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Author Topic: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards  (Read 42134 times)

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Qvist

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The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards
« on: April 09, 2014, 07:10:13 am »
+21

122 votes on this list

The Best $5 Cards - Part 1/6

#66 =0 Counting House (Prosperity) Weighted Average: 8.4% ▲5.2pp / Unweighted Average: 11.2% / Median: 4.6% ▲2.9pp / Standard Deviation: 16.3%

Although it has a much better average value, Counting House is still on the last rank. It was voted last 14 times and 6 times above average.

All $5s are really strong cards, but some shine more often than other ones. Counting House is one that shines very rarely. The best use may be countering Mountebank. With massive Copper in your deck, you have a high probability to get many Coppers in hand even if you're only half through the deck. Then you can easily buy a Province or a Colony with the use of this card only. It also has some really nice synergies with Coppersmith (make all Coppers worth a Silver) and Chancellor (discard all Coppers and put them in hand). But then you need a village to play Counting House and one of these cards in one turn and the probabilities to draw these 3 cards together are low in a deck full of Copper. It comboes also with Golem. Buy many Golems and only one Counting House. The Golem will always find the Counting House and discard all other cards. With a Golem in hand, you are now guaranteed to get all Coppers. But the best combo is probably with Beggar. Beggar gains you Coppers and let you get to $5 to buy Counting Houses. And with so many Coppers Counting Houses should get you to $8 or $11 easily. You can also buy many Warehouses, cycle through your deck discarding all cards right before the reshuffle and then play your Counting House. It has some other nice synergies, but they are very difficult to pull off. With no real supporters, this card is mostly not worth the effort.
#65 ▼3 Harvest (Cornucopia) Weighted Average: 9.8% ▼2.6pp / Unweighted Average: 13.8% / Median: 7.7% ▼2.9pp / Standard Deviation: 18.6%

After losing 5 ranks, Harvest loses 3 more ranks. It has a way better unweighted average and would be one rank higher in the unweighted ranking. It has 19 last ranks (5 more than Counting House) and was voted 7 times above average.

Harvest is very swingy. In games with very few different cards and a coherent strategy, this is mostly a Silver and rarely a Gold and really no good card. And it can discard all your good cards you wanted to play in the next turn and even trigger an unwanted reshuffle. In games with many attacks, especially Cursers, Harvest can really be a better card. You can then make your Curses to money without having them in hand and Harvest can easily be worth $4. In a thin deck with a lot of engine pieces where you don't care about actions Harvest can also be a nice source of virtual money. Harvest has also a nice synergy with Tunnel. But other than that you rarely want to spend $5 for Harvest.
#64 ▼3 Cache (Hinterlands) Weighted Average: 11.3% ▼2.5pp / Unweighted Average: 13.0% / Median: 7.7% ▼4.0pp / Standard Deviation: 15.1%

The first of the treasure cards so close together. Cache also lost 3 ranks, but would be even one rank lower in the unweighted list. It has the fourth lowest deviation in this list. It was voted last 9 times and 5 times above average.

Cache performs differently in different kind of decks. In engine decks with few money (Scrying Pool etc) it's just horrible. In Big Money decks, it's most of the time superior than just a Silver (but mostly only by a small margin). But it only shines in big decks (Gardens) with many green cards (Silk Road), simply said in decks where Copper isn't a so bad card after all. Also nice is Cache in combination with Trader for a Gold and 2 Silvers for only $5. And Cache is like Silver not very good in Colony games.
#63 =0 Contraband (Prosperity) Weighted Average: 12.3% ▲0.4pp / Unweighted Average: 14.5% / Median: 9.2% ▲0.9pp / Standard Deviation: 16.9%

Contraband is the second treasure card down below. It basically stayed where it was as it had nearly no change. It was voted last 12 times and 7 times above average.

Contraband can be very trappy. Buying it as an opener on 5/2 can be a nice early Gold and the +Buy is very important for finding a substitution for the prohibited card. If there are many good cheap engine pieces on the board and you want Gold and a card with +Buy anyway this can be very good. But most of the times you embargo yourself. And in the late game this is a dead card because everybody knows you want that Province. If you buy it, buy only one, because two or more can really shut you down. And beware of Venture + Contraband!
#62 ▲2 Stash (Promo) Weighted Average: 12.5% ▲3.4pp / Unweighted Average: 17.8% / Median: 9.2% ▲2.7pp / Standard Deviation: 25.2%

Stash is the third treasure card in a row. It is 2 ranks higher than last year and even one more rank higher in the unweighted list. It has the second highest deviation in this list with 15 last ranks and 11 votes above average.

