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[Davio]

Hey guys,

I opened my physical copy of 7 Wonders Cities last Monday to take a look at the actual cards we're using and noticed in the Cities rules that you can play 7 Wonders in a team setup. Teams would consist of 2 players, I don't know if they sit next to each other, but I guess they do? Haven't read the specifics though.

Any of you think this is fun and are you interested in playing? Don't really have time to mod, but it can be pretty self-modding if we use a token like in the other games. Once everyone has posted "done" you can just send your hand along. The only modding is in drafting the initial hands.

If you are interested, please post:
1. Preferred format (base, base+cities or base+leaders+cities)
2. Preferred partner name or random partner
3. Preferred wonder or random wonder

That's about it, I guess?

A fun way to pick wonders perhaps is through a (silent) auction mechanic where we give everyone a couple of extra coins to bid. 

[Tables]

The basic way it works that's different to normal 7 Wonders is:
Partners sit adjacent. They show each others their hands and plan together. You each have your own tableau, coins and military VPs.
You may not pay you partner for resources you produce yourself. You may not build with resources if you can build through chaining.
You resolve military against your non-partner neighbour only, but resolve it twice. Diplomacy cancels one of the conflicts (if both of you have diplomacy there is no conflict).
You total both of your scores at the end. The pair with the highest total are the winners (I think tiebreaker is... total coins? I guess?)

I would be up for playing. I think I made my base 7 Wonders document available (it still has misprinted costs on a few guilds though, should fix that!), but if not I can PM it to you. I quite like the silent wonder choice auction, except for a team game, I really think you'd want to be bidding on a pair, and that gets complex...
I would go for all expansions, random partner (I won't object to partnering with eHalc mind you ), and well consider my thoughts on wonder choices there.

[eHalcyon]

Just because I'm writing a LOT doesn't mean it's any good. :-P

[Insomniac]

Would definitely play a team game.

[mith]

I've never tried the team game, so I'd be interested. Random partner is fine. (And definitely random wonders.)

[Insomniac]

Random Wonder, Base+Leaders+Cities, Random Partner

[eHalcyon]

Would play, fine with everything except I'd like to omit most promos.  I kind of want to see Catan though!

I think I am most impressed with mith's play in 7WI.  IIRC, he made the most decisions contrary to my own that, in retrospect, were better than what I had picked.  Then again, it might have been Davio.  Ephesos and Giza beside each other is kind of crazy, especially when they have Trading Posts pointed at each other.

[Qvist]

I would be /in.
Random partner is fine although a timezone depending partner would be great.

[Insomniac]

Also not sure this is a game the mod can play, knowing everyone's hands is REALLY strong.

[Tables]

Yeah, mod can't really play. Davio was saying though, he'd basically shuffle hands at age start and end and we'd pretty much play trust system from there. Which is fine by me, especially as with teams there's twice as many people to send the hands on and post the team's plays so it should work out alright.

[eHalcyon]

But if Davio wants to play, we could probably find a patsy to do the shuffling?  It should be fairly easy to do.  Maybe it could even be scripted.

[Davio]

But if Davio wants to play, we could probably find a patsy to do the shuffling?  It should be fairly easy to do.  Maybe it could even be scripted.

Yeah, I thought about some online service for shuffling and drawing cards, but couldn't come up with a good system.
Basically you need to make sure everyone only gets to see 1 initial hand for each age.

[Kuildeous]

I suppose that one possibility is to generate a list of cards and then assign each card a unique number. This can be handled in Google Docs by assigning a random number and then use the RANK formula to assign unique numbers to each card. Be sure to remove the formulas so that the random numbers don't keep generating.

Then create a different list and assign each player 7 (or 8) spots. Generate random numbers for each of those spots and then use the RANK formula to assign unique numbers to each spot.

Then the person would send each player a list of numbers. Each player looks on the master list and copies the appropriate card to his own spreadsheet. The creator of the master sheet can then get his own numbers, but he pays no attention to what numbers were assigned to the other players.

