguana is putting in is highly likely to be town, so if even he has turned against the gkrieg wagon, we should not lynch there.
Probably means we just have to vote mcmc. I don't think he's behaving like his town self, although his behavior could 100% be attributed to IRL stuff rather game stuff. Still, I've noticed that he hasn't really tried to engage me this game whatsoever, and I think scum mcmc is more likely to do that.
Vote: mcmc
I will go back to Eevee if that wagon becomes viable.
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I like that gkrieg was clearly treating the neighbourhood aspect as important, while mcmc was working to downplay it, e.g. at #403 where he says that he thinks Jimmmmm being in a neighbouhood is coincidental, and in #404 where he says that "I doubt the kill was to do with his neighborhood".
I completely missed that mcmc said that. When mcmc was a Neighborizer in Smash Bros. Mafia and targeted me N1, he tried to convince me that he was town by saying that, if he was scum, he would have targeted a scumbuddy for Daychat. I find it hard to believe that town!mcmc would have such a change of heart.
Considering what others have been saying as well...
vote: mcmc
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And he was town in Smash Bros. Mafia.
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I like that gkrieg was clearly treating the neighbourhood aspect as important, while mcmc was working to downplay it, e.g. at #403 where he says that he thinks Jimmmmm being in a neighbouhood is coincidental, and in #404 where he says that "I doubt the kill was to do with his neighborhood".
I completely missed that mcmc said that. When mcmc was a Neighborizer in Smash Bros. Mafia and targeted me N1, he tried to convince me that he was town by saying that, if he was scum, he would have targeted a scumbuddy for Daychat. I find it hard to believe that town!mcmc would have such a change of heart.
Considering what others have been saying as well...
vote: mcmc
Oh, that's pretty damning.
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Vote Count 2.4
gkrieg13 (2): DatSwan, Hydrad
Awaclus (1): Eevee
mcmcsalot (6): gkrieg13, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, Galzria, Robz888, IDontPlayThisGame
Eevee (1): iguanaiguana
Not Voting (2): EFHW, mcmcsalot
With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Day 2 ends June 11, 2018, 03:30:00 am. That is in 14 hours.
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I will not be here for deadline, but with mcmc at L-1 we might not get there.
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This is going to sound dumb at this point, but I've been turning around on gkrieg. He defended himself really well, reminding me a lot of when I pushed his lynch in jungle oligarchy and I was wrong about him. I'm not 100% he's town and still have a lot of misgivings about how much my tunnel was discredited. But sometimes my reads really do suck so there is that.
Vote: Eevee
Sorry - still here. I'm at work all day, and then have a social event when I get off, but I'll have access all the way through to deadline and will be awake for this one.
If we can get more support here, I like the Eevee lynch more than I like the mcmc lynch.
Robz was on Eevee before and says he would go back if there's interest. With us on Eevee as well that's 3. Is there anybody else on/around that would be good with an Eevee lynch? We would need 4 more, which is a lot on a weekend this close to deadline.
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1) Could you point to where I actually implied that I thought there might be more than two people?
2) What's your opinion of the gkrieg wagon?
1) I'd rather not do that.
That feels just weird, given that you've already quoted a post and responded asking me about it. I didn't really bother reading back over what I'd said straight after your post.. just assumed that I'd worded something weirdly given that I'd been chasing a number of possibilities around in my head. Now I've been and tried to see what wording I used, I'm more confused.
2) Not super excited about it.
Thanks for answering that one!
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If we can get more support here, I like the Eevee lynch more than I like the mcmc lynch.
I prefer the mcmc lynch. I'm just not sure on Eevee -- I don't think I know his play well enough to scumread him, and I've been scum with him one time!
OTOH, I have an additional point that makes me suspicious of mcmc that I'm not ready to explain in-thread. I would be very disappointed to see people divert from his lynch yet again here..
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I'm about to be offline for a few hours (heading to the cinema with friends), then I'll be back for a short while, but then offline till after deadline.
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I just don't like the McMc wagon enough to hammer. I won't vote him today so I'm hoping for Eevee.
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I’m here I’m town.
I want to vote:eevee he has been buddying super hard. And I don’t have the time to explain all the things.
All the people voting me did you see that I have much earlier claimed to have been targeted by something during the night. I also targeted someone during the night.
I can say more if needed.
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wow I really am not a huge fan of either of these wagons.
gimme an hour to read back and I will get to it.
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@McMc I would say anything you think it would help town to know once you are dead. You are likely lynched I think.
And you Eevee vote didn't count.
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Sorry everyone. I've been super busy. I'm not feeling the gkrieg or mcmc wagons. Iguana, what makes you say Hydrad seems towny?
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Sorry everyone. I've been super busy. I'm not feeling the gkrieg or mcmc wagons. Iguana, what makes you say Hydrad seems towny?
I made a post about that. What about Eevee?
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I see we're at L1, so I won't try to start new wagons. vote: Eevee.
I'll fully catch up in a bit. Want to have a vote down.
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Hydrad hedges a lot. He doesn't look like scum here though because his activity level is high (for him) and the townie speculative thoughtfulness is there that he has trouble recreating as scum. We were scum together a few times back in 2015 so I feel like I got decently able to read him.
Also I just noticed that you basically laid out the theory I just posted already in a previous post.
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If we can get more support here, I like the Eevee lynch more than I like the mcmc lynch.
I prefer the mcmc lynch. I'm just not sure on Eevee -- I don't think I know his play well enough to scumread him, and I've been scum with him one time!
OTOH, I have an additional point that makes me suspicious of mcmc that I'm not ready to explain in-thread. I would be very disappointed to see people divert from his lynch yet again here..
If you really think he is scum, then tell us why. This is too vague to influence my vote.
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Hydrad hedges a lot. He doesn't look like scum here though because his activity level is high (for him) and the townie speculative thoughtfulness is there that he has trouble recreating as scum. We were scum together a few times back in 2015 so I feel like I got decently able to read him.
Also I just noticed that you basically laid out the theory I just posted already in a previous post.
Thanks. I remember this post now. Let's talk more Day 3.
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@McMc I would say anything you think it would help town to know once you are dead. You are likely lynched I think.
And you Eevee vote didn't count.
This
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@McMc I would say anything you think it would help town to know once you are dead. You are likely lynched I think.
And you Eevee vote didn't count.
This
What I mean is, the way things are looking, if you want to live you'll have to say a lot more.
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That feels just weird, given that you've already quoted a post and responded asking me about it. I didn't really bother reading back over what I'd said straight after your post.. just assumed that I'd worded something weirdly given that I'd been chasing a number of possibilities around in my head. Now I've been and tried to see what wording I used, I'm more confused.
Well, I just thought that there was an opportunity to scumhunt a little there, which is why it's kinda necessary for you to be confused by it.
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Vote: eevee
I will try to stay on as much as possible there is information I want to reveal if I am lynched but not before
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Vote: eevee
I will try to stay on as much as possible there is information I want to reveal if I am lynched but not before
vote: eevee third times the charm
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Vote: eevee
I will try to stay on as much as possible there is information I want to reveal if I am lynched but not before
As in you want to reveal it when we go to twilight, not at intent-to-hammer?
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Galzria makes 4 for Eevee. Lynching him requires 3 more.
Robz? DatSwan? Hydrad? Space? gkrieg?
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Vote: eevee
I will try to stay on as much as possible there is information I want to reveal if I am lynched but not before
Can you address why you no longer think scum is willing to use a Night Action to gain Daychat?
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Vote: eevee
I will try to stay on as much as possible there is information I want to reveal if I am lynched but not before
Will you be around at 3:30 am ft?
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Vote: eevee
I will try to stay on as much as possible there is information I want to reveal if I am lynched but not before
As in you want to reveal it when we go to twilight, not at intent-to-hammer?
yea
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Vote: eevee
I will try to stay on as much as possible there is information I want to reveal if I am lynched but not before
Will you be around at 3:30 am ft?
no
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Galzria makes 4 for Eevee. Lynching him requires 3 more.
Robz? DatSwan? Hydrad? Space? gkrieg?
Robz will, I thionk datswan and Space might too
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It is scummy of you to ignore idplay's question...
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Vote: eevee
I will try to stay on as much as possible there is information I want to reveal if I am lynched but not before
Can you address why you no longer think scum is willing to use a Night Action to gain Daychat?
When did I think this before and when did I say I don't think this now? I am confused
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Vote: eevee
I will try to stay on as much as possible there is information I want to reveal if I am lynched but not before
Can you address why you no longer think scum is willing to use a Night Action to gain Daychat?
When did I think this before and when did I say I don't think this now? I am confused
for the record I think it is somewhat likely that knowing scum could gain daychat they might want to do that.
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Okay so jimm being in a neighborhood I assume is coincidental. He was most likely in a neighborhood with the liver or multiple organs in the abdominal cavity.
This was most likely an exisiting neighborhood from the beginning of the game with day chat. It potentially had night chat instead but would have been reveled at the beginning. I doubt the kill was to do with his neighborhood. Even if he was in a neighborhood with scum why are we assuming he divulged his role. I mean D1 in an rmm why ever do that.
Okay here is where I reference the neighborhood, dunno must have been drinking. I think it does make sense that non neighborhood scum would want to kill town jimm who was a neighborhood with a scum!neighbor. As noone is claiming neighbor I don't think this is helpful information however.
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Vote: eevee
I will try to stay on as much as possible there is information I want to reveal if I am lynched but not before
As in you want to reveal it when we go to twilight, not at intent-to-hammer?
yea
That is so weird.
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Vote: eevee
I will try to stay on as much as possible there is information I want to reveal if I am lynched but not before
As in you want to reveal it when we go to twilight, not at intent-to-hammer?
yea
That is so weird.
I mean because if I am not getting lynched I don't want to reveal unnecessary info but I do have info town needs. This info does nothing now but will potentially explain things later.
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Vote: eevee
I will try to stay on as much as possible there is information I want to reveal if I am lynched but not before
As in you want to reveal it when we go to twilight, not at intent-to-hammer?
yea
That is so weird.
I mean because if I am not getting lynched I don't want to reveal unnecessary info but I do have info town needs. This info does nothing now but will potentially explain things later.
Right so intent to hammer is a better time than twilight because it may change someone's vote
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Hydrad hedges a lot. He doesn't look like scum here though because his activity level is high (for him) and the townie speculative thoughtfulness is there that he has trouble recreating as scum. We were scum together a few times back in 2015 so I feel like I got decently able to read him.
Also I just noticed that you basically laid out the theory I just posted already in a previous post.
Just to point out that Hydrad hasn't said anything since my long sequence of posts earlier. Nor has he addressed Galz's claim that he's scum. I know that posting times and online statuses aren't totally reliable as a scum-hunting tool, but Hydrad has gone quiet now there's something meaningful to discuss.
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I don't think Hydrad is usually active during this timeframe.
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If we can get more support here, I like the Eevee lynch more than I like the mcmc lynch.
I prefer the mcmc lynch. I'm just not sure on Eevee -- I don't think I know his play well enough to scumread him, and I've been scum with him one time!
OTOH, I have an additional point that makes me suspicious of mcmc that I'm not ready to explain in-thread. I would be very disappointed to see people divert from his lynch yet again here..
If you really think he is scum, then tell us why. This is too vague to influence my vote.
I'm tempted, but I think that level of infodump is not a good thing to drop this close to the deadline, especially since I have to get to bed imminently. D3 is a better time for claims and setup-solving anyway.
If mcmc is not the lynch for today, and I wind up the NK, at least you'll have a good idea why that might be :-P
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I don't think Hydrad is usually active during this timeframe.
... you could look at his posting history in this game to see that's blatantly false. Right now, he hasn't posted in a bit over 14 hours. Many of his other recent posts have been sometime around 1-7pm forum time. I get that weekends often cause people's timings to change. I just find it really odd that you'd rush to his defence with something so flimsy!
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Ok I'm here. My week has been a bit busier lately but I will admit I have been lurking a bit. I guess my thought process right now is that I kinda wanna go eevee because I was kinda feeling off about him recently. But I was kinda getting worried if I'm just jumping around to whatever case is available and making myself think I would of voted there on my own or if I'm getting influenced too much by others. I also don't want to be wrong so I've been debating who to vote on
Poe: 3
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I think I would of voted mcmc normally here. But his reaction to his claiming is kinda makes me think he's town and is making me hesitant
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I don't think Hydrad is usually active during this timeframe.
... you could look at his posting history in this game to see that's blatantly false. Right now, he hasn't posted in a bit over 14 hours. Many of his other recent posts have been sometime around 1-7pm forum time. I get that weekends often cause people's timings to change. I just find it really odd that you'd rush to his defence with something so flimsy!
Lol whatever here he is
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I do think it's a fair thing that space was suspecting me on.
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I also will be around for a while I think.
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If I don't vehemently defend my townreads then scum will have a harder time with their inevitable wild endgame conspiracy theories that I am scum with whoever :P
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I think I would of voted mcmc normally here. But his reaction to his claiming is kinda makes me think he's town and is making me hesitant
Would you agree that a case has been made against him? If so, is his reaction so towny that it invalidates the entire case?
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Vote: eevee
I will try to stay on as much as possible there is information I want to reveal if I am lynched but not before
Can you address why you no longer think scum is willing to use a Night Action to gain Daychat?
When did I think this before and when did I say I don't think this now? I am confused
Would you like me to go find the QT?
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I think I would of voted mcmc normally here. But his reaction to his claiming is kinda makes me think he's town and is making me hesitant
Would you agree that a case has been made against him? If so, is his reaction so towny that it invalidates the entire case?
When you put it that way. No. I guess it isn't enough. Hmm. But yet I just have this feeling he's going to flip town. But either way I think I'm willing to intent to hammer.
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Vote: eevee
I will try to stay on as much as possible there is information I want to reveal if I am lynched but not before
I assumes this means that you're acknowledging that you might not be on at the deadline. If this information is so worth knowing, is it worth the risk that you're not on for twilight and it's lost for good?
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faust, do you have any problem with me posting a link to a QT from a game long over?
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Vote: eevee
I will try to stay on as much as possible there is information I want to reveal if I am lynched but not before
I assumes this means that you're acknowledging that you might not be on at the deadline. If this information is so worth knowing, is it worth the risk that you're not on for twilight and it's lost for good?
Note that twilight for D1 was barely 2 minutes long. It was so short that the thread locked while I was trying to write a post :-(
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faust, do you have any problem with me posting a link to a QT from a game long over?
I would be a bit surprised if you get a response to this much before the deadline... it's already almost 0130 in Germany.
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Space Count
gkrieg13 (2): DatSwan, Hydrad
Awaclus (1): Eevee
mcmcsalot (6): gkrieg13, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, Galzria, Robz888, IDontPlayThisGame
Eevee (3): iguanaiguana, mcmcsalot, EFHW
I was moderately surprised to realise that the springing-up of the Eevee wagon didn't take mcmc off L-1 after all. Hydrad can still hammer here.
Also notice that Swan, Eevee and Hydrad are three of the six people resisting the mcmc wagon, and are the three Galz has fingered as mcmc's scumbuddies. I actually feel like Iguana has been putting up more diversions from mcmc than most, so I think he's up there as a possible scumbuddy if Galz is wrong about one of them.
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I think I'll wait a bit for mcmc to appear so that he can claim after I vote. If he doesn't appear after a bit I'll just vote tho.
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OK done I think with read back.
1) MCMC not wanting to reveal the info until twilight is probably OK yes? I mean I get the idea of vote moving, but also I feel like if "Town!MCMC with a relevant damning result" were at play here, he would obviously reveal it. Not to mention that is just in general, in this instance he is on the chopping block. First point for first points, this is like worth quite a few town points so to speak. I guess it could be Skum!MCMC lying about results, but then like... I mean he what just random bread-crumbed shit at the start of the day to use for a defense he didn't know he would need later in the day?
2) So I am just not getting the Eevee case to be honest. I don't like the MCMC case either obviously, so eff me right? But really, I am not saying I have like a crazy strong town read on them or anything, but the way it has just exploded seems so weird. Like I can come up with a partner I would like to pursue for pretty much every flip at this point, but with Eevee I am just left with like no one... maybe Awculus... but that is a stretch even.
3) I keep trying to go through the vote counts from yesterday to help with this situation and I don't find much. The things that pop up would be
- Obviously, MCMC has been wagoned and then de-wagoned 2/2 days now (or I guess not de-wagoned yet today, but you get what I mean). I mean tbh that kind of stands out, but still my overall feel on him is towny.
- Other than that it is just the vote sequence stuff I mentioned at the beginning of the day.
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I will be on until DL (on phone for the last 2 hours).
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Also, I was at the point of getting turned around on GK but currently still like that case better than either of these wagons. So if any one is having second thoughts I have a back up option over here.
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I guess it could be Skum!MCMC lying about results, but then like... I mean he what just random bread-crumbed shit at the start of the day to use for a defense he didn't know he would need later in the day?
Is it really that much of a stretch?
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vote: Eevee.
Intent to hammer Mcmc if he hits L-1 again.
Essentially: I prefer the Eevee lynch. I want my vote there to show my support for his lynch.
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Vote: Eevee
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In that case I'll go to vote: mcmc so l-1 again
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In that case I'll go to vote: mcmc so l-1 again
i think that is L2 actually...
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Updated:
Space Count
gkrieg13 (2): DatSwan, Hydrad
Awaclus (1): Eevee
mcmcsalot (5): gkrieg13, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, IDontPlayThisGame, Hydrad
Eevee (5): iguanaiguana, mcmcsalot, EFHW, Galzria, Robz888
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Updated:
Space Count
gkrieg13 (1): DatSwan
Awaclus (1): Eevee
mcmcsalot (5): gkrieg13, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, IDontPlayThisGame, Hydrad
Eevee (5): iguanaiguana, mcmcsalot, EFHW, Galzria, Robz888
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In that case I'll go to vote: mcmc so l-1 again
i think that is L2 actually...
Oh I didn't realize robz was their also
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I’m here, catching up.
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I’m here, catching up.
Tell us why you're not scum, Eevee!
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Well, I’m heavily incentivized to vote for mcmc here, but I don’t want to accidentally hammer.
I don’t really have a great defense for myself, I’m getting suspected for buddying in a lot of my games, In sure i’ve been on both sides of the alignment chart. It’s tough to figure anything out before a scum flip, Awaclus is the lunch I think would have the highest chance of hitting scum, but admittedly people’s likelihood’s of being scum are too close in my reads (meaning the reads are too weak).
other than awaclus, top scumreads would be space and robz.
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I’ve been traveling a lot, I feel I was more than engaged day 1 for whatever reason. Just honestly haven’t been forming strong opinions, I know it it isn’t a great defence.
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vote: mcmc
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other than awaclus, top scumreads would be space and robz.
Why
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Updated:
Space Count
gkrieg13 (1): DatSwan
mcmcsalot (6): gkrieg13, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, IDontPlayThisGame, Hydrad, Eevee (L-1)
Eevee (5): iguanaiguana, mcmcsalot, EFHW, Galzria, Robz888
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okay im here where are we at.
dama
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EEVEE do you think im scum and why?
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datswan and robz are online I think they are both town fyi
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I am and i am and Idk what to do here tbh. I am desperately reading back and trying to find something of value. I guess I’ll should say that i don’t have it in me to let it go no lynch but i will take the time i have to make a choice.
Also - i think both options suck
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gkrieg13 (2): DatSwan, Hydrad
mcmcsalot (6): gkrieg13, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, IDontPlayThisGame, hydrad, eevee
Eevee (5): iguanaiguana, efhw, mcmcsalot, robz888, galz
is where we are at
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You have Hydrad twice.
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swan what do you want from me. I am town, I have had low amounts of time and far less analytical work hen normal. what is currently suading you. do you see eevee's buddying?
oh where is he?
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Updated:
Space Count
gkrieg13 (1): DatSwan
mcmcsalot (6): gkrieg13, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, IDontPlayThisGame, Hydrad, Eevee (L-1)
Eevee (5): iguanaiguana, mcmcsalot, EFHW, Galzria, Robz888
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gkrieg13 (1): DatSwan
mcmcsalot (6): gkrieg13, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, IDontPlayThisGame, hydrad, eevee
Eevee (5): iguanaiguana, efhw, mcmcsalot, robz888, galz
is where we are at
swan and any town meber of my wagon
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swan is around to even us up, if any other person is here who is on me please say so
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I want to go to bed soon and need to defend or give my info
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Space Count
gkrieg13 (2): DatSwan, Hydrad
Awaclus (1): Eevee
mcmcsalot (6): gkrieg13, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, Galzria, Robz888, IDontPlayThisGame
Eevee (3): iguanaiguana, mcmcsalot, EFHW
I was moderately surprised to realise that the springing-up of the Eevee wagon didn't take mcmc off L-1 after all. Hydrad can still hammer here.
Also notice that Swan, Eevee and Hydrad are three of the six people resisting the mcmc wagon, and are the three Galz has fingered as mcmc's scumbuddies. I actually feel like Iguana has been putting up more diversions from mcmc than most, so I think he's up there as a possible scumbuddy if Galz is wrong about one of them.
Space seeing that eevee finally voted me do you get that I am a scum forced lynch and eevee was hedging untill as late as possible.
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I townread Hydrad and Space on the mcmcsalot wagon. IDPTG and Eevee are null for me, Awaclus still seems scummy.
Townread Robz and EFHW on the Eevee wagon, scumread iguana and mcmcsalot, Galz is null.
Man these wagons are kinda even for me right now.
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datswan and gkrieg if you votge eevee we are safe if not I need to reveal my info
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plese make the decision soon as I need to go to bed
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I'm around. Nothing for me to do though looks like.
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gonna brush my teeth then I need to go to bed or Im divorced so pleaae if your town lets do his
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datswan and gkrieg if you votge eevee we are safe if not I need to reveal my info
Sorry, would rather lynch you than Eevee.
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okay I have to go to bed please dont lynch me.
I was a dual role. The urethra and the ureter (bladder) I could roleblock(uethra) or be a deflector(ureter) night 1 I roleblocked eevee, nothing I know of happened. WHen Day 2 started I was informed that I was now a vanilla townie.
I confirmed that the mafia only steals your power if you were successfully killed so I wasn't a mafia target that got doctored or anything.
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Keep in mind. If you are town and you are thinking of lynching mcmc I would like it to be done while he can claim.
Poe: 1
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I townread Hydrad and Space on the mcmcsalot wagon. IDPTG and Eevee are null for me, Awaclus still seems scummy.
Townread Robz and EFHW on the Eevee wagon, scumread iguana and mcmcsalot, Galz is null.
Man these wagons are kinda even for me right now.
My reads are completely 180 from thid. I have at least some qualms about hydrad and space, think IDP is town and Eevee scum, and Awaclus town for sure.
Null on EFHW, hard town on iguana, real unsure about mcmc. I share your null on Galz, though!
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Oh. I guess he claimed. Hmm
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Oh. I guess he claimed. Hmm
any thoughts, why do you think im scum"?
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okay I have to go to bed please dont lynch me.
I was a dual role. The urethra and the ureter (bladder) I could roleblock(uethra) or be a deflector(ureter) night 1 I roleblocked eevee, nothing I know of happened. WHen Day 2 started I was informed that I was now a vanilla townie.
I confirmed that the mafia only steals your power if you were successfully killed so I wasn't a mafia target that got doctored or anything.
This definitely doesn't make me feel any better about you. Roleblocker deflector is definitely a good scum role, like really good. Also a really good role for town however.
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okay I have to go to bed please dont lynch me.
I was a dual role. The urethra and the ureter (bladder) I could roleblock(uethra) or be a deflector(ureter) night 1 I roleblocked eevee, nothing I know of happened. WHen Day 2 started I was informed that I was now a vanilla townie.
I confirmed that the mafia only steals your power if you were successfully killed so I wasn't a mafia target that got doctored or anything.
right so you have to think I made this up or that reall somehow I lkost my role(scummy as it is) and decide whats the scum narrative vs a town narrative
This definitely doesn't make me feel any better about you. Roleblocker deflector is definitely a good scum role, like really good. Also a really good role for town however.
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good night all, sry for not being active please dont make the mistake of lynching me.
my only good read is eevee scum.
robz, datswan and efhw are towny
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im bad at reading awaclus, galz it depends on how he is feeling/what he thinks of others to reads him.
please keep uo on post counts and wagaon dsplays with colors if Im gone I always say this and it doesnt happoen
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Like. I'm fine with everything about the claim. Except the vt part. But I don't know if scum would do that. That's kinda weird. Unless that's mcmc maybe stealing jimmms role and using vt to say he can't prove that he's that role?
I think I'm still fine with the lynch
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Go to bed, bro! Don't get divorced.
So, I fully believe mcmc was this role, lost it, and is now VT. Too weird to make up.
He could be town or scum, however. This info doesn't help us there.
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Ya I don't think he made the role up. Maybe the vt part is a lie but I think the other part is true. But ya I dunno what alignment it isbb
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I townread Hydrad and Space on the mcmcsalot wagon. IDPTG and Eevee are null for me, Awaclus still seems scummy.
Townread Robz and EFHW on the Eevee wagon, scumread iguana and mcmcsalot, Galz is null.
Man these wagons are kinda even for me right now.
What's scummy about iguana?
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How do I lose my rlemas scum balance wise.
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Go to bed, bro! Don't get divorced.
So, I fully believe mcmc was this role, lost it, and is now VT. Too weird to make up.
He could be town or scum, however. This info doesn't help us there.
Aside from inviting potential trackers, it gives scum!mcmc an excuse to claim no results later in the game.
PPE: what?
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Go to bed, bro! Don't get divorced.
So, I fully believe mcmc was this role, lost it, and is now VT. Too weird to make up.
He could be town or scum, however. This info doesn't help us there.
Aside from inviting potential trackers, it gives scum!mcmc an excuse to claim no results later in the game.
PPE: what?
Go to bed, bro! Don't get divorced.
So, I fully believe mcmc was this role, lost it, and is now VT. Too weird to make up.
He could be town or scum, however. This info doesn't help us there.
Aside from inviting potential trackers, it gives scum!mcmc an excuse to claim no results later in the game.
PPE: what?
This is why earlier I wanted to know if anyone targeted me. And tried to bring this up. It’s not a last ditch lynch thing I immediately said I had stuff gong on
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Go to bed, bro! Don't get divorced.
So, I fully believe mcmc was this role, lost it, and is now VT. Too weird to make up.
He could be town or scum, however. This info doesn't help us there.
Aside from inviting potential trackers, it gives scum!mcmc an excuse to claim no results later in the game.
PPE: what?
It discourages trackers from tracking mcmc, is that what you meant? Yes, it is a convenient claim for scum!mcmc, but I think it's a true claim regardless.
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Still wont lynch mcmc, still hoping for Eevee.
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Go to bed, bro! Don't get divorced.
So, I fully believe mcmc was this role, lost it, and is now VT. Too weird to make up.
He could be town or scum, however. This info doesn't help us there.
Aside from inviting potential trackers, it gives scum!mcmc an excuse to claim no results later in the game.
PPE: what?
It discourages trackers from tracking mcmc, is that what you meant? Yes, it is a convenient claim for scum!mcmc, but I think it's a true claim regardless.
I meant it encourages a potential tracker to verify it. Also, if mcmc performed the NK, he'd now be a Neighbor (possibly with a bulletproofer shot) and no longer the previous role- which looks like a VT/Goon to those not in the Neighborhood.
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Ok I’m not doing Eevee and I’m not letting it go to no lynch so consider this internet to hammer mcmc. I’ll wair until the end in case people come online and i really hate both choices but i am mcmc over eevee.
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Ok I’m not doing Eevee and I’m not letting it go to no lynch so consider this internet to hammer mcmc. I’ll wair until the end in case people come online and i really hate both choices but i am mcmc over eevee.
Siri sucks *interest to hammer* *Ill wait*
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Datswan, why not Eevee?
I'm not saying it'll happen at this point - Hydrad, IDPTG & Gkrieg have all had opportunities to switch and haven't, and Space has said they prefer Mcmc... Which just leaves Awaclus for the switch, and...
But you didn't say "We're not getting an Eevee lynch", you said "I'm not doing Eevee" - Why don't you think Eevee is scum?
