Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[mcmcsalot]

it would be super neat to hear from the absent players at some point.

Sorry will do soon

[Galzria]

it would be super neat to hear from the absent players at some point.

Sorry will do soon

I've completed my reread and have a series of posts and notes mostly ready - I'm at work until 8:30 FT, but will start posting everything I have when I get home.

[SpaceAnemone]

oh because you were the neighbor maker last game probably

Yeah, sorry! Luckily, I think my meaning was clear enough. I don't think Hydrad is that confusable with Jimmmmm otherwise. I do see the Hydrad-Datswan confusion, though for me I think it's just watery associations of "Hydra" and "Swan" rather than direct icon confusion, since Hydrad just looks like a dark grey rectangle, whereas Swan always parses to me as a black-coloured grecian bust against an orange background, though I recognise that if you examine it closely it's actually a dog in a kitchen :-P

There is so little else comment-worthy to talk about just now.. I'm surprised that all but four players have actually posted in the last 24 hours! (The MIAs are EFHW, Eevee, Awaclus and Robz). I posted super-late last night before sleep, and now it's almost bedtime tonight, and there have only been 4 posts in between.

[iguanaiguana]

oh because you were the neighbor maker last game probably

Yeah, sorry! Luckily, I think my meaning was clear enough. I don't think Hydrad is that confusable with Jimmmmm otherwise. I do see the Hydrad-Datswan confusion, though for me I think it's just watery associations of "Hydra" and "Swan" rather than direct icon confusion, since Hydrad just looks like a dark grey rectangle, whereas Swan always parses to me as a black-coloured grecian bust against an orange background, though I recognise that if you examine it closely it's actually a dog in a kitchen :-P

There is so little else comment-worthy to talk about just now.. I'm surprised that all but four players have actually posted in the last 24 hours! (The MIAs are EFHW, Eevee, Awaclus and Robz). I posted super-late last night before sleep, and now it's almost bedtime tonight, and there have only been 4 posts in between.

Why is all my content not comment worthy?

[SpaceAnemone]

Why is all my content not comment worthy?

Do you mean your weird tunnel on gkrieg, or something else? I figure gkrieg already pointed out that scum-reading someone from PoE based on the fact you more or less townread some other people people is a super-weak case.

I did go back to check the wagons you described, but I thought your evidence was really quite weak. You say that you think Hydrad and Swan are town and therefore you scumread gkrieg because if he's not scum then you'd expect a scum to vote on his wagon. The wagon in question existed for around 100 posts, but started very early in D2, and imho would have been a really conspicuous place for a scum to join, because it would put a player up to 3 votes while most others are not voting, apart from a couple of singleton votes. I wouldn't think that make gkrieg conf!scum even if Hydrad and Swan were ICs.

If I want to divine stuff from wagons, I'd be more interested in reviewing D1. For instance, at #99, mcmc joins the Eevee wagon, which at that point contains me and LL, so consequently I think it's quite possible that either mcmc or Eevee is scum. If you're a townie, then from your point of view at #289, you and LL area both voting mcmc, as is Awaclus.. so there ought to be an increased chance in your mind that at least one of Awaclus or mcmc is scum, and this is based on concretely-known alignments, not townread guesses.

[Eevee]

I don't really find the case on gkrieg convincing, I think it requires too many things to go right. I'm just not that confident that hydrad and and datswan are both town, just due to the odds.

[iguanaiguana]

I haven't seen anyone other than gkrieg give a reason why he is towny or shouldn't be voted.

[Eevee]

Kind of odd this game is stalling. Iguana seems towny for pushing the case though,  seems like a lot of mental hurdles to jump over to fake that. I think if he just wanted to fake a case, he could do it simpler. I'm not super towny on the people currently voting for mcmc, which makes me less interested in that lynch.

[Swowl]

OK all here is the thing, at this point I am liking my GK case more - I get that him not picking up a wagon isn't like exactly indicative of him being skum, but also if someone thinks differently (no offense, but other then GK), could we get some input?

RN there just is like assuredly a decent chunk of skum off the wagon is GK is skum btw. This is just waiting to be set up for a last minute scramble.

I also do not feel the other wagon on MCMC. I feel like their absence has been used against them when they have been more present then half of the field. Relatively to their normal play, they have not been around as much as normal, but I would pretty much rather lynch anyone else not posting at this point over MCMC. Not saying that MCMC couldn't be skum, just that I think GK would be way more likely skum flip at this point.

I do also want to mention that the more GK talks the less I am certain that they are skum. But right now, still my favorite case.

[Hydrad]

I guess I'm still here. nothing has really changed for me in the last few posts so I don't really know what to say here.

rerere Vote: gkreig i guess?

