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Author Topic: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)  (Read 126639 times)

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silverspawn

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M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« on: June 15, 2015, 12:54:44 pm »



Setup information in the second post.

Player list:
  • Awaclus - Mafia Roleblocker (Twilight Sparkle playing as Gilda) - Lynched Day 1
  • Teproc - Mafia Strongman (Liara playing as Chrysalis) - Lynched Day 6
  • Hydrad - Universal Backup -> Innocent Child (Rarity playing as Twilight Sparkle) - Died Night 4
  • Joseph - Innocent Child (Colgate playing as Lyra) - Died Night 1
  • Witherweaver replaced by hockeysemlan - Vanilla Townie (Cold Autumn playing as Scootaloo) - Died Night 3
  • skip wooznum - Town Roleblocker (Fluttershy playing as Pinkie Pie) - Died Night 5
  • A Drowned Kernel - Town Doctor (Pinkie Pie playing as Rainbow Dash) - Lynched Day 3
  • Seprix - Mafia Godfather (Applebloom playing as Discord) - Lynched Day 2
  • --- SURVIVED: mail-mi - Vanilla Townie (Scootaloo playing as Applebloom)
  • UmbrageOfSnow - Vanilla Townie (Rainbow Dash playing as Liara) - Died Night 2
  • --- SURVIVED: chairs - Vanilla Townie (Sweetie Belle playing as Sweetie Belle)
  • pacovf - Vanilla Townie (Lyra playing as Cold Autumn) - Lynched Day 4
Tagged: Ichimaru Gin, scott_pilgrim, faust

Navigation:
Day 1 start - Day 1 end
Day 2 start - Day 2 end
Day 3 start - Day 3 end
Day 4 start - Day 4 end
Day 5 start - Day 5 end
Day 6 start - Day 6 end

The Rules of Mafia apply for this game, just like they always do. In addition...
  • Game days will last 10/9/8/7/7... real days. Nights will last 2 real days.
  • You may vote: nolynch. If a majority of these votes is reached, a no-lynch will occur.
  • All Town Players will have personal QT's.
  • Night Actions may be submitted up until an hour before the next day starts.
  • All players who are still alive are required to check in during the night.
  • If the game stalls and neither side is willing to lynch or nightkill a player, mafia will be forced to act.
  • If a player becomes inactive, other players may request prods on him. In extreme cases, further actions may be taken based on the mod's discretion.
  • Alignment will be referenced as Town-Aligned or Mafia-Aligned.
  • Flavor will be based on the TV Show My little Pony: Friendship is Magic aswell as on the forum game mafiascum. You can also play it here. Be sure to check out the Forum Games!
  • Flavornames and posts will not be relevant for anything that happens in the game.
  • It is forbidden to publicly ask for syntax specific questions about PM's from the mod. For example, if someone claims cop, you may not ask how the pm giving him his result is worded.
  • The town wincon is "You win when all mafia players have been eliminated."
  • Mod posts will be purple! Similar colors should be avoided by players.
  • Players may not quote anything from the game outside of this thread while the game is running.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2015, 11:26:13 am by silverspawn »
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silverspawn

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Re: Mafia 64: Witchcraft is Magic
« Reply #1 on: June 15, 2015, 12:55:03 pm »

This game will use asher++, my favorite semi-open f.ds setup, with one small variation: I will randomize three setups instead of one and pick my favorite out of those. I will not tweak them in any other way, so whichever setup ends up being used has still been properly generated.

Setup quote:


Asher9++ is a semi-open setup for 12 players. Setup generation is a randomized process that is open and explained below.

All games include a Universal Back-Up and a Godfather. The remaining 10 roles are determined by rolling six random numbers from 1-100. Each roll is separate. The following number ranges are assigned letters as shown:

1-50: T (Townie. This directly influences scum power roles.) (50/100)
51-60: E (“Either” Cop or Doctor) (10/100)
61-65: C (Cop) (5/100)
66-70: D (Doctor) (5/100)
71-80: V (Vigilante) (10/100)
81-90: M (Mason) (10/100)
91-100: B (Blocker) (10/100)

After the letters have been assigned, the mod refers to the list below to determine which power roles are included.

E Roles*
E = 1-Shot Doctor OR 1-Shot Cop
EE = 1-Shot Doctor OR 1-Shot Cop x2
EEE = Doctor OR Cop; 1-Shot Doctor OR 1-Shot Cop
EEEE = Doctor OR Cop; 1-Shot Doctor OR 1-Shot Cop x2
EEEEE = Doctor OR Cop x2; 1 -Shot Doctor OR 1-Shot Cop
EEEEEE = Doctor OR Cop x2; 1-Shot Doctor OR 1-Shot Cop x2

C Roles
C = 1-Shot Cop
CC = Cop
CCC = Cop; 1-Shot Cop
CCCC = Cop; 1-Shot Cop x2
CCCCC = Cop x2; 1-Shot Cop
CCCCCC = Cop x2; 1-Shot Cop x2

D Roles
D = Doctor
DD = Doctor; 1-Shot Doctor
DDD = Doctor; 1-Shot Doctor x2
DDDD = Doctor x2; 1-Shot Doctor
DDDDD = Doctor x2; 1-Shot Doctor x2
DDDDDD = Doctor x3

Vigilante Roles
V = 1-Shot Vigilante
VV = Vigilante
VVV = Vigilante; 1-Shot Vigilante
VVVV = Vigilante; 1-Shot Vigilante x2
VVVVV = Vigilante x2; 1-Shot Vigilante
VVVVVV = Vigilante x2; 1-Shot Vigilante x2

Mason Roles
M** = 1 Mason
MM = Innocent Child (Confirmed at start of Day 1)
MMM = 2 Masons
MMMM = 2 Masons; Innocent Child
MMMMM = 3 Masons
MMMMMM = 2 Masons; 2 Masons (i.e. two separate pairings)

Blocker Roles
B = Roleblocker
BB = Roleblocker; 1-Shot Roleblocker
BBB = Roleblocker; 1-Shot Roleblocker x2
BBBB = Roleblocker x2; 1-Shot Roleblocker
BBBBB = Roleblocker x2; 1-Shot Roleblocker x2
BBBBBB = Roleblocker x3

Scum Roles (In addition to the Godfather)
TTTTTT*** = Goon x2
TTTTT*** = Goon x2
TTTT = 1-Shot Strongman; Roleblocker
TTT = 1-Shot Strongman; Roleblocker
TT = Strongman; Roleblocker
T = Strongman; Roleblocker
0 Ts = Strongman; Roleblocker; 1-Shot Bulletproof****

After power roles are determined from the table above, Vanilla Townies are added to arrive at 12 players.

* "Or" roles are determined randomly
** Single M rolls result in the Universal Backup converting to a Mason
*** 5 or 6 T rolls result in a scum team of Goon - Goon - Godfather. During N0, the team may elect to have one of the two Goons be 1-Shot Bulletproof. This is optional and not required.
**** If there are zero Ts, one member of the mafia team is randomly 1-Shot Bulletproof.

Clarifications:

--If a 1-Shot PR is the first PR to die, the UB will inherit that role, even if the shot was used up. The UB will not receive a new shot.
--If the Universal Backup converts to a Mason due to a single M roll, that player will not be informed of the conversion.
--Mafia Strongman modifier defeats one doctor protection or roleblocker. If two or more doctors successfully protect the target, the kill will fail. If a doctor protects the target and the Strongman is blocked, the kill will fail.  If two roleblockers target the Strongman, the kill will fail.
--The Bulletproof modifier will be revealed upon death, if selected or assigned.

Awaclus

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Re: Mafia 64: Witchcraft is Magic (Signups Open)
« Reply #2 on: June 15, 2015, 01:42:59 pm »

/in
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Re: Mafia 64: Witchcraft is Magic (Signups Open)
« Reply #3 on: June 15, 2015, 05:01:56 pm »

I don't think I've actually gotten to play asher9++ yet, always ended up on the mod side of things.

Let's rectify that.

/in
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Hydrad

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Re: Mafia 64: Witchcraft is Magic (Signups Open)
« Reply #4 on: June 15, 2015, 05:04:31 pm »

/in

now does silver like a move vanilla game or does he enjoy a more RMM type game. hmmmm.
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Re: Mafia 64: Witchcraft is Magic (Signups Open)
« Reply #5 on: June 15, 2015, 05:06:47 pm »

/in

now does silver like a move vanilla game or does he enjoy a more RMM type game. hmmmm.
RMM I think. /in
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Town: 22 games, 8 wins
Scum: 5 games, 3 wins

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Re: Mafia 64: Witchcraft is Magic (Signups Open)
« Reply #6 on: June 15, 2015, 05:07:19 pm »

/in
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Re: Mafia 64: Witchcraft is Magic (Signups Open)
« Reply #7 on: June 15, 2015, 05:09:08 pm »

/in

now does silver like a move vanilla game or does he enjoy a more RMM type game. hmmmm.

I imagine he would pick whatever the most extreme is. Given the choice betwene two pretty normal setups and one with barely any PR, I think he'd go for the third.

Playing WIFOM with the mod is rarely very successful though, so I doubt knowing that he chose one of three setups will have much of an impact.
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Witherweaver

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Re: Mafia 64: Witchcraft is Magic (Signups Open)
« Reply #8 on: June 15, 2015, 05:12:42 pm »

/in

now does silver like a move vanilla game or does he enjoy a more RMM type game. hmmmm.

I imagine he would pick whatever the most extreme is. Given the choice betwene two pretty normal setups and one with barely any PR, I think he'd go for the third.

Playing WIFOM with the mod is rarely very successful though, so I doubt knowing that he chose one of three setups will have much of an impact.

It's not really WIFOM unless Silver is basing his decision on what people expect him to do with some kind of judgement assignment there.
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pacovf

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Re: Mafia 64: Witchcraft is Magic (Signups Open)
« Reply #9 on: June 15, 2015, 05:21:39 pm »

/in

now does silver like a move vanilla game or does he enjoy a more RMM type game. hmmmm.

I imagine he would pick whatever the most extreme is. Given the choice betwene two pretty normal setups and one with barely any PR, I think he'd go for the third.

Playing WIFOM with the mod is rarely very successful though, so I doubt knowing that he chose one of three setups will have much of an impact.

It's not really WIFOM unless Silver is basing his decision on what people expect him to do with some kind of judgement assignment there.

But that's what he wants you to think!
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Re: Mafia 64: Witchcraft is Magic (Signups Open)
« Reply #10 on: June 15, 2015, 10:17:22 pm »

/in. The first game on this forum that I read through used this setup. M55 I believe
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Re: Mafia 64: Witchcraft is Magic (Signups Open)
« Reply #11 on: June 15, 2015, 10:19:50 pm »

Can night fall completely on a weekend? Or is another 24 hrs added on?
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Ichimaru Gin

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Re: Mafia 64: Witchcraft is Magic (Signups Open)
« Reply #12 on: June 15, 2015, 10:34:41 pm »

/tag for now.

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Re: Mafia 64: Witchcraft is Magic (Signups Open)
« Reply #13 on: June 15, 2015, 11:08:20 pm »

always /in for asher9
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silverspawn

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Re: Mafia 64: Witchcraft is Magic (Signups Open)
« Reply #14 on: June 15, 2015, 11:22:21 pm »

Can night fall completely on a weekend? Or is another 24 hrs added on?

night can completely fall on a weekend. you only need to be there once - I even considered reducing it to just one day.

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Re: Mafia 64: Witchcraft is Magic (Signups Open)
« Reply #15 on: June 15, 2015, 11:47:08 pm »

/tag
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Re: Mafia 64: Witchcraft is Magic (Signups Open)
« Reply #16 on: June 16, 2015, 02:07:44 pm »

Another MLP game?


Oh god.

Sure.

/in
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silverspawn

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Re: Mafia 64: Witchcraft is Magic (Signups Open)
« Reply #17 on: June 16, 2015, 02:09:31 pm »

Another MLP game?

well, why should I make a non-MLP game when I can make an MLP game instead?

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Re: Mafia 64: Witchcraft is Magic (Signups Open)
« Reply #18 on: June 16, 2015, 02:11:59 pm »

Another MLP game?

well, why should I make a non-MLP game when I can make an MLP game instead?

Good point. When I co-make a thread with someone, I think I'll do something like Batman, cuz hey, Batman is cool.

MLP is cool to you. Or specifically, 20% cooler.
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Re: Mafia 64: Witchcraft is Magic (Signups Open)
« Reply #19 on: June 17, 2015, 10:48:54 am »

Apropos flavor, I'm going to change it... a little bit... I hope you don't mind.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open)
« Reply #20 on: June 17, 2015, 02:23:50 pm »

/in for asher9++
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 3 spots left)
« Reply #21 on: June 17, 2015, 03:46:11 pm »

I'd like to /in if you'll have me.

I did vanish from the face of the internet for a long time and I feel deeply ashamed that I hurt the previous mafia games I was in at the time.  That was a unique life-circumstance problem I'd rather not get into at the moment, but I think it unlikely to reoccur.

Obviously if you want to disallow me and see if I'm still posting on the site 3 months from now or something, I understand, but I'd really like to get back to mafia, it was the thing I loved most about this site (yes, more than Dominion.)  Mafia is just so intense and emotional.

Also, I take these games rather seriously and have a tendency toward the verbose, but I am going to try to tone it down a bit from historic levels.

Anyway, I would love to play in this game, but it seemed worth saying all this upfront rather than some weird train of "Oh, I forgot, it's him" and then feeling awkward about telling me not to play or whatever.  If you don't want me due to my vanishing in the past, I understand completely and there are no hard feelings.  But I promise I won't vanish, and I would really like to play if you'll have me.

Yeah, turning the verbosity down...  It's a work in progress!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 3 spots left)
« Reply #22 on: June 17, 2015, 03:52:38 pm »

/tag

I really want in and play with the legendary UmbrageOfSnow... but I'm in three games already, and signed up for one :/ I guess I'll just spectate a bit.
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silverspawn

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 3 spots left)
« Reply #23 on: June 17, 2015, 03:54:53 pm »


I haven't been playing mafia when you were still there, so I don't know anything of the bad stuff you're talking about. You're in - I don't think rereading it will be necessary.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #24 on: June 17, 2015, 03:56:14 pm »

Definitely gonna spend a lot of this game saying, "You know nothing, UmbrageofSnow."
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 3 spots left)
« Reply #25 on: June 17, 2015, 03:58:28 pm »


I haven't been playing mafia when you were still there, so I don't know anything of the bad stuff you're talking about. You're in - I don't think rereading it will be necessary.
Thanks.  I don't mean to be a drama queen (or drama princess for this game?) about this, I just feel bad.  Looking forward to the game.

EDIT: Wither: Oh how I wish upvotes were possible in Forum Games.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2015, 03:59:37 pm by UmbrageOfSnow »
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #26 on: June 17, 2015, 04:00:00 pm »

UmbrageOfSnow has a life. I don't mind.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 3 spots left)
« Reply #27 on: June 17, 2015, 04:03:15 pm »

Yeah, turning the verbosity down...  It's a work in progress!

I feel like forum mafia could use more verbosity these days. But that's just me.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #28 on: June 17, 2015, 04:03:44 pm »

If it's not too much trouble, could someone provide a list of uos's games played on this forum? He's the only player currently signed up for this game that I haven't seen in multiple previous games and id like to get a feel for how he plays

PPE
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #29 on: June 17, 2015, 04:04:03 pm »

Oh, UoS, the hero from the HP game ! Before my time, but that was a fun game to read.

And obviously it's fine, water under the bridge and all that. Most of the people in HP and Clue aren't even playing anymore : looking at the player list so far I only see mail-mi... ash, you're not in for your own setup ?

PPE : ADK clearly hasn't read (or tried to read) MII. Nothing to do with UoS, but the best case for how very long posts are good for scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #30 on: June 17, 2015, 04:04:30 pm »

If it's not too much trouble, could someone provide a list of uos's games played on this forum? He's the only player currently signed up for this game that I haven't seen in multiple previous games and id like to get a feel for how he plays

PPE

Clue and Harry Potter are the big ones off the top of my head.

Edit : There's a Statistics thread stickied that has all the info you'd possibly need. It's not complete yet, but it definitely has those games.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #31 on: June 17, 2015, 04:05:08 pm »

Have I played with the Duke of Wooz before?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #32 on: June 17, 2015, 04:06:37 pm »

Thx teproc. And seprix, ive played one game here so far. Is BM20 and you were in it. Madman, I believe
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 3 spots left)
« Reply #33 on: June 17, 2015, 04:09:21 pm »


I haven't been playing mafia when you were still there, so I don't know anything of the bad stuff you're talking about. You're in - I don't think rereading it will be necessary.
Thanks.  I don't mean to be a drama queen (or drama princess for this game?) about this, I just feel bad.  Looking forward to the game.

EDIT: Wither: Oh how I wish upvotes were possible in Forum Games.

This forum gives second chances. I too vanished after playing 1.5 games, and look at me now!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #34 on: June 17, 2015, 04:10:05 pm »

Oh, that game. That game was meaningless in terms of actual reads.

You got nothing on me. :)

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 3 spots left)
« Reply #35 on: June 17, 2015, 04:11:56 pm »


I haven't been playing mafia when you were still there, so I don't know anything of the bad stuff you're talking about. You're in - I don't think rereading it will be necessary.
Thanks.  I don't mean to be a drama queen (or drama princess for this game?) about this, I just feel bad.  Looking forward to the game.

EDIT: Wither: Oh how I wish upvotes were possible in Forum Games.

This forum gives second chances. I too vanished after playing 1.5 games, and look at me now!

Glad to hear it, thanks everyone.

Looking forward to being immediately lynched for minor differences from my behavior in the distant past.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #36 on: June 17, 2015, 04:12:05 pm »

Oh, that game. That game was meaningless in terms of actual reads.

You got nothing on me. :)
really? I thought when you posted things like "g dee Dee bsjehdhbiskwbwbwkdodjvenkdjwj" it meant you were town (and then part of a cult). But no, i've read through quite a few game logs
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #37 on: June 17, 2015, 04:13:08 pm »

Oh, that game. That game was meaningless in terms of actual reads.

You got nothing on me. :)
really? I thought when you posted things like "g dee Dee bsjehdhbiskwbwbwkdodjvenkdjwj" it meant you were town (and then part of a cult). But no, i've read through quite a few game logs

On my play? I'm just like Faust and IG and Hydrad. I'm pretty much always scummy. :p
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #38 on: June 17, 2015, 04:14:33 pm »

In fact it turns out I have read clue(ish). I sort of got frustrated when certain players weren't just staight up agreeing to that boss hider plan. Any scum games from UoS?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #39 on: June 17, 2015, 04:15:28 pm »

On my play? I'm just like Faust and IG and Hydrad. I'm pretty much always scummy. :p

How am I always scummy? Really, that's interesting, in my perception other players usually have a town read on me.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #40 on: June 17, 2015, 04:15:47 pm »

Oh, that game. That game was meaningless in terms of actual reads.

You got nothing on me. :)
really? I thought when you posted things like "g dee Dee bsjehdhbiskwbwbwkdodjvenkdjwj" it meant you were town (and then part of a cult). But no, i've read through quite a few game logs

On my play? I'm just like Faust and IG and Hydrad. I'm pretty much always scummy. :p
I always think faust is towny
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #41 on: June 17, 2015, 04:16:03 pm »

On my play? I'm just like Faust and IG and Hydrad. I'm pretty much always scummy. :p

How am I always scummy? Really, that's interesting, in my perception other players usually have a town read on me.

has defeated you, Faust. :)
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #42 on: June 17, 2015, 04:16:46 pm »

Ninja'd by faust himself lol
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #43 on: June 17, 2015, 04:17:37 pm »

faust always seems towny and therefore always seems scummy.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #44 on: June 17, 2015, 04:20:19 pm »

faust always seems towny and therefore always seems scummy.

Ash said in the M62 speccy that I seemed towny and was therefore scum... and he was right !
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #45 on: June 17, 2015, 04:22:30 pm »

I don't think faust is actually that hard to read as scum

Teproc, yeah, he did seem scummier in M61 M57 (where he was town) than he did in the game which just finished (where he was scum); so maybe that's a tell.

e is easy, he is scum whenever he's getting me lynched. 3/3 100% success rate.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2015, 04:26:04 pm by silverspawn »
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #46 on: June 17, 2015, 04:24:03 pm »

Teproc, yeah, he did seem scummier in M61 (where he was town) than he did in the game which just finished (where he was scum); so maybe that's a tell.

I wasn't in M61.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #47 on: June 17, 2015, 04:24:43 pm »

Teproc, yeah, he did seem scummier in M61 (where he was town) than he did in the game which just finished (where he was scum); so maybe that's a tell.

I wasn't in M61.

ehh *blarnia. the other game I modded. the one where you were the thing with the protecting where I just reread you

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #48 on: June 17, 2015, 04:27:28 pm »

But I'm completely unreadable.  8)
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #49 on: June 17, 2015, 04:28:39 pm »

But I'm completely unreadable.  8)

Day1PolicyLynch
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #50 on: June 17, 2015, 04:37:05 pm »

Teproc, yeah, he did seem scummier in M61 (where he was town) than he did in the game which just finished (where he was scum); so maybe that's a tell.

I wasn't in M61.

ehh *blarnia. the other game I modded. the one where you were the thing with the protecting where I just reread you

I'm going to disagree with your statement though : I can't be that scummy when I'm town since I've been mislynched exactly once (and that mislynch has changed my way of playing town a lot).
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #51 on: June 17, 2015, 04:39:33 pm »

Oh and I think I purposefully played scummier in that game because... something to do with the weird PR you had given me.

Oh yeah, just because I wanted to avoid being NKed. So that's probably it.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #52 on: June 17, 2015, 04:41:53 pm »

Oh and I think I purposefully played scummier in that game because... something to do with the weird PR you had given me.

Oh yeah, just because I wanted to avoid being NKed. So that's probably it.

I find this logic weird.  I mean I get it on a surface level, but if some townie is playing scummier than usual, why not NK him for this very reason.  Which leads to it not actually preventing NKs.

Of course, I could be out of touch with how these games go down in practice, but in theory I dislike this strategy.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #53 on: June 17, 2015, 04:43:56 pm »

Oh and I think I purposefully played scummier in that game because... something to do with the weird PR you had given me.

Oh yeah, just because I wanted to avoid being NKed. So that's probably it.

I find this logic weird.  I mean I get it on a surface level, but if some townie is playing scummier than usual, why not NK him for this very reason.  Which leads to it not actually preventing NKs.

Of course, I could be out of touch with how these games go down in practice, but in theory I dislike this strategy.

I agree, but I'm someone who gets NKed a lot so I decided to try it out. Turned out okay, though we lost at lylo (I did get NKed eventually).
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #54 on: June 17, 2015, 04:44:42 pm »

Oh and I think I purposefully played scummier in that game because... something to do with the weird PR you had given me.

Oh yeah, just because I wanted to avoid being NKed. So that's probably it.

right... you even announced that in your QT. I forgot.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #55 on: June 17, 2015, 04:46:10 pm »

Scummy when town and townie when scum.  Until being townie when scum makes you look scummy, then be scummy as scum and townie as town.  Dance like a fly, bite like a mosquito.   
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #56 on: June 17, 2015, 05:03:18 pm »

Scummy when town and townie when scum.  Until being townie when scum makes you look scummy, then be scummy as scum and townie as town.  Dance like a fly, bite like a mosquito.   
Anyone have a fly swatter?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #57 on: June 17, 2015, 05:05:47 pm »

though we lost at lylo
does town ever lose at a time other than lylo?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #58 on: June 17, 2015, 05:08:27 pm »

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #59 on: June 17, 2015, 05:10:07 pm »

mail-me
Why silverspawn why? :(

Seems like a perfectly valid request. I'd think you would like sending mail.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #60 on: June 17, 2015, 05:18:50 pm »

though we lost at lylo
does town ever lose at a time other than lylo?

Sometimes at MyLo ;)
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #61 on: June 17, 2015, 05:22:06 pm »

Sometimes at night.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #62 on: June 17, 2015, 05:25:21 pm »

/in

For future reference, I should be auto-in to pony-themed Mafia.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #63 on: June 17, 2015, 05:26:54 pm »

Sometimes at night.

But only if it's the night after MyLo!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #64 on: June 17, 2015, 05:33:10 pm »

Sometimes at night.

But only if it's the night after MyLo!

Or if there is a Vig, or a Hider or other ways for townies to die more than one at a time.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #65 on: June 17, 2015, 05:34:55 pm »

Or if there are competing factions, like multiball or SK.  Pretty sure this happened in MU.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #66 on: June 17, 2015, 05:38:49 pm »

Yeah yeah okay, I meant we lost in a situation where there were 2 town vs 1 scum, which is the quintessential lylo situation in my head.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #67 on: June 17, 2015, 05:40:14 pm »

You lose when you lose.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #68 on: June 17, 2015, 05:40:25 pm »

Yeah yeah okay, I meant we lost in a situation where there were 2 town vs 1 scum, which is the quintessential lylo situation in my head.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #69 on: June 17, 2015, 05:41:04 pm »

One more!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #70 on: June 17, 2015, 05:41:43 pm »

Oh, OR the one guy that can decide the game for town gets modkilled for inactivity causing the SK to win and you to lose even though you correctly pegged like every scum that game and okay it was still LyLo but I'm still a little bit bitter about it
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #71 on: June 17, 2015, 05:47:48 pm »

Oh, OR the one guy that can decide the game for town gets modkilled for inactivity causing the SK to win and you to lose even though you correctly pegged like every scum that game and okay it was still LyLo but I'm still a little bit bitter about it

Which game was that, some RMM ?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #72 on: June 17, 2015, 05:49:35 pm »

/in

For future reference, I should be auto-in to pony-themed Mafia.



noted! with that you just signed up for every mafia game I'll ever host on this forum

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #73 on: June 17, 2015, 05:52:00 pm »

Oh, OR the one guy that can decide the game for town gets modkilled for inactivity causing the SK to win and you to lose even though you correctly pegged like every scum that game and okay it was still LyLo but I'm still a little bit bitter about it

OR OR someone can break the rules at night and get modkilled after scum gets correctly lynched at Lylo!

This is fun and/or slightly acrimonious!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #74 on: June 17, 2015, 05:54:19 pm »




I love the subtle message here, that Rainbow Dash is a Nobody.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 1 spot left!)
« Reply #75 on: June 17, 2015, 05:55:49 pm »

Oh, OR the one guy that can decide the game for town gets modkilled for inactivity causing the SK to win and you to lose even though you correctly pegged like every scum that game and okay it was still LyLo but I'm still a little bit bitter about it

OR OR someone can break the rules at night and get modkilled after scum gets correctly lynched at Lylo!

This is fun and/or slightly acrimonious!

Well, town was losing that game anyway.

Still kids, the lesson is : don't break the rules !
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 1 spot left!)
« Reply #76 on: June 17, 2015, 06:08:33 pm »

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #77 on: June 17, 2015, 06:09:03 pm »

I love the subtle message here, that Rainbow Dash is a Nobody.
...  ??? ?

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...

hammer?

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 1 spot left!)
« Reply #78 on: June 17, 2015, 06:09:41 pm »

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...

Please yes. Have we still only played one game together (ASoIaF) ? This isn't right.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 1 spot left!)
« Reply #79 on: June 17, 2015, 06:10:06 pm »

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...
Do it.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 1 spot left!)
« Reply #80 on: June 17, 2015, 06:20:14 pm »

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...

Please yes. Have we still only played one game together (ASoIaF) ? This isn't right.

If memory serves right, I've only been in 3 games, so it isn't that surprising.

Anyway, /in. First game as a non-newb!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 1 spot left!)
« Reply #81 on: June 17, 2015, 06:21:19 pm »

Weeee! Thread locked (except for /tag's)! Setups will be generated now - PM's will follow shortly.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Full, PM's going out soon)
« Reply #82 on: June 17, 2015, 07:28:15 pm »

Clarification: Every player will receive 2 flavor names - his pony-mafia mafia name and his pony-mafia name, also a fakeclaim for the latter if he is scum. The first one is his flavor name; the second one is your flavor name in the flavor. Try not to be confused too much!

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Full, PM's going out soon)
« Reply #83 on: June 17, 2015, 08:23:14 pm »

Oh, and please confirm (and do all other night Actions) in the QT rather than per PM. Makes it easier to keep track of everything.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (PM's sent, waiting for confirmation)
« Reply #84 on: June 17, 2015, 09:32:24 pm »

Some notes: I didn't include the town wincon in the PM's, since it's in the rules, and I also didn't explain the PRs, since the setup is semi open. If anyone has questions about his role, he can just ask in his QT.

Otherwise, waiting for everyone to confirm.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (PM's sent, waiting for confirmation)
« Reply #85 on: June 18, 2015, 12:44:58 am »

/tag

Sad to miss a game with returning players!
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« Reply #86 on: June 18, 2015, 10:12:24 am »

It was what for many might have been one of the most beautiful days in living memory. Every last colorful equine in the glorious realm of the sun goddess enjoyed a gorgeous spring afternoon, their many lives happily bound together in eternal harmony. Even nature itself seemed to blossom during this most wondrous of days, perhaps delighted by the frequent laughter that could be heard out of each of the occasional patches of civilization, imbedded into an idyllic if not paradisiac landscape.

But never mind all of that.

"Ugh. Why are we doing this, exactly?"

Twilight pouted. "Rainboooow! I told you. It's a social interaction game. It will help us to get to know one another, learn new things, and deepen our mutual friendship!"

At the sound of the word 'friendship', Liara burst out into a barely contempt stream of giggles. Twilight cast her a somewhat displeased look, but she had since come to terms with the fact that the mercurial magician had a somewhat unpredictable temper, not unlike a certain pink bundle of endless laughter which current bounced up and down somewhere to her right.

"Yes, friendship," she said in a sourly tone. "Aaanyway. Does anypony here have any objections to the established rules?"

Rainbow was about to say something else, but Twilight solved the problem by lighting up her horn, performing a highly complicated short range teleportation spell, and reappearing in front of the pegasus, all within the span of less than a second. Without giving her any chance to react, Twilight locked their lips together in a short but passionate kiss, before playfully biting her into the lower lip.

"Mmhhhuhhhmmm..."

"Nopony? Great. Well then, we can start." A bunch of notes from a nearby bookshelf floated towards her in a purple glow. Very purple. "First order of business... player list!"

"Uh, Twilight?" Cold gave her an amused look. "I think we know everypony who's here..."

"Ahem. Player list left parenthesis by order of signing right parenthesis colon... wait no colon. I mean, yes colon, but I didn't mean to spell that out. Anyway. Twilight, Liara, Rarity, Colgate, Cold Autumn, Fluttershy, Pinkie Pie, Applebloom, Scootaloo, Rainbow Dash, Sweetie Belle, and Lyra. Welcome to Pony Mafia!"

Silence.

"Twilight, silly, we are always ponies. Do you want to add 'pony-' before everything we do? Like if I make sweets, is it pony-baking? Or if you and Rainbow Dash make out--"

"No, it's pony mafia because we're being ponies in the game. Every game of mafia needs to have, a, uh..." A book floated towards her from the small round table "... uhm ..." flapflapflap "... flavor ..." the book floated back towards the table, "and each player needs to have a flavor name which is a character in the flavor chosen by the moderator... or, in this case, by myself. And we're playing as ourselves!"

"Awesome. Does this mean I can get myself as a flavor name?"

"Uhm..." ... ... ... flapflap ... flapflapflapflap ... ... ... ... ... flap ... ... "Yes!" This time, she kept the book close to her. "Anyway. Our moderator is Applejack, who due to her element doesn't feel comfortable playing. Take it away."

"Right." In a leisurely stroll, Applejack walked towards the center of the room. "Well then, Twilight gave me all of the the instruction thingies for this here silly lil' game. If y'all all come up and take on of these here cards, y'all find yer role on the backside."

Scene skipped to balance out pacing.

"Dandy. So, Colgate here who is Lyra is an innocent... uh, pony, so she's all friendly harmony aligned and, uh, apples. If y'all wanna vote, just speak the name of whoever ya wanna vote for into this here magic thingy. Oh, and the evil roles between y'all have evil flavor names, so three of you guys aren't really plain', but I can't tell y'all who it is, because I'm not sure but Twilight said so. Day one is starin' right about now..." Twilight threw her an inflictive look "... which is at exactly twelve past ten, and will last 'till ten days from now on. That's all, so y'all can get goin'."

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Day 1 start
« Reply #87 on: June 18, 2015, 10:12:53 am »

Joseph, who is Colgate with flavor name Lyra is an Innocent Child.

Day 1 begins now and will last until June 28, 3 PM forum time.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2015, 10:21:39 am by silverspawn »
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #88 on: June 18, 2015, 10:19:39 am »

Anyone here?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #89 on: June 18, 2015, 10:23:00 am »

Vote: Teproc for standing me up in Paris and leaving me standing alone in the rue with my baguette in my hand.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #90 on: June 18, 2015, 10:23:57 am »

Vote: Teproc for standing me up in Paris and leaving me standing alone in the rue with my baguette in my hand.

Innuendo intentional?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #91 on: June 18, 2015, 10:24:56 am »

[quote author ="silverspawn"]
Rainbow was about to say something else, but Twilight solved the problem by lighting up her horn, performing a highly complicated short range teleportation spell, and reappearing in front of the pegasus, all within the span of less than a second. Without giving her any chance to react, Twilight locked their lips together in a short but passionate kiss, before playfully biting her into the lower lip.
[/quote]

I didn't know Mafia porn was a thing.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #92 on: June 18, 2015, 10:25:33 am »

And now I'm sad because I can't edit that post. :(

Anyways.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #93 on: June 18, 2015, 10:26:22 am »

And now I'm sad because I can't edit that post. :(

Anyways.

Vote for someone.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #94 on: June 18, 2015, 10:27:54 am »

And now I'm sad because I can't edit that post. :(

Anyways.

Vote for someone.

I don't have any reasons to. Friendship is magic!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #95 on: June 18, 2015, 10:28:40 am »

Vote: Seprix
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #96 on: June 18, 2015, 10:29:41 am »

Vote: Seprix

Is this seriously intended?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #97 on: June 18, 2015, 10:33:06 am »

Vote: Seprix

Stop voting my scum partner kthxbye

Vote: Hydrad
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #98 on: June 18, 2015, 10:33:57 am »

Vote: Seprix

Stop voting my scum partner kthxbye

Vote: Hydrad

vote: Mail-Mi

Hey, anyone claims scum is slightly more suspicious than anything else so far.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #99 on: June 18, 2015, 10:38:37 am »

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Vote Count
« Reply #100 on: June 18, 2015, 10:41:10 am »

Vote Count 1.0

Teproc (1): Witherweaver
Seprix (1): Hydrad
Hydrad (1): mail-mi
mail-mi (1): Seprix

Not Voting (8): Awaclus, Teproc, Joseph2302, skip wooznum, A Drowned Kernel, UmbrageOfSnow, chairs, pacovf

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Day 1 ends on June 28, 3 PM forum time.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2015, 01:34:28 pm by silverspawn »
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #101 on: June 18, 2015, 10:42:41 am »

I uh flavour text what

also vote: Mail-mi he was scum in my newbie mafia. Hi Awaclus!

silver is mod'ing so somepony else will have to claim vanilla townie in his stead.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #102 on: June 18, 2015, 10:44:12 am »

Vote: Seprix

Is this seriously intended?

for RVS its pretty intended.

It's okay, Hydrady! We're all friends! ...Even when we brutally murder each other in social fear of retribution, our hands covered in deep red blood of the innocent and guilty alike...
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #103 on: June 18, 2015, 10:45:31 am »

also Joseph you won't be mislynched this game! wooo.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #104 on: June 18, 2015, 10:46:26 am »

Vote: Seprix

Is this seriously intended?

for RVS its pretty intended.

It's okay, Hydrady! We're all friends! ...Even when we brutally murder each other in social fear of retribution, our hands covered in deep red blood of the innocent and guilty alike...

The small text caught me off guard.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #105 on: June 18, 2015, 10:52:13 am »

Vote: Seprix

Is this seriously intended?

for RVS its pretty intended.

It's okay, Hydrady! We're all friends! ...Even when we brutally murder each other in social fear of retribution, our hands covered in deep red blood of the innocent and guilty alike...

The small text caught me off guard.

I know, it was pretty PTSD-MLP inducing.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #106 on: June 18, 2015, 11:16:17 am »

Hi everybody! vote: mail-mi

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #107 on: June 18, 2015, 11:17:01 am »

vote: chairs
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #108 on: June 18, 2015, 11:20:46 am »

Vote: Seprix

Gotta protect my good buddy Liam, I've actually played with him before I think.  More importantly, that flavor was lovely, stop whining about it and give us a kiss Seprix sweetums.

Now, time for setup talk: there's one important thing we know for sure now, scum is a Godfather, a Roleblocker, and either a Strongman or a 1-shot Strongman.  So keeping this in mind, claiming or trying to narrow down other setup options in any way is a bad idea.  We have nothing else to learn beyond whether the Strongman is 1-shot or not, which hardly matters, either way we don't want to rely on any schemes involving a doctor claiming who they are protecting, and scum has quite a bit worth learning.

We might want to consider a mason/non-mason claim or other things like that later on IFF we've got a suspected fakeclaim, but it's too easy for scum to dodge and exploit in general I think.  Claiming schemes are unlikely to work here.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #109 on: June 18, 2015, 11:23:17 am »

Oh, and I meant to also say: This should be an end to all setup talk.

Beyond knowing for sure that there is a mafia roleblocker and an at-least-1-shot strongman we have nothing else to gain.  So back to regularly scheduled RVS which should hopefully become a lot less random soon with these two lovely wagons.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #110 on: June 18, 2015, 11:26:10 am »

Vote: Seprix

Gotta protect my good buddy Liam, I've actually played with him before I think.  More importantly, that flavor was lovely, stop whining about it and give us a kiss Seprix sweetums.

Now, time for setup talk: there's one important thing we know for sure now, scum is a Godfather, a Roleblocker, and either a Strongman or a 1-shot Strongman.  So keeping this in mind, claiming or trying to narrow down other setup options in any way is a bad idea.  We have nothing else to learn beyond whether the Strongman is 1-shot or not, which hardly matters, either way we don't want to rely on any schemes involving a doctor claiming who they are protecting, and scum has quite a bit worth learning.

We might want to consider a mason/non-mason claim or other things like that later on IFF we've got a suspected fakeclaim, but it's too easy for scum to dodge and exploit in general I think.  Claiming schemes are unlikely to work here.

Doesn't everyone have a pony they can claim as their own though?

And Silverspawn is a total fanfiction writer, so it makes sense he'd show off his Rule 34 stuff.


PPE: 1

Oh, and I meant to also say: This should be an end to all setup talk.

Beyond knowing for sure that there is a mafia roleblocker and an at-least-1-shot strongman we have nothing else to gain.  So back to regularly scheduled RVS which should hopefully become a lot less random soon with these two lovely wagons.

Wait, town advocating openly to not talk about set up?

vote: Professor Umbridge

Maybe this is a stretch, but I see no reason to not talk about set-up, even if it is obvious.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #111 on: June 18, 2015, 11:30:24 am »

Doesn't everyone have a pony they can claim as their own though?

Two! We are playing as ponies playing as ponies (or non-ponies, dunno who the bad guys in MLP are).

Also, FoS on Seprix. Just sayin'.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #112 on: June 18, 2015, 11:39:52 am »

Wait, town advocating openly to not talk about set up?

vote: Professor Umbridge

Maybe this is a stretch, but I see no reason to not talk about set-up, even if it is obvious.

Not sure how much is serious (probably none but anyway).  So I read the other game using this setup last night and you would not believe (or you might if you read it) how much excessive confusion there seemed to be about the setup.  It's not that hard, but to the way some people's brain's work I think it actually is.  Given the amount of what turned out to be legitimately town confusion in that game, it's important that we all know there is a roleblocker, godfather, and some kind of strongman for sure, 100% here.

But any speculation beyond that is dangerous  because a roleblocker and a strongman are really good at getting around town power roles and the more we talk about it the more we risk those being guessed.  There are 924 possible setups in this system, and while that can be narrowed down substantially, it can't be narrowed nearly enough to be actually useful to town.  But scum have half as many viable setups to consider as town do, and a heck of a lot more to gain by solving it right now.  And reasonable odds of being able to come up with actually, legitimately safe power claims.

I don't know who a bunch of the characters in the flavor are, but that hint that there is a theme to the scum flavor-flavor names seems unlikely to be helpful at all without some scum flips to base it on.  That might be worth talking about at some point I guess,
but power role related discussion needs to be kept to a minimum, and in a setup like this it could be dangerously tempting.

There is a godfather, a roleblocker, and a strongmane (1-shot or otherwise).  That's all we know and all we should discuss on that front.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #113 on: June 18, 2015, 11:47:48 am »

It's also worth noting that if anyone is a cop, vig, or mason, then that person knows the strongman is not a 1-shot
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #114 on: June 18, 2015, 12:09:41 pm »

Wait, town advocating openly to not talk about set up?

vote: Professor Umbridge

Maybe this is a stretch, but I see no reason to not talk about set-up, even if it is obvious.

Not sure how much is serious (probably none but anyway).  So I read the other game using this setup last night and you would not believe (or you might if you read it) how much excessive confusion there seemed to be about the setup.  It's not that hard, but to the way some people's brain's work I think it actually is.  Given the amount of what turned out to be legitimately town confusion in that game, it's important that we all know there is a roleblocker, godfather, and some kind of strongman for sure, 100% here.

But any speculation beyond that is dangerous  because a roleblocker and a strongman are really good at getting around town power roles and the more we talk about it the more we risk those being guessed.  There are 924 possible setups in this system, and while that can be narrowed down substantially, it can't be narrowed nearly enough to be actually useful to town.  But scum have half as many viable setups to consider as town do, and a heck of a lot more to gain by solving it right now.  And reasonable odds of being able to come up with actually, legitimately safe power claims.

I don't know who a bunch of the characters in the flavor are, but that hint that there is a theme to the scum flavor-flavor names seems unlikely to be helpful at all without some scum flips to base it on.  That might be worth talking about at some point I guess,
but power role related discussion needs to be kept to a minimum, and in a setup like this it could be dangerously tempting.

There is a godfather, a roleblocker, and a strongman (1-shot or otherwise).  That's all we know and all we should discuss on that front.

Fair enough.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #115 on: June 18, 2015, 12:10:19 pm »

It's also worth noting that if anyone is a cop, vig, or mason, then that person knows the strongman is not a 1-shot

This could be important.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #116 on: June 18, 2015, 12:13:01 pm »

It's also worth noting that if anyone is a cop, vig, or mason, then that person knows the strongman is not a 1-shot

This could be important.

It's useless for town purposes at the moment.  It's true, but we shouldn't talk about it.  One shot of strongman is enough to get by any claiming-protection schemes.  Drop it.

@Skip: If you had to, gun to your head, vote for one of me, Seprix, and Mail-mi right now, who would you vote for and why?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #117 on: June 18, 2015, 12:14:41 pm »

@Skip: If you had to, gun to your head, vote for one of me, Seprix, and Mail-mi right now, who would you vote for and why?

What kind of question is that? It's Day 1.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #118 on: June 18, 2015, 12:17:17 pm »

@Skip: If you had to, gun to your head, vote for one of me, Seprix, and Mail-mi right now, who would you vote for and why?

What kind of question is that? It's Day 1.

Why are you questioning/discouraging us from moving on from RVS?

Day 1 doesn't have to be random.  My vote on you is no longer random, for example.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #119 on: June 18, 2015, 12:18:22 pm »

@Skip: If you had to, gun to your head, vote for one of me, Seprix, and Mail-mi right now, who would you vote for and why?

What kind of question is that? It's Day 1.

Why are you questioning/discouraging us from moving on from RVS?

Day 1 doesn't have to be random.  My vote on you is no longer random, for example.

So questioning the groupthink gets you lynched? That's bullshit. :/
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #120 on: June 18, 2015, 12:19:02 pm »

@WW : I feel really bad about that, though I also stood up a longtime friend for her birthday, I was legit really sick.

UoS nailed everything there is to say about this setup, most importantly that the least we talk about it, the better.

vote: Seprix

PPE : 3
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #121 on: June 18, 2015, 12:20:03 pm »

@Skip: If you had to, gun to your head, vote for one of me, Seprix, and Mail-mi right now, who would you vote for and why?

What kind of question is that? It's Day 1.

Why are you questioning/discouraging us from moving on from RVS?

Day 1 doesn't have to be random.  My vote on you is no longer random, for example.

So questioning the groupthink gets you lynched? That's bullshit. :/

No, but trying to act as if day 1 didn't matter and asking serious questions was bad is scummy. RVS is useless, the faster we get out of it, the better for town.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #122 on: June 18, 2015, 12:21:33 pm »

No, but trying to act as if day 1 didn't matter and asking serious questions was bad is scummy. RVS is useless, the faster we get out of it, the better for town.

Yeah, true.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #123 on: June 18, 2015, 12:43:41 pm »

Vote: Teproc for standing me up in Paris and leaving me standing alone in the rue with my baguette in my hand.

Innuendo intentional?

Baguettes are a big thing in Paris.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #124 on: June 18, 2015, 12:44:49 pm »

As they should. How you people even survive without them is beyond me.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #125 on: June 18, 2015, 12:45:14 pm »

@WW : I feel really bad about that, though I also stood up a longtime friend for her birthday, I was legit really sick.

UoS nailed everything there is to say about this setup, most importantly that the least we talk about it, the better.

vote: Seprix

PPE : 3

I actually decided I was going to open with that for the next game I played with you, so I've been waiting for a while.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #126 on: June 18, 2015, 12:46:41 pm »

As they should. How you people even survive without them is beyond me.

Well, we have them, but it's emulated.  But bread was better in France, hands down.  Coffee too.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #127 on: June 18, 2015, 12:58:21 pm »

The French have nice bread. But the difference is not as perceptible as with croissants. If you've never had a French croissant, you've never had a croissant, period.

Anyway I like what UoS is doing here. Vote: Seprix.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #128 on: June 18, 2015, 01:04:31 pm »

Well, I don't see any real way out of this. I don't see any better lynches, except maybe Hydrad. The only thing I can say is this: Why am I even a good lynch? Because I'm asking questions?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #129 on: June 18, 2015, 01:06:06 pm »

Besides, I retract my vote on Umbrage. He's putting in some actual good points. I will revert back to Hydrad.

vote: Hydrad
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #130 on: June 18, 2015, 01:06:51 pm »

Well, I don't see any real way out of this. I don't see any better lynches, except maybe Hydrad. The only thing I can say is this: Why am I even a good lynch? Because I'm asking questions?

Do you genuinely think this is why people are voting for you ?

PPE : Evidently not...
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #131 on: June 18, 2015, 01:08:30 pm »

Well, I don't see any real way out of this.

 ??? You don't need a real way out of anything during the first hours of D1.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #132 on: June 18, 2015, 01:09:59 pm »

Pardon me if I am a bit worried. I have 4 people voting for me, and this thread hasn't even reached page 6 yet.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #133 on: June 18, 2015, 01:11:46 pm »

Pardon me if I am a bit worried. I have 4 people voting for me

That's convenient, I was about to ask how many votes you have, but it seems like I don't have to do that now.

Vote: Seprix
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #134 on: June 18, 2015, 01:12:59 pm »

Pardon me if I am a bit worried. I have 4 people voting for me, and this thread hasn't even reached page 6 yet.

But we are on page 6!  Check and mate.

Why Hydrad over Mail-mi?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #135 on: June 18, 2015, 01:13:12 pm »

Wow. It's like if you have any reaction at all, you're automatically scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #136 on: June 18, 2015, 01:14:01 pm »

But we are on page 6!  Check and mate.

We're on page 3.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #137 on: June 18, 2015, 01:16:25 pm »

But we are on page 6!  Check and mate.

We're on page 3.
I mean if you have it set to 50 messages per page we are.  If your connection is terrible and you keep it at 25 we're on page 6!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #138 on: June 18, 2015, 01:17:52 pm »

But we are on page 6!  Check and mate.

We're on page 3.
I mean if you have it set to 50 messages per page we are.  If your connection is terrible and you keep it at 25 we're on page 6!

The actual game didn't start until page 4.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #139 on: June 18, 2015, 01:19:41 pm »

But we are on page 6!  Check and mate.

We're on page 3.
I mean if you have it set to 50 messages per page we are.  If your connection is terrible and you keep it at 25 we're on page 6!

The actual game didn't start until page 4.

Respond to the non-joke part of the post, my 25-per-page brother.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #140 on: June 18, 2015, 01:21:52 pm »

Well, I don't want to distract from the game.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #141 on: June 18, 2015, 01:22:14 pm »

Pardon me if I am a bit worried. I have 4 people voting for me, and this thread hasn't even reached page 6 yet.

Early wagons are always on town!  Get yourself to L-1, then you'll be an IC.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #142 on: June 18, 2015, 01:23:11 pm »

I have no clue what scum!Seprix would look like.  He could not possibly be scummier than town!Seprix.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #143 on: June 18, 2015, 01:24:19 pm »

He was scum in Flavourless, you can read that.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #144 on: June 18, 2015, 01:25:21 pm »

Well, I don't want to distract from the game.

You keep distracting from the game!  Questions about your reasoning are much more relevant than page number!

(Although I'll sheep the opinion that French bread is delicious.)
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #145 on: June 18, 2015, 01:25:59 pm »

He was scum in Flavourless, you can read that.

I was in that game, apparently.  I remember very little of it.  Maybe because it left no.. impression, no pop, no pizzazz, no taste, no ... flavor.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #146 on: June 18, 2015, 01:27:05 pm »

Hey, Seprix had a really quick Day 1 wagon there too~
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #147 on: June 18, 2015, 01:27:46 pm »

Well, I don't want to distract from the game.

You keep distracting from the game!  Questions about your reasoning are much more relevant than page number!

(Although I'll sheep the opinion that French bread is delicious.)

...Which is why I directed everything back to discussion. :p

Hey, Seprix had a really quick Day 1 wagon there too~

Haha. That always happens in most games. I'm an easy target. I haven't figured out why that is yet.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #148 on: June 18, 2015, 01:28:48 pm »

UoS wants to know why you are voting Hydrad instead of Mail-mi.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #149 on: June 18, 2015, 01:29:00 pm »

Oh, or I don't remember because I was night killed on the first night.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #150 on: June 18, 2015, 01:31:26 pm »

UoS wants to know why you are voting Hydrad instead of Mail-mi.

Well, I voted Hydrad not so seriously because he joked about scum partners. I don't see why Mail-Mi would be lynch material, I'd have to go look at what he said.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #151 on: June 18, 2015, 01:32:44 pm »

Wait a second here.

WHAT!?

I read Mail-Mi's post as if Hydrad posted that. Yeah, I meant to vote for Mail-Mi. Wow.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #152 on: June 18, 2015, 01:33:33 pm »

unvote

I don't think I'll vote for Mail-Mi over that now, anyways.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #153 on: June 18, 2015, 01:35:23 pm »

You voted for Mail-Mi first...
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #154 on: June 18, 2015, 01:36:09 pm »

Ugh. I'm confused. I'm sorry.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #155 on: June 18, 2015, 01:36:19 pm »

It's also worth noting that if anyone is a cop, vig, or mason, then that person knows the strongman is not a 1-shot

This could be important.

It's useless for town purposes at the moment.  It's true, but we shouldn't talk about it.  One shot of strongman is enough to get by any claiming-protection schemes.  Drop it.

@Skip: If you had to, gun to your head, vote for one of me, Seprix, and Mail-mi right now, who would you vote for and why?
seprix. Because I think he'd be least helpful as town.

PPE: everything since that question
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #156 on: June 18, 2015, 01:36:34 pm »

Vote Count 1.1

Seprix (5): Hydrad, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc, pacovf, Awaclus
mail-mi (1): chairs
Hydrad (1): mail-mi
chairs (1): skip wooznum
Teproc (1): Witherweaver

Not Voting (3): Joseph2302, A Drowned Kernel, Seprix

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Day 1 ends on June 28, 3 PM forum time.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2015, 03:48:27 pm by silverspawn »
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #157 on: June 18, 2015, 01:37:52 pm »

My vote on you is no longer random, for example.
this kind of justifying a previous rvs, I don't like.

Again, PPE
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #158 on: June 18, 2015, 01:38:37 pm »

Silver, you break my heart by misspelling my username so  :'(
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #159 on: June 18, 2015, 01:43:11 pm »

Well, I don't see any real way out of this. I don't see any better lynches, except maybe Hydrad. The only thing I can say is this: Why am I even a good lynch? Because I'm asking questions?
I don't know how to quote two posts, but this and the next one are weird. Way out of what, the game just started?  What did hydrad do?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #160 on: June 18, 2015, 01:44:16 pm »

I will revert back to Hydrad.

vote: Hydrad
when were you on hydrad?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #161 on: June 18, 2015, 01:45:13 pm »

I will revert back to Hydrad.

vote: Hydrad
when were you on hydrad?

I confused Mail-Mi with Hydrad. I'm in college right now, with only 3 hours of sleep.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #162 on: June 18, 2015, 01:47:44 pm »

My vote on you is no longer random, for example.
this kind of justifying a previous rvs, I don't like.

Again, PPE

I concur; I've actually only ever seen  scum do this, I think.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #163 on: June 18, 2015, 01:48:04 pm »

Tentative town on Seprix.  Scum usually doesn't forget who they're voting for, even in RVS.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #164 on: June 18, 2015, 02:22:31 pm »

My vote on you is no longer random, for example.
this kind of justifying a previous rvs, I don't like.

Again, PPE

I concur; I've actually only ever seen  scum do this, I think.

Really ? It seems pretty normal to me : you RVS someone, then you get a real (thgouh weak because early, but still) reason that would push you to vote so you just say that... why would scum even want to do this particularly ?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #165 on: June 18, 2015, 02:25:29 pm »

Vote: WW

because I want to see him lynched day 1 once.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #166 on: June 18, 2015, 02:27:24 pm »

Vote: WW

because I want to see him lynched day 1 once.

Didn't you notice we were out of RVS ? There's actual stuff you could be commenting on.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #167 on: June 18, 2015, 02:29:58 pm »

silver, you break my heart by misspelling my username so  :'(

sorry! fixed.

Hydrad

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #168 on: June 18, 2015, 02:31:18 pm »

Vote: WW

because I want to see him lynched day 1 once.

Didn't you notice we were out of RVS ? There's actual stuff you could be commenting on.

dang it but I enjoy a bit of RVS!

anyways on seprix I guess slight town for him confusing those posts around.

On Umbrage I am liking him sofar also but don't have any sort of read yet.
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mail-mi

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #169 on: June 18, 2015, 02:32:15 pm »

unvote

Hydrad seems like good old Hydrad.
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skip wooznum

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #170 on: June 18, 2015, 02:44:11 pm »

My vote on you is no longer random, for example.
this kind of justifying a previous rvs, I don't like.

Again, PPE

I concur; I've actually only ever seen  scum do this, I think.

Really ? It seems pretty normal to me : you RVS someone, then you get a real (thgouh weak because early, but still) reason that would push you to vote so you just say that... why would scum even want to do this particularly ?
obviously there is also a town narrative, I wasn't claiming otherwise. But I can totally see scum feeling like they have to justify an rvs, or planning an rvs on someone they can easily 'find scummy'
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #171 on: June 18, 2015, 02:44:41 pm »

Vote: Seprix

Is this seriously intended?

for RVS its pretty intended.

It's okay, Hydrady! We're all friends! ...Even when we brutally murder each other in social fear of retribution, our hands covered in deep red blood of the innocent and guilty alike...

Small text is against the rules.
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A Drowned Kernel

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #172 on: June 18, 2015, 02:46:19 pm »

Vote: Seprix

Gotta protect my good buddy Liam, I've actually played with him before I think.  More importantly, that flavor was lovely, stop whining about it and give us a kiss Seprix sweetums.

Now, time for setup talk: there's one important thing we know for sure now, scum is a Godfather, a Roleblocker, and either a Strongman or a 1-shot Strongman.  So keeping this in mind, claiming or trying to narrow down other setup options in any way is a bad idea.  We have nothing else to learn beyond whether the Strongman is 1-shot or not, which hardly matters, either way we don't want to rely on any schemes involving a doctor claiming who they are protecting, and scum has quite a bit worth learning.

We might want to consider a mason/non-mason claim or other things like that later on IFF we've got a suspected fakeclaim, but it's too easy for scum to dodge and exploit in general I think.  Claiming schemes are unlikely to work here.

Doesn't everyone have a pony they can claim as their own though?

And Silverspawn is a total fanfiction writer, so it makes sense he'd show off his Rule 34 stuff.


PPE: 1

Oh, and I meant to also say: This should be an end to all setup talk.

Beyond knowing for sure that there is a mafia roleblocker and an at-least-1-shot strongman we have nothing else to gain.  So back to regularly scheduled RVS which should hopefully become a lot less random soon with these two lovely wagons.

Wait, town advocating openly to not talk about set up?

vote: Professor Umbridge

Maybe this is a stretch, but I see no reason to not talk about set-up, even if it is obvious.

This setup is pretty unbreakable, and he's just pointing that out. I see nothing suspicious about that.
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A Drowned Kernel

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #173 on: June 18, 2015, 02:47:34 pm »

Vote: Teproc for standing me up in Paris and leaving me standing alone in the rue with my baguette in my hand.

Innuendo intentional?

Baguettes are a big thing in Paris.

...Innuendo intentional?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #174 on: June 18, 2015, 02:48:35 pm »

I have no clue what scum!Seprix would look like.  He could not possibly be scummier than town!Seprix.

Yeah, pretty much this.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #175 on: June 18, 2015, 02:49:06 pm »

Uh more later, I thought I had more time than I actually do.
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UmbrageOfSnow

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #176 on: June 18, 2015, 02:50:48 pm »

My vote on you is no longer random, for example.
this kind of justifying a previous rvs, I don't like.

Again, PPE

I concur; I've actually only ever seen  scum do this, I think.

Really ? It seems pretty normal to me : you RVS someone, then you get a real (thgouh weak because early, but still) reason that would push you to vote so you just say that... why would scum even want to do this particularly ?
obviously there is also a town narrative, I wasn't claiming otherwise. But I can totally see scum feeling like they have to justify an rvs, or planning an rvs on someone they can easily 'find scummy'

It's weird that you think that's a justification.

It's much weirder that Wither agreed with you and strengthened it to "something only scum do" especially without actually voting for me.

Vote: Witherweaver
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #177 on: June 18, 2015, 02:52:12 pm »

My vote on you is no longer random, for example.
this kind of justifying a previous rvs, I don't like.

Again, PPE

I concur; I've actually only ever seen  scum do this, I think.

Really ? It seems pretty normal to me : you RVS someone, then you get a real (thgouh weak because early, but still) reason that would push you to vote so you just say that... why would scum even want to do this particularly ?
obviously there is also a town narrative, I wasn't claiming otherwise. But I can totally see scum feeling like they have to justify an rvs, or planning an rvs on someone they can easily 'find scummy'

It's weird that you think that's a justification.

It's much weirder that Wither agreed with you and strengthened it to "something only scum do" especially without actually voting for me.

Vote: Witherweaver

You know nothing, UmbrageOfSnow.
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chairs

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #178 on: June 18, 2015, 03:29:17 pm »

This looks like a job for the Cutie Mark Crusaders!

skip wooznum

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #179 on: June 18, 2015, 03:31:00 pm »

My vote on you is no longer random, for example.
this kind of justifying a previous rvs, I don't like.

Again, PPE

I concur; I've actually only ever seen  scum do this, I think.

Really ? It seems pretty normal to me : you RVS someone, then you get a real (thgouh weak because early, but still) reason that would push you to vote so you just say that... why would scum even want to do this particularly ?
obviously there is also a town narrative, I wasn't claiming otherwise. But I can totally see scum feeling like they have to justify an rvs, or planning an rvs on someone they can easily 'find scummy'

It's weird that you think that's a justification.


maybe justification is the wrong word. I can easily see scum rvs'ing and then later changing it to a real vote because "oh he's actually pretty scummy".  Town can change their minds too, but to explicitly point out for our benefit that your vote is now, in fact, a real vote is something I see as scummy.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #180 on: June 18, 2015, 03:40:43 pm »

Dunno, seems pretty normal to me.

I have to re-read Flavourless's D1, where Seprix went under heavy suspicion as scum, and compare to what's going on right now. I don't think I want to lynch Umbrage either way though. Sensible players are good for town whether they are town or scum, IMHO (if they are scum, they tend to dig their own grave).

Anyway, keeping my vote on Seprix for the time being.

I would like to hear more from chairs!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #181 on: June 18, 2015, 03:42:40 pm »

Oh, and silverspawn, my username is still misspelled in the last vote count and in the player list in the first post. Not like I really mind, but since you said you fixed it, I want to make sure that you actually know how my username is spelled :P.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #182 on: June 18, 2015, 03:47:03 pm »

also Joseph you won't be mislynched this game! wooo.
I haven't been mislynched early for a couple of games.

Oh, and I meant to also say: This should be an end to all setup talk.

Beyond knowing for sure that there is a mafia roleblocker and an at-least-1-shot strongman we have nothing else to gain.  So back to regularly scheduled RVS which should hopefully become a lot less random soon with these two lovely wagons.
Vote: UmbrageOfSnow, because RVs is not that fun. Also, because we haven't played together before-welcome!

Pardon me if I am a bit worried. I have 4 people voting for me

That's convenient, I was about to ask how many votes you have, but it seems like I don't have to do that now.

Vote: Seprix
Someone want to hammer this? Joking of course. Although I'm innocent, so don't lynch me.

My vote on you is no longer random, for example.
this kind of justifying a previous rvs, I don't like.

Again, PPE

I concur; I've actually only ever seen  scum do this, I think.
Yh, doesn't seem super-scummy.

Vote: Seprix

Gotta protect my good buddy Liam, I've actually played with him before I think.  More importantly, that flavor was lovely, stop whining about it and give us a kiss Seprix sweetums.

Now, time for setup talk: there's one important thing we know for sure now, scum is a Godfather, a Roleblocker, and either a Strongman or a 1-shot Strongman.  So keeping this in mind, claiming or trying to narrow down other setup options in any way is a bad idea.  We have nothing else to learn beyond whether the Strongman is 1-shot or not, which hardly matters, either way we don't want to rely on any schemes involving a doctor claiming who they are protecting, and scum has quite a bit worth learning.

We might want to consider a mason/non-mason claim or other things like that later on IFF we've got a suspected fakeclaim, but it's too easy for scum to dodge and exploit in general I think.  Claiming schemes are unlikely to work here.

Doesn't everyone have a pony they can claim as their own though?

And Silverspawn is a total fanfiction writer, so it makes sense he'd show off his Rule 34 stuff.


PPE: 1

Oh, and I meant to also say: This should be an end to all setup talk.

Beyond knowing for sure that there is a mafia roleblocker and an at-least-1-shot strongman we have nothing else to gain.  So back to regularly scheduled RVS which should hopefully become a lot less random soon with these two lovely wagons.

Wait, town advocating openly to not talk about set up?

vote: Professor Umbridge

Maybe this is a stretch, but I see no reason to not talk about set-up, even if it is obvious.

This setup is pretty unbreakable, and he's just pointing that out. I see nothing suspicious about that.
I agree, especially as ss had 3 setups to choose from, so if one of them was reasonably easily breakable, I don't think he'd have chosen that one.