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I think they are less likely skum than mcmc.
All me and the girl friend doing stuff in 30-ish minutes.
I’m hammering mcmc before i go. So if you don’t want that to be an option change your shit accordingly
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Hammering in 20
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faust, do you have any problem with me posting a link to a QT from a game long over?
No.
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Vote Count 2.5
gkrieg13 (1): DatSwan
mcmcsalot (6): gkrieg13, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, IDontPlayThisGame, Hydrad, Eevee
Eevee (5): iguanaiguana, EFHW, mcmcsalot, Galzria, Robz888
Not Voting (0)
With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Day 2 ends June 11, 2018, 03:30:00 am. That is in 2.5 hours.
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Been way more than 20. I’m going to bed.
vote: mcmc
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So.... I’m feeling like we somehow did a good thing?
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i'm worried and regretting it
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Day 2 Final Vote Count
mcmcsalot (7): gkrieg13, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, IDontPlayThisGame, Hydrad, Eevee, DatSwan
Eevee (5): iguanaiguana, EFHW, mcmcsalot, Galzria, Robz888
Not Voting (0)
With 12 alive, it took 7 to lynch.
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What followed were lots of further examinations. Alex was told that they had to prep them for surgery, to remove some of the tumors that build in their kidney. According to the doctors, there was an about 60% chance that this would remove the cancer, otherwise Alex might face having the whole kidney removed.
Still, the experts were baffled by Alex's other, seemingly unrelated symptoms. It took two months before their test, and consultations with other medical experts, yielded results.
Alex's doctor sat down beside them. "We have found the likely cause of what you're going through." She paused. "It seems that you are suffering from a very rare auto-immune deficiency called Morbus Efdeësis. It seems to have been triggered by the cancer and causes your body to turn against itself in an attempt to destroy the cancer cells. In theory this, could even be helpful..." She hesitated for a bit. "However, the targeting isn't very accurate, and your condition actually affects helathy organs."
mcmcsalot has been lynched! They were the Bladder, the Deflector/Roleblocker.
Night 2 begins and lasts 48 hours. Night actions are due by June 12, 2018, 03:30:00 pm.
Thread locked!
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"The good news is" said someone. It was another doctor this time. Alex had had so many of those talks that they only half-listened. "The good news is, we have identified the cancer here, and if we take quick action, we should be able to remove it."
Eevee is Mafia-aligned.
Day 3 begins!
Vote Count 3.0
Not Voting (11): EFHW, gkrieg13, iguanaiguana, Eevee, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, Hydrad, Robz888, DatSwan, Galzria, IDontPlayThisGame
With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 3 ends June 20, 2018, 04:00:00 am.
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what
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so Eevee is alive yes?
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take that back it clearly says he is alive.
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thats interesting. My thought is a cop role that they don't have to out themselves. so seems pretty good.
also this makes me feel a bit better because I was going to post 3 people that I wanted to lynch today and eevee was one of them. although he was my least confident vote out of all 3. So the fact that hes outed here is nice.
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also i'm sorry mcmc. I want to apologize for going through with your lynch. My gut was feeling that you were town but I went through with the lynch for reasons but they weren't good enough.
From now on this game i'm going back to gut!Hydrad because I think he plays better then thinking!Hydrad
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also i'm sorry mcmc. I want to apologize for going through with your lynch. My gut was feeling that you were town but I went through with the lynch for reasons but they weren't good enough.
From now on this game i'm going back to gut!Hydrad because I think he plays better then thinking!Hydrad
Yeah I am obviously kind of seconding that notion in this moment.
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Hydrad you gonna be on for a sec?
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That's... a neat announcement.
Can a mod lie? Or, rather, do we think that a mod would include a power to publicly announce a player as scum who might not be scum?
Also, before we rush to lynch, I think we should consider claiming - at least, we should discuss if we want to do it today or tomorrow. Right now we're at 11 alive with 4 scum, not 10. Thanks to the lack of a NK last night we're not in MyLo. Assuming that Eevee is in fact scum, after the lynch we'll go to night at 10 alive and 3 scum.
Actually... I don't know. I feel like I'm talking myself out of it. I definitely feel like I personally have some things I want to get out sooner rather than later, but I also can't do it on my own - I would need to potentially out others - and I don't want to have a premature mass claim.
Is there any downside to lynching Eevee here that people can think of? He could be some sort of lynch bomb, yes? Is that usually targeted by the player (Eevee), or is it the person that does the hammer? If the latter, we should consensus who casts final vote.
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Hydrad you gonna be on for a sec?
ya i should be for a bit before i sleep. probably at least an hour
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That's... a neat announcement.
Can a mod lie? Or, rather, do we think that a mod would include a power to publicly announce a player as scum who might not be scum?
Also, before we rush to lynch, I think we should consider claiming - at least, we should discuss if we want to do it today or tomorrow. Right now we're at 11 alive with 4 scum, not 10. Thanks to the lack of a NK last night we're not in MyLo. Assuming that Eevee is in fact scum, after the lynch we'll go to night at 10 alive and 3 scum.
Actually... I don't know. I feel like I'm talking myself out of it. I definitely feel like I personally have some things I want to get out sooner rather than later, but I also can't do it on my own - I would need to potentially out others - and I don't want to have a premature mass claim.
Is there any downside to lynching Eevee here that people can think of? He could be some sort of lynch bomb, yes? Is that usually targeted by the player (Eevee), or is it the person that does the hammer? If the latter, we should consensus who casts final vote.
First paranoid thought that comes to mind is Skum has a "target player and have them announced the next day as skum" sort of thing.
And I mean I have not been playing as long as you guys... but does the mod ever like actually lie? I don't think that should be factored in too much probably.
Most likely Eevee is probably skum. Which is weird for me because I did like wayyyyy too much re read work last night coming up with conclusions that pretty much all just got kicked in the ass if that is true.
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That's... a neat announcement.
Can a mod lie? Or, rather, do we think that a mod would include a power to publicly announce a player as scum who might not be scum?
Also, before we rush to lynch, I think we should consider claiming - at least, we should discuss if we want to do it today or tomorrow. Right now we're at 11 alive with 4 scum, not 10. Thanks to the lack of a NK last night we're not in MyLo. Assuming that Eevee is in fact scum, after the lynch we'll go to night at 10 alive and 3 scum.
Actually... I don't know. I feel like I'm talking myself out of it. I definitely feel like I personally have some things I want to get out sooner rather than later, but I also can't do it on my own - I would need to potentially out others - and I don't want to have a premature mass claim.
Is there any downside to lynching Eevee here that people can think of? He could be some sort of lynch bomb, yes? Is that usually targeted by the player (Eevee), or is it the person that does the hammer? If the latter, we should consensus who casts final vote.
wow i didn't even consider the option of a lynch bomb. thats a great idea.
Also In my opinion I would say I could imagine a game where scum could fake a mod thing like that. But I highly doubt it would be in this game where scum already had a decent number advantage compared to most games, If you also gave scum that power it would be brutal I think.
So I believe that eevee is scum like 98%. It helps that I am scum reading him already I guess.
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Hydrad you gonna be on for a sec?
ya i should be for a bit before i sleep. probably at least an hour
Well now Galz is here so he can be included too I guess lol
But like... wtf with the wagon then yesterday if Eevee is skum?
I was kind of banking on TvT wagon and there was a shit ton of skum on Eevee that were going for cred but that is pretty much shot to shit at this point.
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That's... a neat announcement.
Can a mod lie? Or, rather, do we think that a mod would include a power to publicly announce a player as scum who might not be scum?
Also, before we rush to lynch, I think we should consider claiming - at least, we should discuss if we want to do it today or tomorrow. Right now we're at 11 alive with 4 scum, not 10. Thanks to the lack of a NK last night we're not in MyLo. Assuming that Eevee is in fact scum, after the lynch we'll go to night at 10 alive and 3 scum.
Actually... I don't know. I feel like I'm talking myself out of it. I definitely feel like I personally have some things I want to get out sooner rather than later, but I also can't do it on my own - I would need to potentially out others - and I don't want to have a premature mass claim.
Is there any downside to lynching Eevee here that people can think of? He could be some sort of lynch bomb, yes? Is that usually targeted by the player (Eevee), or is it the person that does the hammer? If the latter, we should consensus who casts final vote.
First paranoid thought that comes to mind is Skum has a "target player and have them announced the next day as skum" sort of thing.
And I mean I have not been playing as long as you guys... but does the mod ever like actually lie? I don't think that should be factored in too much probably.
Most likely Eevee is probably skum. Which is weird for me because I did like wayyyyy too much re read work last night coming up with conclusions that pretty much all just got kicked in the ass if that is true.
Mods don't actually lie unless it's a Bastard game, no. I was alluding more to the type of power you said there... I just don't know that it's a reasonable type power. I mean, Godfather turns Red to Green when copped - but that's specifically targeted and not publicly confirmed. I think a false public "confirmation" comes across as too close to mod lying.
I think if anything, Hydrad's suggestion of a Cop that exists that can target someone to have their alignment publicly announced is most likely. Maybe even-night only?
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Good morning all!
My bet is that scum started the game with a bunch of nerf roles, one of which could easily have been "your alignment is announced at the start of D3".
Another nerf would have been being in a neighbourhood with a townie who'd know about it if they did the NK, because they'd vanish from the neighbourhood. My guess would be that whoever NKd Jimmmmm had the worst nerf of the lot, so went first with the role-switching.
Thinking along those lines, I'd guess that Eevee probably tried to make last night's kill and was thwarted somehow. Would be cool if he'd hit Jimmmmm's BPd person, for instance :-)
PPE ~5
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Hydrad you gonna be on for a sec?
ya i should be for a bit before i sleep. probably at least an hour
Well now Galz is here so he can be included too I guess lol
But like... wtf with the wagon then yesterday if Eevee is skum?
I was kind of banking on TvT wagon and there was a shit ton of skum on Eevee that were going for cred but that is pretty much shot to shit at this point.
For me this is making me even more confident about my reads. Like I said before I wasn't super sure eevee was scum but I was doing some thinking around the fact if eevee was scum who do I think is scum. and now that hes all but confirmed it makes me feel better.
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Good morning all!
My bet is that scum started the game with a bunch of nerf roles, one of which could easily have been "your alignment is announced at the start of D3".
Another nerf would have been being in a neighbourhood with a townie who'd know about it if they did the NK, because they'd vanish from the neighbourhood. My guess would be that whoever NKd Jimmmmm had the worst nerf of the lot, so went first with the role-switching.
Thinking along those lines, I'd guess that Eevee probably tried to make last night's kill and was thwarted somehow. Would be cool if he'd hit Jimmmmm's BPd person, for instance :-)
PPE ~5
Is the "your role is announced" bit a common thing?
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Good morning all!
My bet is that scum started the game with a bunch of nerf roles, one of which could easily have been "your alignment is announced at the start of D3".
Another nerf would have been being in a neighbourhood with a townie who'd know about it if they did the NK, because they'd vanish from the neighbourhood. My guess would be that whoever NKd Jimmmmm had the worst nerf of the lot, so went first with the role-switching.
Thinking along those lines, I'd guess that Eevee probably tried to make last night's kill and was thwarted somehow. Would be cool if he'd hit Jimmmmm's BPd person, for instance :-)
PPE ~5
wow once again you guys are thinking of things I'm not even considering and making good points.
I guess I thought of scum roles nerfing themselves, but didn't expect on how they could work other then just being goons.
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Good morning all!
My bet is that scum started the game with a bunch of nerf roles, one of which could easily have been "your alignment is announced at the start of D3".
Another nerf would have been being in a neighbourhood with a townie who'd know about it if they did the NK, because they'd vanish from the neighbourhood. My guess would be that whoever NKd Jimmmmm had the worst nerf of the lot, so went first with the role-switching.
Thinking along those lines, I'd guess that Eevee probably tried to make last night's kill and was thwarted somehow. Would be cool if he'd hit Jimmmmm's BPd person, for instance :-)
PPE ~5
Is the "your role is announced" bit a common thing?
I meant faction rather than role, I guess. Isn't that exactly how IC works?
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Good morning all!
My bet is that scum started the game with a bunch of nerf roles, one of which could easily have been "your alignment is announced at the start of D3".
Another nerf would have been being in a neighbourhood with a townie who'd know about it if they did the NK, because they'd vanish from the neighbourhood. My guess would be that whoever NKd Jimmmmm had the worst nerf of the lot, so went first with the role-switching.
Thinking along those lines, I'd guess that Eevee probably tried to make last night's kill and was thwarted somehow. Would be cool if he'd hit Jimmmmm's BPd person, for instance :-)
PPE ~5
Why wouldn't Eevee have killed Jimmm N1 to knock two birds with one stone?
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Good morning all!
My bet is that scum started the game with a bunch of nerf roles, one of which could easily have been "your alignment is announced at the start of D3".
Another nerf would have been being in a neighbourhood with a townie who'd know about it if they did the NK, because they'd vanish from the neighbourhood. My guess would be that whoever NKd Jimmmmm had the worst nerf of the lot, so went first with the role-switching.
Thinking along those lines, I'd guess that Eevee probably tried to make last night's kill and was thwarted somehow. Would be cool if he'd hit Jimmmmm's BPd person, for instance :-)
PPE ~5
Is the "your role is announced" bit a common thing?
I meant faction rather than role, I guess. Isn't that exactly how IC works?
Wanna make it clear I am absolutely not arguing with you. That was a genuine question. IC I have played with, I have never seen this happen before.
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Good morning all!
My bet is that scum started the game with a bunch of nerf roles, one of which could easily have been "your alignment is announced at the start of D3".
Another nerf would have been being in a neighbourhood with a townie who'd know about it if they did the NK, because they'd vanish from the neighbourhood. My guess would be that whoever NKd Jimmmmm had the worst nerf of the lot, so went first with the role-switching.
Thinking along those lines, I'd guess that Eevee probably tried to make last night's kill and was thwarted somehow. Would be cool if he'd hit Jimmmmm's BPd person, for instance :-)
PPE ~5
Why wouldn't Eevee have killed Jimmm N1 to knock two birds with one stone?
This is a good point.
Although while we are all living in paranoid-ville. Maybe he couldn't kill N1 or something?
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I'll let space answer that question since people don't usually like when I try to answer for them. But I don't think thats exactly what space was trying to say.
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Good morning all!
My bet is that scum started the game with a bunch of nerf roles, one of which could easily have been "your alignment is announced at the start of D3".
Another nerf would have been being in a neighbourhood with a townie who'd know about it if they did the NK, because they'd vanish from the neighbourhood. My guess would be that whoever NKd Jimmmmm had the worst nerf of the lot, so went first with the role-switching.
Thinking along those lines, I'd guess that Eevee probably tried to make last night's kill and was thwarted somehow. Would be cool if he'd hit Jimmmmm's BPd person, for instance :-)
PPE ~5
Why wouldn't Eevee have killed Jimmm N1 to knock two birds with one stone?
Like I said above, "My guess would be that whoever NKd Jimmmmm had the worst nerf of the lot." So maybe on of his buddies had something even more urgent to fix.
The scum team is 4 players out of 14, which is a high ration, so I think they were always going to have something keeping them from slaughtering us wholesale. Pretty sure I said as much D1.
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Hydrad you gonna be on for a sec?
ya i should be for a bit before i sleep. probably at least an hour
Well now Galz is here so he can be included too I guess lol
But like... wtf with the wagon then yesterday if Eevee is skum?
I was kind of banking on TvT wagon and there was a shit ton of skum on Eevee that were going for cred but that is pretty much shot to shit at this point.
For me this is making me even more confident about my reads. Like I said before I wasn't super sure eevee was scum but I was doing some thinking around the fact if eevee was scum who do I think is scum. and now that hes all but confirmed it makes me feel better.
Wait, so assuming Eevee is "actually skum"... that doesn't effect your opinion of Robz and Galz at the end of day yesterday?
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Alas boys, girls and others - It's almost 2am, I was at work for 11 hours yesterday, and I must be awake in 5 for work tomorrow. To bed I must go!
Quite looking forward to catching up tomorrow though!
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I meant faction rather than role, I guess. Isn't that exactly how IC works?
Wanna make it clear I am absolutely not arguing with you. That was a genuine question. IC I have played with, I have never seen this happen before.
It's a faust-constructed RMM, so I'm absolutely not surprised if there's innovative cool stuff that's just a short hop away from stuff we know :-)
I'm not saying I'm necessarily right about my interpretation of what happened to Eevee, but it's the most likely thing I can think of that fits with what I can see and infer about the game.
Maybe Eevee can come along and explain himself? :-P
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Alas boys, girls and others - It's almost 2am, I was at work for 11 hours yesterday, and I must be awake in 5 for work tomorrow. To bed I must go!
Quite looking forward to catching up tomorrow though!
Your inclusion of "others" here is very very appreciated :-)
Also, I really have to be getting to work...
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Alas boys, girls and others - It's almost 2am, I was at work for 11 hours yesterday, and I must be awake in 5 for work tomorrow. To bed I must go!
Quite looking forward to catching up tomorrow though!
(((My "Today's", "Tomorrow's", and "Yesterday's" get very mixed up at 2:00am... but y'all get the point.)))
G'night!
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Hydrad you gonna be on for a sec?
ya i should be for a bit before i sleep. probably at least an hour
Well now Galz is here so he can be included too I guess lol
But like... wtf with the wagon then yesterday if Eevee is skum?
I was kind of banking on TvT wagon and there was a shit ton of skum on Eevee that were going for cred but that is pretty much shot to shit at this point.
For me this is making me even more confident about my reads. Like I said before I wasn't super sure eevee was scum but I was doing some thinking around the fact if eevee was scum who do I think is scum. and now that hes all but confirmed it makes me feel better.
Wait, so assuming Eevee is "actually skum"... that doesn't effect your opinion of Robz and Galz at the end of day yesterday?
hmm I explained it poorly. Its more like this. after I saw mcmc flip I instantly went to the thought process ok if eevee is scum here who else is scummy and who is towny. So I was going to enter today with claims based on the idea that eevee was scum.
The fact that hes basically confirmed scum makes my reads that I was thinking of more confident.
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i am a renowned member of the mafia, truly a made man. just lynch me and get it over with
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Hydrad you gonna be on for a sec?
ya i should be for a bit before i sleep. probably at least an hour
Well now Galz is here so he can be included too I guess lol
But like... wtf with the wagon then yesterday if Eevee is skum?
I was kind of banking on TvT wagon and there was a shit ton of skum on Eevee that were going for cred but that is pretty much shot to shit at this point.
For me this is making me even more confident about my reads. Like I said before I wasn't super sure eevee was scum but I was doing some thinking around the fact if eevee was scum who do I think is scum. and now that hes all but confirmed it makes me feel better.
Wait, so assuming Eevee is "actually skum"... that doesn't effect your opinion of Robz and Galz at the end of day yesterday?
hmm I explained it poorly. Its more like this. after I saw mcmc flip I instantly went to the thought process ok if eevee is scum here who else is scummy and who is towny. So I was going to enter today with claims based on the idea that eevee was scum.
The fact that hes basically confirmed scum makes my reads that I was thinking of more confident.
Fair enough. I was kind of looking at it from the other way around right after the flip. The fact that i was forced to hammer after Galz and Robz switched off made me suspicious, but then when MCMC flipped town I was confused about why they wouldn't switch back to hammer town. Made me think it was TvT. But now, honestly I am even more confused. cuz like... if Eevee was skum, why would skum flip onto Eevee, note that they will hammer MCMC, and then not hammer Town!MCMC and stay on Skum!Eevee?
Thinking while I am typing but Space's idea of the announced starting Day X would make sense there I guess.
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Hydrad you gonna be on for a sec?
ya i should be for a bit before i sleep. probably at least an hour
Well now Galz is here so he can be included too I guess lol
But like... wtf with the wagon then yesterday if Eevee is skum?
I was kind of banking on TvT wagon and there was a shit ton of skum on Eevee that were going for cred but that is pretty much shot to shit at this point.
For me this is making me even more confident about my reads. Like I said before I wasn't super sure eevee was scum but I was doing some thinking around the fact if eevee was scum who do I think is scum. and now that hes all but confirmed it makes me feel better.
Wait, so assuming Eevee is "actually skum"... that doesn't effect your opinion of Robz and Galz at the end of day yesterday?
hmm I explained it poorly. Its more like this. after I saw mcmc flip I instantly went to the thought process ok if eevee is scum here who else is scummy and who is towny. So I was going to enter today with claims based on the idea that eevee was scum.
The fact that hes basically confirmed scum makes my reads that I was thinking of more confident.
Fair enough. I was kind of looking at it from the other way around right after the flip. The fact that i was forced to hammer after Galz and Robz switched off made me suspicious, but then when MCMC flipped town I was confused about why they wouldn't switch back to hammer town. Made me think it was TvT. But now, honestly I am even more confused. cuz like... if Eevee was skum, why would skum flip onto Eevee, note that they will hammer MCMC, and then not hammer Town!MCMC and stay on Skum!Eevee?
Thinking while I am typing but Space's idea of the announced starting Day X would make sense there I guess.
gonna stop thinking out loud now and actually think bc that makes no sense. Skum absorb the power they kill, so obviously they would of had Eevee commit the kill and that would of been their plan if they knew Eevee would be announced... sooooo pretty much my whatever amount of hours put into read backs the last few days is completely meaningless.
fan-tas-tic
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also I guess its easier for me because robz and galz are kinda towny for me. so if anything they are even townier now.
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i am a renowned member of the mafia, truly a made man. just lynch me and get it over with
what would be the Town!Eevee upside of you taking this approach?
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i am a renowned member of the mafia, truly a made man. just lynch me and get it over with
what would be the Town!Eevee upside of you taking this approach?
I don't think there is one. I think its a scum!eevee trying to not give any info away.
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also I guess its easier for me because robz and galz are kinda towny for me. so if anything they are even townier now.
Who the hell did you go to last night thinking was (as you put) "3 top skum", if bottom was Eevee and neither of the others were Robz or Galz?
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with 4 skum alive... just on the off chance that eevee is town, it would only take two town votes to pretty much end this game.
I am a fan at this point of doing something like "will vote Eevee" prior to voting? If someone sees a flaw that is fine. Since I brought it up I will just open with
I will vote Eevee.
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with 4 skum alive... just on the off chance that eevee is town, it would only take two town votes to pretty much end this game.
I am a fan at this point of doing something like "will vote Eevee" prior to voting? If someone sees a flaw that is fine. Since I brought it up I will just open with
I will vote Eevee.
Sure, I like the cautious approach. I'd also like to see the day drag on for a while to force the other scums into having interactions, commenting on Eevee etc.
I will vote Eevee.
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also I guess its easier for me because robz and galz are kinda towny for me. so if anything they are even townier now.
Who the hell did you go to last night thinking was (as you put) "3 top skum", if bottom was Eevee and neither of the others were Robz or Galz?
Hmm I guess there isn't much point in hiding it. I'll do a semi claim for this.
my top 3 were gkrieg/Space/ and eevee was 3rd but lower.
Space is the one that probably seems out of there for most people but heres where my mini claim is. I'm in a neighbourhood with space.
Space was definitely pushing me towards an mcmc lynch over both gkreig and a bit of eevee. This is partly why I lynched mcmc even though I thought he was kinda towny. If he flipped scum I would of put space near the top of town reads, but since he flipped town and the other option was scum (and from my view the 3rd option was also scum) this makes me think space is really scummy.
At the very even if people don't as strongly think those 2 are scummy I'd like this part to be thought about. If either space or gkrieg flips scum look at the other heavily.
Also sorry space if you are town and I just kinda did that claim without letting you know.
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welp I wasn't sure if I was actually going to post that last one or not. I had typed it out then was having second thoughts while highlighting over the post button and i guess i clicked it. No going back now I guess.
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also I guess its easier for me because robz and galz are kinda towny for me. so if anything they are even townier now.
Who the hell did you go to last night thinking was (as you put) "3 top skum", if bottom was Eevee and neither of the others were Robz or Galz?
Hmm I guess there isn't much point in hiding it. I'll do a semi claim for this.
my top 3 were gkrieg/Space/ and eevee was 3rd but lower.
Space is the one that probably seems out of there for most people but heres where my mini claim is. I'm in a neighbourhood with space.
Space was definitely pushing me towards an mcmc lynch over both gkreig and a bit of eevee. This is partly why I lynched mcmc even though I thought he was kinda towny. If he flipped scum I would of put space near the top of town reads, but since he flipped town and the other option was scum (and from my view the 3rd option was also scum) this makes me think space is really scummy.
At the very even if people don't as strongly think those 2 are scummy I'd like this part to be thought about. If either space or gkrieg flips scum look at the other heavily.
Also sorry space if you are town and I just kinda did that claim without letting you know.
Space - confirm? (no offense Hydrad)
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Space - confirm? (no offense Hydrad)
none taken
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Space - confirm? (no offense Hydrad)
none taken
also you can tell me to eff off and that would be acceptable - but i am gonna ask anyways.
How long have you and Space been in a hood together?
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Space - confirm? (no offense Hydrad)
none taken
also you can tell me to eff off and that would be acceptable - but i am gonna ask anyways.
How long have you and Space been in a hood together?
we started the game together. just us no one else was in it s far as i'm aware.
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kay well that was all way more interesting than I thought it was gonna be but i gotta call it for the night.
Also I wanna see the QT IDP was talking about since faust said it was cool.
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Yes, Hydrad and I are in a neighbourhood with day and night chat, and have been since the start of the game. This is one of the reasons I was so focused on neighbourhood stuff yesterday.
And my "extra" piece of info on mcmc was that he appeared to have "neighbourhood slipped" by making an assumption that I didn't think was the first default someone would go to. I expected him either to flip neighbour, or more likely to flip scum, because I'm really very confident that Jimmmmm's kill shows that scums are aware of neighbourhoods. Hydrad totally agreed with the "slip" theory in our QT, which was why I was so suspicious of him for not acting on it, and making such a big pantomime deal of being torn.
At one point yesterday, I was quite sure that maybe the thing scum is burdened with is that they're all in neighbourhoods with townies who'd notice they are missing, which is why I've been quite suspicious of Hydrad and his motives.
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Hydrad you gonna be on for a sec?
ya i should be for a bit before i sleep. probably at least an hour
Well now Galz is here so he can be included too I guess lol
But like... wtf with the wagon then yesterday if Eevee is skum?
I was kind of banking on TvT wagon and there was a shit ton of skum on Eevee that were going for cred but that is pretty much shot to shit at this point.
For me this is making me even more confident about my reads. Like I said before I wasn't super sure eevee was scum but I was doing some thinking around the fact if eevee was scum who do I think is scum. and now that hes all but confirmed it makes me feel better.
Wait, so assuming Eevee is "actually skum"... that doesn't effect your opinion of Robz and Galz at the end of day yesterday?
hmm I explained it poorly. Its more like this. after I saw mcmc flip I instantly went to the thought process ok if eevee is scum here who else is scummy and who is towny. So I was going to enter today with claims based on the idea that eevee was scum.
The fact that hes basically confirmed scum makes my reads that I was thinking of more confident.
Fair enough. I was kind of looking at it from the other way around right after the flip. The fact that i was forced to hammer after Galz and Robz switched off made me suspicious, but then when MCMC flipped town I was confused about why they wouldn't switch back to hammer town. Made me think it was TvT. But now, honestly I am even more confused. cuz like... if Eevee was skum, why would skum flip onto Eevee, note that they will hammer MCMC, and then not hammer Town!MCMC and stay on Skum!Eevee?
Thinking while I am typing but Space's idea of the announced starting Day X would make sense there I guess.
If any scum were on Eevee yesterday, then they are the ones who played it best because they mislynched McMc while still being off wagon.
But we should talk about that tomorrow, not today, I think.
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Ok, actually, I don't think we should give reads today at all. Right now we are 4/11 with 6 needed to lynch. If all goes well, we will be 3/9 or 3/10 with 5 needed to lynch either way.
Scum is close to winning this, even after we lynch Eevee. So they are looking for townies with incorrect reads to keep alive and townies with correct reads to kill. Let's not make that easy for them by talking about what we think beyond whether or not we should lynch Eevee.
I think we should definitely lynch Eevee. The way I see it, 100% he's scum, with a small chance something bad happens if we lynch him. It's not really worth considering other options, I think.
