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[ftl]

Ok, sure, I'll generate random numbers. First one: who I'm giving the Open Up card to. Last digit of the timestamp of this post.

1 Cayvie
2 Robz888
3 Qvist
4 Axxle
5 Grujah
6 Galzria

7,8,9,0: redo

[Axxle]

True randomness is anti-resistance since we can't analyze your choices.

[ftl]

Ok, randomness said I'll give Robz the card. (Note that this is not bolded, not an order yet, to give people a chance to weigh in)

Robz should show his role to:

1 ftl
2 Cayvie
3 Qvist
4 Axxle
5 Grujah
6 Galzria
7,8,9,0: redo randomness

[ftl]

(redoing random)

Also, I should have waited for everyone before doing that, I rushed, Axxle has a point too.

[Galzria]

(redoing random)

Also, I should have waited for everyone before doing that, I rushed, Axxle has a point too.

Well, you haven't assigned, which is good, but I still think random is best.

[Galzria]

True randomness is anti-resistance since we can't analyze your choices.

I agree in theory. But practically, we don't know ftl's alignment. If he's a Spy, allowing him to chose would be fairly bad for Resistance, and here's why:

If Spy ftl chooses to give Open Up to a fellow Spy, that person must then reveal to player X. If player X is Resistance, they declare the recipient of OU to be a Spy. Since ftl chose the recipient, I do not want him in the pool to be player X. This means of 5 players, 4 are Resistance and will expose his teammate. Very bad odds for him.

Thus, Spy ftl would choose to give OU to a Resistance. Again, eliminating ftl from the Player X pool, there are 2 Spy's amongst 5 players who could see the reveal. 40% of the time, Spy's will finger an innocent Resistance, causing massive difficulty for the Resistance.

I don't know about you, but 40% is worryingly high for my tastes.

As Resistance, ftl choosing makes the odds even worse, as you've taken out a Resistance from the pool, and added in a Spy.

Thus by randomizing, ftl's name can be added to the "player X" pool. If he's Resistance that's great. If he's a Spy, we've forced him to possibly hand OU to a partner, in exchange for ftl being in the pool. Resistance still gets 4/6 odds of being chosen at that point to be player X.

[Galzria]

True randomness is anti-resistance since we can't analyze your choices.

I agree in theory. But practically, we don't know ftl's alignment. If he's a Spy, allowing him to chose would be fairly bad for Resistance, and here's why:

If Spy ftl chooses to give Open Up to a fellow Spy, that person must then reveal to player X. If player X is Resistance, they declare the recipient of OU to be a Spy. Since ftl chose the recipient, I do not want him in the pool to be player X. This means of 5 players, 4 are Resistance and will expose his teammate. Very bad odds for him.

Thus, Spy ftl would choose to give OU to a Resistance. Again, eliminating ftl from the Player X pool, there are 2 Spy's amongst 5 players who could see the reveal. 40% of the time, Spy's will finger an innocent Resistance, causing massive difficulty for the Resistance.

I don't know about you, but 40% is worryingly high for my tastes.

As Resistance, ftl choosing makes the odds even worse, as you've taken out a Resistance from the pool, and added in a Spy.

Thus by randomizing, ftl's name can be added to the "player X" pool. If he's Resistance that's great. If he's a Spy, we've forced him to possibly hand OU to a partner, in exchange for ftl being in the pool. Resistance still gets 4/6 odds of being chosen at that point to be player X.

*So I am fine with ftl following his timestamps post above, and think Robz should be the recipient. Who he reveals to needs to be redone (timestamp ended in 0).

[cayvie]

True randomness is anti-resistance since we can't analyze your choices.

I agree in theory. But practically, we don't know ftl's alignment. If he's a Spy, allowing him to chose would be fairly bad for Resistance, and here's why:

If Spy ftl chooses to give Open Up to a fellow Spy, that person must then reveal to player X. If player X is Resistance, they declare the recipient of OU to be a Spy. Since ftl chose the recipient, I do not want him in the pool to be player X. This means of 5 players, 4 are Resistance and will expose his teammate. Very bad odds for him.

Thus, Spy ftl would choose to give OU to a Resistance. Again, eliminating ftl from the Player X pool, there are 2 Spy's amongst 5 players who could see the reveal. 40% of the time, Spy's will finger an innocent Resistance, causing massive difficulty for the Resistance.

I don't know about you, but 40% is worryingly high for my tastes.

As Resistance, ftl choosing makes the odds even worse, as you've taken out a Resistance from the pool, and added in a Spy.

Thus by randomizing, ftl's name can be added to the "player X" pool. If he's Resistance that's great. If he's a Spy, we've forced him to possibly hand OU to a partner, in exchange for ftl being in the pool. Resistance still gets 4/6 odds of being chosen at that point to be player X.

*So I am fine with ftl following his timestamps post above, and think Robz should be the recipient. Who he reveals to needs to be redone (timestamp ended in 0).

I think he did redo, and got a 3 for Qvist.

[Galzria]

True randomness is anti-resistance since we can't analyze your choices.