You need 4 Stashes to get a Province after the reshuffle for sure and in Colony games it's almost useless. But a sure Province that you can get only after a reshuffle needs you to trigger the reshuffle as often as possible. This means you need supporter cards too. The most obvious ones are Golem (with max. one other action) or a few Chancellors. With Scavenger, there exists even a more powerful combo for a guaranteed Province each turn in a deck with 4 Stashes and 2 Scavengers. But still these are rare edge cases that makes Stash not worth $2 more than Silver. Especially at the crucial $5 price point you probably find stronger cards than Stash, although if you have $5 and want a Silver anyway, you can pick up a Stash unhesitatingly probably every time.
#61 ▲4 Saboteur (Intrigue) Weighted Average: 13.7% ▲6.9pp / Unweighted Average: 15.6% / Median: 10.8% ▲4.1pp / Standard Deviation: 17.1%

Saboteur is now better than all the treasure cards, 4 ranks better with a significantly better average value. But it was still voted 15 times on the last rank and 6 times above average.

Saboteur is the worst $5 attack. Why? There are similar reasons like why Thief is bad. It trashes cards from your opponents deck without immediate benefit to you, so it's only destructive. And if you aren't able to play Saboteur in each turn at least one time, your opponent can catch up easily when he just continues and ignores it or re-buys the trashed card if it was essential. Another downside is that the opponent can pick up replacement cards that sometimes aren't that worse or you might even give your opponent the opportunity to pick up Victory cards in the end game. But, on the other side, it can lead to big outbursts if you play 1-2 Saboteurs each turn or if you can even play King's Court with it. In games with no mats and chips you are then able to trash the whole deck and all points from your opponent and can easily finish and win. But these cases are so rare, Saboteur is still a bad card for itself.
#60 ▼5 Royal Seal (Prosperity) Weighted Average: 15.0% ▼5.0pp / Unweighted Average: 18.6% / Median: 13.9% ▼4.4pp / Standard Deviation: 17.9%

And there's the fourth treasure card: Stash dropped 5 ranks and 5pp. It was voted last 4 times and 5 times above average. It would be one rank higher in the unweighted ranking.

I don't know if there's much to say about Royal Seal. It's another Silver with bonus card. You probably want it early in the game, as it will accelerate your strategy. It's strictly superior to Silver. So if you want a Silver anyway and have $5, you can pick it up unhesitatingly. But still it's very expensive for a $5 card and there are better cards for the same cost around most of the times.
#59 ▲1 Mine (Base) Weighted Average: 16.2% ▲2.1pp / Unweighted Average: 18.5% / Median: 13.9% ▲0.6pp / Standard Deviation: 15.1%

Mine is slightly better than last year, being one rank higher, but one rank lower in the unweighted list. It has the third lowest deviation in this list with 2 last ranks and 7 votes above average.

Mine is one of the first trash-for-benefit card you probably got to know. It has the disadvantage of being limited to treasures, so you cannot trash them later into victory cards. But it has the advantage to get the new card immediately in hand. But Mine is still slow. A Moneylender doesn't get you a card, but is at least worth a Silver in the turn you played it, whereas Mine is only worth a Copper. But in the long term Mine can be better. The more often you play the new treasure card, the more Mine was profitable. So, if you want Mine, you want it early. It gets so much better in Colony games. First, Colony games last longer and you will probably see your treasure card more often and Mine is a Silver if you trash Gold for Platinum. For a 5/2 opening Mine/Fool's Gold is a pretty decent opening. PS: Don't confuse Mine with Mint.
#58 =0 Explorer (Seaside) Weighted Average: 16.3% ▲1.6pp / Unweighted Average: 19.2% / Median: 13.9% ▲1.1pp / Standard Deviation: 18.1%

Explorer is only 0.09pp better than Mine. It's slightly better than last year, but still on the same rank. It was votes last 5 times and 6 times above average.

The problem with Explorer is: When you already have 2-3 Provinces and you have $5, you want a Duchy most of the times. When you have one or none, it only nets you a Silver in hand most of the times and then there are still other cards that are better getting you Provinces than just a Silver-generating machine. I mean it's still a decent Big Money cards, but if you compare it to Jack of All Trades, it's better in the Silver-getting, but just worse on all the other parts. So, it's pretty solid with alternate Victory cards, especially Duke, and you want it in thin decks where you can draw it with a Province with high probability. And it's nearly useless in Colony games because of the Province dependency and you don't want that many Silvers.
#57 ▼1 Mandarin (Hinterlands) Weighted Average: 17.8% ▲1.8pp / Unweighted Average: 21.3% / Median: 15.4% ▲2.1pp / Standard Deviation: 19.0%

Mandarin is 1 rank worse than last time despite having a slightly better average value. It was voted last 2 times and 11 times above average.