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I'll go further and say that I think Space is wrong. We should have a short day, with little talking, because at least from the talking we've done so far I think scum has more to gain from it than town does, if anyone who was discussing was in fact town.
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Only (probably) one person is going to die at night anyway, so I don't see the need to claim anything. I think we should save all the claiming and outing until tomorrow.
vote: Eevee
Also sorry I was wrong about Mcmc. This also means that both wagons were town D1, which may give us a little information.
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I agreee with iguana. No claiming, no helping scum by letting them know which townies have better reads. Finger of suspicion at DatSwan for trying to draw this info out of hydrad.
Vote: Eevee
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It be hilarious if Eevee is town. Just saying.
vote: Eevee
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It'd be hilarious if Eevee is town. Just saying.
vote: Eevee
Fixed
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Before I vote Eevee, do we want to dictate hammerer?
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Before I vote Eevee, do we want to dictate hammerer?
A role likie that would be way too powerful for scum here.
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Before I vote Eevee, do we want to dictate hammerer?
A role likie that would be way too powerful for scum here.
You think? Counter balanced by like, Space's theory that Eevee was announced scum due to his own PR? I mean, I guess...
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vote: Eevee
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Before I vote Eevee, do we want to dictate hammerer?
I'm not too worried about it. If we're being maximally careful, I'd nominate DatSwan to hammer.
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Things are looking up!
Why DatSwan?
Short day ok. Longer day would also be ok with me.
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Things are looking up!
Why DatSwan?
Short day ok. Longer day would also be ok with me.
Well, he was mcmc's executioner (reluctantly, I suppose), and here he seemed liked he was fishing a bit with hydrad. I have some thoughts on hydrad v. space, but I'd rather save them for tomorrow.
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I agreee with iguana. No claiming, no helping scum by letting them know which townies have better reads. Finger of suspicion at DatSwan for trying to draw this info out of hydrad.
Vote: Eevee
that's a read you derp.
Vote: Eevee
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L-1.
I think Galzria should unvote and hammer Eevee after someone else votes. Because he brought up the paranoia.
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L-1.
I think Galzria should unvote and hammer Eevee after someone else votes. Because he brought up the paranoia.
That's fine too.
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Vote Count 3.1
Eevee (5): gkrieg13, Robz888, IDontPlayThisGame, Galzria, iguanaiguana
Not Voting (6): EFHW, Eevee, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, Hydrad, DatSwan
With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 3 ends June 20, 2018, 04:00:00 am.
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I have some surprising info. It doesn't really make any difference today so I'm not going to share it.
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L-1.
I think Galzria should unvote and hammer Eevee after someone else votes. Because he brought up the paranoia.
i think that you should. Iguana is easily the most likely scum from Eevee's wagon yesterday - adamantly refusing to hammer a player that ended up flipping town, while going onto a wagon for scum that at the time he had every reason to believe had no real chance.
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L-1.
I think Galzria should unvote and hammer Eevee after someone else votes. Because he brought up the paranoia.
i think that you should. Iguana is easily the most likely scum from Eevee's wagon yesterday - adamantly refusing to hammer a player that ended up flipping town, while going onto a wagon for scum that at the time he had every reason to believe had no real chance.
Fuck you. I am the towniest player alive and you know it.
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L-1.
I think Galzria should unvote and hammer Eevee after someone else votes. Because he brought up the paranoia.
i think that you should. Iguana is easily the most likely scum from Eevee's wagon yesterday - adamantly refusing to hammer a player that ended up flipping town, while going onto a wagon for scum that at the time he had every reason to believe had no real chance.
Fuck you. I am the towniest player alive and you know it.
Not even by a mile.
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Galz is scummier than iguana.
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Ach.. can I have another hour before a hammer? I have things I'd like to share, but I'm currently busy at work.
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Unvote
But I don't see why you can't share tomorrow.
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I have to say, though, I'm awarding zero townpoints for this hammer.. what's the point of making any sort of a big deal out of who hammers if there's no way scum's going risk any kind of delaying tactic anyway. I still very much think it's in town's best interests for the day to run on, and in scum's best interests to make it short before they have to risk interacting more.
PPE 1
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Unvote
But I don't see why you can't share tomorrow.
Because it might be relevant for people with night actions.
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I would hammer on the condition that if Eevee has a vengeful and I die for hammering him that you policy lynch Galzria the following day for suggesting that I should hammer.
I still would massively prefer Galzria to hammer.
I also am really really tempted to find all the times that Galzria has called me scum and been wrong, because there have been a ton of them, but I don't have a ton of time for that right now and I guess it's kinda pointless right now.
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I have to say, though, I'm awarding zero townpoints for this hammer.. what's the point of making any sort of a big deal out of who hammers if there's no way scum's going risk any kind of delaying tactic anyway. I still very much think it's in town's best interests for the day to run on, and in scum's best interests to make it short before they have to risk interacting more.
PPE 1
It's not about town points, the idea is that Eevee could possibly have a role that vengekills his hammerer. At least that is what I have been thinking about.
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Overreacting iguana is town iguana. Galz is fairly townie too, though.
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Damn it, not giving reads is hard!
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L-1.
I think Galzria should unvote and hammer Eevee after someone else votes. Because he brought up the paranoia.
That's fine too.
Now that he's resisting it, I also think it's a good idea for Galz to hammer.
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Re-re-reading things in our neighbourhood, Hydrad was quite townie early on, talking in the QT about how he was trying to get things moving in the main thread etc. It was just his agreement with me on things like how mcmc had apparently slipped, and yet at the same time him still refusing to incorporate that sort of evidence into his reads, that had me really confused. Then late on in D2, he suddenly went from being worried about how I'd read him and his indecisiveness to saying that he was going to use mcmc's alignment to get a read on me, meaning that if I was pushing mcmc and he was town, he thinks I'm scummy.. which is questionable simply because scum are the ones who'd know to lynch towns, but I don't know anything about anyone's alignment.
As an aside, most scums probably don't want to end up conspicuously hammering town like I did at the end of D1, though Galz was trying to pull off something like that as scum in a game where he and IDP were my scumbuddies... it went horribly, and then when Galz fell of the face of the earth and Hydrad replaced him, he got lynched in pretty short order. So that's really not something I'd try as a scum! People who know me at all well will understand where I'm coming from there.
Hydrad has now basically cut off communication in that QT because he's sure I'm scum. I'm definitely town, but I think spending effort convincing him of that isn't as important as convincing enough people in the rest of town overall, so I think it's an abandoned neighbourhood. Just bear in mind that until one or other of us is lynched, NKing us is something scum could use to gain daychat for two of them.
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95% certain we've never been scum together, Space. I think I know the game you're talking about and I was the D1 mislynch. Unless there's another IDP around here...
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95% certain we've never been scum together, Space. I think I know the game you're talking about and I was the D1 mislynch. Unless there's another IDP around here...
Sorry.. Just checked back, and I meant TWM! I get the TLA people confused :-P
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I'm failing to word the rest of what I want to say/warn/suggest in such a way as I'm not giving away more than I want to, so I'm just going to give up at this point.
If we're playing hot potato with who lynches because of the risk of blow-back, rather than people just grabbing cred (I did find that confusing!), then I'd be happy to go for it if I'm one of the ones being scumread by certain people.
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Also, I'm about to disappear for about 2.5 hours, and I don't want to force stuff to be held up any longer, even though I am apparently in the minority for hoping that more interactions means more information before the next time people have to do night-time stuff.
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I'm failing to word the rest of what I want to say/warn/suggest in such a way as I'm not giving away more than I want to, so I'm just going to give up at this point.
If we're playing hot potato with who lynches because of the risk of blow-back, rather than people just grabbing cred (I did find that confusing!), then I'd be happy to go for it if I'm one of the ones being scumread by certain people.
No, Galzria
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I think there are a lot of interactions around Eevee to look at and it would be prudent for townies to do that before submitting any night actions.
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I'm failing to word the rest of what I want to say/warn/suggest in such a way as I'm not giving away more than I want to, so I'm just going to give up at this point.
If we're playing hot potato with who lynches because of the risk of blow-back, rather than people just grabbing cred (I did find that confusing!), then I'd be happy to go for it if I'm one of the ones being scumread by certain people.
You won't be hammering. You have a town tell, and you're town.
I was right about Eevee yesterday. I am fairly confident about Datswan and Hydrad still as well (as noted yesterday). Iguana is easily the scummiest person not named Eevee, Datswan or Hydrad though, and if there is in fact a scum on the Eevee wagon, it's him.
I would very much prefer one of those 3 to hammer Eevee.
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I think there are a lot of interactions around Eevee to look at and it would be prudent for townies to do that before submitting any night actions.
We agree.
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I'm failing to word the rest of what I want to say/warn/suggest in such a way as I'm not giving away more than I want to, so I'm just going to give up at this point.
If we're playing hot potato with who lynches because of the risk of blow-back, rather than people just grabbing cred (I did find that confusing!), then I'd be happy to go for it if I'm one of the ones being scumread by certain people.
You won't be hammering. You have a town tell, and you're town.
I was right about Eevee yesterday. I am fairly confident about Datswan and Hydrad still as well (as noted yesterday). Iguana is easily the scummiest person not named Eevee, Datswan or Hydrad though, and if there is in fact a scum on the Eevee wagon, it's him.
I would very much prefer one of those 3 to hammer Eevee.
Rofl
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I'm failing to word the rest of what I want to say/warn/suggest in such a way as I'm not giving away more than I want to, so I'm just going to give up at this point.
If we're playing hot potato with who lynches because of the risk of blow-back, rather than people just grabbing cred (I did find that confusing!), then I'd be happy to go for it if I'm one of the ones being scumread by certain people.
You won't be hammering. You have a town tell, and you're town.
I was right about Eevee yesterday. I am fairly confident about Datswan and Hydrad still as well (as noted yesterday). Iguana is easily the scummiest person not named Eevee, Datswan or Hydrad though, and if there is in fact a scum on the Eevee wagon, it's him.
I would very much prefer one of those 3 to hammer Eevee.
Rofl
Says scum.
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Weee this has gotten fun.
Reading now.
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I feel like Galzria is just trying to get people to share their reads. My scum read on him has gone up massively in the last couple pages.
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Alright, just for fun, I'm going to show that Galzria has a track record of reading me wrong.
We first played together in M100, both mafia together. That game is basically irrelevant. M103, RMM46, and RMM48 are also basically irrelevant because Galzria didn't play them or pay much attention (although he didn't express a scumread on me in the speccy of RMM46, a game where I was scum.)
In RMM47, I rolled survivor vigilante and played it super pro town, killing two scum in one night, helping town win and getting MVP. Galzria scumread me that entire game! He wanted my lynch above all else while we were both alive and after he died he continued to call me a serial killer in the speccy, insisting that town needed to lynch me to win. https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/DanWheYCBKpyr <-- (see 37, 47, 59, 73).
In M113, Galzria had a super strong scumread on me after he died in the speccy and even persisted calling me scum in the speccy after the moderator had spoiled my town alignment (also in the speccy.) https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/JTZZj6yL3fEku <--(see 12, 23, 28, 38, 39, 49, 50) 38/39 is where schadd spoils my alignment and Galzria has a really hard time believing it.
I was so towny in M113! And I am super towny here. Galzria has a really bad habit of scumreading me, so I have this to say to him:
TOWN!GALZ --> If you exist, your metric for scumreading me is terrible! You always think I am scum when I'm not. Take a look at old games where you were wrong about me and learn what my town tells are! Clearly they are the opposite of whatever you think they should be! If you do this, it will be better for us all, I promise.
SCUM!GALZ --> Again, if you exist, it's a lost cause man. You're not gonna get me lynched, and trying is only going to get you lynched. So uh go ahead and keep trying, because you're scum and I want you to lose.
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Wait so are we keeping Eevee off of L-1 on purpose?
Also - I have no issue in being the hammerer. I have some info, but nothing that seems crazy important, and the likelihood that I gather some/any more is fairly low.
If someone has a way to force Skum to hammer, that is obviously better. But if we are risking it on unknown circumstances, as fun as the game is right now, I am probably a pretty good choice.
Want to make it supppppeerrrrr clear that is not me fishing to try and get someone to out someone or whatever. I am in agreement with the withholding info until tomorrow idea.
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I have to say, though, I'm awarding zero townpoints for this hammer.. what's the point of making any sort of a big deal out of who hammers if there's no way scum's going risk any kind of delaying tactic anyway. I still very much think it's in town's best interests for the day to run on, and in scum's best interests to make it short before they have to risk interacting more.
PPE 1
I mean I can go either way so I am not arguing with the idea, but the concept is kinda weird.
If the day is to go on it would be with the purpose to hunt for skum longer. But like... Assuming that Eevee is skum, doesn't that kind of give Mafia control of the day. They can maneuver appropriately already knowing there is no chance that they will be lynched today if we have already decided to lynch Eevee regardless. Does that make sense?
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I don't see a reason to prolong the day.
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I'm fine with the day ending soon also.
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If the day is to go on it would be with the purpose to hunt for skum longer. But like... Assuming that Eevee is skum, doesn't that kind of give Mafia control of the day. They can maneuver appropriately already knowing there is no chance that they will be lynched today if we have already decided to lynch Eevee regardless. Does that make sense?
I really don't see how that's all that relevant. I mean, scum are often caught by looking back over how they interacted throughout the whole game, not just the day on which they're lynched. Just because we're lynching Eevee today doesn't mean the others are off the hook. I think that in situations where a bad thing is happens to one team, its own members are more likely to be stressed than the opposition, so it's a pretty good time to try to catch scum out or look at how they're behaving. Though having pointed that out I'm now probably encouraging all the scums to fake some chill.
I can see that nobody else is all that keen on the suggestion, though, and it's almost midnight for me now, so I'm not standing in any voters' way at this point.
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k well I am just gonna vote Eevee then. If someone wants me to hammer Ill unvote and vote back on.
Vote: Eevee
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Galzria wants to hammer
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Galzria wants to hammer
Ok i missed that
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Galzria wants to hammer
Not doing.
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Galzria wants to hammer
Not doing.
If I unvote, will you vote and I'll hammer?
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If the day is to go on it would be with the purpose to hunt for skum longer. But like... Assuming that Eevee is skum, doesn't that kind of give Mafia control of the day. They can maneuver appropriately already knowing there is no chance that they will be lynched today if we have already decided to lynch Eevee regardless. Does that make sense?
I really don't see how that's all that relevant. I mean, scum are often caught by looking back over how they interacted throughout the whole game, not just the day on which they're lynched. Just because we're lynching Eevee today doesn't mean the others are off the hook. I think that in situations where a bad thing is happens to one team, its own members are more likely to be stressed than the opposition, so it's a pretty good time to try to catch scum out or look at how they're behaving. Though having pointed that out I'm now probably encouraging all the scums to fake some chill.
I can see that nobody else is all that keen on the suggestion, though, and it's almost midnight for me now, so I'm not standing in any voters' way at this point.
I don't get it. I think we must mis understand each other?
I am saying that currently in the world where "There are 4 skum remaining, all of whom know each other" the ideal of hunting for skum for the remainder of today is kind of moot. I get what you are saying about to look back on and everything... but skum either knows that;
a) Eevee will flip Skum
or
b) Eevee will flip Town
We do not have that information. So when we ask questions, even with the intent of looking back on them... IDK I just feel like that gives skum the upper hand in this spot like a lot.
I mean the exception would be I guess we could hunt by like discussing previous days and drawing out stuff about that, but I was stating this originally based on the "we are not talking about reads today" theme.
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Galzria wants to hammer
Not doing.
If I unvote, will you vote and I'll hammer?
You are both on the wagon
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I don't get it. I think we must mis understand each other?
I am saying that currently in the world where "There are 4 skum remaining, all of whom know each other" the ideal of hunting for skum for the remainder of today is kind of moot. I get what you are saying about to look back on and everything... but skum either knows that;
a) Eevee will flip Skum
or
b) Eevee will flip Town
I'm assuming 100% that Eevee will flip scum. The mod doesn't lie.
We do not have that information. So when we ask questions, even with the intent of looking back on them... IDK I just feel like that gives skum the upper hand in this spot like a lot.
I mean the exception would be I guess we could hunt by like discussing previous days and drawing out stuff about that, but I was stating this originally based on the "we are not talking about reads today" theme.
What would we be talking about if we're in D4 now, and Eevee has been lynched, but nothing else has happened in the night? You're acting like there's no possible way of having a conversation at the moment, and that's just patently false.
I mean, I also disagree with the "we are not talking about reads" dictat, which came from Iguana and was backed up by Robz, but by no means agreed by all of town. Scum already knows who all the townies are, and they don't need reads to pick us off one by one. OTOH, for townies who don't have information-gathering roles, reads are the only way to work out who to trust and who to lynch. Why is town so happy to minimise its own chance of gaining information?
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@Space - The proportion of scum players is high. Giving a lot of reads allows scum to create favorable endgame scenarios for themselves. Scum only needs two townies to be wrong to get a mislynch through. So if two people announce their strongest scumread is a town player, then scum knows not to kill them and can start prepping stories for that mislynch overnight.
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If we don't share reads, then there is a decent chance that scum will shoot someone among townies A, B, and C where townies A and B both would have wanted C's lynch, thereby preventing their gauranteed win.
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I think we should vote on whether Galzria should hammer, or whether I should hammer, or whether you think it doesn't matter and anyone could hammer.
I will hammer if a majority agrees that I should, with the contingency that if some verifiable bad thing happens to me because of the hammer that yall should look at Galz for scum. I don't understand why he wouldn't agree to those same terms if he is indeed town. It was his idea to designate a hammerer in the first place.
What say you, Galzria? Shall we put it to a vote?
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@Iguana, you just spent two posts saying why it's a bad idea to give reads on anyone, then immediately followed that up with a suggestion of everyone voting (presumably based on their reads?) for one of two possibly-controversial players. Am I the only one who finds it kinda funny? :-P
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Space volunteered, so I think they can do it.
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I'm cool with that actually.
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I doubt it matters who hammers. Iguana should not be the hammerer, I guess, in case it does.
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Vote Count 3.2
Eevee (5): gkrieg13, Robz888, IDontPlayThisGame, Galzria, DatSwan
Not Voting (6): EFHW, Eevee, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, Hydrad, iguanaiguana
With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 3 ends June 20, 2018, 04:00:00 am.
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If hes not hammered in like the 8 hours or so it will take me to be done my stuff i'll just hammer him.
I doubt anything will happen.
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I don't get it. I think we must mis understand each other?
I am saying that currently in the world where "There are 4 skum remaining, all of whom know each other" the ideal of hunting for skum for the remainder of today is kind of moot. I get what you are saying about to look back on and everything... but skum either knows that;
a) Eevee will flip Skum
or
b) Eevee will flip Town
I'm assuming 100% that Eevee will flip scum. The mod doesn't lie.
We do not have that information. So when we ask questions, even with the intent of looking back on them... IDK I just feel like that gives skum the upper hand in this spot like a lot.
I mean the exception would be I guess we could hunt by like discussing previous days and drawing out stuff about that, but I was stating this originally based on the "we are not talking about reads today" theme.
What would we be talking about if we're in D4 now, and Eevee has been lynched, but nothing else has happened in the night? You're acting like there's no possible way of having a conversation at the moment, and that's just patently false.
I mean, I also disagree with the "we are not talking about reads" dictat, which came from Iguana and was backed up by Robz, but by no means agreed by all of town. Scum already knows who all the townies are, and they don't need reads to pick us off one by one. OTOH, for townies who don't have information-gathering roles, reads are the only way to work out who to trust and who to lynch. Why is town so happy to minimise its own chance of gaining information?
Not ignoring it space, but II answered it in the post right after this.
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Also Iguana, could you clarify on why you are ok with Space doing the hammer? You were so adamant about Galz (assuming because you think he is skum). Do you think Space is skummy? Or am I missing something?
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Better than nothing if Galzria really won't do it
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Better than nothing if Galzria really won't do it
I won't do it because you say so, no. I have no intent to follow your lead on anything. If it's agreed that I should by others though, that's different.
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Sure dude, that's safe for you to say after people have expressed lack of interest in pushing you to do it. Convenient.
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Sure dude, that's safe for you to say after people have expressed lack of interest in pushing you to do it. Convenient.
Lol
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I'm willing to unvote and hammer if it'll get this through. Or we can wait ~4 hours for hydrad.
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Sure dude, that's safe for you to say after people have expressed lack of interest in pushing you to do it. Convenient.
Lol
;) :D :-*
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I could also hammer if that's needed.
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I could also hammer if that's needed.
Just let Hydrad do it at this point.
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I could also hammer if that's needed.
Just let Hydrad do it at this point.
Sure.
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I could also hammer if that's needed.
Just let Hydrad do it at this point.
I'm now scared because you said this. But I want this game to move.
vote: eevee
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And because I just hammered scum that makes me basically an IC right?
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I could also hammer if that's needed.
Just let Hydrad do it at this point.
Wondering about this.
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Someone go wake up faust!
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yo faust
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I could also hammer if that's needed.
Just let Hydrad do it at this point.
Wondering about this.
I just think Awaclus is townie.
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I could also hammer if that's needed.
Just let Hydrad do it at this point.
Wondering about this.
I just think Awaclus is townie.
And you don't think I, the person who has you as his number 1 scumread since day 1, am townie? That,s a bit biased.
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Prod Faust
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I think he wakes up in a few hours.
I picked a bad time to hammer I guess.
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Day 3 Final Vote Count
Eevee (6): gkrieg13, Robz888, IDontPlayThisGame, Galzria, DatSwan, Hydrad
Not Voting (5): EFHW, Eevee, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, iguanaiguana
With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 3 ends June 20, 2018, 04:00:00 am.
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They quickly proceeded to surgery after that. Alex did not hold up too much hope at this point, though they were told that it wouldn't even be necessary to remove the whole breast.
In the end, the surgery seemed to be successful.
Eevee has been lynched! They were Breast Cancer, the Ascetic Day 3 Guilty Child.
Night 3 begins now and lasts 48 hours. Night action due by June 16, 2018, 01:30:00 pm.
THREAD LOCKED!
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In the night, Alex had seizures and intense pain all over their abdomen and lower back. Was it that time over the month? Even then, this was significantly more violent than what they were used to. They felt their underwear get wet and ran to the bathroom. The bleeding would not stop.
gkrieg13 has been killed! They were the Endometrium, the Even-Night Cop.
Day 4 begins!
Vote Count 4.0
Not Voting (9): EFHW, iguanaiguana, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, Hydrad, Robz888, DatSwan, Galzria, IDontPlayThisGame
With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. Day 4 ends June 24, 2018, 03:00:00 am.
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o
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welp there goes like all my theories.
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Galz is scummier than iguana.
this is the only thing he kinda mentioned that could allude to a read.
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I could also hammer if that's needed.
Just let Hydrad do it at this point.
Wondering about this.
I just think Awaclus is townie.
oh I guess this too.
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need to sleep.
that is a weird af nk.
will elaborate tomorrow.
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I will be pretty busy today and tomorrow. Really want to give this a thorough reread soon.
vote: Mcmcsalot. He still looks scummy from yesterday, but seems to have really dialed back today. That kind of change within a game seems weird to me.
I thought he seemed more his usual self today. What do you mean by dialed back?
By dialed back, he means that he seems more his usual self today.
When have you ever answered a question for someone else?
When have I ever not answered a question for someone else?
I don't know, but this seems like Awaclus trying to be way too meta. I'm pretty sure Awaclus is scum.
actually my guess is awaclus is town based on this.
gkreig was scumreading awaclus on day 2 so it makes sense for him to target awaclus to see if hes scum. then in day 3 he posted
I could also hammer if that's needed.
Just let Hydrad do it at this point.
Wondering about this.
I just think Awaclus is townie.
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This nk is super helpful to us, other than having to lose a townie. I think a lot of people were looking to gkrieg next. I know I was. And the Awaclus theory makes sense, too. Even night cop won't help them at all, either.
I'm thinking there was a redirect.
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Interested to hear Awaclus's surprising information.
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Agree Gkrieg probably copped Awaclus. He was clear about his Galz read being based on Galzria's play
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Interested to hear Awaclus's surprising information.
I was an active universal backup. I used it on mcmc and now I'm a vanilla townie.
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From my perspective it is worthwhile to do a massclaim unless someone has a good reason why we shouldn't. If Awa is town via gkrieg, he could set an order and probably claim his info last.
Open to not claiming too.
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Ah
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I accept that Awaclus was copped by gkrieg and is town. I thought Awaclus was town anyway, though.
Hydrad, Space: how's that neighborhood going? I think it's reasonably likely there's a scum there.
DatSwan: why is it a weird nightkill?
I support massclaiming. Awaclus should set an order.
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From my perspective it is worthwhile to do a massclaim unless someone has a good reason why we shouldn't. If Awa is town via gkrieg, he could set an order and probably claim his info last.
Open to not claiming too.
What's your reason for why we should?
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I don't have anything helpful to share.
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From my perspective it is worthwhile to do a massclaim unless someone has a good reason why we shouldn't. If Awa is town via gkrieg, he could set an order and probably claim his info last.
Open to not claiming too.
What's your reason for why we should?
Youll see if we do a claim.
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From my perspective it is worthwhile to do a massclaim unless someone has a good reason why we shouldn't. If Awa is town via gkrieg, he could set an order and probably claim his info last.
Open to not claiming too.
What's your reason for why we should?
Youll see if we do a claim.
And that's not enough to make me want to massclaim.
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How did Awaclus become an IC?
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How did Awaclus become an IC?
Gkrieg copped me.
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Did nobody else find it surprising that I became a VT when trying to get mcmc's role?
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How did Awaclus become an IC?
Gkrieg copped me.
Is there proof?
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Did nobody else find it surprising that I became a VT when trying to get mcmc's role?
Yes - Because while he said he had been VT'd at night, he didn't flip VT... so VT wasn't his PR... so I don't understand why you became VT.
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How did Awaclus become an IC?
Gkrieg copped me.
Is there proof?
He evidently was a cop, he 180'd his read on me after N2, and I know I'm town so that also fits the narrative.
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Did nobody else find it surprising that I became a VT when trying to get mcmc's role?
Yes - Because while he said he had been VT'd at night, he didn't flip VT... so VT wasn't his PR... so I don't understand why you became VT.
Oh. I didn't notice he said that. I guess that's how it works then.
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My PR is only useful if we claim. I thought I wanted to claim yesterday before thinking it through more. I'm not against it today, but I don't have any more (well, technically I do, I guess) information to share than I did yesterday.
We're more or less in the same boat today that we were yesterday in terms of numbers: Yesterday there were 11 alive with 4 scum. Had we mislynched (theoretical), we would've been 9 alive with 4 scum today - LyLo (barring PR's). By comparison, we're at 9 alive with 3 scum now. If we mislynch, we would go to 7 alive 3 scum - also LyLo (barring PR's). We've basically gained a free night of PR actions with the correct lynch of Eevee - but in terms of claiming/not claiming, eh, I won't advocate for it, but I'm not against it either.
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Did nobody else find it surprising that I became a VT when trying to get mcmc's role?
Yes - Because while he said he had been VT'd at night, he didn't flip VT... so VT wasn't his PR... so I don't understand why you became VT.
Oh. I didn't notice he said that. I guess that's how it works then.
This is what Mcmc said about his role and what happened:
okay I have to go to bed please dont lynch me.
I was a dual role. The urethra and the ureter (bladder) I could roleblock(uethra) or be a deflector(ureter) night 1 I roleblocked eevee, nothing I know of happened. WHen Day 2 started I was informed that I was now a vanilla townie.
I confirmed that the mafia only steals your power if you were successfully killed so I wasn't a mafia target that got doctored or anything.
But then this is the flip from his lynch:
What followed were lots of further examinations. Alex was told that they had to prep them for surgery, to remove some of the tumors that build in their kidney. According to the doctors, there was an about 60% chance that this would remove the cancer, otherwise Alex might face having the whole kidney removed.
Still, the experts were baffled by Alex's other, seemingly unrelated symptoms. It took two months before their test, and consultations with other medical experts, yielded results.
