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[Witherweaver]

You can vote Hydrad and I promise I'm not going to hammer, because I'm not convinced yet.

But, I understand for town!you that's a risk.

[Ampharos]

Yeah.  I really want to hear from him first. 

[Witherweaver]

Day 3. Not too much here.

Iguana immediately claims to be vanillaized, which they must have discussed in the scum QT. 

I am going to have limited access until Tuesday, as I'm moving across the U.S.

That said, I have something to claim.

At the beginning of last night I was notified that I have been vanillaised.

Interesting TMTMTMTMTM.

But why claim this?

Hydrad's response. 

more holiday posts.

This is interesting though I'm really curious if the Teproc wagon will actually build up. I don't think I've ever seen people turn on a claimed cop like this.

You don't have to wonder if you just vote him.

well I kinda wonder... just because I don't feel super comfortable lynching a potential cop

Doesn't want to lynch Teproc.  And

ok so like 36 hours ish or something like that?

I think I'd still rather lynch egork over a claimed cop.

Well, scum!Hydrad knows they're both mislynches, but lynching Teproc looks worse.

Well, very little on Day 3. 

Well, 3 lylos are bad, but who knows. Or you can vote Hydrad and then we'll have much more chances (if Hydrad is scum, that is)

Ya 3 lylos would be bad. But I don't think lynching me will help that out. Sorry. I like it better how it is now.

Reaction to Egor hammer. 

[Witherweaver]

Day 4

as for whos scum... no clue.

But if I've learned one thing its that faust living past day 3 is usually a scum tell.

Could easily be a planned bus.  Faust knew he was going down after Day 3. 

Oh that post is supposed to mean that I'm more willing to go Faust instead of teproc. But I just haven't voted incase of quick hammers

Says he'll go for Faust but doesn't vote, I have to talk him into it.  He eventually hammers.

[Witherweaver]

Day 5:

Huh interesting. I was thinking it was a ww iguana team. But I'm wondering why scum ww wouldn't claim that I took action as that seems like a good way to get me lynched.

PPE: Oh interesting. I guess e or amp aren't 100% confirmed. Hmm. So I guess the question is would scum bus drive amp D1 or e D2 more likely.

Toss me in with his partner, hedging position, standard scumminess.

I'm considering myself conf!town IC, for what it's worth.

Well I also consider myself an IC. But ya right now I don't see that great of a scum narritive for you. So you get like 87% town read for now.

Sorry, but you are a top lynch candidate.  From your perspective, one of Teproc's results has to be wrong, and you must know  Iguana is scum.  (Teproc targeting three scum with two innocent results is pretty crazy.)

Ya I'm fine with an iguana lynch. And ya it was mostly a joke.

Says he's okay with iguana, but at this point it's clear I'm not really an option.

Never actually goes for Iguana:

Day 5 Final Vote Count:

iguanaiguana (3): 2.7, Ampharos, witherweaver

Not Voting (2): iguanaiguana, Hydrad

With 5 alive, it took 2 to lynch.

[Witherweaver]

This is of note for later:

Teproc dying confirms results on Ampharos and myself.

I think we are looking pretty good.

I think you and WW need to reconsider that all of Teproc's results were actually correct. Faust was a bus driver, which should give people some pause to consider that one of Teproc's results could have been redirected. A godfather is also very possible.

I agree that WW as scum does not make sense and I think he is town. I also think e is town, mainly based on how I have read him. So if my reads are correct, I am pretty sure that the scum team is Ampharos/Hydrad.

Through all of D1, Ampharos stuck to a gut scumread on Faust that never got any traction, but switched his read as soon as Faust claimed and pushed for a WW lynch instead. He and Faust were the only two people really pushing for a WW lynch without being willing to consider anything else. To me, this looks a lot like partner interactions. It seemed scummy to me then, and I tried to push for a Faust lynch, but no one listened to me. Later that same day I switched to Hydrad and tried to start a wagon on him, and was again talked off of it. So if I am right that the team is Ampharos/Hydrad/Faust, that means that the two main wagons I was pursuing on D2 were both scum wagons, and the only reason they didn't happen is because I couldn't get people to join me.

I realize that no one has targeted me, and that no one can verify any results on me, and that is really unfortunate, but there was never anything I could do about that. The fact that I can't verify anything I've claimed is tied to my having a passive role.

