Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Piemaster]

Okay, so now Dark Ages has been out for a while...

What do people think are the top 5 Dark Ages cards relative to their cost?

(I'm talking about overall average power, so please avoid cliche 'depends on the board' non-answers and the like)

[ftl]

Definitely Marauder and Cultist. They're worse than Witch and Sea Hag but they're still power cards. 

I definitely have a soft spot for Bandit Camp, which is pretty awesome as well IMO.

I think Knights have to be included in there. They can be vicious.

I think Hermit has to be included, it's both a trasher and a gainer and a mega-turn enabler...

So those would be my 5. Marauder, Cultist, Knights, Hermit, Bandit Camp.

[Beyond Awesome]

Knights
Rebuild
Cultist
Forager
Hermit

[brokoli]

1) Cultist, an absolutely amazing card for engines as for big money games
2) Rebuild, but I might overrate it
3) Marauder
4) Feodum, an excellent (and underrated) alt vp card overall
5) Bandit camp

Then Hermit, Poor house and Forager...

[achmed_sender]

I think I would include Counterfeit. It's rarely game-changing, but solid in almost every game. And it don't hurt much. I think (not in sense of mechanic) that you can compare it with venture. Its almost never a bad buy (sure there can be better ones but its not "bad")

And naturally Rebuild, Cultist, Marauder and Knights
Maybe also Bandit Camp and Wandering Ministrell, they are really power villages.

[werothegreat]

Rebuild, Forager, Count, Cultist, Market Square.

[jsh357]

This one doesn't count but I'm still mentioning it: Necropolis.  I can't count it as it's not a supply card, but having this from the start can really propel an engine.

5. Forager - Effective trasher that your opponent can occasionally make even better for you.  If it cost more than $3, it wouldn't be worth having, but it costs $3 so it typically is.

4. Squire - After more experience with it, I'm sure now that it's one of the best $2 cards.  Gaining attacks for trashing is more effective than you'd think, Squires are easy to pile out, and giving coin is almost as good as giving a card sometimes. 

3. Rebuild - This card can seriously warp your objective.  Suddenly bum-rushing Duchies doesn't seem like a bad plan.  I am still wrapping my head around the card.

2. Knights - Easily the best trashing attack.  You know a card is powerful when your opponent generally wants to buy one just to block them. 

1. Count - Gaining Duchies for nothing is just sick, and the +$3 is great too.  You don't care about gaining Coppers late in the game.  If you can get this with a 5/2 start, it can be one of the best trashers in the game because it remains useful at endgame.  To top it off, you can tuck away cards for next turn beneficially, making the effect the opposite of a drawback.  Count is one of the most handy cards to have around in the entire run of Dominion.


Other Honorable Mentions: Fortress, Scavenger (Double Scavenger BM is surprisingly good), Death Cart, Hermit, Band of Misfits, Junk Dealer

[massenburger]

Rebuild, Forager, Count, Cultist, Market Square.

No Knights? But what about Dame Molly???

[werothegreat]

Rebuild, Forager, Count, Cultist, Market Square.

No Knights? But what about Dame Molly???

Knights are often ignorable.  The first four I listed are never ignorable, and Market Square is just too damn awesome when you get it to work.

[LastFootnote]

Rebuild, Forager, Count, Cultist, Market Square.

No Knights? But what about Dame Molly???

Knights are often ignorable.  The first four I listed are never ignorable, and Market Square is just too damn awesome when you get it to work.

Never ignorable? Really? Rebuild is the one you can probably ignore the least, but the rest are definitely ignorable on the right boards. Especially Count, which loses a lot of utility in games with discarding attacks.

[Jimmmmm]

You really think it's possible to ignore Knights if your opponent starts getting them?

[eHalcyon]

Rebuild, Forager, Count, Cultist, Market Square.

No Knights? But what about Dame Molly???

Knights are often ignorable.  The first four I listed are never ignorable, and Market Square is just too damn awesome when you get it to work.

Never ignorable? Really? Rebuild is the one you can probably ignore the least, but the rest are definitely ignorable on the right boards. Especially Count, which loses a lot of utility in games with discarding attacks.