My vote on you is no longer random, for example.
this kind of justifying a previous rvs, I don't like.

Again, PPE

I concur; I've actually only ever seen  scum do this, I think.

Really ? It seems pretty normal to me : you RVS someone, then you get a real (thgouh weak because early, but still) reason that would push you to vote so you just say that... why would scum even want to do this particularly ?
obviously there is also a town narrative, I wasn't claiming otherwise. But I can totally see scum feeling like they have to justify an rvs, or planning an rvs on someone they can easily 'find scummy'

It's weird that you think that's a justification.


maybe justification is the wrong word. I can easily see scum rvs'ing and then later changing it to a real vote because "oh he's actually pretty scummy".  Town can change their minds too, but to explicitly point out for our benefit that your vote is now, in fact, a real vote is something I see as scummy.
I guess, seems a tad unlikely though.

PPE:2
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silverspawn

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #183 on: June 18, 2015, 03:50:08 pm »

Oh, and silverspawn, my username is still misspelled in the last vote count and in the player list in the first post. Not like I really mind, but since you said you fixed it, I want to make sure that you actually know how my username is spelled :P.

ah... there are so many ways your name can be misspelled!

A Drowned Kernel

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #184 on: June 18, 2015, 05:15:59 pm »

I think I like vote: skip wooznum at the moment.
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mail-mi

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #185 on: June 18, 2015, 05:16:37 pm »

I think I like vote: skip wooznum at the moment.

Why? He doesn't seem particularly scummy or townie to me right now.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #186 on: June 18, 2015, 05:23:23 pm »

I think I like vote: skip wooznum at the moment.

Why? He doesn't seem particularly scummy or townie to me right now.

Does anyone seem particularly scummy or townie to you right now?

ADK, you can still answer his question, though.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #187 on: June 18, 2015, 06:19:30 pm »

I think I like vote: skip wooznum at the moment.

Why? He doesn't seem particularly scummy or townie to me right now.

He does seem somewhat scummy to me right now.
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Seprix

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #188 on: June 18, 2015, 06:22:32 pm »

I think I like vote: skip wooznum at the moment.

Why? He doesn't seem particularly scummy or townie to me right now.

He does seem somewhat scummy to me right now.

Anything specific, or in general?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #189 on: June 18, 2015, 06:25:16 pm »

[snip]

obviously there is also a town narrative, I wasn't claiming otherwise. But I can totally see scum feeling like they have to justify an rvs, or planning an rvs on someone they can easily 'find scummy'

Posts like this read as somewhat hedgey/cautious to me. He's pushing a case, but not strongly, and his basis for his case is relatively safe while being something he could later back off on. Basically, he looks like he's making an effort to be active and helpful without really making any waves.
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skip wooznum

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #190 on: June 18, 2015, 06:33:28 pm »

[snip]

obviously there is also a town narrative, I wasn't claiming otherwise. But I can totally see scum feeling like they have to justify an rvs, or planning an rvs on someone they can easily 'find scummy'

Posts like this read as somewhat hedgey/cautious to me. He's pushing a case, but not strongly, and his basis for his case is relatively safe while being something he could later back off on. Basically, he looks like he's making an effort to be active and helpful without really making any waves.
well, my original post calling UoS out was one line, I didn't think it was damning evidence at the time, and still don't. Then teproc questioned it so I felt I should explain myself in greater length. I wasnt going to push a lynch based on this, it's just nobody even pointed it out. I wouldn't say that post you quoted was hedgey, so much as it was my actual opinion
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #191 on: June 18, 2015, 06:41:29 pm »

vote: chairs

So what's this vote about then? Why are you voting for chairs?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #192 on: June 18, 2015, 06:47:10 pm »

Well..... rvs
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #193 on: June 18, 2015, 06:50:11 pm »

Do you have any non-RVS opinions at the moment?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #194 on: June 18, 2015, 06:50:55 pm »

ADK has smelled blood!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #195 on: June 18, 2015, 06:56:40 pm »

Do you have any non-RVS opinions at the moment?
seprix is slight town for forgetting whom he voted, I don't think that was faked but even if its genuine it doesn't prove anything.
UoS is slight scum for my previously stated reason.
Adk is slight town for pushing me when nobody previously did. Maybe I flatter myself but I don't think I was an ideal choice for a scum mislynch at that point
Teproc is slight scum for not scumhunting harder. He has a reputation as a great town player in I seem to remember seeing him getting more involved this early
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #196 on: June 18, 2015, 07:02:25 pm »

Teproc is slight scum for not scumhunting harder. He has a reputation as a great town player in I seem to remember seeing him getting more involved this early

It's 1AM on a friday morning in the country of the gallic rooster. We'll allow it.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #197 on: June 18, 2015, 07:04:15 pm »

Adk is slight town for pushing me when nobody previously did. Maybe I flatter myself but I don't think I was an ideal choice for a scum mislynch at that point

Flattery eh? You should know I have a general policy of being suspicious of people who claim to find my towny.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #198 on: June 18, 2015, 07:05:25 pm »

Adk is slight town for pushing me when nobody previously did. Maybe I flatter myself but I don't think I was an ideal choice for a scum mislynch at that point

Flattery eh? You should know I have a general policy of being suspicious of people who claim to find my towny.
who says I didn't
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #199 on: June 18, 2015, 07:15:06 pm »

Teproc is slight scum for not scumhunting harder. He has a reputation as a great town player in I seem to remember seeing him getting more involved this early

It's 1AM on a friday morning in the country of the gallic rooster. We'll allow it.
he was here earlier but seemed more interested in baguettes
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #200 on: June 18, 2015, 11:08:25 pm »

Oh, and silverspawn, my username is still misspelled in the last vote count and in the player list in the first post. Not like I really mind, but since you said you fixed it, I want to make sure that you actually know how my username is spelled :P.

ah... there are so many ways your name can be misspelled!

Yay, my username is written correctly now! <3

Back to the game:

In Flavourless, Seprix was scum. He was jokey, considered D1 is pointless and random, he was very eager to get joseph (first wagon) lynched, then kinda backed off super quickly when it turned out bad for him. It's kinda similar from what is happening here, but one would guess that he would have mixed things up if he was scum again. Besides, I can't really compare with his town meta, I haven't really been following the recent games.

ADK has gone hard on skip based on hedginess. But this is only skip's second game on f.ds. Had you played somewhere else before, skip?

skip has done a weak move on UoS based on the RVS-turned-serious-vote argument. WW kinda sheeped that without voting.

Mail-mi has joked that he is scum, rvs for Hydrad, unvoted in his next post, then done a super-hedgy defense of skip.

I think that's all? Based on this, I am quite happy to go back to vote: Mail-mi. I could see Seprix, maybe, for overall scuminess. Maybe, maaaaybe ADK, because I don't know if he is scumhunting or witch-hunting. Everything else seems very weak right now.

joseph and especially chairs need to post more. I mean I know it's been less than 24h, so there's time.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #201 on: June 18, 2015, 11:34:26 pm »



ADK has gone hard on skip based on hedginess. But this is only skip's second game on f.ds. Had you played somewhere else before, skip?

not really. I played a couple games with friends on groupme, which is a smartphone app similar to whatsapp, if anyone knows what I'm talking about. But we were basically fooling around.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #202 on: June 18, 2015, 11:36:45 pm »

And I didn't read mail-mi's post as a defense, more of a question posed to adk to see what explanation would be given.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #203 on: June 18, 2015, 11:40:43 pm »

vote count?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #204 on: June 19, 2015, 12:19:33 am »

And I didn't read mail-mi's post as a defense, more of a question posed to adk to see what explanation would be given.

I would agree with you if it were pretty much anyone but mail-mi who asked that question. But since it was mail-mi who asked, I am instantly suspicious.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #205 on: June 19, 2015, 04:12:55 am »


It's weird that you think that's a justification.

It's much weirder that Wither agreed with you and strengthened it to "something only scum do" especially without actually voting for me.

Vote: Witherweaver

You know nothing, UmbrageOfSnow.

vote: Witherweaver

There's a reason I quoted WW, not skip, when questioning the "justifying an RVS vote" reasoning. He's encouraging suspicion based on dubious reasons without actually taking part... and when confronted, has nothing to say about it. Perhaps hoping we'd just move on ? I won't, town!WW is more engaged than this, and wouldn't only post the jokey response. He would do that and follow it up with an actual post of significance. Here his only post of significance is "yeah, that thing is totally scummy, you go ahead and lynch that guy".
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #206 on: June 19, 2015, 07:53:56 am »

Vote Count 1.2

UmbrageOfSnow (1): Joseph2302
Seprix (1): Awaclus
Witherweaver (3): Hydrad, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc
mail-mi (2): chairs, pavovf
chairs (1): skip wooznum
skip wooznum (1): A Drowned Kernel
Teproc (1): Witherweaver

Not Voting (2): Seprix, mail-mi

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Day 1 ends on June 28, 3 PM forum time.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #207 on: June 19, 2015, 08:29:06 am »

Oooh ooh oooh, I think Teproc may be scum :)

ADK is probably town.

New_Player_001's point on Snow was a good one, not sure why people don't see it.  Next time I won't make a comment on anything without voting, as it's so obvscum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #208 on: June 19, 2015, 08:31:35 am »

Probably town on the guy that brought it up, go.  Not really sure on Snow as the rest of his stuff hasn't seemed scummy. 
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #209 on: June 19, 2015, 08:52:00 am »

New_Player_001's point on Snow was a good one, not sure why people don't see it.  Next time I won't make a comment on anything without voting, as it's so obvscum.

Commenting without voting isn't that scummy, though it is strange to me that you'd keep your RVS vote rather than moving it if you found it genuinely scummy.

What's scummy to me is more your lack of serious response.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #210 on: June 19, 2015, 08:53:54 am »

Oooh ooh oooh, I think Teproc may be scum :)

I'm interested to hear more, but it's also worth noting that you're here doing the exact thing skip found scummy in UoS and you agreed with. It happens all the time, and I still have no idea why it would be scummy.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #211 on: June 19, 2015, 09:02:51 am »

Omgurd the irony, right?

It's scummy to write a short novel and a letter to your senator to justify a vote on someone.

Vote: Teproc if it makes you feel better.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #212 on: June 19, 2015, 09:04:01 am »

Well I should say, especially when you're jumping in on a wagon.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #213 on: June 19, 2015, 09:23:27 am »

Vote: WW
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #214 on: June 19, 2015, 09:35:21 am »

I bet if I make a  joke here ADK will be 100% convinced I've scum.  I think I've seen this episode before.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #215 on: June 19, 2015, 09:49:28 am »

I fail to see how Teproc's post was "a short novel", nor why attempting to justify a vote is scummy, nor how being the second person to vote for someone is "jumping in on a wagon". To me it looks like you're trying to disarm your wagon and discredit people who are voting for you.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #216 on: June 19, 2015, 09:53:19 am »

I fail to see how Teproc's post was "a short novel", nor why attempting to justify a vote is scummy, nor how being the second person to vote for someone is "jumping in on a wagon". To me it looks like you're trying to disarm your wagon and discredit people who are voting for you.

I thought he was third, and I was obviously exaggerating, but his post reads pretty clearly overexplained.   
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #217 on: June 19, 2015, 09:57:21 am »

You're right that he's third, my mistake. But I disagree that his post is "overexplained".
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #218 on: June 19, 2015, 09:58:46 am »

You're right that he's third, my mistake. But I disagree that his post is "overexplained".

If you say so.  It sets off a lot of scum alarms for me, though. 
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #219 on: June 19, 2015, 10:09:04 am »

So, I am a bit confused by WW's position here. Can you walk me through your thought process ever since the "I've only ever seen scum do it" post?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #220 on: June 19, 2015, 10:20:41 am »

So, I am a bit confused by WW's position here. Can you walk me through your thought process ever since the "I've only ever seen scum do it" post?

Placing an RVS vote on someone and then later on saying "This is now a real vote" is something I only recall seeing scum do (in particular, ADK twice as scum).  Snow said something similar like this in regards to his vote on Seprix I think.  Someone (Skip?) pointed it out, and I thought, "Hey, good point."  I didn't vote there.  That's weird I guess, okay.  It wasn't really enough for me to want to vote right then.  It actually did more for assigning town points, as I was thinking, "I like this line of reasoning."
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #221 on: June 19, 2015, 10:21:57 am »

I fail to see how Teproc's post was "a short novel", nor why attempting to justify a vote is scummy, nor how being the second person to vote for someone is "jumping in on a wagon". To me it looks like you're trying to disarm your wagon and discredit people who are voting for you.
I agree with ADK here. Vote: WW.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #222 on: June 19, 2015, 10:22:24 am »

This is L-2 I believe.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #223 on: June 19, 2015, 10:22:42 am »

Actually, it's your recent exchange with Teproc that confuses me the most.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #224 on: June 19, 2015, 10:23:45 am »

Actually, it's your recent exchange with Teproc that confuses me the most.

His post where he votes for me looks like he's trying to come up with justification to vote for me and not him really thinking I look scummy.  So, Teproc looks scummy. 
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #225 on: June 19, 2015, 10:23:56 am »

This is L-2 I believe.

Sweet, early wagons are on town.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #226 on: June 19, 2015, 10:24:15 am »

Or they don't result in a lynch, or something.  I don't remember what the mantra is.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #227 on: June 19, 2015, 10:30:21 am »

Actually, it's your recent exchange with Teproc that confuses me the most.

His post where he votes for me looks like he's trying to come up with justification to vote for me and not him really thinking I look scummy.  So, Teproc looks scummy.

Well, your post about "writing a letter to your senator" sounds quite disingenuous too...
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #228 on: June 19, 2015, 10:51:42 am »

I'm not really sure how disingenuous is supposed to apply there.  Are you suggesting that I was artificially hyperbolizing Teproc's position in older to bolster mine?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #229 on: June 19, 2015, 11:01:03 am »

4 lines is hardly "a short novel and a letter to your senator". You were not simply exaggerating, you were misrepresenting the truth. Plus, Teproc likes justifying his position, so a short paragraph is hardly indicative of anything.

Anyway, your reaction seems to be mostly OMGUS. I still prefer my vote on Mail-mi.

BTW, be the change you want to see in the world, vote: mail-mi!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #230 on: June 19, 2015, 11:02:20 am »

This is L-2 I believe.

Sweet, early wagons are on town.

Actually, I've found that the second guy isn't so safe from the games I've played. I think WW is town though.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #231 on: June 19, 2015, 11:03:23 am »

4 lines is hardly "a short novel and a letter to your senator". You were not simply exaggerating, you were misrepresenting the truth. Plus, Teproc likes justifying his position, so a short paragraph is hardly indicative of anything.

Anyway, your reaction seems to be mostly OMGUS. I still prefer my vote on Mail-mi.

BTW, be the change you want to see in the world, vote: mail-mi!

The thing was, Teproc was basically sheeping Snow's vote, but he added all this extra stuff to it.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #232 on: June 19, 2015, 11:05:30 am »

This is L-2 I believe.

Sweet, early wagons are on town.

Actually, I've found that the second guy isn't so safe from the games I've played. I think WW is town though.

Why?

4 lines is hardly "a short novel and a letter to your senator". You were not simply exaggerating, you were misrepresenting the truth. Plus, Teproc likes justifying his position, so a short paragraph is hardly indicative of anything.

Anyway, your reaction seems to be mostly OMGUS. I still prefer my vote on Mail-mi.

BTW, be the change you want to see in the world, vote: mail-mi!

The thing was, Teproc was basically sheeping Snow's vote, but he added all this extra stuff to it.

Mmmmm...
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #233 on: June 19, 2015, 11:07:21 am »


It's weird that you think that's a justification.

It's much weirder that Wither agreed with you and strengthened it to "something only scum do" especially without actually voting for me.

Vote: Witherweaver

You know nothing, UmbrageOfSnow.

vote: Witherweaver

There's a reason I quoted WW, not skip, when questioning the "justifying an RVS vote" reasoning. He's encouraging suspicion based on dubious reasons without actually taking part... and when confronted, has nothing to say about it. Perhaps hoping we'd just move on ? I won't, town!WW is more engaged than this, and wouldn't only post the jokey response. He would do that and follow it up with an actual post of significance. Here his only post of significance is "yeah, that thing is totally scummy, you go ahead and lynch that guy".

Looks fine to me. I think Teproc is mistaken about WW, but he does have a point here.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #234 on: June 19, 2015, 11:10:23 am »

Reply to Pacovf because I'm on my phone currently: WW seems genuine to me right now. Yes, I know that's not a 'great' reason. But I don't think he's scum right now.

I should do a reads thing soon though, because besides Mail-Mi, no one else is potentially scum, and we have two other guys thus far.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #235 on: June 19, 2015, 11:13:36 am »

What is your position on Mail-mi, again? I recall you saying that you didn't really feel like voting for him now.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #236 on: June 19, 2015, 11:19:09 am »

What is your position on Mail-mi, again? I recall you saying that you didn't really feel like voting for him now.

I said Mail-Mi was scummy to me, but I didn't say why I didn't vote for him. Firstly, I confused Mail with Hydrad (3 hours of sleep does this), and when I realized my mistake, I was at L-1, so I didn't want to look like I was trying to throw votes around, hoping they stick. I want to be a bit more careful this time around, I always switch votes all of the time in my previous games. I feel like I should vote for Mail now.

vote: mail-mi
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #237 on: June 19, 2015, 11:21:34 am »

Vote Count 1.3

Seprix (1): Awaclus
Witherweaver (5): Hydrad, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc, A Drowned Kernel, Joseph2302
mail-mi (3): chairs, pacovf, Seprix
chairs (1): skip wooznum
Teproc (1): Witherweaver

Not Voting (1): mail-mi

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Day 1 ends on June 28, 3 PM forum time.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2015, 12:08:38 pm by silverspawn »
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #238 on: June 19, 2015, 11:31:01 am »

3 votes on mail-mi, that's a wagon! Quick, everybody get on board! There's a limited number of spots, you don't want to be out when the hammer arrives!

Vote Count 1.3

Seprix (1): Awaclus
Witherweaver (5): Hydrad, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc, A Drowned Kernel, Joseph2302
mail-mi (3): chairs, pavovf, Seprix
chairs (1): skip wooznum
Teproc (1): Witherweaver

Not Voting (1): mail-mi

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Day 1 ends on June 28, 3 PM forum time.

You did it again. I thought we were frieeeeeeeeeeeeends  :'(
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #239 on: June 19, 2015, 11:31:23 am »

Just call him Pavlov. 
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #240 on: June 19, 2015, 11:32:24 am »

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #241 on: June 19, 2015, 11:33:14 am »

Vote: pavovf

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #242 on: June 19, 2015, 11:37:36 am »

Vote: pavovf

I appreciate it, but it's just not the same if it's not ashersky doing it.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #243 on: June 19, 2015, 11:38:34 am »

So WW, did you reread or re-skim that flavorless game where Seprix was scum that you mentioned?

Also, could you elaborate on whether it's the phrasing or the action of having an RVS vote become serious that you object to?  And what's the psychological rationale behind that?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #244 on: June 19, 2015, 11:39:55 am »

What is your position on Mail-mi, again? I recall you saying that you didn't really feel like voting for him now.

I said Mail-Mi was scummy to me, but I didn't say why I didn't vote for him. Firstly, I confused Mail with Hydrad (3 hours of sleep does this), and when I realized my mistake, I was at L-1, so I didn't want to look like I was trying to throw votes around, hoping they stick. I want to be a bit more careful this time around, I always switch votes all of the time in my previous games. I feel like I should vote for Mail now.

vote: mail-mi

I thought you should have been voting for him yesterday, and for what it's worth I wouldn't have seen that as throwing your vote around, just correcting a mistake.

So why are you voting for Mail-mi again?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #245 on: June 19, 2015, 11:42:06 am »

4 lines is hardly "a short novel and a letter to your senator". You were not simply exaggerating, you were misrepresenting the truth. Plus, Teproc likes justifying his position, so a short paragraph is hardly indicative of anything.

Anyway, your reaction seems to be mostly OMGUS. I still prefer my vote on Mail-mi.

BTW, be the change you want to see in the world, vote: mail-mi!

The thing was, Teproc was basically sheeping Snow's vote, but he added all this extra stuff to it.

So first I was overexplaining, now it's all about sheeping ? What's next, OMGUS, somehow ? WW is clearly stretching here, though I'm not entirely sure why yet.

@pacovf : could you reiterate your mail-mi case ? I think I must have missed something there.

@Awaclus : I mean I get the joke, but let's not add too much confusion to things.

PPE : 3
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #246 on: June 19, 2015, 11:44:32 am »

Meh im not feeling the ww wagon, though I should probably cast a real vote sooner rather than later. I'll decide today sometime.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #247 on: June 19, 2015, 11:44:55 am »

So WW, did you reread or re-skim that flavorless game where Seprix was scum that you mentioned?

Also, could you elaborate on whether it's the phrasing or the action of having an RVS vote become serious that you object to?  And what's the psychological rationale behind that?

I skimmed.. he looked normal Seprix scummy, maybe not quite as scummy as his usual town self.  I believe I at one point thought  "eh, it's just normal Seprix" so didn't pursue the lynch heavily, but I was only around for Day 1.

I'm not exactly sure about the psychological rationale.  Maybe it's something like, votes get noticed, and scum doesn't like to get noticed, so they don't want to move their vote around a lot.

PPE
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #248 on: June 19, 2015, 11:46:33 am »

So first I was overexplaining, now it's all about sheeping ? What's next, OMGUS, somehow ? WW is clearly stretching here, though I'm not entirely sure why yet.

This seems a bit like an intentional misrepresentation. 
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skip wooznum

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #249 on: June 19, 2015, 11:48:47 am »

So first I was overexplaining, now it's all about sheeping ? What's next, OMGUS, somehow ? WW is clearly stretching here, though I'm not entirely sure why yet.

This seems a bit like an intentional misrepresentation.
I dont think it was intentional. Is it scummy if it's unintentional?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #250 on: June 19, 2015, 12:03:10 pm »

So first I was overexplaining, now it's all about sheeping ? What's next, OMGUS, somehow ? WW is clearly stretching here, though I'm not entirely sure why yet.

This seems a bit like an intentional misrepresentation. 

How so ? You said you found me scummy because I overexplained. So far so good, I can see how you get that read. Then, when it seems like people disagree with that read, you add that I was sheeping. How did I misinterpret anything so far ?
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Witherweaver

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #251 on: June 19, 2015, 12:03:53 pm »

So first I was overexplaining, now it's all about sheeping ? What's next, OMGUS, somehow ? WW is clearly stretching here, though I'm not entirely sure why yet.

This seems a bit like an intentional misrepresentation.
I dont think it was intentional. Is it scummy if it's unintentional?

Well, no
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Witherweaver

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #252 on: June 19, 2015, 12:05:50 pm »

So first I was overexplaining, now it's all about sheeping ? What's next, OMGUS, somehow ? WW is clearly stretching here, though I'm not entirely sure why yet.

This seems a bit like an intentional misrepresentation. 

How so ? You said you found me scummy because I overexplained. So far so good, I can see how you get that read. Then, when it seems like people disagree with that read, you add that I was sheeping. How did I misinterpret anything so far ?

Wasn't it obvious from the beginning that you were jumping on the wagon?  I mean, I even said it:

Well I should say, especially when you're jumping in on a wagon.

It's misrepresenting because you're trying to make some kind of an argument where I'm trying to grasp at things to make a point stand.  People were asking questions and I was responding to them.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #253 on: June 19, 2015, 12:06:54 pm »

Jumping on a wagon = sheeping ?

So any lynch is composed of a bunch of people sheeping for you ?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #254 on: June 19, 2015, 12:07:33 pm »

Jumping on a wagon = sheeping ?

So any lynch is composed of a bunch of people sheeping for you ?

Did you read your original post?  Did I just make it up or something?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #255 on: June 19, 2015, 12:08:20 pm »

You did it again. I thought we were frieeeeeeeeeeeeends  :'(

arghfflllps... I forgot to fix your name in the name file. now it really shouldn't happen again.

Vote: pavovf

Not counting this vote - if you want it to count, revote.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #256 on: June 19, 2015, 12:10:17 pm »

Is it just me or does this ww/teproc fight seem a tad scum vs. scum?
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Seprix

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #257 on: June 19, 2015, 12:12:13 pm »

Is it just me or does this ww/teproc fight seem a tad scum vs. scum?

Probably just you.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #258 on: June 19, 2015, 12:12:58 pm »

The paranoid in me has been whispering that in my ear for a while now.

The other part is heating up popcorn.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #259 on: June 19, 2015, 12:15:51 pm »

Is it just me or does this ww/teproc fight seem a tad scum vs. scum?

I'm okay with that.  Let's lynch Teproc.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #260 on: June 19, 2015, 12:16:01 pm »

Jumping on a wagon = sheeping ?

So any lynch is composed of a bunch of people sheeping for you ?

Did you read your original post?  Did I just make it up or something?

Here's the thing : accusing me of overexplaining and sheeping is contradictory. The first one I can see, because I added on to UoS' argument against you was that you didn't vote when you called him scummy. I kind of agreed with hat but much bigger for me was your refusal to respond when first asked about it.

So there you go, overexplaining is indeed something that can be scummy, fine.

Sheeping is taking someone else's argument and just running with it. That's also something scum can do (though I doubt scum!me would), but it's explicitely contradictory with the other thing.

So yes, you are stretching because you feel pressured right now. I'm tempted to think that you are doing that because you want to discredit me, though that seems somewhat simplistic. If you're town though, I'm not sure why you'd do this, as you're a better town player than that.

PPE : 4
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #261 on: June 19, 2015, 12:18:42 pm »

You're arguing semantics here.  Your post with the vote on me read like "Yeah Snow is right, I want to vote WW.  But I need better reasons, so let's reiterate his argument, and throw  in this, and this, and this, and yeah now I have a good argument."
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #262 on: June 19, 2015, 12:21:56 pm »

Right, that's the "overexplaining argument", which, again, I can see how town!you could read my vote that way. What I find scummy is how defensive you are of your read on me, to the point that you're looking for standard vague scummy buzzwords like "sheeping" to back it up when pressed on it.
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UmbrageOfSnow

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #263 on: June 19, 2015, 12:26:28 pm »

Is it just me or does this ww/teproc fight seem a tad scum vs. scum?

WW's recent responses seem absurd to me.  Like he's opposed to the very concept of building a case or trying to convince people to vote for wagons you're jumping onto.  It's not just a semantic argument.

And my vote was not primarily about WW questioning me without voting, while we're on that topic.  My vote was a lot closer to the reasoning that teproc articulated, that WW was seeing if he could start something by supporting specious reasoning.  The logic there seems to be nonsense, and I have a hard time believing he's never seen town have an RVS vote become a serious vote.  I have an easy time believing he'd like to encourage town-on-town mutual suspicions over silly things.

Seprix, what's your reasoning about Mail-mi?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #264 on: June 19, 2015, 12:28:52 pm »

Right, that's the "overexplaining argument", which, again, I can see how town!you could read my vote that way. What I find scummy is how defensive you are of your read on me, to the point that you're looking for standard vague scummy buzzwords like "sheeping" to back it up when pressed on it.

That's not even going on, and I don't understand how you're not understanding what I'm saying.

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Witherweaver

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #265 on: June 19, 2015, 12:30:01 pm »

Is it just me or does this ww/teproc fight seem a tad scum vs. scum?

WW's recent responses seem absurd to me.  Like he's opposed to the very concept of building a case or trying to convince people to vote for wagons you're jumping onto.  It's not just a semantic argument.

And my vote was not primarily about WW questioning me without voting, while we're on that topic.  My vote was a lot closer to the reasoning that teproc articulated, that WW was seeing if he could start something by supporting specious reasoning.  The logic there seems to be nonsense, and I have a hard time believing he's never seen town have an RVS vote become a serious vote.  I have an easy time believing he'd like to encourage town-on-town mutual suspicions over silly things.

Seprix, what's your reasoning about Mail-mi?

Yes, let me sit back and twirl my whiskers and watch the world burn.
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chairs

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #266 on: June 19, 2015, 12:32:33 pm »

I just can't even right now.

vote: ww. I feel like this is going to be like the early Joseph games, where if we don't lynch you we just keep going back to "ought we?" and you're as good a choice as any D1 in my mind.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #267 on: June 19, 2015, 12:34:42 pm »

I just can't even right now.

vote: ww. I feel like this is going to be like the early Joseph games, where if we don't lynch you we just keep going back to "ought we?" and you're as good a choice as any D1 in my mind.

You're in this game ?

I believe this is L-1, have to check.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #268 on: June 19, 2015, 12:35:05 pm »

Uh L-1 people please don't hammer.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #269 on: June 19, 2015, 12:37:18 pm »

I just can't even right now.

vote: ww. I feel like this is going to be like the early Joseph games, where if we don't lynch you we just keep going back to "ought we?" and you're as good a choice as any D1 in my mind.

Will me flipping town indicate to you that it's a bad wagon?  Because I can save you some time right there: it's a bad wagon.
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UmbrageOfSnow

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #270 on: June 19, 2015, 12:37:26 pm »

WW:  Why have you a couple of times now tried to reduce my reason for voting for you to being about you not voting for me?  Did you find my initial post unclear on that point?  (Non-rhetorical question, I'm serious.)
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #271 on: June 19, 2015, 12:38:27 pm »

Yep, it's L-1. chairs, did you know it was L-1 ?

Obviously don't hammer, need more time to discuss etc.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #272 on: June 19, 2015, 12:38:33 pm »

WW:  Why have you a couple of times now tried to reduce my reason for voting for you to being about you not voting for me?  Did you find my initial post unclear on that point?  (Non-rhetorical question, I'm serious.)

I had thought that was the point.  If I had voted for you instead of saying "Hey, good point here", would you have voted for me?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #273 on: June 19, 2015, 12:39:07 pm »

Yep, it's L-1. chairs, did you know it was L-1 ?

Obviously don't hammer, need more time to discuss etc.

"I don't want to be so obviously driving this mislynch this soon!  Quick!  Where's the reverse?!"
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #274 on: June 19, 2015, 12:39:49 pm »

WW:  Why have you a couple of times now tried to reduce my reason for voting for you to being about you not voting for me?  Did you find my initial post unclear on that point?  (Non-rhetorical question, I'm serious.)

I had thought that was the point.  If I had voted for you instead of saying "Hey, good point here", would you have voted for me?

I also didn't carefully read your post where you voted for me, so maybe I made some assumptions.
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Witherweaver

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #275 on: June 19, 2015, 12:41:56 pm »

Quote
It's much weirder that Wither agreed with you and strengthened it to "something only scum do" especially without actually voting for me.

Vote: Witherweaver

I'm not really sure what you're saying now.

I don't remember seeing town do it.  I remember seeing ADK do it, as scum, twice.  These two things are facts, and I don't see why it's an issue.
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UmbrageOfSnow

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #276 on: June 19, 2015, 12:42:31 pm »

WW:  Why have you a couple of times now tried to reduce my reason for voting for you to being about you not voting for me?  Did you find my initial post unclear on that point?  (Non-rhetorical question, I'm serious.)

I had thought that was the point.  If I had voted for you instead of saying "Hey, good point here", would you have voted for me?

I mean, it was an additional part of the point, but not the main one.  But I'm realizing that might not have been clear enough.  Yes, I would have also voted for you if you voted for me.  So if you had missed that, then would you agree that Teproc's explanation helped establish the case on you more clearly?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #277 on: June 19, 2015, 12:43:24 pm »

WW:  Why have you a couple of times now tried to reduce my reason for voting for you to being about you not voting for me?  Did you find my initial post unclear on that point?  (Non-rhetorical question, I'm serious.)

I had thought that was the point.  If I had voted for you instead of saying "Hey, good point here", would you have voted for me?

I mean, it was an additional part of the point, but not the main one.  But I'm realizing that might not have been clear enough.  Yes, I would have also voted for you if you voted for me.  So if you had missed that, then would you agree that Teproc's explanation helped establish the case on you more clearly?

No, because his explanation was in regards to results that happened after that point.
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silverspawn

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #278 on: June 19, 2015, 12:44:08 pm »

Vote Count 1.4

Seprix (1): Awaclus
Witherweaver (6): Hydrad, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc, A Drowned Kernel, Joseph2302, chairs {L-1}
mail-mi (2): pacovf, Seprix
chairs (1): skip wooznum
Teproc (1): Witherweaver

Not Voting (1): mail-mi

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Day 1 ends on June 28, 3 PM forum time.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #279 on: June 19, 2015, 12:47:08 pm »

I don't want to lynch ww this early and I dont like how chairs joined this wagon
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #280 on: June 19, 2015, 12:48:06 pm »

No, because his explanation was in regards to results that happened after that point.
Some of it was, but this sentence in particular:
He's encouraging suspicion based on dubious reasons without actually taking part
Is what I was trying to say.  I found that helpful, and his additional point about your reply went beyond sheeping, but even if he'd sheeped me, his reexplaining my point more clearly was apparently helpful.

Why didn't you read my post where I voted for you closely?
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UmbrageOfSnow

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #281 on: June 19, 2015, 12:55:42 pm »

Mail-mi is online.  Have any post-RVS opinions Mail-mi?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #282 on: June 19, 2015, 12:56:25 pm »

No, because his explanation was in regards to results that happened after that point.
Some of it was, but this sentence in particular:
He's encouraging suspicion based on dubious reasons without actually taking part
Is what I was trying to say.  I found that helpful, and his additional point about your reply went beyond sheeping, but even if he'd sheeped me, his reexplaining my point more clearly was apparently helpful.

Why didn't you read my post where I voted for you closely?

Okay, I see, but I don't consider the reasoning to really be dubious; the suspicion was good.  I don't feel bad about encouraging it, either. 

So if the argument is that I'm scum fanning flames, that makes some sense, as I get to watch town hurt themselves and don't have to get directly involved myself, which is kind of nice because then I would be less accountable.  But, I'm not sure fanning flames is as productive to lead to lynches as that might suggest.  A better argument would be that it's an easy thing to say to make it look like I'm involved in the game.

To the latter question, work and two other games.  Sometimes I check things on my phone, too (I don't recall if I did in this case), and that tends to lead to more scanning.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #283 on: June 19, 2015, 12:57:42 pm »

I asked this already, but it seems to have been lost in the shuffle : can someone explain the case of mail-mi, if there is one ?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #284 on: June 19, 2015, 01:00:09 pm »

Seprix, what's your reasoning about Mail-mi?

He's only posted in this game a total of 3 times. It's almost like he's lurking. Also, his first post was about being scum partners, which I would let slide, as it's not evidence on it's own. But then his next two posts are just voting for Hydrad, an then unvoting for Hydrad, and nothing else. He hasn't contributed at all, he's totally lurking too because he posted a lot in the other Mafia game he's in, but not posting here? Hrmmm...
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #285 on: June 19, 2015, 01:04:11 pm »

3 posts:
RVS-scumjoke for hydrad
unvote Hydrad
hedgy defense of skip

The unvote is suspicious, looks like "hey guys I am active!" and it's doing absolutely nothing.
The defense sets off alarms for its extreme hedging, "I am going to defend skip but I don't want to commit to anything".

mail-mi tends to not post much, so you have to read between the lines much more than for other players. ]
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #286 on: June 19, 2015, 01:04:50 pm »

WW:  I'd consider stirring up town-on-town antagonism much based on something you don't truly believe (which is my opinion about your scumtell here) to be much scummier than trying to appear active.  I won't claim to be any kind of expert on your meta but you didn't appear to be faking activity in the scum game of yours I skimmed.  Do you think you do that as scum?

I mean I realize that's a loaded question, so maybe it's better if other regular players answer that too, but I was not under the impression that fake activity was what I should be looking for from WW.

Also, if you don't know why scum should be more likely to do a thing than town (due to differing win conditions or psychology) why would you suspect that thing to be a scumtell?  If it's based purely on your own experience, why say this:
New_Player_001's point on Snow was a good one, not sure why people don't see it.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #287 on: June 19, 2015, 01:07:36 pm »

I did know it was L-1.

I appreciate all the reactions.

vote: Teproc.  Sorry to worry you, WW, I just wanted to see what Teproc would do to an unannounced L-1 :)

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #288 on: June 19, 2015, 01:08:34 pm »

3 posts:
RVS-scumjoke for hydrad
unvote Hydrad
hedgy defense of skip

The unvote is suspicious, looks like "hey guys I am active!" and it's doing absolutely nothing.
The defense sets off alarms for its extreme hedging, "I am going to defend skip but I don't want to commit to anything".

mail-mi tends to not post much, so you have to read between the lines much more than for other players. ]

To be fair the case was from before this whole discussion exploded, so I should reexamine where my vote is. But I don't want mail-mi to get off with it so easily either.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #289 on: June 19, 2015, 01:08:59 pm »

I did know it was L-1.

I appreciate all the reactions.

vote: Teproc.  Sorry to worry you, WW, I just wanted to see what Teproc would do to an unannounced L-1 :)

Bah.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #290 on: June 19, 2015, 01:09:11 pm »

I have been lurking indeed; yesterday was busy. I should be on more today to answer any questions.

No that was not a hedge defense of skip, I just wanted to see what ADK's reasoning is.

I think Teproc and WW are of the same alignment. Whether that's town or scum, I don't know.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #291 on: June 19, 2015, 01:09:47 pm »

I have been lurking indeed; yesterday was busy. I should be on more today to answer any questions.

No that was not a hedge defense of skip, I just wanted to see what ADK's reasoning is.

I think Teproc and WW are of the same alignment. Whether that's town or scum, I don't know.

If Teproc is scum, Mail-Mi is highly likely to be scum as well.  It is known.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #292 on: June 19, 2015, 01:09:58 pm »

Yep, it's L-1. chairs, did you know it was L-1 ?

Obviously don't hammer, need more time to discuss etc.

Uh, Chairs? Why is this scummy?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #293 on: June 19, 2015, 01:12:36 pm »

So chairs, what reaction from Teproc would have led you to thinking he was town?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #294 on: June 19, 2015, 01:12:46 pm »

WW:  I'd consider stirring up town-on-town antagonism much based on something you don't truly believe (which is my opinion about your scumtell here) to be much scummier than trying to appear active.  I won't claim to be any kind of expert on your meta but you didn't appear to be faking activity in the scum game of yours I skimmed.  Do you think you do that as scum?

I mean I realize that's a loaded question, so maybe it's better if other regular players answer that too, but I was not under the impression that fake activity was what I should be looking for from WW.

Also, if you don't know why scum should be more likely to do a thing than town (due to differing win conditions or psychology) why would you suspect that thing to be a scumtell?  If it's based purely on your own experience, why say this:
New_Player_001's point on Snow was a good one, not sure why people don't see it.
?

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I'm not sure the relevance to my meta here.  In general, scum tries to appear active and that's a scum tell.  Individual metas change that, but I wouldn't expect you (having never played with me) to be making a metaheavy argument on me.

If every time X has happened (or even some majority of times), Y happens, what's wrong with being okay with Y when X, even if you don't know why?  (That was a cool sentence.)
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #295 on: June 19, 2015, 01:18:20 pm »

I've never played with you, but I made a point to read a scum game of yours last night, and I'm trying to do that with everyone.

You're right that I've never played with you, which is a much better way to get a feel for these things, which is why I want other people to chime in on this.  But I don't expect trying to fake activity from players with your attitude/style/whatever anyway I think.  I could be crazy here, but it's just not the main thing I'm looking for.  And applying general purpose scum tells to players where that would not seem to fit their personality doesn't seem really great.  I find it strange that you want me to do that instead.

And what I'm getting at is that if it's your personal experience rather than something psychological/strategic (which I believe are the only scumtells that make sense, but that's not an argument we need to have right now) then why would you be surprised that other people didn't agree with you?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #296 on: June 19, 2015, 01:20:27 pm »

The larger point I'm driving at here is that WW's actions seem inconsistent with thinking about actual scumhunting and more consistent with stirring up shit.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #297 on: June 19, 2015, 01:21:51 pm »

I've never played with you, but I made a point to read a scum game of yours last night, and I'm trying to do that with everyone.

You're right that I've never played with you, which is a much better way to get a feel for these things, which is why I want other people to chime in on this.  But I don't expect trying to fake activity from players with your attitude/style/whatever anyway I think.  I could be crazy here, but it's just not the main thing I'm looking for.  And applying general purpose scum tells to players where that would not seem to fit their personality doesn't seem really great.  I find it strange that you want me to do that instead.

And what I'm getting at is that if it's your personal experience rather than something psychological/strategic (which I believe are the only scumtells that make sense, but that's not an argument we need to have right now) then why would you be surprised that other people didn't agree with you?

Ah, well, good point.  It's hard for me to see things from not me perspectives.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #298 on: June 19, 2015, 01:24:35 pm »

Yep, it's L-1. chairs, did you know it was L-1 ?

Obviously don't hammer, need more time to discuss etc.

Uh, Chairs? Why is this scummy?

Teproc appeared to be really, really pushing WW to me (maybe your impression will be different). I'm of the opinion that if you're pushing a wagon, you don't throw the brakes when the wagon gets to the edge of the cliff.

As far as WW's behavior - it's generated a lot of interaction on D1. That's something we reliably struggle with, imho, to the point that I almost ignore D1 in Normal (not RMM) games out of habit. Sure, he's been abrasive, but abrasive has led to a lot of opportunities for us to review each other on later Days after flips, which is the best part of forum Mafia, right?

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #299 on: June 19, 2015, 01:25:56 pm »

But about faking activity, etc., I think it's kind of a universal scum tell, some people are just better at it.  It's hard to post as scum, you have to say things, you have to worry about how those things will be said, you second guess yourself a lot, etc. Posts have a tendency to come out contrived.  Do mine come out contrived?  Well, I have no idea.  Obviously to me they do, because I'm the one that contrived them.  I'm always surprised when people don't see things I do that I think are really scummy as blatantly scummy when I'm scum, and even more surprised when people suspect me when I feel so naturally in my town state of mind.  I can't really generate enough of a neutral perspective to really read how much of my town state of mind and scum state of mind come out in a given game. 
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #300 on: June 19, 2015, 01:29:29 pm »

I have been lurking indeed; yesterday was busy. I should be on more today to answer any questions.

No that was not a hedge defense of skip, I just wanted to see what ADK's reasoning is.

I think Teproc and WW are of the same alignment. Whether that's town or scum, I don't know.

If Teproc is scum, Mail-Mi is highly likely to be scum as well.  It is known.

And why is that?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #301 on: June 19, 2015, 01:31:28 pm »

Heh. For me, I've noticed that I'm much more aggressive as Town (well, when I'm not just lurker!chairs, which is a meta that has harmed me as Town but helped me as Mafia). I already know my scum tell is probably going to be "get along with everybody" because I'm always paranoid to be mean/aggro as scum but I'm not sure how I'm going to smooth that out.

(I'm Town this game. It just occurred to me and I wanted to share as an aside).

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #302 on: June 19, 2015, 01:31:44 pm »

I have been lurking indeed; yesterday was busy. I should be on more today to answer any questions.

No that was not a hedge defense of skip, I just wanted to see what ADK's reasoning is.

I think Teproc and WW are of the same alignment. Whether that's town or scum, I don't know.

If Teproc is scum, Mail-Mi is highly likely to be scum as well.  It is known.

And why is that?

Yeah, I can't say I understand this association.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #303 on: June 19, 2015, 01:32:39 pm »

Yep, it's L-1. chairs, did you know it was L-1 ?

Obviously don't hammer, need more time to discuss etc.

Uh, Chairs? Why is this scummy?

Teproc appeared to be really, really pushing WW to me (maybe your impression will be different). I'm of the opinion that if you're pushing a wagon, you don't throw the brakes when the wagon gets to the edge of the cliff.

As far as WW's behavior - it's generated a lot of interaction on D1. That's something we reliably struggle with, imho, to the point that I almost ignore D1 in Normal (not RMM) games out of habit. Sure, he's been abrasive, but abrasive has led to a lot of opportunities for us to review each other on later Days after flips, which is the best part of forum Mafia, right?
are you saying that ww is purposely trying to generate interactions and you consider that towny?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #304 on: June 19, 2015, 01:35:24 pm »

I have been lurking indeed; yesterday was busy. I should be on more today to answer any questions.

No that was not a hedge defense of skip, I just wanted to see what ADK's reasoning is.

I think Teproc and WW are of the same alignment. Whether that's town or scum, I don't know.

If Teproc is scum, Mail-Mi is highly likely to be scum as well.  It is known.

And why is that?

Yeah, I can't say I understand this association.

Ditto.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #305 on: June 19, 2015, 01:40:02 pm »

And for what it's worth, if only one of Teproc/WW is scum, i think it would be Teproc, for the same reason as chairs.

Also, I think chairs is town and won't lynch him today.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #306 on: June 19, 2015, 01:46:26 pm »

But about faking activity, etc., I think it's kind of a universal scum tell,

I fake activity as town.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #307 on: June 19, 2015, 01:52:28 pm »

Yep, it's L-1. chairs, did you know it was L-1 ?

Obviously don't hammer, need more time to discuss etc.

Uh, Chairs? Why is this scummy?

Teproc appeared to be really, really pushing WW to me (maybe your impression will be different). I'm of the opinion that if you're pushing a wagon, you don't throw the brakes when the wagon gets to the edge of the cliff.

As far as WW's behavior - it's generated a lot of interaction on D1. That's something we reliably struggle with, imho, to the point that I almost ignore D1 in Normal (not RMM) games out of habit. Sure, he's been abrasive, but abrasive has led to a lot of opportunities for us to review each other on later Days after flips, which is the best part of forum Mafia, right?
are you saying that ww is purposely trying to generate interactions and you consider that towny?

Yes.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #308 on: June 19, 2015, 01:56:02 pm »

I have been lurking indeed; yesterday was busy. I should be on more today to answer any questions.

No that was not a hedge defense of skip, I just wanted to see what ADK's reasoning is.

I think Teproc and WW are of the same alignment. Whether that's town or scum, I don't know.

If Teproc is scum, Mail-Mi is highly likely to be scum as well.  It is known.

And why is that?

Yeah, I can't say I understand this association.

Ditto.

Because he's lining up mislynches, duh (from WW's PoV).
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #309 on: June 19, 2015, 01:56:17 pm »

Yep, it's L-1. chairs, did you know it was L-1 ?

Obviously don't hammer, need more time to discuss etc.

Uh, Chairs? Why is this scummy?

Teproc appeared to be really, really pushing WW to me (maybe your impression will be different). I'm of the opinion that if you're pushing a wagon, you don't throw the brakes when the wagon gets to the edge of the cliff.

As far as WW's behavior - it's generated a lot of interaction on D1. That's something we reliably struggle with, imho, to the point that I almost ignore D1 in Normal (not RMM) games out of habit. Sure, he's been abrasive, but abrasive has led to a lot of opportunities for us to review each other on later Days after flips, which is the best part of forum Mafia, right?

Well, that makes no sense. Both of those points actually.

To the first : you put someone at L-1two days into the game, of course I'm going to pull the brakes. mail-mi had three posts when you voted, and many people had not had the time to properly state their opinion on recent devlopments. I myself was waiting to hear about the mail-mi case (I'm not convinced, but mail-mi is someone I have a very hard time catching without interactions or PoE), so yeah.

The second implies that WW was trying to get a wagon on himself and is therefore town ? Or something ? It really makes no sense, most of WW's activity has been defending himself, which is good if he's town, but obviously something he'd do as scum too.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #310 on: June 19, 2015, 01:57:50 pm »

I don't think the mail-mi/Teproc scumteam line of reasoning makes much sense either (not only for the obvious reasons), but I doubt WW meant much by it. As a reminder : thinking about scumteams on day 1 is almost always counterproductive.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #311 on: June 19, 2015, 02:02:59 pm »

It would be nice to know the opinion of Awaclus, joseph and Hydrad about all this.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #312 on: June 19, 2015, 02:25:26 pm »

So much has happened!

So WW. Since I've started playing I think WW feels different then normal. If this was my first game I would say his reactions here are towny. But for some reason WW just feels different but it could just be I've never seen him have to react to a day 1 lynch possibility.

On phone so will post more later
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #313 on: June 19, 2015, 02:28:33 pm »

I don't think the mail-mi/Teproc scumteam line of reasoning makes much sense either (not only for the obvious reasons), but I doubt WW meant much by it. As a reminder : thinking about scumteams on day 1 is almost always counterproductive.

It's something Jimmmm pointed out once: a lot of the time, when scum has a  scumpartners in a big argument, etc., they make comments like "town v. town" or "same alignment" or something to that effect.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #314 on: June 19, 2015, 03:23:09 pm »

I don't think the mail-mi/Teproc scumteam line of reasoning makes much sense either (not only for the obvious reasons), but I doubt WW meant much by it. As a reminder : thinking about scumteams on day 1 is almost always counterproductive.

It's something Jimmmm pointed out once: a lot of the time, when scum has a  scumpartners in a big argument, etc., they make comments like "town v. town" or "same alignment" or something to that effect.

Oh I know. He actually observed it in Chocolate Factory, where he had a big fight with ash (who was scum, which Jimmm knew because he had goon copped him and was trying to lynch him without claiming to out the partners), and I (ash's scumbuddy) kinda just said "looks like town v town to me" and moved on.

I'm not saying there's no merit to it, but it's something that only becomes worth discussing once someone does flip scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #315 on: June 19, 2015, 03:24:37 pm »

Right, but sometimes I forget to go back to things, and I don't know that I'll be around if or when you flip scum, so that was more a "let's get this on record" comment.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #316 on: June 19, 2015, 03:27:34 pm »

Nicely done.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #317 on: June 19, 2015, 03:28:11 pm »

Wait, not nicely done, you had the "if or" in there. I'm disappointed.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #318 on: June 19, 2015, 03:47:45 pm »

This is L-2 I believe.

Sweet, early wagons are on town.
Or they don't result in a lynch, or something.  I don't remember what the mantra is.
Probably both, it must be a town wagon because I'm town, right?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #319 on: June 19, 2015, 03:51:30 pm »


It's weird that you think that's a justification.

It's much weirder that Wither agreed with you and strengthened it to "something only scum do" especially without actually voting for me.

Vote: Witherweaver

You know nothing, UmbrageOfSnow.

vote: Witherweaver

There's a reason I quoted WW, not skip, when questioning the "justifying an RVS vote" reasoning. He's encouraging suspicion based on dubious reasons without actually taking part... and when confronted, has nothing to say about it. Perhaps hoping we'd just move on ? I won't, town!WW is more engaged than this, and wouldn't only post the jokey response. He would do that and follow it up with an actual post of significance. Here his only post of significance is "yeah, that thing is totally scummy, you go ahead and lynch that guy".

Looks fine to me. I think Teproc is mistaken about WW, but he does have a point here.
I don't see how this is scummy from Teproc either.

It would be nice to know the opinion of Awaclus, joseph and Hydrad about all this.
I think WW is scummy, which probably makes Teproc slightly town.
chairs is lurky, but that's not a tell of anything.

I have been lurking indeed; yesterday was busy. I should be on more today to answer any questions.

No that was not a hedge defense of skip, I just wanted to see what ADK's reasoning is.

I think Teproc and WW are of the same alignment. Whether that's town or scum, I don't know.

If Teproc is scum, Mail-Mi is highly likely to be scum as well.  It is known.

And why is that?
Don't understand this either.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #320 on: June 19, 2015, 04:39:54 pm »

I'm lurky? I feel like I've been posting pretty damn frequently.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #321 on: June 19, 2015, 04:51:16 pm »

Hydrad: How RVSy was this vote really?  Can you elaborate on your thoughts at the time you made it?

Vote: WW

because I want to see him lynched day 1 once.

And what do you think of Teproc's response to it?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #322 on: June 19, 2015, 04:58:06 pm »

I'm lurky? I feel like I've been posting pretty damn frequently.
9 posts in 2 days isn't super-active, although it is pretty active for chairs actually.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #323 on: June 19, 2015, 05:01:21 pm »

Hydrad: How RVSy was this vote really?  Can you elaborate on your thoughts at the time you made it?

Vote: WW

because I want to see him lynched day 1 once.

And what do you think of Teproc's response to it?

At the time it was pretty RVSy but its kinda turned into a real vote (now I'm scum because I said that right)

Then for teprocs response I guess I agreed with it. We were pretty much out of RVS and with my WW vote there I could have turned the game back into RVS and just hurt us so I think his point was valid.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #324 on: June 19, 2015, 05:03:12 pm »

Hydrad: How RVSy was this vote really?  Can you elaborate on your thoughts at the time you made it?

Vote: WW

because I want to see him lynched day 1 once.

And what do you think of Teproc's response to it?

At the time it was pretty RVSy but its kinda turned into a real vote (now I'm scum because I said that right)

Then for teprocs response I guess I agreed with it. We were pretty much out of RVS and with my WW vote there I could have turned the game back into RVS and just hurt us so I think his point was valid.

Cool.  Any particular reason you wanted to move off Seprix at that time?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #325 on: June 19, 2015, 05:06:57 pm »

Hydrad: How RVSy was this vote really?  Can you elaborate on your thoughts at the time you made it?

Vote: WW

because I want to see him lynched day 1 once.

And what do you think of Teproc's response to it?

At the time it was pretty RVSy but its kinda turned into a real vote (now I'm scum because I said that right)

Then for teprocs response I guess I agreed with it. We were pretty much out of RVS and with my WW vote there I could have turned the game back into RVS and just hurt us so I think his point was valid.

Cool.  Any particular reason you wanted to move off Seprix at that time?

That was even more RVSy then WW. the seprix vote was pretty much just pick a random person to vote kinda vote. WW is I'm actually curious what happens if he gets pressure day 1 kinda vote.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #326 on: June 19, 2015, 05:24:57 pm »

One more thing, Hydrad.  Do you have any thoughts either way about Mail-mi's unvoting you?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #327 on: June 19, 2015, 05:32:20 pm »


@Skip: If you had to, gun to your head, vote for one of me, Seprix, and Mail-mi right now, who would you vote for and why?
can you explain the point of this question? It stood out upon reread. Like trying to give the appearance of scumhunting/asking serious questions.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #328 on: June 19, 2015, 05:39:21 pm »


@Skip: If you had to, gun to your head, vote for one of me, Seprix, and Mail-mi right now, who would you vote for and why?
can you explain the point of this question? It stood out upon reread. Like trying to give the appearance of scumhunting/asking serious questions.

I wanted to ask something specific of someone I didn't have any read on, picked you because you were online and talking with me and Seprix.  Seprix and I were both voting for each other and had had an exchange that seemed like it could generate some reads, and you'd voted for chairs like 1 minute after he voted for Mail-mi.

It was kind of a random question, but it got something out of you, which was the purpose.

Why does that question stand out to you specifically?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #329 on: June 19, 2015, 05:44:12 pm »

One more thing, Hydrad.  Do you have any thoughts either way about Mail-mi's unvoting you?

Hmm usually when people say something like that it means they think I'm scummy but might not vote me since I seem to have made a meta of being scummy even when I'm town. So I guess thats what I took that unvote as.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #330 on: June 19, 2015, 05:44:19 pm »


@Skip: If you had to, gun to your head, vote for one of me, Seprix, and Mail-mi right now, who would you vote for and why?
can you explain the point of this question? It stood out upon reread. Like trying to give the appearance of scumhunting/asking serious questions.

I wanted to ask something specific of someone I didn't have any read on, picked you because you were online and talking with me and Seprix.  Seprix and I were both voting for each other and had had an exchange that seemed like it could generate some reads, and you'd voted for chairs like 1 minute after he voted for Mail-mi.

It was kind of a random question, but it got something out of you, which was the purpose.

Why does that question stand out to you specifically?
I dont see how it would help you determine much of anything from whatever my answer might be. It's asking a question for the sake of not wanting to look like you're not asking questions. What did it get out of me?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #331 on: June 19, 2015, 05:49:21 pm »


@Skip: If you had to, gun to your head, vote for one of me, Seprix, and Mail-mi right now, who would you vote for and why?
can you explain the point of this question? It stood out upon reread. Like trying to give the appearance of scumhunting/asking serious questions.

I wanted to ask something specific of someone I didn't have any read on, picked you because you were online and talking with me and Seprix.  Seprix and I were both voting for each other and had had an exchange that seemed like it could generate some reads, and you'd voted for chairs like 1 minute after he voted for Mail-mi.

It was kind of a random question, but it got something out of you, which was the purpose.

Why does that question stand out to you specifically?
I dont see how it would help you determine much of anything from whatever my answer might be. It's asking a question for the sake of not wanting to look like you're not asking questions. What did it get out of me?

Well some of it's for later, the reason I included Mail-mi in there is a combo of liking 3 options in a list and the off chance that if one of you flipped scum and we got to analyzing interactions with the other, having some extra response might help paint a picture.  (Or be meaningless, but hey, it's a good enough reason for the 3rd options in a random question.)

I wanted to know if you made a read on me or Seprix (I took it that you thought we were both towny) and I also wanted to know how much attention your were paying or seeing what sort of things you were looking for to see if I could get some idea about your mindset.

Your answer was pretty non-committal, but I didn't know if that would be the case when I asked it.  It wasn't a question meant as part of building a case on you or anything.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #332 on: June 19, 2015, 05:50:45 pm »

It's asking a question for the sake of not wanting to look like you're not asking questions. What did it get out of me?

Do you think I looked like I wasn't participating at that point in the game?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #333 on: June 19, 2015, 05:56:11 pm »

It's asking a question for the sake of not wanting to look like you're not asking questions. What did it get out of me?

Do you think I looked like I wasn't participating at that point in the game?
I think you're possibly the type of person who may feel like you're not participating enough if you know you're really scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #334 on: June 19, 2015, 05:58:28 pm »

So to boil down your explanation: you wanted to see what I thought of you and seprix?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #335 on: June 19, 2015, 06:02:11 pm »

So to boil down your explanation: you wanted to see what I thought of you and seprix?

Not really.  I mean that's what I was really asking but I asked because I wanted to get a read on you and see what your thought process was like, and me and Seprix had had the most solid interaction at that point.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #336 on: June 19, 2015, 06:11:32 pm »

So to boil down your explanation: you wanted to see what I thought of you and seprix?

Not really.  I mean that's what I was really asking but I asked because I wanted to get a read on you and see what your thought process was like, and me and Seprix had had the most solid interaction at that point.
alright, I guess. Sounds weak, though
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #337 on: June 19, 2015, 06:33:01 pm »

Well I promised a serious vote. vote: UoS. I still don't like the rvs justification, I don't like this question. It doesn't seem genuine. They're not the kinds of things I remember from your other games (although they were quite a while ago, and were heavy in theory talk). I think this is worth some exploration.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #338 on: June 19, 2015, 06:33:16 pm »

skip / UoS scumteam, calling it now.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #339 on: June 19, 2015, 06:40:56 pm »

The funny thing about Chairs is that he lurks so much, he's only posted 8 times. :)
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #340 on: June 19, 2015, 06:42:20 pm »

Is it just me or does this ww/teproc fight seem a tad scum vs. scum?

The only way to know for sure is to lynch one of them.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #341 on: June 19, 2015, 06:46:09 pm »

I did know it was L-1.

I appreciate all the reactions.

vote: Teproc.  Sorry to worry you, WW, I just wanted to see what Teproc would do to an unannounced L-1 :)

Town read on chairs.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #342 on: June 19, 2015, 06:47:34 pm »

Is it just me or does this ww/teproc fight seem a tad scum vs. scum?

The only way to know for sure is to lynch one of them.
how do you know we'll know for sure after lynching only one of them?  Do you know neither is scum?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #343 on: June 19, 2015, 06:48:03 pm »

I don't think the mail-mi/Teproc scumteam line of reasoning makes much sense either (not only for the obvious reasons), but I doubt WW meant much by it. As a reminder : thinking about scumteams on day 1 is almost always counterproductive.

It's something Jimmmm pointed out once: a lot of the time, when scum has a  scumpartners in a big argument, etc., they make comments like "town v. town" or "same alignment" or something to that effect.

I buy this, actually. Teproc and mail-mi are probably either both town or both scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #344 on: June 19, 2015, 06:48:56 pm »

Mmm I think I could go back to vote: skip
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #345 on: June 19, 2015, 06:56:02 pm »

I don't think the mail-mi/Teproc scumteam line of reasoning makes much sense either (not only for the obvious reasons), but I doubt WW meant much by it. As a reminder : thinking about scumteams on day 1 is almost always counterproductive.

It's something Jimmmm pointed out once: a lot of the time, when scum has a  scumpartners in a big argument, etc., they make comments like "town v. town" or "same alignment" or something to that effect.

I buy this, actually. Teproc and mail-mi are probably either both town or both scum.

Or one could be town and one could be scum. There is no real information to be gleaned here.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #346 on: June 19, 2015, 07:02:29 pm »

Or one could be town and one could be scum. There is no real information to be gleaned here.

Why not?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #347 on: June 19, 2015, 07:24:06 pm »

Or one could be town and one could be scum. There is no real information to be gleaned here.

Why not?

Your argument is total WIFOM, not to mention false. Sure, two scum could be arguing. Two town could be arguing. One town and one scum could be arguing. There's nothing to be gleaned here.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #348 on: June 19, 2015, 07:28:20 pm »

I'm not talking about two people arguing, I'm talking about mail-mi commenting on Teproc and WW and how there's a decent argument that that post is more likely to come from scum. And why are you so certain that there's no information to be gained from Teproc and WW's argument?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #349 on: June 19, 2015, 07:28:49 pm »

Could someone just use <b> on a vote or something so we can jump on the scumslip, please?

Also, semi-v/la for the weekend starting in ~30 minutes from this post.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #350 on: June 19, 2015, 07:33:58 pm »

Could someone just use <b> on a vote or something so we can jump on the scumslip, please?

Also, semi-v/la for the weekend starting in ~30 minutes from this post.

I thought your L-1 thingie somehow convinced you that I was scum ?

ADK : what's your read on WW ?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #351 on: June 19, 2015, 07:35:32 pm »

Mmm I'm considering. Are you maintaining your position that he's scummy?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #352 on: June 19, 2015, 07:36:39 pm »

Could someone just use <b> on a vote or something so we can jump on the scumslip, please?

Also, semi-v/la for the weekend starting in ~30 minutes from this post.

I thought your L-1 thingie somehow convinced you that I was scum ?

ADK : what's your read on WW ?

I'm less convinced now than I was then. Actually kind of thinking vote: mail-mi now. I'm going to get my cutie mark in Mafia busting!

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #353 on: June 19, 2015, 07:37:17 pm »

God, no matter how I look at it, pink is a bad font color for the forum with the theme I'm using.

In case anybody's having trouble reading it, that says "I'm going to get my cutie mark in Mafia busting!".

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #354 on: June 19, 2015, 07:48:53 pm »

Mmm I'm considering. Are you maintaining your position that he's scummy?

Yes. He's my preferred lynch for today, by a mile.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #355 on: June 19, 2015, 07:49:46 pm »

Suppose you couldn't lynch WW and were forced to pick someone else. Who would that be?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #356 on: June 19, 2015, 07:52:45 pm »

Suppose you couldn't lynch WW and were forced to pick someone else. Who would that be?

My first instinct is skip, but I don't like lynching newbies on their first day, so I'd go with Awaclus. Completely under the radar, hasn't said anything of substance I can remember, and I do seem to recall that scum!Awaclus tends to be in the background, though I'd have to check.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #357 on: June 19, 2015, 08:02:17 pm »

I'm not talking about two people arguing, I'm talking about mail-mi commenting on Teproc and WW and how there's a decent argument that that post is more likely to come from scum.

