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[Qvist]

I spent a little on the Supply based card stats page to find interesting combos to watch out.
I type in a card (in interaction card) and try to guess the best combo partners. I use mainly Δ Qual
It says: The change in quality given the conditioned cards are available.
Basically that means: These cards have a very good synergy and especially cards that are mostly mediocre or even bad can get high values here.

But there are some cases I don't understand.
Let's take Hamlet. I guessed Library and Watchtower. They were at #3 and #4, Vineyard is at #2 and that's understandable. What is on #1? Curse! Why??
Native Village has Curse on #1 too? What does that mean?

Another crazy result was Outpost. I guessed Alchemist and Treasury, but it was Alchemist was only #4 and Treasury wasn't so high. On #1 there was Philosopher's Stone! And on #2 there was Explorer! What? Can anyone explain me that?

Then I tried Jack of All Trades, because we know it hasn't any real combo potential. I guessed Fishing Village, it is on #10.
That Jack of All Trades is not a card for synergies was proven that only 18 cards have a positive Delta and in the Top 8 are 7 Treasure Cards and Duke. But the best Treasure Cards are neither Loan nor Hoard. The best one is Bank! I cannot understand it.

I can now proceed for a while, like Explorer is #1 for Mandarin, etc.

I also looked up some games I played and tried to guess the best combo in this game, e.g.
Baron, Bureaucrat, Contraband, Explorer, Haggler, Hunting Party, Jack of All Trades, Native Village, Pearl Diver, Royal Seal
Just copy and paste that in both target and interaction.

I guessed Hunting Party + Baron or Hunting Party + Haggler. They were at #2 and #4. What is on #1? Native Village + Explorer! I can't see any synergy here.

Any ideas?

[DStu]

So I think you do it the wrong way around.

If you type "Hamlet" in interaction card, and nothing in target card, you are looking in how much each card is improved by Hamlet. But you want to know how much Hamlet is improved by each card.

So having Curse first means that gaining Curses improves much by Hamlets. Which is not surprising, as Hamlets are quite good cards to handle Curses. And the +buy of Hamlet might even let you buy Curses to three pile. Which is quite likely because of Hamlets low price.

What you are really looking for is, I think, putting Hamlet in target cards: http://councilroom.com/supply_win?&targets=true&interaction=Hamlet&nested=false&unconditional=true , which gives you top:
Goons, Peddlers, Wharf, Menagerie, KC, Highway

[Davio]

I don't think the Δ Qual specifies synergy directly.

The Δ Qual is higher for cards that are usually worse. So a card like Curse is a horrible card, but maybe with Hamlet, you can sometimes buy them out to 3-pile. I guess this makes Curse a whole lot less horrible than in standard games without Hamlet.

As for Philosopher's Stone, I can kind of understand it, since there are more cards in your deck + discard on 3-card turns. And again, Philo Stone has a high delta, because it's usually bad. So the relative improvement over its otherwise total uselessness is huge!

So the delta tells a bit of the story, but not the whole story. You have to filter mentally through the cards to see if an upset is caused by the fact that the card is usually very very crappy or by the fact that it's fantastic with what you are looking for.

And this is the link you want: http://councilroom.com/supply_win?&targets=Hamlet&interaction=true&nested=false&unconditional=true

DStu's has it the other way around, still.

[Qvist]

So I think you do it the wrong way around.

If you type "Hamlet" in interaction card, and nothing in target card, you are looking in how much each card is improved by Hamlet. But you want to know how much Hamlet is improved by each card.

So having Curse first means that gaining Curses improves much by Hamlets. Which is not surprising, as Hamlets are quite good cards to handle Curses. And the +buy of Hamlet might even let you buy Curses to three pile. Which is quite likely because of Hamlets low price.

What you are really looking for is, I think, putting Hamlet in target cards: http://councilroom.com/supply_win?&targets=true&interaction=Hamlet&nested=false&unconditional=true , which gives you top:
Goons, Peddlers, Wharf, Menagerie, KC, Highway

I partly agree. On some cards it makes sense.
If you have Hamlet as target card you evaluate Hamlet in comparism to other cards in the supply.
If you have Hamlet as interaction card you evaluate other cards in comparism to Hamlet.

There are different kinds of combos.
In Hunting Party + X or Mint + FG, you want only a single copy of the first card and many of the second card.
In Hamlet + Watchtower or Native Village + Bridge, you want ~ the same amount of both cards.
This affects the value of target and interaction cards.

Still, it doesn't change much. The questions are still there. Why is Philosopher's Stone good with Outpost in the supply? Why is Explorer good with Outpost in the supply? Why is Bank good with Jack of all Trades in the supply? Why is Explorer good with Mandarin in the supply?