Alex's doctor sat down beside them. "We have found the likely cause of what you're going through." She paused. "It seems that you are suffering from a very rare auto-immune deficiency called Morbus Efdeësis. It seems to have been triggered by the cancer and causes your body to turn against itself in an attempt to destroy the cancer cells. In theory this, could even be helpful..." She hesitated for a bit. "However, the targeting isn't very accurate, and your condition actually affects helathy organs."
mcmcsalot has been lynched! They were the Bladder, the Deflector/Roleblocker.
Night 2 begins and lasts 48 hours. Night actions are due by June 12, 2018, 03:30:00 pm.
Thread locked!
As Mcmc almost certainly wasn't lying, I do wonder why you became VT when UB'ing him and not a Defector/Roleblocker.
Only thing I can think is that is simply how the mechanics of the game play out. Take scum for example - Faust made it clear that when they flip, the flip will be their original PR, not whatever they may be now (after they absorb new PR's)... however if you were to UB a flipped scum, I assume you would get whatever their current PR was, not their original. So it probably worked the same with Mcmc - he flipped his original PR, even though he was technically a VT now and you UB's his VT.
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Hydrad, Space: how's that neighborhood going? I think it's reasonably likely there's a scum there.
Looks like space hasn't really logged on yet since the day started.
I'm not so sure if theres scum anymore. With gkreig being town its making me really rethink my reads.
although I guess you can still think that I might be scum.
I've also thought about the possibility of a 3rd person being in it that has never talked. But I feel like scum would have probably tried to use it to gain some info I guess instead of just lurking.
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This nk is super helpful to us, other than having to lose a townie. I think a lot of people were looking to gkrieg next. I know I was. And the Awaclus theory makes sense, too. Even night cop won't help them at all, either.
I'm thinking there was a redirect.
I kind of agree that a RD is likely. I did come up with a thought today - Skum could have a "role cop" or something of that nature, and they got the cop results back on GK or something so wanted to kill him?
Probably more likely RD, but just wanted to throw it out there.
Outside of that, I think it is weird because he would of been an easy target for skum to push today, as well as I don't see real issue in believing a "assumed" ReDirector would of chose him as the landing point.
All in all, if we had to lose a towny at night, this wasn't horrible.
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What does "active" UB imply?
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What does "active" UB imply?
I choose when to activate it as well as the target.
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Agree Gkrieg probably copped Awaclus. He was clear about his Galz read being based on Galzria's play
Do you still think Galz is Skum?
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Agree Gkrieg probably copped Awaclus. He was clear about his Galz read being based on Galzria's play
Do you still think Galz is Skum?
Based on what I know, he's my top scum read.
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Agree Gkrieg probably copped Awaclus. He was clear about his Galz read being based on Galzria's play
Do you still think Galz is Skum?
Based on what I know, he's my top scum read.
As you're wrong, I can't wait to see what stretches you use to make that work out for you - or what fakeclaim you wanna go with that results in me being scum.
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Agree Gkrieg probably copped Awaclus. He was clear about his Galz read being based on Galzria's play
Do you still think Galz is Skum?
Based on what I know, he's my top scum read.
As you're wrong, I can't wait to see what stretches you use to make that work out for you - or what fakeclaim you wanna go with that results in me being scum.
I don't have any of that.
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Agree Gkrieg probably copped Awaclus. He was clear about his Galz read being based on Galzria's play
Do you still think Galz is Skum?
Based on what I know, he's my top scum read.
As you're wrong, I can't wait to see what stretches you use to make that work out for you - or what fakeclaim you wanna go with that results in me being scum.
I don't have any of that.
Then I fail to see how you can come to a conclusion that is false based on what you've hinted to be PR related reasons.
- That is, if you want to read me as being scum (or pretend to read me as being scum), that's on you. Go for it. You're wrong, but whatever.
- If you're trying to insinuate that you have a PR related reason to believe I'm scum, you're either lying, or stretching some result you have out to meet an idea that you're trying to sell. As I'm not scum, there is literally no result you could have that says otherwise.
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Hydrad, Space: how's that neighborhood going? I think it's reasonably likely there's a scum there.
I gave up posting in there after he said he was sure I'm scum, because expending effort on convincing him seemed less worthwhile than being useful to town in the main thread, where I know there are guaranteed townies. Now there are a bunch of short posts from Hydrad about building trust, but I feel a bit like it's all about winning opinion for him, and not enough about scumhunting.
In terms of what he's doing in-thread, I liked his immediate re-read of gkreig looking for possible indications of gkrieg's night results, but I'm not going to trust what Hydrad says without either taking the time to reread gkrieg myself (preferably), or at least seeing several people in here confirm that they've re-read gkrieg and come independently to the same conclusions. Sorry I didn't have time to do that tonight :-(
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Ya I kinda blew it. Ah well.
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I've also thought about the possibility of a 3rd person being in it that has never talked. But I feel like scum would have probably tried to use it to gain some info I guess instead of just lurking.
My personal QT explicitly uses the singular for when talking about who I can talk to in the neighbourhood QT, so I really don't think there's a third player snooping.
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I've also thought about the possibility of a 3rd person being in it that has never talked. But I feel like scum would have probably tried to use it to gain some info I guess instead of just lurking.
My personal QT explicitly uses the singular for when talking about who I can talk to in the neighbourhood QT, so I really don't think there's a third player snooping.
Oh you are right. I guess I didn't notice.
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Agree Gkrieg probably copped Awaclus. He was clear about his Galz read being based on Galzria's play
Do you still think Galz is Skum?
Based on what I know, he's my top scum read.
As you're wrong, I can't wait to see what stretches you use to make that work out for you - or what fakeclaim you wanna go with that results in me being scum.
I don't have any of that.
Then I fail to see how you can come to a conclusion that is false based on what you've hinted to be PR related reasons.
- That is, if you want to read me as being scum (or pretend to read me as being scum), that's on you. Go for it. You're wrong, but whatever.
- If you're trying to insinuate that you have a PR related reason to believe I'm scum, you're either lying, or stretching some result you have out to meet an idea that you're trying to sell. As I'm not scum, there is literally no result you could have that says otherwise.
Okay, gotcha.
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Awaclus! We need a massclaim order.
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Awaclus! We need a massclaim order.
I'm not full claiming even if people go along with this. And I still don't think we should.
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Awaclus! We need a massclaim order.
I'm not full claiming even if people go along with this. And I still don't think we should.
Why? Its important to lynch correctly today and a massclaim will probably help with that.
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Awaclus! We need a massclaim order.
I'm not full claiming even if people go along with this. And I still don't think we should.
Why? Its important to lynch correctly today and a massclaim will probably help with that.
I'd rather an extra night of results than scum having their pick of PRs.
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And how, exactly, does it help us lynch correctly?
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So my 2 cents on the GK thing (you can go ahead and just not read it if you want, bc I am pretty much in agreement):
1) This has pretty much got to be GK breadcrumbing Awaclus as town. No reasons, or reason to say it really, no follow up or anything.
I could also hammer if that's needed.
Just let Hydrad do it at this point.
Wondering about this.
I just think Awaclus is townie.
2) Combined with this - which seems to be the opposite on purpose. He makes a timestamp by stating the last couple pages. I think the idea was to make it clear that it is in fact a read, and not a result. I mean read could still be good, but in context to this... whatever you get it.
I feel like Galzria is just trying to get people to share their reads. My scum read on him has gone up massively in the last couple pages.
3) Referencing this for the phrase "claiming and outing". i feel again like this is GK bread crumbing that he has results to give.
Only (probably) one person is going to die at night anyway, so I don't see the need to claim anything. I think we should save all the claiming and outing until tomorrow.
At this point I am convinced GK copped Awaclus. Basing this on both the above and the aforementioned fact that GK's read flipped 100% on Awaclus D3.
The one thing I want to point out, and I am like crazy surprised no one else has mentioned this yet.... is that it is possible skum has Godfather or a similar role. I was pretty null to this point on Awaclus, so Awaclus is essentially Town in my eyes for now... but it is something to be kept in mind if like we get to D6 and "IC Awaclus" is still alive.
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And how, exactly, does it help us lynch correctly?
Are you asking "how mass claiming after 3 nights of results in an RMM would help us lynch correctly?"
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And how, exactly, does it help us lynch correctly?
Are you asking "how mass claiming after 3 nights of results in an RMM would help us lynch correctly?"
Yes.
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Hydrad, Space: how's that neighborhood going? I think it's reasonably likely there's a scum there.
I gave up posting in there after he said he was sure I'm scum, because expending effort on convincing him seemed less worthwhile than being useful to town in the main thread, where I know there are guaranteed townies. Now there are a bunch of short posts from Hydrad about building trust, but I feel a bit like it's all about winning opinion for him, and not enough about scumhunting.
In terms of what he's doing in-thread, I liked his immediate re-read of gkreig looking for possible indications of gkrieg's night results, but I'm not going to trust what Hydrad says without either taking the time to reread gkrieg myself (preferably), or at least seeing several people in here confirm that they've re-read gkrieg and come independently to the same conclusions. Sorry I didn't have time to do that tonight :-(
@ Hydrad - Confirm you stopped posting as mentioned?
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For the godfather thought I think that's a really strong thing to have for a scum team with high numbers. I'm on the idea that they are most likely nerfed in some way. But ya I'll keep it in mind.
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Hydrad, Space: how's that neighborhood going? I think it's reasonably likely there's a scum there.
I gave up posting in there after he said he was sure I'm scum, because expending effort on convincing him seemed less worthwhile than being useful to town in the main thread, where I know there are guaranteed townies. Now there are a bunch of short posts from Hydrad about building trust, but I feel a bit like it's all about winning opinion for him, and not enough about scumhunting.
In terms of what he's doing in-thread, I liked his immediate re-read of gkreig looking for possible indications of gkrieg's night results, but I'm not going to trust what Hydrad says without either taking the time to reread gkrieg myself (preferably), or at least seeing several people in here confirm that they've re-read gkrieg and come independently to the same conclusions. Sorry I didn't have time to do that tonight :-(
@ Hydrad - Confirm you stopped posting as mentioned?
Are you asking if u stopped posting or space.
I kept posting small things but they didn't have much content in them.
Space basically hasn't posted anything though stating they would rather focus on the main thread
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For the godfather thought I think that's a really strong thing to have for a scum team with high numbers. I'm on the idea that they are most likely nerfed in some way. But ya I'll keep it in mind.
Not to beat a dead horse, but I agree with you. Or I did. Then I was re-reading and got to Space's bit about the nerf roles. Eevee being an announced anti-IC is what is weird. They would of had the opportunity N1 to kill someone (Jim). So if they didn't then there was assuredly someone on the skum team that had a MORE pressing role to get rid of then Eevee.
My point is that Eevee's role was pretty damn nerfy. So if there was another that was even worse for them... they may also have 1-2 decent PRs to start. Not arguing with you, just want to make sure it is noted bc people seem to keep leaning away from the idea that Skum could have anything useful.
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Hydrad, Space: how's that neighborhood going? I think it's reasonably likely there's a scum there.
I gave up posting in there after he said he was sure I'm scum, because expending effort on convincing him seemed less worthwhile than being useful to town in the main thread, where I know there are guaranteed townies. Now there are a bunch of short posts from Hydrad about building trust, but I feel a bit like it's all about winning opinion for him, and not enough about scumhunting.
In terms of what he's doing in-thread, I liked his immediate re-read of gkreig looking for possible indications of gkrieg's night results, but I'm not going to trust what Hydrad says without either taking the time to reread gkrieg myself (preferably), or at least seeing several people in here confirm that they've re-read gkrieg and come independently to the same conclusions. Sorry I didn't have time to do that tonight :-(
@ Hydrad - Confirm you stopped posting as mentioned?
Are you asking if u stopped posting or space.
I kept posting small things but they didn't have much content in them.
Space basically hasn't posted anything though stating they would rather focus on the main thread
Specifically - did you tell Space that you were done posting bc you thought they were skum?
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Hydrad, Space: how's that neighborhood going? I think it's reasonably likely there's a scum there.
I gave up posting in there after he said he was sure I'm scum, because expending effort on convincing him seemed less worthwhile than being useful to town in the main thread, where I know there are guaranteed townies. Now there are a bunch of short posts from Hydrad about building trust, but I feel a bit like it's all about winning opinion for him, and not enough about scumhunting.
In terms of what he's doing in-thread, I liked his immediate re-read of gkreig looking for possible indications of gkrieg's night results, but I'm not going to trust what Hydrad says without either taking the time to reread gkrieg myself (preferably), or at least seeing several people in here confirm that they've re-read gkrieg and come independently to the same conclusions. Sorry I didn't have time to do that tonight :-(
@ Hydrad - Confirm you stopped posting as mentioned?
Are you asking if u stopped posting or space.
I kept posting small things but they didn't have much content in them.
Space basically hasn't posted anything though stating they would rather focus on the main thread
Specifically - did you tell Space that you were done posting bc you thought they were skum?
Basically I kinda said something like this.
Hey I think you are scum.
I could be wrong and if I am I'm sorry.
I don't see me losing much by outing this neighborhood as I don't think I'll be posting much things productive in here anyways.
But I still might post a bit.
That's the abbreviation of what I said. So while I said I still might post it wasn't going to be important things
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I've also thought about the possibility of a 3rd person being in it that has never talked. But I feel like scum would have probably tried to use it to gain some info I guess instead of just lurking.
My personal QT explicitly uses the singular for when talking about who I can talk to in the neighbourhood QT, so I really don't think there's a third player snooping.
This post is in violation of the no-quoting rule. As a result, Space is rendered voteless for today only.
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I've also thought about the possibility of a 3rd person being in it that has never talked. But I feel like scum would have probably tried to use it to gain some info I guess instead of just lurking.
My personal QT explicitly uses the singular for when talking about who I can talk to in the neighbourhood QT, so I really don't think there's a third player snooping.
This post is in violation of the no-quoting rule. As a result, Space is rendered voteless for today only.
So mod is mod and it’s Faust’s game - but if i said “i have confirmed with the mod that x is true” i wouldn’t be punished. Can someone tell me why this is not ok from space?
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This is the order:
IDPTG
Hydrad
iguanaiguana
EFHW
Galzria
Space
Robz
DatSwan
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cool.
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Aw, drat.. sorry for that one, town! :-( I came up with such a clumsy way of saying it, too, just so I could be sure I wasn't quoting anything.
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Hydrad, Space: how's that neighborhood going? I think it's reasonably likely there's a scum there.
I gave up posting in there after he said he was sure I'm scum, because expending effort on convincing him seemed less worthwhile than being useful to town in the main thread, where I know there are guaranteed townies. Now there are a bunch of short posts from Hydrad about building trust, but I feel a bit like it's all about winning opinion for him, and not enough about scumhunting.
In terms of what he's doing in-thread, I liked his immediate re-read of gkreig looking for possible indications of gkrieg's night results, but I'm not going to trust what Hydrad says without either taking the time to reread gkrieg myself (preferably), or at least seeing several people in here confirm that they've re-read gkrieg and come independently to the same conclusions. Sorry I didn't have time to do that tonight :-(
@ Hydrad - Confirm you stopped posting as mentioned?
Are you asking if u stopped posting or space.
I kept posting small things but they didn't have much content in them.
Space basically hasn't posted anything though stating they would rather focus on the main thread
I feel it's rather important to mention that I've made a minimal post today to prove I can still post there, in case that's where this line of questioning is going!
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Hydrad, Space: how's that neighborhood going? I think it's reasonably likely there's a scum there.
I gave up posting in there after he said he was sure I'm scum, because expending effort on convincing him seemed less worthwhile than being useful to town in the main thread, where I know there are guaranteed townies. Now there are a bunch of short posts from Hydrad about building trust, but I feel a bit like it's all about winning opinion for him, and not enough about scumhunting.
In terms of what he's doing in-thread, I liked his immediate re-read of gkreig looking for possible indications of gkrieg's night results, but I'm not going to trust what Hydrad says without either taking the time to reread gkrieg myself (preferably), or at least seeing several people in here confirm that they've re-read gkrieg and come independently to the same conclusions. Sorry I didn't have time to do that tonight :-(
@ Hydrad - Confirm you stopped posting as mentioned?
Are you asking if u stopped posting or space.
I kept posting small things but they didn't have much content in them.
Space basically hasn't posted anything though stating they would rather focus on the main thread
I feel it's rather important to mention that I've made a minimal post today to prove I can still post there, in case that's where this line of questioning is going!
it is true. although I'm still talking a bit.
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Its just a lot quieter now :D
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And how, exactly, does it help us lynch correctly?
Are you asking "how mass claiming after 3 nights of results in an RMM would help us lynch correctly?"
Yes.
information gathered at this point from town any individual town is almost certain. Therefore, to not divulge information is to create an opportunity for skum to keep that info from coming to light by eliminating town players prior to their ability to give the information.
Now that can technically be said at any point in time - So I guess my question is... where is your line? If not today, when do you prefer to claim? (and/or do you prefer to claim at all?)
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And how, exactly, does it help us lynch correctly?
Are you asking "how mass claiming after 3 nights of results in an RMM would help us lynch correctly?"
Yes.
information gathered at this point from town any individual town is almost certain. Therefore, to not divulge information is to create an opportunity for skum to keep that info from coming to light by eliminating town players prior to their ability to give the information.
Now that can technically be said at any point in time - So I guess my question is... where is your line? If not today, when do you prefer to claim? (and/or do you prefer to claim at all?)
tired- remove the first "town".
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I won't have anything to reveal, but I expect to be able to back up someone else's claim.
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And how, exactly, does it help us lynch correctly?
Are you asking "how mass claiming after 3 nights of results in an RMM would help us lynch correctly?"
Yes.
information gathered at this point from town any individual town is almost certain. Therefore, to not divulge information is to create an opportunity for skum to keep that info from coming to light by eliminating town players prior to their ability to give the information.
Now that can technically be said at any point in time - So I guess my question is... where is your line? If not today, when do you prefer to claim? (and/or do you prefer to claim at all?)
My line is that people who have something to claim should do so rather than everyone claiming. What if there's a 1-shot Vig who hasn't shot yet? What if there was no NK because of a Doctor? I don't understand why asking to get your PRs is good.
As for scum NKing players to keep infomation from coming to light, that's why I think that people who have something to claim should do so. I'm not saying no one should claim, I'm saying we shouldn't massclaim.
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And how, exactly, does it help us lynch correctly?
Are you asking "how mass claiming after 3 nights of results in an RMM would help us lynch correctly?"
Yes.
information gathered at this point from town any individual town is almost certain. Therefore, to not divulge information is to create an opportunity for skum to keep that info from coming to light by eliminating town players prior to their ability to give the information.
Now that can technically be said at any point in time - So I guess my question is... where is your line? If not today, when do you prefer to claim? (and/or do you prefer to claim at all?)
My line is that people who have something to claim should do so rather than everyone claiming. What if there's a 1-shot Vig who hasn't shot yet? What if there was no NK because of a Doctor? I don't understand why asking to get your PRs sniped is good.
As for scum NKing players to keep infomation from coming to light, that's why I think that people who have something to claim should do so. I'm not saying no one should claim, I'm saying we shouldn't massclaim.
Missed a word
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There's other benefits to a mass claim.
A mass claim with a decent ordering can catch scum inadvertantly in a lie about what they did at night. Sometimes night actions contradict each other and you can lynch based on that info. I've seen that happen a lot. Sometimes people can corroborate each other's stories about night actions and you know that they are either both lying or both telling the truth.
As a for instance, say there is a doctor and a redirector. Pretty reasonable, considering we saw one night kill fail and when we think scum probably expected it to go through and we saw another night kill hit a person we don't think scum was trying to shoot.
Well, the doctor can claim who they protected N2, and we probably shouldn't lynch that person. Then the redirector can claim which person they protected by redirecting onto gkrieg, and we shouldn't lynch that person. And if the redirector and doctor are both townie claims and consistent with other people's claims, we know they are not fake claims.
Or, if they get counter claimed, we can sort that out and lynch between them if we don't think there are two doctors.
This is why I said that my best scum read for now is Galzria. I think it's an OK shot at being correct, but I'd much rather lynch with all the information that may come out with a mass claim instead. I'm not confident enough on Galzria at all. I don't see how anyone can be confident enough about their top scum read to not want the extra information we'll get from a mass claim.
As far as scum knowing who to shoot, it's not really that simple. Say just the redirector claims his targets. Then, scum will just shoot the redirector, and maybe if there's a doctor he'll be protected. But if everyone claims, town as well as scum may know better who to target with their PRs. We may be able to coordinate at night to either expose scum or protect important PRs. There's a lot of potential that we just don't really know about until we try it.
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Each town is looking for scum in a pool of 3/7 other players. If a mass claim can even tell us with reasonable certainty that 2 players are likely town, then town can look for scum out of a pool of 3/5. 3/5 is way better odds than 3/7. We don't need guilty results for it to be a good idea.
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I still think this is a bad idea. But whatever. I'll go along with it, just waiting on a thing for phrasing purposes.
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My role is Town-Aligned Cancer [redacted] Enabler. I don't want to go any further than that since it's related to scum and I want to leave some uncertainty for them about whether it's positive or negative utility. If I die tonight, you'll get the flip and know. If I'm alive tomorrow, I'll reveal it.
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My turn!
I'm a Macho 1-shot lightning rod/neighbor
and no one can figure out if I still have my 1-shot or not. its a secret.
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I am a rolestopping motivator.
So I can target one person at night, and any other night actions that target them will fail, and if they have an active role, they will be able to use it twice the following night.
I had a town read on IDPTG on N1 and didn't trust McMc or Galz enough to motivate them, so I targeted IDPTG N1. Sounds like it didn't do anything.
N2 I thought about who scum was most likely to kill and I targeted EFHW. By this time, I had a scum read on Galz and McMc was dead. I also considered Robz but didn't think he was active enough to draw the NK. EFHW was off wagon and townie. Anyway, it's possible that my targeting her was what prevented the NK N2.
N3 I won't say who I targeted, so that scum doesn't have extra incentive to kill the motivated player. It wasn't gkrieg.
The only role related reason to think Galz is scum is that I am a protective role and I never protected him, and Jim was a protective role and he's dead. Galzria is probably too scummy to get NKed now but I am surprised if he is town and no one protected him that he would still be alive. It's also possible that Jim bulletproofed Galz N1 and that scum tried to shoot him N2.
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I can confirm that I have received the benefit iguana describes. I am the Liver. I also have a protective type role, and have been protecting iguana.
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This is all fascinating!
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I am a Reflexive Cop. I'm told which alignments target me each Night. On N1 I was targeted by one Scum and one Town. On N2 I was targeted by one Town. On N3 I received no result (I'm unclear if I was prevented from getting a result, or if nobody targeted me - as it would return "No Results" either way).
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I am a Reflexive Cop. I'm told which alignments target me each Night. On N1 I was targeted by one Scum and one Town. On N2 I was targeted by one Town. On N3 I received no result (I'm unclear if I was prevented from getting a result, or if nobody targeted me - as it would return "No Results" either way).
this is one of my favorite roles. I like the idea.
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Nice
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I am a Reflexive Cop. I'm told which alignments target me each Night. On N1 I was targeted by one Scum and one Town. On N2 I was targeted by one Town. On N3 I received no result (I'm unclear if I was prevented from getting a result, or if nobody targeted me - as it would return "No Results" either way).
Clarification - you are saying you are certain in this set up that you would receive no result either way, or you are assuming it?
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My turn, since waiting for Galz's confirmation will probably take a while with the timezones.
I'm the prostate. In addition to being in a neighbourhood with Hydrad, I have a one-shot I'm not saying any more about. I have no useful results, and have not protected anyone all game.. I think those are useful pieces of info to have out there.
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I'm the Pancreas, a Compulsive 2-Shot Vanilla-izer. I had to shoot until I was out of shots, and if I didn't specify a target, it would be chosen at random.
Night 1 I picked mcmc. I had fallen behind and didn't have any strong scum reads, but I figured that if mcmc was town there was a good chance he would be killed Night 1 anyway, as he often is, so it wouldn't be doing any damage. Didn't work out that way, sadly.
Night 2 I picked Eevee. His flip says he was Ascetic, so I would assume it did not work.
I'm out of shots now.
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DatSwan, you're up.
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I am a Reflexive Cop. I'm told which alignments target me each Night. On N1 I was targeted by one Scum and one Town. On N2 I was targeted by one Town. On N3 I received no result (I'm unclear if I was prevented from getting a result, or if nobody targeted me - as it would return "No Results" either way).
Clarification - you are saying you are certain in this set up that you would receive no result either way, or you are assuming it?
I receive No Result either way. I actually clarified as the distinction was useful for catching scum in a previous game (although the situation was slightly different), and I wanted to know if I could figure out a way to game it to catch scum here too.
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I am a Lymphocyte, a 1-Shot Vigilante/Odd-Night Tracker.
During N0 I was told that I would have the Vigilante and Tracker abilities, and that I must choose one of them to be 1-Shot and one of them to be Odd-Night (the alternative was if I did not respond they would randomly selected for me). I chose 1-Shot for Vig and Odd-Night for Tracker - which I thought to be the obvious choice.
N1 I Tracked Jimmm and received No Result (so either skum acquired his BP shot when they killed him, or I was blocked.
N2 I did nothing.
N3 I Tracked GK and received No Result.
I have not used my 1-Vig Shot... and obviously I am the worst tracker in the world.
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So no town claims to have targeted Galz...?
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Wait what?
Or awaclus
Or me
Or space
I think I’m even missing someone else
What is your point?
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So no town claims to have targeted Galz...?
That would appear to be the case, yes - which means of the most likely results: Datswan was Roleblocked and Jimmm targeted me, or scum has a redirecting/switching ability.
I'm inclined towards the latter, as I doubt that A) Datswan was blocked, B) Scum killed Jimmm, and C) They had a third entire power to target me. With redirecting (say they redirected from scum to me) I would see them target me, plus whoever may have targeted them. With a switching ability I would still see them, plus any person that targeted my switching partner.
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Wait what?
Or awaclus
Or me
Or space
I think I’m even missing someone else
What is your point?
Galz claimed to be targeted by towns on N1 and N2, one on each night.
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Igauna, Awaclus, Galz and IDP don't seem to have claimed an organ... was that deliberate?
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I don't see why scum would redirect a town onto Galz two nights in a row.
At least it sounds unlikely.
Him botching a fakeclaim is weird too though.
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I'm lungs, didn't think it really mattered.
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Igauna, Awaclus, Galz and IDP don't seem to have claimed an organ... was that deliberate?
Yes.
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I'm going to look more closely at the claims tonight.
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I'm going to look more closely at the claims tonight.
You always sound confident that we are not lynching you.
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I'm going to look more closely at the claims tonight.
You always sound confident that we are not lynching you.
I meant tonight as in a couple hours from now, not at the end of this game day.
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Igauna, Awaclus, Galz and IDP don't seem to have claimed an organ... was that deliberate?
Oversight. I'm the Brain Stem. I'm in charge of the Reflex Center of the body.
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I'm going to look more closely at the claims tonight.
You always sound confident that we are not lynching you.
I meant tonight as in a couple hours from now, not at the end of this game day.
I took your meaning lol.
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Igauna, Awaclus, Galz and IDP don't seem to have claimed an organ... was that deliberate?
No, but I guess if IDPTG's was, it'll help him out if I also keep mine hidden.
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I'm going to look more closely at the claims tonight.
You always sound confident that we are not lynching you.
I meant tonight as in a couple hours from now, not at the end of this game day.
I took your meaning lol.
Just wanted to make sure iguana did.
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I'm going to look more closely at the claims tonight.
You always sound confident that we are not lynching you.
I meant tonight as in a couple hours from now, not at the end of this game day.
I took your meaning lol.
Just wanted to make sure iguana did.
Thanks for clarifying!
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Huh. There is stuff to think about for sure.
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Igauna, Awaclus, Galz and IDP don't seem to have claimed an organ... was that deliberate?
No, but I guess if IDPTG's was, it'll help him out if I also keep mine hidden.
I'm confused by this.
Your not wanting to claim it to help IDPTG? Don't you view him as scummy if he was top of your list?
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Trackers usually see what people targeted others right? So unless jimmm uses his power you don't see who he targeted.