I think the argument I'm quoting has merit, which is now another reason I wish to vote for Mail-mi.

Quote
And why are you so certain that there's no information to be gained from Teproc and WW's argument?

I wasn't talking about the argument per se, rather the statement of the 'scum vs scum or town vs town' thing. I originally was going to clarify my earlier rambles on that, but I thought it would be understood in context. Eh. Rereading it now, it's pretty vague. Wish I clarified.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #358 on: June 19, 2015, 08:04:16 pm »

God, no matter how I look at it, pink is a bad font color for the forum with the theme I'm using.

I am offended that you think I cannot read pink against white
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #359 on: June 19, 2015, 08:13:57 pm »

I am offended that you think I cannot read pink against white

Tiny text is disallowed in the base maifa ruleset. I don't really mind personally, but since you agreed to it it's probably better if you don't use it.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #360 on: June 19, 2015, 08:15:11 pm »

Suppose you couldn't lynch WW and were forced to pick someone else. Who would that be?

My first instinct is skip, but I don't like lynching newbies on their first day, so I'd go with Awaclus. Completely under the radar, hasn't said anything of substance I can remember, and I do seem to recall that scum!Awaclus tends to be in the background, though I'd have to check.

Water is wet. Now I've said something of a substance you probably remember.  :P

I'm in the background because of midsummer and other ongoing games. I don't think it's typical for me to lurk a lot as either alignment, but I've done it more as town.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #361 on: June 19, 2015, 09:03:44 pm »

God, no matter how I look at it, pink is a bad font color for the forum with the theme I'm using.

In case anybody's having trouble reading it, that says "I'm going to get my cutie mark in Mafia busting!".
Pink is the best, unfortunately all the pink colours on here don't show up well unless they're in bold, and you shouldn't bold stuff unless you're the mod. All the best mods use pink text though.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #362 on: June 19, 2015, 09:15:22 pm »

Well I promised a serious vote. vote: UoS. I still don't like the rvs justification, I don't like this question. It doesn't seem genuine. They're not the kinds of things I remember from your other games (although they were quite a while ago, and were heavy in theory talk). I think this is worth some exploration.
It seems a bit odd I guess- could someone who's played with them before say if slightly odd is their usual meta or not?

I did know it was L-1.

I appreciate all the reactions.

vote: Teproc.  Sorry to worry you, WW, I just wanted to see what Teproc would do to an unannounced L-1 :)

Town read on chairs.
Agree, also posting more than usual chairs is probably town!chairs. If chairs was scum, he could lurk as much as he wanted without attracting much suspicion. The post count isn't super-high, but enough to be very different to usual.

I don't think the mail-mi/Teproc scumteam line of reasoning makes much sense either (not only for the obvious reasons), but I doubt WW meant much by it. As a reminder : thinking about scumteams on day 1 is almost always counterproductive.

It's something Jimmmm pointed out once: a lot of the time, when scum has a  scumpartners in a big argument, etc., they make comments like "town v. town" or "same alignment" or something to that effect.

I buy this, actually. Teproc and mail-mi are probably either both town or both scum.
Hm I always forget that this could be the case, this happened in M62 (Hearthstone)- e and Teproc spent most of it accusing each other of being scum, and they were the scumteam. I guess I can see the argument, but how often is it actually same alignment, rather than different alignment?

Suppose you couldn't lynch WW and were forced to pick someone else. Who would that be?

My first instinct is skip, but I don't like lynching newbies on their first day, so I'd go with Awaclus. Completely under the radar, hasn't said anything of substance I can remember, and I do seem to recall that scum!Awaclus tends to be in the background, though I'd have to check.

Water is wet. Now I've said something of a substance you probably remember.  :P

I'm in the background because of midsummer and other ongoing games. I don't think it's typical for me to lurk a lot as either alignment, but I've done it more as town.
I guess it's something you've done as both, I seem to think you've been lurky D1 more often as town.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #363 on: June 19, 2015, 09:33:25 pm »

(...) and you shouldn't bold stuff unless you're the mod.

You can use bold text if you want, as long as it's different enough from this.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #364 on: June 20, 2015, 09:31:40 am »

I will give some thoughts tonight.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #365 on: June 20, 2015, 10:47:41 am »

(...) and you shouldn't bold stuff unless you're the mod.

You can use bold text if you want, as long as it's different enough from this.
Awesome, hot pink is the best colour.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #366 on: June 20, 2015, 01:20:17 pm »

Is all this voting for me because of
I have been lurking indeed; yesterday was busy. I should be on more today to answer any questions.

No that was not a hedge defense of skip, I just wanted to see what ADK's reasoning is.

I think Teproc and WW are of the same alignment. Whether that's town or scum, I don't know.
?

Well what else am I supposed to say? This argument sounds like a town v. town or a scum v. scum argument. That's my honest-to-goodness opinion, and if I'm scummy for it, well then fine.

As for right now, I like chairs' argument for teproc. vote: teproc
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #367 on: June 20, 2015, 01:33:45 pm »

skip / UoS scumteam, calling it now.

Eh, looks like town vs. town to me ;)

I think you're possibly the type of person who may feel like you're not participating enough if you know you're really scum.

So to boil down your explanation: you wanted to see what I thought of you and seprix?

Not really.  I mean that's what I was really asking but I asked because I wanted to get a read on you and see what your thought process was like, and me and Seprix had had the most solid interaction at that point.
alright, I guess. Sounds weak, though

In all seriousness, Skip, this seems like you're coming from a place of assuming I'm scum first and looking for reasons, rather than reading my posts and evaluating.

I don't know what kind of brilliant grand plan you were expecting me to have behind my question but it reads like you were going to find me scummy for this regardless of what I said.  And your logic is that as scum I would want to be active (fair enough), but with no consideration to whether I'd ask the same question as town.  You're starting with your conclusion in mind.  If you're town, you should be careful of this.

What's your read on A Drowned Kernel?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #368 on: June 20, 2015, 01:36:01 pm »

Hi Mail-mi.

What are your thoughts on WW in the WW-Teproc argument?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #369 on: June 20, 2015, 03:02:21 pm »

Hi Mail-mi.

What are your thoughts on WW in the WW-Teproc argument?

Nullish/scummy. I think Teproc comes out as more scummy, but I can definitely see WW being scum in this situation.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #370 on: June 20, 2015, 10:16:29 pm »

skip / UoS scumteam, calling it now.

Eh, looks like town vs. town to me ;)

I think you're possibly the type of person who may feel like you're not participating enough if you know you're really scum.

So to boil down your explanation: you wanted to see what I thought of you and seprix?

Not really.  I mean that's what I was really asking but I asked because I wanted to get a read on you and see what your thought process was like, and me and Seprix had had the most solid interaction at that point.
alright, I guess. Sounds weak, though

In all seriousness, Skip, this seems like you're coming from a place of assuming I'm scum first and looking for reasons, rather than reading my posts and evaluating.

I don't know what kind of brilliant grand plan you were expecting me to have behind my question but it reads like you were going to find me scummy for this regardless of what I said.  And your logic is that as scum I would want to be active (fair enough), but with no consideration to whether I'd ask the same question as town.  You're starting with your conclusion in mind.  If you're town, you should be careful of this.

What's your read on A Drowned Kernel?
I didn't come from a place of assuming you're scum. I came from a place of suspecting you're scum. I came from that place upon rereading your question to me. If you would have supplied a good explanation (which as you yourself say in the quoted post was something I could reasonably assume wouldn't happen) I would have been less suspecting (although I was assuming you wouldn't explain it well). I didn't particularly suspect you before I re-read that post of yours, if that's what you're insinuating.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #371 on: June 20, 2015, 10:47:51 pm »

And im leaning town on adk.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #372 on: June 20, 2015, 10:51:15 pm »

We need more activity here. vote: pacovf, he hasn't received much scrutiny and has been doing a good job of blending in.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #373 on: June 20, 2015, 10:58:35 pm »

Sorry, I'm planning a stream, and have been busy with college. I don't have much to say in all honesty at the moment. Mail-mi still seems like a good lynch.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #374 on: June 20, 2015, 11:00:10 pm »

Sorry, I'm planning a stream, and have been busy with college. I don't have much to say in all honesty at the moment. Mail-mi still seems like a good lynch.

Do you have any opinions on a pacovf lynch?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #375 on: June 20, 2015, 11:01:41 pm »

Sorry, I'm planning a stream, and have been busy with college. I don't have much to say in all honesty at the moment. Mail-mi still seems like a good lynch.

Do you have any opinions on a pacovf lynch?

Not really. Null for him so far.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #376 on: June 21, 2015, 12:41:22 am »

I will give some thoughts tonight.
When is this happening? What's pacovf's time zone situation?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #377 on: June 21, 2015, 12:58:25 am »

Ok, I am back to my computer. Let's see what has been going on.

Things that stand out to me:

The whole WW thing: when rereading, I think he is genuine. While his original comment was sort of weird, I like the answer he gave when asked to explain his thought process about skip's original post, I think it is very towny. I don't agree with his vote on Teproc though, it just feels like Teproc being Teproc. Although the case on WW seems a bit too flimsy for Teproc to be pushing it so hard, so I am a bit wary.

I don't like a single thing chairs has done this game, like, at all. Not sure if it's just crazy!chairs or scum!chairs.

UoS has been stupendous all the way until now, I am definitely not lynching him today. I am bit worried by how on-tune UoS and Teproc seem to be, though.

I still want to lynch Mail-mi:

What are your thoughts on WW in the WW-Teproc argument?

Nullish/scummy. I think Teproc comes out as more scummy, but I can definitely see WW being scum in this situation.

Can we please lynch Mail-mi?

Let's standy-out for me:

skip seems super paranoid of everything and everyone. I think that is more characteristic of newbie town than newbie scum, so towny on him.

Hydrad seems... relaxed. Food for thought.

We need more activity here. vote: pacovf, he hasn't received much scrutiny and has been doing a good job of blending in.

Ha, I see you've gotten your hand on the Markov-chain Text Generating script! Cool!

ADK is throwing suspicion everywhere, maybe looking for what sticks? That looks scummy to me, but I might be biased because I am the latest object of his attentions.


Huh, about anyone else... Joseph is the IC, Awaclus has been super-lurking, and I am not fine with that, and I haven't formed an opinion on Seprix yet.


So people I would vote for: Mail-mi, chairs, ADK, Awaclus, maybe Seprix, maaaaaaaybe Teproc.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #378 on: June 21, 2015, 12:59:11 am »

I will give some thoughts tonight.
When is this happening? What's pacovf's time zone situation?

I had to take care of some stuff before rereading.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #379 on: June 21, 2015, 01:09:37 am »

Ok I changed my mind. Even though I want to see WW lynched day 1 sometime I don't think this is the right game for it.

I havn't thought to much about mail-mi for some reason.

everyone seems to say hes scummy but I'm not sure if I just haven't been paying enough attention or not but it hasn't stuck out to me much yet.

Vote: awaclus for now. more of a placeholder vote.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #380 on: June 21, 2015, 03:10:21 am »

I guess I can do a mail-mi lynch, though I'm not sure how much I'm being influenced by everyone else, or how bad it is if that's what's happening.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #381 on: June 21, 2015, 05:58:48 am »

Vote Count 1.5

UmbrageOfSnow (1): skip wooznum
Seprix (1): Awaclus
Witherweaver (3): UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc, Joseph2302
pacovf (1): A Drowned Kernel
mail-mi (3): pacovf, Seprix, chairs
Awaclus (1): Hydrad
Teproc (2): Witherweaver, mail-mi

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Day 1 ends on June 28, 3 PM forum time.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #382 on: June 21, 2015, 07:38:59 am »

Ok I changed my mind. Even though I want to see WW lynched day 1 sometime I don't think this is the right game for it.

I havn't thought to much about mail-mi for some reason.

everyone seems to say hes scummy but I'm not sure if I just haven't been paying enough attention or not but it hasn't stuck out to me much yet.

Vote: awaclus for now. more of a placeholder vote.
I'm not seeing the mail-mi lynch reasons either, what's the actual case? Unless the case is something liek "he's playing differently to how he does as town" (which I wouldn't know), then seems like a weak case to me.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #383 on: June 21, 2015, 11:07:00 am »

As for right now, I like chairs' argument for teproc. vote: teproc
also, chairs doesn't even like chairs' argument for teproc.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #384 on: June 21, 2015, 12:31:53 pm »

As for right now, I like chairs' argument for teproc. vote: teproc
also, chairs doesn't even like chairs' argument for teproc.

Doesn't mean I don't.

Sorry I've been gone, I just got an internship where I get to dress up as an alien and shoot little children with fake guns, so that's taken up a lot of my time. I'll be here later today, so ask questions and I'll get to answering them.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #385 on: June 21, 2015, 12:33:11 pm »

Don't like the mail-mi lynch. He's null to me, and it seems like the kind of wagon that no one will be held accountable for. "Meh, he wasn't very active, it was worth a shot". That kinf of day 1 lynch, when it doesn't work out (because obviously if it does it's still great), basically means we start the game down 2 townies with nothing but a few night actions to go on.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #386 on: June 21, 2015, 12:40:44 pm »

Huh? I am not voting for him because he isn't very active. Otherwise I would be voting for Awaclus.

Sorry I've been gone, I just got an internship where I get to dress up as an alien and shoot little children with fake guns, so that's taken up a lot of my time. I'll be here later today, so ask questions and I'll get to answering them.

With that sort of internship, I am surprised you are spending any amount of time on this game!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #387 on: June 21, 2015, 12:46:42 pm »

Right but the case isn't much more than that, it's about him hedging and having content-light votes... in other words, you want to lynch him for what he does every game. Which, granted, it fits scum!mail-mi too, so you have a chance of hitting scum, but I tend to think mail-mi is someone you catch with interactions, otherwise you just lynch him every game since his scum meta is basically indistinguishable from his town meta.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #388 on: June 21, 2015, 01:27:26 pm »

ooo can I get my cutie mark in craziness?

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #389 on: June 21, 2015, 01:33:34 pm »

ooo can I get my cutie mark in craziness?
Pink is my colour, stop stealing it. :(
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #390 on: June 21, 2015, 01:34:16 pm »

ooo can I get my cutie mark in craziness?
Pink is my colour, stop stealing it :(
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #391 on: June 21, 2015, 03:06:49 pm »

I buy this, actually. Teproc and mail-mi are probably either both town or both scum.

Hey ADK, so I get why if Teproc flips scum that makes Mail-mi likely scum, and why if Mail-mi flips scum that could make Teproc/WW more likely to be scum, but if Mail-mi or Teproc flip town, why does that make the other more likely town?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #392 on: June 21, 2015, 03:12:35 pm »

See, this is the kind of discussion that, while theoretically interesting, doesn't really get us anywhere right now.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #393 on: June 21, 2015, 03:20:30 pm »

See, this is the kind of discussion that, while theoretically interesting, doesn't really get us anywhere right now.

I'm rereading and it stood out to me.  And I'm not asking for theory reasons.  What discussion would you rather be having?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #394 on: June 21, 2015, 03:32:51 pm »

Awaclus and WW, you guys haven't weighed in on the Mail-mi wagon.  What do you think of it?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #395 on: June 21, 2015, 03:50:15 pm »

I guess I can do a mail-mi lynch, though I'm not sure how much I'm being influenced by everyone else, or how bad it is if that's what's happening.
I really don't like this.  Mail-mi has 3 votes, we have a week left, the case on Mail-mi is pretty thin.

Previously Skip said,
And I didn't read mail-mi's post as a defense, more of a question posed to adk to see what explanation would be given.
And he was explicitly not finding Mail-mi scummy over his RVS voting and unvoting at the time.

So being okay with the Mail-mi lynch is because of Mail-mi voting teproc (who Skip has a couple of times found scummy) based on Chair's trap, which Chairs isn't so behind anymore.  And because 3 other people are voting Mail-mi.

So maybe it's newbtown sheeping, but when it comes to questioning me or not getting on the WW wagon Skip has shown an admirable lack of sheeping.  And in his post where he lends support to the Mail-mi wagon (without voting) he lays the groundwork for the "maybe I'm just newbtown being influenced" defense.  But he doesn't question it, and he was absolutely questioning the rest of us back with
Meh im not feeling the ww wagon, though I should probably cast a real vote sooner rather than later. I'll decide today sometime.

So yeah, Vote: Skip
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #396 on: June 21, 2015, 04:18:11 pm »

It's a strong case. I don't like lynching new players on day 1 though. I'm not saying it's a universal rule or anything, just that I don't like it and would rather avoid it.

Also WW is scum, probably, so let's just lynch him.

I will do a reread in the somewhat near future, see if I have anything more productive to say.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #397 on: June 21, 2015, 04:25:27 pm »

Awaclus and WW, you guys haven't weighed in on the Mail-mi wagon.  What do you think of it?

Not a huge fan of it, but I could do it if there's nothing better. I think it's better than WW at least.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #398 on: June 21, 2015, 04:26:19 pm »

It's a strong case. I don't like lynching new players on day 1 though. I'm not saying it's a universal rule or anything, just that I don't like it and would rather avoid it.

Also WW is scum, probably, so let's just lynch him.

I will do a reread in the somewhat near future, see if I have anything more productive to say.

I am absolutely still happy lynching WW.

PPE: Awaclus, why is Mail-mi better than WW?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #399 on: June 21, 2015, 04:34:37 pm »

Prprprpr... let's go over Mail-mi's most relevant posts.

unvote

Hydrad seems like good old Hydrad.

This is an unvote on a RVS. The whole point of this post is "Hey guys I am active", and nothing else. You decide who is more likely to do this, scum or town.

I think I like vote: skip wooznum at the moment.

Why? He doesn't seem particularly scummy or townie to me right now.

I know this is reading between the lines, but this does not look to me like "I don't understand", but like "I am challenging your vote". He could have commented on any number of things that were happening back then, but he commented on this.

I think Teproc and WW are of the same alignment. Whether that's town or scum, I don't know.

And for what it's worth, if only one of Teproc/WW is scum, i think it would be Teproc, for the same reason as chairs.

Also, I think chairs is town and won't lynch him today.

As for right now, I like chairs' argument for teproc. vote: teproc

Nullish/scummy. I think Teproc comes out as more scummy, but I can definitely see WW being scum in this situation.

Notice the evolution of mail-mi's opinion on the WW/teproc argument. He just wants both of them lynched, and as the day progresses, he moves towards Teproc as he notices that WW is going to be an easy lynch later... while letting everyone know that he still wants WW lynched, in case Teproc doesn't end up happening.


Right but the case isn't much more than that, it's about him hedging and having content-light votes... in other words, you want to lynch him for what he does every game. Which, granted, it fits scum!mail-mi too, so you have a chance of hitting scum, but I tend to think mail-mi is someone you catch with interactions, otherwise you just lynch him every game since his scum meta is basically indistinguishable from his town meta.

Right, I see what you mean, but I don't trust you enough (yet?) to just change my vote on an appeal-to-meta. Similarly, I won't be voting for WW today (unless weird things happen), so what can I do.

I notice you mention that you could see a skip or Awaclus lynch. I'm not sold on skip. I don't see why you are against a Mail-mi lynch but for an Awaclus one. It's the sort of non-accountable wagon you were complaining about for Mail-mi.

ooo can I get my cutie mark in craziness?

Well, you can get either that or the cutie mark in scuminess, not both. You have to choose!

Warning, this might be a trick question.


PPE: case on skip.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #400 on: June 21, 2015, 04:36:04 pm »

I guess I can do a mail-mi lynch, though I'm not sure how much I'm being influenced by everyone else, or how bad it is if that's what's happening.
I really don't like this.  Mail-mi has 3 votes, we have a week left, the case on Mail-mi is pretty thin.

Previously Skip said,
And I didn't read mail-mi's post as a defense, more of a question posed to adk to see what explanation would be given.
And he was explicitly not finding Mail-mi scummy over his RVS voting and unvoting at the time.

So being okay with the Mail-mi lynch is because of Mail-mi voting teproc (who Skip has a couple of times found scummy) based on Chair's trap, which Chairs isn't so behind anymore.  And because 3 other people are voting Mail-mi.

So maybe it's newbtown sheeping, but when it comes to questioning me or not getting on the WW wagon Skip has shown an admirable lack of sheeping.  And in his post where he lends support to the Mail-mi wagon (without voting) he lays the groundwork for the "maybe I'm just newbtown being influenced" defense.  But he doesn't question it, and he was absolutely questioning the rest of us back with
Meh im not feeling the ww wagon, though I should probably cast a real vote sooner rather than later. I'll decide today sometime.

So yeah, Vote: Skip

The whole case hinges on skip apparently changing his opinion for no reason. But between the post you quote and his latest post, the whole "I think WW and Teproc are on the same team" discussion happened, that could definitely make him ok with a Mail-mi lynch.

So yeah, I don't see it.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #401 on: June 21, 2015, 05:03:26 pm »

What's scummy about changing opinion?

I have no problems with lynching Mail-Mi.  He's one of those coin-flip players, though.. as Teproc said, he's equally scummy as town and scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #402 on: June 21, 2015, 05:06:03 pm »

@Skip: if WW and Teproc are both town, do you think that makes Mail-mi more likely or less likely to be scum?  (Pretend we have flips on both WW and Teproc and know 100% that they are town.)
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #403 on: June 21, 2015, 05:08:37 pm »

I don't think UoS's case is "changing opinions is scummy". At least I didn't read that way, and I agree that changing your opinion is generally townie.

@pacovf re: Awaclus being a similar case to mail-mi. That's a good point, though I think Awaclus is much more likely to flip scum. But yeah, he's a meh day 1 lynch for the same reasons as mail-mi... and you'll notice he's not my preferred one.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #404 on: June 21, 2015, 05:08:42 pm »

It's not about changing his opinion (that's fine), it's about being all independent-minded one day and going with the flow into lackadaisically supporting a lynch he has no strong opinion on the next.

If he had an opinion of his own that Mail-mi was scummy, I'd have expected him to say something.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #405 on: June 21, 2015, 05:10:46 pm »

UoS just legitimately used "lackadaisically" in a sentence. Keep this in mind when deciding the MVP for this game silver.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #406 on: June 21, 2015, 05:22:43 pm »

Okay then let's see.

Vote: Awaclus
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #407 on: June 21, 2015, 05:39:46 pm »

I guess I can do a mail-mi lynch, though I'm not sure how much I'm being influenced by everyone else, or how bad it is if that's what's happening.
I really don't like this.  Mail-mi has 3 votes, we have a week left, the case on Mail-mi is pretty thin.
I wasn't saying we should lynch him now, I was expressing my opinion on lynching him, due to the fact that he was the leading wagon at the time. And the case isn't super thick, I think my post conveys that. Responses to the rest will follow
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #408 on: June 21, 2015, 05:51:03 pm »


Previously Skip said,
And I didn't read mail-mi's post as a defense, more of a question posed to adk to see what explanation would be given.
And he was explicitly not finding Mail-mi scummy over his RVS voting and unvoting at the time.

So being okay with the Mail-mi lynch is because of Mail-mi voting teproc (who Skip has a couple of times found scummy) based on Chair's trap, which Chairs isn't so behind anymore.  And because 3 other people are voting Mail-mi.

So maybe it's newbtown sheeping, but when it comes to questioning me or not getting on the WW wagon Skip has shown an admirable lack of sheeping.  And in his post where he lends support to the Mail-mi wagon (without voting) he lays the groundwork for the "maybe I'm just newbtown being influenced" defense.  But he doesn't question it, and he was absolutely questioning the rest of us back with
Meh im not feeling the ww wagon, though I should probably cast a real vote sooner rather than later. I'll decide today sometime.

So yeah, Vote: Skip
I've become less sure of how to evaluate mail-mi's alleged defense of me since I made that comment; his comments on the ww/teproc fight struck me as slightly strange after re-read (I only said teproc was scummy a long while ago before that fight of his, btw. It was because I expected him to be posting more, which he started doing.). And yes, I would definitely call this at least partial sheeping. I really didn't like the ww wagon so I didn't get on board. I was nervous about you and I wanted to see you under pressure but it doesn't seem like people are interested. I did those things on my own, but that doesn't mean I can't go with the flow if it's about something I'm not opposed to. I don't see any inconsistency here.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #409 on: June 21, 2015, 05:54:31 pm »

@Skip: if WW and Teproc are both town, do you think that makes Mail-mi more likely or less likely to be scum?  (Pretend we have flips on both WW and Teproc and know 100% that they are town.)
more or less likely than what? There's more than one other scenario.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #410 on: June 21, 2015, 10:45:13 pm »

It's not about changing his opinion (that's fine), it's about being all independent-minded one day and going with the flow into lackadaisically supporting a lynch he has no strong opinion on the next.

If he had an opinion of his own that Mail-mi was scummy, I'd have expected him to say something.

Oh *rereads the case* hm, I see what you mean now. I still don't agree with it, I think you can read townie behaviour in it just as easily, but it's an ok case, I guess.


@pacovf re: Awaclus being a similar case to mail-mi. That's a good point, though I think Awaclus is much more likely to flip scum. But yeah, he's a meh day 1 lynch for the same reasons as mail-mi... and you'll notice he's not my preferred one.

There's a fundamental difference between the two: Awaclus would strictly be a lurker lynch. That means no accountability whatsoever if we lynch him. Nobody voting for mail-mi is doing so because of his lack of content, it's because what little there is, is scummy, so they won't be able to deflect responsibility tomorrow (should he happen to flip town).

That being said, I don't like the way Awaclus has been lurking. Most lurkers are just passive, not checking the game all that often, then posting a quick thought or two when they log in. Awaclus has been following the game closely, and just choosing not to post anything. Normally I would argue very strongly against a D1 lurker lynch, but I wouldn't feel so strongly about it in this specific case. Still, I would prefer a lynch elsewhere.

The problem is that you offer three lynches. WW and skip are town, IMHO, and Awaclus is a lurker lynch. So there's no common ground between our positions.

UoS just legitimately used "lackadaisically" in a sentence. Keep this in mind when deciding the MVP for this game silver.

Hear, hear.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #411 on: June 21, 2015, 11:01:48 pm »

Here. I can answer any questions you have. I will be reading.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #412 on: June 21, 2015, 11:04:49 pm »

Eh? What should we be asking?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #413 on: June 21, 2015, 11:10:08 pm »

Some people asked me about my thoughts on arguments, I dunno. I guess there's nothing pressing. I'll begin reading now.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #414 on: June 22, 2015, 01:27:07 am »

As for right now, I like chairs' argument for teproc. vote: teproc
also, chairs doesn't even like chairs' argument for teproc.

Doesn't mean I don't.

Sorry I've been gone, I just got an internship where I get to dress up as an alien and shoot little children with fake guns, so that's taken up a lot of my time. I'll be here later today, so ask questions and I'll get to answering them.

And turns out I didn't actually have any time today  :-[
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #415 on: June 22, 2015, 12:07:21 pm »

Some people asked me about my thoughts on arguments, I dunno. I guess there's nothing pressing. I'll begin reading now.

Did you reach any conclusion after your reread?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #416 on: June 22, 2015, 03:06:24 pm »

@Skip: if WW and Teproc are both town, do you think that makes Mail-mi more likely or less likely to be scum?  (Pretend we have flips on both WW and Teproc and know 100% that they are town.)
more or less likely than what? There's more than one other scenario.

Um, I'm not sure how that's a confusing question.  But rather than go around in circles on it, let's try it this way instead:

Have you given much thought to Mail-mi's comment that WW and Teproc are the same alignment, and how does it influence your opinion on Mail-mi, in your own words.  Just talk out all your thoughts here.  If you haven't thought about it, just say that and we'll move on, no need to decide on opinions where you have none about this.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #417 on: June 22, 2015, 04:07:00 pm »

Hey WW, why Awaclus over Mail-mi?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #418 on: June 22, 2015, 04:09:32 pm »

Hey WW, why Awaclus over Mail-mi?

Why Mail-Mi over Awaclus?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #419 on: June 22, 2015, 04:14:09 pm »

Hey WW, why Awaclus over Mail-mi?

Why Mail-Mi over Awaclus?

I'm opposed to lynching Mail-mi. But you voted Awaclus and haven't said much about him that I remember.  Certainly both are lurking.  I wanted to know what your thoughts were.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #420 on: June 22, 2015, 04:16:53 pm »

Hey WW, why Awaclus over Mail-mi?

Why Mail-Mi over Awaclus?

I'm opposed to lynching Mail-mi. But you voted Awaclus and haven't said much about him that I remember.  Certainly both are lurking.  I wanted to know what your thoughts were.

So then it's not Mail-Mi over Awaclus.  Come vote Awaclus, because wagons are cool!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #421 on: June 22, 2015, 04:21:29 pm »

@Skip: if WW and Teproc are both town, do you think that makes Mail-mi more likely or less likely to be scum?  (Pretend we have flips on both WW and Teproc and know 100% that they are town.)
more or less likely than what? There's more than one other scenario.

Um, I'm not sure how that's a confusing question.  But rather than go around in circles on it, let's try it this way instead:

Have you given much thought to Mail-mi's comment that WW and Teproc are the same alignment, and how does it influence your opinion on Mail-mi, in your own words.  Just talk out all your thoughts here.  If you haven't thought about it, just say that and we'll move on, no need to decide on opinions where you have none about this.
when he said it I didn't think much of it, bit it's been pointed out that it's a thing scum will often do if they're partner is in fight and I think I understand why that is. If they're both town on the other hand, im not sure. Maybe it would help if mail-mi explained why his opinion is that it's definitely not town vs scum
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #422 on: June 22, 2015, 04:22:18 pm »

Hey WW, why Awaclus over Mail-mi?

Why Mail-Mi over Awaclus?

I'm opposed to lynching Mail-mi. But you voted Awaclus and haven't said much about him that I remember.  Certainly both are lurking.  I wanted to know what your thoughts were.

So then it's not Mail-Mi over Awaclus.  Come vote Awaclus, because wagons are cool!

Well Mail-mi had a wagon of 3 on him while Awaclus just had Hydrad.  I was surprised you weren't getting on the preexisting wagon.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #423 on: June 22, 2015, 04:39:11 pm »

Frankly, the people on WW should reevaluate their position. Have you noticed how hard it is to get any other wagon going? If WW was scum, mafia players would be trying to get an alternative wagon going. So, unless you believe I am scum and doing exactly that, you should be convinced that WW is town.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #424 on: June 22, 2015, 04:45:59 pm »

Frankly, the people on WW should reevaluate their position. Have you noticed how hard it is to get any other wagon going? If WW was scum, mafia players would be trying to get an alternative wagon going. So, unless you believe I am scum and doing exactly that, you should be convinced that WW is town.

I have been trying to reevaluate my position, but I still find WW scummy.  If WW were town I think his wagon wouldn't have fallen apart so easily, I actually think Mail-mi is town largely because of how much half-assed support his wagon seems to have.

I think you are town, and I think WW is scum.  I don't find that position contradictory.

I think the drop in content of everyone but you, me, Skip, and Teproc (or maintenance of 0 content in the case of Awaclus, Hydrad, and Mail-mi) has more to do with the stalling feeling we have.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #425 on: June 22, 2015, 04:47:56 pm »

I guess I should clarify something: I agree with you that scum benefits from us running out the day and all just shrugging and lynching the "inevitable" candidate.  But it seems to me that that situation results in a Mail-mi lynch rather than a WW lynch.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #426 on: June 22, 2015, 04:51:55 pm »

I have the opposite feeling, but too many people are keeping their opinions to themselves for me to be sure of it. I agree that, right now, it looks like either of them is going to be today's lynch.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #427 on: June 22, 2015, 04:54:52 pm »

Sorry, been super busy and probably shouldn't have joined this game  :-\ but I'll try to get something done sometime soon.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #428 on: June 22, 2015, 04:58:32 pm »

We could also lynch Awaclus.  Or Teproc.  Or both.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #429 on: June 22, 2015, 05:03:08 pm »

Vote: Awaclus
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #430 on: June 22, 2015, 05:14:30 pm »

I actually think Mail-mi is town largely because of how much half-assed support his wagon seems to have.

Just reread this. This only makes sense if you think that the half-assed support comes from scum, right? Who would that be?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #431 on: June 22, 2015, 05:21:37 pm »

I actually think Mail-mi is town largely because of how much half-assed support his wagon seems to have.

Just reread this. This only makes sense if you think that the half-assed support comes from scum, right? Who would that be?

You would be correct.  Do you think I thought otherwise? You're the only person in favor of lynching Mail-mi that I have a townread on.  The rest are null or scummy.  Specifically I have scum reads on WW and Skip, and I'm mildly suspicious of Chairs and Seprix.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #432 on: June 22, 2015, 05:24:16 pm »

I thought it could be a general feeling you had, but that you hadn't explored.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #433 on: June 22, 2015, 06:00:55 pm »

I could probably vote WW.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #434 on: June 22, 2015, 06:01:53 pm »

I could probably vote WW.

Don't vote on me bro.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #435 on: June 22, 2015, 06:02:50 pm »

Comedy gold
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #436 on: June 22, 2015, 06:04:47 pm »

I could probably vote WW.

Weren't you the one that was fake-voting WW to get a Teproc wagon started? Now you want to real-vote WW? What changed?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #437 on: June 22, 2015, 06:06:51 pm »

I could probably vote WW.

Weren't you the one that was fake-voting WW to get a Teproc wagon started? Now you want to real-vote WW? What changed?

^Didn't fall for the bait.  Obvscum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #438 on: June 22, 2015, 06:26:15 pm »

I could probably vote WW.

Weren't you the one that was fake-voting WW to get a Teproc wagon started? Now you want to real-vote WW? What changed?

^Didn't fall for the bait.  Obvscum.

Who didn't fall for what bait and who is obvscum ?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #439 on: June 22, 2015, 06:35:08 pm »

Oh hey.  What do you think of Awaclus?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #440 on: June 22, 2015, 06:40:29 pm »

quick reads

If players are scum, they are a lynch prospect. If unknown, I don't know what to think of them. If town, they are not a lynch prospect.

Awaclus

I didn't like the accusations against Awaclus, but I'm warming up to them. Unknown

Teproc (town) (rational)

I don't understand the arguments against Teproc. He's probably one of my top town reads so far. He's analyzing things pretty well. Town

Hydrad (town)

Well... He's Hydrad. Unknown

WitherWeaver

I'm not so sold on WW yet, but he hasn't done anything explicitly bad, so... Unknown

skip wooznum

I don't know, there are times where I like Skip, times where I don't. I don't know what to think thus far. Scum

A Drowned Kernel

While initially thinking ADK as town, he has recently disappeared, and well, it looks like he just posted his 'daily quota' and is now watching the squabble. Scum

mail-mi

I don't need to explain my rationale, I already have before. Scum

UmbrageOfSnow

He's discussing things, without going too deep into his topics I can say he's town for now. Town

chairs

Short posts with long stretches of inactivity. Do we really know who Chairs is? Unknown

pacovf

Asking the right questions, actually doing things right now. Town
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #441 on: June 22, 2015, 06:41:16 pm »

Guh, I biffed my last post's aesthetic look. I'm pretty bummed.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #442 on: June 22, 2015, 06:42:01 pm »

Oh hey.  What do you think of Awaclus?
I'm going to answer, since I've been lurky. Seems like a better option than the other wagons, I'm really not seeing the mail-mi wagon. Vote: Awaclus.

PPE:1
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #443 on: June 22, 2015, 06:42:31 pm »

Guh, I biffed my last post's aesthetic look. I'm pretty bummed.
You also didn't state an opinion about me.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #444 on: June 22, 2015, 06:43:06 pm »

That's a very safe reads list.  It would seem scummy in general.  From Seprix it's just kind of.. Seprixy.

PPEs
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #445 on: June 22, 2015, 06:43:16 pm »

Oh hey.  What do you think of Awaclus?

Scummy. Don't think we've heard from him since I expressed suspicion of him and he popped up to say "hey, that's just who I am man", which tells me the only goal he has in the game is not being lynched. Backup lynch if you don't work out.

PPE : 5
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #446 on: June 22, 2015, 06:43:56 pm »

Guh, I biffed my last post's aesthetic look. I'm pretty bummed.
You also didn't state an opinion about me.

Do I need to, INNOCENT CHILD?

That's a very safe reads list.  It would seem scummy in general.  From Seprix it's just kind of.. Seprixy.

PPEs

Gee, thanks. I can go in more depth when I'm not drowning in college homework.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #447 on: June 22, 2015, 06:44:50 pm »

I could probably vote WW.

Weren't you the one that was fake-voting WW to get a Teproc wagon started? Now you want to real-vote WW? What changed?

^Didn't fall for the bait.  Obvscum.

Who didn't fall for what bait and who is obvscum ?


This was a serious question by the way, I didn't get that post.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #448 on: June 22, 2015, 06:46:36 pm »

I could probably vote WW.

Weren't you the one that was fake-voting WW to get a Teproc wagon started? Now you want to real-vote WW? What changed?

^Didn't fall for the bait.  Obvscum.

Who didn't fall for what bait and who is obvscum ?


This was a serious question by the way, I didn't get that post.

It was a joke, because last time he put me at L-1 for reactions and voted you based on yours.  Now he says he's considering lynching me, but Pacovf reacts more carefully. 
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #449 on: June 22, 2015, 06:49:54 pm »

I suspected it might have been a joke, but those are always better when they're explained, so good.

I'll probably reread tomorrow, as I'll admit it's possible I'm tunneling and being lazy here.

As a sidenote, this is why I don't like 10-day deadlines, even on day 1. There's just very little urgency right now, and the we'll get to 10 hours before deadline with the biggest wagon at 4 votes or something and rush a lynch as usual.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #450 on: June 22, 2015, 07:58:33 pm »

Oi I'm still here. Sorry I've been posting so little.

I'm find it interesting that my placeholder vote on awaclus has suddenly become a wagon. Thats weird to me. Like I guess I'm still fine with an awaclus lynch but I'm not really sure why others are fine with it suddenly.

this whole game just feels weird though.

pacovf and UoG have day 1 passes in my book though.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #451 on: June 22, 2015, 08:03:48 pm »


this whole game just feels weird though.

pacovf and UoG have day 1 passes in my book though.
I agree, this game feels weird. Mainly because I'm not high on any scum list, that's a new experience.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #452 on: June 22, 2015, 08:06:57 pm »

Oi I'm still here. Sorry I've been posting so little.

I'm find it interesting that my placeholder vote on awaclus has suddenly become a wagon. Thats weird to me. Like I guess I'm still fine with an awaclus lynch but I'm not really sure why others are fine with it suddenly.

this whole game just feels weird though.

pacovf and UoG have day 1 passes in my book though.

Maybe you could get some actual reads instead of a "placeholder" vote or a "hey we never lynch WW day 1" vote.

Just sayin'
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #453 on: June 22, 2015, 08:08:59 pm »

(Also obligatory translation to scummy "I don't want to be held accountable for this vote.")

Awaclus town makes Hydrad more likely scum.  Hey, contingencies are fun!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #454 on: June 22, 2015, 08:10:48 pm »


this whole game just feels weird though.

pacovf and UoG have day 1 passes in my book though.
I agree, this game feels weird. Mainly because I'm not high on any scum list, that's a new experience.

We can lynch you if you'd like. :)

This game is a bit slow, is all. But do we really want to rush everything?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #455 on: June 22, 2015, 08:11:18 pm »

Wait a second. Joseph, you do know you're an IC, right?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #456 on: June 22, 2015, 08:13:05 pm »

Wait a second. Joseph, you do know you're an IC, right?
Yes.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #457 on: June 22, 2015, 08:13:12 pm »

I
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #458 on: June 22, 2015, 08:13:20 pm »

do
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #459 on: June 22, 2015, 08:13:38 pm »

Just getting my post count up, so people don't think I'm scummy.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #460 on: June 22, 2015, 08:14:03 pm »


this whole game just feels weird though.

pacovf and UoG have day 1 passes in my book though.
I agree, this game feels weird. Mainly because I'm not high on any scum list, that's a new experience.

We can lynch you if you'd like. :)

This game is a bit slow, is all. But do we really want to rush everything?
Lynching an IC, seems scummy to me.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #461 on: June 22, 2015, 08:14:39 pm »



This game is a bit slow, is all. But do we really want to rush everything?
No need to rush, we still have 5 days. Although I'm away most of the next 2.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #462 on: June 22, 2015, 08:17:01 pm »

You do know what an IC is, right?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #463 on: June 22, 2015, 08:17:45 pm »

This game is a bit slow, is all. But do we really want to rush everything?

No. That's why people have to post more. So that we don't end up rushing everything during the last 10 hours.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #464 on: June 22, 2015, 08:18:18 pm »

You do know what an IC is, right?

Yes. He's just drunk with towniness.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #465 on: June 22, 2015, 08:21:15 pm »

This game is a bit slow, is all. But do we really want to rush everything?

No. That's why people have to post more. So that we don't end up rushing everything during the last 10 hours.
I agree, we aren't even going to be in the usual scenario of wanting to lynch me, me claiming with a few hours to go, and everyone voting someone else, like in so many games I've been in.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #466 on: June 22, 2015, 08:21:27 pm »

You do know what an IC is, right?

Yes. He's just drunk with towniness.
Probably.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #467 on: June 22, 2015, 10:15:01 pm »

Would scum!awaclus be this uninterested in this game? (Or do we think he's pretending to be uninterested?)
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #468 on: June 22, 2015, 11:12:19 pm »

Is anyone voting (or wanting to vote) for Awaclus for a reason other than him lurking? If he flips town, are you all going to throw your hands up in the air and say "but he was lurking!"?

I'm all up for lynching lurkers... starting on D2. Otherwise, I would rather lynch someone that actually gets us somewhere even if he flips town. Own your votes, people!

Otherwise, if anyone has a strong opinion on Hydrad, ADK or Seprix (remember when he had a wagon on him?), I would like to hear it. We haven't discussed any of them lately.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #469 on: June 22, 2015, 11:33:24 pm »

Okay, time to catch up here.

I buy this, actually. Teproc and mail-mi are probably either both town or both scum.

Hey ADK, so I get why if Teproc flips scum that makes Mail-mi likely scum, and why if Mail-mi flips scum that could make Teproc/WW more likely to be scum, but if Mail-mi or Teproc flip town, why does that make the other more likely town?

Looking back I don't really know why I said that. There is a bit of a partner signal there but you're right that there's nothing to indicate that they're both town.

Also this and other posts are making me feel mostly towny on Umbrage. So let's start working on a no-lynch list: chairs, Umbrage, let's see if anyone else can get themselves on it.



I like the way that pacovf responded to me voting for him, and I like this post. He's making a good effort at this game. unvote for now. He can go on the no-lynch list.

Okay then let's see.

Vote: Awaclus

WW seems to like pursuing "safe" lynches. I'm moving back to liking a WW lynch.

A Drowned Kernel

While initially thinking ADK as town, he has recently disappeared, and well, it looks like he just posted his 'daily quota' and is now watching the squabble. Scum

I do apologize for the absence, RL has not been kind to me lately.

Okay, less to catch up on than I thought. I'm back to wanting to lynch WW. Time to check if I'm hammering if I vote.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #470 on: June 22, 2015, 11:34:34 pm »

Doesn't look like it. vote: WW
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #471 on: June 22, 2015, 11:49:18 pm »

I don't know much about WW because I've been struggling to write this 4-page paper for college (I know, pathetic). I'll read up on the double W as soon as I can.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #472 on: June 22, 2015, 11:51:19 pm »

Why is Awaclus a safe lynch?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #473 on: June 22, 2015, 11:55:32 pm »

He's a lurker.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #474 on: June 23, 2015, 06:55:50 am »

He's a lurker.
True, but that's not a scum tell, that's a general Awaclus tell.
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Vote Count
« Reply #475 on: June 23, 2015, 07:40:52 am »

Vote Count 1.6

Awaclus (4): Hydrad, Witherweaver, UmbrageOfSnow, Joseph2302
Seprix (1): Awaclus
Witherweaver (2): Teproc, A Drowned Kernel
UmbrageOfSnow (1): skip wooznum
Teproc (1): mail-mi
mail-mi (3): pacovf, Seprix, chairs

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Day 1 ends at Jun 28, 3 PM Forum Time.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #476 on: June 23, 2015, 09:23:30 am »

He's a lurker.
True, but that's not a scum tell, that's a general Awaclus tell.

That's my point.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #477 on: June 23, 2015, 09:33:49 am »

It's not an easy lynch if there's resistance!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #478 on: June 23, 2015, 10:21:33 am »

It's not an easy lynch if there's resistance!

Still a safe vote. Scum cares less about pushing mislynches super hard than about appearing active and towny.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #479 on: June 23, 2015, 10:24:12 am »

It's not an easy lynch if there's resistance!

Still a safe vote. Scum cares less about pushing mislynches super hard than about appearing active and towny.

So what's an unsafe vote?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #480 on: June 23, 2015, 10:28:08 am »

It's not an easy lynch if there's resistance!

Still a safe vote. Scum cares less about pushing mislynches super hard than about appearing active and towny.

So what's an unsafe vote?

L-1?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #481 on: June 23, 2015, 10:29:28 am »

It's not an easy lynch if there's resistance!

Still a safe vote. Scum cares less about pushing mislynches super hard than about appearing active and towny.

So what's an unsafe vote?

L-1?

Only two more votes to get Awaclus to L-1! Look!  It's unsafe, and therefore unequivocally townie!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #482 on: June 23, 2015, 10:30:34 am »

In other news, Awaclus has a quickly growing wagon; neglects to respond.  More at 11.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #483 on: June 23, 2015, 10:31:45 am »

Yeah, not defending Awaclus here. I was saying voting someone when they're L-1 is an unsafe vote. :p
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #484 on: June 23, 2015, 10:32:13 am »

In other news, Awaclus has a quickly growing wagon; neglects to respond.  More at 11.

Perhaps he is not online at the moment.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #485 on: June 23, 2015, 10:41:00 am »

In other news, Awaclus has a quickly growing wagon; neglects to respond.  More at 11.

Perhaps he is not online at the moment.

Or the last couple days of moments.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #486 on: June 23, 2015, 10:46:50 am »

In other news, Awaclus has a quickly growing wagon; neglects to respond.  More at 11.

Perhaps he is not online at the moment.

Or the last couple days of moments.

Yes, that seems to be a problem.

I shouldn't be online right now. I'm in college, writing a paper before class. :p
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #487 on: June 23, 2015, 10:59:26 am »

In other news, Awaclus has a quickly growing wagon; neglects to respond.  More at 11.

I've responded to it already.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #488 on: June 23, 2015, 11:00:38 am »

In other news, Awaclus has a quickly growing wagon; neglects to respond.  More at 11.

I've responded to it already.

Good job answering at 11.  Town points for that. 

But this is your first post since before the wagon started. So lying scum.  Scum points for that.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #489 on: June 23, 2015, 11:08:21 am »

Apparently, a wagon starts when one man votes for you. :)
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #490 on: June 23, 2015, 11:10:31 am »

Apparently, a wagon starts when one man votes for you. :)

I didn't have any votes at that time, but the wagon had already started.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #491 on: June 23, 2015, 11:17:00 am »

Can we just vote: awaclus and get rolling? I want to see what N1's NK will be already so we can work with it D2.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #492 on: June 23, 2015, 11:19:10 am »

Woah, Chairs. That's a pretty aggressive push there!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #493 on: June 23, 2015, 11:21:17 am »

Can we just vote: awaclus and get rolling? I want to see what N1's NK will be already so we can work with it D2.

So you are not interested in D1's flip?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #494 on: June 23, 2015, 11:22:48 am »

I feel bad for thinking this (because it might encourage groupthink and dissuade people from carrying out their reads) but chairs feels a bit scummy for me right now. Like, enough for me to change my vote from mail-mi.

vote: Chairs
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #495 on: June 23, 2015, 11:52:12 am »

Can we just vote: awaclus and get rolling? I want to see what N1's NK will be already so we can work with it D2.

So you are not interested in D1's flip?

I am, but I'm actually more interested in N1's flip, because I feel like I get more out of seeing definitely-a-scum-kill data than I do out of groupthink.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #496 on: June 23, 2015, 11:52:55 am »

That's... insane.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #497 on: June 23, 2015, 11:53:36 am »

I feel bad for thinking this (because it might encourage groupthink and dissuade people from carrying out their reads) but chairs feels a bit scummy for me right now. Like, enough for me to change my vote from mail-mi.

vote: Chairs

Yeah, groupthink is my big concern right now - feels like we're just deadlocking.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #498 on: June 23, 2015, 11:53:58 am »

Well, it's not safe.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #499 on: June 23, 2015, 11:54:08 am »

Like, seriously. Lynches are infinitely more informative than night kills, and dismissing them as groupthink is letting scum get away with not being held accountable for their votes.

PPE : 1
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #500 on: June 23, 2015, 11:54:55 am »

If you're so against groupthink, why are you voting for the leading wagon ?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #501 on: June 23, 2015, 11:56:29 am »

Can we just vote: awaclus and get rolling? I want to perform N1's NK already

Vote: chairs
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #502 on: June 23, 2015, 11:57:10 am »

Can we just vote: awaclus and get rolling? I want to perform N1's NK already

Vote: chairs

Why ?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #503 on: June 23, 2015, 11:59:57 am »

Can we just vote: awaclus and get rolling? I want to perform N1's NK already

Vote: chairs

Why ?

Because he's scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #504 on: June 23, 2015, 12:00:13 pm »

If you're so against groupthink, why are you voting for the leading wagon ?

!? Chairs isn't the leading wagon.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #505 on: June 23, 2015, 12:00:58 pm »

If you're so against groupthink, why are you voting for the leading wagon ?

!? Chairs isn't the leading wagon.

Sorry if that was unclear, that was adressed to chairs.

@Awaclus : Do you want to be lynched ?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #506 on: June 23, 2015, 12:01:37 pm »

@Awaclus : Do you want to be lynched ?

Not particularly.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #507 on: June 23, 2015, 12:03:18 pm »

Are you saying I'm not going to get my Cutie Mark in scumhunting after all?  :'(

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #508 on: June 23, 2015, 12:04:11 pm »

If you're so against groupthink, why are you voting for the leading wagon ?

!? Chairs isn't the leading wagon.

Awaclus is, which is what the question was about.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #509 on: June 23, 2015, 12:05:04 pm »

@Awaclus : Do you want to be lynched ?

Not particularly.

Could you please take the time to explain to us why you think chairs is scum then ?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #510 on: June 23, 2015, 12:14:18 pm »

@Awaclus : Do you want to be lynched ?

Not particularly.

Could you please take the time to explain to us why you think chairs is scum then ?

Well, I don't mind explaining it because it should be obvious anyway, but OTOH that also makes the explanation sort of pointless.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #511 on: June 23, 2015, 12:15:23 pm »

@Awaclus : Do you want to be lynched ?

Not particularly.

Could you please take the time to explain to us why you think chairs is scum then ?

Well, I don't mind explaining it because it should be obvious anyway, but OTOH that also makes the explanation sort of pointless.

I'll take that as a "no". Ok then.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #512 on: June 23, 2015, 12:17:12 pm »

@Awaclus : Do you want to be lynched ?

Not particularly.

Could you please take the time to explain to us why you think chairs is scum then ?

Well, I don't mind explaining it because it should be obvious anyway, but OTOH that also makes the explanation sort of pointless.

I wanna hear it!

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #513 on: June 23, 2015, 12:24:33 pm »

This is my reread post. It will be long, rambling, and full of random observations.

UoS was the first to put a serious vote on someone, which merits credit, scum loves to let RVS last forever.

Seprix was being overly dramatic with regards to the early wagon on him. Could be scummy, scum generally gets more scared when they're wagonned since they know they're guilty.

WW being very jokey, but he can be like that as either alignment if memory serves.

Seprix got confused between mail-mi and Hydrad early on. Not really relevant until we gets flips, but something to keep in mind.

My vote on you is no longer random, for example.
this kind of justifying a previous rvs, I don't like.

Again, PPE

I concur; I've actually only ever seen  scum do this, I think.

This is still weird to me. It's really not an argument I expect WW to make, which makes me think he might have agreed with skip to buddy him/have content early.

unvote

Hydrad seems like good old Hydrad.

People are reading too much into this post I think. It reads like mail-mi being mail-mi to me.

I kinda forgot about ADK in this game. Not a good sign, there might be something there, town!ADK is usually much more memorable.

pacovf is doing a solid townie job. No idea what scum!pacovf looks like though, have we gotten that in a normal game yet ?

Still like my WW case at this point. And WW immediately OMGUSed me for it, I thought that had come later. Do you still think I'm scum WW ?

ADK sheeped me immediately on WW with an unexplained vote (though he does elaborate quickly after). Not quite sure what to make of that yet.

Is it just me or does this ww/teproc fight seem a tad scum vs. scum?

Skip is looking much townier on the reread. As someone else pointed out, this is typical paranoid!townie.

chairs L-1 trap... I don't know. These things usually come from town, but scum!chairs is probably capable of it. Leaning town on it, but barely. The problem is that town!chairs apparently does this expecting me to "not push the brakes" which... I have a hard time believing chairs doesn't know that I'm always going to do the "L-1, don't hammer" thing this early in the game. If we hadn't played so many games together, I could see it, but here ? Talked myself into leaning scum on it now.

I've said it before, but I don't like the whole "wagons stagnating/wagons going too fast means X or Y" reasonings. I've seen fast wagons on scum, stagnating wagons on town, I've seen scum teams letting a wagon ramp up on their partner not daring to speak out against it in case it didn't work out and they got lynched against it... those are all things you can really only analyze after a flip, before it's kind of a crapshoot.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #514 on: June 23, 2015, 12:27:23 pm »

Yay a reread post I can get behind!

vote: seprix, you convinced me.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #515 on: June 23, 2015, 12:33:37 pm »

pacovf is doing a solid townie job. No idea what scum!pacovf looks like though, have we gotten that in a normal game yet ?

We haven't gotten scum!pacovf in any game at all (and, spoiler alert, we still won't after this game ;))

Quote
I've said it before, but I don't like the whole "wagons stagnating/wagons going too fast means X or Y" reasonings. I've seen fast wagons on scum, stagnating wagons on town, I've seen scum teams letting a wagon ramp up on their partner not daring to speak out against it in case it didn't work out and they got lynched against it... those are all things you can really only analyze after a flip, before it's kind of a crapshoot.

It was more like "no other wagon is actually sprouting". In any case, all else being equal, that has more chances to indicate town than scum. But I see your point.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #516 on: June 23, 2015, 12:34:21 pm »

UoS : Obvtown. Did too much right to be scum, too much scumhunting when there was no need to if he was scum.

pacovf : Townie, very similar to his ASoIaF play.

skip : Townie. UoS' case works on paper but he really fits the enthuasiastic new townie thing.

mail-mi : Slight town.

Awaclus : Incredibly scummy. Maybe too scummy to be scum. I'm going null right now, but I'm off to find an Awaclus scum game to read, hopefully that clarifies things for me. Null in the meantime.

ADK : Slight scum, though I wouldn't be enthusiastic about lynching him today.

Hydrad : Slight scum. Town!Hydrad puts himself out there more than this I think.

Seprix : Scummy, solely based on early overreaction to the wagon. Didn't stand out any way or the other after that.

chairs : Scummy, based on the L-1 "trap" which didn't read genuine on the reread.

WW : Still think he's scum. He's gotten his game back on since he got wagonned, but his early posts still don't read like town!WW to me, he's just been good about doing damage control since then, and it worked. I still can't shake the feeling, don't think I'm tunneling.


Huh, that's a lot of scum reads.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #517 on: June 23, 2015, 12:34:39 pm »

Off to read a scum!Awaclus game. Maybe a town one too, I'm really confused about his play here.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #518 on: June 23, 2015, 12:35:20 pm »

Yay a reread post I can get behind!

vote: seprix, you convinced me.

You just want to get to D2, do you?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #519 on: June 23, 2015, 12:36:51 pm »

Off to read a scum!Awaclus game. Maybe a town one too, I'm really confused about his play here.

I approve.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #520 on: June 23, 2015, 12:40:34 pm »

Any doubts I have had about Teproc are gone. I'd say him and Pacovf are easily leading town.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #521 on: June 23, 2015, 12:56:59 pm »

Awaclus in Mafia Holiday (he was scum with Hydrad and Joseph, setup was asher9++)

Lots of early theory talk and trying to "catch scum" with some kind of flavor thing.

He's actually pretty active, with backed-up votes (including a nice Chainsaw Defense when faust votes for his scumbuddy Joseph), some "thinking aloud" posts and theory talk with Seprix (who was a newbie then).

At some point that day 1 became all about Joseph, who was in his run of incredibly scummy games as scum. Awaclus tries his best to go for alternative lynches as they come up (I count at least four of them), though he's never full-on defending Joseph it seems.

And then Joseph gets lynched and Awaclus is left to try to survive after very obviously behaving like Joseph's partner on day 1. He's lynched on day 3.

So that was a game that went very poorly for scum, but the big thing here is that Awaclus was much more active and constructive, and things were going pretty well for him until Joseph got lynched. Obviously his activity from the point that Joseph is pressured isn't necessarily applicable, but he was active before, including theory talk.

Not at all like this game then. Now to look at a town game.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #522 on: June 23, 2015, 12:58:54 pm »

Teproc is doing a good job of scumhunting which makes me not want to lynch him. But I also know that he's good enough at this game to be this on top of things as scum.

Awaclus I kind of want to policy lynch because if he's town then he's not being helpful. But again, it's the easy day one lynch, and I still like lynching WW more.

PPE: I'm pretty sure I've seen Awaclus as lurky scum. Wasn't he scum in flavorless?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #523 on: June 23, 2015, 01:04:26 pm »

Awaclus in Futuramafia* (VT)

*P.S. : Ash, if you're reading this, the link for Futuramafia in the Stats page goes to Fish Mafia

This is still the "Joseph being scummy" run of games, and Awaclus gets on that wagon early. Tunnels him all day 1, not very active, though more than he his in this current game. Then Joseph claims Tracker, and he switches to Hydrad and defends the idea of leaving Joseph alive to verify his claim. He gets pretty active then, as deadline is nearing.

Then he's not very active the rest of the game, but his posts always have content.

Meh. Neither of these look anything like what he's doing now. So I'm guessing Awaclus is trying something new, and I don't know why he'd do that (or this specific brand of new) as town.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #524 on: June 23, 2015, 01:05:32 pm »

vote: Awaclus

L-1 I think. Wait no, chairs switched so it's only L-2.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #525 on: June 23, 2015, 01:11:53 pm »

Since we're doing the would-not-lynch list thing, mine is woefully short:

Teproc, pacovf.

With this level of engagement it would be very easy for scum to lead town around into mislynches without having to stick their nose out too far.  Chairs and Awalcus' behavior is actively anti-town.  So if you're town, maybe try to be useful or actually commit to something that you can be held to later.  This sort of play as town is great for your scum game, but you're going to be town more often then scum, so if you're town ACT LIKE IT.

Anyway, when I voted Awalcus yesterday, I wasn't actually interested in lynching him.  I think I am now, but I want some input from those of you who have played with him a lot.

I read Awalcus' posts in a bunch of his recent games and skimmed the content around them.  His meta appears to be that he tries harder and defends himself more as scum.  But it still looks to me that he comes in and defends himself as town too.  Yesterday he was posting on site while ignoring his wagon, which he continues to do.

This quote from RMM 24 caught my eye (he was town there.)
- can you explain exactly what it is from your scum meta which you fail to replicate as town? I've heard you saying that you're easily found at as scum a bunch of times, but never understood why.
2) Well, I don't particularly try to replicate my scum meta when I'm town.  :P Anyway, I always feel enormous pressure to make sense and explain everything as scum. Even in Blarnia Mafia where I somehow got away with it, I explained all of my votes and reads unless the reasons were very clear without an explanation. I obviously do not feel any pressure to explain anything at all when I'm town.

When I read this, I got to thinking: he seems hyper aware of this, and in this game it looks to me (and this is where I need input from people who've actually played with him a bunch rather than skimmed some games) that he's been explaining and defending himself even less than usual.

I'm postulating that he's overcompensating for his known scumtell.

Thoughts?

PPE: 4
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #526 on: June 23, 2015, 01:12:36 pm »

Can we just vote: awaclus and get rolling? I want to see what N1's NK will be already so we can work with it D2.
This doesn't seem very good or towny. Vote: chairs , because this is scummier than anything Awaclus has done /not done.
PPE: Lots
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #527 on: June 23, 2015, 01:14:35 pm »

Since we're doing the would-not-lynch list thing, mine is woefully short:
When I read this, I got to thinking: he seems hyper aware of this, and in this game it looks to me (and this is where I need input from people who've actually played with him a bunch rather than skimmed some games) that he's been explaining and defending himself even less than usual.

I'm postulating that he's overcompensating for his known scumtell.

Thoughts?

I think it's pretty likely, actually. I can hammer if you'd like, I'm down for an Awaclus lynch.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #528 on: June 23, 2015, 01:16:07 pm »

Awaclus in Futuramafia* (VT)

*P.S. : Ash, if you're reading this, the link for Futuramafia in the Stats page goes to Fish Mafia

This is still the "Joseph being scummy" run of games, and Awaclus gets on that wagon early. Tunnels him all day 1, not very active, though more than he his in this current game. Then Joseph claims Tracker, and he switches to Hydrad and defends the idea of leaving Joseph alive to verify his claim. He gets pretty active then, as deadline is nearing.

Then he's not very active the rest of the game, but his posts always have content.

Meh. Neither of these look anything like what he's doing now. So I'm guessing Awaclus is trying something new, and I don't know why he'd do that (or this specific brand of new) as town.
I guess that Awaclus is more active as scum, so possibly this is a town tell.
PPE:1
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #529 on: June 23, 2015, 01:17:15 pm »

Since we're doing the would-not-lynch list thing, mine is woefully short:
When I read this, I got to thinking: he seems hyper aware of this, and in this game it looks to me (and this is where I need input from people who've actually played with him a bunch rather than skimmed some games) that he's been explaining and defending himself even less than usual.

I'm postulating that he's overcompensating for his known scumtell.

Thoughts?

I think it's pretty likely, actually. I can hammer if you'd like, I'm down for an Awaclus lynch.

Definitely do not hammer any time soon.  I think reaching a lynch before the weekend would be nice, but it's Tuesday.  We need reactions and positions from people so we have something to go on tomorrow.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #530 on: June 23, 2015, 01:18:37 pm »

Well, my scum read on Teproc has gone down. 
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #531 on: June 23, 2015, 01:20:42 pm »

Since we're doing the would-not-lynch list thing, mine is woefully short:
When I read this, I got to thinking: he seems hyper aware of this, and in this game it looks to me (and this is where I need input from people who've actually played with him a bunch rather than skimmed some games) that he's been explaining and defending himself even less than usual.

I'm postulating that he's overcompensating for his known scumtell.

Thoughts?

I think it's pretty likely, actually. I can hammer if you'd like, I'm down for an Awaclus lynch.

Definitely do not hammer any time soon.  I think reaching a lynch before the weekend would be nice, but it's Tuesday.  We need reactions and positions from people so we have something to go on tomorrow.

Yeah, this. It's not a bad case, but I have to think about it.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #532 on: June 23, 2015, 01:22:14 pm »

Since we're doing the would-not-lynch list thing, mine is woefully short:
When I read this, I got to thinking: he seems hyper aware of this, and in this game it looks to me (and this is where I need input from people who've actually played with him a bunch rather than skimmed some games) that he's been explaining and defending himself even less than usual.

I'm postulating that he's overcompensating for his known scumtell.

