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[Qvist]

Conclusion:
yuma can't be town if CF and Eevee (my current scum picks) are scum. So, unvote.

This conclusion makes no sense.

Of course it makes sense. I always said that CF and Eevee are looking scummy for me. And you always looked townish to me.
But if that's true, then explain me why one of those two don't hammer you!?

[yuma]

2 scum could currently vote for yuma, but this makes still little sense because after lynching yuma and another townie kill at night, there are 4 townies against 3 scums with us basically having no PRs. That's basically a win for Mafia. The only guess what makes sense is that there are currently all 3 Mafia guys voting for yuma and waiting for someone to hammer him which makes that person look scummy.

I think it pretty highly likely that all three scum are on my wagon and that it took off that fast. 2 maybe, but I think 1 is the most likely number

yuma, did you mean to type "unlikely" at the bolded spot above?

yes, unlikely is the appropriate word here

[yuma]

Conclusion:
yuma can't be town if CF and Eevee (my current scum picks) are scum. So, unvote.

This conclusion makes no sense.

Of course it makes sense. I always said that CF and Eevee are looking scummy for me. And you always looked townish to me.
But if that's true, then explain me why one of those two don't hammer you!?

Because they, if scum and I town, know that they will become a prime target for lynch tomorrow after I flip town. I have stated this so many times before. Scum wanted my wagon to be full of mostly town (maybe 1 scum on it) and expressed town reads on me to get cred. And now they can't vote for me because they would have to go back on their former read, just like you are doing.

Why dont' you hammer me?

[Qvist]

Conclusion:
yuma can't be town if CF and Eevee (my current scum picks) are scum. So, unvote.

This conclusion makes no sense.

Of course it makes sense. I always said that CF and Eevee are looking scummy for me. And you always looked townish to me.
But if that's true, then explain me why one of those two don't hammer you!?

Because they, if scum and I town, know that they will become a prime target for lynch tomorrow after I flip town. I have stated this so many times before. Scum wanted my wagon to be full of mostly town (maybe 1 scum on it) and expressed town reads on me to get cred. And now they can't vote for me because they would have to go back on their former read, just like you are doing.

Why dont' you hammer me?

And what's the deal if they would be prime target for the kill? They still probably would have won with 3 scum against 4 townies with no power roles. Yeah, we might get the PR back, but the chances for winning are pretty slim.

I would hammer you if I were scum and you are town, you can be sure.

And I didn't changed my mind yet. I only realised that a scum team of CF, Eevee and a third person (who is not you) is unlikely.

[Captain_Frisk]

All right folks

1. Captain_Frisk - I'm town.
2. jotheonah
4. Eevee
5. Voltgloss
6. Axxle
8. yuma - I'm going to gamble that he is town.  I would have claimed a PR as scum.
10. ashersky
11. QVist - aggressive tunnelling on me is unlikely as a new scum player
12. TheMunch - bad theory is unlikely to be scum

This leaves the scum team as 3 out of {joth, axxle, eevee, ashersky, voltgloss}

If we can just eliminate one person out of that set, we can lynch the rest in order and win the game, because we have 1 mislynch.

[Eevee]

Vote: ashersky then?

I like your like of thinking Frisk, and basically only disagree on Qvist.

[yuma]

Conclusion:
yuma can't be town if CF and Eevee (my current scum picks) are scum. So, unvote.

This conclusion makes no sense.

Of course it makes sense. I always said that CF and Eevee are looking scummy for me. And you always looked townish to me.
But if that's true, then explain me why one of those two don't hammer you!?

Because they, if scum and I town, know that they will become a prime target for lynch tomorrow after I flip town. I have stated this so many times before. Scum wanted my wagon to be full of mostly town (maybe 1 scum on it) and expressed town reads on me to get cred. And now they can't vote for me because they would have to go back on their former read, just like you are doing.

Why dont' you hammer me?

And what's the deal if they would be prime target for the kill? They still probably would have won with 3 scum against 4 townies with no power roles. Yeah, we might get the PR back, but the chances for winning are pretty slim.

I would hammer you if I were scum and you are town, you can be sure.

And I didn't changed my mind yet. I only realised that a scum team of CF, Eevee and a third person (who is not you) is unlikely.