Since D2 happened I have been gone from the game, having very little time to post for quite a while now, and as a result I think I've started to look worse and worse. I apologize for not trying harder, and if we lose this game because of me, as much as it would totally suck, I accept that it would be my fault. That said, there is no reason we have to lose when we are so, so close to actually pulling this together and winning.

I don't know what else to say. All I have is my story. I don't have any way to prove it is the truth. But I hope that people will at least consider it.

Iguana tries to get us onto Amph.

[Witherweaver]

Well, more interesting, really.  See how he says team is Ampharos/Hydrad, but he only explains why Amph is scum.  Hydrad is just the default.  His 'case' on Amp feels pretty forced; if Iguana were legitimately bussing Amp for towncred to scum!Amp, this would feel more genuine, I think.  Hydrad is just tossed in and not discussed.  Points a lot more to Hydrad being partner, I think.

[Witherweaver]

Worth noting, as e's reads have been good:

Just reread Hydrad.  He looks like scum to me. 

What is scummy about him is hard to put into words.  He was big into an ampharos lynch, he loves bus driving (even specifically bringing it up back on D2), he joined the faust wagon so he wouldn't be on the wrong side of things.  He chose faust's side in the WW vs faust thing.  Everything feels very, well, stiff for Hydrad. 

Again, I don't have anything specific besides PoE and circumstantial evidence, but I am happy with a Hydrad lynch today.  I am also not surprised that Hydrad would have been the one to do the kill last night.  I mean, totally WIFOM (WW was going to target Hydrad or iguana) but WW had already targeted Hydrad once without success to it makes sense that he targets iguana.

Because right now (unless scum have ninja), WW has targeted both iguana and Hydrad and received "no motion detected" both times.  And AT LEAST one of them have to be scum.  I mean, I think both are scum, but no matter what, one of them has to be.

[Witherweaver]

If Amph is scum, this is well faked:

No point messing around, I suppose.

Vote: Iguana

Got nervous.

Unvote

No way he's not scum. I'll eat my shoe if I'm wrong.  Got like 1/20th of the way through the re-read and it's so obvious.  The fake fight with faust.  The happy-go-lucky demeanor.  I'll hang my hat on this one.

Vote: Iguana

Except the last one feels a little bit off.  (Like, "so obvious".  Nothing is really obvious when you don't know alignments.)

[Witherweaver]

This is a bit of a more likely town post than scum post:

His scum tells are

- Look, I am calmly thinking about the possibility of scum!me, but it doesn't matter, since it's all hypothetical
- LOOK, I TOTALLY DO NOT FEEL PRESSURED BY YOUR VOTE!

These are the most important ones.

There's also

- Look, I consider your scum read on me to be valid
- Look, I am totally calm about the option of lynching me and am judging it objectively
- Obligatory 'you will realize I'm town' near the end

All of those (except maybe the last one if you take it out of context) are more likely to be from fairly new scum than fairly new town

I'M NOT CALM ABOUT THIS POSSIBILITY!!!! IT IS FREAKING ME OUT!
I AM SO TOTALLY PRESSURED BY YOUR VOTE, SO MUCH THAT IT MAKES ME TYPE IN CAPS AND MISS PUNCUTATION!!!111oneoneone

But wait!  For only $29.99 more, you get:

Your scum read of me is totally not valid in any way!
I am peeing my pants cause I'm so scared about getting lynched!
You'll never get the fact that I'm town, so why try?


----------

In all seriousness, that last one is kinda true.  I see what you're doing, but you're just wasting my time (I would say our time but technically you don't know my role, so you get a pass this time.). Go at least look at Teproc.  Also, consider the fact that I'm not that new (around 15 forum games and several hundred irc) and have developed my own playstyle.

(There are 15 scum tells in the above sentences; if you don't get them all, you're scum!!!!1111 one)

[Witherweaver]

did you really play about 15 forum mafia games? can you provide links?

None that are on publically accessable forums, sorry 

Plus they are under different names so I could just be making it up.

So describe to me how you play as scum.

I try to emulate my normal carefree manner, but tend to not try anything too fancy or attention grabbing.  So not as crazed as normal but still moderately crazed.  I don't want to tell all my secret little stuff I tend to do so that when I am scum I can use them in other games, but this game is not it. 

Summary: My scum games are much chiller than normal.  Sometimes.  Cause WIFOM.  Or #yolo. 