Thoughts?

I think it's pretty likely, actually. I can hammer if you'd like, I'm down for an Awaclus lynch.

Definitely do not hammer any time soon.  I think reaching a lynch before the weekend would be nice, but it's Tuesday.  We need reactions and positions from people so we have something to go on tomorrow.

We have lots. There's no rush either, but I'd be fine with us reaching a lynch today as well.

Besides, Awaclus is at L-2. This what the votes look like right now :

Awaclus (5) : Hydrad, WW, UoS, Joseph, Teproc
chairs (3) : Seprix, Awaclus, Joseph
Seprix (1) : chairs
Witherweaver (1): ADK
mail-mi (1) : pacovf
Teproc (1) : mail-mi
UoS (1) : skip

PPE : Right when I unvote you, isn't that nice. This is where I point that if people want to get a WW wagon going, I'd be glad to switch back. I think he and Awaclus have similar chances of flipping scum, but WW is a more productive lynch in terms of interactions.

@pacovf : Fine, but let's not get to deadline, that's never a good idea.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #533 on: June 23, 2015, 01:23:55 pm »

Wait, Joseph's listed twice there, so there are actually only 4 votes on Awaclus.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #534 on: June 23, 2015, 01:24:46 pm »

So I voted Awaclus for two basic reasons:

1) town!Awaclus gets very indignant when he has a wagon on him, and continually talks about how not scum he's been acting.  He hadn't really been involved this game (and as a result hasn't been as frustrating as usual), so I wanted to prompt him into reacting.  Cool that I can just start an unexplained wagon and people vote along.  That's a power I want to abuse.

2) Wanted to push the Teproc/Mail-Mi connection more, well or anyone/Mail-Mi.  I wanted to see how people would react to an alternative wagon to Mail-Mi in case he does turn up scum.

I kind of expected to be swayed away from Awaclus, but he has seemed to put in the minimum amount of effort possible and I'm wondering if he's just trying hard to act as he sees himself when he's town.

PPEs: A few.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #535 on: June 23, 2015, 01:31:42 pm »

We have lots. There's no rush either, but I'd be fine with us reaching a lynch today as well.
I'd be fine with reaching a lynch today, but I really want Hydrad and WW to chime in on what I'm saying about Awaclus first.  Those shouldn't be 0 accountability votes if he flips town.  ADK and Mail-mi commenting on Awaclus would be nice too.

Quote
This is where I point that if people want to get a WW wagon going, I'd be glad to switch back. I think he and Awaclus have similar chances of flipping scum, but WW is a more productive lynch in terms of interactions.

@pacovf : Fine, but let's not get to deadline, that's never a good idea.

Seconded and seconded.

But I think getting more comments on a Awaclus vote would make his lynch more informative.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #536 on: June 23, 2015, 01:59:00 pm »

1) town!Awaclus gets very indignant when he has a wagon on him, and continually talks about how not scum he's been acting.

This is true. Usually when I'm town, I have like 29384723984723 town tells that everyone is either not noticing or choosing to ignore on purpose, which is why I have to point them out. In this game, I haven't posted much because a lot of stuff has been going on IRL and other games, and that's why there aren't that many things that I can point out. The only notable thing is that I don't lurk as scum, but there's the problem that I don't usually lurk as town either.
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Vote Count
« Reply #537 on: June 23, 2015, 01:59:32 pm »

Vote Count 1.7

Awaclus (4): Hydrad, Witherweaver, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc
Seprix (1): chairs
Witherweaver (1): A Drowned Kernel
UmbrageOfSnow (1): skip wooznum
Teproc (1): mail-mi
mail-mi (1): pacovf
chairs (3): Seprix, Awaclus, Joseph2302

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Day 1 ends at Jun 28, 3 PM Forum Time.
« Last Edit: June 23, 2015, 02:14:04 pm by silverspawn »
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #538 on: June 23, 2015, 02:00:56 pm »

Can we just vote: awaclus and get rolling? I want to see what N1's NK will be already so we can work with it D2.
This doesn't seem very good or towny. Vote: chairs , because this is scummier than anything Awaclus has done /not done.
PPE: Lots

@silver : Joseph voted chairs in this post.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #539 on: June 23, 2015, 02:03:23 pm »

1) town!Awaclus gets very indignant when he has a wagon on him, and continually talks about how not scum he's been acting.

This is true. Usually when I'm town, I have like 29384723984723 town tells that everyone is either not noticing or choosing to ignore on purpose, which is why I have to point them out. In this game, I haven't posted much because a lot of stuff has been going on IRL and other games, and that's why there aren't that many things that I can point out. The only notable thing is that I don't lurk as scum, but there's the problem that I don't usually lurk as town either.

Didn't you point out earlier this game that you do lurk?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #540 on: June 23, 2015, 02:04:18 pm »

Hey Awalcus,

Let's say Joe and chairs come back to you and Seprix hammers (or whatever other scenario that leads to you being lynched you think is most probable).

What do you think of the wagon on you?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #541 on: June 23, 2015, 02:14:41 pm »

@silver : Joseph voted chairs in this post.

thanks, fixed.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #542 on: June 23, 2015, 02:19:54 pm »

Awaclus isn't a terrible lynch but he's not my favorite.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #543 on: June 23, 2015, 02:44:53 pm »

1) town!Awaclus gets very indignant when he has a wagon on him, and continually talks about how not scum he's been acting.

This is true. Usually when I'm town, I have like 29384723984723 town tells that everyone is either not noticing or choosing to ignore on purpose, which is why I have to point them out. In this game, I haven't posted much because a lot of stuff has been going on IRL and other games, and that's why there aren't that many things that I can point out. The only notable thing is that I don't lurk as scum, but there's the problem that I don't usually lurk as town either.

Didn't you point out earlier this game that you do lurk?

I do lurk in this game, and I used to lurk in RMMs because I didn't know what was going on, but I don't usually lurk.

Hey Awalcus,

Let's say Joe and chairs come back to you and Seprix hammers (or whatever other scenario that leads to you being lynched you think is most probable).

What do you think of the wagon on you?

I think it looks like people are there to pressure me to post more rather than because they actually want to lynch me, which is pro-town, but not hard to do as scum. Chairs was scummy but he's no longer on my wagon.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #544 on: June 23, 2015, 02:52:15 pm »

I think it looks like people are there to pressure me to post more rather than because they actually want to lynch me, which is pro-town, but not hard to do as scum. Chairs was scummy but he's no longer on my wagon.

Okay, so who's scum off-wagon?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #545 on: June 23, 2015, 02:55:23 pm »

I think it looks like people are there to pressure me to post more rather than because they actually want to lynch me, which is pro-town, but not hard to do as scum. Chairs was scummy but he's no longer on my wagon.

Okay, so who's scum off-wagon?

Chairs.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #546 on: June 23, 2015, 02:57:47 pm »

Awaclus isn't a terrible lynch but he's not my favorite.

You've played with Awaclus a lot, do you think he's been acting even more passive than usual, i.e. with his lack of response to this wagon yesterday?  Or is this normal for him.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #547 on: June 23, 2015, 03:04:21 pm »

He tends to be pretty passive regardless of alignment. Which is a bad way to play but unfortunately doesn't indicate much about his alignment here.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #548 on: June 23, 2015, 03:06:13 pm »

He tends to be pretty passive regardless of alignment. Which is a bad way to play but unfortunately doesn't indicate much about his alignment here.

So you think his play here is no more or less passive than his other games?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #549 on: June 23, 2015, 03:08:27 pm »

He tends to be pretty passive regardless of alignment. Which is a bad way to play but unfortunately doesn't indicate much about his alignment here.

I don't tend to be passive.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #550 on: June 23, 2015, 03:10:29 pm »

He tends to be pretty passive regardless of alignment. Which is a bad way to play but unfortunately doesn't indicate much about his alignment here.

I don't tend to be passive.

So it's only when you're trying to avoid your normal scumtells?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #551 on: June 23, 2015, 03:13:46 pm »

As (arguably) the leader of the Cutie Mark Crusaders, I think it's only fair to treat me as an IC.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #552 on: June 23, 2015, 03:14:13 pm »

Ugh, I thought the bold would make it more readable. It did not.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #553 on: June 23, 2015, 03:17:11 pm »

Chairs, talk to me about Awalcus.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #554 on: June 23, 2015, 03:21:54 pm »

He feels... reserved? I think reserved is the word I want. Mafia's more fun if you just cut loose and say what you want and don't think too hard about your posts. Less Rarity, more Pinkie Pie!

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #555 on: June 23, 2015, 03:27:56 pm »

Deliberately trying to be scummy is not pro-town.

If you are town, trying to be scummy allows scum to set up an easy mislynch, and it distracts players who would like to win from more productive scumhunting.

I'm not going to be buying "too scummy to be scum" this game, no matter how much setup it has.  Play like this sets scum up to have a much easier game.  It could be coming from scum, or bad town, but either way it hurts town.  Scum should not be allowed to get away with being this openly anti-town.  Town should care about trying to win the game.

I'm reducing the list of people I'm willing to lynch today to Chairs, Awalcus, and WW.  Any other lurker has the potential to actually help us, but I think we're legitimately better off without Awalcus or Chairs even if they are town if this is how they are going to play.

I would dayvig them both if I could.

PPE: More than normal?  And I'm sorry, but I don't fell like partying when there's work to be done.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #556 on: June 23, 2015, 03:32:16 pm »

I don't want to lynch Chairs today.  I wouldn't say I have a townread on him, but he's far more active than usual, and I want to see where it goes.  I'd reconsider him on later days.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #557 on: June 23, 2015, 03:32:22 pm »

If order of lynches didn't matter and we could just instantly kill everyone who refused to commit to a stance on anything, I am sure we would win.  But we'd also kill 2/3 of town.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #558 on: June 23, 2015, 03:40:03 pm »

He tends to be pretty passive regardless of alignment. Which is a bad way to play but unfortunately doesn't indicate much about his alignment here.

So you think his play here is no more or less passive than his other games?

He's maybe more passive here than usual. As I said, he's certainly not the worst lynch. I'm still holding out for WW a little, though.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #559 on: June 23, 2015, 03:42:39 pm »

Deliberately trying to be scummy is not pro-town.

If you are town, trying to be scummy allows scum to set up an easy mislynch, and it distracts players who would like to win from more productive scumhunting.

I'm not going to be buying "too scummy to be scum" this game, no matter how much setup it has.  Play like this sets scum up to have a much easier game.  It could be coming from scum, or bad town, but either way it hurts town.  Scum should not be allowed to get away with being this openly anti-town.  Town should care about trying to win the game.

I'm reducing the list of people I'm willing to lynch today to Chairs, Awalcus, and WW.  Any other lurker has the potential to actually help us, but I think we're legitimately better off without Awalcus or Chairs even if they are town if this is how they are going to play.

I would dayvig them both if I could.

PPE: More than normal?  And I'm sorry, but I don't fell like partying when there's work to be done.

More than normal. And if you're going to win, you've got to do this:


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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #560 on: June 23, 2015, 03:43:20 pm »

I don't tend to be passive.

So it's only when you're trying to avoid your normal scumtells?

No, I'm always super active as scum and it's always easy to tell that I'm scum.

Deliberately trying to be scummy is not pro-town.

If you are town, trying to be scummy allows scum to set up an easy mislynch, and it distracts players who would like to win from more productive scumhunting.

I'm not going to be buying "too scummy to be scum" this game, no matter how much setup it has.  Play like this sets scum up to have a much easier game.  It could be coming from scum, or bad town, but either way it hurts town.  Scum should not be allowed to get away with being this openly anti-town.  Town should care about trying to win the game.

I'm reducing the list of people I'm willing to lynch today to Chairs, Awalcus, and WW.  Any other lurker has the potential to actually help us, but I think we're legitimately better off without Awalcus or Chairs even if they are town if this is how they are going to play.

I would dayvig them both if I could.

I'm deliberately trying to be towny.

PPE: More than normal?  And I'm sorry, but I don't fell like partying when there's work to be done.

Less than normal if anything.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #561 on: June 23, 2015, 03:48:53 pm »

Less than normal if anything.

So you're being less passive than normal?

It seems like you're just disagreeing with what is said against you without bothering to either actually defend the point or even read it, since you're contradicting yourself needlessly.  This is what I mean by saying I think you are trying to be more uninvolved and less wordy and defensive than normal, over-correcting for your previous scumtells.

Why don't you explain why I should vote for chairs over you, even if it's obvious (I'm certainly open to it.)
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #562 on: June 23, 2015, 03:56:05 pm »

Ye unvote. I dig UoS's current play. It apparently takes real determination to get anything out of awaclus and he's showing no signs of giving up
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #563 on: June 23, 2015, 04:11:28 pm »

So you're being less passive than normal?

It seems like you're just disagreeing with what is said against you without bothering to either actually defend the point or even read it, since you're contradicting yourself needlessly.  This is what I mean by saying I think you are trying to be more uninvolved and less wordy and defensive than normal, over-correcting for your previous scumtells.

Why don't you explain why I should vote for chairs over you, even if it's obvious (I'm certainly open to it.)

No, less reserved. I'm not contradicting myself. I'm always trying to say what needs to be said as briefly as possible, regardless of what I'm writing (you can check my post history if you want to confirm this; the majority of them are oneliners). I'm being super defensive here and it is a town tell.

You should vote for anyone over me because I'm obviously town.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #564 on: June 23, 2015, 04:15:47 pm »

You've said chairs is scum multiple times.  Make your case.

As briefly as possible as one thing, but brief to the point of non-existence and you're going to eat rope.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #565 on: June 23, 2015, 04:22:37 pm »

@Mail-mi, Teproc is not happening today.  Read up and get your vote on someone relevant.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #566 on: June 23, 2015, 04:35:07 pm »

@Hydrad: I have to go soon and you seem to be on more when I'm gone, but when you come on tonight could you please talk about Awaclus?

1) Do you think he's being more or less defensive than normal?

2) Do you think he's being more or less lurky than normal?

3) Do you think he's being more or less reserved than normal?

4) What do you think of his response to pressure today?

5) Is your vote on him still a placeholder vote?

6) What do you think about Awaclus' interaction with Chairs?

7) If you agree with me that he's being more X than normal, what do you think of my idea that this is overcompensating for the scumtells he's been so happy to point out about himself in most of his games?

8) What do you think of his town tell?

9) What do you think of him pointing it out.

Sorry for the giant list of questions here, but I want to get your position nailed down before we lynch Awaclus, I want to lynch Awaclus, and I don't want to spend 3 days going back and forth on this stuff if we're not both on at once, which seems reasonably likely.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #567 on: June 23, 2015, 04:36:23 pm »

Sunglasses unintentional there, but it's cracking me up for some reason.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #568 on: June 23, 2015, 04:44:10 pm »

I find UmbrageOfSnow's avatar to be fitting.  I hope he's writing everything down.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #569 on: June 23, 2015, 04:48:25 pm »

I'm only on post 6 in my personal QT discussing my thoughts/feelings about this game. I'm probably not keeping track of enough things there.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #570 on: June 23, 2015, 04:49:23 pm »

Unrelated, the more tight-lipped Awaclus gets/feels, the more I want to lynch him. This feels a lot like how I reacted to suspicion in D1 of HP Mafia.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #571 on: June 23, 2015, 04:55:41 pm »

You've said chairs is scum multiple times.  Make your case.

The case is that he's scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #572 on: June 23, 2015, 04:56:25 pm »

I find UmbrageOfSnow's avatar to be fitting.  I hope he's writing everything down.

You would not believe the number of lists and scribbles I've made on napkins.  Or maybe you would.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #573 on: June 23, 2015, 05:02:56 pm »

You've said chairs is scum multiple times.  Make your case.

The case is that he's scum.

Okay I think this bears repeating one more time and then I'm shutting up about it.

If you are town, you are giving scum a free mislynch.  That is bad for town.  After you flip, you are giving town nothing to look at to get your scumreads lynched tomorrow (and I promise I look at dead players' words).  This is bad for town assuming you have any reads at all.  Stop doing  things to help the other team win.

It's also good for you if you're scum because you don't say much that could allow us to draw many associations with your partners now that you suspect you're getting lynched.

So I don't think you're really so committed to helping the other team win. I think you are scum, and this is you doubling down on your strategy to not get lynched.  I don't even really think that's best play from scum, but I think it makes sense from a scum mindset.  You don't think I'm budging, so you're going for an appeal to audacity hoping the rest of town won't lynch you if you're just. that. unbelievably. stubborn.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #574 on: June 23, 2015, 05:05:49 pm »

Again, am I going to lynch or not? It's looking worse and worse for Awaclus.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #575 on: June 23, 2015, 05:07:04 pm »

Again, am I going to lynch or not? It's looking worse and worse for Awaclus.

He only has 4/7 votes on him, you may as well put him at L-2.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #576 on: June 23, 2015, 05:07:51 pm »

make that 5/7.

vote: awaclus.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #577 on: June 23, 2015, 05:10:39 pm »

L-1 is fun, but let's not hammer him until we get a response from Hydrad.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #578 on: June 23, 2015, 05:14:15 pm »

So Seprix go ahead and vote, and I think 100% we ought to be lynching Awaclus, he appears to have given up.  But Hydrad should have to own his vote.  No "Oh, I meant to move it and you guys lynched him too fast for me" on Day 2.

And for the record I'm all for lynching Awaclus through any PR claim that isn't Mason or Universal Backup.  In the case of either of those we should look for counterclaims, but otherwise it just risks outing a PR and the Universal Backup can inherit a town!Awaclus PR anyway (unlikely as I think that to be.)

That, and counterclaiming other PRs is pointless in this setup unless we mass claim, which is terrible right now.
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Vote Count
« Reply #579 on: June 23, 2015, 05:14:33 pm »

Vote Count 1.8

Awaclus (5): Hydrad, Witherweaver, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc, chairs
Witherweaver (1): A Drowned Kernel
Teproc (1): mail-mi
mail-mi (1): pacovf
chairs (3): Seprix, Awaclus, Joseph2302

Not Voting (1): skip wooznum

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Day 1 ends at Jun 28, 3 PM Forum Time.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #580 on: June 23, 2015, 05:15:48 pm »

Again, I haven't had the time to reread Awaclus, but while UoS is really persuasive, the case against Awaclus is still just that he is lurking. Lurker lynches are bad in D1, because if he flips town, we have next to nothing. I would totally be for an Awaclus lynch for D2 (assuming nothing better comes up from the flips), because he has earned it many times over, but I don't think I want to lynch him today.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #581 on: June 23, 2015, 05:17:35 pm »

Again, I haven't had the time to reread Awaclus, but while UoS is really persuasive, the case against Awaclus is still just that he is lurking. Lurker lynches are bad in D1, because if he flips town, we have next to nothing. I would totally be for an Awaclus lynch for D2 (assuming nothing better comes up from the flips), because he has earned it many times over, but I don't think I want to lynch him today.

Feel free to take those 30 seconds now.

Actually, I think Awaclus is trying hard to be stubborn and unhelpful because that's his town meta.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #582 on: June 23, 2015, 05:19:10 pm »

Again, I haven't had the time to reread Awaclus, but while UoS is really persuasive, the case against Awaclus is still just that he is lurking. Lurker lynches are bad in D1, because if he flips town, we have next to nothing. I would totally be for an Awaclus lynch for D2 (assuming nothing better comes up from the flips), because he has earned it many times over, but I don't think I want to lynch him today.

My case is not about lurking!

It's about meta!

And we have more interactions with Awaclus than we do with Mail-mi, which is where your vote is parked right now.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #583 on: June 23, 2015, 05:19:25 pm »

 
Again, I haven't had the time to reread Awaclus, but while UoS is really persuasive, the case against Awaclus is still just that he is lurking. Lurker lynches are bad in D1, because if he flips town, we have next to nothing. I would totally be for an Awaclus lynch for D2 (assuming nothing better comes up from the flips), because he has earned it many times over, but I don't think I want to lynch him today.

I don't quite buy that this argument is any less applicable on Day 2.  Can just cycle 1->2->3 here and it remains the same.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #584 on: June 23, 2015, 05:20:22 pm »

Again, I haven't had the time to reread Awaclus, but while UoS is really persuasive, the case against Awaclus is still just that he is lurking. Lurker lynches are bad in D1, because if he flips town, we have next to nothing. I would totally be for an Awaclus lynch for D2 (assuming nothing better comes up from the flips), because he has earned it many times over, but I don't think I want to lynch him today.

My case is not about lurking!

It's about meta!

And we have more interactions with Awaclus than we do with Mail-mi, which is where your vote is parked right now.

Also, Mail-Mi is lurking as well.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #585 on: June 23, 2015, 05:21:32 pm »

Again, I haven't had the time to reread Awaclus, but while UoS is really persuasive, the case against Awaclus is still just that he is lurking. Lurker lynches are bad in D1, because if he flips town, we have next to nothing. I would totally be for an Awaclus lynch for D2 (assuming nothing better comes up from the flips), because he has earned it many times over, but I don't think I want to lynch him today.

Your vote sitting on mail-mi is somewhat undercutting your point here.

Also Awaclus is not just lurking, he's deliberately playing anti-town (see his consistent refusal to say anything of substance about anything). If he's town, I have no idea what he's doing.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #586 on: June 23, 2015, 05:22:29 pm »

You've said chairs is scum multiple times.  Make your case.

The case is that he's scum.

Okay I think this bears repeating one more time and then I'm shutting up about it.

If you are town, you are giving scum a free mislynch.  That is bad for town.  After you flip, you are giving town nothing to look at to get your scumreads lynched tomorrow (and I promise I look at dead players' words).  This is bad for town assuming you have any reads at all.  Stop doing  things to help the other team win.

It's also good for you if you're scum because you don't say much that could allow us to draw many associations with your partners now that you suspect you're getting lynched.

So I don't think you're really so committed to helping the other team win. I think you are scum, and this is you doubling down on your strategy to not get lynched.  I don't even really think that's best play from scum, but I think it makes sense from a scum mindset.  You don't think I'm budging, so you're going for an appeal to audacity hoping the rest of town won't lynch you if you're just. that. unbelievably. stubborn.

And if I made the case, you'd lynch me because that's a scum tell.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #587 on: June 23, 2015, 05:23:05 pm »

I'm also not giving scum a free mislynch because we're not lynching me today.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #588 on: June 23, 2015, 05:23:43 pm »

And if I made the case, you'd lynch me because that's a scum tell.

 ???
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #589 on: June 23, 2015, 05:23:58 pm »

Also Awaclus is not just lurking, he's deliberately playing anti-town (see his consistent refusal to say anything of substance about anything).

No, that's deliberately playing anti-scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #590 on: June 23, 2015, 05:24:44 pm »

And if I made the case, you'd lynch me because that's a scum tell.

 ???

You've been reading my past games, you should know that I have never ever made a single case on anyone as town, but I do feel enormous pressure to justify my votes as scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #591 on: June 23, 2015, 05:26:28 pm »

And if I made the case, you'd lynch me because that's a scum tell.

 ???

You've been reading my past games, you should know that I have never ever made a single case on anyone as town, but I do feel enormous pressure to justify my votes as scum.

So... that means you'll never, ever make a case as town ? Enjoy the mislynches man.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #592 on: June 23, 2015, 05:26:54 pm »

Actually, I think Awaclus is trying hard to be stubborn and unhelpful because that's his town meta.

It's true that trying hard to be stubborn and unhelpful is my town meta. Thanks for bringing that up for me.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #593 on: June 23, 2015, 05:27:17 pm »

Wow yeah I could definitely lynch awaclus today. Scum read is skyrocketing.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #594 on: June 23, 2015, 05:28:16 pm »

I'm also not giving scum a free mislynch because we're not lynching me today.

If you're going to claim, go ahead. I mean you're free to wait L-1 and intent to hammer, but at this point it's a formality.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #595 on: June 23, 2015, 05:28:49 pm »

So... that means you'll never, ever make a case as town ? Enjoy the mislynches man.

Some day I'll probably make a case if I have a guilty investigative result on someone.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #596 on: June 23, 2015, 05:28:57 pm »

I'm also not giving scum a free mislynch because we're not lynching me today.

If you're going to claim, go ahead. I mean you're free to wait L-1 and intent to hammer, but at this point it's a formality.

VT.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #597 on: June 23, 2015, 05:30:20 pm »

Wow yeah I could definitely lynch awaclus today. Scum read is skyrocketing.

Why did the scum read skyrocket as soon as I started actually being towny?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #598 on: June 23, 2015, 05:30:52 pm »

Why am I surprised that this makes no sense ? I should expect that by now.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #599 on: June 23, 2015, 05:31:35 pm »

Well, I'm ending this facade. :/

vote: Awaclus
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #600 on: June 23, 2015, 05:31:38 pm »

Wow yeah I could definitely lynch awaclus today. Scum read is skyrocketing.

Why did the scum read skyrocket as soon as I started actually being towny?

At some point you're going to not act the way you insist that you do act as scum.  I'm not convinced that point isn't now.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #601 on: June 23, 2015, 05:32:02 pm »

Why am I surprised that this makes no sense ? I should expect that by now.

You mean lynching me makes no sense? I agree!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #602 on: June 23, 2015, 05:32:13 pm »

Yeah, intent to hammer. We're still pretty early so I'll give people a chance to jump in and give last thoughts but anyone who states intent to play anti-town should be lynched as a matter of course. And awaclus is way too self-aware here for my liking.

PPE:

Wow yeah I could definitely lynch awaclus today. Scum read is skyrocketing.

Why did the scum read skyrocket as soon as I started actually being towny?

Because you "being towny" is just you declaring yourself to be towny, not actually attempting to play the game.

PPE 2: Beat me to the punch. Also shouldn't that be "charade"?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #603 on: June 23, 2015, 05:32:34 pm »

And if I made the case, you'd lynch me because that's a scum tell.

 ???

You've been reading my past games, you should know that I have never ever made a single case on anyone as town, but I do feel enormous pressure to justify my votes as scum.

Let's say you're right and we're going to lynch you no matter what.  If you made the case, maybe we'd listen to it tomorrow.  And maybe in your next scum game you'd be able to get away with making a case on someone since you've changed your meta.

But it seems your priority here is on what won't get you lynched, in the magical land where Pacovf is able to get us to lynch Mail-mi instead.  Your priority, if you are town, should be on getting us to see what you see so that we lynch scum!chairs tomorrow.

PPE: 6
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #604 on: June 23, 2015, 05:32:58 pm »

I mean I think we're done here. The only thing he's ever talked about in this game is himself and I refuse to believe that any town player would manage to do that.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #605 on: June 23, 2015, 05:33:25 pm »

what the hell is going on people

PPE 20
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #606 on: June 23, 2015, 05:33:45 pm »

Also, Chairs hasn't really been scummy.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #607 on: June 23, 2015, 05:35:07 pm »

Didn't Hydrad start this whole thing by throwing his vote on Awaclus as a placeholder?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #608 on: June 23, 2015, 05:35:37 pm »

Didn't Hydrad start this whole thing by throwing his vote on Awaclus as a placeholder?

Actually I wasn't aware  Awaclus had any votes for him when I voted.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #609 on: June 23, 2015, 05:35:59 pm »

I find Seprix's actions here a little questionable.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #610 on: June 23, 2015, 05:36:29 pm »

I mean I think we're done here. The only thing he's ever talked about in this game is himself and I refuse to believe that any town player would manage to do that.

I haven't had time to talk about anything else with this wagon on me.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #611 on: June 23, 2015, 05:36:59 pm »

I'm also not giving scum a free mislynch because we're not lynching me today.

If you're going to claim, go ahead. I mean you're free to wait L-1 and intent to hammer, but at this point it's a formality.

VT.

Well, that surprises me.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #612 on: June 23, 2015, 05:37:05 pm »

I guess we can wait for Hydrad.

@WW : In what way ?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #613 on: June 23, 2015, 05:37:20 pm »

I find Seprix's actions here a little questionable.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who seems a possible scum!Seprix.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #614 on: June 23, 2015, 05:38:11 pm »

Didn't Hydrad start this whole thing by throwing his vote on Awaclus as a placeholder?

Yes, and that's why I threw that giant list of questions at him.

But he has chimed in since his placeholder vote:
Oi I'm still here. Sorry I've been posting so little.

I'm find it interesting that my placeholder vote on awaclus has suddenly become a wagon. Thats weird to me. Like I guess I'm still fine with an awaclus lynch but I'm not really sure why others are fine with it suddenly.

this whole game just feels weird though.

pacovf and UoG have day 1 passes in my book though.

So he had a chance to move it.  I don't know, I kind of wanted to get a bit more out of Hydrad, but at this point with Awaclus' responses I just can't see lynching anyone else, so if Hydrad is scum (and I don't particularly have a scumread on him or anything) he wouldn't think at this point that he has much hope of changing the outcome by posting other than what he would most purely say as town, so I'm not sure there's much to be gained waiting for him anymore.

What do you guys think?

PPE: 6
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #615 on: June 23, 2015, 05:39:08 pm »

Fixed that for you.
I haven't had time to talk about anything else with this wagon on me.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #616 on: June 23, 2015, 05:39:36 pm »

I guess we can wait for Hydrad.

@WW : In what way ?

The way he voted for Awaclus (making a point to point out how moved he was to do so), though that's a little normal for Seprix.

Then the .. apprehension? about the lynch with the "didn't this whole thing get started..." comment.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #617 on: June 23, 2015, 05:40:29 pm »

I find Seprix's actions here a little questionable.

Cool. :) I guess an Awaclus/WW scumteam isn't unreasonable.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #618 on: June 23, 2015, 05:41:31 pm »

I guess we can wait for Hydrad.

@WW : In what way ?

The way he voted for Awaclus (making a point to point out how moved he was to do so), though that's a little normal for Seprix.

Then the .. apprehension? about the lynch with the "didn't this whole thing get started..." comment.

Oooooh. I wasn't apprehensive. I was doing a quick mental read on Hydrad.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #619 on: June 23, 2015, 05:41:39 pm »

I'm fine either way.

@WW : I only saw the vote, I see what you mean. This depends on Awaclus' flip I suppose, we'll see.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #620 on: June 23, 2015, 05:42:08 pm »

Yeah I'm surprised by the VT claim too, and Seprix's play around this is a bit weird, as is Pacovf's and ADK's.

We need to see the flip before reading too much into this obviously, but see, we did get a lot of interactions out of this wagon.

My scumread on WW has faded through this recent stuff by the way.  Maybe that's premature, but wanted to say it before we go to night.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #621 on: June 23, 2015, 05:42:29 pm »

I find Seprix's actions here a little questionable.

Cool. :) I guess an Awaclus/WW scumteam isn't unreasonable.

It's unreasonable because I'm town.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #622 on: June 23, 2015, 05:43:40 pm »

I find Seprix's actions here a little questionable.

Cool. :) I guess an Awaclus/WW scumteam isn't unreasonable.

If Awaclus flips scum I'm putting on my IC flag and strutting it around like Freddy Mercury performing live.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #623 on: June 23, 2015, 05:45:07 pm »

Yeah I'm surprised by the VT claim too, and Seprix's play around this is a bit weird, as is Pacovf's and ADK's.

Yeah, but well, I am at work.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #624 on: June 23, 2015, 05:45:20 pm »

I do agree with WW that Seprix is pretty scummy here, though. I could lynch him if nobody else wants to lynch chairs.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #625 on: June 23, 2015, 05:46:15 pm »

I find Seprix's actions here a little questionable.

Cool. :) I guess an Awaclus/WW scumteam isn't unreasonable.

If Awaclus flips scum I'm putting on my IC flag and strutting it around like Freddy Mercury performing live.

When I flip town, are you going to put on your confirmed scum flag and strut it around the same way, too?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #626 on: June 23, 2015, 05:47:55 pm »

I don't think scum!Awaclus means town!WW. I do think town!Awaclus heavily implies scum!WW.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #627 on: June 23, 2015, 05:48:37 pm »

I do agree with WW that Seprix is pretty scummy here, though. I could lynch him if nobody else wants to lynch chairs.

You're going to have to say more about Chairs.    Bussing for your partner's towncred because you know you're getting lynched is not going to cut it.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #628 on: June 23, 2015, 05:49:05 pm »

I don't think scum!Awaclus means town!WW. I do think town!Awaclus heavily implies scum!WW.

Hi I'm Chairs and I like to get things backwards.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #629 on: June 23, 2015, 05:49:33 pm »

I don't think scum!Awaclus means town!WW. I do think town!Awaclus heavily implies scum!WW.

Huh, I would probably say the reverse, at face value.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #630 on: June 23, 2015, 05:50:03 pm »

I find Seprix's actions here a little questionable.

Cool. :) I guess an Awaclus/WW scumteam isn't unreasonable.

If Awaclus flips scum I'm putting on my IC flag and strutting it around like Freddy Mercury performing live.

When I flip town, are you going to put on your confirmed scum flag and strut it around the same way, too?

Nah I'm going to analyze your wagon.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #631 on: June 23, 2015, 05:50:22 pm »

Why are we doing Awaclus? Also, he's fakeclaimed VT as a PR before, so it's an option to consider.

PPE:4 (I think, on phone so counting is harder)
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #632 on: June 23, 2015, 05:51:23 pm »

Why are we doing Awaclus? Also, he's fakeclaimed VT as a PR before, so it's an option to consider.

PPE:4 (I think, on phone so counting is harder)

Really ? Are we at the point that we don't lynch town because they might be lying ? Think about that for a second.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #633 on: June 23, 2015, 05:51:49 pm »

Why are we doing Awaclus? Also, he's fakeclaimed VT as a PR before, so it's an option to consider.

PPE:4 (I think, on phone so counting is harder)

Read through my exchanges with him today and tell me how we can justify not lynching him.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #634 on: June 23, 2015, 05:52:00 pm »

I don't think scum!Awaclus means town!WW. I do think town!Awaclus heavily implies scum!WW.

Hi I'm Chairs and I like to get things backwards.

Of course he does, he's scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #635 on: June 23, 2015, 05:52:31 pm »

I don't think scum!Awaclus means town!WW. I do think town!Awaclus heavily implies scum!WW.

Hi I'm Chairs and I like to get things backwards.

Of course he does, he's scum.

LEt's entertain you for a second. Your perceived scumteam is what ? Chairs/WW and ?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #636 on: June 23, 2015, 05:53:54 pm »

Why are we doing Awaclus? Also, he's fakeclaimed VT as a PR before, so it's an option to consider.

PPE:4 (I think, on phone so counting is harder)

Read through my exchanges with him today and tell me how we can justify not lynching him.

I think it's a lot harder to justify lynching me.

I don't think scum!Awaclus means town!WW. I do think town!Awaclus heavily implies scum!WW.

Hi I'm Chairs and I like to get things backwards.

Of course he does, he's scum.

LEt's entertain you for a second. Your perceived scumteam is what ? Chairs/WW and ?

Not necessarily WW, although it could be him. Probably more like chairs/Seprix and then someone.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #637 on: June 23, 2015, 05:54:16 pm »

And, you know, what are your reads in general ? On the off chance that you're Morgrim!Awaclus, give us that at least.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #638 on: June 23, 2015, 05:57:46 pm »

I don't think scum!Awaclus means town!WW. I do think town!Awaclus heavily implies scum!WW.

This is kind of interesting.  I'm wondering if Chairs is trying to goad me into getting off the Awaclus wagon to push a scum!me argument.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #639 on: June 23, 2015, 05:58:59 pm »

This is absurd. @Awaclus, you dont want to tell us why you think chairs is scum. Can you tell us why you don't want to tell us why you think chairs is scum?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #640 on: June 23, 2015, 06:04:04 pm »

I don't think scum!Awaclus means town!WW. I do think town!Awaclus heavily implies scum!WW.

This is kind of interesting.  I'm wondering if Chairs is trying to goad me into getting off the Awaclus wagon to push a scum!me argument.

I mean, realtalk, goading people is what I've been trying to do throughout D1. I think we've got a lot of really good stuff to comb through for D2 because of it, even if it means I end up getting mislynched.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #641 on: June 23, 2015, 06:06:12 pm »

And, you know, what are your reads in general ? On the off chance that you're Morgrim!Awaclus, give us that at least.

Awaclus - obvtown
Teproc - towny
Hydrad - null
Joseph - Innocent Child
Witherweaver - slightly suspicious
skip wooznum - null
A Drowned Kernel - slightly suspicious
Seprix - scummy
mail-mi - null
UmbrageOfSnow - towny
chairs - scummy
pacovf - towny

This is absurd. @Awaclus, you dont want to tell us why you think chairs is scum. Can you tell us why you don't want to tell us why you think chairs is scum?

Well, besides getting lynched for the scum tell, there's also the reason that I think people's reactions when they're being voted without an explanation outside of RVS can be extremely valuable. It's not working now because nobody's taking it my vote seriously so chairs isn't probably feeling a lot of pressure from it, but it has worked in the past. Also, later in the game, it can be beneficial for making NKs more difficult for scum — they don't know what's the reason why I'm voting for them or how convinced I actually am, and sometimes that information could be very important.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #642 on: June 23, 2015, 06:08:32 pm »

And, you know, what are your reads in general ? On the off chance that you're Morgrim!Awaclus, give us that at least.

Awaclus - obvtown
Teproc - towny
Hydrad - null
Joseph - Innocent Child
Witherweaver - slightly suspicious
skip wooznum - null
A Drowned Kernel - slightly suspicious
Seprix - scummy
mail-mi - null
UmbrageOfSnow - towny
chairs - scummy
pacovf - towny

This is absurd. @Awaclus, you dont want to tell us why you think chairs is scum. Can you tell us why you don't want to tell us why you think chairs is scum?

Well, besides getting lynched for the scum tell, there's also the reason that I think people's reactions when they're being voted without an explanation outside of RVS can be extremely valuable. It's not working now because nobody's taking it my vote seriously so chairs isn't probably feeling a lot of pressure from it, but it has worked in the past. Also, later in the game, it can be beneficial for making NKs more difficult for scum — they don't know what's the reason why I'm voting for them or how convinced I actually am, and sometimes that information could be very important.
are there any reasons that don't assume your survival through day 1?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #643 on: June 23, 2015, 06:09:19 pm »

Unexplained votes have value, yeah, but you have to explain them eventually, otherwise there's 0 accountability for votes, which is great for scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #644 on: June 23, 2015, 06:11:11 pm »

are there any reasons that don't assume your survival through day 1?

Can't think of any.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #645 on: June 23, 2015, 06:20:02 pm »

are there any reasons that don't assume your survival through day 1?

Can't think of any.
and at this point in the proceedings, after claiming vt, you don't think you're going to get lynched? (Side point: why did you say before that you were confident you weren't getting lynched today? I took that as softclaiming a PR. sorry I can't find the wuote right now)
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #646 on: June 23, 2015, 06:20:11 pm »

Vote Count 1.9

Awaclus (6): Hydrad, Witherweaver, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc, chairs, Seprix {L-1}
Witherweaver (1): A Drowned Kernel
Teproc (1): mail-mi
mail-mi (1): pacovf
chairs (2): Awaclus, Joseph2302

Not Voting (1): skip wooznum

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Day 1 ends at Jun 28, 3 PM Forum Time.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #647 on: June 23, 2015, 06:20:46 pm »

I'm also not giving scum a free mislynch because we're not lynching me today.
here it is
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #648 on: June 23, 2015, 06:30:58 pm »

wow what theres been like 3 pages since last night?

I'll be reading them for a bit.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #649 on: June 23, 2015, 06:31:11 pm »

(Side point: why did you say before that you were confident you weren't getting lynched today?

Because I'm super towny.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #650 on: June 23, 2015, 06:34:36 pm »

(Side point: why did you say before that you were confident you weren't getting lynched today?

Because I'm super towny.
way to answer the sidepoint. You still think you wont get lynched?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #651 on: June 23, 2015, 06:37:43 pm »

Why are we doing Awaclus? Also, he's fakeclaimed VT as a PR before, so it's an option to consider.

PPE:4 (I think, on phone so counting is harder)

Read through my exchanges with him today and tell me how we can justify not lynching him.
I will do that tomorrow, only got phone access at the moment,  which makes posting and rereading harder. 12-24 hours till I get to a proper computer.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #652 on: June 23, 2015, 06:38:19 pm »

(Side point: why did you say before that you were confident you weren't getting lynched today?

Because I'm super towny.
way to answer the sidepoint. You still think you wont get lynched?

He has to say these things, regardless of his position. His hope is to instill doubt into you.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #653 on: June 23, 2015, 06:45:06 pm »

(Side point: why did you say before that you were confident you weren't getting lynched today?

Because I'm super towny.
way to answer the sidepoint. You still think you wont get lynched?

I shouldn't be getting lynched.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #654 on: June 23, 2015, 06:45:21 pm »

@Hydrad: I have to go soon and you seem to be on more when I'm gone, but when you come on tonight could you please talk about Awaclus?

1) Do you think he's being more or less defensive than normal?

2) Do you think he's being more or less lurky than normal?

3) Do you think he's being more or less reserved than normal?

4) What do you think of his response to pressure today?

5) Is your vote on him still a placeholder vote?

6) What do you think about Awaclus' interaction with Chairs?

7) If you agree with me that he's being more X than normal, what do you think of my idea that this is overcompensating for the scumtells he's been so happy to point out about himself in most of his games?

8) What do you think of his town tell?

9) What do you think of him pointing it out.

Sorry for the giant list of questions here, but I want to get your position nailed down before we lynch Awaclus, I want to lynch Awaclus, and I don't want to spend 3 days going back and forth on this stuff if we're not both on at once, which seems reasonably likely.

oh boy questions! still reading but thought i should answer while I see this.

1) less defensive

2) more lurky

3)more reserved

4)Probably is more of a towny way for him to respond to the pressure but at the same time he seems to be aware of his meta so he could just be emulating it.

5)no its now kinda a serious vote

6)feels strange that he says hes scummy but giving no points to it at all really

7)I kinda agree with that point and thats why my vote is still on him currently.

8)wait which one was his town tell exactly?

9) same as above. not 100% sure what town tell your talking about.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #655 on: June 23, 2015, 06:45:51 pm »

Oh I thought Seprix's vote was the hammer for some reason. I'm fine with vote: awaclus, people have said what they need to.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #656 on: June 23, 2015, 06:47:49 pm »

@awaclus, now can you tell us about chairs?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #657 on: June 23, 2015, 06:49:35 pm »

@awaclus, now can you tell us about chairs?

Yeah. They are things you can sit on.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #658 on: June 23, 2015, 06:50:16 pm »

Thread locked!

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #659 on: June 23, 2015, 06:52:51 pm »

Final Vote Count Day 1

Awaclus (7): Hydrad, Witherweaver, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc, chairs, Seprix, A Drowned Kernel
Teproc (1): mail-mi
mail-mi (1): pacovf
chairs (2): Awaclus, Joseph2302

Not Voting (1): skip wooznum

With 12 alive, it took 7 to lynch.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #660 on: June 23, 2015, 06:58:25 pm »

Awaclus has been lynched. He was Twilight Sparkle, the Mafia Roleblocker playing as Gilda.

Night 1 starts now and will last until June 25, 7 PM Forum time. All Night Actions may be submitted and changed until 1 hour before Day 2 begins. Remember to confirm even if you don't have a power. Please use your QT for both purposes.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2015, 12:38:38 pm by silverspawn »
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 1)
« Reply #661 on: June 25, 2015, 06:01:14 pm »

the fabric of the world began to crumble
when a huge chunk of history
went lost into nothingness
for a moment, it seemed like it would break in two
until at last, it stabilized
there was no escaping the endless wheel of time
what was lost
would have to be rewritten.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 1)
« Reply #662 on: June 25, 2015, 06:59:24 pm »

"So... what now?"

Twilight shrugged. "As far as I understood it, the idea of the game is that any discussion had spawns more discussion, so as soon as it has started, it'll keep itself going."

"Right," Liara said, "But how do we get it going?"

"Well... the book said something about voting for random players in the beginning - if no discussion arises naturally."

"Most fabulous. Like so? Ahem. Vote for Twilight Sparkle." RIIIIIIIIIING! A radiant stroke of energy appeared above Twilight's head, forming a Romareian 'I'. "Lovely. What do you think, dear?"

"Quite..." Twilight nervously eyed the purple script above her. "Except you shouldn't vote for me-"

"Vote for Twilight," said a calm voice from across the room. RIIIIIIIIIING! Cold gave Twilight a short, apologetic smile.

"Okay, I think that's enough content for us to analyze, so you can-"

"Hah. Totally vote for Twilight." RIIIIIIIIIING! At this point, Rainbow may or may have protruded her tongue.

RIIIIIIIIIING! "Hey!" Twilight snapped. "Is that your way of thanking me for solving your magic problem?"

"Yeah, that is super-duper ungrateful, isn't it? Vote for Liara." RIIIIIIIIIING! "Oh, and Twilight, could you maaybe reduce the volume just a tiiiny-tiny-bitsy?"

"Sure." Visibly relieved, Twilight tilted her head, sending a short stream of purple energy into seemingly nowhere. "Thank you, Pinkie. Now - what does this tell us about-"

"Alignment?" Rainbow shrugged. "Nothing."

"I'm not so sure about that." Cold camly walked across the room, slowly drawing circles around Twilight. "Though I have never played this game before, I would suppose that the liars in our midst feel more pressure from votes than the rest of us, since they know they are guilty. What do you think, Twilight?"

"That's, uh..." Twilight stocked, sweat running down her face. "Uhhm..."

riiiiiiiiiing. That was Sweetie Belle, shortly followed by - riiiiiiiiiing. - Applebloom.

"Stop!" Twilight shrieked in panic. "That's only one vote away from a lynch! I just got scared, alright? I'm not chaos!"

Cold turned calmly around and leaned forward to Pinkie, whispering something into her ear. Pinkie nodded, and slowly approached Twilight, looming closer like a panther.

"Maaaaybe you  just got scared," she said, her face leaning forward dangerously close to Twilight's, who instinctively backed off to the wall behind her. "Or maaaybe you're one big lying MEANIE!"

"That's not fair!" Twilight protested. "Scum has to lie in this game! That doesn't make them mean."

In an instant, Pinkie Pie was back to her bouncy and giggly harmless self. "I know that, silly. I just did what Cold told me."

"And I'm pretty sure Harmony would rather say something like 'But I'm innocent!' in that situation," Cold concluded.

"Yap. Clear Chaos." Liara disappeared, only to rematerialize beside Cold momentarily. "Good work, sis."

"Now, we should not finalize the lynch quite yet. We're only a few minutes into the game and-"

"Vote for myself," Twilight said in a disheartened voice. riiiiiiiiiing. "You got me. Least I can do now is deny you the rest of the day."

"Sorry, Twilight." Flapping her wings, Fluttershy flew over next to her, drawing her into a warm hug. "I still like you, even if you're chaos," she whispered.

Blushing, Twilight half-heartedly returned the gesture. "Three minutes into ten days. Ugh..."

"So, who're your chaus-buddies, huh?"

Twilight gave Rainbow a sad smile. "Pinkie and Fluttershy," she replied flatly.

"What?" Rainbow's body jerked around like a rubber ball, facing Fluttershy. "Is that true?"

BONG.

"Day's over."

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 1)
« Reply #663 on: June 25, 2015, 07:04:18 pm »

Joseph has been killed in the night. He was Colgate playing as Lyra, the Innocent Child.

Hydrad who is Rartiy playing as Twilight, the Universal Backup, is now an Innocent Child.
« Last Edit: July 03, 2015, 06:51:47 pm by silverspawn »
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 1)
« Reply #664 on: June 25, 2015, 07:04:38 pm »

Day 2 starts!

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 1)
« Reply #665 on: June 25, 2015, 07:07:04 pm »

Vote: chairs
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 1)
« Reply #666 on: June 25, 2015, 07:07:35 pm »

Hydrad, congrats! :) reads should be even easier now!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 1)
« Reply #667 on: June 25, 2015, 07:11:40 pm »

Vote: chairs

That's an interesting out-the-gate vote.  Mind explaining why you think I'm scum?

I would've rather have seen them shoot not-the-IC, but I can understand the logic. You nix the UB getting any other Town powers, and you're eliminating one person from the lynch pool no matter what, so why not?

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 1)
« Reply #668 on: June 25, 2015, 07:13:45 pm »

Vote: chairs

That's an interesting out-the-gate vote.  Mind explaining why you think I'm scum?

I would've rather have seen them shoot not-the-IC, but I can understand the logic. You nix the UB getting any other Town powers, and you're eliminating one person from the lynch pool no matter what, so why not?

I misremembered you as being off-wagon, so now I'm reconsidering. But I don't see why you felt the need to analyze the NK when they killed the IC.
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Re: Vote Count
« Reply #669 on: June 25, 2015, 07:14:00 pm »

Vote Count 2.0

chairs (1): A Drowned Kernel

Not Voting (9): skip wooznum, Hydrad, Witherweaver, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc, chairs,  mail-mi, pacovf, Seprix

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 2 ends at Jul 4, 7 PM Forum Time.

UmbrageOfSnow

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 1)
« Reply #670 on: June 25, 2015, 07:14:24 pm »

I'll actually be able to be on a bit late tonight for once (but not much more for a couple hours after this post.)

Anyway, I'm happy to immediately reduce the lynch pool to 6 today
skip wooznum
A Drowned Kernel
Seprix
mail-mi
chairs
pacovf

Pretty likely, IMO, that there are 2 scum out of 6 here, so a 1/3 chance.  But we can do better than random!

Vote: Pacovf

Let's talk about that not-lynching-lurkers-except-Mail-Mi thing.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #671 on: June 25, 2015, 07:16:32 pm »

For what it's worth I was sure they'd kill either me or Teproc.  But yeah, preventing our UB from getting any useful role is good, and it gets around my argument for lynching through a PR claim.

I'm still probably in favor of lynching through some PR claims though.  It's too hard to get around, and outing the PRs isn't so great.  But lets take that case-by-case when it comes up.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #672 on: June 25, 2015, 07:18:28 pm »

If there's scum on-wagon, ADK and Seprix look a lot worse that Chairs, IMO.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 1)
« Reply #673 on: June 25, 2015, 07:21:11 pm »

Vote: chairs

That's an interesting out-the-gate vote.  Mind explaining why you think I'm scum?

I would've rather have seen them shoot not-the-IC, but I can understand the logic. You nix the UB getting any other Town powers, and you're eliminating one person from the lynch pool no matter what, so why not?

I misremembered you as being off-wagon, so now I'm reconsidering. But I don't see why you felt the need to analyze the NK when they killed the IC.

I analyzed it specifically because I thought at first it was a poor choice for scum. Upon review, I realized it was the best move they could have possibly made, barring some sort of PR slip on D1.

@UoS: why do you think scum would have shot you or Teproc?

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #674 on: June 25, 2015, 07:22:44 pm »

Personally, barring a good argument, my lynch pool is down to 2 people:

skip wooznum or Joseph2302.

skip wooznum.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #675 on: June 25, 2015, 07:26:22 pm »

Also, Mail-mi posted on-site (only a couple times but still) while we were lynching Awaclus conveniently without stopping in here to offer any thoughts or reactions.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 1)
« Reply #676 on: June 25, 2015, 07:29:29 pm »

@UoS: why do you think scum would have shot you or Teproc?

Because he, WW, and I were driving the Awaclus lynch and Joe was mostly just sheeping.  No offense to Joseph but he seemed to be lightly going along with whatever theories were pushed.  It seemed to be like he was open to being manipulated by scum, and was semi-lurking.

People at the end of the day were also treating me and Teproc as basically universal town reads, and we might have PRs.

But as I think about it, the UB point is an even better one than I at first thought for that exact reason.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #677 on: June 25, 2015, 07:29:55 pm »

Oh, and my reasoning on not WW was that WW still had a lot of suspicion on him comparatively.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #678 on: June 25, 2015, 07:30:25 pm »

Personally, barring a good argument, my lynch pool is down to 2 people:

skip wooznum or Joseph2302.

skip wooznum.

You can't lynch a dead IC.

Who's the other one in your lynch pool?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #679 on: June 25, 2015, 07:33:46 pm »

Haven't finished re-read yet but im thinking adk/pacovf atm
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #680 on: June 25, 2015, 07:35:58 pm »

Also, I sort of forgot abput this
Is it just me or does this ww/teproc fight seem a tad scum vs. scum?

The only way to know for sure is to lynch one of them.
how do you know we'll know for sure after lynching only one of them?  Do you know neither is scum?
but I think that's a scumslip from adk
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #681 on: June 25, 2015, 07:39:33 pm »

woo I'm an IC now also! sweet. hmm now to find scum...
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #682 on: June 25, 2015, 07:40:53 pm »

Skip: Care to explain why that's a scumslip?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #683 on: June 25, 2015, 07:43:00 pm »

I'm comfortable removing Teproc and UoS from my lynch pool today. Probably WW as well.

Seprix I don't see as super scummy but I'll have to go back and read him.

chairs and skip and mail-mi are the scummiest. pacovf was also off-wagon, but I remember finding him towny yesterday for some reason, so I'll go re-examine that.

PPE: I also fail to see how that's supposed to be a scumslip.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #684 on: June 25, 2015, 07:44:54 pm »

Skip: Care to explain why that's a scumslip?
well, how does he know we'll find out after lynching one of them? Maybe we'll lynch one and he'll flip scum and we won't know whether or not it's scum v scum. Unless he knows they're both town. How would he know that?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #685 on: June 25, 2015, 07:48:13 pm »

Personally, barring a good argument, my lynch pool is down to 2 people:

skip wooznum or Joseph2302.

skip wooznum.

Okay, PPE everything from after this post, I'll read it after I advise that I am apparently really REALLY sold that Joseph is Mafia every game, I even made this mistake in my personal QT when musing on who I thought should be D2's lynch.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #686 on: June 25, 2015, 07:49:27 pm »

well, how does he know we'll find out after lynching one of them? Maybe we'll lynch one and he'll flip scum and we won't know whether or not it's scum v scum. Unless he knows they're both town. How would he know that?

Logic aside, why'd you say this
And im leaning town on adk.
as your followup to that at the time?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #687 on: June 25, 2015, 07:50:28 pm »

Well, my lynch pool is down to 1 for D2 since dead ICs can't melt steel beams.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #688 on: June 25, 2015, 07:50:38 pm »

well, how does he know we'll find out after lynching one of them? Maybe we'll lynch one and he'll flip scum and we won't know whether or not it's scum v scum. Unless he knows they're both town. How would he know that?

Logic aside, why'd you say this
And im leaning town on adk.
as your followup to that at the time?
like I said, I forgot almost immediately afterwards
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #689 on: June 25, 2015, 07:51:19 pm »

And that's two days later
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #690 on: June 25, 2015, 07:52:07 pm »

like I said, I forgot almost immediately afterwards
So what was causing you to lean town on ADK?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #691 on: June 25, 2015, 07:52:16 pm »

Sorry, one day. But still
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #692 on: June 25, 2015, 07:53:08 pm »

like I said, I forgot almost immediately afterwards
So what was causing you to lean town on ADK?
I think the fact that he found me scummy
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #693 on: June 25, 2015, 07:54:04 pm »

like I said, I forgot almost immediately afterwards
So what was causing you to lean town on ADK?
I think the fact that he found me scummy

That's because you are scummy m8m8m8.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #694 on: June 25, 2015, 07:54:26 pm »

Sorry, one day. But still

29 posts.  But still.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #695 on: June 25, 2015, 08:00:09 pm »

well, how does he know we'll find out after lynching one of them? Maybe we'll lynch one and he'll flip scum and we won't know whether or not it's scum v scum. Unless he knows they're both town. How would he know that?

Logic aside,
so, you agree?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #696 on: June 25, 2015, 08:06:11 pm »

well, how does he know we'll find out after lynching one of them? Maybe we'll lynch one and he'll flip scum and we won't know whether or not it's scum v scum. Unless he knows they're both town. How would he know that?

Logic aside,
so, you agree?

No, I think your logic makes 0 sense.  But I wanted to know your responses to other stuff more than I wanted to argue with you about your logic being bad.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #697 on: June 25, 2015, 08:08:12 pm »

well, how does he know we'll find out after lynching one of them? Maybe we'll lynch one and he'll flip scum and we won't know whether or not it's scum v scum. Unless he knows they're both town. How would he know that?

Logic aside,
so, you agree?

No, I think your logic makes 0 sense.  But I wanted to know your responses to other stuff more than I wanted to argue with you about your logic being bad.
well are we done with the other stuff?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #698 on: June 25, 2015, 08:11:07 pm »

well are we done with the other stuff?

I mean that's up to you.  I'm willing to vote for you now if that's what you mean.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #699 on: June 25, 2015, 08:11:57 pm »

Also, Mail-mi posted on-site (only a couple times but still) while we were lynching Awaclus conveniently without stopping in here to offer any thoughts or reactions.

I think this is unfair and should not be used against players. Mafia is not the only reason people might want to check this forum for, and following the developments of a game of Mafia takes longer than pretty much anything else in here. Just because someone has posted elsewhere at the same time is not proof that they also read the game and chose not to say anything.

That being said, the fact remains that he didn't say anything.

I will answer your accusation and post some thought either later tonight or tomorrow. I am in a rush right now.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #700 on: June 25, 2015, 08:14:43 pm »

well are we done with the other stuff?

I mean that's up to you.  I'm willing to vote for you now if that's what you mean.
that's not what I mean. Why would you vote for me?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #701 on: June 25, 2015, 08:21:31 pm »

Also, Mail-mi posted on-site (only a couple times but still) while we were lynching Awaclus conveniently without stopping in here to offer any thoughts or reactions.

I think this is unfair and should not be used against players. Mafia is not the only reason people might want to check this forum for, and following the developments of a game of Mafia takes longer than pretty much anything else in here. Just because someone has posted elsewhere at the same time is not proof that they also read the game and chose not to say anything.

That being said, the fact remains that he didn't say anything.

I will answer your accusation and post some thought either later tonight or tomorrow. I am in a rush right now.

Fair enough, and it was his other game he was posting in, so maybe he didn't have time to read this.

But I'm still willing to hold it against him, maybe I'm not fair, whatever.  Deliberate lurking doesn't seem that implausible to me.

Yeah I'm about to head out too.

PPE Skip: Yes, I know that isn't what you meant.  I'm being a bit of a jerk here deliberately.  I should knock that off.  I would vote for you because I found your reaction to me somewhat scummy.  You seemed more on edge than maybe you should have.  It could be town, but I find it a tad more likely to come from scum.  And I think your reasoning on ADK seems made up.  Not just poor reasoning, but artificial reasoning.  Reasoning that you didn't actually reason.

You'll note I'm not actually voting you over pacovf at the moment, I'm just threatening to.  Talk to us about pacovf.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #702 on: June 25, 2015, 08:54:55 pm »

Yeah I'm surprised by the VT claim too, and Seprix's play around this is a bit weird, as is Pacovf's and ADK's.

Yeah, but well, I am at work.
I did not find his play weird until after the flip. I assumed you already found it weirdbecause you thought awac was scum. I didnt. But neither did pacovf. I found it scummy that he acknowledged his weird play. And also, like you pointed out, he repeatedly said awaclus was a bad lynch while supporting a similar one. I still want to talk about the scumslip
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #703 on: June 25, 2015, 09:26:24 pm »

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #704 on: June 25, 2015, 09:27:12 pm »

Haven't read last couple pages.  Hydrad being an IC was great; he was a prime candidate for me today.

Just from memory, my primary lynch candidates are Chairs and Pacovf.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #705 on: June 25, 2015, 09:28:19 pm »

Oh, and my reasoning on not WW was that WW still had a lot of suspicion on him comparatively.

I was pretty sure I was going to get killed last night.  I had also forgotten we had an IC.  Better him than me, I say.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #706 on: June 25, 2015, 09:30:33 pm »

Personally, barring a good argument, my lynch pool is down to 2 people:

skip wooznum or Joseph2302.

skip wooznum.

Fabricating town slips? o_O
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #707 on: June 25, 2015, 09:32:31 pm »

Also, I sort of forgot abput this
Is it just me or does this ww/teproc fight seem a tad scum vs. scum?

The only way to know for sure is to lynch one of them.
how do you know we'll know for sure after lynching only one of them?  Do you know neither is scum?
but I think that's a scumslip from adk

?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #708 on: June 25, 2015, 09:33:04 pm »

I'm comfortable removing Teproc and UoS from my lynch pool today. Probably WW as well.

Seprix I don't see as super scummy but I'll have to go back and read him.

chairs and skip and mail-mi are the scummiest. pacovf was also off-wagon, but I remember finding him towny yesterday for some reason, so I'll go re-examine that.

PPE: I also fail to see how that's supposed to be a scumslip.

Probably? Were you not here for the IC flag thing?!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #709 on: June 25, 2015, 09:33:48 pm »

Personally, barring a good argument, my lynch pool is down to 2 people:

skip wooznum or Joseph2302.

skip wooznum.

Okay, PPE everything from after this post, I'll read it after I advise that I am apparently really REALLY sold that Joseph is Mafia every game, I even made this mistake in my personal QT when musing on who I thought should be D2's lynch.

Seems less fabricated.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #710 on: June 25, 2015, 09:44:57 pm »

I kind of feel entertained that you think I'd have been clever enough to gambit a fabricated townslip.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #711 on: June 25, 2015, 09:45:25 pm »

Also, the reason I knew Awaclus was scum by the end of D1? Because he acted JUST LIKE ME when I was caught scum D1 in HP mafia. I think I might have even been a roleblocker.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #712 on: June 25, 2015, 11:43:22 pm »

Since we're doing the would-not-lynch list thing, mine is woefully short:
When I read this, I got to thinking: he seems hyper aware of this, and in this game it looks to me (and this is where I need input from people who've actually played with him a bunch rather than skimmed some games) that he's been explaining and defending himself even less than usual.

I'm postulating that he's overcompensating for his known scumtell.

Thoughts?

I think it's pretty likely, actually. I can hammer if you'd like, I'm down for an Awaclus lynch.
leaning town on seprix
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 1)
« Reply #713 on: June 25, 2015, 11:59:27 pm »

Let's talk about that not-lynching-lurkers-except-Mail-Mi thing.

That is grossly misrepresenting my position. Lynching a lurker and a lurker-lynch is not the same thing. The first means that you have reasons to believe a given lurker is scum. The second means lynching a lurker because lurkers are harder to read. I never proposed to lynch mail-mi because he was lurking. But the original case on Awaclus was very, very close to that, so I was against it, because it gives scum a free lynch with no accountability.

The final real-day of D1, you formulated a case on Awaclus that was better than a lurker lynch. I recognized that it was good, but I asked for some time to mull it over (and back then you were of the same opinion than me). Then the activity level of the thread exploded, and it became clear that Awaclus was going to be lynched right there (after your post here, there was no other possible way the day would end).

I could not follow all that while at work, and that was bothering me. I wanted the time to read Awaclus's posts, to see if I agreed with your case. I wanted the time to check if Awaclus was soft-claiming a PR. I wanted the time to analyze the wagon on Awaclus, to see the reasons people were voting for him, and if we could hold them accountable. It greatly annoyed me that I couldn't get involved in the development of the game. So I argued against an Awaclus lynch, because it seemed like the only way to get the time to do all that. And well, that arguing was rushed, because I was at work.

Now I have to reread D1 (not now now though) to reevaluate my reads.

But I'm still willing to hold it against him, maybe I'm not fair, whatever.  Deliberate lurking doesn't seem that implausible to me.