Mandarin is another cheap Gold, but you need an action to play it. What makes it better than the last cheap Gold-alternatives? The drawback of this card is to put back a card on your deck. But this can be also very nice, because you can prepare your next turn just like Courtyard does it. So, if you have more money than you need or you have colliding terminals, just put back a card. But with colliding terminals, the other card might be even stronger and you want to play that this turn. The on-buy effect can also be very nice. With a 5/2 opening you can buy the wanted stronger card next turn too and get an additional Mandarin. Mandarin/Hunting Party or Mandarin/Mint are very nice openings. In the late game where you miss $8 or $11 you can just play one Platinum or two Golds, buy the Mandarin and have a higher chance to reach it in the next turn. That can be very effective. And there is also the hard to setup Golden Deck which you can build with Horn of Plenty. But, still it's a cheap Gold and there are many better alternatives on the board most of the times.
#56 ▲3 Outpost (Seaside) Weighted Average: 19.4% ▲5.0pp / Unweighted Average: 21.5% / Median: 16.9% ▲3.6pp / Standard Deviation: 18.7%

Outpost is 3 ranks and 5pp better, not bad! It was voted 3 times on the last rank and 8 times above average.

Outpost seems so nice for getting extra turns. But you only get a 3-card hand. It's like you Militia'd yourself, even worse, you cannot choose the 3 cards you want to keep. If you really need a +Buy, Outpost can fulfill this need. But even in those cases it's not better than a Workshop. If you want to use it to attack multiple times per turn, it can work, but still it is another terminal in your deck that can collide. It really can shine, in cases when you can guarantee a good card in your next hand. Treasury, Alchemist and Scheme are probably the best combos. Another case where your 3-card hand isn't that bad, maybe with Menagerie or Minion, but this isn't very reliable either, because one of your 3 cards has to be one of your Minions. Another combo is Double Tactician/Outpost where you can get 8 cards. Generally it's pretty good with Duration cards, especially Wharf, Caravan and Haven. You can also get Outpost if you have high action density, but in most other cases you better ignore Outpost.
« Last Edit: April 29, 2014, 04:12:19 am by Qvist »
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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2014, 07:10:28 am »
+8

The Best $5 Cards - Part 2/6

#55 ▲2 Tribute (Intrigue) Weighted Average: 20.8% ▲5.3pp / Unweighted Average: 23.9% / Median: 16.9% ▲0.2pp / Standard Deviation: 21.1%

Tribute is 5pp and 2 ranks better than last year. It was voted last twice and 13 times above average.

Tribute is another swingy card and even depends on the opponents' deck. You can have really bad luck, revealing the same card. Then Tribute is really bad. In action-heavy decks you get +4 actions what you only want if there isn't another village around (but then you probably don't want many action cards). All other combinations can really be nice, e.g. in BM games, giving you $4 most of the times and later in the game +cards). It only really shines in games with dual-type cards. Hitting a Harem and a Nobles and getting +4 Cards, +2 Actions and $2 with only one card is excellent. But the unreliableness still is Tribute's biggest problem. Forming your strategy around it not only depends on you, your opponent has to cooperate.
#54 ▼3 Rogue (Dark Ages) Weighted Average: 22.9% ▼10.0pp / Unweighted Average: 25.1% / Median: 18.5% ▼11.5pp / Standard Deviation: 21.2%

Rogue is significantly worse (10pp to be exact), therefore it dropped 3 ranks. It was voted last twice and 14 times above average.

Rogue is a Graverobber and Knights hybrid. Like all trashing attacks, it can be really powerful if you can play them every turn, maybe even multiples, especially against a thin deck. It has the huge advantage over Saboteur that it gives you at least a benefit of +$2. You can even get the cards you trashed back which can be huge especially if you're using Highways to trash your opponents' Provinces. But the more cards you gain the more it slows you down as you probably won't see the Rogue as often what is a similar problem like the one that Thief has. Probably the biggest downside is that you can't choose between gaining and attacking. In a 2-player game it probably won't slow your opponent down because you need 2 Rogues per turn to attack once. If it's a 2-player mirror match, luck might be a big factor. One opponent may even never be able to attack and is just busy getting his trashed cards back. In a multiplayer game it's probably even worse as you won't be able to attack very often. Getting cards back from the trash may be very useful on the other side when there are trash-for-benefit cards like Apprentice or Rebuild on the board. So, all-in-all a weak attack with a heavily board-dependant gaining ability.
#53 =0 Mint (Prosperity) Weighted Average: 25.9% ▼2.4pp / Unweighted Average: 28.0% / Median: 23.1% ▼0.2pp / Standard Deviation: 18.6%

Mint is slightly worse than last year, but still on the same rank. It was voted last once, 18 times below 10% and 18 times above average.

Mint can duplicate a treasure card in hand. The problem still is, you need that Gold or Platinum in hand, so you really need to draw most of your deck with a good engine or need a small deck to accomplish this regularly. In the first case you probably don't want Mint because you don't want too many treasure cards. But for the latter case, Mint itself helps. Most of the time you buy Mint just to trash most of your Coppers. It really depends if you want Mint with your opening buy as you are now left with only 2 coppers, having no buying power. The only opening which is really powerful is Mint/Fool's Gold, because you have a small deck and get 2 Fool's Gold per turn most of the times. But Mint/Squire or Mandarin/Mint or Mint/$3 on a Baker board can also be solid openers. Again: Beware, don't confuse Mint with Mine.
#52 =0 Graverobber (Dark Ages) Weighted Average: 31.0% ▲2.0pp / Unweighted Average: 32.6% / Median: 29.2% ▼0.8pp / Standard Deviation: 19.3%

This time Graverobber is above Rogue. It is slightly better, but still on the same rank. It was voted last once, 10 times below 10% and 14 times above average.