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Trackers usually see what people targeted others right? So unless jimmm uses his power you don't see who he targeted.
Right. I was speaking from frame of mind prior to the claim. Good point.
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Vote Count 4.1
Not Voting (9): EFHW, iguanaiguana, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, Hydrad, Robz888, DatSwan, Galzria, IDontPlayThisGame
With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. Day 4 ends June 24, 2018, 03:00:00 am.
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Your not wanting to claim it to help IDPTG? Don't you view him as scummy if he was top of your list?
He chose not to reveal his organ. If we think that's scummy, we can lynch him for it. If not, it helps if scum doesn't know my organ.
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I don't see why scum would redirect a town onto Galz two nights in a row.
At least it sounds unlikely.
Him botching a fakeclaim is weird too though.
Godfather would show as town. But why would scum target Galz so much? We also can't see any effects of all this targeting .
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No town redirect means scum killed gkrieg on purpose?
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Maybe they knew he was a cop.
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I was just going to say maybe they have a rolecop.
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Robz's claim could be a fakeclaim. None of the details are verifiable.
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Robz's claim could be a fakeclaim. None of the details are verifiable.
McMc verified that he was vanillaized before he died, and Robz reacted the way his PR would react here:
Go to bed, bro! Don't get divorced.
So, I fully believe mcmc was this role, lost it, and is now VT. Too weird to make up.
He could be town or scum, however. This info doesn't help us there.
This post basically reads as "It was my PR that made him vanilla; therefore it isn't a town tell that he got vanillaized, but it did happen."
Of course it is possible he's a scum vanillaiser who was planning to claim town vanillaiser from the beginning. He definitely has a scummy role. But Robz is in his town meta too.
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I'm going to look more closely at the claims tonight.
You always sound confident that we are not lynching you.
I meant tonight as in a couple hours from now, not at the end of this game day.
I took your meaning lol.
Just wanted to make sure iguana did.
Thanks for clarifying!
Does it change your statement?
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I'm going to look more closely at the claims tonight.
You always sound confident that we are not lynching you.
I meant tonight as in a couple hours from now, not at the end of this game day.
I took your meaning lol.
Just wanted to make sure iguana did.
Thanks for clarifying!
Does it change your statement?
Yeah. I misunderstood that you were planning to reveal your thoughts on the claims next game day, which sounded weird. I get it now. You also said something earlier about how you'll reveal your role 'tomorrow' if you don't get killed tonight. That made me think, huh, he's not expecting to get lynched today and when I saw both statements that was why I misunderstood the second one.
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I'm going to look more closely at the claims tonight.
You always sound confident that we are not lynching you.
I meant tonight as in a couple hours from now, not at the end of this game day.
I took your meaning lol.
Just wanted to make sure iguana did.
Thanks for clarifying!
Does it change your statement?
Yeah. I misunderstood that you were planning to reveal your thoughts on the claims next game day, which sounded weird. I get it now. You also said something earlier about how you'll reveal your role 'tomorrow' if you don't get killed tonight. That made me think, huh, he's not expecting to get lynched today and when I saw both statements that was why I misunderstood the second one.
Ah, yes. I was inconsistent with my language there. Sorry for any confusion. As for sounding confident that I'm not getting lynched, I'm not sure what to tell you. I don't think I'm getting lynched so that's probably why it sounds like that.
I looked at the claims like I said I would and I didn't find much. Robz's claim is interesting to say the least. It could be scum hiding behind supposedly targeting an Ascetic N2 to explain why he ended up targeting someone regardless of his read on them or unlucky town hitting an Ascetic scum (although it got us a free lynch).
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If Robz were fakeclaiming scum, he probably had better options.
1) Don't claim to have vanillaized McMc. If worried about a tracker, claim that you did something else to McMc.
2) Claim that you vanillaized McMc, but then claim something else. Don't claim to have tried to vanillaized Eevee.
There was no expectation from any of us that he would have been 2-shot compulsive. It takes a lot of creativity to make something like that up. If you are going to be creative, why not make up something that doesn't sound scummy?
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IDP saying that the only weird looking claim is Robz' claim and ignoring Galzria's claim is scummyAF.
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IDP saying that the only weird looking claim is Robz' claim and ignoring Galzria's claim is scummyAF.
Please show me where I said that.
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IDP saying that the only weird looking claim is Robz' claim and ignoring Galzria's claim is scummyAF.
Please show me where I said that.
I looked at the claims like I said I would and I didn't find much. Robz's claim is interesting to say the least. It could be scum hiding behind supposedly targeting an Ascetic N2 to explain why he ended up targeting someone regardless of his read on them or unlucky town hitting an Ascetic scum (although it got us a free lynch).
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IDP saying that the only weird looking claim is Robz' claim and ignoring Galzria's claim is scummyAF.
Please show me where I said that.
I looked at the claims like I said I would and I didn't find much. Robz's claim is interesting to say the least. It could be scum hiding behind supposedly targeting an Ascetic N2 to explain why he ended up targeting someone regardless of his read on them or unlucky town hitting an Ascetic scum (although it got us a free lynch).
I'm not seeing the bit where I said the only weird claim is Robz's.
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You said you didn't find much, then you only talked about Robz.
Were you planning to add more later?
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You said you didn't find much, then you only talked about Robz.
Were you planning to add more later?
People already brought up the Galz thing. I don't have anything to add to it at this point, but no one said anything about Robz. If I have something to contribute, I'll bring it up.
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Ok, to me it looked like potential scum partner deflection. Especially because EFHW had just brought up Robz too. So you ended up backing that up but ignoring the Galz stuff, which IMO is weirder and scunmier.
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If Robz were fakeclaiming scum, he probably had better options.
1) Don't claim to have vanillaized McMc. If worried about a tracker, claim that you did something else to McMc.
2) Claim that you vanillaized McMc, but then claim something else. Don't claim to have tried to vanillaized Eevee.
There was no expectation from any of us that he would have been 2-shot compulsive. It takes a lot of creativity to make something like that up. If you are going to be creative, why not make up something that doesn't sound scummy?
I can see what you are saying, but the choice of Eevee feels convenient. I wouldn't vote Robz on the basis of just this, but it's worth noting.
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I found this on mafiawiki:
"Sometimes, an Ascetic killing role, such as an Ascetic Goon, Vigilante, or Serial Killer, forgoes its protection on a night when it is performing a kill."
What if scum!Robz was hoping to remove Eevee's guilty child role? We'd need an explanation for why it didn't work, though, assuming faust would tell Eevee that he would lose his protection if he did the kill. The nk didn't go through N2. Maybe he kept his protection as a result?
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I found this on mafiawiki:
"Sometimes, an Ascetic killing role, such as an Ascetic Goon, Vigilante, or Serial Killer, forgoes its protection on a night when it is performing a kill."
What if scum!Robz was hoping to remove Eevee's guilty child role? We'd need an explanation for why it didn't work, though, assuming faust would tell Eevee that he would lose his protection if he did the kill. The nk didn't go through N2. Maybe he kept his protection as a result?
There's no need for the Vanillaizer in that scenario because scum can change roles by killing anyway. It is a bit weird why Eevee never got rid of his Guilty role, though, and the best explanations I can come up with off the top of my head are:
1) someone else in the scum team had a worse negative utility ability that they needed to get rid of
2) Eevee was immune to the role changing mechanic
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Galzria's claim is more problematic, in any case. He says he was targeted 3 times, including twice by town, and there is no evidence of any of those targetings. Jimmmmm could possibly have given him the bulletproof, but I would expect him to hang on to that until reads were stronger. gkrieg seems to have investigated Awaclus. mcmc said he targeted Eevee N1. If a godfather targeted him, that means two scum used night actions on him N1, with no apparent effects.
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Vote: Galz
I am having a hard time seeing how it's possible for him to be telling the truth. Basically the only way would be a scum!redirector. Which is definitely possible, this is RMM, and faust has put redirectors in games before. But Galz being scum seems a bit neater.
I had forgot about the whole scum absorbs the PR of the person they kill thing. So Eevee did the kill in order to shed his nerf, but the kill failed and he remained nerf'd... he targeted the BP'd player, maybe. My Vanilla-izing likewise failed because he's ascetic.
Kinda cool that ascetic was a drawback here for scum.
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Vote: Galz
I am having a hard time seeing how it's possible for him to be telling the truth. Basically the only way would be a scum!redirector. Which is definitely possible, this is RMM, and faust has put redirectors in games before. But Galz being scum seems a bit neater.
I had forgot about the whole scum absorbs the PR of the person they kill thing. So Eevee did the kill in order to shed his nerf, but the kill failed and he remained nerf'd... he targeted the BP'd player, maybe. My Vanilla-izing likewise failed because he's ascetic.
Kinda cool that ascetic was a drawback here for scum.
Also EFHW and I protected eachother that night, so scum shooting one of us is a likely answer. Note that DatSwan claimed Jim took no action N1 too.
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Vote: Galz seems right to me.
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Er Vote: Galz
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Vote: Galz
I am having a hard time seeing how it's possible for him to be telling the truth. Basically the only way would be a scum!redirector. Which is definitely possible, this is RMM, and faust has put redirectors in games before. But Galz being scum seems a bit neater.
I had forgot about the whole scum absorbs the PR of the person they kill thing. So Eevee did the kill in order to shed his nerf, but the kill failed and he remained nerf'd... he targeted the BP'd player, maybe. My Vanilla-izing likewise failed because he's ascetic.
Kinda cool that ascetic was a drawback here for scum.
Also EFHW and I protected eachother that night, so scum shooting one of us is a likely answer. Note that DatSwan claimed Jim took no action N1 too.
Yep yep, there's that.
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alright getting on plane in like an hour and a half. I still need to go through claims in my head fully - so I will do it then and then get back.
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I found this on mafiawiki:
"Sometimes, an Ascetic killing role, such as an Ascetic Goon, Vigilante, or Serial Killer, forgoes its protection on a night when it is performing a kill."
What if scum!Robz was hoping to remove Eevee's guilty child role? We'd need an explanation for why it didn't work, though, assuming faust would tell Eevee that he would lose his protection if he did the kill. The nk didn't go through N2. Maybe he kept his protection as a result?
There's no need for the Vanillaizer in that scenario because scum can change roles by killing anyway. It is a bit weird why Eevee never got rid of his Guilty role, though, and the best explanations I can come up with off the top of my head are:
1) someone else in the scum team had a worse negative utility ability that they needed to get rid of
2) Eevee was immune to the role changing mechanic
Also... just saying, If Eevee was Ascetic that means he can't be targeted right? So how would Skum!Robz target Eevee to rid him of his power? Doesn't Ascetic just mean it would fail?
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I found this on mafiawiki:
"Sometimes, an Ascetic killing role, such as an Ascetic Goon, Vigilante, or Serial Killer, forgoes its protection on a night when it is performing a kill."
What if scum!Robz was hoping to remove Eevee's guilty child role? We'd need an explanation for why it didn't work, though, assuming faust would tell Eevee that he would lose his protection if he did the kill. The nk didn't go through N2. Maybe he kept his protection as a result?
There's no need for the Vanillaizer in that scenario because scum can change roles by killing anyway. It is a bit weird why Eevee never got rid of his Guilty role, though, and the best explanations I can come up with off the top of my head are:
1) someone else in the scum team had a worse negative utility ability that they needed to get rid of
2) Eevee was immune to the role changing mechanic
Also... just saying, If Eevee was Ascetic that means he can't be targeted right? So how would Skum!Robz target Eevee to rid him of his power? Doesn't Ascetic just mean it would fail?
Yes possibly, but EFHW was saying that sometimes Ascetic scum aren't protected while they're performing the NK.
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I found this on mafiawiki:
"Sometimes, an Ascetic killing role, such as an Ascetic Goon, Vigilante, or Serial Killer, forgoes its protection on a night when it is performing a kill."
What if scum!Robz was hoping to remove Eevee's guilty child role? We'd need an explanation for why it didn't work, though, assuming faust would tell Eevee that he would lose his protection if he did the kill. The nk didn't go through N2. Maybe he kept his protection as a result?
There's no need for the Vanillaizer in that scenario because scum can change roles by killing anyway. It is a bit weird why Eevee never got rid of his Guilty role, though, and the best explanations I can come up with off the top of my head are:
1) someone else in the scum team had a worse negative utility ability that they needed to get rid of
2) Eevee was immune to the role changing mechanic
Also... just saying, If Eevee was Ascetic that means he can't be targeted right? So how would Skum!Robz target Eevee to rid him of his power? Doesn't Ascetic just mean it would fail?
Yes possibly, but EFHW was saying that sometimes Ascetic scum aren't protected while they're performing the NK.
So, just making sure I got it here - Eevee did the kill to drop the shield as a positive utility in order to be VT? Why in the hell would Robz VT Eevee in that scenario? They could just have Eevee commit the kill and absorb the new power right?
If Eevee wasn't protected then Skum Robz would not use a shot on them because the kill would of swapped out their power yeah?
If Eevee was protected then skum Robz would not use a shot on them because the VT shot would not of landed yeah?
So.... I have to add that up but I am thinking confident on Robz being town at this point.
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Yeah, I mean if Robz is scum he for sure had a 1 shot vanillaize only and maybe some other powers and is fakeclaiming.
Also why would mafia vanillaize McMc then push his lynch the next day? that's poor use of powers.
So yeah Robz is probably town.
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Yeah, I mean if Robz is scum he for sure had a 1 shot vanillaize only and maybe some other powers and is fakeclaiming.
Also why would mafia vanillaize McMc then push his lynch the next day? that's poor use of powers.
So yeah Robz is probably town.
Robz also jumped onto the eevee wagon when I was about to lynch mcmc I think
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vote: galz
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Stop.
I won't have time until tomorrow afternoon to catch up on everything and expand on all my thoughts but:
- If Space is town, then we have 5 town votes total today with theirs not counting. It takes 5 to lynch. As I'm town, it's impossible to get a correct lynch without me on the wagon. More to the point, it shouldn't really be feasible for you to have more than 5 votes on me very easily unless I'm town.
- Why would I, as scum, make a claim halfway through a mass claim that doesn't end up being verified? 1) I gambled and lost? That's a stupid gamble that pays off a tiny, tiny percent of the time. I would've been banking on just 3 remaining people (Space, Robz, Swan) to verify my claim not knowing what they were or who they targeted. 2) My scummates were behind me in the claim but didn't collaborate my story. This would be more believable... maybe, if you thought any of the 3 behind me were absent minded enough to let that happen. I started the talk of mass claim yesterday. Look back, and you'll see that everything I've said on the topic has been consistent with what I've claimed - you don't think as scum with that much forethought and bread crumbing we didn't talk over how we were going to handle the massclaim that was extremely likely to happen? The play and claim from a scum!Galzria perspective simply doesn't make any sense.
- The assumption here by people that "Because Galzria's claim doesn't work he's probably lying" is a ridiculous line of thought to follow in a RMM game. Scum are obviously lying about their powers. Things have happened that we can't explain without knowing what scum's powers are - that is, occam's razor in a normal game would suggest that yeah, I'm probably scum. In an RMM though it's more likely that scum have messed with shit than that I made up what appears to be a verifiably untrue claim.
- Lastly, stopping for a moment to actually look for where the most likely lies have occurred: Vote: Datswan. Either: Datswan is town and scum for some reason redirected to me twice N1/N2, which doesn't seem likely - or he's scum and has conveniently claimed Jimmm didn't go anywhere to prevent Jimmm from being the town that targeted me. That is - assume Datswan is lying. Now it's a whole lot more reasonable that town (Jimmm) targeted me N1, along with scum (Roleblock, Rolecop, whatever they actually have).
- Lastly twice: And this is important: If Swan is scum as I believe is the most likely case, and is TELLING THE TRUTH about being a 1 shot Vig, then scum can potentially win on my mislynch. With 9 alive (6 town, 3 scum), then after my lynch we go to 5 town 3 scum. If scum NK and Vig that's a D5 with 3 town, 3 scum. Now, we have some protective roles, which helps, but I think our best bet if you end up lynching me is to have the Lightning Rod (assuming they're town) activate. This -should- prevent multiple kills from occurring.
I'll expand more on all my thoughts tomorrow, but I wanted to have them out there before you all go rushing into a lynch that's, if you really stop to think about it, pretty idiotic here.
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Vote Count 4.2
Galzria (3): Robz888, iguanaiguana, Hydrad
DatSwan (1): Galzria
Not Voting (5): EFHW, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, DatSwan, IDontPlayThisGame
With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. Day 4 ends June 24, 2018, 03:00:00 am.
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So, just making sure I got it here - Eevee did the kill to drop the shield as a positive utility in order to be VT? Why in the hell would Robz VT Eevee in that scenario? They could just have Eevee commit the kill and absorb the new power right?
If Eevee wasn't protected then Skum Robz would not use a shot on them because the kill would of swapped out their power yeah?
If Eevee was protected then skum Robz would not use a shot on them because the VT shot would not of landed yeah?
>Eevee did the kill to drop the shield as a positive utility in order to be VT?
That's what EFHW was suggesting, and I was pointing out that he doesn't need to do that because he could just absorb the PR of whoever he kills. Which presumably he tried on N2 and it didn't work because the kill didn't go through.
>If Eevee wasn't protected then Skum Robz would not use a shot on them because the kill would of swapped out their power yeah?
Yeah.
>If Eevee was protected then skum Robz would not use a shot on them because the VT shot would not of landed yeah?
Yeah.
>So.... I have to add that up but I am thinking confident on Robz being town at this point.
Well, that's if you believe what he was saying. There are ways Robz can be scum:
1) He's not really a 2-shot Compulsive Vanillaizer. He's a Vanillaizer of some kind, but he may not have used it past N1.
2) He is really a 2-shot Compulsive Vanillaizer, but his N2 target wasn't Eevee. Instead, it was a different scumbuddy or a townie who got protected according to earlier claims.
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I'm thinking the ascetic part of his role would have prevented taking on the new role.
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<b> unvote </b>
I need to think about Galz's text wall.
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I'm thinking the ascetic part of his role would have prevented taking on the new role.
That doesn't work. Either it drops completely or it's always there. Too bad, it was such a pretty convergence of roles.
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Unvote
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Galz, who do you think targeted you N2?
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Galzria's argument points out the obvious flaw in the scum!Galz theory. But the explanations needed to account for it seem almost as unlikely as his having made such a bad fakeclaim.
Roleblock doesn't account for any actions he saw because he saw them. Rolecop is possible. I don't think Jimmmmm wouldn't have used his bp so early, but maybe. So, yeah, who was it N2? For a redirect, you would see a scum in addition to the town. If godfather, they could have redirected someone who didn't take an action. Ninja redirector?
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Did nobody else find it surprising that I became a VT when trying to get mcmc's role?
Yes - Because while he said he had been VT'd at night, he didn't flip VT... so VT wasn't his PR... so I don't understand why you became VT.
Also, backups don't usually inherit VT. If the person that dies is VT then nothing happens. Having to pick a target also means he wasn't universal. Did you have to pick for the whole game, or could you change targets? Since we lynched mcmc, it's unlikely there was scum interference.
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I'm not saying these questions implicate Awaclus, but we haven't considered that gkrieg could have been redirected.
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<b> unvote </b>
I need to think about Galz's text wall.
Scumslip!
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Did nobody else find it surprising that I became a VT when trying to get mcmc's role?
Yes - Because while he said he had been VT'd at night, he didn't flip VT... so VT wasn't his PR... so I don't understand why you became VT.
Also, backups don't usually inherit VT. If the person that dies is VT then nothing happens. Having to pick a target also means he wasn't universal. Did you have to pick for the whole game, or could you change targets? Since we lynched mcmc, it's unlikely there was scum interference.
I had to target a dead person, and then I would receive their role.
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Did nobody else find it surprising that I became a VT when trying to get mcmc's role?
Yes - Because while he said he had been VT'd at night, he didn't flip VT... so VT wasn't his PR... so I don't understand why you became VT.
Also, backups don't usually inherit VT. If the person that dies is VT then nothing happens. Having to pick a target also means he wasn't universal. Did you have to pick for the whole game, or could you change targets? Since we lynched mcmc, it's unlikely there was scum interference.
I had to target a dead person, and then I would receive their role.
Could you target someone who was nk'd? Then would both you and scum have the role?
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Did nobody else find it surprising that I became a VT when trying to get mcmc's role?
Yes - Because while he said he had been VT'd at night, he didn't flip VT... so VT wasn't his PR... so I don't understand why you became VT.
Also, backups don't usually inherit VT. If the person that dies is VT then nothing happens. Having to pick a target also means he wasn't universal. Did you have to pick for the whole game, or could you change targets? Since we lynched mcmc, it's unlikely there was scum interference.
I had to target a dead person, and then I would receive their role.
Could you target someone who was nk'd? Then would both you and scum have the role?
First question: yes. Second question: I assume so.
However, I specifically wanted to avoid targeting someone who was NK'd because that would have looked suspicious.
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Did nobody else find it surprising that I became a VT when trying to get mcmc's role?
Yes - Because while he said he had been VT'd at night, he didn't flip VT... so VT wasn't his PR... so I don't understand why you became VT.
Also, backups don't usually inherit VT. If the person that dies is VT then nothing happens. Having to pick a target also means he wasn't universal. Did you have to pick for the whole game, or could you change targets? Since we lynched mcmc, it's unlikely there was scum interference.
I had to target a dead person, and then I would receive their role.
Could you target someone who was nk'd? Then would both you and scum have the role?
First question: yes. Second question: I assume so.
However, I specifically wanted to avoid targeting someone who was NK'd because that would have looked suspicious.
Why did you target mcmc, when you knew he had been vanilla-ized?
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Why did you target mcmc, when you knew he had been vanilla-ized?
I didn't notice he said that.
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Why did you target mcmc, when you knew he had been vanilla-ized?
I didn't notice he said that.
Oh, I didn't notice you said that. Thanks.
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I am just gonna get ahead of the questions here and say that "my pr is complicated" (or at least it is to me). Specifically, it leads me to believe it is possible that Skum!Neighbor may of had a PR that expires, or is forced to be used at an exact time.
Essentially what I am trying to say that if there was a situation last night where Skum!Nieghbor was "forced" to be the person to carry out the kill - then they would of had to kill Jim right? I am saying this under the assumption they would be removed from the Neighborhood or whatever once that was no longer part of their PR.
This is from DatSwan back in early D2. We now know that Swan has claimed vig-plus-oddnight-tracker. That's not quite what I felt he was driving at here, whereas something like Eevee's D3 Guilty Child seemed much more the kind of thing Swan was describing.
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Why did you target mcmc, when you knew he had been vanilla-ized?
I didn't notice he said that.
Now you know that to play optimally you have to read posts longer than one line even when they didn't quote your post.
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Why did you target mcmc, when you knew he had been vanilla-ized?
I didn't notice he said that.
Oh, I didn't notice you said that. Thanks.
Two more questions - Was it a one-shot deal? Did you take this action at night, meaning it could have been subject to interference?
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I am just gonna get ahead of the questions here and say that "my pr is complicated" (or at least it is to me). Specifically, it leads me to believe it is possible that Skum!Neighbor may of had a PR that expires, or is forced to be used at an exact time.
Essentially what I am trying to say that if there was a situation last night where Skum!Nieghbor was "forced" to be the person to carry out the kill - then they would of had to kill Jim right? I am saying this under the assumption they would be removed from the Neighborhood or whatever once that was no longer part of their PR.
This is from DatSwan back in early D2. We now know that Swan has claimed vig-plus-oddnight-tracker. That's not quite what I felt he was driving at here, whereas something like Eevee's D3 Guilty Child seemed much more the kind of thing Swan was describing.
This is a good point. I'm interested to hear DatSwan's response.
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I need to reread but I think DatSwan might be scum here.
That would also make that mini gkrieg wagon on D2 make a lot more sense.
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I think our appointing Awaclus as IC may have been premature. His role really doesn't sound universal or like backup. It sounds like the absorbing scum do when they nk. Would faust have named it so imprecisely? Possible, but something I think he would try to avoid. gkrieg could have been redirected.
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Two more questions - Was it a one-shot deal? Did you take this action at night, meaning it could have been subject to interference?
1) It wasn't, but obviously there isn't a way to use it again now that I've lost that role.
2) Yes.
I think our appointing Awaclus as IC may have been premature. His role really doesn't sound universal or like backup. It sounds like the absorbing scum do when they nk.
Mcmc wasn't NK'd, he was lynched.
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Would faust have named it so imprecisely?
It's an active universal backup.
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I dunno EFHW, he got copped. We don't even need to sort Awaclus today as long as we agree its better to lynch elsewhere.
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I dunno EFHW, he got copped. We don't even need to sort Awaclus today as long as we agree its better to lynch elsewhere.
We don't have to lynch him today, but gkrieg could have been rolecopped N1 and redirected N2. I'm objecting to the IC status.
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I dunno EFHW, he got copped. We don't even need to sort Awaclus today as long as we agree its better to lynch elsewhere.
We don't have to lynch him today, but gkrieg could have been rolecopped N1 and redirected N2. I'm objecting to the IC status.
What is your opinion on DatSwan vs Galzria?
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Catching up
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Ok, to me it looked like potential scum partner deflection. Especially because EFHW had just brought up Robz too. So you ended up backing that up but ignoring the Galz stuff, which IMO is weirder and scunmier.
Is this the post you were talking about from EFHW?
Robz's claim could be a fakeclaim. None of the details are verifiable.
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My hesitation with Galz's claim is that I do think scum!Galz would be so bold as to create a claim that he knows town can't verify and attempt to talk his way out of it.
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I am just gonna get ahead of the questions here and say that "my pr is complicated" (or at least it is to me). Specifically, it leads me to believe it is possible that Skum!Neighbor may of had a PR that expires, or is forced to be used at an exact time.
Essentially what I am trying to say that if there was a situation last night where Skum!Nieghbor was "forced" to be the person to carry out the kill - then they would of had to kill Jim right? I am saying this under the assumption they would be removed from the Neighborhood or whatever once that was no longer part of their PR.
This is from DatSwan back in early D2. We now know that Swan has claimed vig-plus-oddnight-tracker. That's not quite what I felt he was driving at here, whereas something like Eevee's D3 Guilty Child seemed much more the kind of thing Swan was describing.
I was speaking in context to how i had to select my modifiers on N0.
I until claim time i kind of was acting under the impression most of us went through the similar process. The thing that made most sense for a Jim death was skum shared his hood...and the. You can price the logic together from there.
I do however, upon reading, see as how my language would of been suggesting i had a modifier of that specific type.
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My hesitation with Galz's claim is that I do think scum!Galz would be so bold as to create a claim that he knows town can't verify and attempt to talk his way out of it.
Talk his way out of a bad claim once it backfires? Definitely. But he also is experienced enough to know not to claim completely bad things to start with. What would his motive be for doing that? Just hoping that he can WIFOM people into never lynching him?
It seems like his fakeclaim would be a needlessly high risk strategy.
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Constant wild weird speculation about what scum might be doing is actually a big part of Swan's scum MO.
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Vote: DatSwan
I am talking myself into this one. Hope I don't regret it!
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Constant wild weird speculation about what scum might be doing is actually a big part of Swan's scum MO.
How is one post constant wild weird talking? I mean you do you, but space asked a question and i have an answer.
I feel like you are grasping to create cases when there are actual cases to be made instead.
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Constant wild weird speculation about what scum might be doing is actually a big part of Swan's scum MO.
How is one post constant wild weird talking? I mean you do you, but space asked a question and i have an answer.
I feel like you are grasping to create cases when there are actual cases to be made instead.
Oh no I am definitely sheeping Galz's case. That was just a little thing. I was more remembering how much wild speculation you did in Lost mafia and then suddenly realizing some of your posts in here are pretty similar.
I think I should reread you though and try to figure out why I townread you D1
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A point in Galz's favor, and against DatSwan, is that Galz defected from the mcmc wagon to vote Eevee at a pretty pivotal moment--just before I did, actually. DS, on the other hand, hammered mcmc.
I am wary, though, of being tricked by scum!Galz's silver tongue. He is absolutely capable of all of this.
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Unvote actually until I can properly re read. SorryI know I'm all over the place.