There's a difference between the plausible deniability of "he didn't post anything at that time, maybe he was deliberately lurking!" and "I checked his activity on the forum, and I know that he deliberately chose to not post anything at that time!". The second is much more incriminating, but requires a specific reading of information not even available on the game thread. I am not ok with that.
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Seprix

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #714 on: June 26, 2015, 12:00:46 am »

Awaclus - obvtown
Teproc - towny
Hydrad - null
Joseph - Innocent Child
Witherweaver - slightly suspicious
skip wooznum - null
A Drowned Kernel - slightly suspicious
Seprix - scummy
mail-mi - null
UmbrageOfSnow - towny
chairs - scummy
pacovf - towny

Think we can learn anything from this list?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #715 on: June 26, 2015, 12:04:39 am »

No.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #716 on: June 26, 2015, 12:06:52 am »

Also, Mail-mi posted on-site (only a couple times but still) while we were lynching Awaclus conveniently without stopping in here to offer any thoughts or reactions.

Need to do more catching up, but need to respond to this. You guys put up like 8 pages when I was asleep, so I went and checked my other game, then had to leave before I could get through this one, then by the time I came back Awaclus was lynched.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #717 on: June 26, 2015, 12:11:27 am »

If I were Awaclus, at least one of my partners would be "null". He only has two people on that list at null.

Let's lynch skip.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #718 on: June 26, 2015, 12:14:35 am »

HOORAY Awaclus was scum!

I think we need to lynch off-wagon today.

Final Vote Count Day 1

Awaclus (7): Hydrad, Witherweaver, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc, chairs, Seprix, A Drowned Kernel
Teproc (1): mail-mi
mail-mi (1): pacovf
chairs (2): Awaclus, Joseph2302

Not Voting (1): skip wooznum

With 12 alive, it took 7 to lynch.

...which, well, really narrows it down to Pacovf and Skip. Skip was acting pretty scummy yesterday, and not having your vote on someone is bad news, like he wanted to find an argument for anyone else but couldn't, but didn't want to vote his scum partner. (Haven't reread end of Day 1 yet so don't know if this is what his posts felt like). vote: skip wooznum
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #719 on: June 26, 2015, 12:45:22 am »

Analyzing the wagon come D1 end, and given Seprix's Law of Mafia Average (One/Two scum tends to jump on wagon, The rest stay off wagon), I think I can come to this conclusion:

One scum is in this list: [Crossed players not scum]

Hydrad, Witherweaver, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc, chairs, Seprix, A Drowned Kernel

One scum is in the other list:

Mail-Mi, Pacovf, Skip Wooznum

Also to factor in is Awaclus voting for Chairs. Could Awaclus have voted for his scum buddy in a last ditch effort to throw everyone off after he died?

Wait, I found this gem over here.

1) town!Awaclus gets very indignant when he has a wagon on him, and continually talks about how not scum he's been acting.

This is true. Usually when I'm town, I have like 29384723984723 town tells that everyone is either not noticing or choosing to ignore on purpose, which is why I have to point them out. In this game, I haven't posted much because a lot of stuff has been going on IRL and other games, and that's why there aren't that many things that I can point out. The only notable thing is that I don't lurk as scum, but there's the problem that I don't usually lurk as town either.

This could easily be scum!WW defending Awaclus there. So if that's the case, we have WW/Awaclus/???. This is nice because I think everyone else bar maybe Chairs (and that's a maybe) is pretty much Town on the wagon.

We have mail-Mi, Pacovf and Skip. Skip seems townie, because he's quite overeager, which is typical for newer players. Pacovf has been strong town thus far.

Looks like a WW/Awaclus/Mail-Mi scum team so far.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #720 on: June 26, 2015, 12:50:50 am »

Oh, and my reasoning on not WW was that WW still had a lot of suspicion on him comparatively.

I was pretty sure I was going to get killed last night.  I had also forgotten we had an IC.  Better him than me, I say.

Not to mention WW not dying D1 is pretty odd, though I guess the safe lynch would be Joseph.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #721 on: June 26, 2015, 12:59:08 am »

That post from ww was acusing awac of not being defensive, not defending him. And ww not dying isnt strange at all
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #722 on: June 26, 2015, 01:05:11 am »

If I were Awaclus, at least one of my partners would be "null". He only has two people on that list at null.

Let's lynch skip.

Why not mail-mi?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #723 on: June 26, 2015, 01:08:17 am »

Also, Mail-mi posted on-site (only a couple times but still) while we were lynching Awaclus conveniently without stopping in here to offer any thoughts or reactions.

Need to do more catching up, but need to respond to this. You guys put up like 8 pages when I was asleep, so I went and checked my other game, then had to leave before I could get through this one, then by the time I came back Awaclus was lynched.

HOORAY Awaclus was scum!

I think we need to lynch off-wagon today.

Final Vote Count Day 1

Awaclus (7): Hydrad, Witherweaver, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc, chairs, Seprix, A Drowned Kernel
Teproc (1): mail-mi
mail-mi (1): pacovf
chairs (2): Awaclus, Joseph2302

Not Voting (1): skip wooznum

With 12 alive, it took 7 to lynch.

...which, well, really narrows it down to Pacovf and Skip. Skip was acting pretty scummy yesterday, and not having your vote on someone is bad news, like he wanted to find an argument for anyone else but couldn't, but didn't want to vote his scum partner. (Haven't reread end of Day 1 yet so don't know if this is what his posts felt like). vote: skip wooznum

This is extremely bizarre. How did you know that D1 ended without also seeing the flip?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #724 on: June 26, 2015, 01:26:28 am »

Also, Mail-mi posted on-site (only a couple times but still) while we were lynching Awaclus conveniently without stopping in here to offer any thoughts or reactions.

Need to do more catching up, but need to respond to this. You guys put up like 8 pages when I was asleep, so I went and checked my other game, then had to leave before I could get through this one, then by the time I came back Awaclus was lynched.

HOORAY Awaclus was scum!

I think we need to lynch off-wagon today.

Final Vote Count Day 1

Awaclus (7): Hydrad, Witherweaver, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc, chairs, Seprix, A Drowned Kernel
Teproc (1): mail-mi
mail-mi (1): pacovf
chairs (2): Awaclus, Joseph2302

Not Voting (1): skip wooznum

With 12 alive, it took 7 to lynch.

...which, well, really narrows it down to Pacovf and Skip. Skip was acting pretty scummy yesterday, and not having your vote on someone is bad news, like he wanted to find an argument for anyone else but couldn't, but didn't want to vote his scum partner. (Haven't reread end of Day 1 yet so don't know if this is what his posts felt like). vote: skip wooznum

This is extremely bizarre. How did you know that D1 ended without also seeing the flip?

I'm with Pacovf, that IS a bit weird. Only strengthens my Mail-Mi read, so hey. Have an explanation? Because if you don't, I think I have my lynch candidate.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #725 on: June 26, 2015, 01:55:11 am »

Think we can learn anything from this list?

No.
Not to mention WW not dying D1 is pretty odd, though I guess the safe lynch would be Joseph.

It's not that odd.  Like I said, I thought for sure it would be me or Teproc (with a chance of WW) and then on reflection realized Joe makes much more sense as a target after all.  Think about it, now we have to worry more about fake PR claims and if they hit a PR with their next night kill (and they probably had to kill Joe sooner or later), now we actually lose that PR for good.  In the long game, it makes more sense here I think.


Analyzing the wagon come D1 end, and given Seprix's Law of Mafia Average (One/Two scum tends to jump on wagon, The rest stay off wagon),
You're naming this after yourself, really??  You did not invent this.

Quote from: Seprix
This could easily be scum!WW defending Awaclus there.
That's not a defense

Quote from: Seprix
We have mail-Mi, Pacovf and Skip. Skip seems townie, because he's quite overeager, which is typical for newer players. Pacovf has been strong town thus far.

Looks like a WW/Awaclus/Mail-Mi scum team so far.

I don't think it's really worth it trying to call the scumteam.  Let's just lynch the next scum for now, then worry about the team.

I do actually really like the idea of lynching off-wagon today, it seems unlikely that both scum would bus their partner day 1.  On the other hand, you and ADK did jump on after Awaclus started acting so scummy that it seemed kind of inevitable.  But yeah, lynching completely off wagon sounds like a good idea to me.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 1)
« Reply #726 on: June 26, 2015, 02:10:09 am »

Let's talk about that not-lynching-lurkers-except-Mail-Mi thing.

That is grossly misrepresenting my position. Lynching a lurker and a lurker-lynch is not the same thing. The first means that you have reasons to believe a given lurker is scum. The second means lynching a lurker because lurkers are harder to read.

You're splitting hairs here.  You're right that I just semi-randomly voted for Awaclus to get him in here, but by the time you started arguing about this it was far from lynching a lurker because he was hard to read.

And yeah, when you said you wanted time to look it over that was fine, and I get that it's hard to keep up with this stuff while at work. I'm sympathetic toward that.

But I'm not sympathetic to this post overall.  You might be legitimately emotional, but I'm in no way grossly misrepresenting what you said.  You didn't say you were frustrated or you wanted time to analyze the wagon.  I was trying to hold people accountable for their votes and at the time only Hydrad hadn't chimed in if I recall correctly.  That's a legitimate worry I agree.

But your argument is nonsense.  And not wanting to lynch a claimed vanilla townie who is reacting super scummily under pressure because he might be lying and softclaiming a PR is crazy.

Quote
So I argued against an Awaclus lynch, because it seemed like the only way to get the time to do all that. And well, that arguing was rushed, because I was at work.
Yeah, I have to admit this is plausible.  But you could have said that at the time, rather than making a bad defense.  I'm inclined to believe you really were rushed and not thinking, but that in your rush you made a bad defense of your scumbuddy.  That makes more sense to me with how that went down.  I think as town you didn't need to have a terrible argument, you could have just asked us to wait.

But I'm still willing to hold it against him, maybe I'm not fair, whatever.  Deliberate lurking doesn't seem that implausible to me.

There's a difference between the plausible deniability of "he didn't post anything at that time, maybe he was deliberately lurking!" and "I checked his activity on the forum, and I know that he deliberately chose to not post anything at that time!". The second is much more incriminating, but requires a specific reading of information not even available on the game thread. I am not ok with that.
[/quote]
You're right, we don't know that Mail-mi was avoiding the game for scum reasons.  And I'm not trying to say that anything is for sure.  But I have every right to find it suspicious and to keep it in mind and point it out.

I actually kind of like Mail-mi's reply to this.  And the fact that he replied to it already gives us more content on him than we had all day yesterday.  And the threat of lynching him may get him to catch up on this game if he's town.  But it's also a serious threat because there's a good chance he's scum.

I don't like how you're framing this, as if I'm going to lynch Mail-mi single handedly, based soley on the fact that he lurked through the day end.  As if I'm claiming it's some sort of huge case.  I'm not even voting the guy!

But if people are going to lurk scummily, I'm going to say something.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #727 on: June 26, 2015, 02:11:09 am »

Wow.  Okay looks like I'm wall posting.  Time to sleep.  Not having internet at home to avoid these late night posts has been good for my game I think.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #728 on: June 26, 2015, 02:16:34 am »

Got to read some Pacovf games tomorrow, but what do you guys think about this reply to me?

It reads pretty scummy from where I'm sitting.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #729 on: June 26, 2015, 02:24:30 am »

So you're saying my Law of Mafia Scum Averages isn't a law!? #triggered

I think Pacovf was just rushed, I'm not entirely sure he's scummy, though since he did try to defend Awaclus, I can give him a closer read. No harm.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #730 on: June 26, 2015, 05:01:24 am »

Ok, wagon analysis, here we go. Let's start with WW.

Well, I was probably wrong about WW. Probably. His Awaclus vote is actually not as decisive as I first thought though, he gains less town cred than, say, UoS from the lynch.

Though I guess there's very little scum narrative for WW to vote for a partner at that point, when he was under pressure with a mail-mi wagon right there... Either you vote mail-mi or you launch an other mislynch wagon, but that'd be a very weird moment to bus, except if he thought he was going to be lynched himself, but that didn't look incredibly likely at that point. Ok, WW is probably town. If he's still alive at lylo or something it can and should be reconsidered, but lynching him at anypoint before that would very likely be wrong.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #731 on: June 26, 2015, 05:02:17 am »

UoS is obvtown and should never be lynched. Basically. Next.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #732 on: June 26, 2015, 05:08:33 am »

chairs.

Can we just vote: awaclus and get rolling? I want to see what N1's NK will be already so we can work with it D2.

If that's a bus, that's a pretty bold one. That put Awaclus to L-2 AND chairs was going away from the biggest competing wagon (mail-mi, who had three votes counting chairs').

The comment about wanting to see the NK flip is strange for a bunch of reasons, but still, that does not look like a bus to me.

Mmh, he does vote Seprix later. The vote count hadn't changed at that point, maybe he thought the Awaclus lynch was inevitable earlier on and then saw an escape in lynching Seprix ? I mean that's a scum narrative, but the town narrative seems so much stronger.

Yeah, I could see it, but hairs is not in my lynch pool today.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #733 on: June 26, 2015, 05:20:25 am »

Seprix.

Awaclus

I didn't like the accusations against Awaclus, but I'm warming up to them. Unknown

Awaclus has 3 votes on him at this point, bu they're very recent. This is pretty classic scumpartner read : "oh yeah we could totally lynch this guy, I'm fine with that. OTOH, look at those other three scum reads I have ! Why dond't we lynch them ? skip, ADK and mail-mi were the scum reads FWIW.

I feel bad for thinking this (because it might encourage groupthink and dissuade people from carrying out their reads) but chairs feels a bit scummy for me right now. Like, enough for me to change my vote from mail-mi.

vote: Chairs

Deflection, shortyly after chairs gets on the Awaclus wagon.

Well, I'm ending this facade. :/

vote: Awaclus

Very little posts between those two votes.

We have a winner here, Seprix's attitude towards the Awaclus wagon is pretty typical scum partner. I would expect maybe a little more effort towards getting another wagon going, but still, that makes him a frontrunner for today's lynch.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #734 on: June 26, 2015, 05:31:04 am »

ADK.

Okay then let's see.

Vote: Awaclus

WW seems to like pursuing "safe" lynches. I'm moving back to liking a WW lynch.

Doesn't look like it. vote: WW

This is a catch-up post (and follow-up vote), at that point Awaclus has 4 votes and WW has 1. WW was looking like a tough sell at this point, but I could still see scum!ADK deciding to push that wagon when his partner is starting to be in danger, as his argument against the WW lynch made it hard for him to go for the other possible wagon at the time : mail-mi, who had 3 votes.

Wow yeah I could definitely lynch awaclus today. Scum read is skyrocketing.

This is during the end-game craziness, after Awaclus softclaimed a PR but before he claimed VT. No vote here though, ADK could have been anticipating a claim from Awaclus at that point. He hammers some time later after some confusion because he though Seprix had hammered already.

Definitely in the lynch pool. Based strictly on interactions with Awaclus, he's not that scummy, but I wouldn't expect scum!ADK to be too sloppy either. I also just haven't gotten a town vibe from ADK at any point in this game, which is very unusual for me. In the lynch pool certainly.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #735 on: June 26, 2015, 05:33:20 am »

Off-wagon now, let's start with mail-mi.

Well that was quick. He has 0 interactions with Awaclus, though to be faire he has 0 interactions with most people. mail-mi being Awaclus' partner would certainly help explain the lack of resistance to an Awaclus lynch yesterday. He's probably a good lynch for today, though I like Seprix better at this point.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #736 on: June 26, 2015, 05:52:11 am »

pacovf.

Huh, about anyone else... Joseph is the IC, Awaclus has been super-lurking, and I am not fine with that, and I haven't formed an opinion on Seprix yet.


So people I would vote for: Mail-mi, chairs, ADK, Awaclus, maybe Seprix, maaaaaaaybe Teproc.

This is right before Hydrad voes Awaclus, so he has 0 votes there. Fits a scumpartner attitude : Awaclus is among people pacovf is fine lynching, but not too high up there.

I notice you mention that you could see a skip or Awaclus lynch. I'm not sold on skip. I don't see why you are against a Mail-mi lynch but for an Awaclus one. It's the sort of non-accountable wagon you were complaining about for Mail-mi.

Only 1 vote on Awaclus at this point, but pacovf is already doing some damage control. Well, that or pacovf is being consistent with his view on lurker lynches, but either way, this still fits.

Is anyone voting (or wanting to vote) for Awaclus for a reason other than him lurking? If he flips town, are you all going to throw your hands up in the air and say "but he was lurking!"?

I'm all up for lynching lurkers... starting on D2. Otherwise, I would rather lynch someone that actually gets us somewhere even if he flips town. Own your votes, people!

Otherwise, if anyone has a strong opinion on Hydrad, ADK or Seprix (remember when he had a wagon on him?), I would like to hear it. We haven't discussed any of them lately.

Now this is deflecting. Awaclus has 4 votes on him now and is the leading wagon, so now is where a competent scumpartner has to make a choice. What's weird here is that pacovf's vote is sitting on mail-mi, which goes rather strongly against his argument here (yes he'll say he had an actual case on mail-mi, but if mail-mi had been lynched it would still have mostly been a lurker lynch). Now inconsistencies tend to be townie, but this particularly inconsistency allows pacovf to stay on the main competing wagon to a scum lynch, so maybe not this time.

Off to read a scum!Awaclus game. Maybe a town one too, I'm really confused about his play here.

I approve.

Not sure if this means anything, but it's probably relevant in some way.

Again, I haven't had the time to reread Awaclus, but while UoS is really persuasive, the case against Awaclus is still just that he is lurking. Lurker lynches are bad in D1, because if he flips town, we have next to nothing. I would totally be for an Awaclus lynch for D2 (assuming nothing better comes up from the flips), because he has earned it many times over, but I don't think I want to lynch him today.

Awaclus has 5 votes on him now. THis reminds me very strongly of Star Wars Mafia, which will speak to probably nobody here (maybe WW was in that ?), but I'll explain. I was scum with XP in that game, and XP was super scummy on D1 and had a lynch on him. I defended him with what basically amounted as a "too scummy to be scum" argument, and persisted even when I knew he was about to be lynched, because I felt like town!me would not switch at that point, and that anyone with a passing familiarity with my meta would recognize a switch to be a desperate attempt at towncred. In fact I hoped that my stalwart defense of him would be seen as exonerating.

I think pacovf has a pretty close playstyle to mine, so it'd make sense that his scumplay would be close to mine as well, and it really feels like this is happening here.

Starting to think Awaclus/Seprix/pacovf might be a winning ticket, though that's probably getting ahead of ourselves. I definitely like both lynches better than the other somewhat scummy people so far (ADK and mail-mi).
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #737 on: June 26, 2015, 05:59:04 am »

skip.

Would scum!awaclus be this uninterested in this game? (Or do we think he's pretending to be uninterested?)

Going into this, that's the argument I was looking for in scumpartners. Awaclus had 4 votes at this point.

This is absurd. @Awaclus, you dont want to tell us why you think chairs is scum. Can you tell us why you don't want to tell us why you think chairs is scum?

Could go either way on that one.

are there any reasons that don't assume your survival through day 1?

Can't think of any.
[/quote]and at this point in the proceedings, after claiming vt, you don't think you're going to get lynched? (Side point: why did you say before that you were confident you weren't getting lynched today? I took that as softclaiming a PR. sorry I can't find the wuote right now)
[/quote]

Could be frustration that Awaclus didn't claim something ?

I don't know. He could be a scumpartner, but I just don't really feel it. He goes back and forth with Awaclus a lot in the end, which I don't think scum, especially new!scum would feel very comfortable doing, as he'd know at this point that Awaclus was about to flip scum. Not in my lynch pool for today, need more from/about him.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #738 on: June 26, 2015, 06:01:41 am »

Ok, so I think today's lynch should be between Seprix and pacovf. I'm pretty confident at least one of them is scum.

vote: Seprix
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #739 on: June 26, 2015, 09:29:12 am »

Ok, so I think today's lynch should be between Seprix and pacovf. I'm pretty confident at least one of them is scum.

vote: Seprix
id much rather lynch pacovf than seprix
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 1)
« Reply #740 on: June 26, 2015, 09:44:48 am »

You're splitting hairs here.  You're right that I just semi-randomly voted for Awaclus to get him in here, but by the time you started arguing about this it was far from lynching a lurker because he was hard to read.

I am not splitting hairs. Before your case, Awaclus was strictly a lurker lynch. After your case, I was barely following along, because I was at work. I actually completely forgot what your case was by the end of the day. I just could not keep up. I want to believe that either as town or scum, I would not try to deliberately misrepresent what another player is saying.

Quote
But your argument is nonsense.  And not wanting to lynch a claimed vanilla townie who is reacting super scummily under pressure because he might be lying and softclaiming a PR is crazy.

Check your timeline. My defense came before he claimed VT, and before he started being super flippant about his wagon.

Quote
Quote
So I argued against an Awaclus lynch, because it seemed like the only way to get the time to do all that. And well, that arguing was rushed, because I was at work.
Yeah, I have to admit this is plausible.  But you could have said that at the time, rather than making a bad defense.  I'm inclined to believe you really were rushed and not thinking, but that in your rush you made a bad defense of your scumbuddy.  That makes more sense to me with how that went down.  I think as town you didn't need to have a terrible argument, you could have just asked us to wait.

I already asked you to wait! And you were ignoring me! And honestly, you can't tell me that if I had asked you to wait again, instead of rushing a defense, you wouldn't be waving that against me just as well.

Quote
I don't like how you're framing this, as if I'm going to lynch Mail-mi single handedly, based soley on the fact that he lurked through the day end.  As if I'm claiming it's some sort of huge case.  I'm not even voting the guy!

That's how your initial post reads to me. I see now that it's not what you intended. Sorry for the confusion.

pacovf.

Huh, about anyone else... Joseph is the IC, Awaclus has been super-lurking, and I am not fine with that, and I haven't formed an opinion on Seprix yet.


So people I would vote for: Mail-mi, chairs, ADK, Awaclus, maybe Seprix, maaaaaaaybe Teproc.

This is right before Hydrad voes Awaclus, so he has 0 votes there. Fits a scumpartner attitude : Awaclus is among people pacovf is fine lynching, but not too high up there.

I notice you mention that you could see a skip or Awaclus lynch. I'm not sold on skip. I don't see why you are against a Mail-mi lynch but for an Awaclus one. It's the sort of non-accountable wagon you were complaining about for Mail-mi.

Only 1 vote on Awaclus at this point, but pacovf is already doing some damage control. Well, that or pacovf is being consistent with his view on lurker lynches, but either way, this still fits.

I would have to read what happened between those two posts to see why I switched positions. But dunno, seems like doing damage control at one vote is waaaaaay premature.

Quote
Is anyone voting (or wanting to vote) for Awaclus for a reason other than him lurking? If he flips town, are you all going to throw your hands up in the air and say "but he was lurking!"?

I'm all up for lynching lurkers... starting on D2. Otherwise, I would rather lynch someone that actually gets us somewhere even if he flips town. Own your votes, people!

Otherwise, if anyone has a strong opinion on Hydrad, ADK or Seprix (remember when he had a wagon on him?), I would like to hear it. We haven't discussed any of them lately.

Now this is deflecting. Awaclus has 4 votes on him now and is the leading wagon, so now is where a competent scumpartner has to make a choice. What's weird here is that pacovf's vote is sitting on mail-mi, which goes rather strongly against his argument here (yes he'll say he had an actual case on mail-mi, but if mail-mi had been lynched it would still have mostly been a lurker lynch). Now inconsistencies tend to be townie, but this particularly inconsistency allows pacovf to stay on the main competing wagon to a scum lynch, so maybe not this time.

Huuuuh no. When I wrote my case on mail-mi, your reaction wasn't that it was bad because it was a lurker lynch (you said that my case fitted town!mail-mi's meta too). It would be nice if we could stop pretending that my vote on mail-mi was encouraging a lurker lynch. Unlike Awaclus's wagon, which started strictly as a lurker lynch, only with more words. Not to mention that mail-mi never got a wagon on him (3 votes woooo), so it's hard to say what a mail-mi lynch would have looked like.

To be fair, I find a bit grating all this "but your vote was sitting on mail-mi!" thing.

Quote
Off to read a scum!Awaclus game. Maybe a town one too, I'm really confused about his play here.

I approve.

Not sure if this means anything, but it's probably relevant in some way.

I approved that you were willing to go the extra mile for this game.

Quote
Again, I haven't had the time to reread Awaclus, but while UoS is really persuasive, the case against Awaclus is still just that he is lurking. Lurker lynches are bad in D1, because if he flips town, we have next to nothing. I would totally be for an Awaclus lynch for D2 (assuming nothing better comes up from the flips), because he has earned it many times over, but I don't think I want to lynch him today.

Awaclus has 5 votes on him now. THis reminds me very strongly of Star Wars Mafia, which will speak to probably nobody here (maybe WW was in that ?), but I'll explain. I was scum with XP in that game, and XP was super scummy on D1 and had a lynch on him. I defended him with what basically amounted as a "too scummy to be scum" argument, and persisted even when I knew he was about to be lynched, because I felt like town!me would not switch at that point, and that anyone with a passing familiarity with my meta would recognize a switch to be a desperate attempt at towncred. In fact I hoped that my stalwart defense of him would be seen as exonerating.

I could have switched at that point. My last post was that I wanted more time to think about UoS's case.

You don't address the proposal to lynch Awaclus D2. What do you think of it?

Anyway, I am at work, so don't expect a back and forth. I am mostly posting so that Teproc sees something before he goes to sleep. I will do a reread tonight or tomorrow, fish for towny things I did, and update my town/scum reads.
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Witherweaver

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #741 on: June 26, 2015, 10:23:45 am »

I don't think scum!Awaclus means town!WW. I do think town!Awaclus heavily implies scum!WW.

FYI, this is why I came into today thinking Chairs was scummy.  This was a weird thing to say, because at that point I basically could not unvote Awaclus.  If I unvoted, I would have looked like scum afraid of being on a bad mislynch, and maybe people would move to me instead of Awaclus.  If Awaclus ended up getting lynched as scum, then I look like his partner.

I'm not sure exactly what Chairs intended with this, but it had felt pretty odd.  It felt like he wanted me to unvote and then do something with that.  Perhaps he just wanted to see reactions.

But anyway, we should probably lynch off wagon today.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #742 on: June 26, 2015, 10:36:31 am »

scum!seprix = scum!skip.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #743 on: June 26, 2015, 10:40:12 am »

I had reasons for thinking Seprix was scum after yesterday, but I don't remember what those were.  Probably because he's Seprix.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 1)
« Reply #744 on: June 26, 2015, 10:42:28 am »

You don't address the proposal to lynch Awaclus D2. What do you think of it?

I don't know what he thinks of it (or who "he" is), but it was scummy.

Vote: Pacovf
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #745 on: June 26, 2015, 10:44:04 am »

...(numerous weird things)...

In this "Law of Mafia Average", does it matter whether the wagon was on scum or town?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 1)
« Reply #746 on: June 26, 2015, 10:56:28 am »

You don't address the proposal to lynch Awaclus D2. What do you think of it?

I don't know what he thinks of it (or who "he" is), but it was scummy.

Really? Why?

I was talking to Teproc there.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #747 on: June 26, 2015, 10:59:59 am »

Because it's averting from his lynch while not opposing the idea of lynching him.  Who knows, maybe Awaclus will come back tomorrow and start acting super townie and we won't want to lynch him any more.  Maybe general town feeling will change.

I did a similar thing in my first scum game with regards to Ashersky. 
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #748 on: June 26, 2015, 11:11:37 am »

Fair enough.

What's the difference with NMVI then? Something similar happened there, and you reacted the opposite way.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #749 on: June 26, 2015, 11:19:35 am »

Vote Count 2.1

Seprix (1): Teproc
pacovf (2): UmbrageOfSnow, Witherweaver
chairs (1): A Drowned Kernel
skip wooznum (1): mail-mi

Not Voting (5): Seprix, pacovf, Hydrad, chairs, skip wooznum

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 2 ends at Jul 4, 7 PM Forum Time.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #750 on: June 26, 2015, 11:24:29 am »

Fair enough.

What's the difference with NMVI then? Something similar happened there, and you reacted the opposite way.

You'd have to remind me.  Was that the New Mafia game that you played?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #751 on: June 26, 2015, 11:35:58 am »

Also, Mail-mi posted on-site (only a couple times but still) while we were lynching Awaclus conveniently without stopping in here to offer any thoughts or reactions.

Need to do more catching up, but need to respond to this. You guys put up like 8 pages when I was asleep, so I went and checked my other game, then had to leave before I could get through this one, then by the time I came back Awaclus was lynched.

HOORAY Awaclus was scum!

I think we need to lynch off-wagon today.

Final Vote Count Day 1

Awaclus (7): Hydrad, Witherweaver, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc, chairs, Seprix, A Drowned Kernel
Teproc (1): mail-mi
mail-mi (1): pacovf
chairs (2): Awaclus, Joseph2302

Not Voting (1): skip wooznum

With 12 alive, it took 7 to lynch.

...which, well, really narrows it down to Pacovf and Skip. Skip was acting pretty scummy yesterday, and not having your vote on someone is bad news, like he wanted to find an argument for anyone else but couldn't, but didn't want to vote his scum partner. (Haven't reread end of Day 1 yet so don't know if this is what his posts felt like). vote: skip wooznum

This is extremely bizarre. How did you know that D1 ended without also seeing the flip?

I'm with Pacovf, that IS a bit weird. Only strengthens my Mail-Mi read, so hey. Have an explanation? Because if you don't, I think I have my lynch candidate.

I do. My first post was my "respond to UoS" post, and my second was my "respond to everything" post. I had read up til the end of the day and saw the flip, and had to catch up with all of day 2.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #752 on: June 26, 2015, 11:40:59 am »

Fair enough.

What's the difference with NMVI then? Something similar happened there, and you reacted the opposite way.

You'd have to remind me.  Was that the New Mafia game that you played?

Yes. I deflected to TA while SK dug a hole for himself, while saying that we should totally lynch him D2. Although there I deflected because SK was a newbie, not a lurker. During D2, you thought unlikely that such a thing could come from scum.

If you don't remember the game well enough to tell where the difference is, no need to reread it.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #753 on: June 26, 2015, 11:45:49 am »

Okay.  It's certainly possible it's inconsistent.  Maybe I didn't think you would be so bold to defend there, I'm not sure.

Here it felt like you were just really lukewarm about Awaclus; you didn't want to completely argue that he shouldn't be lynched at all, but didn't want to get on the wagon either.

Also, your meta-awareness of how you handled a similar situation when you were town in a different game does not to many favors for my impression of you now.  You could have easily been aware of this yesterday when deciding how to treat Awaclus.  "Oh, I did this in my other town game and it was very similar, so it won't be suspicious if I do it here."
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #754 on: June 26, 2015, 11:46:17 am »

Well I also haven't reread Day 1.  It's possible my opinion will change.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #755 on: June 26, 2015, 12:08:31 pm »

Also, your meta-awareness of how you handled a similar situation when you were town in a different game does not to many favors for my impression of you now.  You could have easily been aware of this yesterday when deciding how to treat Awaclus.  "Oh, I did this in my other town game and it was very similar, so it won't be suspicious if I do it here."

So you think that my reasoning was:

"I can totally get away with defending Awaclus now that he is nearly lynched, because I did an arguably similar thing in a 10 month old game that shares three players with this game, one of them being quite active!"

No, I was just interested in what people thought about the whole "let's lynch him D2" thing, because it confused people in that other game.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #756 on: June 26, 2015, 12:28:38 pm »

I don't really think the meta-awarness makes you scummy.

But I do think "let's lynch him Day 2" is incredibly scummy, it was really bugging me on Day 1 and through the night.  Saying we'll lynch someone Day 2 instead gives a lot of chance for town to fail to commit, not want to jump into anything too soon and stumble around into mislynching a townie instead.  It's not just some slim hope for putting off the lynch a day to save him for more than a day, it's a reasonably good one.  And even if it doesn't work, it gets a low-information mislynch out of the way now rather than having to secure one in the future.

I'm not sure what others think, but my reasoning is that you were at work, not able to keep up with things and because of this didn't think your defense of Awaclus through the way you would have liked to.  I like to play online chess, and I have a bad habit of suddenly playing stupid and hanging a piece when under time pressure and distracted by work or other things.

I think you realized that your defense was not going to make you look good after posting it, but that it was a mistake made in a hurry.  And I think it's a mistake much more likely to come from scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #757 on: June 26, 2015, 12:31:45 pm »

Also, your meta-awareness of how you handled a similar situation when you were town in a different game does not to many favors for my impression of you now.  You could have easily been aware of this yesterday when deciding how to treat Awaclus.  "Oh, I did this in my other town game and it was very similar, so it won't be suspicious if I do it here."

So you think that my reasoning was:

"I can totally get away with defending Awaclus now that he is nearly lynched, because I did an arguably similar thing in a 10 month old game that shares three players with this game, one of them being quite active!"

No, I was just interested in what people thought about the whole "let's lynch him D2" thing, because it confused people in that other game.

I feel that the fact that you brought up your play in the other game is undermining your point a little here.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #758 on: June 26, 2015, 12:44:53 pm »

Also, your meta-awareness of how you handled a similar situation when you were town in a different game does not to many favors for my impression of you now.  You could have easily been aware of this yesterday when deciding how to treat Awaclus.  "Oh, I did this in my other town game and it was very similar, so it won't be suspicious if I do it here."

So you think that my reasoning was:

"I can totally get away with defending Awaclus now that he is nearly lynched, because I did an arguably similar thing in a 10 month old game that shares three players with this game, one of them being quite active!"

No, I was just interested in what people thought about the whole "let's lynch him D2" thing, because it confused people in that other game.

I feel that the fact that you brought up your play in the other game is undermining your point a little here.

Well, you did react the exact opposite way than the previous time, and I was curious.

But I do think "let's lynch him Day 2" is incredibly scummy, it was really bugging me on Day 1 and through the night.  Saying we'll lynch someone Day 2 instead gives a lot of chance for town to fail to commit, not want to jump into anything too soon and stumble around into mislynching a townie instead.  It's not just some slim hope for putting off the lynch a day to save him for more than a day, it's a reasonably good one.  And even if it doesn't work, it gets a low-information mislynch out of the way now rather than having to secure one in the future.

That's a nice explanation, thanks.

Quote
I'm not sure what others think, but my reasoning is that you were at work, not able to keep up with things and because of this didn't think your defense of Awaclus through the way you would have liked to.  I like to play online chess, and I have a bad habit of suddenly playing stupid and hanging a piece when under time pressure and distracted by work or other things.

So we agree that the fact that I made a bad defense of Awaclus is a consequence of being at work, not a consequence of alignment?

Quote
I think you realized that your defense was not going to make you look good after posting it, but that it was a mistake made in a hurry.  And I think it's a mistake much more likely to come from scum.

That's one way to read it. I gave another explanation already, and repeating it has diminishing returns. People can read it, weight whether it feels genuine or not, or which explanation seems more likely. Then compare to other people and decide who is more likely to be scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #759 on: June 26, 2015, 12:50:02 pm »

@pacovf, so whom do you think is scum then?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #760 on: June 26, 2015, 12:57:58 pm »

So we agree that the fact that I made a bad defense of Awaclus is a consequence of being at work, not a consequence of alignment?

We do not.  I absolutely do not question your explanation of what happened in real life.  But I disagree that this says nothing of the mindset you were in when you said it.

Either way, you felt rushed, pressured, wanting to keep the day going and wanting to say something about that.  I agree that that's true of you either alignment.  But what you said and the thought process that arrives at that point I think is absolutely alignment indicative.  Reading that is the tricky part.  But my read is that you were coming at this from the point of view of wanting to avoid Awaclus' lynch or put it off if you could.  Not that you wanted to delay the lynching for scumhunting reasons, but that you wanted to avert the lynch.  And I think you approach your frustration that way if you are scumbuddies with Awaclus.

And yeah, no need to reiterate what you already said, I'm only still going back and forth with you because I'm worried I'm being unclear.  I don't want this to be a back-and-forth for 10 pages either.  I want to know what others think.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #761 on: June 26, 2015, 02:25:24 pm »

Hey Pavlov  ;D,

In your first game, Mail-mi was lurking scum on Day 1.  You seemed the most commited to lynching Mail-mi here.  You were opposed to a lurker lynch, but liked your case on Mail-mi.

Could you talk about how that first game influenced you here, if at all.  (Maybe it didn't, I don't know, but I'd like your thoughts on this.)  Do you think things Mail-mi did there contributed to your read here?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #762 on: June 26, 2015, 02:48:24 pm »

Hey Pavlov  ;D,

*bellringing*

Quote
In your first game, Mail-mi was lurking scum on Day 1.  You seemed the most commited to lynching Mail-mi here.  You were opposed to a lurker lynch, but liked your case on Mail-mi.

Could you talk about how that first game influenced you here, if at all.  (Maybe it didn't, I don't know, but I'd like your thoughts on this.)  Do you think things Mail-mi did there contributed to your read here?

Hum, in that game, TwistedArcher was suspicious of mail-mi over very little, and he turned out to be right. I think I recognize the same sort of thing TA noticed in that game. Teproc says I am just recognizing mail-mi's play style, but well, I disagree.

In any case, I have to reread what happened in D1. Especially Awaclus's wagon.

@pacovf, so whom do you think is scum then?

Right now, I prefer a mail-mi lynch over a skip lynch if off-wagon, and I prefer an ADK or Seprix lynch over chairs if on-wagon. I don't think I want to lynch UoS, Teproc or WW.

This is subject to change after the famed reread.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #763 on: June 26, 2015, 04:04:41 pm »

...(numerous weird things)...

In this "Law of Mafia Average", does it matter whether the wagon was on scum or town?

Oh, it has to be scum lynch. I forgot that prerequisite. I've played enough games as scum to think in this way, and I've seen this trend enough times to where I think it's a thing I can legitimately call up. UoS says this is already a thing people have noticed, which makes me even happier, because I figured it out on my own.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #764 on: June 26, 2015, 04:08:40 pm »

Yep, Teproc is right pacovf. You're just recognizing my playstyle . I'm more of an observer, so I try to post but I don't usually have much to say. Also I've been busy.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #765 on: June 26, 2015, 04:37:38 pm »

Yep, Teproc is right pacovf. You're just recognizing my playstyle . I'm more of an observer, so I try to post but I don't usually have much to say. Also I've been busy.

I kind of feel like pulling my hair out here.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #766 on: June 26, 2015, 09:19:32 pm »

Re : mail-mi. I'll admit that I'm just terrible at reading mail-mi, so I'm by no means an authority on the subject, but while I can respect atht you do see something different here, I don't.

Re : your proposal to lynch Awaclus on day 2. UoS summed it up pretty well : not only is it an empty promise, as numerous things will happen between now and then, it's also setting up automatic lynches, which does horrible things to rereads and interactions.

To everyone : you should absolutely reread day 1, or at least any post with the word "Awaclus" in it. Anything that happened on day 1 is more important than anything happening later (except claims I guess).
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #767 on: June 26, 2015, 09:21:47 pm »

To elaborate on the "let's lynch Awaclus day 2" thing : it's totally something a scumpartner would do. Because it shows your commitment to lynching him without actually requiring you to do it. Yes you would have had to push for his lynch on day 2, but it might not have happened because, well, it's a different day, there's a day 1 lynch to analyse, possible night actions results etc. So it lets you appear as if you're totally down with lynching the scum, while maybe getting a chance to save him.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #768 on: June 26, 2015, 11:25:48 pm »

WHAT TIME IS IT?

REREADING TIME

Pardon me if I am a bit worried. I have 4 people voting for me

That's convenient, I was about to ask how many votes you have, but it seems like I don't have to do that now.

Vote: Seprix

Awaclus second post. This is really, really bold if Seprix is scum.

Suppose you couldn't lynch WW and were forced to pick someone else. Who would that be?

My first instinct is skip, but I don't like lynching newbies on their first day, so I'd go with Awaclus. Completely under the radar, hasn't said anything of substance I can remember, and I do seem to recall that scum!Awaclus tends to be in the background, though I'd have to check.

First time someone mentions Awaclus accusatively. Teproc was pretty consistently on Awaclus, although he did prefer a WW lynch for most of the day and took a while to actually vote for Awaclus.

Awaclus and WW, you guys haven't weighed in on the Mail-mi wagon.  What do you think of it?

Not a huge fan of it, but I could do it if there's nothing better. I think it's better than WW at least.

Interesting. Not sure what to think of this.

Okay then let's see.

Vote: Awaclus

Second vote on Awaclus, after Hydrad's placeholder vote. I think this looks pretty good for WW.

Vote: Awaclus

Comes at a time of low activity, when the viable lynches were mail-mi and WW.

Would scum!awaclus be this uninterested in this game? (Or do we think he's pretending to be uninterested?)

After fourth vote on Awaclus. This looks a little bit bad.

Okay then let's see.

Vote: Awaclus

WW seems to like pursuing "safe" lynches. I'm moving back to liking a WW lynch.
Doesn't look like it. vote: WW
Why is Awaclus a safe lynch?
He's a lurker.

Same, Awaclus has 4 votes on him, WW only one (Teproc).

It's not an easy lynch if there's resistance!

Still a safe vote. Scum cares less about pushing mislynches super hard than about appearing active and towny.

So what's an unsafe vote?

L-1?

Only two more votes to get Awaclus to L-1! Look!  It's unsafe, and therefore unequivocally townie!
Yeah, not defending Awaclus here. I was saying voting someone when they're L-1 is an unsafe vote. :p
In other news, Awaclus has a quickly growing wagon; neglects to respond.  More at 11.

Perhaps he is not online at the moment.

Or the last couple days of moments.

Yes, that seems to be a problem.

I shouldn't be online right now. I'm in college, writing a paper before class. :p

This looks bad for Seprix. He is trying to defend Awaclus in the most inconspicuous way.

Can we just vote: awaclus and get rolling? I want to see what N1's NK will be already so we can work with it D2.

L-2. This is pretty nuts if chairs is scum. It makes him look pretty bad right then and Awaclus wasn't yet guaranteed to get lynched. Although he does switch his vote quickly to Seprix in quite a flimsy way, after Teproc's reread.

Awaclus I kind of want to policy lynch because if he's town then he's not being helpful. But again, it's the easy day one lynch, and I still like lynching WW more.

PPE: I'm pretty sure I've seen Awaclus as lurky scum. Wasn't he scum in flavorless?

The first part of this post is just horribly scummy; Awaclus had 4 votes on him at that point. The second part is weird for scum!ADK though. I would expect him to move to Seprix, if anything (although I guess they could be scumpartners). Mmm...

vote: Awaclus

L-1 I think. Wait no, chairs switched so it's only L-2.

It takes altogether too long for Teproc to vote for Awaclus, considering his previous posts about him, but I am still willing to give town points. He reread a town and a scum game, noticed that it could go both ways, and decided to vote for Awaclus anyway.

This quote from RMM 24 caught my eye (he was town there.)
- can you explain exactly what it is from your scum meta which you fail to replicate as town? I've heard you saying that you're easily found at as scum a bunch of times, but never understood why.
2) Well, I don't particularly try to replicate my scum meta when I'm town.  :P Anyway, I always feel enormous pressure to make sense and explain everything as scum. Even in Blarnia Mafia where I somehow got away with it, I explained all of my votes and reads unless the reasons were very clear without an explanation. I obviously do not feel any pressure to explain anything at all when I'm town.

When I read this, I got to thinking: he seems hyper aware of this, and in this game it looks to me (and this is where I need input from people who've actually played with him a bunch rather than skimmed some games) that he's been explaining and defending himself even less than usual.

I'm postulating that he's overcompensating for his known scumtell.

Thoughts?

PPE: 4

This comes right after Teproc's vote (but there's a PPE). This is also pretty much getting Awaclus in the coffin. This, together with today's level of activity (unnecessary if he is scum) pretty much guarantees that UoS is town.

I think it's pretty likely, actually. I can hammer if you'd like, I'm down for an Awaclus lynch.

Man, Awaclus-Seprix interactions just keep going back and forth. Awaclus was down at 4 votes, but I am not sure Seprix was following that closely, he probably thought he would actually be hammering. Could be done just for the towncred though.

Awaclus isn't a terrible lynch but he's not my favorite.
He tends to be pretty passive regardless of alignment. Which is a bad way to play but unfortunately doesn't indicate much about his alignment here.
He tends to be pretty passive regardless of alignment. Which is a bad way to play but unfortunately doesn't indicate much about his alignment here.

So you think his play here is no more or less passive than his other games?

He's maybe more passive here than usual. As I said, he's certainly not the worst lynch. I'm still holding out for WW a little, though.

Again! He even specifically attacks the basis of the case on Awaclus! Then he drops it when pressured.

Unrelated, the more tight-lipped Awaclus gets/feels, the more I want to lynch him. This feels a lot like how I reacted to suspicion in D1 of HP Mafia.

Still hovering at 4 votes, and chairs once again puts pressure on Awaclus. Yeah, I don't think I want to lynch chairs. Not today, anyway.

Man, I think it's great that Awaclus was at 4 votes for so long. It's that point where it can go both ways, so vote switching is really informative.

Again, am I going to lynch or not? It's looking worse and worse for Awaclus.

Ladies and Gentlemen, I proudly present, Seprix. Right after final-nail-on-the-coffin UoS's case.

Again, I haven't had the time to reread Awaclus, but while UoS is really persuasive, the case against Awaclus is still just that he is lurking. Lurker lynches are bad in D1, because if he flips town, we have next to nothing. I would totally be for an Awaclus lynch for D2 (assuming nothing better comes up from the flips), because he has earned it many times over, but I don't think I want to lynch him today.

Just for the record, here is my defense, with Awaclus at 5 votes and Seprix asking to hammer.

Wow yeah I could definitely lynch awaclus today. Scum read is skyrocketing.

After Awaclus just starts sprouting nonsense.

VT.

Well, I'm ending this facade. :/

vote: Awaclus

Yeah, ok, whatever. Seprix really waited until the last possible moment to vote for Awaclus.

Yeah, intent to hammer. We're still pretty early so I'll give people a chance to jump in and give last thoughts but anyone who states intent to play anti-town should be lynched as a matter of course. And awaclus is way too self-aware here for my liking.

Same here.

Didn't Hydrad start this whole thing by throwing his vote on Awaclus as a placeholder?

Frankly, at this point this is reaching too-scummy-to-be-scum levels.

I don't think scum!Awaclus means town!WW. I do think town!Awaclus heavily implies scum!WW.

Weeeeeird.

And, you know, what are your reads in general ? On the off chance that you're Morgrim!Awaclus, give us that at least.

Awaclus - obvtown
Teproc - towny
Hydrad - null
Joseph - Innocent Child
Witherweaver - slightly suspicious
skip wooznum - null
A Drowned Kernel - slightly suspicious
Seprix - scummy
mail-mi - null
UmbrageOfSnow - towny
chairs - scummy
pacovf - towny

This is absurd. @Awaclus, you dont want to tell us why you think chairs is scum. Can you tell us why you don't want to tell us why you think chairs is scum?

Well, besides getting lynched for the scum tell, there's also the reason that I think people's reactions when they're being voted without an explanation outside of RVS can be extremely valuable. It's not working now because nobody's taking it my vote seriously so chairs isn't probably feeling a lot of pressure from it, but it has worked in the past. Also, later in the game, it can be beneficial for making NKs more difficult for scum — they don't know what's the reason why I'm voting for them or how convinced I actually am, and sometimes that information could be very important.
are there any reasons that don't assume your survival through day 1?

I actually like this post! I don't think newbie!scum!skip writes this.

Oh I thought Seprix's vote was the hammer for some reason. I'm fine with vote: awaclus, people have said what they need to.

His previous post was intent to hammer, after Seprix's vote. I think this could be a thinly disguised "let's just cut conversation here, we've lost enough already".


And of course, not a single post by mail-mi anywhere near this.


Woooooooo that was long. Off to read WW's wagon, I think there is a very good chance he is town, so it should be informative. I will give my reads and vote after that.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #769 on: June 26, 2015, 11:49:02 pm »

Not lynching Pacovf today. I liked that analysis. And ADK is now definitely my top lynch choice behind Skip.

And of course, not a single post by mail-mi anywhere near this.

Already told you why.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #770 on: June 27, 2015, 12:04:25 am »

That was a very nice novel, Pacovf. :)
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #771 on: June 27, 2015, 12:12:01 am »

Vote: WW

because I want to see him lynched day 1 once.

First vote on WW, whatever.

obviously there is also a town narrative, I wasn't claiming otherwise. But I can totally see scum feeling like they have to justify an rvs, or planning an rvs on someone they can easily 'find scummy'

It's weird that you think that's a justification.

It's much weirder that Wither agreed with you and strengthened it to "something only scum do" especially without actually voting for me.

Vote: Witherweaver

First real vote on WW. Again, whatever, UoS is not scum.


It's weird that you think that's a justification.

It's much weirder that Wither agreed with you and strengthened it to "something only scum do" especially without actually voting for me.

Vote: Witherweaver

You know nothing, UmbrageOfSnow.

vote: Witherweaver

There's a reason I quoted WW, not skip, when questioning the "justifying an RVS vote" reasoning. He's encouraging suspicion based on dubious reasons without actually taking part... and when confronted, has nothing to say about it. Perhaps hoping we'd just move on ? I won't, town!WW is more engaged than this, and wouldn't only post the jokey response. He would do that and follow it up with an actual post of significance. Here his only post of significance is "yeah, that thing is totally scummy, you go ahead and lynch that guy".

Third vote on WW. At the time, the only other "wagon" was mail-mi, at 2 votes.

Vote: WW
I fail to see how Teproc's post was "a short novel", nor why attempting to justify a vote is scummy, nor how being the second person to vote for someone is "jumping in on a wagon". To me it looks like you're trying to disarm your wagon and discredit people who are voting for you.

4th vote. Right before this, ADK had been going pretty hard against skip, but was alone voting for him. Here he is adding new arguments against WW.

I fail to see how Teproc's post was "a short novel", nor why attempting to justify a vote is scummy, nor how being the second person to vote for someone is "jumping in on a wagon". To me it looks like you're trying to disarm your wagon and discredit people who are voting for you.
I agree with ADK here. Vote: WW.

5th vote.

Reply to Pacovf because I'm on my phone currently: WW seems genuine to me right now. Yes, I know that's not a 'great' reason. But I don't think he's scum right now.

I should do a reads thing soon though, because besides Mail-Mi, no one else is potentially scum, and we have two other guys thus far.

Seprix is the first person to defend WW, and he doesn't even have an alternative wagon. He does vote mail-mi after this.

[Fight between Teproc and WW here]

Is it just me or does this ww/teproc fight seem a tad scum vs. scum?

If we assume that WW (and Teproc) are town, this doesn't look so good, but meh, I just think skip fits a town narrative so much better.

I just can't even right now.

vote: ww. I feel like this is going to be like the early Joseph games, where if we don't lynch you we just keep going back to "ought we?" and you're as good a choice as any D1 in my mind.
I did know it was L-1.

I appreciate all the reactions.

vote: Teproc.  Sorry to worry you, WW, I just wanted to see what Teproc would do to an unannounced L-1 :)

The famous and famed unannounced one-two punch of L-1 and Teproc bounce. This is horribly anti-town (somebody could have derphammered, and the "trap" was basically unavoidable). Considering the rest of chairs's game, I am willing to attribute this to eager chairs, but it's definitely something to keep in mind.

At L-1, were voting for WW: Hydrad, UoS, Teproc, ADK, Joseph, Chairs. Teproc and I quickly point out that it is L-1, so it's not like scum could get away with a derphammer, and unfortunately chairs doesn't stay long enough there for scum to feel like announcing intent to hammer either, so I don't think we can get all that much from this :/ Anyway, weren't on the wagon Awaclus, mail-mi, skip, Seprix and pacovf. Of those, only mail-mi seemed ok with a WW lynch.

I don't want to lynch ww this early and I dont like how chairs joined this wagon

I count this as a defense of WW. He does some other arguably weak defenses later.

I have been lurking indeed; yesterday was busy. I should be on more today to answer any questions.

No that was not a hedge defense of skip, I just wanted to see what ADK's reasoning is.

I think Teproc and WW are of the same alignment. Whether that's town or scum, I don't know.
And for what it's worth, if only one of Teproc/WW is scum, i think it would be Teproc, for the same reason as chairs.

Also, I think chairs is town and won't lynch him today.

Ah, these two posts again. In retrospect, they don't look as bad if we assume that WW is town. Actually, for it to look bad, both mail-mi and one of Teproc/WW would have to be scum, and that seems soooooo unlikely right now.

Is it just me or does this ww/teproc fight seem a tad scum vs. scum?

The only way to know for sure is to lynch one of them.

Heh. This looks really, really bad today.

Mmm I think I could go back to vote: skip

...and suddenly he goes back to skip? What the hell? Sure, WW has been hovering at 5 votes for a while, but still, and skip didn't really look all that lynchable.

ADK : what's your read on WW ?
Mmm I'm considering. Are you maintaining your position that he's scummy?
Yes. He's my preferred lynch for today, by a mile.
Suppose you couldn't lynch WW and were forced to pick someone else. Who would that be?

This is kinda defending WW without defending him? This doesn't mesh all that well with scum!ADK.

The whole WW thing: when rereading, I think he is genuine. While his original comment was sort of weird, I like the answer he gave when asked to explain his thought process about skip's original post, I think it is very towny. I don't agree with his vote on Teproc though, it just feels like Teproc being Teproc.

Oh hey I do defend WW at some point. He was sitting at 4 votes then, with a couple of extra votes floating around (ADK, chairs).

Ok I changed my mind. Even though I want to see WW lynched day 1 sometime I don't think this is the right game for it.

I havn't thought to much about mail-mi for some reason.

everyone seems to say hes scummy but I'm not sure if I just haven't been paying enough attention or not but it hasn't stuck out to me much yet.

Vote: awaclus for now. more of a placeholder vote.

After this post, the wagon on WW basically disintegrates, and he isn't mentioned again.


Mmmmm... I was hoping to get something more out of this, meh. Final thoughts coming in a bit.

PPE 2
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #772 on: June 27, 2015, 12:14:01 am »

And of course, not a single post by mail-mi anywhere near this.

Already told you why.

Yeah, I know. I am just mentioning you because otherwise we would forget you exist, and go on our merry way lynching other people.

That was a very nice novel, Pacovf. :)

Yikes, you are right that it is very long. Short version coming soon.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #773 on: June 27, 2015, 12:16:46 am »

More info is good, though. :T
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #774 on: June 27, 2015, 12:21:49 am »

So, from the Awaclus lynch, ADK and Seprix look absolutely horrible. UoS is guaranteed town, WW is very likely to be town too, and Teproc and chairs look pretty good (the former for inciting an Awaclus lynch, but unfortunately only voting very late; the latter for decisive votes, the first of which being quite weird).

From the WW wagon, ADK and chairs look bad, and I don't think anyone looks particularly good.

Then there's mail-mi, who has been completely absent from this game. I don't think I can say I have a case on him anymore, but I could be ok with a lurker!mail-mi lynch later on (thank God, now when people will accuse me of inciting a lurker-lynch, they will be right!). Skip Wooznum just fits a town playstyle too well for me to want to lynch him with the weak evidence against him.

Awaclus made a pretty ballsy vote on Seprix back when he had a wagon on him, so considering both wagons, and between ADK and Seprix, I definitely prefer vote: ADK.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #775 on: June 27, 2015, 12:23:18 am »

And the Heavens be blessed that Hydrad inherited the Innocent Child.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #776 on: June 27, 2015, 12:37:38 am »

And the Heavens be blessed that Hydrad inherited the Innocent Child.

your welcome.

also really good job with the reads
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #777 on: June 27, 2015, 02:43:58 am »

Vote: A Drowned Kernel
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #778 on: June 27, 2015, 06:55:24 am »

Awaclus made a pretty ballsy vote on Seprix back when he had a wagon on him, so considering both wagons, and between ADK and Seprix, I definitely prefer vote: ADK.

I think you're giving too much weight to the Seprix wagon. It was very, very early on in the day, and I know we've had some day 1 quicklynches recently, but it was still unlikely to go all the way. I suppose it's worth some town cred for Seprix, but his interactions with Awaclus so perfectly fit what I'd expect from a scumpartner that I can't overlook it.

ADK is a good lynch as well, not my preferred but I'll join it if needed. His interactions with Awaclus are more subtle but that's to be expected since ADK is more experienced. It's just that when you lynch scum on day 1, I think the simplest answer tends to be the right one (and here the simplest answers are Seprix and pacovf).

People need to stop giving massive towncred for just doing work btw. People like pacovf will absolutely do that as scum, especially when their day 1 interactions are as damning as they are here. It's fine to give some towncred for it (it's a big reason why I prefer lynching Seprix to pacovf), but just like mail-mi lurking doesn't mean he's scum, pacovf (or me, or WW etc.) doing rereads doesn't mean they're town.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #779 on: June 27, 2015, 11:07:46 am »

Awaclus made a pretty ballsy vote on Seprix back when he had a wagon on him, so considering both wagons, and between ADK and Seprix, I definitely prefer vote: ADK.

I think you're giving too much weight to the Seprix wagon. It was very, very early on in the day, and I know we've had some day 1 quicklynches recently, but it was still unlikely to go all the way. I suppose it's worth some town cred for Seprix, but his interactions with Awaclus so perfectly fit what I'd expect from a scumpartner that I can't overlook it.

Well, I am just using Occam's razor. Seprix looks a bit worse than ADK from his interactions with Awaclus, but it becomes a toss up between the two when you consider WW's wagon*. So Awaclus's early vote on Seprix tips the scales towards ADK. I would still be happy with a Seprix lynch, though.

*Yes, I know that wagons on town are not as informative as wagons on scum, and that we aren't 100% sure that WW is town. That doesn't mean we should ignore it.


Quote
ADK is a good lynch as well, not my preferred but I'll join it if needed. His interactions with Awaclus are more subtle but that's to be expected since ADK is more experienced. It's just that when you lynch scum on day 1, I think the simplest answer tends to be the right one (and here the simplest answers are Seprix and pacovf).

Considering our playstyles, do you really think that ADK being more subtle here is actually so good an argument that you put him on an entirely different willing-to-lynch category than Seprix and I?

Honestly, after finishing the reread, ADK seems quite a bit scummier than I am, but then again, I am terribly biased.


Quote
People need to stop giving massive towncred for just doing work btw. People like pacovf will absolutely do that as scum, especially when their day 1 interactions are as damning as they are here. It's fine to give some towncred for it (it's a big reason why I prefer lynching Seprix to pacovf), but just like mail-mi lurking doesn't mean he's scum, pacovf (or me, or WW etc.) doing rereads doesn't mean they're town.

Can we ignore this perfectly good point you are raising just because it would serve me? :P
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #780 on: June 27, 2015, 11:17:21 am »

I apologize for not having time for this at the moment, please don't lynch me until I have a chance to properly defend myself.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #781 on: June 27, 2015, 11:27:07 am »

Sure, we can wait, don't worry.

In the meantime, Seprix, care to defend yourself or put your vote down somewhere?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #782 on: June 27, 2015, 11:44:24 am »


Quote
ADK is a good lynch as well, not my preferred but I'll join it if needed. His interactions with Awaclus are more subtle but that's to be expected since ADK is more experienced. It's just that when you lynch scum on day 1, I think the simplest answer tends to be the right one (and here the simplest answers are Seprix and pacovf).

Considering our playstyles, do you really think that ADK being more subtle here is actually so good an argument that you put him on an entirely different willing-to-lynch category than Seprix and I?

Honestly, after finishing the reread, ADK seems quite a bit scummier than I am, but then again, I am terribly biased.

Well, first of all you've never been scum, so even though you're a good town player, you might not be the best scum player ever (they can't all be) on your first try. More importantly though, the scum narrative for you is very different thatn ADK's.

For you, it's basically that you defended Awaclus very early on and felt like you had to make a choice between either defending him or bussing him, to avoid being in the classic scumpartner position of "he's a great lynch, but let's do someone, anyone, else". That's not a subtle position at all, but it doesn't need to be. This is exactly how I approached it the first time I had a scumpartner with a leading wagon on day 1 (Star Wars Mafia), so I think it's a very convincing scum narrative for you. Well, convincing to me at least, since I do think we are similar players.

For ADK, it's him deflecting away from Awaclus fairly consistently, but not doing it so in the over-the-top scummy way of Seprix. I think this is less scummy because it's just harder to distinguish from a town behavior.

Now that I think about it more, I guess I don't have a great answer to your question. I'm just less convinced about ADK being scum than I am about you and Seprix, and I'm not sure why there's a different degree there but there is. I realize that's not something you can do much about, but it is what it is.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #783 on: June 27, 2015, 03:05:04 pm »

Well, first of all you've never been scum, so even though you're a good town player, you might not be the best scum player ever (they can't all be) on your first try. More importantly though, the scum narrative for you is very different thatn ADK's.

This has been bothering me for a while now, and I think I've managed to put my finger on why: it looks like you are choosing the scum!pacovf meta that best fits the current facts, and that's a reasoning shortcut.

Example: Let's assume for a moment that WW had never been scum here before. I reread WW, and think "what sort of scum narrative fits these facts?", and I say "when under pressure, WW always busses a partner so that either gets mass towncred". Well, that sounds reasonable enough, and it fits the facts perfectly! Let's lynch WW! Obviously, this is just a reductio ad absurdum for illustrative purposes.

My point is, if you choose my scum meta, I am obviously going to fit a scum narrative (compared to a town one) much better than ADK's fits one based on his preexisting scum meta, which you cannot choose.

Note that I am not saying that your assumption about my scum meta is a bad one. It's just that there's a host of equally likely ones that you could have chosen instead, and that I don't fit as well.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #784 on: June 27, 2015, 03:26:11 pm »

vote: seprix. Seprix pacovf scum team with pacman gambit on an adk mislynch into maybe a we mislynch before we trash seprix and he comes up roses no matter what.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #785 on: June 27, 2015, 03:26:35 pm »

Ww not we.

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Vote Count
« Reply #786 on: June 27, 2015, 03:35:32 pm »

Vote Count 2.2

Seprix (2): Teproc, chairs
pacovf (1): Witherweaver
A Drowned Kernel (2): pacovf, UmbrageOfSnow
chairs (1): A Drowned Kernel
skip wooznum (1): mail-mi

Not Voting (3): Seprix, Hydrad, skip wooznum

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 2 ends at Jul 4, 7 PM Forum Time.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #787 on: June 27, 2015, 04:28:03 pm »

Sure, we can wait, don't worry.

In the meantime, Seprix, care to defend yourself or put your vote down somewhere?

It seems I read the WW/Awaclus interactions out of context, so I don't have the scum read on WW to go to. Mail-Mi and ADK are among the higher reads I have, but I don't want to look like I'm switching votes all the time, so I am reluctant to vote right now. This is also the reason I waited to vote for Awaclus, and I know it looks bad. People seriously grilled me as anti-town for constantly switching my vote in every other game, so I thought I'd try to not vote as often this game. Maybe I'm doing it wrong, but it doesn't seem to be working. :/
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #788 on: June 27, 2015, 04:31:08 pm »

So to answer your question, I'm not really sure who to vote for, because honestly, I don't see the ADK case. I'm not as confident on the Mail-Mi case, but I guess that's still my top read thus far.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #789 on: June 27, 2015, 04:53:58 pm »

Well, first of all you've never been scum, so even though you're a good town player, you might not be the best scum player ever (they can't all be) on your first try. More importantly though, the scum narrative for you is very different thatn ADK's.