Graverobber can either get a card out of the trash or is an Expand for Action cards. Both options are heavily depending on the board. An Expand for $5 can be really strong, especially if have loaded up on many (non-terminal) $5s like Treasury, Stables, Laboratory or City to name a few. It works especially well with Upgrade as it gets Action cards in the trash which we can get back with Graverobber and Highway because we could potentially get Provinces out of the trash. If Graverobber is the only trash-for-benefit card on the board the "getting cards out of the trash" option is often really slow, but with others as the before mentioned Upgrade it can be really strong. Another nice combo is Border Village+Graverobber as we can trash Border Village for a Province and can later get even 2 cards with Graverobber where the second card doesn't even need to be in the trash. It can also be used in a draw engine where you use Pillage as strong attack to get the Pillage you just played right back. Graverobber is highly board dependant and therefore hard to rank.
#51 ▼5 Pillage (Dark Ages) Weighted Average: 33.5% ▼11.1pp / Unweighted Average: 34.2% / Median: 29.2% ▼12.5pp / Standard Deviation: 21.0%

Pillage is the third Dark Ages card close together. It dropped over 11pp and 5 ranks which is quite a lot. It was voted below 10% 15 times and 27 times above average.

Pillage is a very nasty very strong attack. Discarding key cards from opponents' hands is very strong and can be devastating if your opponent draws KC + only one Action card. But it being a one-shot makes it significantly weaker. You don't want to buy it too late as you need one shuffle to Attack and another shuffle to use the 2 Spoils which are one-shots themselves. Picking it up in Big Money games in mid-game when you don't necessarily need more Silver, it's often probably better picking up a Pillage to slow your opponent down as you will definitely profit from the 2 Spoils. But it's probably best in engines where you draw most of your deck where the 2 Spoils are enough money to rebuy the Pillage and therefore play Pillage each turn. Especially with University it's good as you can just re-gain it each turn. But in other decks Pillage often is just too slow to be worthwhile.
#50 ▼8 Venture (Prosperity) Weighted Average: 34.6% ▼12.8pp / Unweighted Average: 37.2% / Median: 33.9% ▼14.4pp / Standard Deviation: 18.0%

Venture keeps falling in this list. Once as honorable mention in theory's Top 5 Non-Attack $5 list, it dropped again 8 ranks and nearly 13pp. It was voted only twice below 10% and 23 times above average. It would be one rank higher in the unweighted list.

Venture is very similar to the "+1 Card, +1 Action, +$1, +Bonus" cards like Market, Treasury or Highway. It draws a card, gives $1 and doesn't cost an action. What is the +Bonus of Venture? Being a Treasure Card, it can't be drawn dead. And it has a Filter effect finding another Treasure Card. So you're guaranteed $2 when playing a Venture (ignoring edge cases like Potion and Horn of Plenty), making it another "Almost Strictly Superior to Silver $5 Treasure Card". The filter effect allows you to go green earlier, because you can discard the green cards with Ventures. This effect reminds of Adventurer (and the name of course). While an Adventurer in a Copper-free deck gets you to at least $4 and Venture only to $3, Venture is still superior, because it's $1 cheaper and doesn't cost an action and is also chainable. Ventures are great if you have multiples and as few other Treasure Cards as possible. If you manage that, they are even superior to Gold. But otherwise it's often just another entry in the weak $5 treasure card group.
#49 ▼5 Trading Post (Intrigue) Weighted Average: 35.5% ▼9.7pp / Unweighted Average: 35.8% / Median: 32.3% ▼11.0pp / Standard Deviation: 20.4%

Trading Post dropped also by nearly 10pp and lost 5 ranks. It was voted last 3 times, 12 times below 10% and 34 times above 50%. In the unweighted list, it's one rank lower.

Trading Post is another card in the category "Good opener, but bad afterwards" like Chapel. But Trading Post is really hard to evaluate. It costs $5 and is only an important opener in about ~ 30% of all 2-player games (ignoring Baker openings where it can really shine). But it had 8 openings in the Top 50 of all openings on Councilroom, that still shows its strength. If you compare its ability with Mine as a opener: It can trash 2 instead of one card and it can trash all card types and isn't limited to treasures. It's especially strong in Torturer games as you can trash the Curse right away. But Trading Post has fiercer competition in the $5 list, so its downside of getting weak soon was taken more into account by all of you.
#48 ▲2 Treasury (Seaside) Weighted Average: 35.8% ▼0.5pp / Unweighted Average: 37.8% / Median: 33.9% ▼1.1pp / Standard Deviation: 20.6%

Treasury re-gained the 2 ranks that it lost last year. It was voted last once, and 5 times below 10% and 8 times above 70%.