Little story for you:

In M3 I was mafia with eevee and voltgloss. In day 3 we were in great shape. It was 3 scum against 5 townies. We mislynched Morgrim with all 3 scum on the wagon. We thought we had the win in the bag. But our night kill was blocked and then in 3 subsquent days each of us were lynched while our night kill was blocked. And we lost the game.

Crazy things happen in mafia, and if there is one thing mafia can't be is too overconfident. A lynch of a mafia player tomorrow could very easily open up the floodgates and allow a town win. A Power Role would be back, there would be analysis of comparing the scum to other players, there would be who had voted for that scum and who that scum had voted for. Scum does not want to get lynched tomorrow. They want to cruise to victory with a mislynch today and a mislynch tomorrow.

[Eevee]

Not ready to gamble the game on you being town (trademark blitz), but like your iniative of going after people I suspect to be mafia instead of yuma who I think is town. And you are one of my townier reads (right behind yuma and munch), so that's good too.

[Captain_Frisk]

Vote: ashersky then?

I like your like of thinking Frisk, and basically only disagree on Qvist.

No.  if you disagree with qvist, then my argument is shot.  Also, we can't just start lynching until we figure out who we think is town in that set.

[Qvist]

Thanks for the background story, but this time the kill can't be blocked unless the Mafia Doctor Switch dies.
Or do I miss something?

[yuma]

All right folks

1. Captain_Frisk - I'm town.
2. jotheonah
4. Eevee
5. Voltgloss
6. Axxle
8. yuma - I'm going to gamble that he is town.  I would have claimed a PR as scum.
10. ashersky
11. QVist - aggressive tunnelling on me is unlikely as a new scum player
12. TheMunch - bad theory is unlikely to be scum

This leaves the scum team as 3 out of {joth, axxle, eevee, ashersky, voltgloss}

If we can just eliminate one person out of that set, we can lynch the rest in order and win the game, because we have 1 mislynch.

the most town in that set are volt and axxle (axxle coming in first), but I am not convinced that you are town obviously, although I appreciate the read on me.

[Voltgloss]

Axxle, what are your thoughts on yuma's VT claim and the discussion since then?

[yuma]

Thanks for the background story, but this time the kill can't be blocked unless the Mafia Doctor Switch dies.
Or do I miss something?

scum can't perform kill and switch at the same time.... so say the mafia vig switch dies. That means either the cop or doc switch can't switch if they want to perform the kill.

[Qvist]

Thanks for the background story, but this time the kill can't be blocked unless the Mafia Doctor Switch dies.
Or do I miss something?

scum can't perform kill and switch at the same time.... so say the mafia vig switch dies. That means either the cop or doc switch can't switch if they want to perform the kill.

Ah, right. I forgot about that. That makes sense.

[Eevee]

Oh yuma, just thinking about the end of III is painfuul. We were doing so well!

[Axxle]

Axxle, what are your thoughts on yuma's VT claim and the discussion since then?

still think he's town and am increasingly certain that there is a substantial scum presence on the wagon.  Could be deluded town but I think most players aren't.
unvote

I'll reread.

[jotheonah]

I'm torn between being less sure yuma is scum (because of the VT claim and the general feel of his posts) and feeling really dumb if I abandon the yuma wagon and then it turns out he IS scum. Because, guys, do you remember scum yuma? He's sneaky as hell.

[jotheonah]

Like, I had a Mod's eye view of MV, and yuma snuck right through that game without ever being suspected.

[TheMunch]

In M3 I was mafia with eevee and voltgloss. In day 3 we were in great shape. It was 3 scum against 5 townies. We mislynched Morgrim with all 3 scum on the wagon. We thought we had the win in the bag. But our night kill was blocked and then in 3 subsquent days each of us were lynched while our night kill was blocked. And we lost the game.

Crazy things happen in mafia, and if there is one thing mafia can't be is too overconfident. A lynch of a mafia player tomorrow could very easily open up the floodgates and allow a town win. A Power Role would be back, there would be analysis of comparing the scum to other players, there would be who had voted for that scum and who that scum had voted for. Scum does not want to get lynched tomorrow. They want to cruise to victory with a mislynch today and a mislynch tomorrow.