This has been bothering me for a while now, and I think I've managed to put my finger on why: it looks like you are choosing the scum!pacovf meta that best fits the current facts, and that's a reasoning shortcut.

Example: Let's assume for a moment that WW had never been scum here before. I reread WW, and think "what sort of scum narrative fits these facts?", and I say "when under pressure, WW always busses a partner so that either gets mass towncred". Well, that sounds reasonable enough, and it fits the facts perfectly! Let's lynch WW! Obviously, this is just a reductio ad absurdum for illustrative purposes.

My point is, if you choose my scum meta, I am obviously going to fit a scum narrative (compared to a town one) much better than ADK's fits one based on his preexisting scum meta, which you cannot choose.

Note that I am not saying that your assumption about my scum meta is a bad one. It's just that there's a host of equally likely ones that you could have chosen instead, and that I don't fit as well.

You're making it sound like my case on you is all meta, which it's not. Meta is a small part of it.

The main case is : you defended Awaclus and deflected from his lynch. Awaclus was scum.

WHat I'm adding to that is that I'm speculating that your scum meta (which I have to speculate about since it doesn't exist) would be similar to mine, and that this option (defending and deflecting from my partner very openly) is one I have taken in the past as scum. This is admittedly not an insanely strong argument, but it makes sense to me. Wether or not it makes sense to others I don't know, but I didn't try to find scum when rereading you, it's simply that the scum narrative seemed (and still does) stronger with you than with most other players.

All that being said, me having a conversation with you about how I think you're scum is not the most productive thing in te world, so I'll let others share their views on that now.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #790 on: June 27, 2015, 05:24:04 pm »

Teproc has been talking sense. Pacofv is coming off to me as rhetorical in these discussions.  Seprix is still a wild card.  Probably better to lynch him sooner than later.  Or cop him or something.   I haven't seen a big reason to lynch Skip.  I agree with Snow being town.

Okay here's a thought.  Mail-Mi was the alternate wagon to Awaclus.  Say they're both scum.  Does scum try to divert from both, or do they try to cut losses and bus for town cred?  Was there much of a push back towards Mail-Mi when Awaclus wagon was ramping up?  If so, that's and indication that Mail-Mi is town, and pushers are suspicious.  If not, then scum is a little more likely. And ,well, he probably gets some town points just because you don't often have leading wagons on two scum.

Chairs I'm back to towner on. 
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #791 on: June 27, 2015, 06:11:06 pm »

You're making it sound like my case on you is all meta, which it's not. Meta is a small part of it.

The main case is : you defended Awaclus and deflected from his lynch. Awaclus was scum.

Sorry if I was unclear, I was just talking about your preference for lynching me over lynching ADK, not about finding either of us scummy.

I was describing more-or-less scientifically the problem in that part of your reasoning (it's a common thing in data analysis). You might see where I am coming from if you imagine yourself in my position, as a town player with no defined scum meta.


Quote
All that being said, me having a conversation with you about how I think you're scum is not the most productive thing in te world, so I'll let others share their views on that now.

Fair enough.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #792 on: June 27, 2015, 06:35:46 pm »

Mail-Mi was the alternate wagon to Awaclus.  Say they're both scum.  Does scum try to divert from both, or do they try to cut losses and bus for town cred?  Was there much of a push back towards Mail-Mi when Awaclus wagon was ramping up?  If so, that's and indication that Mail-Mi is town, and pushers are suspicious.  If not, then scum is a little more likely. And ,well, he probably gets some town points just because you don't often have leading wagons on two scum.

It sounds like the conclusion you're coming to is that Mail-mi is town either way.  Do you agree with that?

I don't recall any real push back to Mail-mi other than by Pacovf.  ADK was lightly against the Awaclus lynch but was voting WW as I recall.

I do think Mail-mi and Pacovf seem like an unlikely scum team.  I'm unwilling to lynch Chairs today.  Is Mail-mi off the table for you, or close to it?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #793 on: June 27, 2015, 06:37:48 pm »

So to answer your question, I'm not really sure who to vote for, because honestly, I don't see the ADK case. I'm not as confident on the Mail-Mi case, but I guess that's still my top read thus far.

Why/how is Mail-mi your top read?  I know I pestered you about this on Day 1, but I still want to hear more about it.  Or maybe about why you're not feeling ADK or Pacovf.  Not sure which way your brain works, but could you go into a bit of detail about those three?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #794 on: June 27, 2015, 10:51:59 pm »

I'm not too focused on the game. ADK and Pacovf could be announcing they're scum and I wouldn't know. College is hard :(
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #795 on: June 27, 2015, 10:56:01 pm »

.....ADK are among the higher reads I have....
...honestly, I don't see the ADK case...
these are back to back contradicting posts
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #796 on: June 27, 2015, 10:59:26 pm »

Mail-Mi was the alternate wagon to Awaclus.  Say they're both scum.  Does scum try to divert from both, or do they try to cut losses and bus for town cred?  Was there much of a push back towards Mail-Mi when Awaclus wagon was ramping up?  If so, that's and indication that Mail-Mi is town, and pushers are suspicious.  If not, then scum is a little more likely. And ,well, he probably gets some town points just because you don't often have leading wagons on two scum.

It sounds like the conclusion you're coming to is that Mail-mi is town either way.  Do you agree with that?

I don't recall any real push back to Mail-mi other than by Pacovf.  ADK was lightly against the Awaclus lynch but was voting WW as I recall.

I do think Mail-mi and Pacovf seem like an unlikely scum team.  I'm unwilling to lynch Chairs today.  Is Mail-mi off the table for you, or close to it?

That's probably because the "And" at the beginning of the last sentence isn't correct.  The last point wasn't conclusive, but it's a point to towards town.  The part before depends on what we can find with Day 1 interactions. 
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #797 on: June 27, 2015, 10:59:56 pm »

I.e., it could lead to town or scum conclusions, but I'm not sure which yet.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #798 on: June 27, 2015, 11:00:01 pm »


Is it just me or does this ww/teproc fight seem a tad scum vs. scum?

The only way to know for sure is to lynch one of them.

Heh. This looks really, really bad today.


[/quote]bad because it now looks like they're both town and he's trying to get one lynched, or because it looks like he's slipping that he knows they're both town?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #799 on: June 27, 2015, 11:01:23 pm »

I messed up there but I think everyone gets what was supposed to happen with the quotes
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #800 on: June 27, 2015, 11:07:10 pm »

Why does that look bad for Pac but not for you?

Wait, actually, I'm confused on who said what there.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #801 on: June 27, 2015, 11:27:11 pm »

I think this is what that mess of quotes is supposed to look like.

Is it just me or does this ww/teproc fight seem a tad scum vs. scum?
If we assume that WW (and Teproc) are town, this doesn't look so good, but meh, I just think skip fits a town narrative so much better.
Is it just me or does this ww/teproc fight seem a tad scum vs. scum?
The only way to know for sure is to lynch one of them.
Heh. This looks really, really bad today.

bad because it now looks like they're both town and he's trying to get one lynched, or because it looks like he's slipping that he knows they're both town?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #802 on: June 27, 2015, 11:29:52 pm »

Wait, there is a better way to do this.

Is it just me or does this ww/teproc fight seem a tad scum vs. scum?

If we assume that WW (and Teproc) are town, this doesn't look so good, but meh, I just think skip fits a town narrative so much better.

The only way to know for sure is to lynch one of them.

Heh. This looks really, really bad today.

bad because it now looks like they're both town and he's trying to get one lynched, or because it looks like he's slipping that he knows they're both town?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #803 on: June 27, 2015, 11:32:20 pm »

Damn it.

Quotes are hard.

Anyway, I think (both Skip and Pacovf, I'm not even sure anymore) are both reading way to much into "only way to know for sure is to lynch one of them."  How do you know for sure if someone is scum?  You lynch them.  Why do you guys think there is more to it than that.  (Do you both think that, I don't know now.)
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #804 on: June 27, 2015, 11:35:23 pm »

@WW: What exactly do you want to look far with regards to Mail-mi and the wagon on Awaclus?  Is there any way I can help with that, I've got a lot of internet and free time tonight.

@Hydrad: Can we get some IC thoughts in here please?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #805 on: June 27, 2015, 11:49:22 pm »

@WW: What exactly do you want to look far with regards to Mail-mi and the wagon on Awaclus?  Is there any way I can help with that, I've got a lot of internet and free time tonight.

@Hydrad: Can we get some IC thoughts in here please?

Well my thought was that if Awaclus' partners didn't want to bus, they'd have to look to alternative wagons.  Town!Mail-Mi would be a natural choice (though, perhaps too obvious).  I guess (glancing back through the pages) the votes weren't on him, but I think people were willing to go back on him.  (Note: Did most Awaclus votes move from Mail-Mi?)  So if Mail-Mi didn't have anyone diverting from Awaclus to him, it's an indication that he's not town. 

I don't know, though, maybe there's nothing there. 
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #806 on: June 27, 2015, 11:53:04 pm »

Damn it.

Quotes are hard.

Anyway, I think (both Skip and Pacovf, I'm not even sure anymore) are both reading way to much into "only way to know for sure is to lynch one of them."  How do you know for sure if someone is scum?  You lynch them.  Why do you guys think there is more to it than that.  (Do you both think that, I don't know now.)
adk implied we would know for sure if it was scum v scum or wasn't after lynching one of them. That's different than saying we'd know for sure if someone is scum or not after lynching him in quite an obvious way.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #807 on: June 27, 2015, 11:55:26 pm »

I think this is what that mess of quotes is supposed to look like.


Is it just me or does this ww/teproc fight seem a tad scum vs. scum?
The only way to know for sure is to lynch one of them.
Heh. This looks really, really bad today.

bad because it now looks like they're both town and he's trying to get one lynched, or because it looks like he's slipping that he knows they're both town?
and yes this is what I meant basically. Sorry about the confusion.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #808 on: June 27, 2015, 11:56:03 pm »

I think that the requirement to make the civility pledge should be replaced by a quoting workshop  ;D


Quote from: A Drowned Kernel

Is it just me or does this ww/teproc fight seem a tad scum vs. scum?

The only way to know for sure is to lynch one of them.

Heh. This looks really, really bad today.
bad because it now looks like they're both town and he's trying to get one lynched, or because it looks like he's slipping that he knows they're both town?

Bad because it looks like they are both town and he just wanted to lynch any of them.

I understand your scumslip argument, but a scumslip that requires the potential scum to be perfectly on top of the De Morgan's Law is not a very strong scumslip argument.

I'm not too focused on the game. ADK and Pacovf could be announcing they're scum and I wouldn't know. College is hard :(

...did Seprix just concede the game here?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #809 on: June 27, 2015, 11:56:16 pm »

Hm, I think that's just as likely (or more likely) misspeaking as it is a "scumslip". 
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #810 on: June 27, 2015, 11:56:44 pm »

I'm not too focused on the game. ADK and Pacovf could be announcing they're scum and I wouldn't know. College is hard :(

...did Seprix just concede the game here?

...No...? What does that even mean?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #811 on: June 27, 2015, 11:57:24 pm »

...did Seprix just concede the game here?

Go read the last day of Adventures Mafia~
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #812 on: June 28, 2015, 12:02:07 am »

Man, I'm still upset about that game.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #813 on: June 28, 2015, 12:03:09 am »

I'm not too focused on the game. ADK and Pacovf could be announcing they're scum and I wouldn't know. College is hard :(

...did Seprix just concede the game here?

...No...? What does that even mean?

You are announcing that we shouldn't really expect you to follow the game. This is despite you seeming like one of the most probably lynches of today. The only reason I can see for this is that you are scum that knows he is in an unwinnable position.

...did Seprix just concede the game here?

Go read the last day of Adventures Mafia~

Which one is that? What do I have to look for?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #814 on: June 28, 2015, 12:06:01 am »

It looked like Seprix was basically admitting to being scum, but turned out town.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #815 on: June 28, 2015, 12:06:25 am »

Every point I've tried to make has been debunked or torn apart, so obviously no one needs my opinion on anything this game. :p
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #816 on: June 28, 2015, 12:14:46 am »

I understand your scumslip argument, but a scumslip that requires the potential scum to be perfectly on top of the De Morgan's Law is not a very strong scumslip argument.
what is De Morgan's law?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #817 on: June 28, 2015, 12:16:36 am »

I understand your scumslip argument, but a scumslip that requires the potential scum to be perfectly on top of the De Morgan's Law is not a very strong scumslip argument.
what is De Morgan's law?

Not (A and B) = (Not A) or (Not B)
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #818 on: June 28, 2015, 12:22:10 am »

Giving something a fancy name doesn't stop it from being intuitive
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #819 on: June 28, 2015, 12:27:27 am »

I don't think he was considering all the logical ramifications of his post, but was just going with something that was "close enough".
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #820 on: June 28, 2015, 12:32:54 am »

I don't think he was considering all the logical ramifications of his post, but was just going with something that was "close enough".
maybe. But if thats true then I have no issue with his post at all. I dont think he actually wanted one of them lynched, I read the post as a joke.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #821 on: June 28, 2015, 01:26:14 am »

I'll try to post more. But me being an IC has benifits and negatives.

Good part is that people spend no time discussing how scummy I am!

bad part is i'm not a very good person to lead and trust reads. But i'll try to work on that.

UoS and teproc still feel really good though.

I'll try to post a more indepth post soonish.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #822 on: June 28, 2015, 04:16:39 pm »

Just acknowledge that I'm a virtual IC so we can move on from there.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #823 on: June 28, 2015, 07:43:12 pm »

...that hint that there is a theme to the scum flavor-flavor names seems unlikely to be helpful at all without some scum flips to base it on.  That might be worth talking about at some point I guess,..
should we talk about this? Does anyone know the flavor?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #824 on: June 28, 2015, 08:24:29 pm »

...that hint that there is a theme to the scum flavor-flavor names seems unlikely to be helpful at all without some scum flips to base it on.  That might be worth talking about at some point I guess,..
should we talk about this? Does anyone know the flavor?

I'm thinking it might be more useful to find the third scum once we have 2 scum flips to look for a pattern.  But it would be useful if we're all locked into our flavor-flavor claims.

I vote we do a flavor-flavor claim.  And then, in a different order, a flavor claim.  Anyone disagree?

Hydrad should probably call the orders.  We've got enough time in the day today that we probably have nothing to lose by this, and maybe it gains us some interactions.  I would really like to see ADK/Mail-mi/Seprix/Pacovf and Skip as the earlier claims though.  But it should probably be up to the IC.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #825 on: June 28, 2015, 08:25:11 pm »

And it'll at least get the lurkers to post.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #826 on: June 28, 2015, 08:58:14 pm »

Just acknowledge that I'm a virtual IC so we can move on from there.

I will not, because people can't just declare themselves innocent and expect everyone else to follow the Pied Piper without a reason.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #827 on: June 28, 2015, 08:59:40 pm »

...that hint that there is a theme to the scum flavor-flavor names seems unlikely to be helpful at all without some scum flips to base it on.  That might be worth talking about at some point I guess,..
should we talk about this? Does anyone know the flavor?

I'm thinking it might be more useful to find the third scum once we have 2 scum flips to look for a pattern.  But it would be useful if we're all locked into our flavor-flavor claims.

I vote we do a flavor-flavor claim.  And then, in a different order, a flavor claim.  Anyone disagree?

Hydrad should probably call the orders.  We've got enough time in the day today that we probably have nothing to lose by this, and maybe it gains us some interactions.  I would really like to see ADK/Mail-mi/Seprix/Pacovf and Skip as the earlier claims though.  But it should probably be up to the IC.

It's only Day 2. We lynched scum first day. We're not losing, we shouldn't give scum any advantages right now.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #828 on: June 28, 2015, 09:04:05 pm »

Mafia players have Pony-Mafia flavour name fake claims, so there's not anything to gain from this. Unless a Mafia player gets confused and posts his real Pony-Mafia flavour name, I guess.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #829 on: June 28, 2015, 09:23:26 pm »

Mafia players have Pony-Mafia flavour name fake claims, so there's not anything to gain from this. Unless a Mafia player gets confused and posts his real Pony-Mafia flavour name, I guess.

And what little chance of that happening just vanished if they read this post. But yeah, wasn't going to happen realistically. :p
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #830 on: June 28, 2015, 09:50:05 pm »

So what advantage are scum getting from this Seprix?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #831 on: June 28, 2015, 09:51:49 pm »

So what advantage are scum getting from this Seprix?

It seems incredibly obvious. If we all reveal our roles at the same time, bye bye cop, doctor, useful roles. As you said D1, we shouldn't discuss the game yet.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #832 on: June 28, 2015, 09:53:56 pm »

So what advantage are scum getting from this Seprix?

It seems incredibly obvious. If we all reveal our roles at the same time, bye bye cop, doctor, useful roles. As you said D1, we shouldn't discuss the game yet.

At what point did it look like I was suggesting we claim our roles?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #833 on: June 28, 2015, 09:59:37 pm »

So what advantage are scum getting from this Seprix?

It seems incredibly obvious. If we all reveal our roles at the same time, bye bye cop, doctor, useful roles. As you said D1, we shouldn't discuss the game yet.

At what point did it look like I was suggesting we claim our roles?

My bad, I read flavor as roles.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #834 on: June 28, 2015, 10:00:54 pm »

Man, I don't think I've been correct about a single thing this entire game. I defended Awaclus, I posted something long about WW!scum that instantly got debunked because I read a post out of context, and now I'm not even reading words right.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #835 on: June 29, 2015, 12:05:46 am »

I shoved all-in on Awaclus repeatedly and hard. Do you really think I'd do that as scum D1?

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #836 on: June 29, 2015, 12:10:38 am »

I shoved all-in on Awaclus repeatedly and hard. Do you really think I'd do that as scum D1?

It's not likely, but there are these arguments to be made:

1. Scum could anticipate this line of thinking. But wait, Seprix. Why would chairs lynch Awaclus if they were scumbuddies? That makes no sense! Well, that leads to my next point.

2. Chairs could not back out of his read because it got too hot and he knew exactly what would entail if he backed out before the near inevitable lynch. Scum votes for scum sometimes to mix it up, I propose that is what you could have done. And then the wagon started hard, and then boom, you had a problem on your hands.

But all of this is theoretical and not too likely. So yes, I would consider you town.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #837 on: June 29, 2015, 05:29:38 am »

Claiming flavor seems like a waste of time. I have a hard time imagining scum not having mod-provided fakeclaims here.

chairs' first vote for Awaclus is indeed very townie, but it's severly undercut by him switching to Seprix at the first opportunity. After that he came back when the lynch was already pretty inevitable. chairs is far from a top sspect, but he's far from an IC as well. Aside from Hydrad, only UoS is IC-ish.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #838 on: June 29, 2015, 05:30:22 am »

There's no need to go to deadline guys.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #839 on: June 29, 2015, 08:01:51 am »

We are still waiting for ADK's defense though.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #840 on: June 29, 2015, 09:40:30 am »

Hydrad was Twilight Sparkle while Awaclus was playing as Twilight Sparkle. Probably just a coincidence though. I don't see any real meaning there.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #841 on: June 29, 2015, 09:43:22 am »

It's the other way around. Hydrad is Rarity, playing as Twilight Sparkle.
Awaclus was Twilight Sparkle, playing as Gilda, with whatever unknown Pony-Mafia flavour fakeclaim.

It's kind of entertaining to discuss needlessly contrived setups, but I don't see what's to win in doing so.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #842 on: June 29, 2015, 09:45:39 am »

chairs' first vote for Awaclus is indeed very townie, but it's severly undercut by him switching to Seprix at the first opportunity. After that he came back when the lynch was already pretty inevitable. chairs is far from a top sspect, but he's far from an IC as well. Aside from Hydrad, only UoS is IC-ish.

Missed this first time around. I think WW is pretty IC-ish too. Granted, a little bit less than UoS.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #843 on: June 29, 2015, 10:55:27 am »

Okay, let's try this:

While I'm not totally sold on pacovf, he's obviously trying, if he's scum he'll have plenty of time to slip up later, and looking back I like some of his replies to my pressure.

So my 3-player lynch pool is:

ADK
Mail-mi
Seprix

WW, Teproc, Hydrad: you guys are all strong town reads for me.  3 man lynch pool from each of you, please?  (3 is somewhat arbitrary, if you really must have 1,2, or 4, go for it I guess.)
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #844 on: June 29, 2015, 11:01:57 am »

I would prefer one of:

Mail-Mi
Pacovf

(Note they were both off wagon).  I would be willing to do:

ADK
Seprix

(They were the last two on wagon, and the scummiest on wagon, and probably the only possible scum on wagon save the Chairs factor.)
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #845 on: June 29, 2015, 11:08:18 am »


There's a fundamental difference between the two: Awaclus would strictly be a lurker lynch. That means no accountability whatsoever if we lynch him. Nobody voting for mail-mi is doing so because of his lack of content, it's because what little there is, is scummy, so they won't be able to deflect responsibility tomorrow (should he happen to flip town).

That being said, I don't like the way Awaclus has been lurking. Most lurkers are just passive, not checking the game all that often, then posting a quick thought or two when they log in. Awaclus has been following the game closely, and just choosing not to post anything. Normally I would argue very strongly against a D1 lurker lynch, but I wouldn't feel so strongly about it in this specific case. Still, I would prefer a lynch elsewhere.

The problem is that you offer three lynches. WW and skip are town, IMHO, and Awaclus is a lurker lynch. So there's no common ground between our positions.

Ugh, I know I just took Pacovf off the table for me, but this post really pings me.  It looks like Pacovf picked up on Awaclus' scum strategy here, and yet is opposed to lynching him later.  For some reason I wasn't looking this early when I was looking at the wagon before.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #846 on: June 29, 2015, 11:24:44 am »

Awaclus and WW, you guys haven't weighed in on the Mail-mi wagon.  What do you think of it?

Not a huge fan of it, but I could do it if there's nothing better. I think it's better than WW at least.

When I asked Awaclus why Mail-mi was better than WW he never gave a reason.  At this point he only had Hydrad's placeholder vote of course, so he was certainly not feeling pressured yet.  I think given Awaclus' flip, strategy, and reply that the reason he didn't have a reason was obviously because there was no reason and he hadn't actually thought about this in any detail.  But what does Awaclus very slightly preferring a Mail-mi lynch over a WW lynch without contributing anything tell us?

For me, I think it makes Mail-mi somewhat more likely to be scum.  What do you guys think?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #847 on: June 29, 2015, 11:30:37 am »

Realizing that's a bit unclear:

Awaclus knows Mail-mi and WW's alignment.  Awaclus has decided to avoid contributing or making any firm statements in the game.

If we lynch Mail-mi and he is scum or lynch WW and he is town, Awaclus looks like he's paying attention and has some insight.

Now it's also possible that Awaclus wanted us to lynch Mail-mi because Mail-mi is town, but I think even refusing-to-be-committal Awaclus could have given it stronger support than that, especially as Mail-mi was the center of discussion at the moment and had (I think) 3 votes and a couple other people making non-committal noises.  And especially as his own perceived town meta, while it involves not ever making a case apparently, certainly allows for having an opinion beyond "if no one better comes along."

I can see either interpretation, but I think this is still a point against Mail-mi.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #848 on: June 29, 2015, 11:36:23 am »

Awaclus and WW, you guys haven't weighed in on the Mail-mi wagon.  What do you think of it?

Not a huge fan of it, but I could do it if there's nothing better. I think it's better than WW at least.

When I asked Awaclus why Mail-mi was better than WW he never gave a reason.  At this point he only had Hydrad's placeholder vote of course, so he was certainly not feeling pressured yet.  I think given Awaclus' flip, strategy, and reply that the reason he didn't have a reason was obviously because there was no reason and he hadn't actually thought about this in any detail.  But what does Awaclus very slightly preferring a Mail-mi lynch over a WW lynch without contributing anything tell us?

For me, I think it makes Mail-mi somewhat more likely to be scum.  What do you guys think?

Sounds a little less likely that Mail-Mi was his partner.  Him saying nothing about the wagon at all is suspicious, but there was a lot he didn't say on.  Hard to judge, but I don't quite get a partner vibe from his comment.

His vote was on Seprix at the time (he was the only one), if that means anything.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #849 on: June 29, 2015, 11:55:44 am »

I see what UoS is saying regarding scum!mail-mi but I don't think you go that route as scum.

I think in Awaclus's position you avoid mentioning your partner entirely or toss a meaningless vote on them to throw off suspicion... which is to say, Seprix now looks scummier to me.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #850 on: June 29, 2015, 11:59:21 am »

I see what UoS is saying regarding scum!mail-mi but I don't think you go that route as scum.

I think in Awaclus's position you avoid mentioning your partner entirely or toss a meaningless vote on them to throw off suspicion... which is to say, Seprix now looks scummier to me.

I mean he only said anything about Mail-mi after I explicitly asked him.  People had been talking about Mail-mi for a while with no contribution from Awaclus.

And yeah, I know there's not much to go off of, in either direction, with Mail-mi.  But these small chances might still be enough to help decided a lynch with better odds than a random choice among all the scummy people.
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Vote Count
« Reply #851 on: June 29, 2015, 12:46:23 pm »

Vote Count 2.3

Seprix (2): Teproc, chairs
pacovf (1): Witherweaver
A Drowned Kernel (2): pacovf, UmbrageOfSnow
chairs (1): A Drowned Kernel
skip wooznum (1): mail-mi

Not Voting (3): Seprix, Hydrad, skip wooznum

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 2 ends at Jul 4, 7 PM Forum Time.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #852 on: June 29, 2015, 12:58:45 pm »

Why are you guys not voting?

Seprix is so paranoid of being found scummy for his normal play that he's playing even scummier.

Vote: Seprix
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #853 on: June 29, 2015, 02:06:02 pm »

My 3-people lynch pool would be {Seprix, pacovf, ADK}
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #854 on: June 29, 2015, 02:12:01 pm »

Awaclus and WW, you guys haven't weighed in on the Mail-mi wagon.  What do you think of it?

Not a huge fan of it, but I could do it if there's nothing better. I think it's better than WW at least.

When I asked Awaclus why Mail-mi was better than WW he never gave a reason.  At this point he only had Hydrad's placeholder vote of course, so he was certainly not feeling pressured yet.  I think given Awaclus' flip, strategy, and reply that the reason he didn't have a reason was obviously because there was no reason and he hadn't actually thought about this in any detail.  But what does Awaclus very slightly preferring a Mail-mi lynch over a WW lynch without contributing anything tell us?

For me, I think it makes Mail-mi somewhat more likely to be scum.  What do you guys think?
I believe he did think about it and tried to reflect the popular opinion (or at least what he assumed the popular opinion would end up being). I dont think it means anything alignment-wise.
Realizing that's a bit unclear:

Awaclus knows Mail-mi and WW's alignment.  Awaclus has decided to avoid contributing or making any firm statements in the game.

If we lynch Mail-mi and he is scum or lynch WW and he is town, Awaclus looks like he's paying attention and has some insight.

Now it's also possible that Awaclus wanted us to lynch Mail-mi because Mail-mi is town, but I think even refusing-to-be-committal Awaclus could have given it stronger support than that, especially as Mail-mi was the center of discussion at the moment and had (I think) 3 votes and a couple other people making non-committal noises.  And especially as his own perceived town meta, while it involves not ever making a case apparently, certainly allows for having an opinion beyond "if no one better comes along."

I can see either interpretation, but I think this is still a point against Mail-mi.
this assumes one of ww/mm is town and one is scum. But they could just both be town, or both scum (though admittedly unlikely). If theyre both town, awaclus's comment still fits.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #855 on: June 29, 2015, 02:14:06 pm »

At this point I'll vote: adk but I like lynching pacovf too.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #856 on: June 29, 2015, 02:36:29 pm »

I mean he only said anything about Mail-mi after I explicitly asked him.  People had been talking about Mail-mi for a while with no contribution from Awaclus.

And yeah, I know there's not much to go off of, in either direction, with Mail-mi.  But these small chances might still be enough to help decided a lynch with better odds than a random choice among all the scummy people.

I don't think that post carried enough weight for it to be worth it to try to read through the generous amounts of WIFOM that Awaclus is capable of.

I see what UoS is saying regarding scum!mail-mi but I don't think you go that route as scum.

I think in Awaclus's position you avoid mentioning your partner entirely or toss a meaningless vote on them to throw off suspicion... which is to say, Seprix now looks scummier to me.

When Awaclus voted for Seprix, it was L-2, and the wagon was quickly growing. Granted, it was very early, but still.


I prefer an ADK lynch to a Seprix one, but would be happy with either. A mail-mi lynch would be fine too.

I would like to hear ADK's defense before we lynch anyone, but I am not averse to people getting votes down already. Especially Seprix and mail-mi (skip is not happening today).
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #857 on: June 29, 2015, 07:33:29 pm »

I think my 3 are ADK first then pacovf/seprix are tied for a close second right now.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #858 on: June 29, 2015, 07:42:50 pm »

vote: ADK
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #859 on: June 29, 2015, 07:45:21 pm »

I don't know what to add, so I guess I can answer any questions you guys have for me.

Also, I'm going on a week long vacation next week with no internet access. So maybe it might be a good idea to lynch me just because of that.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #860 on: June 29, 2015, 07:48:27 pm »

I promise a reread tonight.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #861 on: June 29, 2015, 07:58:30 pm »

I don't know what to add, so I guess I can answer any questions you guys have for me.

You could start by moving your vote to someone that might actually get lynched today.

Quote
Also, I'm going on a week long vacation next week with no internet access. So maybe it might be a good idea to lynch me just because of that.

...
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #862 on: June 29, 2015, 08:05:45 pm »

I don't know what to add, so I guess I can answer any questions you guys have for me.

Also, I'm going on a week long vacation next week with no internet access. So maybe it might be a good idea to lynch me just because of that.

Well, if this is the case, I can't see scum saying this AT ALL. I'm so puzzled over this. I think my read just flew out the window here.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #863 on: June 29, 2015, 08:07:42 pm »

I don't know what to add, so I guess I can answer any questions you guys have for me.

You could start by moving your vote to someone that might actually get lynched today.

Quote
Also, I'm going on a week long vacation next week with no internet access. So maybe it might be a good idea to lynch me just because of that.

...

Erm, I think skip might be lynched today.

I am town, but I'm just a VT and I haven't been contributing to the game at all anyway, so I'm the best town you could possibly lynch.
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I currently imagine mail-mi wearing a dark trenchcoat and a bowler hat, hunched over a bit, toothpick in his mouth, holding a gun in his pocket.  One bead of sweat trickling down his nose.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #864 on: June 29, 2015, 08:13:30 pm »

I don't remember anyone else saying that they wanted to lynch skip today. Nobody has built a real case on him either. It seems quite unlikely.

I am town, but I'm just a VT and I haven't been contributing to the game at all anyway, so I'm the best town you could possibly lynch.

...
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #865 on: June 29, 2015, 08:14:13 pm »

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #866 on: June 29, 2015, 08:21:50 pm »

I don't remember anyone else saying that they wanted to lynch skip today. Nobody has built a real case on him either. It seems quite unlikely.

Well, I guess I could vote: seprix then.

Quote
I am town, but I'm just a VT and I haven't been contributing to the game at all anyway, so I'm the best town you could possibly lynch.

...

*shrugs*
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I currently imagine mail-mi wearing a dark trenchcoat and a bowler hat, hunched over a bit, toothpick in his mouth, holding a gun in his pocket.  One bead of sweat trickling down his nose.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #867 on: June 29, 2015, 08:26:31 pm »

*shrugs*

Haha.

Still have to think about what this means though.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #868 on: June 29, 2015, 08:45:38 pm »

Do you have any strong opinion about anything? How closely have you been following the game? What are the things that have struck you the most?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #869 on: June 30, 2015, 10:54:53 am »

So, did you have the time to do that reread, ADK?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #870 on: June 30, 2015, 11:00:22 am »

Ugh, I'm being awful about this game. When I get behind it just seems so hard to catch up. I'm sorry for dropping the ball here, I will try and have something by the end of the day.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #871 on: June 30, 2015, 11:00:57 am »

I realize that this looks super scummy, and don't blame people for having scum reads on me right now. I will try and make it right though.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #872 on: June 30, 2015, 11:03:08 am »

I guess part of the problem is I feel I need to do some sort of massive reread, but in the interest of getting some sort of content out before I can do that, I'll say that I'd rather lynch off wagon than on, and that pre-reread skip is my preferred lynch.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #873 on: June 30, 2015, 11:31:34 am »

To be fair to Mail-mi, I was pushing a Skip lynch earlier, but my town reads don't like lynching him, and only my scumreads do, and ADK, Mail-mi, Seprix, and Pacovf are all plenty scummy in their various ways and the naive-town theory on Skip is certainly plausible.  I'd rather a lynch most of my townreads agree on when there are so unfortunately many good lynches.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #874 on: July 01, 2015, 02:19:03 am »

Uh, guys? Inactivity is pro scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #875 on: July 01, 2015, 02:30:40 am »

Alright, here goes.

The first posts of real substance start here, where Seprix votes for UoS for supposedly shutting down theory talk. There are some PSA posts here where people post things that are true but unhelpful, like Skip pointing out that there's a Strongman. UoS and Seprix are both willing to get into real play here, so town points for each of them. This post largely eliminates the possibility that they are partners to me, as I don't think scum talks to each other that directly, especially so early (I'm also pretty sure that UoS is town but I'm trying to unpack everything from the beginning and consider every possibility).

Witherweaver moves back to RVS. It's scummy, but so blatantly so that I think actual scum would avoid it.

This is a major overreaction to a small number of votes- and in the next post, he also comments that one of the people voting for him has a good point. Both of these things are scummy, but also slightly less so coming from Seprix. Still, scum points for him here.

Okay, Awaclus's first post. Let's pretend Seprix is Awaclus's partner here. How does he react to his partner coming under fire so early? I'd say he's more likely to direct his posts toward the people voting for Seprix, rather than address Seprix directly, which is what he does. He also votes for Seprix immediately thereafter, but without actually provding much justification, which I think he would be more careful to do if he was bussing. This is pointing back toward town!Seprix to me.

pacovf is quietly pushing the Seprix lynch in this and in other posts. I feel like he's also subtly buddying UoS.

This post, as well as the post that WW is quoting, stuck out to me a bit. Regardless of my read on UoS, changing an RVS vote to a serious one is something that is seen as pretty universally scummy, and thus a “safe” thing for scum to vote based on. I get a slight partner vibe from the two of them here, but WW could also be looking for a townie's incorrect read to sheep.

Another WW post that gives me scum vibes. Scum likes to defend townies that have lots of suspicion, so that they can appear reasonable and can say “I told you so!” when the lynch goes through. WW's also savvy enough to avoid appearing too eager to jump on a wagon.

This post strengthens my town read on UoS. And WW gets jokey in response, which is scummy.

chairs is absent for most of the early game, but that could just be chairs being chairs.

pacovf seems very calculated in his posts. Going to keep an eye on him. This too, looks possibly like scum ready to sheep a towny. And this is a post where he puts out a lot without committing to much of anything, and ends with a pretty safe vote on someone known for lurking. Scum read rising.

This is really weird to me. Like WW is making a point of not remember who Skip is. If one of them flips scum I think it's very likely that they're partners.

This post makes me disinclined to believe that Seprix and WW are partners, but I'll look for more interactions between the two of them.

Here's Awaclus, posting but making a point not to comment on anything that's happened or is happening. The biggest wagon at this moment is on WW. Doesn't want to say something incriminating about his partner?

This might be a nitpicky thing, but I think it's interesting that here, Skip says that he “doesn't feel the WW wagon”, rather than saying that he thinks WW is town or providing a reason.

I realize I haven't been really commenting on Teproc's posts. It's mostly that I find him towny, but as a wise man once said, Teproc always seems towny when scum. I don't want to discount him entirely.

chairs doing wacky stuff. In my experience wacky chairs is town chairs. I also like this post, which I guess I missed the first time.

This discussion eliminates the possibility of a UoS/Skip team to me, but I think UoS is town anyway, so whatever.

Teproc is the first person to bring up lynching Awaclus. Town.

Super hedgey post from mail-mi. Might also be WW's partner.

This might be indicative of a pacovf and Awaclus connection. pacovf being aware of his partner lurking, commenting on it without voting on it.

Awaclus post. Says next to nothing, but apparently isn't a fan of the WW lynch. Didn't speak out against it when it was within hammer range, though.

Okay, if this is bussing, it's super early and super quick. If WW is Awaclus's partner, he's either a) hoping the lynch doesn't actually go through, b) is going for a super-gutsy scum play, or possibly c) is just frustrated his partner is lurking so much. The second two don't seem like scum!WW plays to me. So less suspicion of WW now.

This post of pacovf's, on the other hand, points strongly toward an Awaclus/pacovf partnership. It's hedgey, noncomittal, ready to bus if need be but trying to push away from the lynch.

chairs tries to restart the WW wagon after people start voting for Awaclus. Major scum points here. And maybe his partner notices?

Yeah, way scummy on pacovf. Will probably be voting for him.

And this pushes me back toward a town read on WW.

Awaclus pushes chairs pretty hard, but there's a lot of WIFOM there. I don't know if there's real information to be had.

This, I think, is probably Awaclus trying to make WW look his partner, so it's even less likely that they actually are.

Okay, that's day one. Right now my reads are something like:

Town: UoS, WW, probably Teproc.
Scummy: pacovf>skip>Seprix>mail-mi>chairs.

I'll try and get to day two tomorrow morning.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #876 on: July 01, 2015, 02:52:55 am »

Proud of ya, ADK! :)

Reading now.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #877 on: July 01, 2015, 02:54:07 am »

..like Skip pointing out that there's a Strongman.
is this also not a scumslip or can we lynch him now?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #878 on: July 01, 2015, 03:04:50 am »

I don't quite get your statement, Skip. Care to elaborate?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #879 on: July 01, 2015, 03:06:12 am »

I don't quite get your statement, Skip. Care to elaborate?
I never said there is a strongman. He knows there is because he's scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #880 on: July 01, 2015, 03:07:39 am »

I don't quite get your statement, Skip. Care to elaborate?
I never said there is a strongman. He knows there is because he's scum.

Does town have a strongman equivalent?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #881 on: July 01, 2015, 03:08:46 am »

I don't quite get your statement, Skip. Care to elaborate?
I never said there is a strongman. He knows there is because he's scum.

Does town have a strongman equivalent?
no, if I understand you're question correctly. Which im not entirely certain I do.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #882 on: July 01, 2015, 03:09:24 am »

No, that's a stupid question. (I was making sure there wasn't some mix up where ADK had a PR) After looking over the setup... Yeah, looks bad for ADK.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #883 on: July 01, 2015, 03:10:07 am »

Another option is that ADK could be a cop? If I'm not mistaken, they can find out roles, right?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #884 on: July 01, 2015, 03:10:19 am »

I don't quite get your statement, Skip. Care to elaborate?
I never said there is a strongman. He knows there is because he's scum.

IC requires two letters to be rolled which means there's at least a one-shot strongman for sure.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #885 on: July 01, 2015, 03:15:00 am »

vote: Seprix, the things you are saying are just way too weird. L-1?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #886 on: July 01, 2015, 03:17:16 am »

I'm inclined to believe ADK because I don't think he'd lie about setup. However, I've been pouring over the set up for 5 minutes now, and I cannot understand how ADK got his conclusion thus far.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #887 on: July 01, 2015, 03:18:24 am »

vote: Seprix, the things you are saying are just way too weird. L-1?

That is correct.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #888 on: July 01, 2015, 03:21:30 am »

If there's confusion I think it's because I'm using "strongman" to refer to both the 1-shot version and the full version because that's easier to type out and I assumed people would know what I meant.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #889 on: July 01, 2015, 03:23:44 am »

Well, I'm ready to make my claim if nobody has any ethical reasons to object. I can't think of any.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #890 on: July 01, 2015, 03:24:30 am »

Also, if you're really confused about the setup: six letters got rolled. We had an IC, so we know at least two M's got rolled, which means at most 4 T's got rolled, which means we know that scum has at least a 1-shot strongman and possibly a full strongman. Skip's post that I quoted also implied that he thought this through as well, so it's surprising to me that he's calling it a scumslip when I mentioned it.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #891 on: July 01, 2015, 03:26:08 am »

I don't quite get your statement, Skip. Care to elaborate?
I never said there is a strongman. He knows there is because he's scum.

It's also worth noting that if anyone is a cop, vig, or mason, then that person knows the strongman is not a 1-shot

Bolding mine. And bed for real for real now.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #892 on: July 01, 2015, 03:30:23 am »

Okay. I'm a Cop. Not a 1-shot, either. I investigated Chairs N1 and he's Town, so barring any insanity rules, Chairs is towny.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #893 on: July 01, 2015, 03:32:29 am »

Also, if you're really confused about the setup: six letters got rolled. We had an IC, so we know at least two M's got rolled, which means at most 4 T's got rolled, which means we know that scum has at least a 1-shot strongman and possibly a full strongman. Skip's post that I quoted also implied that he thought this through as well, so it's surprising to me that he's calling it a scumslip when I mentioned it.

PPE: I'm not intending to hammer right now, but go for it. Also I'm going to bed for real now.
I didn't point out there's at least a one-shot. UoS did that b4 me so when you quoted MY post, which was specifically discussing strongman vs. one-shot strongman, you somehow missed that a town player wouldnt know that its definitely a full strongman, and you slipped that you had such knowledge. Now your excuse is that you meant one-shot strongman. But if you meant that, you would've quoted UoS's post, not mine.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #894 on: July 01, 2015, 03:36:03 am »

Okay. I'm a Cop. Not a 1-shot, either. I investigated Chairs N1 and he's Town, so barring any insanity rules, Chairs is towny.
sigh...
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #895 on: July 01, 2015, 03:42:00 am »

Also, if you're really confused about the setup: six letters got rolled. We had an IC, so we know at least two M's got rolled, which means at most 4 T's got rolled, which means we know that scum has at least a 1-shot strongman and possibly a full strongman. Skip's post that I quoted also implied that he thought this through as well, so it's surprising to me that he's calling it a scumslip when I mentioned it.

PPE: I'm not intending to hammer right now, but go for it. Also I'm going to bed for real now.
I didn't point out there's at least a one-shot. UoS did that b4 me so when you quoted MY post, which was specifically discussing strongman vs. one-shot strongman, you somehow missed that a town player wouldnt know that its definitely a full strongman, and you slipped that you had such knowledge. Now your excuse is that you meant one-shot strongman. But if you meant that, you would've quoted UoS's post, not mine.

I didn't miss that. I was pointing out that you were making an empty post about the setup, and was using strongman to refer to the role in general. I feel like that should be obvious but whatever.

Okay. I'm a Cop. Not a 1-shot, either. I investigated Chairs N1 and he's Town, so barring any insanity rules, Chairs is towny.

There is a godfather so this doesn't 100% clear Chairs. I am inclined to believe Seprix right now. I'm also not sure why I told him to go ahead and claim, it is late and I'm not thinking too straight.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #896 on: July 01, 2015, 03:46:43 am »

There is a godfather so this doesn't 100% clear Chairs. I am inclined to believe Seprix right now. I'm also not sure why I told him to go ahead and claim, it is late and I'm not thinking too straight.

But I'd say the odds are good.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #897 on: July 01, 2015, 03:46:52 am »

vote: Seprix, the things you are saying are just way too weird. L-1?
this was a bad vote. Seprix says weird things. Deal with it.

PPE: I'm not intending to hammer right now, but go for it. Also I'm going to bed for real now.
this is way worse. Of course he shouldn't claim. We're nowhere near deadline and I think a bunch of people want to lynch you anyway. And he was only third on your scumlist anyway. If you hadnt already scumslipped I think this is bad enough by itself.

PPE
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #898 on: July 01, 2015, 03:48:01 am »

Well, I guess it was a bad idea to reveal then.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #899 on: July 01, 2015, 03:50:23 am »


I didn't miss that. I was pointing out that you were making an empty post about the setup, and was using strongman to refer to the role in general. I feel like that should be obvious but whatever.
according to your own account, we should interpret your post to say "skip points out there's at least a one-shot strongman." This is downright false, I didn't point that out. So what I think happened is that you scumslipped.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #900 on: July 01, 2015, 03:55:56 am »

Meant this:

I didn't miss that. I was pointing out that you were making an empty post about the setup, and was using strongman to refer to the role in general. I feel like that should be obvious but whatever.
according to your own account, we should interpret your post to say "skip points out there's at least a one-shot strongman." This is downright false, I didn't point that out. So what I think happened is that you scumslipped.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #901 on: July 01, 2015, 03:58:24 am »

vote: Seprix, the things you are saying are just way too weird. L-1?
this was a bad vote. Seprix says weird things. Deal with it.

PPE: I'm not intending to hammer right now, but go for it. Also I'm going to bed for real now.
this is way worse. Of course he shouldn't claim. We're nowhere near deadline and I think a bunch of people want to lynch you anyway. And he was only third on your scumlist anyway. If you hadnt already scumslipped I think this is bad enough by itself.

PPE

You are correct that he shouldn't have claimed, and I apologize for having said so. You are not correct that I scumslipped, because I am not scum.

I was going over posts and writing things down as I saw them. I was making a point about you making an empty post, and didn't spell things out completely explicitly. So sue me.

All this makes me think you're probably town anyway, so I'm ready to vote: pacovf
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #902 on: July 01, 2015, 04:04:13 am »

Its worthless for me to keep saying the same thing but you still haven't responded to the point ive made at least twice.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #903 on: July 01, 2015, 05:46:28 am »

Vote Count 2.4

Seprix (5): Teproc, chairs, UmbrageOfSnow, mail-mi, pacovf {L-1}
pacovf (2): Witherweaver, A Drowned Kernel
A Drowned Kernel (2): skip wooznum, Seprix

Not Voting (1): Hydrad

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 2 ends at Jul 4, 7 PM Forum Time.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #904 on: July 01, 2015, 05:48:48 am »

unvote for now. Scum has every incentive to claim but Cop is powerful, might be worth lynching someone else.

skip : scumslips arguments are not as strong as you think they are. "Scumslips" have come from town at least as often as the have from scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #905 on: July 01, 2015, 05:51:43 am »

Will be back later, don't have time for more now. Basicall our choice is :

- lynch someone else scummy, which runs into the risk of drawing out another claim and put us in an uncomfortable situation
- lynch Seprix through the claim, but there's a slight chance that we lose a cop which, if he is one, is likely our strongest PR left.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #906 on: July 01, 2015, 06:01:17 am »

right may as well keep seprix alive. I believe the claim for now.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #907 on: July 01, 2015, 08:39:42 am »

unvote

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #908 on: July 01, 2015, 09:06:40 am »

Will be back later, don't have time for more now. Basicall our choice is :

- lynch someone else scummy, which runs into the risk of drawing out another claim and put us in an uncomfortable situation
- lynch Seprix through the claim, but there's a slight chance that we lose a cop which, if he is one, is likely our strongest PR left.
you think theres only a slight chance he's telling the truth?
unvote for now. Scum has every incentive to claim but Cop is powerful, might be worth lynching someone else.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #909 on: July 01, 2015, 09:10:12 am »

skip : scumslips arguments are not as strong as you think they are. "Scumslips" have come from town at least as often as the have from scum.
I know. And I promise I dont just run around looking for scumslips, though this game may give impressions otherwise. But instead of talking about the comparative merits of scumslip arguments in general, id much rather you explain to me how you believe adk's defense of it this time.
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Replacement
« Reply #910 on: July 01, 2015, 10:51:26 am »

Witherweaver has been replaced by hockeysemlan.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #911 on: July 01, 2015, 10:51:56 am »

Vote Count 2.5

Seprix (3): UmbrageOfSnow, mail-mi, pacovf
pacovf (2): hockeysemlan, A Drowned Kernel
A Drowned Kernel (2): skip wooznum, Seprix

Not Voting (3): Hydrad, Teproc, chairs

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 2 ends at Jul 4, 7 PM Forum Time.
« Last Edit: July 01, 2015, 10:53:52 am by silverspawn »
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #912 on: July 01, 2015, 11:01:33 am »

unvote I believe seprix.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #913 on: July 01, 2015, 12:28:29 pm »

I don't really believe Seprix.

He didn't understand how cop actually worked
Another option is that ADK could be a cop? If I'm not mistaken, they can find out roles, right?

Then again, he also didn't get why a townie could know for sure there was a non-1-shot strongman without it being a scumslip.

And with 50% of the remaining scum being godfathers, cop isn't as strong as it sometimes is.

Still, I think we should leave Seprix alive for today, the non-Godfather scum may feel pressure to take this decision off our hands, and if not Seprix can start creating a better not-Godfather pool.

Once the Godfather is dead, the strongman has to take him out or die by POE.  If Seprix lives past a certain point we can safely lynch fakeclaim!Seprix then, which is better than now.

Oh, I just said "strongman" was that a scumslip?  No.  No it was not.

Vote: Pacovf
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #914 on: July 01, 2015, 12:33:14 pm »

Also, come on Mail-mi, you can do better than that.

I really don't like Mail-mi's commitment to not even trying.  Like I just don't understand why you're even signing up for these games.  You're not even trying to be helpful here.

I get the impression only WW and I are interested in voting Mail-mi, and I want to get a lynch decision reached in the next couple of days before we get to the holiday weekend.  But can we  please, PLEASE not let Mail-mi get away with this crap for the whole rest of the game guys?  I mean what if we go to LYLO with Mail-mi.  If we let him coast that far the game is a coin flip.  He's just daring us to never lynch him because "scum wouldn't do that"  but I think scum absolutely would lurk and say "might as well just lynch me".  And I'm worried the town who make it to the endgame are just going to give him a pass.

I do not understand why a VT claim, a commitment to unhelpfulness, and "sure, go ahead and lynch me" should be worth towncred.  Do we give towncred for self-voting too?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #915 on: July 01, 2015, 12:34:38 pm »

Ah, the replacement has been announced..

Hi everyone! Trying to catch up the best I can, keep doing whatever it is your doing in the meantime. If you want to give me heads up about your thoughts on me /WW I appreciate it.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #916 on: July 01, 2015, 12:35:08 pm »

Also, come on Mail-mi, you can do better than that.

I really don't like Mail-mi's commitment to not even trying.  Like I just don't understand why you're even signing up for these games.  You're not even trying to be helpful here.

I get the impression only WW and I are interested in voting Mail-mi.

I'm down for lynching him now, and I'm not alone in that regard.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #917 on: July 01, 2015, 12:37:03 pm »

Ah, the replacement has been announced..

Hi everyone! Trying to catch up the best I can, keep doing whatever it is your doing in the meantime. If you want to give me heads up about your thoughts on me /WW I appreciate it.

That reminds me. Why did WW leave? If I'm asking an unethical question, sorry.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #918 on: July 01, 2015, 12:39:30 pm »

Seprix, if you really are a cop, please investigate one of our collective top lynch targets that we don't lynch today.  So if we lynch Pacovf, investigate Mail-m.  If we lynch Mail-mi, investigate Pacovf, etc.  Report results at the start of each day so we have them out there.

If you're really a cop we need you to investigate the targets most useful in process of elimination in the event we lynch the Godfather.  i.e. the mislynches we could most likely avoid, who are unlikely to be NK'd.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #919 on: July 01, 2015, 12:41:56 pm »

Seprix, if you really are a cop, please investigate one of our collective top lynch targets that we don't lynch today.  So if we lynch Pacovf, investigate Mail-m.  If we lynch Mail-mi, investigate Pacovf, etc.  Report results at the start of each day so we have them out there.

If you're really a cop we need you to investigate the targets most useful in process of elimination in the event we lynch the Godfather.  i.e. the mislynches we could most likely avoid, who are unlikely to be NK'd.

Assuming I don't die.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #920 on: July 01, 2015, 12:43:52 pm »

Ah, the replacement has been announced..

Hi everyone! Trying to catch up the best I can, keep doing whatever it is your doing in the meantime. If you want to give me heads up about your thoughts on me /WW I appreciate it.

Hi Hockey, welcome to the game.

I'm townreading your slot, but don't let that make you lazy please.  Why is that your first question though?

If you're really asking "am I in danger of being lynched right now" the answer is no.  We're lynching Mail-mi, Pacovf or mayyyybbe Seprix who just claimed cop or ADK who finally decided to step it up and play the game.

Mail-mi is a lurker lynch, but it's such a good lurker lynch.  Pacovf has really bad interactions with lynched scum!Awaclus, but on the other hand he's actually participating in the game.  That's roughly what today's decision is going to be at this point I think.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #921 on: July 01, 2015, 12:46:32 pm »

Assuming I don't die.

It's not a bad assumption to make.  There are plenty of good NK targets for scum and we might have a doctor.  And no offense, but if you are a real cop, you're more likely to be disbelieved and lynched through it than, for example, Hydrad.  And the Godfather has nothing to fear from you.

Play the game like you're going to see tomorrow.  The odds are reasonable that you will.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #922 on: July 01, 2015, 12:49:41 pm »

Assuming I don't die.

It's not a bad assumption to make.  There are plenty of good NK targets for scum and we might have a doctor.  And no offense, but if you are a real cop, you're more likely to be disbelieved and lynched through it than, for example, Hydrad.  And the Godfather has nothing to fear from you.

Play the game like you're going to see tomorrow.  The odds are reasonable that you will.

Got it. I'll scout out whoever we don't lynch who is in second place, then.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #923 on: July 01, 2015, 01:01:34 pm »

Will be back later, don't have time for more now. Basicall our choice is :

- lynch someone else scummy, which runs into the risk of drawing out another claim and put us in an uncomfortable situation
- lynch Seprix through the claim, but there's a slight chance that we lose a cop which, if he is one, is likely our strongest PR left.
you think theres only a slight chance he's telling the truth?
unvote for now. Scum has every incentive to claim but Cop is powerful, might be worth lynching someone else.


I would expect scum!Seprix to claim here, and Cop is probably the best fakeclaim for scum ? It's either that or a 1-Shot, but Cop works even better, because there's upside for us not to lynch him even if we don't fully believe him, as evidenced by, well, my position here. chairs is also an interesting choice, as it's someone who would have been an understandable cop target given that many suspected him at the end of day 1, but it's suspected much now, so it's not like he's actually removing anyone from the lynch pool. The more I think about it, the more this claim seems too neat to be true actually.

Yeah, way too neat. My argument for not lynching him was that a Cop is a real problem for scum here, because if he lives they're going to get PoEd to death, especially if we manage to lynch the Godfather. But the more I think about it, the more this looks like a fakeclaim to me, especially considering the confusion about Cop/Rolecop earlier.

vote: Seprix

@UoS, re : mail-mi. Don't lynch anti-town, lynch scum. I'm not particularly convinced mail-mi is town, but there are other people I find much scummier.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #924 on: July 01, 2015, 01:01:59 pm »

Ugh. Quoting is hard guys. Hopefully you get the gist of it.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #925 on: July 01, 2015, 01:02:06 pm »

So Seprix, why did you investigate chairs?


vote: Seprix, the things you are saying are just way too weird. L-1?
this was a bad vote. Seprix says weird things. Deal with it.

"Weird" is a shorthand because it was very late for me. He reads a) panicked and b) overplaying setup confusion in those posts. I don't see a reason why he would be panicking there. Moreover, the "I don't know how cop works" thing is completely artificial. Yes, now he could say that he was reverse-soft-claiming cop, but still, it's bad.

A posteriori, I don't like how he offered to claim before anyone announced intent to hammer.


You mentioned that you wanted to reread D2 too. Is that going to happen? You haven't addressed the case on you either (mainly how consistently you've been deflecting away from Awaclus all D1).

Also, come on Mail-mi, you can do better than that. [...]
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Well, after he said that he was a VT (when nobody was even asking!), and fine with getting lynched, that means we will have to lynch him at some point, because that's just a very easy way out for scum. We just don't have to lynch him today, though

Wuh? ...ok.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #926 on: July 01, 2015, 01:02:26 pm »

Hey, I agree, quoting is hard!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #927 on: July 01, 2015, 01:03:19 pm »

Ah, the replacement has been announced..

Hi everyone! Trying to catch up the best I can, keep doing whatever it is your doing in the meantime. If you want to give me heads up about your thoughts on me /WW I appreciate it.

I used to think you were scum. Now I don't, and basically everyone thinks you're town because you were at a decisive place on the Awaclus wagon.

Have you not followed the game at all ? That would be an interesting perspective.

PPE : 2
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #928 on: July 01, 2015, 01:04:38 pm »

I realize now my vote probably didn't count, so : vote: Seprix
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #929 on: July 01, 2015, 01:08:27 pm »

Ah, the replacement has been announced..

Hi everyone! Trying to catch up the best I can, keep doing whatever it is your doing in the meantime. If you want to give me heads up about your thoughts on me /WW I appreciate it.

Hi Hockey, welcome to the game.

I'm townreading your slot, but don't let that make you lazy please.  Why is that your first question though?

If you're really asking "am I in danger of being lynched right now" the answer is no.  We're lynching Mail-mi, Pacovf or mayyyybbe Seprix who just claimed cop or ADK who finally decided to step it up and play the game.


Good. Yeah, I wanted to know If I needed to defend myself soon (only saw the D1 wagon so far). I will try not to be lazy, but I don't want to stress my readthrough if I can avoid it. If I'm townie right now I take my time tonight, and contribute as soon as I can later on :)
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #930 on: July 01, 2015, 01:09:13 pm »

That reminds me. Why did WW leave? If I'm asking an unethical question, sorry.

He did not say.

I realize now my vote probably didn't count

Yes, votes in quotes don't count. This one counts of course.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #931 on: July 01, 2015, 01:16:32 pm »

vote: mail-mi.

I'm okay with this.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #932 on: July 01, 2015, 01:34:35 pm »

Also, come on Mail-mi, you can do better than that.

I really don't like Mail-mi's commitment to not even trying.  Like I just don't understand why you're even signing up for these games.  You're not even trying to be helpful here.

I get the impression only WW and I are interested in voting Mail-mi, and I want to get a lynch decision reached in the next couple of days before we get to the holiday weekend.  But can we  please, PLEASE not let Mail-mi get away with this crap for the whole rest of the game guys?  I mean what if we go to LYLO with Mail-mi.  If we let him coast that far the game is a coin flip.  He's just daring us to never lynch him because "scum wouldn't do that"  but I think scum absolutely would lurk and say "might as well just lynch me".  And I'm worried the town who make it to the endgame are just going to give him a pass.

I do not understand why a VT claim, a commitment to unhelpfulness, and "sure, go ahead and lynch me" should be worth towncred.  Do we give towncred for self-voting too?

I did it because I don't have time to do anything with this game, and don't know when I will. And I want others to enjoy this game without me weighing it down, when I don't have time to put in the effort this game deserves. I certainly won't until after I get back from my vacation next week.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #933 on: July 01, 2015, 01:44:29 pm »

@UoS, re : mail-mi. Don't lynch anti-town, lynch scum. I'm not particularly convinced mail-mi is town, but there are other people I find much scummier.

I'm not interested in lynching Mail-mi only because he's anti-town.  But I really don't like our odds if we bring him to LYLO, regardless of his alignment.  You will note that my vote is currently on Pacovf though.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #934 on: July 01, 2015, 01:58:46 pm »

I don't really believe Seprix.

He didn't understand how cop actually worked
Another option is that ADK could be a cop? If I'm not mistaken, they can find out roles, right?

Then again, he also didn't get why a townie could know for sure there was a non-1-shot strongman without it being a scumslip.

And with 50% of the remaining scum being godfathers, cop isn't as strong as it sometimes is.

Still, I think we should leave Seprix alive for today, the non-Godfather scum may feel pressure to take this decision off our hands, and if not Seprix can start creating a better not-Godfather pool.

Once the Godfather is dead, the strongman has to take him out or die by POE.  If Seprix lives past a certain point we can safely lynch fakeclaim!Seprix then, which is better than now.

Oh, I just said "strongman" was that a scumslip?  No.  No it was not.

Vote: Pacovf
ok, so about that rolecop confusion, yeah, maybe he thought if he investigated scum he would get a result of guilty that also included the role. Is that so crazy?

And no when you said 'strongman' it wasn't a scumslip because you meant 'some kind of strongman' and that was a correct usage in your situation. In adk's situation that couldn't have been what it meant. It meant 'full strongman'. Scumslip.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #935 on: July 01, 2015, 02:01:01 pm »

Assuming I don't die.

It's not a bad assumption to make.  There are plenty of good NK targets for scum and we might have a doctor.  And no offense, but if you are a real cop, you're more likely to be disbelieved and lynched through it than, for example, Hydrad.  And the Godfather has nothing to fear from you.

Play the game like you're going to see tomorrow.  The odds are reasonable that you will.

Got it. I'll scout out whoever we don't lynch who is in second place, then.
dont announce whom you're investigating
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #936 on: July 01, 2015, 02:02:48 pm »

And no when you said 'strongman' it wasn't a scumslip because you meant 'some kind of strongman' and that was a correct usage in your situation. In adk's situation that couldn't have been what it meant. It meant 'full strongman'. Scumslip.

It is so crazy.  Because he already had a result on chairs!  And because cop never works like that.

And ADK didn't say that.  And you've pointed out yourself how a town player could know that we had a full strongman even if that is really what he meant.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #937 on: July 01, 2015, 02:03:51 pm »

Also, come on Mail-mi, you can do better than that.

I really don't like Mail-mi's commitment to not even trying.  Like I just don't understand why you're even signing up for these games.  You're not even trying to be helpful here.

I get the impression only WW and I are interested in voting Mail-mi, and I want to get a lynch decision reached in the next couple of days before we get to the holiday weekend.  But can we  please, PLEASE not let Mail-mi get away with this crap for the whole rest of the game guys?  I mean what if we go to LYLO with Mail-mi.  If we let him coast that far the game is a coin flip.  He's just daring us to never lynch him because "scum wouldn't do that"  but I think scum absolutely would lurk and say "might as well just lynch me".  And I'm worried the town who make it to the endgame are just going to give him a pass.

I do not understand why a VT claim, a commitment to unhelpfulness, and "sure, go ahead and lynch me" should be worth towncred.  Do we give towncred for self-voting too?
I see what you're saying. Id just rather lynch adk. And based on pavovf and adk each finding the other extremely scummy, I think it's less likely they're a team. So I'd currently have mail-mi as my seccond lynch option
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #938 on: July 01, 2015, 02:04:54 pm »


ok, so about that rolecop confusion, yeah, maybe he thought if he investigated scum he would get a result of guilty that also included the role. Is that so crazy?[/quote]

It is, because he supposedly got a result on chairs, and that result said "Town" (or something to that effect), which is very clearly not chairs's role, just his alignement.

PPE : 2
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #939 on: July 01, 2015, 02:05:08 pm »

I'm blaming it all on the heat.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #940 on: July 01, 2015, 02:11:44 pm »

You mentioned that you wanted to reread D2 too. Is that going to happen? You haven't addressed the case on you either (mainly how consistently you've been deflecting away from Awaclus all D1).

I'll try to get it to it, and if the case on me is that I've been lurking and deflected from Awaclus than on the first point I apologize and am trying to fix it, and on the second point, if I was deflecting from awaclus than it wasn't intentional. I was okay with an Awaclus lynch but had a lynch that I liked better (which I now don't like at all). I also didn't push against the Awaclus lynch nearly as hard as you did, which is why you're my preferred lynch.

I'd like to lynch pacovf. I could lynch mail-mi. I'm not lynching hockey.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #941 on: July 01, 2015, 02:15:26 pm »

I could lynch pacovf.

vote: pacovf.