Agreed.  Forager is certainly ignorable in the presence of better trashing.  Count too.  Like Cursers, Cultist can be ignored when a fast engine and/or good trashing are around.  Market Square is certainly ignorable when there isn't any trashing.

You really think it's possible to ignore Knights if your opponent starts getting them?

Knights aren't that much scarier than Saboteur, which is also often ignorable.




f.ds golden rule: it depends on the kingdom.

[Jimmmmm]

You really think it's possible to ignore Knights if your opponent starts getting them?

Knights aren't that much scarier than Saboteur, which is also often ignorable.

I disagree. In my experience, Knights are pretty brutal.

[DG]

Strongest cards relative to their cost? Probably spoils, madman, mercenary, then poor house and beggar.

[werothegreat]

Strongest cards relative to their cost? Probably spoils, madman, mercenary, then poor house and beggar.

I think you were trying to say "Squire," and you accidentally said "Beggar."

[Jimmmmm]

Strongest cards relative to their cost? Probably spoils, madman, mercenary, then poor house and beggar.

I see what you did there.

[jaybeez]

Knights aren't that much scarier than Saboteur, which is also often ignorable.

Knights all give you some practical benefit, and remove $3-6 worth of value from your opponent's deck each play.  Sab gives you no benefit and removes $2 worth of value from your opponent's deck each play.  There's a huge difference between a terminal (or non-terminal!) something that trashes cards outright and a terminal nothing that replaces a card with one of lesser value.  I mean, I haven't played with DA a ton.  But in the games I have played, Knights were never ignorable.

[Tables]

That's not quite a fair comparison - Saboteur (almost) guarantees it'll hit, and gives the opponent no choice about what they lose. And there's lots of numbers it can hit which will end up removing more than $2 of value - hitting $3's, occasionally $6's and sometimes Provinces near the end will make them drop down $3 or more. Knights often don't hit, can end up trashing themselves, and lets the opponent choose what they lose if you do hit two relevant things.

I'd say that Knights attack is a fair bit weaker than Saboteurs. Obviously though, the real deal is the fact that Knights all have something else - that something varies, but all of them are okay. Some of the better ones especially (which in my very limited experience would be the +$2 Knight and depending on when they come out, the 2 VPs and trash up tp 2 cards ones) are extremely potent cards, with a pretty good benefit and a damaging attack.

[dondon151]

Yeah, generally if Saboteur hits a $3 or $4 card, the opponent won't choose to take a replacement unless there are good $2s, the game is nearing the end (Estate), or Coppers are good.

That said, I don't know which is stronger in the general case.

[Morgrim7]

Cultist has gotta be first.

[eHalcyon]

The main reason I don't think Knights are that scary is that they can whiff, especially if you haven't trimmed your deck.  If strong trashing is available, yeah, Knights are a lot more relevant because there's a much better chance of hitting good cards.  But the Knight attack isn't scary when all it does is cycle Coppers and Estates.

[enfynet]

No one picked Rats? Donald would be ashamed of you all!

[Jimmmmm]

I have a rule about Knights: don't play with them if you have newbies, because they'll make the mistake of not buying them and end up with 9-card decks.

Well, the no-newbie rule probably extends to Dark Ages in general, but particularly Knights.

[Qvist]

As I now use percentages I can compare cards from different lists. This is the rating currently (missing the cards costing $5 and $6):

Marauder 72.1%
Squire 70.9%
Ironmonger 66.2%
Market Square 62.1%
Hermit 60.5%
Deatch Cart 58.9%
Forager 56.8%
Procession 52.6%
Wandering Minstrel 52.3%
Fortress 52.2%
Urchin/Mercenary 51.0%
Storeroom 51.0%
Scavenger 48.3%
Sage 46.5%
Feodum 45.5%
Poor House 46.3%
Beggar 34.8%
Vagrant 26.7%
Armory 25.5%
Rats 18.7%

[Jimmmmm]

That's interesting and worth looking at, but not necessarily that accurate. I'd say on average $3 and $5 cards are more powerful for their cost than $4 cards.