(I can envision the QT facepalming right now "wtf is he doing".  Hi mom!)

We accuse scum of being meta-aware quite often, but usually/generally speaking scum talk less about their meta, because they're conscious of that sentiment. 

[Witherweaver]

A big reads list:

The List:

(I’m fully aware these are almost useless.  It’s mostly for me to keep track of how I’m feeling at certain points in the game, and to share that with all y’all.)

-----------------

People that are probably town:

Roadrunner:  His post 390 just screams town to me.  He’s trying to push the game as well, when scum are typically content to let sleeping dogs lie.

Yuma:  The claim does a ton.  This is so extremely dangerous to do as scum this early in the game.  By no means does the claim mean he couldn’t be scum, but it’s just bad scum practice to do this right away.  Maybe if the claim was a bomb or something, but it’s not.   Additionally, most people seem to have accepted Yuma’s claim, and instead of just armchairing and popcorning, Yuma got into the thick of things, getting all debatey and stuff.  This seems more town play to me.

-----------------

People that seem/feel town:

Awaclus:  His entrance posts are goofy and carefree in the middle of an ongoing discussion.   Scum often like to seem like they know what’s going on if entering the game later.  However, you all said that he’s often random like this, so I’m taking it all with a grain of salt.

Iguanaiguana:  Impassioned arguments about scum tells and early heavy arguments with SS reads pretty town to me.  Ig’s a smart guy though, and could be trying some aggressive and dangerous play, but I’m not feeling it right now.

Silverspawn:  Mostly same as Iguana.  I normally look at early conflict and almost always town on town violence.   I had Silver in the above category, but as the game went on, I realized that he very well could just be a hyperactive scum player.  He seems like the type of guy that could do that, but for now I’m sticking with my initial analysis.

-----------------

Big ?s

2.7:  Not a whole lot to go on here, and what I have seen hasn’t spoken to me either way.  Concerning, but it’s early.  We’ll see where things go from here.  (Gosh I sound like a scum defending a partner by slight FoS but not really saying anything.  Whatever, we’ll get more later.)

Faust:  Initially faust came across very scummy, mostly just sitting there and throwing out peanut gallery comments here and there.  However, he got very frustrated when people went after him aggressively, which tends to read town.  However however, I think he’s smart enough to fake these types of emotions, though maybe not since last game he wanted to vote for PPS based on an out-of-game interaction.  Gut says ?scum, head is confused.

Hydrad:  Hydrad does what he wants.  And I’ll be darned if I have any idea what that is.

Teproc:  See, I said 50% chance of scum so I can do things like upgrade you to ?.  On re-read, I don’t get as much of a scum feel from Teproc, and I find myself agreeing with a bunch of things he says.  His recent list matches up a lot with what I’m putting here as well, things I was thinking before I saw his list.  It will take a while for that initial scum feel to wear off, but we’ll leave Tep here for now.

Witherweaver: Wither I have no idea on.  There’s definite possibility of being scum, as I think for the most part he’s been cruising with the crowd, but he’s had enough of a unique voice in discussions that I’m not sure what to think.  Teh feelz aren’t much help either, as they’re all over the spectrum here.  I’ll admit, I have no idea right now.  Maybe another re-read???

-----------------

They could be scum?

EgorK:  Chillin’ out maxin’ relaxin’ all cool.  Maybe this is classic EgorK play but something feels off. 

Haddock:  Maybe it’s just the way he posts things, with lots of open-ended statements and questions and general uncertainty, but that type of posting is just really easy for scum to use and look like they’re doing something.  I’ll probably be dead wrong on this one.

Sounds more likea town reads list than scum.  Note that it's not so balanced.  Two town, three maybe town, 5 null, two maybe scum. 

[Witherweaver]

Also, because I darn well want to:

unvote
Vote: faust

^That's my gut talking.  We'll see what happens.  Probably nothing.

This can definitely be a bus.

[Witherweaver]

Ampharos (1): faust
faust (1): Ampharos

That's too cute.

I'd do something like this with a partner; I'm not sure if Amph would. 

[Witherweaver]

Ampharos (1): faust
faust (1): Ampharos

That's too cute.

Scum partners, obv.

Ha!

[Witherweaver]

see, this is one of the reasons why you are scummy, although not the most important one.

You think reads lists are towny. So you make a reads list, and now you expect to be towny because of it.