[SpaceAnemone]

Kind of odd this game is stalling. Iguana seems towny for pushing the case though,  seems like a lot of mental hurdles to jump over to fake that. I think if he just wanted to fake a case, he could do it simpler. I'm not super towny on the people currently voting for mcmc, which makes me less interested in that lynch.

There's a bit of a conflation of (at least) three things here.

1) You think the game is stalling in spite of enthusiastic posts.
2) You don't think Iguana is faking his zeal for pushing the gkrieg case.
3) You don't think the people pushing the only alternative wagon are townie.
4) Therefore you don't think the alternative wagon is on a scum.

So are 3 and 4 related in your mind to 1 and 2?

Do you personally think mcmc is scummy (aside from being voted for by allegedly-not-super-townie people)? How about gkrieg?

[SpaceAnemone]

Personally, I feel like people are working weirdly hard to divert from the mcmc wagon, and I don't think his behaviour in the game is so super-townie to warrant that.

Vote: mcmc

[SpaceAnemone]

OK all here is the thing, at this point I am liking my GK case more - I get that him not picking up a wagon isn't like exactly indicative of him being skum, but also if someone thinks differently (no offense, but other then GK), could we get some input?

I liked what gkrieg was doing looking for possible neighbours of Jimmmmm, and I thought his posts were helpful. I think Jimmmmm being a neighbour is crucially important, either because he had a scum neighbour and the reason he's dead is that the scums wanted an assumed neighbourhood daychat power, or because while his kill was entirely arbitrary, we expect his town buddy in there to die tonight because scums want daychat.

I like that gkrieg was clearly treating the neighbourhood aspect as important, while mcmc was working to downplay it, e.g. at #403 where he says that he thinks Jimmmmm being in a neighbouhood is coincidental, and in #404 where he says that "I doubt the kill was to do with his neighborhood".

[SpaceAnemone]

Personally, I think there's something interesting and discussion-worth there, both in the even itself and how people are reacting to it. Still nobody has come out and claimed to have been in a neighbourhood with Jimmmmm. I don't see many townie reasons to stay quiet in the main thread now that at least one scum has access to the neighbourhood, so I think that means a subset of scum probably have a neighbourhood. The only neighbourhood I've been in was a very useful space in which to daychat with Robz about how to lie to the rest of town and win M116, so two scums having that kind of power is not good. Howcome people aren't talking more about it?

Why do you think there were more than 2 people in the neighborhood?

@Awaclus:

1) Could you point to where I actually implied that I thought there might be more than two people?

2) What's your opinion of the gkrieg wagon?

[SpaceAnemone]

Request prods on EFHW, gkrieg13, Awaclus, mcmcsalot, Robz, and IDontPlayThisGame.

Note: we have a little over 18 hours till deadline.

[SpaceAnemone]

Space Count:

gkrieg13 (3): DatSwan, iguanaiguana, Hydrad
Awaclus (1): Eevee
mcmcsalot (3): gkrieg13, Awaclus, SpaceAnemone
SpaceAnemone (1): IDontPlayThisGame
Eevee (1): Robz888
Not Voting (3): EFHW, mcmcsalot, Galzria

We need 7 to get a lynch, and we only have 8 townies in the game.

[iguanaiguana]

This is totally pathetic. Thanks for prodding everyone Space.

[Awaclus]

1) Could you point to where I actually implied that I thought there might be more than two people?

2) What's your opinion of the gkrieg wagon?

1) I'd rather not do that.

2) Not super excited about it.

[gkrieg13]

OK all here is the thing, at this point I am liking my GK case more - I get that him not picking up a wagon isn't like exactly indicative of him being skum, but also if someone thinks differently (no offense, but other then GK), could we get some input?

RN there just is like assuredly a decent chunk of skum off the wagon is GK is skum btw. This is just waiting to be set up for a last minute scramble.

I also do not feel the other wagon on MCMC. I feel like their absence has been used against them when they have been more present then half of the field. Relatively to their normal play, they have not been around as much as normal, but I would pretty much rather lynch anyone else not posting at this point over MCMC. Not saying that MCMC couldn't be skum, just that I think GK would be way more likely skum flip at this point.

I do also want to mention that the more GK talks the less I am certain that they are skum. But right now, still my favorite case.

Are you going to address anything that Space has said in relation to me?  Space has said that the wagon case on me is weak. Also mcmc isn’t posting. His post count today is really low. It’s like you are trying to come up with crappy reasons to keep the vote on me for some reason. Like trying to get other people to say that the wagon case is flimsy instead of trying to find scum elsewhere. Also your point that there is scum off the wagon if I’m scum is the same probability for mcmcsalot, so once again a super flimsy argument.