Treasury is really no bad card. You often gladly pick up a cantrip card that gives you money. Especially the top-decking ability is really nice if you get it early in the game as you guarantees you one coin more per turn for quite a while. With 2-3 Treasuries you can keep buying good cards every turn. Treasury also comboes well with Outpost. But still, Treasuries alone are very slow, too slow on most boards. They're therefore better in Colony games and in all other games that tend to be slow. Beware of discarding attacks if you have more than 3 Treasuries. Treasury is especially good in greenless games like with Bishop/Goons or when you don't buy victory cards and and only gain them with let's say Expand or Graverobber. You can then keep top-decking them even until the late game and expand them too.
#47 ▼7 Merchant Ship (Seaside) Weighted Average: 36.9% ▼11.7pp / Unweighted Average: 38.3% / Median: 35.4% ▼12.9pp / Standard Deviation: 20.1%

After rising 10 ranks and dropping 4 ranks, Merchant Ship is back where it started. It lost nearly 12pp and 7 ranks, that's a lot. It was voted 6 times below 10% and 9 times above 70%.

Merchant Ship is a very simple card. While Harvest is a not guaranteed $4, this now is a guaranteed $4, just split over two turns. It's good for Big Money games as it increases the probability to have $8 early as you only need $6 in hand in the following turn. And if you manage to play one each turn, this is basically $4 every turn. The probability of colliding Merchant Ships is also lower because of the Duration effect. In comparism to many other $5s, where you either don't get guaranteed $4 or guaranteed $3, this card can be really strong. But there are still many (especially terminal) $5s that are superior.
#46 ▲8 Mystic (Dark Ages) Weighted Average: 37.5% ▲9.6pp / Unweighted Average: 39.1% / Median: 35.4% ▲10.4pp / Standard Deviation: 20.2%

Mystic is 8 ranks and nearly 10pp better than last time, not bad. It was voted below 10% only 4 times and above 70% 12 times.

Mystic is a Conspirator and Wishing Well mixup. As it's non-terminal, it's really no bad card and hurts rarely in a deck, but unless you haven't any helper cards that let you guess the top card of your deck, it's like a Minion without Attack option. With 2 Mystics in hand you can at least draw one card. Mystic is good with Chapel or in other thin decks where your deck will contain not much other cards than Mystics. It's also good on any board that offers no terminal draw which you want for Big Money or for an engine. So it can be also a great addition in a Scrying Pool engine for example because all you want is the non-terminal money. And finally you can now profit from all the cards that you wished Wishing Well could combo with. You can now profit from opponents' Spies, Scrying Pools, Duchesses or sort of negate Fortune Teller, Ghost Ship, Bureaucrat, Rabble and other top-decking attacks. And of course it combos with Apothecary, Cartographer (and maybe also Wishing Well itself) and other cards which let you arrange the top of the deck. Especially with +Buy cheap cantrips like Vagrant or Pearl Diver combo well with it. But still with any strong attack or strong terminal draw, Mystic is way to slow and not the way to go.
#45 ▲3 Library (Base) Weighted Average: 38.4% =0pp / Unweighted Average: 39.7% / Median: 40.0% ▲1.7pp / Standard Deviation: 20.9%

Library has exactly the same average value, but is still 3 ranks better than last time. It was voted 5 times below 10% and 12 times above 70%.

It's best use may be countering discarding attacks as it may even set other actions aside and therefore increase the probability to draw treasures. But it's also very useful for engines with villages that don't increase your handsize, like Fishing Village, Festival, Plaza or Hamlet. And even in Big Money it is a stronger (but more expensive alternative) than Smithy as you won't draw Libraries/Smithies dead.
« Last Edit: April 14, 2014, 08:24:04 am by Qvist »
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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2014, 07:10:34 am »
+10

The Best $5 Cards - Part 3/6

#44 ▼1 Band of Misfits (Dark Ages) Weighted Average: 38.6% ▼7.3pp / Unweighted Average: 42.3% / Median: 36.9% ▼6.4pp / Standard Deviation: 22.2%

Band of Misfits lost only 1 rank, but quite a bit in points. It would be 2 ranks higher in the unweighted list. It was voted 12 times below 20% and 17 times above 70%.