It does not work that way. towniness is not some progressive point gathering, it's a judgement of your alignment. Every scum can sit down and write a reads list. It depends on the content.

That's bad for you both because you have being towny in the forefront of your mind, and because you gave Amph unjustified town points.

Is it Iguana being scummy or actually thinking that?  Just because he says something that could be scummy does not mean it is.  Most everything in this game is WIFOM and up to personal opinion.

I'd bet my non-existent hat you both are town.

Points to scum.  Akin to saying "town v. town" when it's town v. your scum partner.

[Witherweaver]

There's just so much overt play if it's Faust/Iguana/Amph:

Ampharos

Basically, I got exactly what I was hoping I would get from Ampharos, which is a meaningful contribution to the game. His first few posts looked scummy to me, but now it looks more like he was drawing attention to himself because he knew he could show himself to be towny under scrutiny. At the same time, Ampharos seems like kind of a loose cannon. And that makes him harder to trust.

Wow, I don't get what you're saying here... I mean, I really don't. This description could be under "Ampharos is scummy" without having to change anything. What exactly points to him being town? It is most curios how the wagon suddenly puffed away for no real reason.

Maybe I am just showing my newbie idiocy here, but I still feel like putting all of your thoughts out into the open is townie, because scum would prefer to keep their ideas shrouded in secrecy. They are the ones with things to hide. So yeah Ampharos' reads list makes him look town, whereas the people who just attack everything while not contributing their thoughts themselves still look like scum to me.

If this is stupid or wrong, then I guess you'd better school me in the ways of playing the game backwards.

I don't know what I did to deserve this kind of attitude... but well. You could have explained what you meant with that read, which would have benefitted town. Instead you are agitating against me (I think? I'm not even sure. Where have I kept my ideas "shrouded in secrecy"?) and suddenly bring up a new point (Ampharos's reads list) that you didn't even mention before.

To be fair, most of your posts have a peanut gallery feel to them, where you're sitting to the side, throwing out comments about ongoings.  Not saying that you're doing nothing, but there's a lot that would be tough to call constructive or helpful.  I'm in no way insulting you, but stating my strong suspicion of you and agreement with Iguana in this case.  (Boy I'm agreeing with him a lot lately.  Ig you better not be scum or I'm donezo if you ever get lynched/inspected).

I like my vote where it is, for now.  <3 faustaros is real

[Witherweaver]

On the other hand (from like two posts ago), this point is valid:

I'd bet my non-existent hat you both are town.

That's interesting; in your previous reads list, iguana and silver only showed up as light town. What changed? Or are you just in a gambling mood?

The more Day 1 consistent headbutting between two people, the more likely they are to be stubborn townies refusing to give up their point.  That behavior draws too much attention.  It's important to note that this is very different than one person relentlessly going after another, and that can easily be a sign of scum on either side of that (i.e. your moves on GKrieg last game).

If Amph is scum he's playing extremely confidently and fearlessly. 

[Witherweaver]

I think I also want to come out and just say that I want to drop the Faust thing from my sig. I put it in because another player suggested it but on further thought I don't really like having something negative about Faust in my sig. He bested me last game, and I don't have bad feelings anymore. I think I just want to leave it at that.

I think we're on the same page.  We are both sensing something about faust this game but are trying not to be jerks about it.  I'd encourage you to keep up the pressure while trying to do so in a respectful manner.  I feel like we have something going and would hate to lose it simply because we're trying to be nice.  It's a balancing act, but I think you know what I mean.

Note to all: I find myself agreeing with Iguana on many things this game, and am aware this may cloud my judgement on him from here on out.  Feel free to slap me around with a fish should I start missing the obvious.   

Does not sound like partner.

[Witherweaver]

Granted, Ampharos has been very useful and helpful since then.  He has toned down the crazy, and come through with some good theory talk and stuff.  Because he has already escaped all attention on D1.

He brought attention to himself by opening with a good salvo.  He gets some people to vote him, but there is nothing there.  He calms down and gives some good contributions.  (Like I said, I am a sucker for reads posts).  Which establishes him as not scum and helpful town.

I call it manipulation.

Good manipulation.

You forgot the part where I sent cookies to everyone's house.  Speaking of that, what's your address again?

In all seriousness, you have legit points.  I haven't really been scrutinized.  I'd like to think that my play is pretty openly town, but it might be a bit early to let me off the hook.  Give me more attention, dangit! 