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A point in Galz's favor, and against DatSwan, is that Galz defected from the mcmc wagon to vote Eevee at a pretty pivotal moment--just before I did, actually. DS, on the other hand, hammered mcmc.
I am wary, though, of being tricked by scum!Galz's silver tongue. He is absolutely capable of all of this.
I know, right?? If it was anyone BUT Galz I would happily vote DatSwan I feel like, but it's Galz so you never know how deeply he drank the wine, and I hate rewarding 'too scummy to be scum' claims like his seems to be.
I really really want some explanation for how a town could have targeted him D2 besides a scum redirector that we haven't seen any other evidence for.
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We know we probably shouldn't lynch among Robz, Awaclus, Iguana, EFHW.
So that only leaves: IDP, Space, Hydrad, Galz, DatSwan.
If we assume there's exactly one scum in Galz/DatSwan, then that should mean two scum in IDP, Space, Hydrad, no???
Or like, if there is also one scum in Hydrad/Space (one scum neighbor, one town) then IDP is scum by PoE.
Maybe we should just lynch him?
I mean, there's all sorts of snags to that. Hydrad/Space could both be scum lying about being neighbors (but I doubt that based on interactions). Galz/DatSwan could both be scum gambiting.
I think I should follow McMc's advice and color the wagons in with all the green and red.
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EFHW could be scum if Galzria is town and Eevee tried to shoot Galzria, who was bulletproof because of Jim.
It's only if I blocked the kill or EFHW blocked the kill, then EFHW is conf!town (and y'all can know I'm town too). We'll never get confirmation on that so there will always be uncertainty.
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I do find it likely that Jim would use his bulletproof N1 on Galzria. If he town read Galz, then Galz is an obvious choice as a popular night kill.
Oh wait, town!Galz couldn't have been NK'd by Eevee because he would have detected Eevee targeting him that night. So EFHW really really should be town.
Scum!Robz wouldn't have vanillaized scum's choice for who to lynch D2 (and McMc was clearly their top lynch choice, considering how much he was pushed. I should probably go get evidence for that assertion......) So Robz really should be town.
Awaclus got copped, so he really should be town.....
SO
We have Galz/DatSwan = probably one scum
Hydrad / Space = probably one scum by default because we are out of spots for both to be town and it's very unlikely that they both planned to claim neighbors and both are scum.
IDP = scum, because he's the only spot left to put scum somewhere.
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Someone please check my logic.
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Well, Galz and DS COULD both be scum, and hydrad and Space COULD both be scum, but yeah it's not super likely.
Why is EFHW town again? I believe you, I just don't remember.
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I do find it likely that Jim would use his bulletproof N1 on Galzria. If he town read Galz, then Galz is an obvious choice as a popular night kill.
Oh wait, town!Galz couldn't have been NK'd by Eevee because he would have detected Eevee targeting him that night. So EFHW really really should be town.
Scum!Robz wouldn't have vanillaized scum's choice for who to lynch D2 (and McMc was clearly their top lynch choice, considering how much he was pushed. I should probably go get evidence for that assertion......) So Robz really should be town.
Awaclus got copped, so he really should be town.....
SO
We have Galz/DatSwan = probably one scum
Hydrad / Space = probably one scum by default because we are out of spots for both to be town and it's very unlikely that they both planned to claim neighbors and both are scum.
IDP = scum, because he's the only spot left to put scum somewhere.
I am phone posting but quick read makes sense from your perspective.
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I do find it likely that Jim would use his bulletproof N1 on Galzria. If he town read Galz, then Galz is an obvious choice as a popular night kill.
Oh wait, town!Galz couldn't have been NK'd by Eevee because he would have detected Eevee targeting him that night. So EFHW really really should be town.
Scum!Robz wouldn't have vanillaized scum's choice for who to lynch D2 (and McMc was clearly their top lynch choice, considering how much he was pushed. I should probably go get evidence for that assertion......) So Robz really should be town.
Awaclus got copped, so he really should be town.....
SO
We have Galz/DatSwan = probably one scum
Hydrad / Space = probably one scum by default because we are out of spots for both to be town and it's very unlikely that they both planned to claim neighbors and both are scum.
IDP = scum, because he's the only spot left to put scum somewhere.
I am phone posting but quick read makes sense from your perspective.
It should make sense from your perspective too!
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Well, Galz and DS COULD both be scum, and hydrad and Space COULD both be scum, but yeah it's not super likely.
Why is EFHW town again? I believe you, I just don't remember.
EFHW and I should both be LIKELY town because we both protected each other on N2 when Eevee likely tried to shoot someone and failed. If DatSwan is scum and Galzria is town, then Galzria is likely bulletproof (because he probably detected Jim targeting him N1) and Eevee could have then shot Galzria and then in that case EFHW & Iguana wouldn't be cleared. In that case, we still should be considered town just because we have both been very towny. If DatSwan is town, then his result that Jim didn't bulletproof anyone N1 is likely correct and we should be both towny and cleared by results.
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Well, Galz and DS COULD both be scum, and hydrad and Space COULD both be scum, but yeah it's not super likely.
Why is EFHW town again? I believe you, I just don't remember.
EFHW and I should both be LIKELY town because we both protected each other on N2 when Eevee likely tried to shoot someone and failed. If DatSwan is scum and Galzria is town, then Galzria is likely bulletproof (because he probably detected Jim targeting him N1) and Eevee could have then shot Galzria and then in that case EFHW & Iguana wouldn't be cleared. In that case, we still should be considered town just because we have both been very towny. If DatSwan is town, then his result that Jim didn't bulletproof anyone N1 is likely correct and we should be both towny and cleared by results.
If Eevee shot town!Galzria, that would have shown up in his results.
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oh a bunch of things are happening while i was asleep.
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Okay, if my logic is correct then I think I solved the game for town.
Again, the logic:
Awaclus is likely town because gkrieg breadcrumbed copping him N2. (Scum probably didn't rolecop gkrieg N1 then redirect him because they killed him N3. If they wanted to redirect gkrieg's cop action to give him false results, they would have let him live and report his results. Killing him in the absence of town redirection indicates that scum feared his PR and his results should be trusted. This also means scum probably doesn't have limitless redirection at their disposal).
Robz is likely town because it would be horrible scum strategy to vanillaize McMcsalot when mafia likely was planning to push his lynch on D2. Picking any townie to vanillaize, scum!Robz should have picked someone who was ostensibly scummy but unlikely to be lynched. And if we look at the McMc wagons, I think we can see that scum should be on there:
Day 2 Final Vote Count
mcmcsalot (7): gkrieg13, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, IDontPlayThisGame, Hydrad, Eevee, DatSwan
Eevee (5): iguanaiguana, EFHW, mcmcsalot, Galzria, Robz888
Not Voting (0)
With 12 alive, it took 7 to lynch.
The only way the mcmc wagon wasn't scum's top choice is if Galzria/Robz/EFHW has two scum in it and scum would have rather bussed than lynch McMc. And I think scum Robz plays with more finesse than to vanillaize a player and then have his team get them lynched at the same time. He didn't push hard against the McMc lynch at all. Robz is also playing like town!Robz and not like scum!Robz, so that's a thing too.
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I'm ok with an IDP lynch. He is very different this game. He said he's some kind of enabler. It would be good to hear more about that.
Ppe ii
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Well, Galz and DS COULD both be scum, and hydrad and Space COULD both be scum, but yeah it's not super likely.
Why is EFHW town again? I believe you, I just don't remember.
EFHW and I should both be LIKELY town because we both protected each other on N2 when Eevee likely tried to shoot someone and failed. If DatSwan is scum and Galzria is town, then Galzria is likely bulletproof (because he probably detected Jim targeting him N1) and Eevee could have then shot Galzria and then in that case EFHW & Iguana wouldn't be cleared. In that case, we still should be considered town just because we have both been very towny. If DatSwan is town, then his result that Jim didn't bulletproof anyone N1 is likely correct and we should be both towny and cleared by results.
If Eevee shot town!Galzria, that would have shown up in his results.
Oh right, duh, we are both almost 100% totally cleared. We are each other's only conceivable way that the N2 kill got blocked, barring some MAJOR result tampering on scum's part. It was really very very lucky that we targeted each other.
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I could go with an IDP lynch also.
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Well, Galz and DS COULD both be scum, and hydrad and Space COULD both be scum, but yeah it's not super likely.
Why is EFHW town again? I believe you, I just don't remember.
EFHW and I should both be LIKELY town because we both protected each other on N2 when Eevee likely tried to shoot someone and failed. If DatSwan is scum and Galzria is town, then Galzria is likely bulletproof (because he probably detected Jim targeting him N1) and Eevee could have then shot Galzria and then in that case EFHW & Iguana wouldn't be cleared. In that case, we still should be considered town just because we have both been very towny. If DatSwan is town, then his result that Jim didn't bulletproof anyone N1 is likely correct and we should be both towny and cleared by results.
If Eevee shot town!Galzria, that would have shown up in his results.
Oh right, duh, we are both almost 100% totally cleared. We are each other's only conceivable way that the N2 kill got blocked, barring some MAJOR result tampering on scum's part. It was really very very lucky that we targeted each other.
I didn't really think about how you guys are mini IC's while the claims were going. I didn't make the connection that you protecting each other is the only real way that n3 a kill didn't go through.
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Robz and Galz on Eevee's wagon does count in their favor.
Hydrad, you mean N2?
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Robz and Galz on Eevee's wagon does count in their favor.
Hydrad, you mean N2?
err ya sorry
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so scumteam is most likely
IDP/Galz/Dat?
with me and space on sidelines imo.
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also if we think we need it and i'm being viewed as a high suspect scum person.
I'm willing to use my power one night to make it so I die instead of one of our towny people.
I don't really know how else to use it.
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also if we think we need it and i'm being viewed as a high suspect scum person.
I'm willing to use my power one night to make it so I die instead of one of our towny people.
I don't really know how else to use it.
You wouldn't die.
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I have a plan. Please read this post.
We LIKELY have only town among EFHW/Iguana/Awaclus/Robz.
We LIKELY have one scum between Hydrad/Space
We LIKELY have one scum between Galzria/DatSwan
That means that IDP is the most likely player to be scum.
Today, we lynch IDP.
If he is town, we play defensively. EFHW should pick at random between Iguana and Robz for a target. Iguana should pick at random between EFHW and Awaclus for a target. That gives scum 50% odds of getting a NK on any of those targets and may help them PoE for us or maybe they won't get a kill.
If he is scum, we put DatSwan's PR to the test. I will rolestop DatSwan, allowing him to use his claimed 1-shot vigilante on Galzria un-tampered with. If EFHW's protection can help make sure my rolestop goes through, she'll use it on me to protect me. Otherwise she'll protect whoever. If DatSwan is town, he shoots Galzria, and we see the scum!Galzria flip we need to see in order to know that DatSwan wasn't lying. If Galzria doesn't die, we should strongly, strongly consider lynching DatSwan. The only way scum could stop this is by protecting Galz directly or by roleblocking both DatSwan and me. No one else should tamper with this. Scum will have two players left, so we would hope a low chance to be able to mess with this plan.
If we can use this plan to sort DatSwan/Galzria and IDP correctly across two days, we have a high chance of going into the decision between Space/Hydrad with two tries. And then we win.
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also if we think we need it and i'm being viewed as a high suspect scum person.
I'm willing to use my power one night to make it so I die instead of one of our towny people.
I don't really know how else to use it.
You wouldn't die.
I'm macho so i would
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Oh, right. Forgot that detail.
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Iguana, protecting me would allow three people to be protected the next night (me and my two targets.)
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I have a plan. Please read this post.
We LIKELY have only town among EFHW/Iguana/Awaclus/Robz.
We LIKELY have one scum between Hydrad/Space
We LIKELY have one scum between Galzria/DatSwan
That means that IDP is the most likely player to be scum.
Today, we lynch IDP.
If he is town, we play defensively. EFHW should pick at random between Iguana and Robz for a target. Iguana should pick at random between EFHW and Awaclus for a target. That gives scum 50% odds of getting a NK on any of those targets and may help them PoE for us or maybe they won't get a kill.
If he is scum, we put DatSwan's PR to the test. I will rolestop DatSwan, allowing him to use his claimed 1-shot vigilante on Galzria un-tampered with. If EFHW's protection can help make sure my rolestop goes through, she'll use it on me to protect me. Otherwise she'll protect whoever. If DatSwan is town, he shoots Galzria, and we see the scum!Galzria flip we need to see in order to know that DatSwan wasn't lying. If Galzria doesn't die, we should strongly, strongly consider lynching DatSwan. The only way scum could stop this is by protecting Galz directly or by roleblocking both DatSwan and me. No one else should tamper with this. Scum will have two players left, so we would hope a low chance to be able to mess with this plan.
If we can use this plan to sort DatSwan/Galzria and IDP correctly across two days, we have a high chance of going into the decision between Space/Hydrad with two tries. And then we win.
the one thing we have to be careful of is if there is a bus driver. other then that it sounds ok to me
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Iguana, protecting me would allow three people to be protected the next night (me and my two targets.)
Hm.
I guess the bare bones of my plan is: we need to lynch IDP and if DatSwan is town he needs to prove it by shooting Galzria. Obviously we can't 100% lock things down with night actions because we don't know what scum can do. But if I rolestop DatSwan that doesn't give him much of an excuse for why his vig shot didn't go through.
We may be able to do something with Hydrad's lightning rod in order to ensure that we lynch correctly there too. But I think that should be a N5 thing not a N4 thing. Maybe?
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Here's the D1 final vote count in case there's anything to be learned here:
Day 1 Final Vote Count
mcmcsalot (3): iguanaiguana, Awaclus, LaLight
Hydrad (1): IDontPlayThisGame
SpaceAnemone (1): Robz888
IDontPlayThisGame (1): Jimmmmm
LaLight (8): EFHW, gkrieg13, mcmcsalot, Galzria, Hydrad, Eevee, DatSwan, SpaceAnemone
Not Voting (0)
With 14 alive, it took 8 to lynch.
Things of note:
Having likely all townies at EoD on the opposing McMc wagon may have been the impetus for the scum team to decide to push McMc the next day.
2/3 of the unpopular 1 vote options are likely on scum with two of them being pushed by likely towns.
The lalight wagon was started by town and then hammered down by a mix of town and scum.
If Hydrad is scum and IDP is scum, then IDP ended the day bussing.
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Vote: IDontPlayThisGame
I'm done for today.
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Iguana, protecting me would allow three people to be protected the next night (me and my two targets.)
Hm.
I guess the bare bones of my plan is: we need to lynch IDP and if DatSwan is town he needs to prove it by shooting Galzria. Obviously we can't 100% lock things down with night actions because we don't know what scum can do. But if I rolestop DatSwan that doesn't give him much of an excuse for why his vig shot didn't go through.
We may be able to do something with Hydrad's lightning rod in order to ensure that we lynch correctly there too. But I think that should be a N5 thing not a N4 thing. Maybe?
if i use it it ruins all your plans for tonight and stuff also. so might not be good today.
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So i am good with the plan i think.... i have one little worry i need to read back on though.
My only concern is that with securing my shot so perfectly (role stop to defend potential role block) is we are kinda putting all of our eggs in one basket.
I cannot wrap my head around how skum!galz would mess up his claim the way he did, which is why i will tentatively agree to the plan.
My large concerns stems from the Night 1 logistics.
I checked Jim, he came back blank. We have gone through 100 scenarios trying to make it make sense... but the one that makes me nervous is the one where Galz is skum and lied and didn’t expect me to be a tracker. The point there is that that would dictate that Jim did not use his BP and when skum killed Jim they got that shot.
No way Skum!Galz carries N1 kill, and they would never use the BP on Eevee... so yeah.
Now i know that sounds like me “thinking too much about skum yadda yadda”... but it should be considered how likely it actually is that Galz is or could be bullet proofed if he is skum.
We need to discuss the lynch of the day, bc if IDP is Town, and Galz is Town... we lose tonight i think.
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Ah yes, Galzria could be bulletproof scum.
Who do we think DatSwan should shoot?
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Ah yes, Galzria could be bulletproof scum.
Who do we think DatSwan should shoot?
OK also, I wanna make it clear of two things:
1) Not saying anything huge, but it was kind of skummy of you to miss that pretty large flaw in the plan. So it has me just slightly suspicious of your motives with assigning my shot rn.
2) I still don't know if shooting Galz is the wrong play, I was kind of hoping to talk about it before we just moved off of him.
If we need to select someone else I am actually kind of a fan of having Awaclus choose. Or whatever, but just throwing that idea out there.
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Ah yes, Galzria could be bulletproof scum.
Who do we think DatSwan should shoot?
OK also, I wanna make it clear of two things:
1) Not saying anything huge, but it was kind of skummy of you to miss that pretty large flaw in the plan. So it has me just slightly suspicious of your motives with assigning my shot rn.
2) I still don't know if shooting Galz is the wrong play, I was kind of hoping to talk about it before we just moved off of him.
If we need to select someone else I am actually kind of a fan of having Awaclus choose. Or whatever, but just throwing that idea out there.
If you want to call me scummy for any reason you should probably address how you think the N2 kill was blocked other than EFHW or I blocking it.
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Instead of having DatSwan shoot, we could make Hydrad use his lightning rod tonight instead. I don't like that idea as much though because personally I think Space is scum and Hydrad is town.
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But getting Hydrad NKd is undeniably good for PoE at this point.
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Ya I am town. But at the same time I have been doing terrible this game so me drawing a kill might be the most helpful thing I do lol.
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Ah yes, Galzria could be bulletproof scum.
Who do we think DatSwan should shoot?
OK also, I wanna make it clear of two things:
1) Not saying anything huge, but it was kind of skummy of you to miss that pretty large flaw in the plan. So it has me just slightly suspicious of your motives with assigning my shot rn.
2) I still don't know if shooting Galz is the wrong play, I was kind of hoping to talk about it before we just moved off of him.
If we need to select someone else I am actually kind of a fan of having Awaclus choose. Or whatever, but just throwing that idea out there.
If you want to call me scummy for any reason you should probably address how you think the N2 kill was blocked other than EFHW or I blocking it.
I mean... i said it was a light notion to begin with - but obv if you are skum i also assume EFHW is skum.
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Ah yes, Galzria could be bulletproof scum.
Who do we think DatSwan should shoot?
OK also, I wanna make it clear of two things:
1) Not saying anything huge, but it was kind of skummy of you to miss that pretty large flaw in the plan. So it has me just slightly suspicious of your motives with assigning my shot rn.
2) I still don't know if shooting Galz is the wrong play, I was kind of hoping to talk about it before we just moved off of him.
If we need to select someone else I am actually kind of a fan of having Awaclus choose. Or whatever, but just throwing that idea out there.
If you want to call me scummy for any reason you should probably address how you think the N2 kill was blocked other than EFHW or I blocking it.
I mean... i said it was a light notion to begin with - but obv if you are skum i also assume EFHW is skum.
Can you create a plausible narrative for that?
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Gosh I do not have enough time to put in the necessary brain power for this right now. When is our deadline? It's not like soon is it?
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Sunday.
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Ah yes, Galzria could be bulletproof scum.
Who do we think DatSwan should shoot?
OK also, I wanna make it clear of two things:
1) Not saying anything huge, but it was kind of skummy of you to miss that pretty large flaw in the plan. So it has me just slightly suspicious of your motives with assigning my shot rn.
2) I still don't know if shooting Galz is the wrong play, I was kind of hoping to talk about it before we just moved off of him.
If we need to select someone else I am actually kind of a fan of having Awaclus choose. Or whatever, but just throwing that idea out there.
If you want to call me scummy for any reason you should probably address how you think the N2 kill was blocked other than EFHW or I blocking it.
I mean... i said it was a light notion to begin with - but obv if you are skum i also assume EFHW is skum.
Can you create a plausible narrative for that?
I actually have one that is even remotely not laughable. But as i see no point in risking a lynch on you today I’m gonna keep t to myself for now (sorry)
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Hydrad dying doesn't help that much with POE, since he and Space could both be town. Also, he could be roleblocked and then we might draw the wrong conclusion.
Space, would your role help us in this POE overnight?
Unless Space can help somehow, I think we should not have a specific plan for tonight. If DatSwan is town, he can pick the vig target he thinks is best. I think WIFOM is our friend here.
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I'm ok with an IDP lynch. He is very different this game. He said he's some kind of enabler. It would be good to hear more about that.
Still hoping for an answer to this.
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I'm ok with an IDP lynch. He is very different this game. He said he's some kind of enabler. It would be good to hear more about that.
Still hoping for an answer to this.
A little drunk atm. I'll decide if I want to answer when I'm sober.
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I'm ok with an IDP lynch. He is very different this game. He said he's some kind of enabler. It would be good to hear more about that.
Still hoping for an answer to this.
A little drunk atm. I'll decide if I want to answer when I'm sober.
Decide now! It's more fun! I'm drunk too FWIW
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Hydrad dying doesn't help that much with POE, since he and Space could both be town. Also, he could be roleblocked and then we might draw the wrong conclusion.
Space, would your role help us in this POE overnight?
Unless Space can help somehow, I think we should not have a specific plan for tonight. If DatSwan is town, he can pick the vig target he thinks is best. I think WIFOM is our friend here.
I am OK with that as of right this moment.
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Hydrad dying doesn't help that much with POE, since he and Space could both be town. Also, he could be roleblocked and then we might draw the wrong conclusion.
Space, would your role help us in this POE overnight?
Unless Space can help somehow, I think we should not have a specific plan for tonight. If DatSwan is town, he can pick the vig target he thinks is best. I think WIFOM is our friend here.
I am OK with that as of right this moment.
I mean, that's stupid, OF COURSE you are okay with the plan that gives you maximum flexibility.
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Hydrad dying doesn't help that much with POE, since he and Space could both be town. Also, he could be roleblocked and then we might draw the wrong conclusion.
Space, would your role help us in this POE overnight?
Unless Space can help somehow, I think we should not have a specific plan for tonight. If DatSwan is town, he can pick the vig target he thinks is best. I think WIFOM is our friend here.
I am OK with that as of right this moment.
I mean, that's stupid, OF COURSE you are okay with the plan that gives you maximum flexibility.
I am also OK with the plan I presented before this which was either "Awaclus chooses" or "majority vote chooses".
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Ah yes, Galzria could be bulletproof scum.
Who do we think DatSwan should shoot?
OK also, I wanna make it clear of two things:
1) Not saying anything huge, but it was kind of skummy of you to miss that pretty large flaw in the plan. So it has me just slightly suspicious of your motives with assigning my shot rn.
2) I still don't know if shooting Galz is the wrong play, I was kind of hoping to talk about it before we just moved off of him.
If we need to select someone else I am actually kind of a fan of having Awaclus choose. Or whatever, but just throwing that idea out there.
If you want to call me scummy for any reason you should probably address how you think the N2 kill was blocked other than EFHW or I blocking it.
I mean... i said it was a light notion to begin with - but obv if you are skum i also assume EFHW is skum.
Can you create a plausible narrative for that?
I actually have one that is even remotely not laughable. But as i see no point in risking a lynch on you today I’m gonna keep t to myself for now (sorry)
Lol ok dude
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Hydrad dying doesn't help that much with POE, since he and Space could both be town. Also, he could be roleblocked and then we might draw the wrong conclusion.
Space, would your role help us in this POE overnight?
Unless Space can help somehow, I think we should not have a specific plan for tonight. If DatSwan is town, he can pick the vig target he thinks is best. I think WIFOM is our friend here.
I mean, they are both town only if DatSwan/Galz are scum and gambiting, or I am wrong about Robz/Awaclus. Both are possible but I don't think the likeliest.
I think Hydrad is town. So actually him dying is only helpful for PoE theoretically. So yeah, "no plan" is an okay plan for right now.
Honestly I just wanted to be like Ashersky and break the setup.
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I'd like to hear IDPTG's insight about Awaclus.
I missed something. With so little information in the set-up post, I haven't reread it as much as I normally do so I don't remember it as well. unvote
Idea went poof?
Yeah. Slips aren't slips when they're in the set-up post. I said I had a (1) reason.
What was this about exactly?
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I'm falling behind right now :-( I'm also going straight from work to a game tonight, and it's likely to go on late, meaning I'm likely not to be back here before tomorrow morning my time.
Thoughts while trying to keep up at least a little bit: I don't mind Awaclus being a sort-of-IC, because gkrieg's breadcrumb was quite clear, so barring redirection shenanigans, we can trust that. OTOH, the assumption that Iguana and EFHW are both cleared based on the assumption I/we made about how Eevee probably expected to perform the NK and rid himself of the guilty child role is not so solid. Coincidences happen, weird scum nerfs might happen (I'm more convinced of this now that I see there are several good strong town roles out there), and it's also possible for scum just to have misplayed.
It's also possible that we could have a plot by scum!Iguana and scum!EFHW to sacrifice Eevee (who's a very nervous, not-super-willing scum anyway, as I recall) in order to set themselves up as ICs. Remember that a) we may well have two scums with daychat in Jimmmmm's neighbourhood, and b) scums probably came into the day prepared to claim, so it's possibly even more likely for two scums to have a consistent story than for two towns, given that there's clearly a lot of stuff going on in an RMM that affect everyone's results and perspectives.
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It's also possible that we could have a plot by scum!Iguana and scum!EFHW to sacrifice Eevee (who's a very nervous, not-super-willing scum anyway, as I recall) in order to set themselves up as ICs. Remember that a) we may well have two scums with daychat in Jimmmmm's neighbourhood, and b) scums probably came into the day prepared to claim, so it's possibly even more likely for two scums to have a consistent story than for two towns, given that there's clearly a lot of stuff going on in an RMM that affect everyone's results and perspectives.
IMO Eevee plays pretty well as scum. You should reread him. He was not playing this game like he wanted to get outed on D3.
Also, here's the claim order:
IDPTG
Hydrad
iguanaiguana
EFHW
Galzria
Space
Robz
DatSwan
If EFHW and I are both scum and this were a gambit, how are we supposed to know that there aren't 1-2 MORE protective roles in the group of Galz/Space/Robz/DatSwan. What makes claiming double protective roles safe for us? We could have ended up in a situation where we had 4-5 claimed protective roles and it was obvious that scum was among some of them. Also, we would have had no way of knowing beforehand that no one else would claim any legitimate way that the N2 kill was blocked, so the payoff for such a gambit would have been too small. Only if we were near the bottom of the claim order could our claims be considered suspicious.
Also, from a setup balance perspective, 4/14 mafia with three protective roles (Iguana, EFHW, Jim) makes sense but 4/14 mafia with a single 1-shot bulletproofer as the only protective role doesn't make a lick of sense. If we are BOTH scum and BOTH lying, then this game doesn't have any kind of nightly doctoring/roleblocking/etc. type role and the list of town PRs also looks really weak. The setup you are proposing is unbalanced.
The weakest "IC" is Robz. He's just probably town. Anyone who doesn't see that EFHW and I are town is either scum or hasn't thought about it hard enough yet.
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I'd like to hear IDPTG's insight about Awaclus.
I missed something. With so little information in the set-up post, I haven't reread it as much as I normally do so I don't remember it as well. unvote
Idea went poof?
Yeah. Slips aren't slips when they're in the set-up post. I said I had a (1) reason.
What was this about exactly?
I thought there was a scumslip. Upon rereading, it wasn't.
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Well, Galz and DS COULD both be scum, and hydrad and Space COULD both be scum, but yeah it's not super likely.
Why is EFHW town again? I believe you, I just don't remember.
EFHW and I should both be LIKELY town because we both protected each other on N2 when Eevee likely tried to shoot someone and failed. If DatSwan is scum and Galzria is town, then Galzria is likely bulletproof (because he probably detected Jim targeting him N1) and Eevee could have then shot Galzria and then in that case EFHW & Iguana wouldn't be cleared. In that case, we still should be considered town just because we have both been very towny. If DatSwan is town, then his result that Jim didn't bulletproof anyone N1 is likely correct and we should be both towny and cleared by results.
This is ridiculous. You're claiming that I'm scum by PoE but you're town because you and EFHW claim to have protected each other? If I accept that you two targeted each other, where's the proof that they were both protective roles?