I agree in theory. But practically, we don't know ftl's alignment. If he's a Spy, allowing him to chose would be fairly bad for Resistance, and here's why:

If Spy ftl chooses to give Open Up to a fellow Spy, that person must then reveal to player X. If player X is Resistance, they declare the recipient of OU to be a Spy. Since ftl chose the recipient, I do not want him in the pool to be player X. This means of 5 players, 4 are Resistance and will expose his teammate. Very bad odds for him.

Thus, Spy ftl would choose to give OU to a Resistance. Again, eliminating ftl from the Player X pool, there are 2 Spy's amongst 5 players who could see the reveal. 40% of the time, Spy's will finger an innocent Resistance, causing massive difficulty for the Resistance.

I don't know about you, but 40% is worryingly high for my tastes.

As Resistance, ftl choosing makes the odds even worse, as you've taken out a Resistance from the pool, and added in a Spy.

Thus by randomizing, ftl's name can be added to the "player X" pool. If he's Resistance that's great. If he's a Spy, we've forced him to possibly hand OU to a partner, in exchange for ftl being in the pool. Resistance still gets 4/6 odds of being chosen at that point to be player X.

*So I am fine with ftl following his timestamps post above, and think Robz should be the recipient. Who he reveals to needs to be redone (timestamp ended in 0).

I think he did redo, and got a 3 for Qvist.

Ah, got it. I expected his redo to have the full list again (why? Don't ask me! ).

So based on that, I am fine with:

Robz Opens Up to Qvist

If others have issue, please, discuss!

[Robz888]

That is fine with me.

[cayvie]

Me too.

[Qvist]

D'oh. I misread the card and thought that the person that is assigned to open up can choose to whom he will reveal himself. But it is the leader who can choose both.
So, now I wait for a PM right?

[Galzria]

D'oh. I misread the card and thought that the person that is assigned to open up can choose to whom he will reveal himself. But it is the leader who can choose both.
So, now I wait for a PM right?

He hasn't assigned yet. When he does, it will be bolded and double hashtagged (##).

[Robz888]

D'oh. I misread the card and thought that the person that is assigned to open up can choose to whom he will reveal himself. But it is the leader who can choose both.
So, now I wait for a PM right?

It is the case that the person assigned the card chooses, I think. But I agree to abide by the random choice, which was you.

[Qvist]

Ok, I understand. Of course I'm fine with that decision. More information is always good.

[Axxle]

Fine.

[Axxle]

Fine.

I don't agree but I'll accept it.

[Galzria]

Fine.

I don't agree but I'll accept it.

Axxle, I understand your problem with randomness. You're completely right that we lose a chance to get a read on ftl. I just think the alternative, letting ftl choose, is too dangerous without knowing anything about his role. He could, very easily have a strong ability to dictate the flow of this game.

I think regardless of the outcome we can start to make theories on both the receiver of OU, and the person he reveals to. Yes, we lose the chance at a read on ftl, but I don't think the risk of him choosing is worth it. Later on, once more information is out there? Sure, maybe. But not now, going in blind.

[Tables]

Just to clarify:

Open Up is given to any other person X by the Leader. X chooses another person Z. X shows his character card (Resistance/Spy) to Z.
Establish Confidence is given to any other person Y. Y checks the character card of the current leader (i.e. the person who gave him the card).

The problem comes mainly because the wording is a bit wonky and looks identical on both cards.

[ftl]

As I'm resistance, I'd be picking entirely blindly anyway, so public random is as good as anything to me. Well, if I was picking non-randomly, I'd promise to put on my mission whoever showed me their rolecard (and was resistance).

Hey, if you want, I can pick Opinion Maker without public random! I think I might as well do that.

[Galzria]

As I'm resistance, I'd be picking entirely blindly anyway, so public random is as good as anything to me. Well, if I was picking non-randomly, I'd promise to put on my mission whoever showed me their rolecard (and was resistance).

Hey, if you want, I can pick Opinion Maker without public random! I think I might as well do that.

That works for me.

[ftl]

Let's do this thing.

##I give the plot card Opinion Maker to Galzria . You're last in line to pick a team, might as well get your vote first so we get more info on you faster.

##I give the plot card Open Up to Robz888 , requesting on behalf of the Resistance that you show your role to Qvist, which was determined by a fair RNG. (This is not rule-required, but you'd get a huge FoS if you showed your card to somebody else.)

[Robz888]

##I show my alignment card to Qvist . Tables, how should we facilitate this? Do you want to message it to him?

[Galzria]

Let's do this thing.

##I give the plot card Opinion Maker to Galzria . You're last in line to pick a team, might as well get your vote first so we get more info on you faster.

##I give the plot card Open Up to Robz888 , requesting on behalf of the Resistance that you show your role to Qvist, which was determined by a fair RNG. (This is not rule-required, but you'd get a huge FoS if you showed your card to somebody else.)

Now you've given a good Resistance reason to give it to me, I need to come up with a good Spy reason and weigh the two...

[Galzria]

##I show my alignment card to Qvist . Tables, how should we facilitate this? Do you want to message it to him?

I believe Tsbles will.