One thing I'd like to talk about is faust - we haven't had much discussion about him except for a few people throwing out little sentences here and there, and iguana and myself going after him a little bit.  Since you threw him in the scummy side of your list, what do you think?

Also, I spent like half an hour trying to make a picture of Isa the Iguana (from Dora the explorer) and Twilight Sparkle hi-fiving each other as a peace offering to ss, and came up with nothing but absolute failure. Chromebooks can suck.

I guess people will just have to imagine it? And hopefully not be really pissed off?

I find your lack of photoshop skills disturbing.

Also, I am pretty much lost by all this 8 levels deep argumentating.  It seems like you were all enjoying yourselves until that because not the case, but I'm just kinda sitting here on my hands, vaguely reading words and feeling my eyes glaze over.  At least someone voted for me, I understand that!  Exciting! And faust said his vows to make faustaros eternally binding.  That's cool. 

Summary as far as I'm aware:  ss and iguana argue.  ss and yuma argue.  yuma gets upset, leaves, will hopefully come back soon.  That's about what I've gotten out of this.  That and I'm not so sure Yuma is for sure town anymore. 

PPE: I like nicknames.

Egor and Ampharos trying to get the easy yuma lynch strengthens my scumreads here. I think we have good wagons, but they should be larger.

No.  If I was trying to lynch him I would have voted him.  I brought up this whole discussion, true, but I'm doing it to make town aware of the danger and that we should discuss possible ways to deal with it.

You know what IS scummy?  The fact that no matter how much I ask people about you or other people mention you as possible scum, no discussion ever comes of it?  It's impossible to get anything started on you and there's a possible explanation why: your more vocal scum partners are leaving you entirely alone.

There are others too. He's pretty vocal about getting a Faust wagon going.  In one sense, it's safe as no one is biting.  On the other hand, he doesn't really know no one is going to bite, and relentlessly bussing your partner with no out on Day 1 is not so great. 

[Witherweaver]

what you just said

Ok.  I don't really want you to defend yourself.  Like you said, you have done that.  Give me something to work with.  Give me something to partner with you on. 

Lynching Awaclus?  I am totally down.  Let's do it together. 

Lynching faust?  Explain this a bit more for me

I mean, I really like your play, and would miss you on D2.  Just give me someone better to lynch and I will join you.

Okay, I promised I'd respond in the morning, so here we go.

Awaclus.  Important to note that I’ve never played with him before, so I haven’t had a chance to read his playstyle yet.  However, his entrance was in-your-face and random, lots of vote switching quickly.  I find that type of entrance from a player that plays non-standard (which it seems he does) to be indicative of town.  I often find scum people try to tone done the crazy a little bit and make their entrance a little more smooth.  This type of reasoning demands that the player come into the game after a good bit of discussion has started, though.  Crazy at the beginning of the game can just be scum playing crazy and knowing they have plenty of time to work that into town cred.

Now.  All that said, that’s just the read I had on him early on.  Since then, Awaclus hasn’t done too much other than go after Yuma if I recall (again, is there a search function for the thread?).  To me he’s sticking too strongly to his thought process there, firmly committed to the yuma lynch, and that also reads town.  Normally scum back off or at least water-down their lynch desires to an extent. 

I guess I haven’t seen a ton that would make me want to actively push an Awaclus lynch, though I am okay with lynching a lower-activity player, provided there is plenty said about him earlier to give something to work with should they flip town.  I don’t think it’s the best lynch here, but if it came down to it, I’d consider jumping on that wagon (though my general MO is to not jump on wagons unless my vote is needed - I’d rather vote where I want my vote unless I have to vote to dodge a no-lynch).

The more the game goes on, the more I’m not so sure I want a faust vote at this point.  I think my real drive in going at faust earlier was to get people to actually look at him, which really no one was.  There was a while where I felt he wasn’t being that helpful to town and was throwing out peanut-gallery comments, but as of late he’s been more in-line with some of the things I’ve been thinking, and it makes me not so sure I’d want him lynched at this point in the game.  I’m still very very wary of him and refuse to say I’m reading him town, but I’m toning down my “kill kill” mantra.