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I do find it likely that Jim would use his bulletproof N1 on Galzria. If he town read Galz, then Galz is an obvious choice as a popular night kill.
Oh wait, town!Galz couldn't have been NK'd by Eevee because he would have detected Eevee targeting him that night. So EFHW really really should be town.
Scum!Robz wouldn't have vanillaized scum's choice for who to lynch D2 (and McMc was clearly their top lynch choice, considering how much he was pushed. I should probably go get evidence for that assertion......) So Robz really should be town.
Awaclus got copped, so he really should be town.....
SO
We have Galz/DatSwan = probably one scum
Hydrad / Space = probably one scum by default because we are out of spots for both to be town and it's very unlikely that they both planned to claim neighbors and both are scum.
IDP = scum, because he's the only spot left to put scum somewhere.
This is the best bit. You've got two "probably" statements and one is even followed by more hypothetical analysis but you end up with a concrete conclusion. If any one of your earlier assumptions is is wrong, your "case" on me falls apart since it's built on nothing more than PoE.
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I can confirm that I have received the benefit iguana describes. I am the Liver. I also have a protective type role, and have been protecting iguana.
This is even more vague than my claim and I really don't see how it would verify EFHW as town. Any scum role that targets a person can look like protection as long as scum never NKs the person they're targeting. Iguana, what's your reason to think that EFHW is basically conf!town because of this?
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I'm ok with an IDP lynch. He is very different this game. He said he's some kind of enabler. It would be good to hear more about that.
Still hoping for an answer to this.
Not happening yet. I had my reasons for keeping it quiet and they're still valid.
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Well, Galz and DS COULD both be scum, and hydrad and Space COULD both be scum, but yeah it's not super likely.
Why is EFHW town again? I believe you, I just don't remember.
EFHW and I should both be LIKELY town because we both protected each other on N2 when Eevee likely tried to shoot someone and failed. If DatSwan is scum and Galzria is town, then Galzria is likely bulletproof (because he probably detected Jim targeting him N1) and Eevee could have then shot Galzria and then in that case EFHW & Iguana wouldn't be cleared. In that case, we still should be considered town just because we have both been very towny. If DatSwan is town, then his result that Jim didn't bulletproof anyone N1 is likely correct and we should be both towny and cleared by results.
This is ridiculous. You're claiming that I'm scum by PoE but you're town because you and EFHW claim to have protected each other? If I accept that you two targeted each other, where's the proof that they were both protective roles?
We blocked a kill. Also see my response to Space above.
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Well, Galz and DS COULD both be scum, and hydrad and Space COULD both be scum, but yeah it's not super likely.
Why is EFHW town again? I believe you, I just don't remember.
EFHW and I should both be LIKELY town because we both protected each other on N2 when Eevee likely tried to shoot someone and failed. If DatSwan is scum and Galzria is town, then Galzria is likely bulletproof (because he probably detected Jim targeting him N1) and Eevee could have then shot Galzria and then in that case EFHW & Iguana wouldn't be cleared. In that case, we still should be considered town just because we have both been very towny. If DatSwan is town, then his result that Jim didn't bulletproof anyone N1 is likely correct and we should be both towny and cleared by results.
This is ridiculous. You're claiming that I'm scum by PoE but you're town because you and EFHW claim to have protected each other? If I accept that you two targeted each other, where's the proof that they were both protective roles?
We blocked a kill. Also see my response to Space above.
You claim to have targeted two different people, so only one of you did any real blocking assuming that's the reason the N2 kill didn't go through. I never said you're both scum, just that claiming you're both town because a kill was blocked is absurd. You never addressed the possibility of only one of you being scum, just either both of you as town or both as scum.
Why are you so convinced EFHW is town?
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Your PoE case seems to revolve around everyone telling the truth....which definitely didn't happen.
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Well, Galz and DS COULD both be scum, and hydrad and Space COULD both be scum, but yeah it's not super likely.
Why is EFHW town again? I believe you, I just don't remember.
EFHW and I should both be LIKELY town because we both protected each other on N2 when Eevee likely tried to shoot someone and failed. If DatSwan is scum and Galzria is town, then Galzria is likely bulletproof (because he probably detected Jim targeting him N1) and Eevee could have then shot Galzria and then in that case EFHW & Iguana wouldn't be cleared. In that case, we still should be considered town just because we have both been very towny. If DatSwan is town, then his result that Jim didn't bulletproof anyone N1 is likely correct and we should be both towny and cleared by results.
This is ridiculous. You're claiming that I'm scum by PoE but you're town because you and EFHW claim to have protected each other? If I accept that you two targeted each other, where's the proof that they were both protective roles?
We blocked a kill. Also see my response to Space above.
You claim to have targeted two different people, so only one of you did any real blocking assuming that's the reason the N2 kill didn't go through. I never said you're both scum, just that claiming you're both town because a kill was blocked is absurd. You never addressed the possibility of only one of you being scum, just either both of you as town or both as scum.
Why are you so convinced EFHW is town?
Because either they shot her and I blocked it or they shot me and she blocked it. It takes two people to block a kill.
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Your PoE case seems to revolve around everyone telling the truth....which definitely didn't happen.
You'll need to refute his answer to Space to be taken seriously. This has been the topic of pages of discussion already.
vote: IDPTG
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Your PoE case seems to revolve around everyone telling the truth....which definitely didn't happen.
You'll need to refute his answer to Space to be taken seriously. This has been the topic of pages of discussion already.
vote: IDPTG
I think his point is that if one of you/iguana is skum, then you are most likely lying - the logic that someone needs to be able to refute the case is a moot point... the argument is “someone is lying”.
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Sorry all - didn't have the time I thought I would yesterday afternoon. My day today looks pretty busy at the moment as well, but I'll really really really try to get some time set aside for this evening.
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Idp what is your skum pool rn?
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Btw all i am mobile only for the rest of the game day - I’ll have constant access but sorry for typos and shit in advance.
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Your PoE case seems to revolve around everyone telling the truth....which definitely didn't happen.
You'll need to refute his answer to Space to be taken seriously. This has been the topic of pages of discussion already.
vote: IDPTG
I think his point is that if one of you/iguana is skum, then you are most likely lying - the logic that someone needs to be able to refute the case is a moot point... the argument is “someone is lying”.
Dude... if she is scum and I am town, who blocked the N2 kill? I mean, seriously, explain that. You yourself claim Jim didn't use his bulletproof on anyone. No one else has claimed a protecting action.
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Your PoE case seems to revolve around everyone telling the truth....which definitely didn't happen.
You'll need to refute his answer to Space to be taken seriously. This has been the topic of pages of discussion already.
vote: IDPTG
I think his point is that if one of you/iguana is skum, then you are most likely lying - the logic that someone needs to be able to refute the case is a moot point... the argument is “someone is lying”.
Dude... if she is scum and I am town, who blocked the N2 kill? I mean, seriously, explain that. You yourself claim Jim didn't use his bulletproof on anyone. No one else has claimed a protecting action.
Dude ...
1) skum is lying has an rb and they blocked me n1
2) whatever IDP is “enabling” could play a part
3) spaces unknown shot could have something to do with it
The only one that i know is an option is number 1. But just saying... there are possible ways. I’m not like pushing for EFHW or you at this point, i just don’t want the concept “you both have to be Town” to be generally accepted bc it is false.
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Your PoE case seems to revolve around everyone telling the truth....which definitely didn't happen.
You'll need to refute his answer to Space to be taken seriously. This has been the topic of pages of discussion already.
vote: IDPTG
His answer to Space has nothing to do with what I said there.
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Can you settle for, we are town, all that stuff you said is a lot less likely than the simple explanation that scum shot one of us because we were (and still are ) very towny players and we ended up protecting each other for the same reason? We both decided to fight a mislynch and push a correct lynch the day before... the explanation that we are both town makes clear sense whereas the resistance to it sounds conspiratorial. Huh, it's almost as if the scum team doesn't want the other townies to accept that there are two IC-level townies who can protect each other at night.
Also, what is your end goal here? Do you seriously think IDP is towny at this point? If so, why? Do you understand why it isn't easy for the rest of us to sort between you and Galz and therefore finding someone else who is likely to be scum is better?
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Well, Galz and DS COULD both be scum, and hydrad and Space COULD both be scum, but yeah it's not super likely.
Why is EFHW town again? I believe you, I just don't remember.
EFHW and I should both be LIKELY town because we both protected each other on N2 when Eevee likely tried to shoot someone and failed. If DatSwan is scum and Galzria is town, then Galzria is likely bulletproof (because he probably detected Jim targeting him N1) and Eevee could have then shot Galzria and then in that case EFHW & Iguana wouldn't be cleared. In that case, we still should be considered town just because we have both been very towny. If DatSwan is town, then his result that Jim didn't bulletproof anyone N1 is likely correct and we should be both towny and cleared by results.
This is ridiculous. You're claiming that I'm scum by PoE but you're town because you and EFHW claim to have protected each other? If I accept that you two targeted each other, where's the proof that they were both protective roles?
We blocked a kill. Also see my response to Space above.
You claim to have targeted two different people, so only one of you did any real blocking assuming that's the reason the N2 kill didn't go through. I never said you're both scum, just that claiming you're both town because a kill was blocked is absurd. You never addressed the possibility of only one of you being scum, just either both of you as town or both as scum.
Why are you so convinced EFHW is town?
Because either they shot her and I blocked it or they shot me and she blocked it. It takes two people to block a kill.
I disagree that it takes two people to block a kill, but I acknowledge I hadn't completely thought through the one scum/one town scenario for the two of you. A blocked kill suggests both town, but only if that really is why there was no kill. There are scenarios where the kill went elsewhere and was still blocked because, as I implied earlier, scum is probably lying.
PPE: Iguana, what's your actual case on me?
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Your PoE case seems to revolve around everyone telling the truth....which definitely didn't happen.
You'll need to refute his answer to Space to be taken seriously. This has been the topic of pages of discussion already.
vote: IDPTG
His answer to Space has nothing to do with what I said there.
I don't even think everyone is telling the truth. I am just looking at occam's razor and sorting what is highly likely and makes sense from absurd conspiracy theory level stuff.
Not everyone is lying... but only three people are... and I was able to deduce a lot from that.
But I did go back and read you to be sure and you habe not been towny at all. I was wrong about you D1 as I often am.
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PPE: Iguana, what's your actual case on me?
Besides the amazing PoE like what is rarely seen in mafia?
You have a scummy, dodgy claim that gives you no accountability to show or prove anything that's happened this game.
You are frequently mislynched because you are misunderstood, but this game you've flown under the radar all game until now when I started tunneling you.
When you voted, you voted either for unpopular options that gained little traction and had no account, or you voted for mislynches. You helped push McMc over the line D2 right when I started to really push hard for Eevee to be lynched instead.
You have a suspiciously low level of interaction with the other suspect players in the game... namely DatSwan, Galzria, and Space. Two of those three are likely your partners and there's nothing to indicate that any of them are unlikely partners with you.
When I started pushing your case, several people who are likely to be scum started agitating and coming up with conspiracy theories about an EFHW/Iguana scum team in order to discredit me and therefore defend you, but without ever saying anything about you directly.
ALL OF THAT IS SCUMMY
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PPE: Iguana, what's your actual case on me?
Besides the amazing PoE like what is rarely seen in mafia?
You have a scummy, dodgy claim that gives you no accountability to show or prove anything that's happened this game.
You are frequently mislynched because you are misunderstood, but this game you've flown under the radar all game until now when I started tunneling you.
When you voted, you voted either for unpopular options that gained little traction and had no account, or you voted for mislynches. You helped push McMc over the line D2 right when I started to really push hard for Eevee to be lynched instead.
You have a suspiciously low level of interaction with the other suspect players in the game... namely DatSwan, Galzria, and Space. Two of those three are likely your partners and there's nothing to indicate that any of them are unlikely partners with you.
When I started pushing your case, several people who are likely to be scum started agitating and coming up with conspiracy theories about an EFHW/Iguana scum team in order to discredit me and therefore defend you, but without ever saying anything about you directly.
ALL OF THAT IS SCUMMY
It's not that great.
If you knew what it was, you'd understand why I'm hedging.
That's false. I'm almost never mislynched. Misunderstood, maybe, but lynched because of it? Never. Unless someone can prove me wrong, I've been lynched four times (if I weren't on my phone, I'd pull the game numbers): D1 in LOST Mafia (mislynch, wasn't very active), D1 in whichever one you modded (mislynch, again, wasn't very active), D1 some time in July 2017 (correct lynch, I had a terrible post that sealed my fate and town jumped on it), and D3 in the game where Robz found 2 scum with 2 Cop shots (correct lynch, replaced into a Cop with a guilty result on me).
We've established I'm not very good at this game. I had the lowest winrate on f.ds for a time and I still probably do (barring players with <3 games). My only victories have come after my mislynch. Arguably my very presence is anti-town.
If they were my partners, why would I have avoided talking to them especially when I've been making an effort to talk more?
They probably didn't say anything about me because they're not defending me...
Also, I don't think we've played enough together where you weren't scum to say you misread me "often".
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I do find it likely that Jim would use his bulletproof N1 on Galzria. If he town read Galz, then Galz is an obvious choice as a popular night kill.
Oh wait, town!Galz couldn't have been NK'd by Eevee because he would have detected Eevee targeting him that night. So EFHW really really should be town.
Ascetic blocks Cops, does it not? I wouldn't be surprised if it also blocks Reflexive Cops (faust hasn't answered me).
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I do find it likely that Jim would use his bulletproof N1 on Galzria. If he town read Galz, then Galz is an obvious choice as a popular night kill.
Oh wait, town!Galz couldn't have been NK'd by Eevee because he would have detected Eevee targeting him that night. So EFHW really really should be town.
Ascetic blocks Cops, does it not? I wouldn't be surprised if it also blocks Reflexive Cops (faust hasn't answered me).
Are you trying to build a case for me or EFHW being scum? What do you actually think? Who is your top scum read?
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I do find it likely that Jim would use his bulletproof N1 on Galzria. If he town read Galz, then Galz is an obvious choice as a popular night kill.
Oh wait, town!Galz couldn't have been NK'd by Eevee because he would have detected Eevee targeting him that night. So EFHW really really should be town.
Ascetic blocks Cops, does it not? I wouldn't be surprised if it also blocks Reflexive Cops (faust hasn't answered me).
Are you trying to build a case for me or EFHW being scum? What do you actually think? Who is your top scum read?
Neither at the moment. Guilty conscience much?
I'm still working that out.
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I do find it likely that Jim would use his bulletproof N1 on Galzria. If he town read Galz, then Galz is an obvious choice as a popular night kill.
Oh wait, town!Galz couldn't have been NK'd by Eevee because he would have detected Eevee targeting him that night. So EFHW really really should be town.
Ascetic blocks Cops, does it not? I wouldn't be surprised if it also blocks Reflexive Cops (faust hasn't answered me).
Are you trying to build a case for me or EFHW being scum? What do you actually think? Who is your top scum read?
Neither at the moment. Guilty conscience much?
I'm still working that out.
Lol
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I do find it likely that Jim would use his bulletproof N1 on Galzria. If he town read Galz, then Galz is an obvious choice as a popular night kill.
Oh wait, town!Galz couldn't have been NK'd by Eevee because he would have detected Eevee targeting him that night. So EFHW really really should be town.
Ascetic blocks Cops, does it not? I wouldn't be surprised if it also blocks Reflexive Cops (faust hasn't answered me).
I doubt it, but what if it did?
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I do find it likely that Jim would use his bulletproof N1 on Galzria. If he town read Galz, then Galz is an obvious choice as a popular night kill.
Oh wait, town!Galz couldn't have been NK'd by Eevee because he would have detected Eevee targeting him that night. So EFHW really really should be town.
Ascetic blocks Cops, does it not? I wouldn't be surprised if it also blocks Reflexive Cops (faust hasn't answered me).
I doubt it, but what if it did?
It means that Galz may have been the N2 NK target and still be telling the truth about his results.
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Request prod on Awaclus.
Deadline is in ~30 hours. If you haven't voted yet, you should.
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Can you settle for, we are town, all that stuff you said is a lot less likely than the simple explanation that scum shot one of us because we were (and still are ) very towny players and we ended up protecting each other for the same reason? We both decided to fight a mislynch and push a correct lynch the day before... the explanation that we are both town makes clear sense whereas the resistance to it sounds conspiratorial. Huh, it's almost as if the scum team doesn't want the other townies to accept that there are two IC-level townies who can protect each other at night.
Also, what is your end goal here? Do you seriously think IDP is towny at this point? If so, why? Do you understand why it isn't easy for the rest of us to sort between you and Galz and therefore finding someone else who is likely to be scum is better?
1) I absolutely accept it is more likely you are town.
2) i also do not think idp is towny at this point, i just was attempting to clarify something i thought was being mis interpreted before... it didn’t matter who was saying it.
3) yes i get the sorting is hard and i am purposely not really pushing Galz rn for exactly that reason.
What i have been attempting to do is cultivate conversation and this “what if scenario” is all i have to go on. At first your over defensive attitude towards it pinged me - but after more than enough time to solve night actions... i am forced to find it more likely you are town than skum
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Vote Count 4.3
Galzria (2): Robz888, Hydrad
DatSwan (1): Galzria
IDontPlayThisGame (2): iguanaiguana, EFHW
Not Voting (4): Awaclus, SpaceAnemone, DatSwan, IDontPlayThisGame
With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. Day 4 ends June 24, 2018, 03:00:00 am. That is in 23 hours.
Awaclus has been prodded.
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theres also the thought of iguana and efhw always protecting each other. plus efhw can doctor one extra person. so its like we have 3 doctors with 2 semi-ICs not being able to be killed. which seems pretty good. POE alone might win us the game with that.
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theres also the thought of iguana and efhw always protecting each other. plus efhw can doctor one extra person. so its like we have 3 doctors with 2 semi-ICs not being able to be killed. which seems pretty good. POE alone might win us the game with that.
Yeah I was considering that at first (before getting into the paranoid stuff)... it was actually the thought that led me to the paranoia lol. Cuz like if they are both skum, then they can just claim that obviously skum isn't shooting them because they know they are double shielding. But I am, at least for now given up on that, and hopefully PoE will just pan out well for us.
What are your thoughts on IDP?
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hi
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hi
Dude you are not even playing. At least vote or you should replace out.
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hi
Dude you are not even playing. At least vote or you should replace out.
Have you never played a game with Awaclus before?
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I'm a bit behind, has IDP full claimed yet? He should do so.
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I'm a bit behind, has IDP full claimed yet? He should do so.
Nope. Neither has Space or EFHW for that matter.
Iguana, do you still think there's at least one scum in Galz/DatSwan?
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I'm a bit behind, has IDP full claimed yet? He should do so.
Nope. Neither has Space or EFHW for that matter.
Iguana, do you still think there's at least one scum in Galz/DatSwan?
We're not lynching Space or EFHW here, though.
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I'm a bit behind, has IDP full claimed yet? He should do so.
Nope. Neither has Space or EFHW for that matter.
Iguana, do you still think there's at least one scum in Galz/DatSwan?
Definitely at least one.
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I'm a bit behind, has IDP full claimed yet? He should do so.
Nope. Neither has Space or EFHW for that matter.
Iguana, do you still think there's at least one scum in Galz/DatSwan?
Definitely at least one.
What do you think of Galz's analysis of scum!DatSwan as a Vig?
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I am hopeful that night actions may make it more clear which people are telling the truth later. Particularly with Galz/DatSwan
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But I do agree with Galzria that if we lynch town today, going full protective mode to prevent scum getting two kills is a smart move.
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vote: DatSwan
Despite disagreeing with iguana's PoE, I do think there's a chance he's the scum in the Galz/Swan pairing and a scum!Vig is a little too dangerous here to risk. I also don't believe that Jim held his shot.
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hi
Dude you are not even playing. At least vote or you should replace out.
I am playing.
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vote: DatSwan
Despite disagreeing with iguana's PoE, I do think there's a chance he's the scum in the Galz/Swan pairing and a scum!Vig is a little too dangerous here to risk. I also don't believe that Jim held his shot.
Now see *that* doesn’t make sense. I was last to claim... all the BS surrounding Galz and botching the claim and whatever set aside... what possible reason would any skum player have to fake claim Vig? It’s like the easiest role to verify.
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Actually yeah, i didn’t really think about it at first but given my place in the draft Vig should essentially absolve me... or at the very damn minimum put me ahead of Galz.
Vote: IDPTG
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I believe that's L-2.
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Robz/Hydrad - are you both still intent on Galz? Thoughts on his response? Thoughts on IDplay as an alternative?
If I am right about you two being town, we will need to agree on a lynch.
But if you are both town and so is Galz, then scum could have easily hammered. I was voting at one point, so if even one of you is town, they may have credibly ended the day at some point if Galz were town...
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Actually yeah, i didn’t really think about it at first but given my place in the draft Vig should essentially absolve me... or at the very damn minimum put me ahead of Galz.
Vote: IDPTG
It would be really nice if you shot someone scummy for us, yes :)
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Robz/Hydrad - are you both still intent on Galz? Thoughts on his response? Thoughts on IDplay as an alternative?
If I am right about you two being town, we will need to agree on a lynch.
But if you are both town and so is Galz, then scum could have easily hammered. I was voting at one point, so if even one of you is town, they may have credibly ended the day at some point if Galz were town...
I've said before that I'm fine with a IDPTG lynch. I just didn't move my vote so that we would get more talking time.
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Obviously I'd move to Galz to keep myself alive.
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Why did Swan pick Jimmmmm for investigation N1, if indeed that's what he's claiming? It's oddly convenient.
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I'm not at all comfortable with the assumption that faust has put together a game where two townie protective roles can support each other indefinitely and become untouchable, and that's the scenario iguana is describing here.
I think I'm townreading iguana now, having done a load of re-reading, but assuming it is town!iguana, I think he's settled on a comfortable scenario that makes sense to him and I worry he's overlooking details like the issue above, which don't support it.
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I'm not at all comfortable with the assumption that faust has put together a game where two townie protective roles can support each other indefinitely and become untouchable, and that's the scenario iguana is describing here.
I think I'm townreading iguana now, having done a load of re-reading, but assuming it is town!iguana, I think he's settled on a comfortable scenario that makes sense to him and I worry he's overlooking details like the issue above, which don't support it.
Where did I say that I have a townread on DatSwan? I've said I think the smartest course of action is to give DatSwan to prove he is the PR he says he is by lynching scum today and giving him a chance to shoot another scum. Failing that, I think we should go full protective and make sure scum only gets one kill so we get another chance tomorrow.
I do see suspicious aspects both to DatSwan's and Galzria's claims. So given the 50/50 it seems to be there, I don't think it's as smart as lynching someone who I believe has higher chances of being scum, IDPTG.
I've also never said that I think that EFHW and I can protect each other indefinitely. Other people have said that, sure, but not me. All I've said is that I don't see a way that the N2 scum kill was blocked other than EFHW or I protecting it, making the most likely scenario that EFHW and I are both town.
Note that having several layers of protective roles in a game makes it less likely that any particular player gets IC'd because of being protected from the NK. It's just the way it turned out.
The ways that you've described for EFHW to be scum are very much fringe cases. The explanation I am seeing is much simpler and more likely, and it's hard for me to see why you can't accept that.
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Some reasoning about the game state.
Scum has known all along that Eevee would be outed D3 if he lived. D1 they actually didn't bus him at all: it was just my RVS vote, and a little from LL and mcmc; nobody else voted him that day, and those two have already flipped town. If anyone scumreads me for that, you should ask yourself about why I was resolutely not on the Eevee wagon D2 when it would have looked so much more townie to be there.
Let's assume scum's roles are all things that either trap them into being discovered, or possibly screw with their ability to kill effectively. For this reason, let's assume that Jimmmmm and gkrieg were killed by different scums, ridding the scumteam of two problem roles on the first two nights. So scums 1 and 2 got rid of bad roles, and for some reason Eevee (scum #3) didn't kill N3. Maybe scum #4's power interfered, but maybe it just felt to the scumteam like it put them in a better position if they let Eevee fall, having set things up well on D2. Scum #4's role could have been auto-death if they hadn't killed yet, and/or a nerf like the first time they kill, they steal a role but the player doesn't die. If I'd been designing this game (with the assumption that what we have is decent townie actions roles and high scum numbers with nerfy roles to drive their behaviour), then that's the sort of thing I'd think about.
If this is at all accurate, I think it would be good to reexamine the people on the D2 Eevee wagon, because if the scum-team was setting up to bus, then the people voting Eevee should be a mixture of people genuinely scumreading him, and scums setting up to look townie if/when the guilty child stuff kicks in.
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Why did Swan pick Jimmmmm for investigation N1, if indeed that's what he's claiming? It's oddly convenient.
Go read my D1. He was tied for top skum read.
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@EFHW, could you clarify who was protected by your role N2 and N3?
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Vote: IDPTG
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Some reasoning about the game state.
Scum has known all along that Eevee would be outed D3 if he lived. D1 they actually didn't bus him at all: it was just my RVS vote, and a little from LL and mcmc; nobody else voted him that day, and those two have already flipped town. If anyone scumreads me for that, you should ask yourself about why I was resolutely not on the Eevee wagon D2 when it would have looked so much more townie to be there.
Let's assume scum's roles are all things that either trap them into being discovered, or possibly screw with their ability to kill effectively. For this reason, let's assume that Jimmmmm and gkrieg were killed by different scums, ridding the scumteam of two problem roles on the first two nights. So scums 1 and 2 got rid of bad roles, and for some reason Eevee (scum #3) didn't kill N3. Maybe scum #4's power interfered, but maybe it just felt to the scumteam like it put them in a better position if they let Eevee fall, having set things up well on D2. Scum #4's role could have been auto-death if they hadn't killed yet, and/or a nerf like the first time they kill, they steal a role but the player doesn't die. If I'd been designing this game (with the assumption that what we have is decent townie actions roles and high scum numbers with nerfy roles to drive their behaviour), then that's the sort of thing I'd think about.
If this is at all accurate, I think it would be good to reexamine the people on the D2 Eevee wagon, because if the scum-team was setting up to bus, then the people voting Eevee should be a mixture of people genuinely scumreading him, and scums setting up to look townie if/when the guilty child stuff kicks in.
So i want to start this off by saying I think that it is probably far more likely that Eevee just tries to carry the kill and attacked a protected player. However, as i have spent the majority of the day accepting that while still pursuing my less than likely avenues... here are some thoughts on your thoughts:
1) Final Wagon was [II, EFHW, MCMC, Galz, Robz].
2) Galz obv was pushing Eevee as skum all the way from day1. Which is weird in your scenario, but also i do think it seemed genuine. So Idk.
3) if you want disingenuous eevee wagoing this is a pretty damn good starting point:This is going to sound dumb at this point, but I've been turning around on gkrieg. He defended himself really well, reminding me a lot of when I pushed his lynch in jungle oligarchy and I was wrong about him. I'm not 100% he's town and still have a lot of misgivings about how much my tunnel was discredited. But sometimes my reads really do suck so there is that.
Vote: Eevee
That being said at the end II essentially refuses to switch to the Eevee wagon.
3) Robz and EFHW bounce around.
4) and we know now that MCMC was town.
First off this approach, Space, is based on some pretty large speculations regarding roles. However, if you are correct- it appears Galz and II would be the re read candidates.
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2) Galz obv was pushing Eevee as skum all the way from day1. Which is weird in your scenario, but also i do think it seemed genuine. So Idk.
For reference, Galz spent most of D1 not voting for anyone, joined the mcmc wagon briefly, unvoted, then moved to the LL wagon in 4th position, and stayed there till the lynch.
That being said at the end II essentially refuses to switch to the Eevee wagon.
I think Iguana is unlikely to be scum without EFHW also being scum, because of the way she backed up his motivator thing before it had been claimed.
First off this approach, Space, is based on some pretty large speculations regarding roles.
This is fair, but I'm also taking my confirmed "bad IC" theory about Eevee (when others were coming up with more wild explanations for the D3 info on him) as minor evidence that I might be thinking along the right sort of lines. If a role like yours, or some others we've seen, falls into scum hands, they don't need powerful scum PRs of their own. I think the interesting thing to do is to give them roles that force them to take turns making the kills, and to have to spend time trying to figure out which townies have scum-useful roles, and which have protective stuff that they're not so interested in acquiring.