I'd kind of like to get the lynch in today because (as will continue for the foreseeable future) I'll be out of town this weekend.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #942 on: July 01, 2015, 02:19:50 pm »

I was going to suggest we push for a lynch by tomorrow, but I'm happy lynching one of Mail-mi or Pacovf today.  How long are you going to be online today chairs?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #943 on: July 01, 2015, 02:20:49 pm »

And no when you said 'strongman' it wasn't a scumslip because you meant 'some kind of strongman' and that was a correct usage in your situation. In adk's situation that couldn't have been what it meant. It meant 'full strongman'. Scumslip.

It is so crazy.  Because he already had a result on chairs!  And because cop never works like that.

And ADK didn't say that.  And you've pointed out yourself how a town player could know that we had a full strongman even if that is really what he meant.
he had a town result on chairs. He may still not know what a scum result looks like.

I will explain the scumslip for probably the last time before I give up: I said that a cop or a vig or a mason knows there's a full strongman. Note that this was after UoS pointed out there was some kind of strongman. Adk described MY post as pointing out there was a strongman. Now he says he meant that I pointed out there was some kind of strongman. I dont believe thats what he meant because I DIDN'T POINT THAT OUT. so what he meant was that I pointed out there was a strongman. Which I didnt, but if he were a strongman he may make that slip. Now UoS points out that if he is said cop, vig, or mason, he'd have that information too. I realized that and therefore contemplated not pointing it out. But then I decided that thats a slip thats much less likely because if he's a pr he had to figure out himself that there's a strongman and is more sensitive to the fact that nobody else knows that. But if he was given the information in the beginning pf the game, I think thats an easier slip.

PPE: @teproc, I can see seprix assuming 'town' means 'vt', but yeah maybe
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #944 on: July 01, 2015, 02:21:27 pm »

Pacovf is at L-2 by the way, so let's not be too hasty with voting and not reading PPEs people.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #945 on: July 01, 2015, 02:24:55 pm »

I also didn't push against the Awaclus lynch nearly as hard as you did

Very debatable.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #946 on: July 01, 2015, 02:32:25 pm »

Also, adk told seprix to claim and then immediately said "oh yeah, don't know why I did that."  Nobody cares about that
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #947 on: July 01, 2015, 02:33:32 pm »

Also, adk told seprix to claim and then immediately said "oh yeah, don't know why I did that."  Nobody cares about that
supposed to be a question mark at the end of that
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #948 on: July 01, 2015, 02:43:12 pm »

Hehe, skip on ADK reminds me of myself on mail-mi in D1.

For what it's worth, I would be quite happy with an ADK lynch too.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #949 on: July 01, 2015, 02:48:40 pm »

Hehe, skip on ADK reminds me of myself on mail-mi in D1.

For what it's worth, I would be quite happy with an ADK lynch too.

So you're thinking that Skip is going to look bad for trying to deflect us onto ADK when we lynch you and you flip scum?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #950 on: July 01, 2015, 02:53:25 pm »

No, I just sympathize with his frustration.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #951 on: July 01, 2015, 03:01:42 pm »

For what it's worth, my thoughts after a quick readthrough: (great with the summarizes from pac and adk , made it easier to get somewhat of a picture)

I found ADK pretty scummy, especially around Seprix claim, seemed somewhat pushy.

I don't really get (or find) the case against pac. Could someone explain it to me?

And as I understand it we might have to lynch mail-mi and I guess I rather do it today than later on, so if you want a quick vote from me it's going to be on him..

 
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #952 on: July 01, 2015, 03:15:30 pm »

For what it's worth, my thoughts after a quick readthrough: (great with the summarizes from pac and adk , made it easier to get somewhat of a picture)

I found ADK pretty scummy, especially around Seprix claim, seemed somewhat pushy.

I don't really get (or find) the case against pac. Could someone explain it to me?

And as I understand it we might have to lynch mail-mi and I guess I rather do it today than later on, so if you want a quick vote from me it's going to be on him..

I feel like I mentioned it my megapost. When Awaclus was getting lynched, he had a number of posts where he arguing against, with the rather weak argument that a lurker lynch wouldn't give us much information.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #953 on: July 01, 2015, 03:17:41 pm »

For what it's worth, my thoughts after a quick readthrough: (great with the summarizes from pac and adk , made it easier to get somewhat of a picture)

I found ADK pretty scummy, especially around Seprix claim, seemed somewhat pushy.

I don't really get (or find) the case against pac. Could someone explain it to me?

And as I understand it we might have to lynch mail-mi and I guess I rather do it today than later on, so if you want a quick vote from me it's going to be on him..

I feel like I mentioned it my megapost. When Awaclus was getting lynched, he had a number of posts where he arguing against, with the rather weak argument that a lurker lynch wouldn't give us much information.
not to mention offering to lynch him on day 2, which I still don't understand why pure lurker lynches are better later, if that's what pacovf claims he meant. Pacovf can you explain that?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #954 on: July 01, 2015, 03:42:57 pm »

It's not that they are better later, it's that they are less worse. If you do a pure lurker lynch D1 and the flip is town, then you are just as uninformed during D2 as during D1, which means that the next lynch will be similarly random. However, if you do a pure lurker lynch, say, D2, and he flips town, then you start D3 with the information from the D1 lynch, which is infinitely better than no information at all.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #955 on: July 01, 2015, 03:51:17 pm »

Also to factor in is Awaclus voting for Chairs. Could Awaclus have voted for his scum buddy in a last ditch effort to throw everyone off after he died?

Seprix first reference to chairs today. Someone try to convince me this comes from cop!seprix with town result on chairs.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #956 on: July 01, 2015, 03:56:03 pm »

It's not that they are better later, it's that they are less worse. If you do a pure lurker lynch D1 and the flip is town, then you are just as uninformed during D2 as during D1, which means that the next lynch will be similarly random. However, if you do a pure lurker lynch, say, D2, and he flips town, then you start D3 with the information from the D1 lynch, which is infinitely better than no information at all.

We've been over this before, but for Hockey's benefit: Awaclus wasn't a random lurker lynch at the time, and your vote was on Mail-mi with whom there were basically no interactions from anyone.  Awaclus at least had interactions even before your workday.

Pacovf was unable to follow the game closely while at work, and wanted more time before we lynched Awaclus so he could make sure everyone was accountable for their votes.  But in a rush, instead of asking for more time like a worried, unable-to-follow-the-game townie, he panicked and made a weak-sauce defense of Awaclus on the basis of lurker lynches being bad despite Pacovf's current vote on Mail-mi and the fact that Awaclus had been being super scummy in response to pressure, which Pacovf apparently hadn't caught, despite having caught enough to know Awaclus was inevitably getting lynched at that point.

It looks much more like a panicked, not-enough-time scum partner reaction than a panicked-wants-to-hold-people-accountable town reaction.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #957 on: July 01, 2015, 03:57:57 pm »

And pacovf's answer to that is he didn't consider mail-mi to be a lurker lynch as he had a genuine case against him.

And my (and others) answer to that is that there also was a real case against Awaclus.

This is simplified of course.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #958 on: July 01, 2015, 03:58:20 pm »

Also to factor in is Awaclus voting for Chairs. Could Awaclus have voted for his scum buddy in a last ditch effort to throw everyone off after he died?

Seprix first reference to chairs today. Someone try to convince me this comes from cop!seprix with town result on chairs.
wow, yeah. Would voting seprix now be the hammer?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #959 on: July 01, 2015, 03:59:40 pm »

Also to factor in is Awaclus voting for Chairs. Could Awaclus have voted for his scum buddy in a last ditch effort to throw everyone off after he died?

Seprix first reference to chairs today. Someone try to convince me this comes from cop!seprix with town result on chairs.

This is what I was going to check out next, thanks for sparing me the time. That's pretty damning.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #960 on: July 01, 2015, 04:00:10 pm »

And pacovf's answer to that is he didn't consider mail-mi to be a lurker lynch as he had a genuine case against him.

And my (and others) answer to that is that there also was a real case against Awaclus.

This is simplified of course.

Thanks.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #961 on: July 01, 2015, 04:02:44 pm »

Also to factor in is Awaclus voting for Chairs. Could Awaclus have voted for his scum buddy in a last ditch effort to throw everyone off after he died?

Seprix first reference to chairs today. Someone try to convince me this comes from cop!seprix with town result on chairs.
wow, yeah. Would voting seprix now be the hammer?

Only Teproc and I are voting for Seprix at the moment.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #962 on: July 01, 2015, 04:03:33 pm »

vote: seprix
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #963 on: July 01, 2015, 04:04:27 pm »

vote: Seprix that's pretty ridiculous.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #964 on: July 01, 2015, 04:09:53 pm »

Analyzing the wagon come D1 end, and given Seprix's Law of Mafia Average (One/Two scum tends to jump on wagon, The rest stay off wagon), I think I can come to this conclusion:

One scum is in this list: [Crossed players not scum]

Hydrad, Witherweaver, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc, chairs, Seprix, A Drowned Kernel

One scum is in the other list:

Mail-Mi, Pacovf, Skip Wooznum

Also to factor in is Awaclus voting for Chairs. Could Awaclus have voted for his scum buddy in a last ditch effort to throw everyone off after he died?

Wait, I found this gem over here.

1) town!Awaclus gets very indignant when he has a wagon on him, and continually talks about how not scum he's been acting.

This is true. Usually when I'm town, I have like 29384723984723 town tells that everyone is either not noticing or choosing to ignore on purpose, which is why I have to point them out. In this game, I haven't posted much because a lot of stuff has been going on IRL and other games, and that's why there aren't that many things that I can point out. The only notable thing is that I don't lurk as scum, but there's the problem that I don't usually lurk as town either.

This could easily be scum!WW defending Awaclus there. So if that's the case, we have WW/Awaclus/???. This is nice because I think everyone else bar maybe Chairs (and that's a maybe) is pretty much Town on the wagon.

We have mail-Mi, Pacovf and Skip. Skip seems townie, because he's quite overeager, which is typical for newer players. Pacovf has been strong town thus far.

Looks like a WW/Awaclus/Mail-Mi scum team so far.

Just acknowledge that I'm a virtual IC so we can move on from there.

I will not, because people can't just declare themselves innocent and expect everyone else to follow the Pied Piper without a reason.

I shoved all-in on Awaclus repeatedly and hard. Do you really think I'd do that as scum D1?

It's not likely, but there are these arguments to be made:

1. Scum could anticipate this line of thinking. But wait, Seprix. Why would chairs lynch Awaclus if they were scumbuddies? That makes no sense! Well, that leads to my next point.

2. Chairs could not back out of his read because it got too hot and he knew exactly what would entail if he backed out before the near inevitable lynch. Scum votes for scum sometimes to mix it up, I propose that is what you could have done. And then the wagon started hard, and then boom, you had a problem on your hands.

But all of this is theoretical and not too likely. So yes, I would consider you town.

These are all posts where Seprix talks about chairs during D2, before his claim. This is completely ridiculous.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #965 on: July 01, 2015, 04:14:19 pm »

Okay, so there is a godfather in this setup, so Seprix would have reason not to automatically believe his result... but his posts following his claim indicated that he wasn't paying much attention to the setup? But he was considering result-tampering roles as existing?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #966 on: July 01, 2015, 04:19:13 pm »

Okay, so there is a godfather in this setup, so Seprix would have reason not to automatically believe his result... but his posts following his claim indicated that he wasn't paying much attention to the setup? But he was considering result-tampering roles as existing?

Thanks Pacovf.

Uh, wow.  Yeah so Seprix, the cop who doesn't understand what cop results look like and doesn't seem to realize we had a Godfather also comes up with scenarios for his claimed innocent result to be scum.  That's like an anti-breadcrumb.  Um, yeah.  I wasn't sold on his claim before, but that makes the chances like 0%.

Vote: Seprix

Lynching scum is better than lynching maybe-scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #967 on: July 01, 2015, 04:22:48 pm »

And that's L-1.  Again.

Could we get an official vote count please
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #968 on: July 01, 2015, 04:37:08 pm »

vote: Seprix because I like hammering and because that is an awfully damning report.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #969 on: July 01, 2015, 05:36:20 pm »

Thread locked!

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #970 on: July 01, 2015, 05:37:37 pm »

Day 2 Final Vote Count

Seprix (6): pacovf, Teproc, skip wooznum, A Drowned Kernel, UmbrageOfSnow, chairs
A Drowned Kernel (1): Seprix

Not Voting (3): Hydrad, hockeysemlan, mail-mi

With 10 alive, it took 6 to lynch.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #971 on: July 01, 2015, 05:48:46 pm »

On an idyllic patch of green not far off the Ponyvillean Town Hall, a fairly large group of friends stood together, happily absorbed in seemingly relentless arguments. Not far off, Twilight was unhappily absorbed in a dusty book about formal logical systems, an occasional sigh interrupting her lecture. The game had slowed down substantially after her lynch a week ago, and she found herself asking herself not for the first time whether or not she should even still join them. Even Applejack, although technically required to attend every meeting, had been largely absent, and Twilight would probably get more stuff done in the library.

"Kind of depressing, huh?"

Twilight looked up. "Yeah..." She sighed - that might sound strange because it's a repetition, but it happened, so it has to be said.

"What're you reading?" Colgate asked, hesitantly sitting down beside her.

"A book on the usage of formal logical systems." She raised the cover. "Probably not your main area."

"No... I know a little bit about it, though."

A pause.

"They're really getting into this, aren't they?"

"Oh, yeah." Colgate chuckled. "Yes, they are. Especially Rainbow. She's taken up somewhat of a leading role... didn't expect so much level headed input from her, to be honest."

"But you don't interact with the game anymore, do you? You're dead, you aren't allowed to."

"Nono, I just watch. I only talked a little bit to Applejack, and now to you." Another pause. "Twilight, uh... can I ask you something?"

"Sure."

"How come you got into a relationship with... you know, both of your pegasus friends?"

Twilight giggled. A smile crept onto her face at the mere mention of the subject. "Well... Rainbow asked me out first. Fluttershy made her, actually. Apparently she flat out told Rainbow that she had a thing for me which she wasn't aware of, and... I guess she was right. It didn't take long for me to return her affection... I guess I've just been that lucky. Or lonely. One of the two.

"Mh... and Fluttershy... that happened much more gradually. I was working with her on a pretty big project, and saw her everyday, and I just... bean to be uneasy around her, nervous, excited. I told Rainbow everything about it, and that it didn't take away from what I felt for her, and she told me to ask Fluttershy out, so I did."

"But they two aren't...?"

"Oh no, they aren't. But they've known each other forever... I guess that's why they're both fine with... well, sharing me." Twilight shook her head, her gaze still fixated at the colorful display of chaosful lynching and murdering, but she didn't even really see it. "You know, sometimes... sometimes, I... I think I'm just so stupidly lucky for... everything. I didn't... deserve them. Or, at least I didn't earn them. It just... happened. With both of them. And not just them, but the other girls, too. It used to be so different, when I was living alone in Canterlot and worked all day without ever receiving recognition. I just... hope it doesn't turn around again, one day. I've been so much happier since I live here that my past life barely feels like... part of my life anymore. It feels more like something which has been told to me, and I know I lived it, but only because I keep telling myself I did."

"Mh... well." Colgate smirked. "For what it's worth, I think they're both pretty cute."

Twilight giggled.

BANG.

"Oh hey, looks like they finally agreed on a lynch."

"What? What relevance?"

"Huh?"






Seprix has been lynched. He was Applebloom playing as Discord, the Mafia Godfather.

Night 2 will last until July 3, 6 pm Forum Time. Don't forget to confirm in your QT during the night.
« Last Edit: July 01, 2015, 05:52:16 pm by silverspawn »
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 2)
« Reply #972 on: July 03, 2015, 06:32:06 pm »

"Rainbow! Yo, Rainbow Dash!"

A rainbow colored mane peaked up behind a white cloud hovering in a random spot above town.

"What? I was napping."

"Sugar, you're always nappin'. I dun rightly have the time to wait out whenever I wanna talk to ya."

"Heh. Good point." FWOOSH. A rainbow colored blur drew itself from the cloud to the ground below. "What's up?"

"I..."

"Did ya see how I was smashing the game yesterday? Oh, you hear it. Totally owned that chaos scum. Hah. Who does Applebloom think she is, anyway?"

Applejack cleared her throat, but Rainbow overheard it.

"Totally ownin' that game, I tell ya. Chaos hunting is my middle name. Yup. Rainbow Professionalism Chaos Hunting Danger Dash. If Twilight ever makes another one of these, there's gotta be more chaos playing, otherwise it's not even a challenge. Hah. Well, unless I'm chaos next time, then I'd probably not even need any team mates. Eh, I mean it wasn't like AB was doing a good job, either. What was she thinking just claiming police pony out of nowhere? As if she could ever be that. Hah! Can ya imagine AB as a police pony? Ohh, that's rich!"

Applejack's eyes were shooting daggers towards Rainbow, at this point, who finally seemed to realize whom she was talking to.

"Ahem. Right. Heh. Just got carried away, I guess. Well, being awesome is a mighty bit of work. No time to be considerate. Uhh, anyway, did ya wanna to tell me something?"



























« Last Edit: July 03, 2015, 06:39:50 pm by silverspawn »
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 2)
« Reply #973 on: July 03, 2015, 06:33:57 pm »

UmbrageOfSnow has died in the night. He was Rainbow Dash playing as Liara, a Vanilla Townie.

Day 3 begins!

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 2)
« Reply #974 on: July 03, 2015, 06:38:02 pm »

I will have to reread the flavour at some point to see if it is actually a novelization of player behaviour, or just random fanfic.

Anyway, let's flawless this. Vote: ADK.

Honourable mentions: mail-mi, skip.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #975 on: July 03, 2015, 07:12:53 pm »

Seprix confused mail-mi and hydrad at the start of day 1, when he forgot he was voting for mail-mi and thought he was voting for hydrad. I don't think mail-mi is the third partner. Pacovf was probably the main pusher of the seprix lynch iirc. That leaves adk. vote: adk
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #976 on: July 03, 2015, 07:17:35 pm »

I think that's actually a very good point.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #977 on: July 03, 2015, 07:52:47 pm »

ok sure vote: adk

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #978 on: July 04, 2015, 05:10:34 am »

You got this.

I'll be a good boy and sheep whatever you want:

vote: adk
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #979 on: July 04, 2015, 05:58:25 am »

hmm I guess that makes sense.

but we should probably let ADK say something before this goes.

that might be L-1 already
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #980 on: July 04, 2015, 06:49:23 am »

Vote Count 3.1

A Drowned Kernel (4):  pacovf, skip wooznum, chairs, hockeysemlan {L-1}
   
Not Voting (4): Teproc, Hydrad, A Drowned Kernel, mail-mi

With 8 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. Day 3 ends at Jul 11, 6 PM Forum Time.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #981 on: July 04, 2015, 11:05:27 am »

Seprix confused mail-mi and hydrad at the start of day 1, when he forgot he was voting for mail-mi and thought he was voting for hydrad. I don't think mail-mi is the third partner. Pacovf was probably the main pusher of the seprix lynch iirc. That leaves adk. vote: adk

Actually pacovf was pushing me over seprix. But I agree that it's most likely ADK.
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pacovf

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #982 on: July 04, 2015, 11:19:33 am »

Woot? I wasn't pushing you at all, yesterday.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #983 on: July 04, 2015, 12:27:56 pm »

Woot? I wasn't pushing you at all, yesterday.
Woops. Got seprix mixed up with Awaclus.
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A Drowned Kernel

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #984 on: July 04, 2015, 05:32:21 pm »

Only on briefly, but claim time-

I was originally assigned as a VT but halfway through day two silverspawn informed that there had been a mix up and that I was now a Doctor. I have no idea what that's about but I protected Hydrad last night.

We should lynch mail-mi. vote: mail-mi
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pacovf

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #985 on: July 04, 2015, 05:36:27 pm »

That must be the most ridiculous claim I have ever read.

Why should we lynch mail-mi?
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Hydrad

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #986 on: July 04, 2015, 05:58:30 pm »

Its to the point of being so ridiculous would scum even be able to fakeclaim that?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #987 on: July 04, 2015, 06:13:21 pm »

Only on briefly, but claim time-

I was originally assigned as a VT but halfway through day two silverspawn informed that there had been a mix up and that I was now a Doctor. I have no idea what that's about but I protected Hydrad last night.

We should lynch mail-mi. vote: mail-mi

0_o?!?!

Okay...

Well I'm never on wagon because both times theres been a rush to the lynch while I'm gone.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #988 on: July 04, 2015, 06:22:46 pm »

Bwaha.

No. Lynch ADK. Seems extremely solide.

Scum is autolosing this. He just want to avoid an flawless-loss. He try anything..
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #989 on: July 04, 2015, 06:45:44 pm »

Its to the point of being so ridiculous would scum even be able to fakeclaim that?

He's counting on us thinking this. A hopeless endeavour, but then again, he doesn't really have any other choice.

To be fair scum has been really unlucky this game.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #990 on: July 04, 2015, 10:18:22 pm »

Only on briefly, but claim time-

I was originally assigned as a VT but halfway through day two silverspawn informed that there had been a mix up and that I was now a Doctor. I have no idea what that's about but I protected Hydrad last night.

We should lynch mail-mi. vote: mail-mi
why wouldn't you protect UoS (except for that you shot him)?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 2)
« Reply #991 on: July 04, 2015, 11:58:07 pm »

I will have to reread the flavour at some point to see if it is actually a novelization of player behaviour, or just random fanfic.
oh, it isn't random, lyra. That reminds me, adk, you should flavor claim
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #992 on: July 05, 2015, 08:19:16 am »

Weird claims are town claims. I don't want t lynch ADK right now. Not sure who though.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #993 on: July 05, 2015, 02:01:42 pm »

It's not such a great argument when ADK knows it and he's with his back to the wall.

But if you have a case on someone else, I am ready to listen.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #994 on: July 05, 2015, 02:43:49 pm »

Im not the best at this, but is there any way to counter this except on the chance that no T's were rolled and every PR claims?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #995 on: July 05, 2015, 02:47:42 pm »

There is no (reasonable) way to counterclaim this, because we don't know what sort of strongman scum has.

And well, the chance that no Ts were rolled and we have a massclaim, yes.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #996 on: July 05, 2015, 02:48:49 pm »

Im not the best at this, but is there any way to counter this except on the chance that no T's were rolled and every PR claims?

Yea, would it be time to some kind mass-claim, right now?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #997 on: July 05, 2015, 03:03:38 pm »

Well actually full doctor+any non doctor PR would counter it, I think.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #998 on: July 05, 2015, 03:05:09 pm »

No. Odds are very high that we aren't going to learn anything from it. The only advantage would be forcing the last scum to choose right now whether he wants to fakeclaim or not.

But huh the last scum is ADK and he has already chosen, so...

Well actually full doctor+any non doctor PR would counter it, I think.

I don't think so. How?
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skip wooznum

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #999 on: July 05, 2015, 03:06:13 pm »

Sorry. Full doctor+any PR other than one-shot cop and one-shot doctor would counter
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1000 on: July 05, 2015, 03:09:21 pm »

Massclaiming is a bad idea.

I don't know pacovf. I just don't feel great about the ADK lynch, I'm leaning mail-mi but really just by PoE at this point. Haven't had time to reread and frankly don't feel a great motivation to do so again (thought they'd probably be targeted rereads). I (and everyone) need to look at Seprix's interactions with people in general, to see if that points somewhere, or away from somewhere. I'm really not motivated to do it tonight, but I'll probably do it tomorow.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1001 on: July 05, 2015, 03:14:55 pm »

BY the way, wouldn't ADK being a PR explain is "scumslip" ? I remember thinking that at some point, but can't remember and am too lazy/tired to figure it out. Will at some point, but if someone else does that's cool too.
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skip wooznum

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #1002 on: July 05, 2015, 03:17:05 pm »

PPE: I'm not intending to hammer right now, but go for it. Also I'm going to bed for real now.
this makes a lot more sense if adk is on a team with seprix and they discussed fakeclaims the night before and he lost himself and encouraged seprix to claim. I don't see town!adk saying something like this
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1003 on: July 05, 2015, 03:20:03 pm »

BY the way, wouldn't ADK being a PR explain is "scumslip" ? I remember thinking that at some point, but can't remember and am too lazy/tired to figure it out. Will at some point, but if someone else does that's cool too.
him being a cop, vig, mason, or one-shot RB would explain his scumslip. Him being a doctor does not. Also any two of those roles, or masons and anything, will counter.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1004 on: July 05, 2015, 04:51:21 pm »

I don't believe adk and am willing to hammer.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #1005 on: July 05, 2015, 06:23:46 pm »

Analyzing the wagon come D1 end, and given Seprix's Law of Mafia Average (One/Two scum tends to jump on wagon, The rest stay off wagon), I think I can come to this conclusion:

One scum is in this list: [Crossed players not scum]

Hydrad, Witherweaver, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc, chairs, Seprix, A Drowned Kernel

One scum is in the other list:

Mail-Mi, Pacovf, Skip Wooznum

Also to factor in is Awaclus voting for Chairs. Could Awaclus have voted for his scum buddy in a last ditch effort to throw everyone off after he died?

Wait, I found this gem over here.

1) town!Awaclus gets very indignant when he has a wagon on him, and continually talks about how not scum he's been acting.

This is true. Usually when I'm town, I have like 29384723984723 town tells that everyone is either not noticing or choosing to ignore on purpose, which is why I have to point them out. In this game, I haven't posted much because a lot of stuff has been going on IRL and other games, and that's why there aren't that many things that I can point out. The only notable thing is that I don't lurk as scum, but there's the problem that I don't usually lurk as town either.

This could easily be scum!WW defending Awaclus there. So if that's the case, we have WW/Awaclus/???. This is nice because I think everyone else bar maybe Chairs (and that's a maybe) is pretty much Town on the wagon.

We have mail-Mi, Pacovf and Skip. Skip seems townie, because he's quite overeager, which is typical for newer players. Pacovf has been strong town thus far.

Looks like a WW/Awaclus/Mail-Mi scum team so far.
in the bolded part, he says everyone on the wagon except maybe chairs and ww are town. Thats UoS, Teproc, hydrad, himself, and adk.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1006 on: July 05, 2015, 08:06:00 pm »

So who are we lynching? Still ADK?

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1007 on: July 05, 2015, 10:05:14 pm »

Massclaiming is a bad idea.

I don't know pacovf. I just don't feel great about the ADK lynch, I'm leaning mail-mi but really just by PoE at this point. Haven't had time to reread and frankly don't feel a great motivation to do so again (thought they'd probably be targeted rereads). I (and everyone) need to look at Seprix's interactions with people in general, to see if that points somewhere, or away from somewhere. I'm really not motivated to do it tonight, but I'll probably do it tomorow.

I would reread, but there is no real argument against lynching ADK other than you not feeling all that great about it. I might reconsider rereading if you find something interesting or if ADK does a nice defense of himself / case on someone else. But before the reread, the only people I would consider lynching are mail-mi and skip, and skip found a (IMHO) very good argument for mail-mi's innocence, which in turn makes you wonder why he would bother eliminating an easy mislynch if he is scum...

So I don't see who else could be the last scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1008 on: July 05, 2015, 10:44:29 pm »

Can anyone state the case against me? As far as I can tell it's that I was lurking for awhile, which I admit happened and I apologize for. mail-mi has been lurking harder, and as he points out was off-wagon twice. My claim is the truth, which is all I have.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1009 on: July 05, 2015, 10:48:54 pm »

Also I received a message from silverspawn that implies that the change was due to the fact that the setup was originally incorrect, which I guess means that he gave scum the regular strongman when they were supposed to get the 1-shot and had to add an extra role. I'm not sure how I feel about the mod doing this kind of thing but I guess it's silverspawn's prerogative.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1010 on: July 05, 2015, 10:51:45 pm »

I don't really know how to feel about this claim. I don't picture silverspawn making this change at this stage of the game, but it's also a bizarre claim. It's also not testable because if there's really a strongman, the doctor will be moot, effectively being the same role as a VT.

I think the correct call here is frankly to lynch you anyway.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1011 on: July 05, 2015, 11:04:58 pm »

If there's another doctor we can both protect the IC and make the strongman moot until he kills one of us.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1012 on: July 05, 2015, 11:13:47 pm »

Can anyone state the case against me? As far as I can tell it's that I was lurking for awhile, which I admit happened and I apologize for. mail-mi has been lurking harder, and as he points out was off-wagon twice. My claim is the truth, which is all I have.

You deflected from Awaclus pretty consistently, and you were pretty easy on Seprix too (can't say that you deflected from him, because you weren't present enough during D2). Mail-mi has "just" been lurking pretty hard, but I think that skip's latest argument gives him enough townie points to get him off the hook for now.

The only thing going on for you is your bizarre claim.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1013 on: July 05, 2015, 11:17:08 pm »

If you don't believe it, you don't believe it.

This game hasn't been my most shining moment of mafia, and I freely admit that. mail-mi is my biggest scum read at the moment, mostly do to PoE, but obviously I haven't put in the time to have as informed of an opinion as I should. I deflected less consistently against awaclus than pacovf did, though based on yesterday's lynch I'm inclined to think he's town. If you want a reason not to lynch me, I voted to lynch scum twice. I'm not above bussing as scum but I know it's suicide to lose both your partners on the first two days.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1014 on: July 05, 2015, 11:19:47 pm »

You voted for both of them when they were already lost. That's why I am not giving you town points for being on-wagon.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1015 on: July 05, 2015, 11:22:32 pm »

Also I received a message from silverspawn that implies that the change was due to the fact that the setup was originally incorrect, which I guess means that he gave scum the regular strongman when they were supposed to get the 1-shot and had to add an extra role. I'm not sure how I feel about the mod doing this kind of thing but I guess it's silverspawn's prerogative.
this is him trying to subtly explain yesterday's scumslip. I want to lynch him soo bad.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #1016 on: July 06, 2015, 12:02:25 am »

.....ADK are among the higher reads I have....
...honestly, I don't see the ADK case...
these are back to back contradicting posts
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1017 on: July 06, 2015, 12:29:53 am »

Personally, I think the time has come for the hammer. ADK is the obvious candidate for the last scum, and that won't change since it is impossible for him to prove in any certain way that he is a doctor. So we might as well be done with it.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1018 on: July 06, 2015, 12:33:20 am »

Also I received a message from silverspawn that implies that the change was due to the fact that the setup was originally incorrect, which I guess means that he gave scum the regular strongman when they were supposed to get the 1-shot and had to add an extra role. I'm not sure how I feel about the mod doing this kind of thing but I guess it's silverspawn's prerogative.
this is him trying to subtly explain yesterday's scumslip. I want to lynch him soo bad.

My explanation for my "scumslip" remains the one I gave yesterday, which is the truth.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1019 on: July 06, 2015, 12:35:45 am »

Just think about the claim. Doc!adk wouldn't protect hydrad, he'd protect UoS. He was almost as conf!town, and was much more active in pushing a town agenda and overall a much better nk. I don't think anyone would disagree with this. The only explanation for his claim is that he's scum and afraid of claiming to protect UoS because some actual doctor might claim to have protected him also and then we'd just lynch him.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1020 on: July 06, 2015, 12:39:20 am »

Bunch of pronouns in that last post but I hope it was still clear
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1021 on: July 06, 2015, 01:03:52 am »

Personally, I think the time has come for the hammer. ADK is the obvious candidate for the last scum, and that won't change since it is impossible for him to prove in any certain way that he is a doctor. So we might as well be done with it.
I'm going to bed soon, and it seems like Teproc is the only one arguing against it. vote: adk
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1022 on: July 06, 2015, 01:05:22 am »

Lynch mail-mi tomorrow kthx
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1023 on: July 06, 2015, 01:06:53 am »

Lynch mail-mi tomorrow kthx
It's not me. I already said, I'm just a VT.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1024 on: July 06, 2015, 01:09:03 am »

Also don't discount pacovf if it gets down to lylo and he's still around but I feel good about town's chances here in general.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1025 on: July 06, 2015, 01:27:09 am »

ah my bad adk i probably should of used my IC powers to defend you better. unless you scum...
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1026 on: July 06, 2015, 02:03:21 am »

If I was scum the game would be over and I wouldn't be keeping up the pretense.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1027 on: July 06, 2015, 02:56:58 am »

Sorry ADK. Will definitely look into mail-mi again.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1028 on: July 06, 2015, 04:35:18 am »

Why were we in a rush exactly ? I understand ADK would probably have been lynched anyway but there was really no need to rush that quickly.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1029 on: July 06, 2015, 10:35:20 am »

Nothing was happening, and it was unlikely that anything was going to happen. You yourself said that you didn't really feel motivated to do a reread. Might as well move on and not lose what little momentum we have. Demotivated town is losing town.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1030 on: July 06, 2015, 10:38:04 am »

I didn't mean that in general, I meant that I wasn't motivated that particular day, but whatever.

This was an automatic lynch, and those are almost always good for scum, because no one can go and analyze them/hold people responsible for their votes. "Well, ADK was scummy, everyone agreed, so yeah I lynched him".

We're still very likely to win, but scum only needs, what, 3 mislynches from now ?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1031 on: July 06, 2015, 10:45:21 am »

Scum needs two mislynches to win. We can fit in a no-lynch if it comes to that.

I agree that I would have preferred if the lynch weren't automatic, but how do you fight that? If everybody agreed that he was scummy, everybody agreed that he was scummy, there is no way around that.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1032 on: July 06, 2015, 10:48:22 am »

By letting people have some time. It was the week-end, and for instance I was planning on rereading Seprix for interactions. I'll do that anyway, but who knows what I would've gotten out of that, or other people, and then there's the fact that people are just more involved in the game during the week in general.

I was counting the ADK lynch in my count. It looks like a mislynch, as I would expect scum!ADK to just move us to post-game discussion, but you never know.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1033 on: July 06, 2015, 10:51:32 am »

Fair enough.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #1034 on: July 06, 2015, 10:59:42 am »

Thread locked!

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1035 on: July 06, 2015, 11:00:02 am »

Day 3 Final Vote Count

A Drowned Kernel (5): pacovf, skip wooznum, chairs, hockeysemlan, mail-mi
mail-mi (1): A Drowned Kernel

Not Voting (2): Teproc, Hydrad

With 8 alive, it took 5 to lynch.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1036 on: July 06, 2015, 11:03:07 am »

A chill inducing sound hit Twilight's ears as she opened the door to her library. It was a melody full of sadness and melancholy, of beauty and grandeur, of loss and fugacity. It took Twilight a couple of moments to realize that it was Lyra, standing amidst the group, gently plucking strings on her lyre which she held before her in a beautifully illuminated cloud of green magic. When the last chords passed, a few seconds of pregnant silence followed, before the audience around her began to break into cheers.

"Thank you, thank you!" Lyra bowed, wiping a tear off her forehead. "My very own composition... I've been working on it forever and just got it finished yesterday."

"But..." Pinkie frowned. "Why did you say it was my farewell?"

"Oh." In an instant, Lyra's expression shifted, her lyre being carefully put away into its container. "Well, because you're the last chaos, of course. But I admit I was mostly looking for an excuse to play it..." She smiled bashfully.

"No I'm not!"

"You tried to prevent us from lynching Twilight on Day one..."

"What? No I didn't! I helped to get her lynched! I helped you!"

A slight crack appeared in the world's fabric, thin but wide, a crevice drawing itself vertically across reality.

Pinkie's pupils shrank. "Uhhh, guys, do you see this?"

"On day 2," Lyra continued without listening, "you didn't really help with Applebloom, though you also didn't consider much at all. Clear chaos behavior."

"I, uhm, have to agree," Fluttershy chimed in softly. "I also have reason not to lynch most of the others."

"Fluttershy's right!" Sweetie Belle exclaimed, which may or may not have been an attempt to make herself plot relevant.

"But I'm not chaos!" Pinkie shouted, her panic perhaps enchanted by what she was seeing, although the crack seemed to close itself at this point. "I'm Rainbow Dash! The element of loyalty! I couldn't be evil!"

Cold coughed. "I'm afraid your flavor doesn't excuse your behavior... though this is exactly the kind of argument scum would make. Yeah, we caught you."

"You're not Rainbow Dash!" Scootaloo pouted. "Rainbow Dash is gone! VOTE FOR PINKIE PIE!"

"Uhh..." Twilight blinked. "... yeah, about that. Listen guys..."

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1037 on: July 06, 2015, 11:03:41 am »

A Drowned Kernel has been lynched. He was Pinkie Pie playing as Rainbow Dash, a Town Doctor.

Confirming that I did make a mistake with the original role distribution - massive apologies for that! The current setup now is what has been randomized before the game.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #1038 on: July 06, 2015, 11:05:39 am »

Night 3 begins now and will last until July 08, 11 AM Forum Time. Remember to check in during the night.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 3)
« Reply #1039 on: July 08, 2015, 08:15:00 am »

Still missing confirmation from 2 players.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 3)
« Reply #1040 on: July 08, 2015, 04:26:59 pm »

hockeysemlan has died in the night. He was Cold Autumn playing as Scootaloo, a Vanilla Townie.

Day 4 begins now and ends at July 15, 4 pm Forum Time.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 3)
« Reply #1041 on: July 08, 2015, 04:30:44 pm »

Do we..... massclaim?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 3)
« Reply #1042 on: July 08, 2015, 04:32:17 pm »

Well, that was unexpected. I wonder if there is anything to learn from that nightkill choice.

I definitely have to reread, I don't have any strong reads right now. That will probably have to wait until the weekend. But before that, an innocent question: assume I am a 1-shot cop, and get a town result during N1. When should I claim it? Right away? When the godfather dies? When I am up to L-1?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1043 on: July 08, 2015, 05:07:37 pm »

Well, that was unexpected. I wonder if there is anything to learn from that nightkill choice.

I definitely have to reread, I don't have any strong reads right now. That will probably have to wait until the weekend. But before that, an innocent question: assume I am a 1-shot cop, and get a town result during N1. When should I claim it? Right away? When the godfather dies? When I am up to L-1?

There's no way anyone should answer that question right now. If you have something to claim, you can go ahead, if not don't.

I'd be fine with a massclaim at this point, though it won't solve anything it'll at least clarify some things.

Also, what do you find surprising in the NK ?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1044 on: July 08, 2015, 05:45:45 pm »

I was trying to do a clever stunt, but I don't know if it will be possible or even necessary anymore. Oh well. I would still like to have the answer when the game ends.

I am not opposed to a massclaim.

The nightkill is suprising because Hockeysemlan is not as towny as the literal IC, Hydrad (and either there is no doctor or the last scum is strongman). And hockeysemlan doesn't seem as dangerous town as, say, yourself.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1045 on: July 08, 2015, 05:54:25 pm »

I hate clever stunts, so I'm not entirely sorry for possibly screwing that up.

As for the NK, I think WW/hockey was very close to IC, and Hydrad is just completely absent, so he was the person I saw as most likely to die tonight, with Hydrad a close second. We don't know if scum has a full strongman either, could be an indication they don't, maybe ?

Is mail-mi still V/LA ?

Now that I think about it a little more, I don't love massclaiming. There are still ways it could be bad for town, and I don't think there's any way for us to catch scum with it.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1046 on: July 08, 2015, 05:55:54 pm »

I hate clever stunts, so I'm not entirely sorry for possibly screwing that up.

Why do you hate fun, Teproc?  :(
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1047 on: July 08, 2015, 05:58:00 pm »

I hate clever stunts, so I'm not entirely sorry for possibly screwing that up.

Why do you hate fun, Teproc?  :(

I know, I know. I just don't think "town traps" are as useful as people think they are, and this one in particular seemed like it could very easily be abused by scum!you, so there.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1048 on: July 08, 2015, 06:03:54 pm »

sorry I`m doing a very poor job of an IC. I guess I`m just more afraid of being wrong in this situation then if I was normal town since I theoretically should have more influence with people. I`ll try to do better.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1049 on: July 08, 2015, 06:04:44 pm »

As for the NK, I think WW/hockey was very close to IC, and Hydrad is just completely absent, so he was the person I saw as most likely to die tonight, with Hydrad a close second. We don't know if scum has a full strongman either, could be an indication they don't, maybe ?

If there is an extra doctor, scum has a full strongman, per number of letters rolled. If there is no extra doctor, then it doesn't matter whether the strongman was 1-shot or not. So scum could have shot Hydrad if he wanted to, no problem.

I hate clever stunts, so I'm not entirely sorry for possibly screwing that up.

Why do you hate fun, Teproc?  :(

I know, I know. I just don't think "town traps" are as useful as people think they are, and this one in particular seemed like it could very easily be abused by scum!you, so there.

Oh, I know you know what I was trying to do with that, and I can't say more.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1050 on: July 08, 2015, 06:05:31 pm »

also in my eyes I think I`m ok with a massclaim also at this point.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1051 on: July 08, 2015, 06:07:44 pm »

TBH the value of IC is that:

1) we know your perspective comes from Town

2) all Town members can remove you from their lynch pool automatically.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1052 on: July 08, 2015, 06:08:50 pm »

sorry I`m doing a very poor job of an IC. I guess I`m just more afraid of being wrong in this situation then if I was normal town since I theoretically should have more influence with people. I`ll try to do better.

If anything, you have an excuse for having worse reads than a random townie, since you have less information than them.

@pacovf : Right, didn't think that through.

PPE : The bad massclaim scenario I was thinking of is actually wrong I just realised, so I'm fine with it as well. Just need mail-mi in here for that to happen though. When did he say his V/LA was again ?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1053 on: July 08, 2015, 06:10:21 pm »

pacovf
skip wooznum
chairs
mail-mi
Teproc
Hydrad

In no particular order, the remaining players.

Hydrad is IC.
I know I'm Town.

That leaves pacovf, skip, mail-mi, and Teproc.

out of that group... vote: mail-mi.

I'm in favor of a massclaim, I think.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1054 on: July 08, 2015, 06:50:54 pm »

I still have to reread, but mail-mi does seem like the most likely scum, just from simple PoE. Nobody else really fits a scum narrative all that well, aside from maybe skip.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1055 on: July 08, 2015, 10:06:18 pm »

vote: teproc, can someone remind me why he's confirmed town? He was like, 5th on wagon with awaclus. With seprix I don't remember him pushing seprix too much pre-claim. And then post-claim he started pushing him really hard. And then pac pointed out the utter ridiculousness of his claim. But its possible that teproc realized this right away and knew he was getting lynched and wanted towncred by pushing the lynch before it inevitably became obvious to everyone else that seprix was scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1056 on: July 08, 2015, 10:23:23 pm »

Oh and the adk lynch was clearly happening no matter what, and it fits for scum!teproc to come out as against it, at least so early in the day, as it was happening without his help.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1057 on: July 08, 2015, 10:29:46 pm »

As for the NK, I think WW/hockey was very close to IC, and Hydrad is just completely absent, so he was the person I saw as most likely to die tonight, with Hydrad a close second. We don't know if scum has a full strongman either, could be an indication they don't, maybe ?

If there is an extra doctor, scum has a full strongman, per number of letters rolled. If there is no extra doctor, then it doesn't matter whether the strongman was 1-shot or not. So scum could have shot Hydrad if he wanted to, no problem.
I assume scum is a full strongman, and therefore knows there is at least one more pr, potentially some kind of cop, which could hurt him a lot, and scum wants to shoot someone who potentially is the pr, ergo not the IC. Note that scum did not shoot teproc, which is weird if teproc is town, although I get the sense that in practice this isnt a great argument.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1058 on: July 09, 2015, 12:21:14 am »

vote: teproc, can someone remind me why he's confirmed town? He was like, 5th on wagon with awaclus. With seprix I don't remember him pushing seprix too much pre-claim. And then post-claim he started pushing him really hard. And then pac pointed out the utter ridiculousness of his claim. But its possible that teproc realized this right away and knew he was getting lynched and wanted towncred by pushing the lynch before it inevitably became obvious to everyone else that seprix was scum.

While Teproc took some time to vote for Awaclus, he was putting pressure on him fairly early. With Seprix, he made a case on him, voted for him relatively early, and didn't budge from there (save brief hesitation post-claim). I really don't see Teproc being scum here. Admittedly I still have to reread.

I assume scum is a full strongman, and therefore knows there is at least one more pr, potentially some kind of cop, which could hurt him a lot, and scum wants to shoot someone who potentially is the pr, ergo not the IC.

Seems plausible.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1059 on: July 09, 2015, 12:42:47 am »

vote: teproc, can someone remind me why he's confirmed town? He was like, 5th on wagon with awaclus. With seprix I don't remember him pushing seprix too much pre-claim. And then post-claim he started pushing him really hard. And then pac pointed out the utter ridiculousness of his claim. But its possible that teproc realized this right away and knew he was getting lynched and wanted towncred by pushing the lynch before it inevitably became obvious to everyone else that seprix was scum.

While Teproc took some time to vote for Awaclus, he was putting pressure on him fairly early. With Seprix, he made a case on him, voted for him relatively early, and didn't budge from there (save brief hesitation post-claim). I really don't see Teproc being scum here. Admittedly I still have to reread.

I assume scum is a full strongman, and therefore knows there is at least one more pr, potentially some kind of cop, which could hurt him a lot, and scum wants to shoot someone who potentially is the pr, ergo not the IC.

Seems plausible.
I wouldn't say he was putting too much pressure. At least most of it was still early enough for awaclus to get out of the lynch. After re-read it really seems plausible for teproc to be scum. I still need to read day 2
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #1060 on: July 09, 2015, 01:02:19 am »

Ok, so I think today's lynch should be between Seprix and pacovf. I'm pretty confident at least one of them is scum.

vote: Seprix
this is where he votes seprix. He could totally be planning to switch later on to pacovf
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1061 on: July 09, 2015, 06:57:08 am »

skip, are you in favor of a massclaim ? Because if you are, I'll be waiting for that before doing rereads, provided mail-mi's around.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1062 on: July 09, 2015, 09:17:40 am »

mail-mi has already claimed VT, so no need to wait for him. I am definitely not going to reread yet if there is a massclaim coming.

I think skip and chairs should claim their PRs before Teproc and I.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1063 on: July 09, 2015, 09:20:28 am »

Oh right, that happened. My order would be pacovf/skip/chairs/me... let's just say I do not put an immense amount of weight into the Seprix wagon.

Certainly I think chairs should claim after you and skip.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1064 on: July 09, 2015, 09:24:11 am »

Really? Why do you have such a strong town read on chairs?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1065 on: July 09, 2015, 09:26:25 am »

Actually, your townreads there are just a consequence of you ignoring Seprix's wagon, so my question is, why do you ignore Seprix's wagon?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1066 on: July 09, 2015, 09:31:34 am »

I'm not sure actually, I remember rereading him on day 1 and coming out of it feeling like it was town chairs. Or maybe it was his day 2 play ? This is why I need to reread. I guess I'd be fine with skip claiming after chairs, his case on me really reads like paranoid own.

I don't completely ignore the Seprix wagon, I just don't think it's even half as relevant as the Awaclus wagon. Seprix had too damning interactions with Awaclus to live long, so I'm assuming the last scum would be fine with bussing him.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1067 on: July 09, 2015, 10:06:52 am »

skip, are you in favor of a massclaim ? Because if you are, I'll be waiting for that before doing rereads, provided mail-mi's around.
I don't know if we should massclaim, I've barely ever played. That's why I asked.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1068 on: July 09, 2015, 10:09:21 am »

Ok, well in this setup massclaim won't solve anything. It will, however, help clarify things. It makes it slightly harder for scum to fakeclaim (slightly), especially because it prevents them from doing so at lylo (which sounds far away but a mislynch here brings us to mylo already). On the town side, there's really no downside to it at this point.

Basically we're going to do it at some point, and we might as well get it out of the way now.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1069 on: July 09, 2015, 10:16:16 am »

Ok, well in this setup massclaim won't solve anything. It will, however, help clarify things. It makes it slightly harder for scum to fakeclaim (slightly), especially because it prevents them from doing so at lylo (which sounds far away but a mislynch here brings us to mylo already). On the town side, there's really no downside to it at this point.

Basically we're going to do it at some point, and we might as well get it out of the way now.
why is there no downside, they now know if we have any cops and who those cops are?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1070 on: July 09, 2015, 10:18:31 am »

Ok, well in this setup massclaim won't solve anything. It will, however, help clarify things. It makes it slightly harder for scum to fakeclaim (slightly), especially because it prevents them from doing so at lylo (which sounds far away but a mislynch here brings us to mylo already). On the town side, there's really no downside to it at this point.

Basically we're going to do it at some point, and we might as well get it out of the way now.
why is there no downside, they now know if we have any cops and who those cops are?

I'm not too worried about that.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1071 on: July 09, 2015, 10:25:27 am »

Ok, well in this setup massclaim won't solve anything. It will, however, help clarify things. It makes it slightly harder for scum to fakeclaim (slightly), especially because it prevents them from doing so at lylo (which sounds far away but a mislynch here brings us to mylo already). On the town side, there's really no downside to it at this point.

Basically we're going to do it at some point, and we might as well get it out of the way now.
why is there no downside, they now know if we have any cops and who those cops are?

I'm not too worried about that.
why not?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1072 on: July 09, 2015, 10:27:09 am »

I'm sure you can figure it out. There might not be a point in me not responding here, but you never know, I don't want to give scum a guide to what I expect from this massclaim.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1073 on: July 09, 2015, 12:49:06 pm »

So huh it seems we all agree that we should do a massclaim?

I guess Hydrad should give a claim order.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1074 on: July 09, 2015, 05:05:27 pm »

I can make an order.

One thing i'm thinking of is having skip be one of the later claims though. originally i was going to have him near the top but as it seems hes not familiar with claims would it be a good idea for me to put him near the back as with scum he might not be able to take much advantage from it?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1075 on: July 09, 2015, 05:18:18 pm »

...

Any order is fine, just give one.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1076 on: July 09, 2015, 05:23:13 pm »

1. pacovf
2. chairs
3. skip
4. teproc
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1077 on: July 09, 2015, 05:29:06 pm »

I am a vanilla pony.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1078 on: July 09, 2015, 06:11:40 pm »

I'm Sweetie Belle, playing as Sweetie Belle!

I am a Vanilla Pony. Maybe I can get my cutie mark in Mafia-hunting, though?

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1079 on: July 09, 2015, 06:22:59 pm »

Is cutie mark a MLP thing ? Or just a chairs thing ?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1080 on: July 09, 2015, 07:40:59 pm »

Im a roleblocker. I blocked nobody night 1, adk night 2, and mail-mi night 3.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1081 on: July 09, 2015, 07:50:31 pm »

Do you know how a roleblocker works, skip?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1082 on: July 09, 2015, 08:06:56 pm »

Do you know how a roleblocker works, skip?
I do, but your condescension as always is much appreciated :P
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1083 on: July 09, 2015, 08:25:35 pm »

Is not condescension. I honestly want you to explain what a roleblocker can and cannot do.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1084 on: July 09, 2015, 09:07:01 pm »

Is not condescension. I honestly want you to explain what a roleblocker can and cannot do.
a roleblocker can block the night target's night actions. If the night action is a strongman kill, the kill will go through, unless another blocker targets the strongman or a doctor targets the nk target.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1085 on: July 09, 2015, 09:10:23 pm »

Good, good.

Teproc is not going to claim until tomorrow, so in the meantime, there's something I meant to ask you that has been bugging me for the past few days:

I will have to reread the flavour at some point to see if it is actually a novelization of player behaviour, or just random fanfic.
oh, it isn't random, lyra. That reminds me, adk, you should flavor claim

Why did you call me Lyra here?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1086 on: July 09, 2015, 09:17:22 pm »

Are you lyra?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1087 on: July 09, 2015, 09:24:33 pm »

I'd rather you answer the question first.
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Re: Flavor
« Reply #1088 on: July 09, 2015, 09:55:15 pm »


"Ahem. Player list left parenthesis by order of signing right parenthesis colon... wait no colon. I mean, yes colon, but I didn't mean to spell that out. Anyway. Twilight, Liara, Rarity, Colgate, Cold Autumn, Fluttershy, Pinkie Pie, Applebloom, Scootaloo, Rainbow Dash, Sweetie Belle, and Lyra. Welcome to Pony Mafia!"

in order of signup sheet
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1089 on: July 09, 2015, 09:58:05 pm »

*facepalm*

Well done.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1090 on: July 09, 2015, 09:58:45 pm »

Man, silver must be laughing now.
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Re: Flavor
« Reply #1091 on: July 09, 2015, 10:21:54 pm »


"Ahem. Player list left parenthesis by order of signing right parenthesis colon... wait no colon. I mean, yes colon, but I didn't mean to spell that out. Anyway. Twilight, Liara, Rarity, Colgate, Cold Autumn, Fluttershy, Pinkie Pie, Applebloom, Scootaloo, Rainbow Dash, Sweetie Belle, and Lyra. Welcome to Pony Mafia!"

in order of signup sheet

reading the flavor/setup info is scum.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1092 on: July 09, 2015, 11:45:48 pm »

Is cutie mark a MLP thing ? Or just a chairs thing ?

MLP - in the MLP lore/fiction/whatever, Sweetie Belle and her two friends Scootaloo and Apple Bloom have not yet received their "cutie mark", which is the icon on a pony's rear flank that indicates their unique gift (e.g. Pinkie Pie has balloons and she is really good at throwing parties). In the cartoon, a recurring theme is that these three have formed a club titled the "Cutie Mark Crusaders" and regularly attempt a variety of activities with the goal of finding that special thing that they will be good at, gaining their cutie marks and bringing them one step closer to adulthood (although most of their filly friends have cutie marks, and I'd argue quite a few of those are less mature, with certain cutie marks not being quite understandable insofar as what someone's special gift may be, but that's neither here nor there).

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1093 on: July 10, 2015, 04:45:12 am »

I'm a VT. skip's claim seems solid, probably out of my lynch pool for today.

I will reread at some point, but I'll be pretty busy this week-end (whole family in town for my nephew's birthday), so I might only get to it next week.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1094 on: July 10, 2015, 08:15:48 am »

Ok, well in this setup massclaim won't solve anything. It will, however, help clarify things. It makes it slightly harder for scum to fakeclaim (slightly), especially because it prevents them from doing so at lylo (which sounds far away but a mislynch here brings us to mylo already). On the town side, there's really no downside to it at this point.

Basically we're going to do it at some point, and we might as well get it out of the way now.
why is there no downside, they now know if we have any cops and who those cops are?

I'm not too worried about that.
why not?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1095 on: July 10, 2015, 08:18:26 am »

Ok, well in this setup massclaim won't solve anything. It will, however, help clarify things. It makes it slightly harder for scum to fakeclaim (slightly), especially because it prevents them from doing so at lylo (which sounds far away but a mislynch here brings us to mylo already). On the town side, there's really no downside to it at this point.

Basically we're going to do it at some point, and we might as well get it out of the way now.
why is there no downside, they now know if we have any cops and who those cops are?

I'm not too worried about that.
why not?

Because a Cop or 1-Shot Cop would have already claimed. When you're a Cop, your main fear is dying without sharing your results. pacovf was getting at that earlier, basically the Godfather's death would have been the latest point at which a Cop would have claimed, because even one new IC almost wins the game on the spot for us. One-Shot Cop is even more incentivized to claim because there's no particular cost to him being killed by scum once he's claimed.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1096 on: July 10, 2015, 09:08:33 am »

Well that's mildly disappointing.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1097 on: July 10, 2015, 10:54:17 am »

Well, they can't all be the best massclaim ever.

I am inclined to believe skip's claim too. That only leaves mail-mi and chairs in my mind.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1098 on: July 10, 2015, 11:14:53 am »

I mean, I've already voted for mail-mi because I'm pretty sure that's the right answer. If it's not, I honestly don't know who it could be, because I feel like you've all been pretty Towny.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1099 on: July 10, 2015, 11:18:45 am »

If it ends up being mail-mi, how many times do I get to say "I told you so"?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1100 on: July 10, 2015, 12:24:36 pm »

On re-read, I had a bunch of reasons that pointed to mail-mi not being seprix's partner. Ill look for them later. Dont lynch him too soon plz.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1101 on: July 10, 2015, 03:37:20 pm »

I actually will be busy till sunday night. Ill try to do a re-read then
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Vote Count
« Reply #1102 on: July 10, 2015, 07:34:56 pm »

Vote Count 4.1

mail-mi (1): chairs
Teproc (1): skip wooznum

Not Voting (4): Teproc, Hydrad, pacovf, mail-mi

With 6 alive, it takes 4 to lynch. Day 3 ends at July 15, 4 PM Forum Time.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1103 on: July 10, 2015, 07:36:12 pm »

Hey skip, are you serious about your vote on Teproc?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1104 on: July 11, 2015, 05:21:45 pm »

BACK!

Hm. I was going to vote: skip, but I believe his roleblocker claim.

Which means I'm going to vote: pacovf because of his off-wagonness on Awaclus, and I agree with Teproc that the seprix wagon doesn't mean very much.

Also, it's not me.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1105 on: July 12, 2015, 01:36:07 am »

Hey skip, are you serious about your vote on Teproc?
I think it's important that he's not really an IC and people should realize that. Call it paranoid if you want. I don't like lynching anyone else really all that much so im not really sure what to do. I wont have much time to think till sunday night
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #1106 on: July 12, 2015, 10:42:37 am »

I have a little time now, so let's look at Awaclus' interactions with people still alive (who are not me, because I wouldn't have much to say about that) :

Awaclus and WW, you guys haven't weighed in on the Mail-mi wagon.  What do you think of it?

Not a huge fan of it, but I could do it if there's nothing better. I think it's better than WW at least.

Definitely fits a scum!mail-mi scenario. Awaclus wasn't under pressure at the time, but he still had the opportunity to go for a mail-mi lynch and didn't take it. Not really indicative either way though.

Can we just vote: awaclus and get rolling? I want to perform N1's NK already

Vote: chairs

chairs' vote was putting Awaclus a L-2. Makes chairs look townie, as he could have been a legitimate alternative at that point. Also worth noting that Seprix had just voted for chairs as well.

Can we just vote: awaclus and get rolling? I want to perform N1's NK already

Vote: chairs

Why ?

Because he's scum.

@Awaclus : Do you want to be lynched ?

Not particularly.

Could you please take the time to explain to us why you think chairs is scum then ?

Well, I don't mind explaining it because it should be obvious anyway, but OTOH that also makes the explanation sort of pointless.

I still find this confusing though, why did Awaclus refuse to explain his vote if he and Seprix were trying to set him up as an alternate wagon ?

Hey Awalcus,

Let's say Joe and chairs come back to you and Seprix hammers (or whatever other scenario that leads to you being lynched you think is most probable).

What do you think of the wagon on you?

I think it looks like people are there to pressure me to post more rather than because they actually want to lynch me, which is pro-town, but not hard to do as scum. Chairs was scummy but he's no longer on my wagon.

Not sure if there's something to make out of this, but maybe someone else will.

I think it looks like people are there to pressure me to post more rather than because they actually want to lynch me, which is pro-town, but not hard to do as scum. Chairs was scummy but he's no longer on my wagon.

Okay, so who's scum off-wagon?

Chairs.

Still the only player he calls scummy. He had 4 votes at that point.

I do agree with WW that Seprix is pretty scummy here, though. I could lynch him if nobody else wants to lynch chairs.

This is past the point where his lynch seemed inevitable (he had claimed VT already). Maybe he just understood very early taht he was going down and put his 2 partners as his scum reads to throw people off ? But that backfires horribly once one of them gets lynched... nah, I think his insistence on chairs lookgs good for chairs still.

I don't think scum!Awaclus means town!WW. I do think town!Awaclus heavily implies scum!WW.

Hi I'm Chairs and I like to get things backwards.

Of course he does, he's scum.

LEt's entertain you for a second. Your perceived scumteam is what ? Chairs/WW and ?

Not necessarily WW, although it could be him. Probably more like chairs/Seprix and then someone.

Still refuses to comment on any other player than those three (and still noncommital on WW).

And, you know, what are your reads in general ? On the off chance that you're Morgrim!Awaclus, give us that at least.

Awaclus - obvtown
Teproc - towny
Hydrad - null

Joseph - Innocent Child
Witherweaver - slightly suspicious
skip wooznum - null
A Drowned Kernel - slightly suspicious
Seprix - scummy
mail-mi - null
UmbrageOfSnow - towny
chairs - scummy
pacovf - towny


His last reads, with alive people bolded.

Well that wasn't a lot. Mostly this gives town points to chairs.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #1107 on: July 12, 2015, 11:32:51 pm »

I feel bad for thinking this (because it might encourage groupthink and dissuade people from carrying out their reads) but chairs feels a bit scummy for me right now. Like, enough for me to change my vote from mail-mi.

vote: Chairs
actually this feels a lot like seprix had his vote on a partner and was itching to get it off.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #1108 on: July 12, 2015, 11:38:08 pm »

Analyzing the wagon come D1 end, and given Seprix's Law of Mafia Average (One/Two scum tends to jump on wagon, The rest stay off wagon), I think I can come to this conclusion:

One scum is in this list: [Crossed players not scum]

Hydrad, Witherweaver, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc, chairs, Seprix, A Drowned Kernel

One scum is in the other list:

Mail-Mi, Pacovf, Skip Wooznum

Also to factor in is Awaclus voting for Chairs. Could Awaclus have voted for his scum buddy in a last ditch effort to throw everyone off after he died?

Wait, I found this gem over here.

1) town!Awaclus gets very indignant when he has a wagon on him, and continually talks about how not scum he's been acting.

This is true. Usually when I'm town, I have like 29384723984723 town tells that everyone is either not noticing or choosing to ignore on purpose, which is why I have to point them out. In this game, I haven't posted much because a lot of stuff has been going on IRL and other games, and that's why there aren't that many things that I can point out. The only notable thing is that I don't lurk as scum, but there's the problem that I don't usually lurk as town either.

This could easily be scum!WW defending Awaclus there. So if that's the case, we have WW/Awaclus/???. This is nice because I think everyone else bar maybe Chairs (and that's a maybe) is pretty much Town on the wagon.

We have mail-Mi, Pacovf and Skip. Skip seems townie, because he's quite overeager, which is typical for newer players. Pacovf has been strong town thus far.

Looks like a WW/Awaclus/Mail-Mi scum team so far.
would seprix put his only living partner on his projected scumteam?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #1109 on: July 12, 2015, 11:41:16 pm »

Also, Mail-mi posted on-site (only a couple times but still) while we were lynching Awaclus conveniently without stopping in here to offer any thoughts or reactions.

Need to do more catching up, but need to respond to this. You guys put up like 8 pages when I was asleep, so I went and checked my other game, then had to leave before I could get through this one, then by the time I came back Awaclus was lynched.

HOORAY Awaclus was scum!

I think we need to lynch off-wagon today.

Final Vote Count Day 1

Awaclus (7): Hydrad, Witherweaver, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc, chairs, Seprix, A Drowned Kernel
Teproc (1): mail-mi
mail-mi (1): pacovf
chairs (2): Awaclus, Joseph2302

Not Voting (1): skip wooznum

With 12 alive, it took 7 to lynch.

...which, well, really narrows it down to Pacovf and Skip. Skip was acting pretty scummy yesterday, and not having your vote on someone is bad news, like he wanted to find an argument for anyone else but couldn't, but didn't want to vote his scum partner. (Haven't reread end of Day 1 yet so don't know if this is what his posts felt like). vote: skip wooznum

This is extremely bizarre. How did you know that D1 ended without also seeing the flip?