That begs the question of “who do I want to lynch day 1”.  Which… is a tough question.  The length of this day makes it hard to stick with “teh feelz” reads that normally drive my day 1 votes, since there is so much time to change your tone and manipulate people.  Here’s a list of people and if I would/could vote for them:

2.7 - Probably not at this point.  Reads and feels slightly town and is pretty active.
Awaclus - Possibly.  I’m getting slight town read as explained above, but could be persuaded due to lower activity.
EgorK - Possibly.  Has read slightly scummy but when our wagons were the biggest, didn’t try to push mine as scum often do. 
faust - Possibly.  Explained above.
Haddock - Would vote for him.  Something has felt a bit off all game, probably due to consistent mid-line comments.  Not the strongest Day 1 lynch but I’d be okay with this.
Hydrad - Would vote for him.  He’s all over the place and hasn’t drawn too much fire right now.  People seem to not want to vote him because they aren’t sure how to read him.
iguana - Would not vote.  Reads very town.  I’m possibly blinded here though.
RR - Would not vote.  Reads town, specifically 390.
SS - Would probably not vote. I’m a big proponent of early head to head battles that go on forever being town vs town.  SS vs Iguana is such an example, so I believe him to be town.
Teproc - Possibly.  I’m very wary of Teproc since my initial feelz were at least 50% scum on him, but he’s been pretty town driving lately.
WW - Possibly.  I’m having a really freaking hard time reading WW.  He’s kind of just brash in his comments without any real explanation much of the time, which is sometimes hard to work with.  It could just be a playstyle difference between the two of us.
yuma - Would vote for him (and am).  The last game I was in, Yuma modded.  That means he’s experienced.  I find the timing of his return to be very suspicious, since his wagon was taking off.  Will I feel bad if he’s telling the truth and we lynch him and he was just needing some time away?  Yes, of course.  However, I’ve seen smart scum manipulate emotions like that, and I have no way of knowing if he was telling the truth or not.  We’ve had plenty of opinions on yuma as well, so it wouldn’t be a completely wasted lynch.  I still think this is the strongest place for my vote right now; the potential for a gambit is high in my opinion. 

All that said, if you would like a further in-depth analysis of a specific person, I’d be glad to do so.  I am at work, so it might be delayed, though today is pretty slow and I’m mainly just working on quality-of-life improvements.

Hope this is along the lines of what you’re looking for.

A longer reads post later in the day.  I don't like here that he continues to make a point of saying how he could be wrong about his town!Iguana judgement. 

[Witherweaver]

A late reads list from Faust:

So I need to figure out stuff. This has been a long day and I don't really know who to vote for anymore. From memory:

Witherweaver - he has been around a lot, huh? Also actually generating content I think. Vocal about lynching Ampharos. Seems pretty normal so far.
yuma - feels townier lately. I am profoundly bad at reading him, so. But if we can actually confirm him, that would be good. So no lynching  here I think.
silverspawn - very active. Active is good. I remember feeling bad about him early on, can't remember what that was about. Seems normal lately.
Teproc - I feel like he is defending a lot of people. I think that's kinda his thing, do I get that meta correctly? I feel like his play is very pro-town. Not lynching.
iguanaiguana - huh. There was some fighting. I think he came out of that somewhat townie-looking. Seems much like in RMM28. I think he should stay alive.
Hydrad - I could lynch Hydrad, I don't remember any of his stances. I feels cheap though. Well, what can you do?
Roadrunner7671 - Gut says town. My gut has been horribly wrong before with him. Still, he's not a preferred candidate.
2.7... - seems eager to push the game forward. Also I want him to live to D2 for once. So sympathy pass.
faust
Ampharos - still leaves a scummy feel. I should probably reread to see what's really there. I like this lynch, but it's so popular.
EgorK - unusually involved after some lurky time. That's good, though he does a lot of theory talk and less scumhunting.
Awaclus - his thing with yuma is cheap and allows him to do nothing else. Doing nothing else is anti-town. He also does not make a ton of sense to me, which is always a red flag.
Haddock - I do not know. I don't really know how to tell scum!Haddock from town!Haddock. The two games I've seen him in he felt pretty much the same.

Strikethrough for not lynching, bold for preferred, in case that's not clear.

PPE: 6

Problem here is that Amph and Hydrad are a bit equivalent. 

[Witherweaver]

Amph ends Day 1 not even voting.  I think that's actually more town pointing.  Scum is more conscious of where their vote is.

Day 2:

Vote: faust

Rational:

Day one went WAYYYY too long and I ended up getting talked out of everything I was working on by the end of the day, thus my vote not being on anyone.  There was too much time for people to talk me out of my position.  I'm going back to one of the loose ends that I worked on a lot - I'm not convinced faust is town.