Band of Misfits heavily depends on the board, even more than cards like Throne Room. It's probably THE most board dependant card. On boards with a lot of $5 cards it's basically useless. But it can also be very strong. Especially with cards that are strong, but only a limited period of time or need specific other cards in hand, especially Ambassador or cards like Sea Hag, Throne Room, Moneylender and Conspirator, Band of Misfits is a great card. Its flexibility is great, especially when you can play it as a cantrip or a village in "worst" case, but on boards with power $5s - which are not rare - Band of Misfits is really a trap card. Keep also the downside in mind that you can't copy cards that aren't in the supply anymore what can be problematic with $4 cards like Caravan or Ironmonger which piles tend to deplete. Also keep in mind that it only copies the on-play part and can't copy reactions.
#43 ▲6 Inn (Hinterlands) Weighted Average: 39.3% ▲1.8pp / Unweighted Average: 41.5% / Median: 36.9% ▼1.4pp / Standard Deviation: 21.8%

Inn is slightly better, but is ranked even 6 ranks higher. It was voted 19 times below 20% and 17 times above 70%.

Inn's main effect is pretty simple. It's a Young Witch with no attack effect, but +2 Actions instead. So it's a village that doesn't increase handsize, but has a filter effect. This is nice but not really great. You more often want the money of a Bazaar than the filter effect of Inn, but on boards with no trashing but strong draw you still might prefer an Inn. More important is its on-gain effect. Shuffling action cards into the draw pile is great when you time it right, especially when there are (nearly) no cards in the draw pile. Decks with high action density love Inn, so you can prepare a Scrying Pool mega-draw or a King's Court-Bridge mega turn for example. If you manage to have enough money and at least an extra-buy with your actions, you can buy a Inn from the extra-buy and won't see your bought victory cards so fast, especially in combination with Chancellor. Even if you don't necessarily have a high action density and miss $8, buy a Inn for getting all your nice actions in the next turn.
#42 ▲5 Council Room (Base) Weighted Average: 40.7% ▲0.5pp / Unweighted Average: 42.9% / Median: 38.5% ▲0.2pp / Standard Deviation: 23.0%

Council Room has nearly the same average value, but is 5 ranks higher. In the unweighted list it would be even 1 rank higher. It was voted 19 times below 20% and 17 times above 70%.

Council Room is really strong per se, but don't underestimate the extra card for your opponent! If he draws a Gold or the much needed village for his own Council Room, he may even profit more from your play than you do. It really only shines on boards with discard attacks like Militia or Goons. With such cards you take back the profit from your opponent and have a really big hand and even a +Buy. Its drawing power and +Buy makes it a good opener combined with Fool's Gold.
#41 Merchant Guild (Guilds) Weighted Average: 41.0% / Unweighted Average: 41.4% / Median: 35.4% / Standard Deviation: 23.0%

Merchant Guild is the worst of the new Guilds cards in this list. It would be 3 ranks lower in the unweighted list. It was voted 22 times below 20% and 14 times above 70%.

Merchant Guild feels like a Duration card as you can't spend the coin tokens right away. The on-play effect is really weak, without a doubt. If you ignore the delayed effect "+1$, +1 Buy, Gain a Coin Token" would be a solid $4 card as it is strictly better than Woodcutter and mostly better than Nomad Camp. You shouldn't buy Coppers for coin tokens right away, but in the end game Merchant Guild reads "+1$, take 2 Coin Tokens, Gain a Copper", so pretty similar to one option of Count. All in all still a pretty weak card. But sometimes it can really shine. If you build an engine with cheap engine pieces like Hamlet, you need the +Buy anyway and you don't lose that much tempo as Merchant Guild usually does (as it doesn't give you much money) with the profit of getting free coin tokens which help you to smooth out your buys, and giving you endgame control. And if your deck manages to get 3-4 Merchant Guilds in play, you get a ton of coin tokens and a great endgame control. While you often prefer Bridge over Merchant Guild and Merchant Guild can be ignored in the presence of power $5s, it still can be a board dominating card sometimes. It also has the same nice interaction like Goons with Watchtower: buy extra Coppers for coin tokens and trash them right away.
#40 ▲4 Market (Base) Weighted Average: 42.0% ▼3.1pp / Unweighted Average: 43.4% / Median: 41.5% ▼1.1pp / Standard Deviation: 18.6%

Market is clearly worse than last year, but still 4 ranks better. It was voted 10 times below 20% and 10 times above 70%.

Market is a nice addition to most of the decks, but it is no super strong card. You want it most of the times because of the cantrip +Buy as an addition to your main strategy, because +Buy cantrips are rare and essential for an engine because you may already have stronger terminal cards. And it is also often superior to Silver in all but Big Money games as you draw a card and get an additional $1. The non-terminal +Buys is very important in some combos too, like a Highway+Market chain.
#39 ▼4 Cartographer (Hinterlands) Weighted Average: 47.8% ▼2.4pp / Unweighted Average: 48.9% / Median: 47.7% ▼2.3pp / Standard Deviation: 21.6%

We're making a big jump of over 5pp. Cartographer is over 2pp and 4 ranks worse than last year. It was voted 12 times below 20% and 11 times above 80%.