I'm with Pacovf, that IS a bit weird. Only strengthens my Mail-Mi read, so hey. Have an explanation? Because if you don't, I think I have my lynch candidate.
even stronger words against mail-mi here. This I think was the post I was remembering from a previous re-read that lead me to believe mail-mi was town. Plus seprix mixing mail-mi and hydrad up earlier.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #1110 on: July 12, 2015, 11:50:11 pm »

Not lynching Pacovf today. I liked that analysis. And ADK is now definitely my top lynch choice behind Skip.
this is interesting. In pacovf's re-read, adk and seprix came off as almost equally scummy, yet mail-mi only expressed interest in lynching adk
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 2)
« Reply #1111 on: July 12, 2015, 11:56:06 pm »

vote: Seprix, the things you are saying are just way too weird. L-1?
this doesn't seem like bussing from pacovf. Id imagine he would try to articulate himself clearer with a bus. Just my impression
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1112 on: July 13, 2015, 12:03:00 am »

Alright, so chairs I definitely do not want to lynch. A lot of towny interactions with awa and seprix.

Id rather not lynch pac. I believe his defense for his D1 play, he in general comes off as towny to me.

Teproc also looks not as bad on re-read. He went after both scum decently hard. But im not 100% sold on him

Mail-mi I guess I can lynch, but there is some evidence pointing to his innocence. Overall though, I think hes gotta be the correct choice. vote: mail-mi

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #1113 on: July 13, 2015, 12:06:53 am »

Sorry guys, this game completely slipped out of my mind during the weekend. I promise a reread tomorrow evening.


Note that Awaclus also put Seprix to L-2 without any sort of explanation. I am not entirely sure we can read anything off Awaclus's actions...

@skip: yes, Seprix interactions with mail-mi are kind of weird; confusing mail-mi with Hydrad, especially. Do note that Seprix was the godfather, so in a sense, he was the most important scum player, and could have considered a bus like a reasonable move during D2.

Does anybody have any opinion on Seprix-chairs during D2? He comes up quite hostile to him at first... then he claims he investigated him and got a town result. Is that more likely if chairs is town or scum? I honestly have no idea.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1114 on: July 13, 2015, 12:10:17 am »

I think seprix clearly made a mistake with that claim, not realizing that he was supposed to find chairs suspicious. One would probably forget reads one made on a townie than on one's own scumpartner.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1115 on: July 13, 2015, 09:42:05 am »

Yeah, I really don't know why he decided to fake that claim on me of all people.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1116 on: July 14, 2015, 12:44:45 am »

Reading quickly any post mentioning Seprix... and I end up about as confused as before the reread.

Mail-mi and Seprix attack each other with a little bit more intensity than seems reasonable between scum partners, and then there's the mail-mi/Hydrad confusion. Mail-mi voted for Seprix during D2, although he did unvote later. Dunno.

chairs moved his vote from Awaclus to Seprix, then back to Awaclus during the later parts of D1. That's just batshit insane if he is the last scum.

Teproc pretty much had laser-sight guidance on scum this game. Hard to see him be scum.

skip has felt really towny during the whole game, and there's the thing with the roleblocker claim, which is a useless, but believable, claim.

Hydrad is an IC, and I am town.

I say, when you don't understand what is going on, vote for the lurker. vote: mail-mi. This is L-1. I think I go back to skip being my other choice for possible last scum. My gut says he is town, but his interactions with Awaclus and Seprix don't look as good as Teproc's or chairs's.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1117 on: July 14, 2015, 12:45:31 am »

I'll bold it just in case: mail-mi is at L-1.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1118 on: July 14, 2015, 01:10:01 am »

And I'm still just a VT. I think Pacovf has been taking way too much charge with this game, and everyone is following him like sheep. vote: pacovf just in case I'm not right now.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #1119 on: July 14, 2015, 08:19:23 am »

Rereading Seprix now.

Wait a second here.

WHAT!?

I read Mail-Mi's post as if Hydrad posted that. Yeah, I meant to vote for Mail-Mi. Wow.

Right, that happened. I don't think it's as big a deal as you are all making it out to be. IN the first few days of the game, you can easily get that kind of confusion even with your scumpartner... this would be a big deal on day 2, or even late in day 1, but that was pretty early in the day (and neither Hydrad or mail-mi had said a lot).

What is your position on Mail-mi, again? I recall you saying that you didn't really feel like voting for him now.

I said Mail-Mi was scummy to me, but I didn't say why I didn't vote for him. Firstly, I confused Mail with Hydrad (3 hours of sleep does this), and when I realized my mistake, I was at L-1, so I didn't want to look like I was trying to throw votes around, hoping they stick. I want to be a bit more careful this time around, I always switch votes all of the time in my previous games. I feel like I should vote for Mail now.

vote: mail-mi

This is a super weak vote... it's also the 3rd vote on mail-mi (main wagon at that point was WW). Not super decisive, butmakes mail-mi a bit more likely to be town.

Seprix, what's your reasoning about Mail-mi?

He's only posted in this game a total of 3 times. It's almost like he's lurking. Also, his first post was about being scum partners, which I would let slide, as it's not evidence on it's own. But then his next two posts are just voting for Hydrad, an then unvoting for Hydrad, and nothing else. He hasn't contributed at all, he's totally lurking too because he posted a lot in the other Mafia game he's in, but not posting here? Hrmmm...

Seprix was the one who brought up mail-mi posting in other threads. To me, that means he was pretty serious about the mail-mi wagon.

Sorry, I'm planning a stream, and have been busy with college. I don't have much to say in all honesty at the moment. Mail-mi still seems like a good lynch.

Do you have any opinions on a pacovf lynch?

Not really. Null for him so far.

First mention of pacovf so far, this is at a pretty uncertain point in the game, the W wagon was dying down and both WW and mail-mi had 3 votes.

quick reads

Awaclus

I didn't like the accusations against Awaclus, but I'm warming up to them. Unknown

Teproc (town) (rational)

I don't understand the arguments against Teproc. He's probably one of my top town reads so far. He's analyzing things pretty well. Town

skip wooznum

I don't know, there are times where I like Skip, times where I don't. I don't know what to think thus far. Scum

mail-mi

I don't need to explain my rationale, I already have before. Scum

chairs

Short posts with long stretches of inactivity. Do we really know who Chairs is? Unknown

pacovf

Asking the right questions, actually doing things right now. Town

Edited down to alive people + Awaclus. People tend to put their scumbuddies in different categories, so chairs looks good here. Mostly this points me towards skip and pacovf : skip is in the "I totally want to lynch him but will never actually vote for him" position (as opposed to mail-mi, whom Seprix did push), while pacovf is a town read because he was a consensus town read at the time so there's very little cost to that.

I feel bad for thinking this (because it might encourage groupthink and dissuade people from carrying out their reads) but chairs feels a bit scummy for me right now. Like, enough for me to change my vote from mail-mi.

vote: Chairs

chairs had just put Awaclus to L-2, seems like a desperate attemps at deflection. chairs is looking damn near IC-ish at this point.

I'll do day 2 in a different post.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1120 on: July 14, 2015, 08:34:40 am »

Analyzing the wagon come D1 end, and given Seprix's Law of Mafia Average (One/Two scum tends to jump on wagon, The rest stay off wagon), I think I can come to this conclusion:

One scum is in this list: [Crossed players not scum]

Hydrad, Witherweaver, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc, chairs, Seprix, A Drowned Kernel

One scum is in the other list:

Mail-Mi, Pacovf, Skip Wooznum

Also to factor in is Awaclus voting for Chairs. Could Awaclus have voted for his scum buddy in a last ditch effort to throw everyone off after he died?

Well this is interesting. I tend to think Seprix was telling the truth here with his Law thing, because I think scum generally tries to makes cases by pointing out things that they are themselves doing (and therefore know to be scummy) in other people. But that's easy for me to say, since the only people on-wagon left are chairs (very likely own) and myself.

We have mail-Mi, Pacovf and Skip. Skip seems townie, because he's quite overeager, which is typical for newer players. Pacovf has been strong town thus far.

Looks like a WW/Awaclus/Mail-Mi scum team so far.

Still sticking with mail-mi, which is much less significant than on day 1, but still something. Worth noting that skip was under a fair bit of suspicion early day 2, so his town read is a little less safe than on pacovf.

HOORAY Awaclus was scum!

I think we need to lynch off-wagon today.

This is extremely bizarre. How did you know that D1 ended without also seeing the flip?

I'm with Pacovf, that IS a bit weird. Only strengthens my Mail-Mi read, so hey. Have an explanation? Because if you don't, I think I have my lynch candidate.

Still going strong on mail-mi.

So you're saying my Law of Mafia Scum Averages isn't a law!? #triggered

I think Pacovf was just rushed, I'm not entirely sure he's scummy, though since he did try to defend Awaclus, I can give him a closer read. No harm.

This is after pacovf gets under suspicion for interactions with Awaclus on day 1. Smells like scumbuddies to me, non-commital but leaving the door open to a bus if he absolutely needs to.

So to answer your question, I'm not really sure who to vote for, because honestly, I don't see the ADK case. I'm not as confident on the Mail-Mi case, but I guess that's still my top read thus far.

Huh. Suddenly less decisive on mail-mi.

And then we get into fakeclaim territory and he gets lynched.

Ok, I think chairs can safely be discounted. mail-mi and skip are both possibilities, skip moreso than mail-mi based on interactions alone, if only because there are so few of them. Seprix pushing mail-mi on day 1 still means something to me. However my main suspect at this point is pretty clearly pacovf, Awaclus has nothing to say about him (except calling him townie in his dying WIFOM reads) but that's true of most people. Seprix, OTOH, is constantly following the flow of town on pacovf, null when consensus haven't formed yet, then town when everyone sees him as town, then slight doubt when cases are made against him. Easily the player that fits the best so far.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1121 on: July 14, 2015, 09:07:31 am »

...that's actually a good point.

vote: pacovf

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #1122 on: July 14, 2015, 09:23:41 am »

Anyway I like what UoS is doing here. Vote: Seprix.

4th vote in that super early Seprix wagon. So early in the game that I don't think it makes them less likely to be partners, but worth noting.

In Flavourless, Seprix was scum. He was jokey, considered D1 is pointless and random, he was very eager to get joseph (first wagon) lynched, then kinda backed off super quickly when it turned out bad for him. It's kinda similar from what is happening here, but one would guess that he would have mixed things up if he was scum again. Besides, I can't really compare with his town meta, I haven't really been following the recent games.

His argument on Seprix allows him to move off him (he votes mail-mi in that post) without taking a strong stance on him either.

What is your position on Mail-mi, again? I recall you saying that you didn't really feel like voting for him now.

This is adressed to Seprix, who was basically calling mail-mi scummy without actually voting. Coaching maybe ? Not super strong though.

@pacovf re: Awaclus being a similar case to mail-mi. That's a good point, though I think Awaclus is much more likely to flip scum. But yeah, he's a meh day 1 lynch for the same reasons as mail-mi... and you'll notice he's not my preferred one.

There's a fundamental difference between the two: Awaclus would strictly be a lurker lynch. That means no accountability whatsoever if we lynch him. Nobody voting for mail-mi is doing so because of his lack of content, it's because what little there is, is scummy, so they won't be able to deflect responsibility tomorrow (should he happen to flip town).

That being said, I don't like the way Awaclus has been lurking. Most lurkers are just passive, not checking the game all that often, then posting a quick thought or two when they log in. Awaclus has been following the game closely, and just choosing not to post anything. Normally I would argue very strongly against a D1 lurker lynch, but I wouldn't feel so strongly about it in this specific case. Still, I would prefer a lynch elsewhere.

The problem is that you offer three lynches. WW and skip are town, IMHO, and Awaclus is a lurker lynch. So there's no common ground between our positions.

This is where we get into the thick of it. Of course there's a town narrative for this, and pacovf has provided it. But there's also a strong scum narrative, and it's stronger for pacovf than anyone else alive (at least for day 1). asically by saying Awaclus is a lurker lynch with no accountability, he's washing his hands of the lynch himself : if the lynch doesn't have accountability, he doesn't have to be held accountable himself for not being on it. Granted the Awaclus wagon was very small (either one or two votes, not a lot of vote counts around there) at the time, but still, any lurker on day 1 is vulnerable, and pacovf had to be aware of this if he was scum, and was thus offering another, better lurker lynch in mail-mi. And when I say lurker lynch, I don't mean "lynching someone solely for being a lurker" here, I just means "lynching someone who happens to be a lurker", which is always easier on day 1 than lyncing active players.

Is anyone voting (or wanting to vote) for Awaclus for a reason other than him lurking? If he flips town, are you all going to throw your hands up in the air and say "but he was lurking!"?

I'm all up for lynching lurkers... starting on D2. Otherwise, I would rather lynch someone that actually gets us somewhere even if he flips town. Own your votes, people!

4 votes on Awaclus at this point.

Again, I haven't had the time to reread Awaclus, but while UoS is really persuasive, the case against Awaclus is still just that he is lurking. Lurker lynches are bad in D1, because if he flips town, we have next to nothing. I would totally be for an Awaclus lynch for D2 (assuming nothing better comes up from the flips), because he has earned it many times over, but I don't think I want to lynch him today.

5 votes on Awaclus.

That's basically it for day 1. There's a post where he expresses surprise about Awaclus claiming VT? but then everyone was surprised about that since he had softclaimed a PR earlier.

DAY 2


There's more after this, won't quote it all because I want to go watch the Tour de France so I'm speeding this up a bit.

Above is pacovf defending his day 1 play (quoting it here so that he doesn't have to reiterate everything).

Basically it's this : while pacovf has a town narrative, and it's easy to believe it because he's been active, he also has a stronger scum narrative than anyone else on day 1. mail-mi and skip have decent ones as well, but mail-mi looks better when looking at interactions and skip looks better based on play alone. The way skip's play is townie is much harder to replicate than the way pacovf's play is townie, which is why I think pacovf is the better lynch.

WHAT TIME IS IT?

REREADING TIME

Won't quote the whole thing because it's huge and you can just click on it, but he's laying some heavy suspicion on Seprix on it, among others. But he also points out the L-2 Awaclus vote on Seprix, which leads us here :

So, from the Awaclus lynch, ADK and Seprix look absolutely horrible. UoS is guaranteed town, WW is very likely to be town too, and Teproc and chairs look pretty good (the former for inciting an Awaclus lynch, but unfortunately only voting very late; the latter for decisive votes, the first of which being quite weird).

From the WW wagon, ADK and chairs look bad, and I don't think anyone looks particularly good.

Then there's mail-mi, who has been completely absent from this game. I don't think I can say I have a case on him anymore, but I could be ok with a lurker!mail-mi lynch later on (thank God, now when people will accuse me of inciting a lurker-lynch, they will be right!). Skip Wooznum just fits a town playstyle too well for me to want to lynch him with the weak evidence against him.

Awaclus made a pretty ballsy vote on Seprix back when he had a wagon on him, so considering both wagons, and between ADK and Seprix, I definitely prefer vote: ADK.

Between Seprix and ADK then, but he chooses ADK. Of course town can do this, because hey, it was a reasonable choice, but still, convenient position for scum to be in, because he can switch gears at any point.

Awaclus made a pretty ballsy vote on Seprix back when he had a wagon on him, so considering both wagons, and between ADK and Seprix, I definitely prefer vote: ADK.

I think you're giving too much weight to the Seprix wagon. It was very, very early on in the day, and I know we've had some day 1 quicklynches recently, but it was still unlikely to go all the way. I suppose it's worth some town cred for Seprix, but his interactions with Awaclus so perfectly fit what I'd expect from a scumpartner that I can't overlook it.

Well, I am just using Occam's razor. Seprix looks a bit worse than ADK from his interactions with Awaclus, but it becomes a toss up between the two when you consider WW's wagon*. So Awaclus's early vote on Seprix tips the scales towards ADK. I would still be happy with a Seprix lynch, though.

*Yes, I know that wagons on town are not as informative as wagons on scum, and that we aren't 100% sure that WW is town. That doesn't mean we should ignore it.


Quote
ADK is a good lynch as well, not my preferred but I'll join it if needed. His interactions with Awaclus are more subtle but that's to be expected since ADK is more experienced. It's just that when you lynch scum on day 1, I think the simplest answer tends to be the right one (and here the simplest answers are Seprix and pacovf).

Considering our playstyles, do you really think that ADK being more subtle here is actually so good an argument that you put him on an entirely different willing-to-lynch category than Seprix and I?

Honestly, after finishing the reread, ADK seems quite a bit scummier than I am, but then again, I am terribly biased.


Quote
People need to stop giving massive towncred for just doing work btw. People like pacovf will absolutely do that as scum, especially when their day 1 interactions are as damning as they are here. It's fine to give some towncred for it (it's a big reason why I prefer lynching Seprix to pacovf), but just like mail-mi lurking doesn't mean he's scum, pacovf (or me, or WW etc.) doing rereads doesn't mean they're town.

Can we ignore this perfectly good point you are raising just because it would serve me? :P

More of the same, and that last quote of mine is still relevant so there.

Sure, we can wait, don't worry.

In the meantime, Seprix, care to defend yourself or put your vote down somewhere?

Looks a bit partner-y, though Seprix wasn't the main wagon at that point, so meh.

I'm not too focused on the game. ADK and Pacovf could be announcing they're scum and I wouldn't know. College is hard :(

...did Seprix just concede the game here?

Not sure what that's about, I don't know why pacovf would read that as a confession, regardless of his alignement. Maybe someone else can make something of it ?

I see what UoS is saying regarding scum!mail-mi but I don't think you go that route as scum.

I think in Awaclus's position you avoid mentioning your partner entirely or toss a meaningless vote on them to throw off suspicion... which is to say, Seprix now looks scummier to me.

When Awaclus voted for Seprix, it was L-2, and the wagon was quickly growing. Granted, it was very early, but still.


I prefer an ADK lynch to a Seprix one, but would be happy with either. A mail-mi lynch would be fine too.

I would like to hear ADK's defense before we lynch anyone, but I am not averse to people getting votes down already. Especially Seprix and mail-mi (skip is not happening today).

One thing I'm noticing in this reread is how consistent pacovf's reads are. Which, in case you're wondering, is not that townie. This is probably me looking at it with scum-colored glasses though at this point, as I'm fairly convinced.

vote: Seprix, the things you are saying are just way too weird. L-1?

Seprix was indeed being a little weird, speculating openly about ADK's role (because of the whole scumslip discussion). Not sure why that warranted the vote but ADK had just done a reread, maybe pacovf felt the wind was blowing in Seprix's way at that point, since he was at 4 votes with ADK at 3 (including pac).

Then Seprix claims, and pacovf is the one who pokes holes in it. I think those holes would have been found either way, but could maybe has bought Seprix a day if I and others had been lazy. That still deserves some towncred from pacvof, he certainly didn't have to do that. But if he thinks Seprix is going to be lynched, he's going to need to grab all the towncred he can get, because he has to get through 3 mislynches at that point, so the scum narrative is definitely there. Again, I can't really look at this objectively now, I'm pretty convinced, but this doesn't dissuade me.

And there's a bit more left but it's less relevant. I might get back to it at some point, but seriously guys, they're getting into the Pyrénées right now.

vote: pacovf

I will reread skip and mail-mi next, but I'm prety certain we should lynch pacovf today.

PPE : With chair's vote, that's L-1.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1123 on: July 14, 2015, 01:42:12 pm »

And I'm still just a VT. I think Pacovf has been taking way too much charge with this game, and everyone is following him like sheep. vote: pacovf just in case I'm not right now.

...have we been following the same game?


@Teproc: I don't think you are giving me enough credit for my role in Seprix's lynch. It didn't look like he was going to get lynched when I shot his claim down. I could also have kept my focus on mail-mi during D2. There were enough people that were ready to lynch him if needed.

I think you are so convinced of my scuminess by the time you end up reading D1, that you don't weight properly all the other, later things that should shake your read on me, at the very least to the same degree as mail-mi.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1124 on: July 14, 2015, 01:42:29 pm »

I agree that chairs is pretty much conf!town though.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1125 on: July 14, 2015, 02:01:44 pm »

And I'm still just a VT. I think Pacovf has been taking way too much charge with this game, and everyone is following him like sheep. vote: pacovf just in case I'm not right now.

...have we been following the same game?


I'm talking about the last couple days.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1126 on: July 14, 2015, 11:27:36 pm »

Scheisse, less than 17 hours to deadline, and I am not going to be super available tomorrow. Man, I dropped the ball today, sorry. Teproc, if you want to reread more people, it will have to be quick...

In case I can't contribute tomorrow, I would just like to say that if mail-mi ends up winning this game as scum, I shall be very put out.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1127 on: July 15, 2015, 05:46:20 am »

I will reread mail-mi and skip before deadline.

You're right that I'm dismissing your Seprix wagon because your day 1 convinced me, but I don't think that's a mistake. Because we lynched scum on day 1, that is by far the most significant day.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1128 on: July 15, 2015, 10:06:25 am »

The most significant, ok, maybe. But well, that's basically the only thing you are giving consideration to, and you basically admit in your own reread-case on me that by the end you are dismissing things that would normally make you think I am towny. Not enough to mark me as a townread when giving consideration to everything, ok, fair enough, but I don't think I am the only reasonable lynch today, as you are trying to make it look like (cf. mail-mi).

I don't know if what you are doing is the right thing to do or not, in the general case. I am biased by the knowledge of my alignment.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1129 on: July 15, 2015, 10:08:38 am »

Well, if Hydrad and chairs don't log in today, then I am the only feasible lynch. That sucks.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1130 on: July 15, 2015, 11:03:10 am »

I mean, I'm logged in.

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Vote Count
« Reply #1131 on: July 15, 2015, 11:34:50 am »

Vote Count 4.2

pacovf (3): mail-mi, chairs, Teproc
mail-mi (2): skip wooznum, pacovf

Not Voting (1): Hydrad

With 6 alive, it takes 4 to lynch. Day 4 ends at Jul 15, 4 PM Forum Time. That is in 4,5 hours.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1132 on: July 15, 2015, 11:37:25 am »

Seprix, OTOH, is constantly following the flow of town on pacovf, null when consensus haven't formed yet, then town when everyone sees him as town, then slight doubt when cases are made against him. Easily the player that fits the best so far.
this is big for me. It's swaying me towards pacovf here. And seprix was pushing mail-mi day 2 as was pointed out. I'm ready to hammer.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1133 on: July 15, 2015, 11:43:43 am »

I'd be fine with it. I was going to reread mail-mi and, well, you later today but I doubt I'll change my mind at this point.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1134 on: July 15, 2015, 12:57:09 pm »

Well, there's only so much one can say to defend himself.



I think you should no-lynch tomorrow, just for some extra peace of mind against conspiracy theories.

Man, you should have lynched mail-mi today, you are not going to like tomorrow's choice.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #1135 on: July 15, 2015, 01:31:03 pm »

Vote: Seprix

Stop voting my scum partner kthxbye

Vote: Hydrad

mail-mi doesn't have a lot of posts so that's the ind of stuff (this was during RVS) we have to work with. Probably more likely to vote for a scum partner than a random town player at that point in the game, but it's not much.

That's literally it for day 1 as far as interactions with Seprix and Awaclus go. Which means light scum to me : it should really be null, but the way day 1 went down, having an inactive partner would be an explaining factor.

HOORAY Awaclus was scum!

I think we need to lynch off-wagon today.

Final Vote Count Day 1

Awaclus (7): Hydrad, Witherweaver, UmbrageOfSnow, Teproc, chairs, Seprix, A Drowned Kernel
Teproc (1): mail-mi
mail-mi (1): pacovf
chairs (2): Awaclus, Joseph2302

Not Voting (1): skip wooznum

With 12 alive, it took 7 to lynch.

...which, well, really narrows it down to Pacovf and Skip. Skip was acting pretty scummy yesterday, and not having your vote on someone is bad news, like he wanted to find an argument for anyone else but couldn't, but didn't want to vote his scum partner. (Haven't reread end of Day 1 yet so don't know if this is what his posts felt like). vote: skip wooznum

The "HOORAY" thing is a little much, but it looks pretty good that mail-mi immediately assumes we're lynching on-wagon. If he's scum, that means he gets lynched eventually. Maybe he was planning to take the fall for Seprix, which would fit since mail-mi knew he was going to be absent, but that seems like a terrible, terrible strategy.

Not lynching Pacovf today. I liked that analysis. And ADK is now definitely my top lynch choice behind Skip.

And of course, not a single post by mail-mi anywhere near this.

Already told you why.

Seprix not mentioned. I think he only had one vote at that point, but still, ADK and skip were the other two possible lynches (aside from himself of course), so that's pretty convenient.

I don't know what to add, so I guess I can answer any questions you guys have for me.

You could start by moving your vote to someone that might actually get lynched today.

Quote
Also, I'm going on a week long vacation next week with no internet access. So maybe it might be a good idea to lynch me just because of that.

...

Erm, I think skip might be lynched today.

I am town, but I'm just a VT and I haven't been contributing to the game at all anyway, so I'm the best town you could possibly lynch.

Right, that happenned. Again, this is the "mail-mi falls on his sword and bets on Seprix living" scenario, but that seems like a horrible, horrible strategy. Or it's a grab for towncred... I don't know, it reads genuine to me.

I don't remember anyone else saying that they wanted to lynch skip today. Nobody has built a real case on him either. It seems quite unlikely.

Well, I guess I could vote: seprix then.


That's L-2. Don't think it buys him towncred more than it does pacovf, but it means that scum!mail-mi's strategy would have made 0 sense on day 2.

unvote I believe seprix.

Oh wait, now it does, of course. Ok, so there's maybe something there, because it did look like Seprix might survive thanks to his claim before pacovf threw it apart.


And then he pretty enthusiastically goes for the easy mislynches (though basically everyone went for ADK, so meh). Hm. There's more there than I expected frankly. Claiming VT and saying "just lynch" me just doesn't seem like a scum!mail-mi move. I still think pacovf isabetter lynch but it's closer than I thought.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #1136 on: July 15, 2015, 02:18:05 pm »

Hm. There's more there than I expected frankly.

Told you so! You still have 1h45 to change your vote. Go ahead, I promise I won't hold your temporary fit of madness against you.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #1137 on: July 15, 2015, 02:37:14 pm »

Told you so! You still have 1h45 to change your vote. Go ahead, I promise I won't hold your temporary fit of madness against you.

vote: pacovf Scrambling scum.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1138 on: July 15, 2015, 02:50:04 pm »

Hehe, you were already voting for me  :P
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1139 on: July 15, 2015, 03:34:20 pm »

Hm. There's more there than I expected frankly.

Told you so! You still have 1h45 to change your vote. Go ahead, I promise I won't hold your temporary fit of madness against you.

If others change their minds on you I will, but at this point it doesn't look likely.

Which, by the way, we need Hydrad or skip around to get a lynch here. No lynch is probably horrible ? Well actually it's not that bad, we still get 2 shots at lynching scum but still.
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Re: Vote Count
« Reply #1140 on: July 15, 2015, 03:34:57 pm »

Vote Count 4.3

pacovf (3): mail-mi, chairs, Teproc
mail-mi (2): skip wooznum, pacovf

Not Voting (1): Hydrad

With 6 alive, it takes 4 to lynch. Day 4 ends at Jul 15, 4 PM Forum Time. That is in 30 minutes.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1141 on: July 15, 2015, 03:35:45 pm »

To be clear I still prefe lynching pacovf, but lynching mail-mi seems good as well. I'm pretty confident the last scum is between those two anyway, skip seems super townie.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1142 on: July 15, 2015, 03:36:47 pm »

Hm. There's more there than I expected frankly.

Told you so! You still have 1h45 to change your vote. Go ahead, I promise I won't hold your temporary fit of madness against you.

If others change their minds on you I will, but at this point it doesn't look likely.

Which, by the way, we need Hydrad or skip around to get a lynch here. No lynch is probably horrible ? Well actually it's not that bad, we still get 2 shots at lynching scum but still.

I think a no-lynch tomorrow is actually quite beneficial to town. No-lynch today is slightly less optimal, but that's what it's looking like.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1143 on: July 15, 2015, 03:38:05 pm »

I'm certainly hoping that skip is town, otherwise we've lost this (barring me suddenly getting hypnotic powers).
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1144 on: July 15, 2015, 03:40:39 pm »

Well, I guess it's vote: pacovf time
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1145 on: July 15, 2015, 03:41:27 pm »

good luck tomorrow, still think you should no-lynch.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1146 on: July 15, 2015, 03:42:37 pm »

First time I'm mislynched! i am sure there's things to be learned from this.
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Re: Vote Count
« Reply #1147 on: July 15, 2015, 04:04:23 pm »

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1148 on: July 15, 2015, 04:04:40 pm »

Final Vote Count Day 4

pacovf (4): mail-mi, chairs, Teproc, skip wooznum
mail-mi (1): pacovf

Not Voting (1): Hydrad

With 6 alive, it took 4 to lynch.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 4)
« Reply #1149 on: July 15, 2015, 04:06:51 pm »

pacovf has been lynched. He was Lyra playing as Cold Autumn, a Vanilla Townie.

Night 4 starts now and ends at Jul 16, 4 pm Forum Time.

If anyone wants the night to last 2 real days, say so in your QT and I will prolong it one day.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 4)
« Reply #1150 on: July 16, 2015, 04:22:49 pm »

Hydrad has died in the night. He was Rarity playing as Twilight Sparkle, the Universal Backup and Innocent Child.

Day 5 starts!

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Re: Vote Count
« Reply #1151 on: July 16, 2015, 04:24:03 pm »

Vote Count 5.0

Not Voting (4): Teproc, mail-mi, chairs, skip wooznum

With 4 alive, it takes 3 to lynch. Day 5 ends at July 23, 4 PM Forum Time.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2015, 04:48:39 pm by silverspawn »
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 5)
« Reply #1152 on: July 16, 2015, 04:43:29 pm »

Well, that was the smart choice. Bravo, scum.

vote: no lynch

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 5)
« Reply #1153 on: July 16, 2015, 04:46:09 pm »

Hm. Well, let's get this day out of the way.

vote: no lynch
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Re: Vote Count
« Reply #1154 on: July 16, 2015, 04:48:25 pm »

Vote Count 5.1

Not Voting (2): mail-mi, skip wooznum
No-Lynch (2): chairs, Teproc {L-1}

With 4 alive, it takes 3 to lynch. Day 5 ends at July 23, 4 PM Forum Time.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 5)
« Reply #1155 on: July 16, 2015, 04:50:47 pm »

Just in case : no lynch is good here because we have no IC. Because everyone is (more or less) in the lynch pool, no lynching forces scum to narrow the lynch pool by one player, which is obviously better for us. It's unlikely to change much, but still the best play here.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 5)
« Reply #1156 on: July 16, 2015, 07:50:44 pm »

I'll wait for skip to post but yeah vote: no lynch.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 5)
« Reply #1157 on: July 16, 2015, 09:22:53 pm »

vote: no lynch sorry to steal the hammer :P
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 5)
« Reply #1158 on: July 16, 2015, 09:32:25 pm »

vote: no lynch sorry to steal the hammer :P

Jerk. :P

vote: no lynch anyway. :P
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Vote Count
« Reply #1159 on: July 16, 2015, 09:37:07 pm »

Final Vote Count Day 5

Not Voting (1): mail-mi

No-Lynch (3): chairs, Teproc, skip wooznum

With 4 alive, it took 3 to decide.

No-one has been lynched. Night 5 begins now and ends at July 17, 6 PM Forum Time.

As last time, I will delay it on request or if necessary.


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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Night 5)
« Reply #1160 on: July 17, 2015, 07:03:32 pm »

skip wooznum has died in the night. He was Fluttershy playing as Pinkie Pie, a Town Roleblocker.

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Re: Vote Count
« Reply #1161 on: July 17, 2015, 07:04:42 pm »

Vote Count 6.1

Not Voting (3): mail-mi, chairs, Teproc

With 3 alive, it takes 2 to lynch. Day 6 ends at July 24, 7 PM Forum Time.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1162 on: July 17, 2015, 07:46:15 pm »

well... that's actually pretty good for me, since I was totally going to vote skip!

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1163 on: July 17, 2015, 07:47:06 pm »

Sooo...

mail-mi: Why is Teproc scum?

Teproc: Why is mail-mi scum?

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1164 on: July 17, 2015, 07:54:16 pm »

Well, this definitely wasn't the kill I expected... what ?

I guess I'll reread chairs now... this all looks too neat though. Won't get to it before monday though. In the meantime, no one vote, lylo, please reread stuff, etc. That includes you mail-mi, if you're town you've got serious work to do here.

@chairs : I did reread mail-mi late last day so you've got that.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1165 on: July 17, 2015, 10:45:00 pm »

Well, this definitely wasn't the kill I expected... what ?

I guess I'll reread chairs now... this all looks too neat though. Won't get to it before monday though. In the meantime, no one vote, lylo, please reread stuff, etc. That includes you mail-mi, if you're town you've got serious work to do here.

@chairs : I did reread mail-mi late last day so you've got that.

I know. And it stinks that I'm only on phone. :(
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1166 on: July 18, 2015, 11:00:55 am »

I was definitely expecting me to die.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1167 on: July 18, 2015, 11:46:35 am »

Well, one of you two is scum. Had I been scum, I definitely would not have killed skip because he's the only other one I could feasibly throw some suspicion on. And now I'm the obvious lynch, and when/if I get lynched scum has a party.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1168 on: July 19, 2015, 12:10:37 pm »

I feel like this game has basically devolved into a Mexican standoff. None of us wants to be the first mover here in case we're wrong on our reads.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1169 on: July 19, 2015, 09:35:11 pm »

Either that or it's the week-end and people are busy. Also one of us is mail-mi. I'll be doing my part tomorrow.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1170 on: July 20, 2015, 02:27:27 am »

Also one of us is mail-mi.

Okay, I'm honestly a little peeved at this. I get that you nor most other people don't like my playstyle, but guess what? I don't care. I play these games to have fun, not give myself another couple hours of work each time I play. So, while I do put in the effort when it matters, I'm not going to spend hours and hours working on this. And, I'm also much more of an observer, in the games and real life. So I don't post as much as others. Sorry if it bothers you, but that's how it is.

...that being said, this is lylo and I need to make sure I'm not lynched so town doesn't lose. I'll be home Wednesday morning, I'll do rereading then if I get the chance.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1171 on: July 20, 2015, 02:28:47 am »

Also don't mean for this to get hostile.  :-\ It just had to be said.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1172 on: July 20, 2015, 06:13:47 am »

Sorry, I didn't mean anything by it mail-mi, I understand it's your playstyle, and while I do think it can be anti-town sometimes, well it's just a game.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #1173 on: July 20, 2015, 08:47:55 am »

Rereading chairs.

Can we just vote: awaclus and get rolling? I want to see what N1's NK will be already so we can work with it D2.

This puts Awaclus at L-2, pretty decisive, though...

Yay a reread post I can get behind!

vote: seprix, you convinced me.

He gets off the Awaclus wagon after I express suspicion of Seprix in my reread...but that's jumping from one scum to another, so it can't be deflection obviously.

Unrelated, the more tight-lipped Awaclus gets/feels, the more I want to lynch him. This feels a lot like how I reacted to suspicion in D1 of HP Mafia.

Feels like a genuine argument, and Awaclus was pretty much dead in the water at this point, so it could be scum!chairs planning to come back on the bus... from another bus. Yeah, if chairs is scum, his day 1 was bold as hell.

make that 5/7.

vote: awaclus.

There we go, that's L-2 again.

I find Seprix's actions here a little questionable.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who seems a possible scum!Seprix.

This is still day 1, after Seprix hammers. chairs would have needed to have decided to bus both partners right on day 1. I don't really buy it (though he came relatively late to the Seprix wagon later I think).

If I were Awaclus, at least one of my partners would be "null". He only has two people on that list at null.

Let's lynch skip.

Ok, so that's something (it'd relatively early in day 2). But then...

scum!seprix = scum!skip.

So... ok, there could be something here. chairs, after bussing Awaclus, figures the only way he wins is by surviving alone, and gets ready to bus Seprix, though he'd rather he live longer obviously, so while he's ready to bus, he's pushing other wagons. That's... a possible narrative. I guess.

vote: seprix. Seprix pacovf scum team with pacman gambit on an adk mislynch into maybe a we mislynch before we trash seprix and he comes up roses no matter what.

Aaaand that's a vote on Seprix when there's only one on him and little pressure. Ok then, scratch that thought I suppose.

Just acknowledge that I'm a virtual IC so we can move on from there.

Super bold thing to say if he's scum.

He does move off the Seprix wagon before coming back to it and hammering past the point of no return. That hammer is not that telling in and of itself (Seprix was going to be lynched no matter what at that point), but still, I just can't fit chair's play with any kind of scum narrative at this point. The only one that's left is that he decided to bus both his partners midway through day 1 and... why would he do that ?

Yeah, ok, there's no way it's chairs. Well, I've said that before and been wrong, but still, I just don't see it. WIll reread mail-mi sometime this week just to make sure, but I'm thining the skip kill was just a desperate mail-mi trying to throw us a curveball to hope taht it makes us doubt ourselves maybe ?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1174 on: July 20, 2015, 02:39:51 pm »

Oh, I guess yeah you guys should reread me. I just assumed we all knew I was Town at this point and we were debating which of you was scum :P

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1175 on: July 21, 2015, 01:04:59 pm »

I'll get to my mail-mi reread soon, but guys, do something. Deadline is in 3 days, and this is lylo, we really don't want to have to rush things. There's still time, but not that much.

chairs : I see now you want me to also explain why I'm town. I'm sorry but I can't really do that, you'll have to reread me and make up your own mind... I find that people defending themselves is rarely productive. And yeah, I know I'm not the most fun player to reread, but well, it's lylo, you're going to have to do it.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1176 on: July 21, 2015, 02:07:27 pm »

vote: teproc

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1177 on: July 21, 2015, 02:30:12 pm »

vote: teproc

Okay, confirming I'm not scum.

Why?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1178 on: July 21, 2015, 02:43:03 pm »

Wait, what ?

Really ? Well I guess it's all a bonus from now on, because we were about to lose badly. vote: chairs
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1179 on: July 21, 2015, 02:48:15 pm »

And now the choice is mine. Oh dear.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1180 on: July 21, 2015, 02:52:05 pm »

Trying to make sense of this. I guess chairs decided to bus early day 1, and decided to act very suspicious of Serix then without actually pushing his lynch, since his on-wagon vote was the hammer.

Man, that means both scum bussed on day 1 two. Weird game.

mail-mi, please take the time to reread. Hopefully it should clear things up ? Not sure what else there is I can do to convince you.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1181 on: July 21, 2015, 02:55:41 pm »

Trying to make sense of this. I guess chairs decided to bus early day 1, and decided to act very suspicious of Serix then without actually pushing his lynch, since his on-wagon vote was the hammer.

Man, that means both scum bussed on day 1 two. Weird game.

mail-mi, please take the time to reread. Hopefully it should clear things up ? Not sure what else there is I can do to convince you.

Tomorrow morning/afternoon. Count on it.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1182 on: July 21, 2015, 03:38:47 pm »

The fact that mail mi didn't vote means I'm right. Awesome!

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1183 on: July 22, 2015, 12:51:02 pm »

Deadline is in ~55 hours.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1184 on: July 22, 2015, 01:10:58 pm »

Okay. I reread. I have to vote: teproc.

I hope I'm right.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1185 on: July 22, 2015, 01:12:30 pm »

Yeah. I'm trying to think what would have happened if I had killed chairs instead of skip, but I don't know.

chairs, what made you vote for me ? Not being willing to defend myself is legitimately what I would have done as town...

Anyway, gg town.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1186 on: July 22, 2015, 01:14:33 pm »

I felt like I was forced to bus Awaclus, and then the Seprix bus was going to have to happen at some point, not sure how I could have ahndled this game better. Probably something in the NKs, but most of those were on IC-ish people. I even got the pacovf lynch to have a mail-mi mislynch available at mylo, that seemed like the ideal scenario.

Mafia QT
My QT
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1187 on: July 22, 2015, 01:17:44 pm »

Yeah, I have trouble defending against people that make sense.

It was nicely done anyway! I only started being suspicious of yourself when you survived all the way to Lylo.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1188 on: July 22, 2015, 01:28:22 pm »

Teproc, you've posted the link to your personal QT twice.

My own QT. There's not much in there, aside from me being very wrong.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1189 on: July 22, 2015, 01:29:38 pm »

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1190 on: July 22, 2015, 01:33:28 pm »

People should have just sheeped me Day 1.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1191 on: July 22, 2015, 01:34:51 pm »

People should have just sheeped me Day 1.

As you'll see in QTs, I was downright terrified of you, and almost wanted to kill you N1 (which would've been dumb). You know my scum meta too well.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1192 on: July 22, 2015, 01:46:57 pm »

Thinking about who's MVP, I'd probably go skip, him suspecting me (and I see in the speccy that he would have voted for me at lylo) is what put me in an awful situation when I had to do the last kill. Credits to pacovf for insisting on how good no lynching was (town 100% loses if we lynch right away), though that was a pretty obvious call there.

chairs would be the other consideration, for the gambit of voting for me at lylo. I think the choice was much easier for mail-mi once it's between chairs and me.

Actually chairs also was on-wagon both times, so it's probably got to be chairs.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1193 on: July 22, 2015, 02:05:40 pm »

chairs, skip and Teproc seem like reasonable MVP choices. UoS played very well too.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1194 on: July 22, 2015, 02:22:26 pm »

WOOHOO!

I thought I was going to be wrong for sure. Anyway, give all credit to chairs, I don't deserve anything for this game.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1195 on: July 22, 2015, 02:22:35 pm »

Just read the Mafia QT. Yeah, I don't think you could have predicted chairs turning on you, and skip would have done so too, although maybe mail-mi would have voted for skip rather than you. I was mad at you (not really) by how deftly you managed to wave away my towncred for the Seprix lynch before I could capitalize on it, but it turned out to be for the best ^^
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1196 on: July 22, 2015, 02:36:47 pm »

Also, go sign up for DGIM2!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1197 on: July 22, 2015, 03:52:42 pm »

Just read the Mafia QT. Yeah, I don't think you could have predicted chairs turning on you, and skip would have done so too, although maybe mail-mi would have voted for skip rather than you. I was mad at you (not really) by how deftly you managed to wave away my towncred for the Seprix lynch before I could capitalize on it, but it turned out to be for the best ^^

Yeah that was pretty essential as I couldn't have too many ICs, and I felt you would be more lynchable than skip. It also had the advantage of being seemingly against my interest (since I bussed Seprix from the get go on day 2, so day 2 looked great for me), which is the kind of thing I was hoping would save me at lylo when people reread.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1198 on: July 22, 2015, 03:56:12 pm »

God, I played like shit this game.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1199 on: July 22, 2015, 04:03:34 pm »

The way you engaged me during lylo was the lynchpin, but I was 100% sold on D5 that mail-mi was Town, so skip dying sealed it. I just needed you to engage so mail-mi would have your reads (as I was hoping you'd somehow distort the truth) on him to make it so.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1200 on: July 22, 2015, 04:05:04 pm »

FWIW even in my QT I misread you all the way until D6.

http://www.quicktopic.com/51/H/6sviJHED6gH7

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1201 on: July 22, 2015, 04:08:42 pm »

The way you engaged me during lylo was the lynchpin, but I was 100% sold on D5 that mail-mi was Town, so skip dying sealed it. I just needed you to engage so mail-mi would have your reads (as I was hoping you'd somehow distort the truth) on him to make it so.

I see. What sold you on town!mail-mi ?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1202 on: July 22, 2015, 04:11:33 pm »

I see. What sold you on town!mail-mi ?
This^^
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1203 on: July 22, 2015, 04:38:44 pm »

Well, uhm. Yeah. Town wins. chairs is mvp.

I was going to write flavor for the finale, but now it's pointless since the post game phase has already started - don't do that in future games, please - posting before the official flip, that is. technically, you're all violating the mafia ruleset.

And sorry for the ADK slipup.

QT's:

Mod
Mafia
Speccy
skip
chairs
mail-mi
Hydrad
best QT
Teproc
WW/hockey
UOS
ADK
Joseph
images

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1204 on: July 22, 2015, 04:43:27 pm »

Also, setups:

Setup #1:
Uniersal Backup
Doctor
Roleblocker
VT * 6
---
Godfather
1-Shot Strongman
Roleblocker


Setup #2:
Mason * 2
Doctor OR Cop
1-Shot Doctor OR 1-Shot Cop
VT * 5
---
Godfather
Strongman
Roleblocker


Setup #3:
Universal Backup
Innocent Child
Roleblocker
Doctor
VT * 6
---
Godfather
Strongman
Roleblocker

I chose #3 because #1 seemed kinda boring and #2 seemed kinda unbalanced. Also, I don't like cops. They're just too strong.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1205 on: July 22, 2015, 04:44:36 pm »

In the end it ended kinda like a vanilla setup with two IC's, but only because Teproc was the strongman. which I guess is fine.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1206 on: July 22, 2015, 05:01:18 pm »

Hah, UoS succesfully baited me into NKing me, those were intentional PR breadcrumbs ! Nice. Not actually impactful, but still.

@silverspawn : I guess it's technically against the rules, but really once scum comes out after the lylo lynch, there's no reason to wait for the mod to show up to start post-game discussion. You could still have written flavor if you wanted to, I'm pretty sure in similar cases before mods who cared about it have written flavor. Sorry if we ruined your endgame there.

Yeah the setup ended up favouring scum, but only because I was the strongman. Had I been the roleblocker, it would have been much, much harder.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1207 on: July 22, 2015, 05:02:04 pm »

into NKing him*
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1208 on: July 22, 2015, 05:07:56 pm »

@silverspawn : I guess it's technically against the rules, but really once scum comes out after the lylo lynch, there's no reason to wait for the mod to show up to start post-game discussion.

I mean, there is no rational reason. I think it breaks immersion.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1209 on: July 22, 2015, 05:30:58 pm »

I, for one, would still like to see the flavor.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1210 on: July 22, 2015, 05:40:27 pm »

I was going to write flavor for the finale, but now it's pointless since the post game phase has already started - don't do that in future games, please - posting before the official flip, that is. technically, you're all violating the mafia ruleset.

Sorry! I figured you were taking your time because you wanted to write flavour, so I got carried away and started posting. I didn't think it would bother you :( Will be more careful from now on.

Yay I win best QT
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1211 on: July 22, 2015, 06:13:56 pm »

Can someone point to where UoS was breadcrumbing a PR? I don't remember seeing that.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1212 on: July 22, 2015, 06:47:03 pm »

I love that the speccy is like "LOL WHAT CHAIRS"

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1213 on: July 22, 2015, 07:22:33 pm »

/m11 in pacovf's QT just blew my mind.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1214 on: July 22, 2015, 07:32:24 pm »

Wow great game guys!! Thx ss for modding!! To anyone who suggested me for mvp, im flattered but quite frankly I didn't begin to deserve it. I think teproc or chairs or uos should get it
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1215 on: July 22, 2015, 07:35:51 pm »

And the rb power was quite frustating really. I was aching for the strongman to just die already so it would be useful.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1216 on: July 22, 2015, 09:30:11 pm »

wow good job. I'm so glad I got NK'ed s i would of given teproc the town read and thrown the game.

gj team!
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1217 on: July 23, 2015, 09:38:54 am »

Can we do some theory talk on having an IC in this setup?

It looks like it's of almost dare I say negative utility to town as it gives scum the ability to disarm the UB. Please discuss.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1218 on: July 23, 2015, 09:43:36 am »

Can we do some theory talk on having an IC in this setup?

It looks like it's of almost dare I say negative utility to town as it gives scum the ability to disarm the UB. Please discuss.

It also makes scum's first NK automatic, especially if they have Strongman (assuming the day 1 lynch wasn't a town PR). Even if it's only 1-shot, it's probably the right call for them to use it N1 to kill the IC and neutralize the UB. To clarify the problem : the UB is an IC anyway since he can't profitably be counterclaimed.

The problem is that you then need to completely change the whole M letter. A single M can't give you two masons, and there's no other way that makes sense, so you'd need to a whole other category of roles instead.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1219 on: July 23, 2015, 09:55:38 am »

Can we do some theory talk on having an IC in this setup?

It looks like it's of almost dare I say negative utility to town as it gives scum the ability to disarm the UB. Please discuss.

It also makes scum's first NK automatic, especially if they have Strongman (assuming the day 1 lynch wasn't a town PR). Even if it's only 1-shot, it's probably the right call for them to use it N1 to kill the IC and neutralize the UB. To clarify the problem : the UB is an IC anyway since he can't profitably be counterclaimed.

The problem is that you then need to completely change the whole M letter. A single M can't give you two masons, and there's no other way that makes sense, so you'd need to a whole other category of roles instead.
or just that UB doesn't inherit IC powers
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1220 on: July 23, 2015, 10:14:47 am »

I have all sorts of interesting ideas for Mafia, one of them being an IC created randomly from a Vanilla town come D2-D3 if no scum is lynched for example.

I really wanna create a game.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1221 on: July 23, 2015, 11:29:26 am »

A variation on IC that can either be revealed when the player PM's the mod, or is automatically revealed on a certain day could fix the UB-disarming power, but that's significantly stronger than a regular IC is.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1222 on: July 23, 2015, 11:32:44 am »

I have a lot of wacky ideas. Honestly, my first game I make one day (when I figure it out, I want to co mod with someone to make sure I don't fuck up) I want to probably do bastard. :p
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1223 on: July 23, 2015, 12:24:36 pm »

A variation on IC that can either be revealed when the player PM's the mod, or is automatically revealed on a certain day could fix the UB-disarming power, but that's significantly stronger than a regular IC is.

I mean, you can also just add a one-shot cop. That's kind of an IC variant.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1224 on: July 23, 2015, 12:25:03 pm »

I have a lot of wacky ideas. Honestly, my first game I make one day (when I figure it out, I want to co mod with someone to make sure I don't fuck up) I want to probably do bastard. :p

if it's bastard, you can't really fuck it up.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1225 on: July 23, 2015, 12:28:03 pm »

I have a lot of wacky ideas. Honestly, my first game I make one day (when I figure it out, I want to co mod with someone to make sure I don't fuck up) I want to probably do bastard. :p

if it's bastard, you can't really fuck it up.

I'm not worried about balance. I'm worried about screwing up background stuff and not posting things in the thread right and I don't know the system to do it. Seriously, if someone could just tell me what to do and what to put in the beginning thread, I could do the rest no problem, though also being with a co-mod for the first game just to make sure things run smoothly, you know?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1226 on: July 23, 2015, 12:31:47 pm »

A variation on IC that can either be revealed when the player PM's the mod, or is automatically revealed on a certain day could fix the UB-disarming power, but that's significantly stronger than a regular IC is.

I mean, you can also just add a one-shot cop. That's kind of an IC variant.
how is a one-shot cop an IC variant?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #1227 on: July 23, 2015, 12:34:45 pm »

A variation on IC that can either be revealed when the player PM's the mod, or is automatically revealed on a certain day could fix the UB-disarming power, but that's significantly stronger than a regular IC is.

I mean, you can also just add a one-shot cop. That's kind of an IC variant.
how is a one-shot cop an IC variant?

he creates an IC night 1, then claims it day 2.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1228 on: July 23, 2015, 12:38:31 pm »

A variation on IC that can either be revealed when the player PM's the mod, or is automatically revealed on a certain day could fix the UB-disarming power, but that's significantly stronger than a regular IC is.
I mean you sort of say what the problem with your solution is so I'll just say, yes I agree with that.

At it's core I think the issue is that having the UB inherit IC powers makes for an incredibly weak UB. (Teproc already pointed out the UB is an IC anyway, which I meant to point out but forgot. Thx for that.) The most direct way to fix that is to just say it doesn't inherit IC powers. (Or that UB doesn't waste its inheriting ability on a power it already has, if we're keeping with that parenthetical logic.)
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 1 start!)
« Reply #1229 on: July 23, 2015, 12:39:05 pm »

A variation on IC that can either be revealed when the player PM's the mod, or is automatically revealed on a certain day could fix the UB-disarming power, but that's significantly stronger than a regular IC is.

I mean, you can also just add a one-shot cop. That's kind of an IC variant.
how is a one-shot cop an IC variant?

he creates an IC night 1, then claims it day 2.
well maybe they're both scum
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1230 on: July 23, 2015, 12:41:23 pm »

There aren't that many setups where you get an IC anyway.  It's a balancing measure for the game.  Plus, if you mislynch a town PR D1, it's inherited instead.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1231 on: July 23, 2015, 12:42:43 pm »

There aren't that many setups where you get an IC anyway. 
yes but why are there any?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1232 on: July 23, 2015, 12:43:40 pm »

There aren't that many setups where you get an IC anyway. 
yes but why are there any?
because IC's are super cool!

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1233 on: July 23, 2015, 12:44:16 pm »

A variation on IC that can either be revealed when the player PM's the mod, or is automatically revealed on a certain day could fix the UB-disarming power, but that's significantly stronger than a regular IC is.
I mean you sort of say what the problem with your solution is so I'll just say, yes I agree with that.

At it's core I think the issue is that having the UB inherit IC powers makes for an incredibly weak UB. (Teproc already pointed out the UB is an IC anyway, which I meant to point out but forgot. Thx for that.) The most direct way to fix that is to just say it doesn't inherit IC powers. (Or that UB doesn't waste its inheriting ability on a power it already has, if we're keeping with that parenthetical logic.)

The question is whether significantly stronger than an IC is too strong for town though.  And with the delayed-reveal IC the UB is worse if town is doing really well and hasn't lost any PRs yet, and better if town is doing poorly.  Plus it sticks to the similar-types theme of the letters.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1234 on: July 23, 2015, 12:45:02 pm »

There aren't that many setups where you get an IC anyway. 
yes but why are there any?
Realizing now that you might be answering that with your next sentence, I just don't understand what it means. Whats a balancing measure?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Day 6)
« Reply #1235 on: July 23, 2015, 12:54:43 pm »

A variation on IC that can either be revealed when the player PM's the mod, or is automatically revealed on a certain day could fix the UB-disarming power, but that's significantly stronger than a regular IC is.
I mean you sort of say what the problem with your solution is so I'll just say, yes I agree with that.

At it's core I think the issue is that having the UB inherit IC powers makes for an incredibly weak UB. (Teproc already pointed out the UB is an IC anyway, which I meant to point out but forgot. Thx for that.) The most direct way to fix that is to just say it doesn't inherit IC powers. (Or that UB doesn't waste its inheriting ability on a power it already has, if we're keeping with that parenthetical logic.)

The question is whether significantly stronger than an IC is too strong for town though.  And with the delayed-reveal IC the UB is worse if town is doing really well and hasn't lost any PRs yet, and better if town is doing poorly.  Plus it sticks to the similar-types theme of the letters.
ah I didn't realize that was the question. Tbh I haven't really thought about it, I just assumed it was too strong for town. If that's the question, well, I'll have to think about it. And I don't know what you're getting at in the second sentence or what you're arguing for.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1236 on: July 23, 2015, 01:01:52 pm »

Let's say IC were to read "If you are still alive on Day 4 (or whatever, this is an example), the mod will publicly confirm that you are town."

If town is doing really well and only gets VTs killed and is killing scum, then that weakens the UB a bit because, as happened in this game, the UB inherits this power, which isn't so great.

If town is doing poorly and lynched or got NK'd a PR, then the UB is used up.  But there's a larger window for that than with a regular IC.

And some kind of IC is nice because it forms a similar function to mason, and all the letters stick to a theme.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1237 on: July 23, 2015, 01:02:43 pm »

And not adding on edge-case rules is more elegant is my larger point I guess.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1238 on: July 23, 2015, 01:15:51 pm »

An IC who gets revealed later is stronger than an opening-post IC, unless it's "revealed on day 10" or something crazy like that.

I think the best solution is to say UB can't inherit ICs. It's a legitimate question anyway, one that I believe ash had to rule on during the first iteration of this setup, so there's room there.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1239 on: July 23, 2015, 01:22:42 pm »

Let's say IC were to read "If you are still alive on Day 4 (or whatever, this is an example), the mod will publicly confirm that you are town."

If town is doing really well and only gets VTs killed and is killing scum, then that weakens the UB a bit because, as happened in this game, the UB inherits this power, which isn't so great.

If town is doing poorly and lynched or got NK'd a PR, then the UB is used up.  But there's a larger window for that than with a regular IC.

And some kind of IC is nice because it forms a similar function to mason, and all the letters stick to a theme.
I understand all this. What im asking is what is the relationship, if any, between the first and second sentences in this post:

The question is whether significantly stronger than an IC is too strong for town though.  And with the delayed-reveal IC the UB is worse if town is doing really well and hasn't lost any PRs yet, and better if town is doing poorly. 
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1240 on: July 23, 2015, 01:32:27 pm »

I don't really think a delayed-reveal IC is that strong, and if town is doing well it's a bit weaker than if town is doing poorly (in the way it interacts with the Universal Backup), which negates the difference between the two versions somewhat.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1241 on: July 23, 2015, 01:34:17 pm »

I mean it's still strictly better, but not by so much I think it makes town too strong.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1242 on: July 23, 2015, 01:37:54 pm »

I mean it's still strictly better, but not by so much I think it makes town too strong.
Ah, but edge case: Lynched D1
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1243 on: July 23, 2015, 01:39:41 pm »

I mean it's still strictly better, but not by so much I think it makes town too strong.
Ah, but edge case: Lynched D1
they wouldn't lynch him cuz he would claim. And if it gets to the he claimed was the reveal day and the mod doesn't make him IC they can just lynch him then.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1244 on: July 23, 2015, 02:00:03 pm »

I mean it's still strictly better, but not by so much I think it makes town too strong.
Ah, but edge case: Lynched D1
they wouldn't lynch him cuz he would claim. And if it gets to the he claimed was the reveal day and the mod doesn't make him IC they can just lynch him then.

You have clearly not played enough games of mafia yet.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1245 on: July 23, 2015, 02:01:27 pm »

Also, that would allow scum to fake-claim IC.  Which seems kind of fun.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1246 on: July 23, 2015, 02:01:53 pm »

I mean it's still strictly better, but not by so much I think it makes town too strong.
Ah, but edge case: Lynched D1
they wouldn't lynch him cuz he would claim. And if it gets to the he claimed was the reveal day and the mod doesn't make him IC they can just lynch him then.

You have clearly not played enough games of mafia yet.

No way you get lynched through a "the mod will claim me as IC tomorrow" claim. There's no scenario where that goes well for scum to fakeclaim (well, lylo excepted obviously).
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1247 on: July 23, 2015, 02:06:12 pm »

Also, that would allow scum to fake-claim IC.  Which seems kind of fun.
not really though. It's a fakeclaim that just gets you lynched later, seems awful. That's exactly why nobody claiming it would get lynched through the claim. And even if nobody got lynched through the claim, it's still awful for a fakeclaim cuz it gets you lynched later.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1248 on: July 23, 2015, 02:06:58 pm »

So... Is there anything special I need to know in modding a Mafia game?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1249 on: July 23, 2015, 02:07:18 pm »

I mean it's still strictly better, but not by so much I think it makes town too strong.
Ah, but edge case: Lynched D1
they wouldn't lynch him cuz he would claim. And if it gets to the he claimed was the reveal day and the mod doesn't make him IC they can just lynch him then.

You have clearly not played enough games of mafia yet.
I haven't, but I don't see how it's clear.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1250 on: July 23, 2015, 02:11:41 pm »

I mean it's still strictly better, but not by so much I think it makes town too strong.
Ah, but edge case: Lynched D1
they wouldn't lynch him cuz he would claim. And if it gets to the he claimed was the reveal day and the mod doesn't make him IC they can just lynch him then.

You have clearly not played enough games of mafia yet.
I haven't, but I don't see how it's clear.

Didn't someone get lynched same day in this game despite claiming?
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faust

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1251 on: July 23, 2015, 02:15:02 pm »

I mean it's still strictly better, but not by so much I think it makes town too strong.
Ah, but edge case: Lynched D1
they wouldn't lynch him cuz he would claim. And if it gets to the he claimed was the reveal day and the mod doesn't make him IC they can just lynch him then.

You have clearly not played enough games of mafia yet.
I haven't, but I don't see how it's clear.

I have often been in situations where people got lynched without a chance to claim.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1252 on: July 23, 2015, 02:51:24 pm »

So... Is there anything special I need to know in modding a Mafia game?

it's not hard per se (setup aside), you just need to be careful not to make mistakes. or, no, there isn't.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1253 on: July 23, 2015, 04:03:10 pm »

I mean it's still strictly better, but not by so much I think it makes town too strong.
Ah, but edge case: Lynched D1
they wouldn't lynch him cuz he would claim. And if it gets to the he claimed was the reveal day and the mod doesn't make him IC they can just lynch him then.

You have clearly not played enough games of mafia yet.
I haven't, but I don't see how it's clear.

Didn't someone get lynched same day in this game despite claiming?

All claims are not created equal. If you claim "I'm an IC that will be confirmed by the mod day 2 (or even day 3)", you are not getting lynched.

faust's point that you sometimes get lynched without getting the chance to claim is more relevant, but that's not the norm.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1254 on: July 23, 2015, 04:53:16 pm »

Also the role allows scum to fakeclaim it early to avoid a D1 scum flip.
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UmbrageOfSnow

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1255 on: July 23, 2015, 05:13:46 pm »

Also the role allows scum to fakeclaim it early to avoid a D1 scum flip.

Which makes me like it more.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #1256 on: July 23, 2015, 08:07:18 pm »

Oh, that game. That game was meaningless in terms of actual reads.

You got nothing on me. :)
really? I thought when you posted things like "g dee Dee bsjehdhbiskwbwbwkdodjvenkdjwj" it meant you were town (and then part of a cult). But no, i've read through quite a few game logs

On my play? I'm just like Faust and IG and Hydrad. I'm pretty much always scummy. :p
CTRL+F IG  :D
Really? I don't think I'm suspected much at all anymore. People joke about it a lot, but I've never felt like I get more suspicion than anyone else--I mean maybe, but I like never get lynched.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #1257 on: July 23, 2015, 08:52:30 pm »

Oh, that game. That game was meaningless in terms of actual reads.

You got nothing on me. :)
really? I thought when you posted things like "g dee Dee bsjehdhbiskwbwbwkdodjvenkdjwj" it meant you were town (and then part of a cult). But no, i've read through quite a few game logs

On my play? I'm just like Faust and IG and Hydrad. I'm pretty much always scummy. :p
CTRL+F IG  :D
Really? I don't think I'm suspected much at all anymore. People joke about it a lot, but I've never felt like I get more suspicion than anyone else--I mean maybe, but I like never get lynched.
has this been on your mind for the entire game?
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Signups Open, 2 spots left)
« Reply #1258 on: July 23, 2015, 08:58:02 pm »

has this been on your mind for the entire game?

Yes.
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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1259 on: July 23, 2015, 09:26:10 pm »

lol. naw. I just searched iterations of my username to see if I was mentioned at all  :'(
Narcissistic...maybe.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1260 on: July 23, 2015, 09:26:31 pm »

lol. naw. I just now searched for iterations of my username to see if I was mentioned at all  :'(
Narcissistic...maybe.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1261 on: July 23, 2015, 09:28:02 pm »

Um, clicked quote and thought I could edit my post for some reason. I really have no explanation aside from sleep deprivation.

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Re: M64: Pony-Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Town wins!)
« Reply #1262 on: July 23, 2015, 09:31:32 pm »

Um, clicked quote and thought I could edit my post for some reason. I really have no explanation aside from sleep deprivation.

vote: IG
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