Or, alternatively, I could generate the numbers and send out people's cards. I would just need the master list so I can plug them into a spreadsheet and crank them out.

[Davio]

I would be okay with that suggestion, Kuildeous.

You can use the info dumps from Tables' topics, right?

If I'm allowed to play myself, I would be for Base+Cities (no leaders), random wonder pick and random partner pick with timezone preference.

My timezone is CET, which is UTC+1 at the moment and will be UTC+2 when we enter DST.

[Kuildeous]

Yeah, I could generate random hands. It'd be minimal effort on my part to get them out to you guys just three times (well, four if you have Leaders).

I won't be playing. With my scatterbrain, I'd have to have a moderator to facilitate the handing off of cards.

But I'm happy to help kick off the game. I may just need Davio to message me for the next batch of cards since I likely won't be following along.

[Tables]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0ApPT0N9WtHcKdDBjaW5mRXFfV1ZHRnljTktRQzUwV3c#gid=3

There's one other thing that's gonna be hard without a moderator, which is Halikarnassos. The discard pile is secret information, it'd need to be tracked.

[Davio]

Oh, right, forgot about that.

I guess everyone can keep his "own" discard pile and provide it when Halikarnoss builds?

[Davio]

Current candidates:

• Tables
• Insomniac
• eHalcyon
• mith
• Qvist
• Kuildeous
• Davio

That's 7, how fun, but a team game requires 8.
So anyone feel like joining so we can get this show on the road?

We'll figure out the details when we start I think, I like Kuildeous' shuffle suggestion.
Every player needs to keep his own "discard" pile in case Halikarnassos builds his wonder stages.

There's also an issue in timing like when you build some yellow cards, they could be influenced by what another player is building that turn.
So, you can just post: I'm building this and once everyone has posted, you can gather your earned coins.
And the timing issue could matter because, seeing what your neighbor has built, might decide you to get resource X from neighbor A or B.
So, there's the honor system again, decide how you want to grab your resources before you check other builds and post yourself.
Military is also an aspect, just don't look at other player's decisions before you posted your own.

Spoiler tags can be used for this.

But those are all details, let's get an 8th player and fire it up?

I would be willing to act as a "soft"-mod if any decisions need to be taken if that's OK with you guys?

[Kuildeous]

Well, I'm not actually /in. I was just offering to shuffle the cards and distribute them to you. I can afford the time to do that, but I don't think I can commit to a self-moderating 7 Wonders game.

So if you want to play six-player 7 Wonders teams, then you're golden.

[Davio]

Well, I'm not actually /in. I was just offering to shuffle the cards and distribute them to you. I can afford the time to do that, but I don't think I can commit to a self-moderating 7 Wonders game.

So if you want to play six-player 7 Wonders teams, then you're golden.

Well, I think this is doable.

What do you guys think?

I'll let Kuildeous do the shuffle and then I'll softmod the rest of the game.

[Kuildeous]

One other thing: I'll need the card lists trimmed down for 6 players.

And if I recall, I add N black cards to each age, which bumps the hand size to 8.

Also, I add N+2 purple cards.

[Tables]

I think my list shows which cards are for 7, so you just remove those.
Yes, it's N black cards per age, N+2 guilds in age III.

The thing I'd suggest each pair do is start up a quicktopic, and bold decisions in it when their final. Then well even if you want to cheat, your partner can call you on it. Once everyone's choices are in, then either person can forward hands on (I'd forward to both your partner (so they know you've done it) and both other players (so they both see the new hand).

[Insomniac]

Ill make a qt whenever I know who my partner is!

[eHalcyon]

So it's in pairs?  For some reason I thought the 8 player team game was an epic 4v4.

[Insomniac]

So it's in pairs?  For some reason I thought the 8 player team game was an epic 4v4.

its pairs.