Cartographer is useful in all decks (maybe except Big Money decks). It reminds of Navigator, but hasn't the problems of being terminal and you can choose for each card separately to discard or to put back. It also draws a card, although you often wish to top-deck first and draw afterwards. Basically it is a 4 times more powerful Spy (except the attack). You can also compare it to Warehouse. While Warehouse only makes this turn better, you can use Cartographer to either prepare your next turn (mitigating draw luck) or to prepare the cards you want to draw with either a second Cartographer or any other card that draws cards. So it combos very nice with many cards, especially cards that draw and are non-terminal, like Wishing Well or Herald and is also not bad against strong top-decking attacks like Ghost Ship or Rabble (although you draw one card first). It's also decent in slogs where you can cycle through your deck faster and can connect your good cards much more easily. With all the good points, Cartographer is rarely board dominating and has a high opportunity cost, it's just an good addition to your deck and makes your deck stronger and more stable.
#38 ▼6 Festival (Base) Weighted Average: 49.0% ▼4.8pp / Unweighted Average: 50.6% / Median: 49.2% ▼9.1pp / Standard Deviation: 18.8%

After dropping 4 ranks, Festival lost again 6 ranks. It would be still 2 ranks higher in the unweighted list. It has only 4 votes below 20% and 8 votes above 80%.

Festival is a simple card and is like a combined Village and (Grand) Market without the draw. The lack of draw is really the only but big downside of this card. Still it is good in any engine, giving the money and actions you need and if you have "draw up to ..." cards like Watchtower or Library, it's really great. In any Non-Big-Money game Festival is mostly superior to Silver.
#37 ▲1 City (Prosperity) Weighted Average: 49.9% ▲1.2pp / Unweighted Average: 50.2% / Median: 50.8% ▲2.5pp / Standard Deviation: 21.4%

City is slightly better and is also 1 rank higher. It was voted 8 times below 20% and 10 times above 80%.

City is also highly dependant from the board. On many boards you just spend $5 for a mediocre $3 Village. But with Cursers where the Curses are likely going out, this can be very strong and especially in multiplayer Cities are very strong. When activated, a Level 2 City is already a combined Laboratory and Village, so basically a ~$6 card. A Level 3 City is a combined Laboratory, Market and Village and would normally cost ~9$. It's often a trap because if one player goes for Cities to run this pile out, he's just buying Villages and doesn't build up his economy. Then you do much better not buying any City and try to end the game as fast as you can. In longer lasting games (especially Colony games) Cities are much stronger, but you really have to consider, if you really want so many Villages. As already said, in 3+ player games any pile can deplete faster and Cities are therefore much stronger. And if you have won the City Split and have Level 3 Cities, you have to just be sure that you don't lose on a 3-pile ending. But as many of us only play 2 player games, this wasn't taken that much into account.
#36 ▼9 Catacombs (Dark Ages) Weighted Average: 50.4% ▼5.3pp / Unweighted Average: 49.7% / Median: 49.2% ▼9.1pp / Standard Deviation: 20.0%

Catacombs is the first above average card and dropped quite a lot, 9 ranks! It would be even 2 ranks lower in the unweighted list. It was voted 10 times below 20% and 10 times below 80%.

Catacombs is no complicated card. It combines the strengths of Smithy and Oracle into one card, making it a very good card drawer for Big Money as well as for engines and is therefore a very solid card overall. The on-trash effect is a very nice bonus. You probably won't trigger it by yourself as often as you can't get a Duchy out of it and there really needs to be good targets for this to be worth for any trash-for-benefit card. But it can be really nice with Procession as you will draw 6 cards and get another Procession for free. But most of the times it's just a really good defense against trashing attacks like Knights or Swindler especially if you can replace it with a Smithy instead.
#35 Journeyman (Guilds) Weighted Average: 51.1% / Unweighted Average: 51.0% / Median: 52.3% / Standard Deviation: 19.5%

Journeyman is the second Guilds card in this list with 3 more remaining. It was voted 6 times below 20% and 8 times above 80%.

Journeyman is very solid card drawer for both big money and engines. It really shines if you can get rid of your starting Estates and especially Shelters because you can name Copper then and are guaranteed to only draw good cards what is good for Big Money and great for engines. And if you are good in deck tracking Journeyman is in general able to draw you the cards you need.
#34 ▼2 Jester (Cornucopia) Weighted Average: 51.3% ▼0.3pp / Unweighted Average: 53.9% / Median: 52.3% ▲4.0pp / Standard Deviation: 20.5%

Jester dropped another 2 ranks, just like last year, although it basically has the same average value. It would be 4 ranks higher in the unweighted list! It was voted 4 times below 20% and 16 times above 80%.