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Any thoughts on IDP, Space? I can't remember you talking about him and now here he sits nearly lynched.
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Any thoughts on IDP, Space? I can't remember you talking about him and now here he sits nearly lynched.
I actually have remarkably little opinion on him either in a townie direction or a scummy one. He's worth a reread, certainly. It's getting really late for me, but I guess with no vote then I'm off the hook as far as needing to be there for deadline... that's good, because 8am on a Sunday morning is not a time of the week that exists in Space-space!
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IDP re-read... I'm getting so sleepy I'm almost nodding off at my laptop and it's well after 2am, so I'm going to have to call it a night now :-(
Early on is a bunch of engagement with Awaclus, which is a good way to keep a post count up and get pretty much nowhere.
Calls me scummy, not very long after having said that something else I'd said was NAI, in response to Robz's case.
Is #416 the thing where he later says he thought he'd found a scum-slip but then it wasn't?
Agrees with me over Jimmmm, then votes me not very long after over LL.
Jumps onto my mcmc case (the wagon was already building, but he was specifically agreeing with me) at #582. Obviously my case was wrong, but was expect some scums to want to play along with it.
Third place on the D3 Eevee wagon, saying "It be hilarious if Eevee is town. Just saying." There are worlds in which that could be defined as a forced-sounding statement.
#861 "How did Awaclus become an IC?" Non-partner tell, I think, though not so relevant while Awaclus is considered sort-of-IC.
I sympathise with the desire not to fullclaim. The fact he's the only person worrying openly about scum having their pick of PRs is a bit worrying for the rest of us, really!
His later D4 argument with iguana looks like he's reading into things badly: Iguana points out that IDP comments on one claim but not another, then IDP asks where he said he wasn't commenting on the other, which is not how "not commenting" works.. I can see why that might rub Iguana up the worng way.
I certainly agree that a POE argument with so little sure evidence out there is not a strong one to make. Iguana has already gone wrong on that once this game with gkrieg.
Not sure what to make of his lack of thinking through the "two people protecting each other" thing from the side where one of them might be scum. I could clearly see what iguana was saying, because I'd gone through similar thought processes myself as a town trying to think it through, so perhaps it's a sign that IDP wasn't going through the same process. I think it's moderatley weak evidence, though.
His point at #1099 about ascetic blocking reflexive cops is solid.
My conclusion is still that I'm in two minds about him. I can certainly see stuff there that could easily fit with a scummy motivation, but I don't think it's clear at all, and I'm not fond of using POE so much as a lynch case.
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2) Galz obv was pushing Eevee as skum all the way from day1. Which is weird in your scenario, but also i do think it seemed genuine. So Idk.
For reference, Galz spent most of D1 not voting for anyone, joined the mcmc wagon briefly, unvoted, then moved to the LL wagon in 4th position, and stayed there till the lynch.
That being said at the end II essentially refuses to switch to the Eevee wagon.
I think Iguana is unlikely to be scum without EFHW also being scum, because of the way she backed up his motivator thing before it had been claimed.
First off this approach, Space, is based on some pretty large speculations regarding roles.
This is fair, but I'm also taking my confirmed "bad IC" theory about Eevee (when others were coming up with more wild explanations for the D3 info on him) as minor evidence that I might be thinking along the right sort of lines. If a role like yours, or some others we've seen, falls into scum hands, they don't need powerful scum PRs of their own. I think the interesting thing to do is to give them roles that force them to take turns making the kills, and to have to spend time trying to figure out which townies have scum-useful roles, and which have protective stuff that they're not so interested in acquiring.
So i will be sitting at poker tables for the next week and i am the worst at phone posting, but if memory serves Galz was full board that eevee was skum in early days.
I agree that if specifically ii is skum then efhw almost def be skum to.
And i like your theory, and have problem brainstorming it, but in he end it is speculation (just like everything else tbf)
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@EFHW, could you clarify who was protected by your role N2 and N3?
I have protected iguana every night. N3 I protected a second person. I don't think it's helpful to say who.
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@EFHW, could you clarify who was protected by your role N2 and N3?
I have protected iguana every night. N3 I protected a second person. I don't think it's helpful to say who.
It was probably me since I'm basically always going to be MVP and am the greatest at the game. Thanks efhw.
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On a more serious note I'm ready to lynch idtpg. I think that should still happen.
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Also dat should shoot as town just so that he doesn't die with a shot available right? So the scum can't big and end the game right away.
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If we lynch town and vig shots town do we lose tomorrow if scum also kills a town? I'm unable to check our count right now
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If idp is Town i don’t THINK i should shoot bc that’s game over if it is mislynch plus Vig miss plus nk - someone tell me i am wrong if i am wrong
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Someone tell me i am wrong if i am wrong bc my gameplan rn is absolutely to hold my shot if the lynch flips town
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Also Galz outside of me what is your skum pool rn
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Awaclus, why did you put IDPTG first and why did you put DatSwan last in the claiming order?
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If Idplay is town, then DatSwan should hold his shot and Hydrad should prolly lightning rod.
If idplay is scum, Datswan should shoot and no Hydralightning.
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If Idplay is town, then DatSwan should hold his shot and Hydrad should prolly lightning rod.
If idplay is scum, Datswan should shoot and no Hydralightning.
I agree i should not shoot but i think there is a 0% chance that Hydrad is skum at this point so the second part is ok but i hate it
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If Idplay is town, then DatSwan should hold his shot and Hydrad should prolly lightning rod.
If idplay is scum, Datswan should shoot and no Hydralightning.
I agree i should not shoot but i think there is a 0% chance that Hydrad is skum at this point so the second part is ok but i hate it
Its designed to protect us against a potential scum!you, so I get that you hate it as either alignment
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If Idplay is town, then DatSwan should hold his shot and Hydrad should prolly lightning rod.
If idplay is scum, Datswan should shoot and no Hydralightning.
I agree i should not shoot but i think there is a 0% chance that Hydrad is skum at this point so the second part is ok but i hate it
Its designed to protect us against a potential scum!you, so I get that you hate it as either alignment
Not like you bro - sloppy. No one is ever skum in my position and also a Vig.
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It also has the benefit of forcing the scum who does the kill to take his used up role instead of like your PR, so it protects us against town!you getting killed too.
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If town me doesn’t shoot bc idp flips town ... they are still gonna shoot me you get that right?
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I do find it likely that Jim would use his bulletproof N1 on Galzria. If he town read Galz, then Galz is an obvious choice as a popular night kill.
Oh wait, town!Galz couldn't have been NK'd by Eevee because he would have detected Eevee targeting him that night. So EFHW really really should be town.
Ascetic blocks Cops, does it not? I wouldn't be surprised if it also blocks Reflexive Cops (faust hasn't answered me).
I doubt it, but what if it did?
It means that Galz may have been the N2 NK target and still be telling the truth about his results.
Did you get an answer to this?
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If town me doesn’t shoot bc idp flips town ... they are still gonna shoot me you get that right?
See above. we can protect you with hydralightning. It should be above anything they can do action resolution wise
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I do find it likely that Jim would use his bulletproof N1 on Galzria. If he town read Galz, then Galz is an obvious choice as a popular night kill.
Oh wait, town!Galz couldn't have been NK'd by Eevee because he would have detected Eevee targeting him that night. So EFHW really really should be town.
Ascetic blocks Cops, does it not? I wouldn't be surprised if it also blocks Reflexive Cops (faust hasn't answered me).
I doubt it, but what if it did?
It means that Galz may have been the N2 NK target and still be telling the truth about his results.
Did you get an answer to this?
Faust said he won't answer.
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If Idplay is town, then DatSwan should hold his shot and Hydrad should prolly lightning rod.
If idplay is scum, Datswan should shoot and no Hydralightning.
I agree i should not shoot but i think there is a 0% chance that Hydrad is skum at this point so the second part is ok but i hate it
Its designed to protect us against a potential scum!you, so I get that you hate it as either alignment
Not like you bro - sloppy. No one is ever skum in my position and also a Vig.
Do you mean scum claiming last would never fakeclaim vig? Why not?
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If Idplay is town, then DatSwan should hold his shot and Hydrad should prolly lightning rod.
If idplay is scum, Datswan should shoot and no Hydralightning.
I agree i should not shoot but i think there is a 0% chance that Hydrad is skum at this point so the second part is ok but i hate it
Its designed to protect us against a potential scum!you, so I get that you hate it as either alignment
Not like you bro - sloppy. No one is ever skum in my position and also a Vig.
Do you mean scum claiming last would never fakeclaim vig? Why not?
So i feel like the answers are obvious but before i answer i want to clarify - are you disagreeing with me?
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Why is it either DatSwan or Galzria and not both?
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If town me doesn’t shoot bc idp flips town ... they are still gonna shoot me you get that right?
See above. we can protect you with hydralightning. It should be above anything they can do action resolution wise
Sorry unfamiliar with hydralighnting - got it now
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Why is it either DatSwan or Galzria and not both?
People have said it could be both. Like a lot actually.
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If Idplay is town, then DatSwan should hold his shot and Hydrad should prolly lightning rod.
If idplay is scum, Datswan should shoot and no Hydralightning.
I agree i should not shoot but i think there is a 0% chance that Hydrad is skum at this point so the second part is ok but i hate it
Its designed to protect us against a potential scum!you, so I get that you hate it as either alignment
Not like you bro - sloppy. No one is ever skum in my position and also a Vig.
Do you mean scum claiming last would never fakeclaim vig? Why not?
So i feel like the answers are obvious but before i answer i want to clarify - are you disagreeing with me?
Well, vig is generally a good fakeclaim for scum. Going last, you knew you didn't need to explain anything, which weakens its usefulness perhaps, but it's still a pretty good fakeclaim.
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If Idplay is town, then DatSwan should hold his shot and Hydrad should prolly lightning rod.
If idplay is scum, Datswan should shoot and no Hydralightning.
I agree i should not shoot but i think there is a 0% chance that Hydrad is skum at this point so the second part is ok but i hate it
Which part did you hate and why?
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If Idplay is town, then DatSwan should hold his shot and Hydrad should prolly lightning rod.
If idplay is scum, Datswan should shoot and no Hydralightning.
I agree i should not shoot but i think there is a 0% chance that Hydrad is skum at this point so the second part is ok but i hate it
Its designed to protect us against a potential scum!you, so I get that you hate it as either alignment
Not like you bro - sloppy. No one is ever skum in my position and also a Vig.
Do you mean scum claiming last would never fakeclaim vig? Why not?
So i feel like the answers are obvious but before i answer i want to clarify - are you disagreeing with me?
Well, vig is generally a good fakeclaim for scum. Going last, you knew you didn't need to explain anything, which weakens its usefulness perhaps, but it's still a pretty good fakeclaim.
Ok except for this is this game - not just an assumption of all games - i could of claimed literally ANYTHING. If i was skum i would of claimed a ton of other shit before this, as would everyone.
Also you did t answer my question.
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Yes, I disagree. But I'd like to hear where you are coming from, which might lead to me agreeing.
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If Idplay is town, then DatSwan should hold his shot and Hydrad should prolly lightning rod.
If idplay is scum, Datswan should shoot and no Hydralightning.
I agree i should not shoot but i think there is a 0% chance that Hydrad is skum at this point so the second part is ok but i hate it
Which part did you hate and why?
I don’t get it?
1) i think Hydrad is Town
2) it should be pretty obv Hydrad is Town to everyone at this point
3) they use rod and die. Which is bad. And i don’t like.
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If Idplay is town, then DatSwan should hold his shot and Hydrad should prolly lightning rod.
If idplay is scum, Datswan should shoot and no Hydralightning.
I agree i should not shoot but i think there is a 0% chance that Hydrad is skum at this point so the second part is ok but i hate it
Which part did you hate and why?
I don’t get it?
1) i think Hydrad is Town
2) it should be pretty obv Hydrad is Town to everyone at this point
3) they use rod and die. Which is bad. And i don’t like.
Ok, I thought you meant something specific to your role. Still interested to hear why scum in this game wouldn't fakeclaim vig.
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Why is it either DatSwan or Galzria and not both?
Its possible and very much on my mind but I don't think today would have played out quite this way if they were both scum. Discussions for the next game day?
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I'm still at work for the next 45ish minutes. I'll read over this then.
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Why is it either DatSwan or Galzria and not both?
Its possible and very much on my mind but I don't think today would have played out quite this way if they were both scum. Discussions for the next game day?
It's relevant to the POE that is motivating the lynch of IDPTG.
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Why is it either DatSwan or Galzria and not both?
Its possible and very much on my mind but I don't think today would have played out quite this way if they were both scum. Discussions for the next game day?
It's relevant to the POE that is motivating the lynch of IDPTG.
that's why I had to stick with my read - that they would have pushed each other's lynch if one but not both were scum. I mean my PoE has been criticized a lot so obviously I hope its right.
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I'm signing off here. Townreads on Hydrad and DatSwan, so might as well stay with IDP.
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Yes, I disagree. But I'd like to hear where you are coming from, which might lead to me agreeing.
Ok-
I think that it would be stupid for skum to claim Vig here because...
it is verifiable. 2 known prof roles and 1 Vig puts skum in a stupid spot to claim this.
I have some other stupid reasons but this is he big one.
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Sorry, I have family in town and no time. I really have not been able to catch up. I still have some time?
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I'm going to bed. Catch yall on the flip side.
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vote: Galzria
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vote: IDPTG
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vote: IDPTG
Yeah, just realized that might happen.
I got hit by Robz's Vanilla shot N2
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Believe that's hammer. Still had hope people would switch to Datswan, who I'm certain is scum (only way my results make any sense), but as that wasn't happening...
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I really hope you're town iguana. You seemed so proud of yourself.
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Believe that's hammer. Still had hope people would switch to Datswan, who I'm certain is scum (only way my results make any sense), but as that wasn't happening...
I was about to switch back to DatSwan but your vote beat me to it.
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vote: IDPTG
Yeah, just realized that might happen.
I got hit by Robz's Vanilla shot N2
You (obviously) weren't my choice of lynch here - but a choice isn't something Iguana left us with, so - if you're town, sorry.
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Remember that there's either at least one scum on my mislynch or Space is scum.
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Speaking of Space, Space- I didn't ask iguana where I said I wasn't commenting on Galz's claim. I asked him to show me where I said that the only one I thought was weird was Robz's because that's what he accused me of saying. Which I never said. And for someone who wasn't allowed to vote today, you really hedged on that read.
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I could see Hydrad/Space being scum neighbors and one of them is the one that killed Jim.
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EFHW and Space never really claimed anything. I think that's worth keeping in mind.
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I could see Hydrad/Space being scum neighbors and one of them is the one that killed Jim.
I doubt if this were the case, that they started the game this way - setup post clearly states that scum doesn't have day chat. It's entirely possible that one of them was a neighbor with Jimmm to start however, and the other killed Jimmm to gain neighborhood access.
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Hold on so if idp got hit by robz by shot, and MCMC, and awaclus.... and robz is a 2 shot... then someone is lying?
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Hold on so if idp got hit by robz by shot, and MCMC, and awaclus.... and robz is a 2 shot... then someone is lying?
Awaclus is a VT because he chose to take on mcmc's role but mcmc died a VT instead of his initial role. Or he's lying.
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Pretty sure Robz is town because I do not see a world in which he actually targets me N2 so he probably wasn't lying about Eevee and I was randomly selected.
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Hold on so if idp got hit by robz by shot, and MCMC, and awaclus.... and robz is a 2 shot... then someone is lying?
Awaclus is a VT because he chose to take on mcmc's role but mcmc died a VT instead of his initial role. Or he's lying.
He's not super likely to be lying - or at least, he's not super likely to be scum lying - as his "towniness" comes from what we believe to be Gkrieg's results.
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wait so if hes town I'm destroying myself?
unfortunate. hopefully hes scum i guess.
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Let's assume scum's roles are all things that either trap them into being discovered, or possibly screw with their ability to kill effectively. For this reason, let's assume that Jimmmmm and gkrieg were killed by different scums, ridding the scumteam of two problem roles on the first two nights. So scums 1 and 2 got rid of bad roles, and for some reason Eevee (scum #3) didn't kill N3.
1) Eevee didn't kill N3 because he was lynched D3.
2) Gkrieg wasn't killed N2. Nobody was. Gkrieg died N3.
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Day 4 Final Vote Count
Galzria (3): Robz888, Hydrad, IDontPlayThisGame
IDontPlayThisGame (5): iguanaiguana, EFHW, DatSwan, Awaclus, Galzria
Not Voting (1): SpaceAnemone
With 9 alive, it took 5 to lynch.
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It had been months since Alex had been out of the hospital. They were hooked up to several machines and lying in a bed most of the time. Alex began wondering whether they would die there.
IDontPlayThisGame has been lynched! They were the Thyroid, the Cancer Absorbing Enabler!
Night 4 begins and lasts 48 hours. Night actions due within 36 hours.
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Alex's parent stood in the hospital room. Alex lay there, as they had been for weeks now, unmoving, artificially fed, and so very, very thin. The doctor had just left. She had given an update on Alex's condition. It was bad, very bad. Then she had pointed out how all the machines were keeping Alex alive. She made very clear that should the machines stop, Alex would drift away and die. Painless, the doctor had said. Then she made an effort to clarify that she was going to leave and would not be back for at least half an hour. By that point, Alex's parent had already understood what she was trying to tell them.
Now, they stood there, a pained expression on their face. It was not the first time they had considered that option, of course not. But still, what if there was hope? But was there? It certainly didn't sound like it.
Hydrad has been killed. They were the Testicles, the Macho 1-shot Lightning Rod/Neighbor.
SpaceAnemone has been killed. They were the Prostate, the Night 4 Suicidal Self-Roleblocker/Neighbor.
iguanaiguana, EFHW and Awaclus have been endgamed!
The scum team of Eevee, Galzria, Robz888 and DatSwan wins!
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Bummer
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Oh wow! That's neat.
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gg scum
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How annoying would it have been if you weren't able to change roles? I was thinking of trying to be the D1 lynch.
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I straight up lied, saying I shot Eevee. I actually shot IDP.
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Huh. Neat!
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Things may have gone very differently if IDP or Space had claimed?
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How annoying would it have been if you weren't able to change roles? I was thinking of trying to be the D1 lynch.
Haha we couldn't change after we VT'd you.
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I straight up lied, saying I shot Eevee. I actually shot IDP.
Lolllllll.
How annoying would it have been if you weren't able to change roles? I was thinking of trying to be the D1 lynch.
Haha we couldn't change after we VT'd you.
Were you told when that happened?
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Things may have gone very differently if IDP or Space had claimed?
Surprised IDPTG didn't push Robz for claiming to VT Eevee N2.
Space... damn - Space, why didn't you claim that you would die N4? Could that have been doctored?
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I straight up lied, saying I shot Eevee. I actually shot IDP.
Lolllllll.
How annoying would it have been if you weren't able to change roles? I was thinking of trying to be the D1 lynch.
Haha we couldn't change after we VT'd you.
Were you told when that happened?
Only that we no longer absorbed.
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Things may have gone very differently if IDP or Space had claimed?
How would my claim have changed much?
Things may have gone very differently if IDP or Space had claimed?
Surprised IDPTG didn't push Robz for claiming to VT Eevee N2.
Space... damn - Space, why didn't you claim that you would die N4? Could that have been doctored?
It was a good shot. I seriously thought he didn't aim for me and the random bit was real.
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I straight up lied, saying I shot Eevee. I actually shot IDP.
Lolllllll.
How annoying would it have been if you weren't able to change roles? I was thinking of trying to be the D1 lynch.
Haha we couldn't change after we VT'd you.
Were you told when that happened?
Only that we no longer absorbed.
Did faust tell your or you figured it out?
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This at least explains why I couldnt decide whether Galz or DatSwan was scummier
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This at least explains why I couldnt decide whether Galz or DatSwan was scummier
Lolz yeah you were on there pretty good
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I straight up lied, saying I shot Eevee. I actually shot IDP.
Lolllllll.
How annoying would it have been if you weren't able to change roles? I was thinking of trying to be the D1 lynch.
Haha we couldn't change after we VT'd you.
Were you told when that happened?
Only that we no longer absorbed.
Did faust tell your or you figured it out?
He told us that we no longer absorbed the night it happened - but he didn't tell us why. With the massclaim it became obvious that we neutralized our enabler.
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I straight up lied, saying I shot Eevee. I actually shot IDP.
Lolllllll.
How annoying would it have been if you weren't able to change roles? I was thinking of trying to be the D1 lynch.
Haha we couldn't change after we VT'd you.
Were you told when that happened?
Only that we no longer absorbed.
Did faust tell your or you figured it out?
After the following day had started it was annoinced
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I straight up lied, saying I shot Eevee. I actually shot IDP.
Lolllllll.
How annoying would it have been if you weren't able to change roles? I was thinking of trying to be the D1 lynch.
Haha we couldn't change after we VT'd you.
Were you told when that happened?
Only that we no longer absorbed.
Did faust tell your or you figured it out?
He told us that we no longer absorbed the night it happened - but he didn't tell us why. With the massclaim it became obvious that we neutralized our enabler.
Ugh. I assumed he wouldn't tell you.
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This is the order:
IDPTG
Hydrad
iguanaiguana
EFHW
Galzria
Space
Robz
DatSwan
:'( :'( :'(
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Our night actions definitely did not play in our favor. The lynch of Mcmc the day after VT'ing him was not ideal, but it allowed us to build some separation and with both Robz and I on Eevee it worked out ok. Eevee shooting a Doctored Iguana wasn't ideal.
Swan killed Jimmm N1 as we didn't want anybody else to change PR's, and if he killed anybody else and absorbed their PR the Jimmm neighborhood would've been shut down - making it obvious to Jimmm that Swan was scum.
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This is the order:
IDPTG
Hydrad
iguanaiguana
EFHW
Galzria
Space
Robz
DatSwan
:'( :'( :'(
Yeah.
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Our roles were weaker than we thought, looking back. My Godfather was only useful against Gkrieg, and only on Even nights. Robz' VT ability arguably did as much harm as good. Eevee being Ascetic... man did we mess that up. Plan was to VT him N2, and then have Robz kill D3 to restore Eevee's power - we caught the flaw before it hurt us, but it only gave Eevee one chance to try and drop his PR. Plus, given the town PR's in play, Aesthetic wasn't super strong either. Swan was a D3 PGO Neighbor - but that's a long time to plan for, and is really hit or miss.
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I straight up lied, saying I shot Eevee. I actually shot IDP.
Lolllllll.
How annoying would it have been if you weren't able to change roles? I was thinking of trying to be the D1 lynch.
Haha we couldn't change after we VT'd you.
Were you told when that happened?
Only that we no longer absorbed.
Did faust tell your or you figured it out?
After the following day had started it was annoinced
I mean we didn’t know how. We spent a day and a half assuming it was a one time activated ability
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Good game guys.
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Space... damn - Space, why didn't you claim that you would die N4? Could that have been doctored?
Nothing could prevent it, so my plan was to be super-townie and try to draw the NK so scum would take my role away from me and die themselves. Unfortunately, I'm not good at looking townie :-(
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Our night actions definitely did not play in our favor. The lynch of Mcmc the day after VT'ing him was not ideal, but it allowed us to build some separation and with both Robz and I on Eevee it worked out ok. Eevee shooting a Doctored Iguana wasn't ideal.
Swan killed Jimmm N1 as we didn't want anybody else to change PR's, and if he killed anybody else and absorbed their PR the Jimmm neighborhood would've been shut down - making it obvious to Jimmm that Swan was scum.
Yes, it was rather risky to have Eevee shoot such a widely townread player. And then the VT'ing was very ineffectual. It would have been better to keep at least one shot to sort out situations like the mutual protection thing.
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Things may have gone very differently if IDP or Space had claimed?
I think so.
Great act by DatSwan. I had basically decided he was town.
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Things may have gone very differently if IDP or Space had claimed?
I think so.
Great act by DatSwan. I had basically decided he was town.
He was the one I was most sure was scummy, because his role was too swingy with an option of picking an every-other-night kill that might fall to either team, and also just far too strong. The only reason I didn't go all-out after him was a concern that he might be trying to draw the NK if his role was a scum-poison one like mine.. which seemed more likely because of his early comment about role timings.
The other thing that threw me off was the fact that you and Iguana had a plausible way of making a protection racket.. I really hadn't expected faust to make something like that possible. It was especially interesting in a setup where I felt like town had a strong incentive to lie about their roles.
Would me claiming have done town any good? The main utility of my role was that if scum took me out, they'd die, and as soon as they know I'm doomed town, there's no incentive for them to do that.
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Are there links to mod/scum/neighbourhood/speccy QTs? I could post the link to the one Hydra and I are in, but I've done enough damage posting QT-related stuff for one game :-(
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Mod QT (https://quicktopic.com/52/H/xT7JiwFh9J4h)
Speccy QT (https://quicktopic.com/52/H/TbhrATpXuCx)
Mafia QT (https://quicktopic.com/52/H/v7mYDeyy2Z4gB)
Space/Hydrad neighborhood (https://quicktopic.com/52/H/KZPubJGGCn2nP)
Jimmmmm/DatSwan neighborhood (https://quicktopic.com/52/H/WmTAVfL67VT)
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The other thing that threw me off was the fact that you and Iguana had a plausible way of making a protection racket.. I really hadn't expected faust to make something like that possible. It was especially interesting in a setup where I felt like town had a strong incentive to lie about their roles.
Well, scum had a way to prevent it. Obviously iguana's role was pretty good. I could have toned it down signficantly by making the rolestopping only stop non-killing roles, but that in turn would have made it more powerful if it fell into scum's hands. And that was always a consideration to make here.
Ultimately it turned out nicely. Finding that mutual protection and trusting in it was a thing that town did nicely (and scum probably should have challenged one of those claims). But scum still won, so it wasn't broken or anything.
Would me claiming have done town any good? The main utility of my role was that if scum took me out, they'd die, and as soon as they know I'm doomed town, there's no incentive for them to do that.
I half-expected an early fakeclaim with that role. You could have tried to draw the nightkill way earlier. But obviously that's a bit of a double-edged sword.
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Things may have gone very differently if IDP or Space had claimed?
I think so.
Great act by DatSwan. I had basically decided he was town.
He was the one I was most sure was scummy, because his role was too swingy with an option of picking an every-other-night kill that might fall to either team, and also just far too strong. The only reason I didn't go all-out after him was a concern that he might be trying to draw the NK if his role was a scum-poison one like mine.. which seemed more likely because of his early comment about role timings.
The other thing that threw me off was the fact that you and Iguana had a plausible way of making a protection racket.. I really hadn't expected faust to make something like that possible. It was especially interesting in a setup where I felt like town had a strong incentive to lie about their roles.
Would me claiming have done town any good? The main utility of my role was that if scum took me out, they'd die, and as soon as they know I'm doomed town, there's no incentive for them to do that.
We would have lynched you, they would have gotten only one NK, and we could have gone to LyLo....
Knowing you were town would have made a huge difference for me too...I was sure you were scum haha
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Good job team!
The setup was nice, even if things didn't turn out great for me.
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Would me claiming have done town any good? The main utility of my role was that if scum took me out, they'd die, and as soon as they know I'm doomed town, there's no incentive for them to do that.
It would have made a big difference in my thinking, especially if IDP had claimed, but even without his claim. The chances of being the nk weren't very big, but imo providing information would have been very helpful. Same for him, really. He thought he could make scum waste an nk on him, but his information would have greatly helped the lynch.
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Things may have gone very differently if IDP or Space had claimed?
How would my claim have changed much?
I would have voted Robz, not you.
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Things may have gone very differently if IDP or Space had claimed?
How would my claim have changed much?
I would have voted Robz, not you.
We would also have known that they had lost their absorbing power.
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Stuff to think about for future games.
It was fun having mutual confirmed town with iguana. Too bad about Alex...
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Stuff to think about for future games.
It was fun having mutual confirmed town with iguana. Too bad about Alex...
It even almost mattered for a minute there!
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Things may have gone very differently if IDP or Space had claimed?
I think so.
Great act by DatSwan. I had basically decided he was town.
Thanks!