(I initially wanted to vote Teproc here, but his debate about Yuma using his shot or not and the end of Day 1 has won me over for now).

Also, very interested to hear from Yuma.

If he's bussing, he's really committed to it.

[Witherweaver]

Continuing after Faust:

No, he's town. I said why, but I can say again if you need me to.

I went back and read it, and I you know, I initially had him marked on my spreadsheet as town for that reason.  Emotional outbursts tend to be town indicators. 

However. 

faust knows that, I'm sure.  He could have faked it for town cred, or, and more likely in my opinion, he was being serious about being frustrated and was venting, regardless of his alignment.  It was more an "attack" on his meta play, and that's annoying regardless of your role.

All things said:
1. faust is smart enough to have faked that, or could be legit upset because it was an attack on meta.  Either of these being true is enough for me to not give town cred for that.
2. Something has felt off all game about faust.  I've only played in one game with him, but it was where he was a mafia who didn't know his other members.  It was the ultimate puzzle to figure out, and he seemed really excited and engaged to solve it.  To me, that seems like someone who would be excited about being town, going full bloodhound mode, hunting down the baddies.  I get being like that, because I am often like that.  So that begs the question, why isn't faust like that this game?  He looks like town if you just glance over what he's saying, but a lot of it seems to me to be more distractionary points than ones that are legit cases/pursuit of baddies.  To me, it doesn't line up from the faust I know.
3. Why hasn't this wagon taken off?  It's not like other wagons, where there are lots of people saying "oh I'm not voting for him because x,y,z".  People just aren't saying anything other than off-hand "oh he just seems town", if we even get that.

So you're comparing me to a game where I was scum, see that I'm different here, and conclude that I must be scum?

Of course that game where I was a Traitor I needed to play differently. I needed to be this super town person. I accidentally lynched my partner D1, and my other partner soon had a guilty result on him. So it all came down to me, and I needed to put some serious effort in to win. It was thrilling, it was fun, but it also was exhausting. So sorry if I'm not as present.

And about 3 - I think at least Haddock explicitly stated why he doesn't like my wagon. So did RR, whether you like his reason or not. Who are these people who say "he just seems like town"? I don't think they exist.

PPE 10. Wow.

Yes, because your scum role demanded play more like a town role.  I think it's fair to say that traitor plays more like town than it does scum. i.e. you are the uniformed, and must figure it out.

I get the exhausted thing; this game especially with its long days can be tiresome.  I will feel bad if you flip town and I've been barking up the wrong tree just because it needed a bit of a break from being super town tree. 

That said, I cannot shake the nagging feeling that I'm on to something, and I'm not getting what I need to dissuade me from that. It's up to the rest of the town to either pursue this or to steer away from it, because I might be past the point of return. 

Maybe I'm giving too little credit to those that said why they didn't like your wagon.  I'll go read Haddock's.

Does not look much like partners.

[Witherweaver]

More:

No, he's town. I said why, but I can say again if you need me to.

I went back and read it, and I you know, I initially had him marked on my spreadsheet as town for that reason.  Emotional outbursts tend to be town indicators. 

However. 

faust knows that, I'm sure.  He could have faked it for town cred, or, and more likely in my opinion, he was being serious about being frustrated and was venting, regardless of his alignment.  It was more an "attack" on his meta play, and that's annoying regardless of your role.

All things said:
1. faust is smart enough to have faked that, or could be legit upset because it was an attack on meta.  Either of these being true is enough for me to not give town cred for that.
2. Something has felt off all game about faust.  I've only played in one game with him, but it was where he was a mafia who didn't know his other members.  It was the ultimate puzzle to figure out, and he seemed really excited and engaged to solve it.  To me, that seems like someone who would be excited about being town, going full bloodhound mode, hunting down the baddies.  I get being like that, because I am often like that.  So that begs the question, why isn't faust like that this game?  He looks like town if you just glance over what he's saying, but a lot of it seems to me to be more distractionary points than ones that are legit cases/pursuit of baddies.  To me, it doesn't line up from the faust I know.
3. Why hasn't this wagon taken off?  It's not like other wagons, where there are lots of people saying "oh I'm not voting for him because x,y,z".  People just aren't saying anything other than off-hand "oh he just seems town", if we even get that.