[gkrieg13]

Oh didn’t realize that Space and Datswan’s posts were in a different order than I thought. Some of my above post is invalid.

[gkrieg13]

I haven't seen anyone other than gkrieg give a reason why he is towny or shouldn't be voted.

But no one else has jumped on. You should look elsewhere for scum.

[iguanaiguana]

Dude, scum knows that town needs 7 out of 8 townies to agree to lynch scum. Half the people in the game aren't even really playing. Of course it's going to be near impossible to get a wagon on scum.

there's two wagons here without a lot of traction. I just want people to think about the people voting both sides.

Hydrad/DatSwan/Iguana vs Space/gkrieg/Awaclus. Which side looks townier? Saying that should inform your vote when scum does not want to bus because town basically has to act with one mind is not crazy.

[iguanaiguana]

Both major wagons being on town is really, really common D1. It is maybe THE most common thing. McMc is super absent for IRL reasons, making him unable to defend himself.

Those are good reasons why scum may want to target him for a mislynch if he is town, and if it were not for a few towny people suggesting gkrieg, he would be the only option proposed.

Even if McMc himself isn't super towny the circumstances around his wagon should give people pause.

[Galzria]

vote: mcmc

I strongly prefer the Mcmc lynch to Gkrieg, and for the following reason more than anything else:

f.ds has a bad meta that those who talk the most and participate more are far more likely to be suspected. In a game thread such as this, which has been as dead as it's been (and yes, I've been a contributor to this), scum have very little incentive to participate. They can't go non-existent either mind you, but why draw attention to themselves when there is simply no reason?

And of course, there's the WIFOM that if we "always let those that are participating get a pass" then scum will just post more - but if that's the end result I think we come out with a much better chance of catching them in the long term without having to rely on PR's to get lucky.

Further, in regards to Mcmc, this isn't just a "lynch all lurkers" lynch. He was definitely off D1 - I liked my case on him then, but I'll also admit I liked his defense. Problem I have is that... well, he was the 2nd leading wagon D1 - and it's reasonable to assume that he would come into today taking some heat for avoiding the lynch at LaLight's expense. From that perspective, as scum, I would've done exactly what he's done - meld into the shadows hoping to avoid that heat, but be ready to come up fighting if the pressure gets applied. From a town perspective though, I think I would've come into today with a little extra effort to right the ship, knowing that I was a possible "next-in-line-mislynch".

Gkrieg, on the other hand, is fighting the iguana case, even without a lot of votes (they're building a little bit now, but he's been active since the case was made). He's been active for most of D2, and the primary point against his lynch (that two other players appear townie to iguana) is something I just don't agree with. I think Datswan is scum. His thoughts D1 weren't well thought out or complete, and he's been making statements that to me have felt like he's trying to stay "in-meta" rather than find scum.

Moving down the list, I also think Eevee is scum. AFAIK he has like, no scum reads, and has been town reading almost everybody - a pretty telling scum!Eevee trait in my experience.

I'm also highly (highly) suspicious of Hydrad for reasons that I'm not going to go into right now.

Want to lynch:
Mcmc (Between him and Gkrieg, this is the better lynch)
Datswan (scum scum)
Eevee (scum scum)
Hydrad (scum scum)

Won't lynch:
Space (town tell - not going into more detail)
Iguana

Will lynch to get a lynch through:
Anybody

Don't want to lynch:
Gkrieg (reasons above, plus 2/3 on wagon I believe to be scum (Datswan/Hydrad)

Don't know what to make of:
Robz888 (Bad!Robz usually = Town!Robz though)
IDPTG (Is he even playing this game?)
Awaclus (Hell if I know)
EFHW (She was a stronger presence D1, and I think she'll be later on too - at least enough to get a better read than I have now)

[gkrieg13]

Both major wagons being on town is really, really common D1. It is maybe THE most common thing. McMc is super absent for IRL reasons, making him unable to defend himself.

Those are good reasons why scum may want to target him for a mislynch if he is town, and if it were not for a few towny people suggesting gkrieg, he would be the only option proposed.

Even if McMc himself isn't super towny the circumstances around his wagon should give people pause.

His wagon is also being fought against very hard by other people. Also your second paragraph is ridiculous. You go out of your way to make it sound like you and Hydrad and Datswan are heroes. Also the fact that wagons D1 are more likely to be town than one scum one town is equally flimsy. Does that just mean we should never lynch someone who had a wagon D1?  Why have you done such a 180 on mcmc?