Isn't this precisely the situation I outlined?  If I am town and Yuma is town, it would be pretty easy to have cruised to a victory with a mislynch today (hammer yuma) and a mislynch tomorrow (lynch me for pushing town yuma so hard).  This didn't happen (and I think Yuma being town is the cause). 

What I dont like about this post from Yuma is that he came up with his (imo less likely) scenario where the people that have built up town reads on yuma are scum and saying that my scenario is less likely yet acknowledges that it is the winning scenario for scum in this post.  Yuma's initial proposition of the "people built town reads on yuma" was this post:

Munch: you have completely missed, or chosen to ignore, my theory, and I am willing to bet some serious Goko coin (no, not really, I don't have any Goko coin, but if I did, I would bet it) that this is what is happening. That scum was hoping that enough townies would be willing to lynch me so as to enable them to stay off my lynch wagon for the most part. At this point I don't think that all 3 scum are on my wagon. My bet is that scum expressed a town read on me to gain the necessary cred for tomorrow when I flipped town tomorrow. But in fact not enough townies were willing to vote for me. But the scum not voting for me had already expressed a town read on me and are not willing to go back on that because they will be a prime target tomorrow when I flip town. This is why I am voting Qvist. He seemed to be the most likely to fit this bill because he has provided the weakest reason for why I am town. Actually Frisk fits this bill as well. But his "style" has been more town to me.

Ending with this line:

I wish there was someway that I could convince you of it beside getting lynched.

I think the way that yuma could have convinced me that yuma was town without getting lynched was to actually follow through with the case that he proposed.  He claimed that this situation was much more likely yet never followed through with the scumhunt.  If scum consist of the people who have town reads on yuma (and there aren't many; I know of at least 4 people who dont have scum reads on you) then why hasn't Yuma actually going after the people that have town reads on him?

[TheMunch]

Isn't this precisely the situation I outlined?  If I am town and Yuma is town, it would be pretty easy to have cruised to a victory with a mislynch today (hammer yuma) and a mislynch tomorrow (lynch me for pushing town yuma so hard).  This didn't happen (and I think Yuma being town scum is the cause). 

That was a bad typo..

[yuma]

I AM VOTING QVIST! pay attention!

[Captain_Frisk]

Isn't this precisely the situation I outlined?  If I am town and Yuma is town, it would be pretty easy to have cruised to a victory with a mislynch today (hammer yuma) and a mislynch tomorrow (lynch me for pushing town yuma so hard).  This didn't happen (and I think Yuma being town scum is the cause). 

That was a bad typo..

I may need to take you off my "townie" list.

[yuma]

and you are not understanding what I am trying to say.

Let me try again.... scum didn't want to all be on my wagon come after my flip of town and being mislynched.

So instead they expressed town reads on me, and wanted townies to lynch me instead. But now they don't have enough townies to get a lynch on me, but are hesitant to vote for me because that would make that person--not you munch, you have enough town reads now that you are more likely to be the NK then the lynch tomorrow--the lynch tomorrow resulting in a scum lynch tomorrow.

Am I making any sense or are you really not getting what I am trying to say.

everytime I post you dont' understand it? Is it me, or is it you?

[TheMunch]

Isn't this precisely the situation I outlined?  If I am town and Yuma is town, it would be pretty easy to have cruised to a victory with a mislynch today (hammer yuma) and a mislynch tomorrow (lynch me for pushing town yuma so hard).  This didn't happen (and I think Yuma being town scum is the cause). 

That was a bad typo..

I may need to take you off my "townie" list.

Aww, c'mon.  Typos = scumslip now?

I AM VOTING QVIST! pay attention!

You are spending too much time being defensive and less time driving cases.

[TheMunch]

and you are not understanding what I am trying to say.

Let me try again.... scum didn't want to all be on my wagon come after my flip of town and being mislynched.

So instead they expressed town reads on me, and wanted townies to lynch me instead. But now they don't have enough townies to get a lynch on me, but are hesitant to vote for me because that would make that person--not you munch, you have enough town reads now that you are more likely to be the NK then the lynch tomorrow--the lynch tomorrow resulting in a scum lynch tomorrow.

Am I making any sense or are you really not getting what I am trying to say.

everytime I post you dont' understand it? Is it me, or is it you?

My town reads are going to evaporate if you flip town.