And maybe I'm missing something, but can you tell me how Hamlet handles Curses well?

Edit:

As for Philosopher's Stone, I can kind of understand it, since there are more cards in your deck + discard on 3-card turns. And again, Philo Stone has a high delta, because it's usually bad. So the relative improvement over its otherwise total uselessness is huge!

I don't get that either. Yeah, it's easy to get a higher delta for PS because it's usually bad, but is PS+Outpost really a viable strategy? Outpost turns with 2P won't be rare IMO. Outpost is here the +buy, yeah, but even on bad boards this seams really slow.

[DStu]

And maybe I'm missing something, but can you tell me how Hamlet handles Curses well?

Discard them, get whatever you want.

As for Philosopher's Stone, I can kind of understand it, since there are more cards in your deck + discard on 3-card turns. And again, Philo Stone has a high delta, because it's usually bad. So the relative improvement over its otherwise total uselessness is huge!

I don't get that either. Yeah, it's easy to get a higher delta for PS because it's usually bad, but is PS+Outpost really a viable strategy? Outpost turns with 2P won't be rare IMO. Outpost is here the +buy, yeah, but even on bad boards this seams really slow.

I still think it's an artefact of your method. As you ask, the list neither gives you the best card for PS, nor for Outpost. But gives you the card which is most improved by Outpost, which still might be a bad card (and is a bad card in this case, as PS has 0.9 win/every gain and 44.88 quality).
So why might there even be some synergy?  You probably could tell such a story about every pair, but let's try. Imagine someone goes for PS, because the board supports it. They are attacked by Ambassadors or Mountebanks whatever. You bring PS up to $6 or $7 eventually, of course Outpost is a good card here. A three card hand with a PS might be enough to buy a Province.

[Qvist]

Ok, maybe I'm just asking because I'm not 100% sure how to read the stats.

And maybe I'm missing something, but can you tell me how Hamlet handles Curses well?

Discard them, get whatever you want.

Yeah, but I rarely need +Buy and +Actions in curse heavy games. I rather have a Cellar or a Secret Chamber. But Hamlet is the 6th best card in combination with Curse, why? I understand the Top 5, but I don't understand Hamlet. Worker's Village is #7  I'm stumped. Is it from buying out the curse pile to end the game?

I still think it's an artefact of your method. As you ask, the list neither gives you the best card for PS, nor for Outpost. But gives you the card which is most improved by Outpost, which still might be a bad card (and is a bad card in this case, as PS has 0.9 win/every gain and 44.88 quality).

Yeah, that makes sense. Thanks.


Ok, another example: Hunting Party.
I expect Baron, Haggler, Horse Traders, Mandarin, Monument. None of these cards are on the top.
Basically the cards on top are all cantrips which isn't bad with Hunting Party, but still I'm confused, especially by Black Market at #6.

If I enter Hunting Party as an interaction card I can find a few cards mentioned above, but find Horn of Plenty and University on top (to get more Hunting Parties, I think).

Explanations?

[DStu]

Ok, maybe I'm just asking because I'm not 100% sure how to read the stats.

Yeah, but I rarely need +Buy and +Actions in curse heavy games. I rather have a Cellar or a Secret Chamber. But Hamlet is the 6th best card in combination with Curse, why? I understand the Top 5, but I don't understand Hamlet. Worker's Village is #7  I'm stumped. Is it from buying out the curse pile to end the game?

That's because it's only counted when you gain Curse in your turn. So you need some +buy, and a three-pile ending. Which is likely with Hamlet.

[Qvist]

That's because it's only counted when you gain Curse in your turn.

I didn't knew or overlooked it, makes much more sense now.

[DG]

The outpost can help the philosopher's stone since the outpost turns will add more cards to the deck and you cycle your fat deck faster. The big spending spike of the philosopher's stone works better than average treasure in both the outpost turn and the extra turn. I generally wouldn't try to use outposts with treasure decks but there are a lot of people on isotropic who do and they might find that this combination works for them.

[rrenaud]

I think supply win is a lot cooler than other stuff on councilroom, it's nice to see it get even a tiny bit of recognition.  (OTOH, people care about themselves more than seeing things in the data they already know, so probably it's not actually useful to the expert players on the forum.  And everyone f'ing loves narcissism).

Regarding Hunting Party vs baron, monument, etc.

I think the supply win stats have a certainly directionality in it.  Very good cards aren't influenced much by poor/medicore ones very much.  For the most part, you are going to want a Hunting Party whether or not a Baron is present.  OTOH, you might decide to get a Baron because HP is in the set (HP is the #6 helper for Baron according to the stats).  Even though Baron helps HP a bit, the strength disparity weakens or breaks the connection.