Jester is a very swingy attack. You can deal out Curses, you can spam Coppers. But mainly it's a card which gains you good cards, especially if your opponent and you are going for the same strategy. If not, you have a really hard decision if you want that action card in your deck or give your opponent another free card. If you have a good running engine with any spying attack (like Scrying Pool), Jester is very good. And in 3+ player games Jester is even stronger, because you can gain multiple good cards per turn. The main reason this attack is ranked that low, may be that you all take 2 player games into account where it's very swingy.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2014, 04:37:22 am by Qvist »
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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2014, 07:10:40 am »
+8

The Best $5 Cards - Part 4/6

#33 ▼3 Rabble (Prosperity) Weighted Average: 52.4% ▼1.9pp / Unweighted Average: 54.1% / Median: 52.4% ▼2.6pp / Standard Deviation: 20.2%

After being 4 ranks better, Rabble dropped basically where it was. It was voted 6 times below 20% and 14 times above 80%. It would be 4 ranks better in the unweighted ranking.

The attack of one Rabble may even be worse than a Fortune Teller, as it can't guarantee to hit. It's not a very good opener, especially with good trashers, but gets stronger and stronger in the late game. Rabble is stronger the more you play in one turn. If you build up a (Village-Smithy-like) engine and need good drawing power, Rabble is the way to go, because if your opponent goes green too early, he gets bad hands regularly pretty soon and you may crush him. Your Rabbles can hit him even stronger than any other discarding attack, because he has at best only 2 good cards in hand. But beware of Farming Village, which is a very effective counter. And if you don't need the drawing power, you can skip over Rabble, because one Rabble isn't that strong per se.
#32 ▼5 Count (Dark Ages) Weighted Average: 54.6% ▼0.8pp / Unweighted Average: 53.4% / Median: 52.3% ▼6.0pp / Standard Deviation: 23.4%

Count has nearly the same average value, but is 5 ranks worse than last year. It was voted 9 times below 20% and 18 times above 80%.

The 9 different options are not so powerful for a card costing $5, but its flexibility makes it good. The $3 coin option let you have either a Horse Traders effect without +Buy or a Mandarin or let you gain a Copper. If you use Count as virtual money in an engine, then the Mandarin effect is probably best as you can put a village or another card you don't need back and safe for next turn. If you use Count in alt VP games, gaining a Copper is not really a disadvantage. The discarding option is probably the weakest although you can choose it if you really don't need those 2 cards or have a Tunnel in hand. If you open 5/2 the trash your hand option can be really powerful and is similar strong as a 5/2 with Trading Post. Keep in mind that putting back a Copper is mostly worse than gaining a Copper if you want to trash starting cards with it. But mostly you want to safe a card for next turn if you want to choose that option. Discarding two cards is here mostly the weakest option too unless you really want to use Count to only trash 2 cards and discard 2 cards. Gaining Duchies is of course really powerful with Duke, Silk Road, Ill-Gotten-Gains or Rebuild and can pretty strong in the end game when Duchy dancing. Although a terminal Gold seems to be more powerful, think it through! If you end up buying a Duchy anyways you wasted 2$. So, all in all not a particular power card, but can be very good on a 5/2, in Alt-VP games - especially Duke and in most end game scenarios.
#31 ▲2 Horn of Plenty (Cornucopia) Weighted Average: 54.6% ▲4.1pp / Unweighted Average: 52.9% / Median: 53.9% ▲7.2pp / Standard Deviation: 22.7%

Horn of Plenty is again slightly better than the year before. It was very close, but it is only 0.02pp better than Count. It would be 3 ranks lower in the unweighted list. It was voted 10 times below 20% and 14 times above 80%.

Horn of Plenty is one of the cards that are very hard to master. On average boards it's similar to Ironworks and often too slow. But if you can build a decent engine with several different cards involved (and that is the hardest part), then HoP is very powerful. With one Horn of Plenty and a good engine the game can end in like 3-4 turns as you can gain more Horn of Plenties pretty fast and then gain a lot of Provinces in a mega turn. The problem is to build such an engine and prepare the mega turn before the opponent gets a too big Province lead. But even without a megaturn, Horn of Plenty is very useful, something that's often ignored. It has a high opportunity cost, but a non-terminal gainer, that can't even be drawn dead can make a difference in an engine game where engine pieces are not that expensive.
#30 ▼7 Bandit Camp (Dark Ages) Weighted Average: 54.6% ▼5.0pp / Unweighted Average: 54.5% / Median: 56.9% ▼8.1pp / Standard Deviation: 19.9%

Bandit Camp is significantly worse than last year, 7 ranks and 5pp. It was only 0.01pp better than Horn of Plenty and therefore only 0.03pp better than Count, so these 3 cards are really close together. It would be 2 ranks higher in the unweighted list. It was voted 6 times below 20% and 10 times above 80%.

The obvious comparism to Bandit Camp is Bazaar. You get one-shot Golds instead of $1. Which one is better? Of course it depends... While Bazaar is an obvious Engine Card, Bandit Camp can be very good incorporated in a money-ish approach. The Spoils ramp your economy fast for early Golds or Provinces. But Bandit Camp is also especially good with +Buys as you won't waste money from the Spoils. And with trashing in draw engines where you draw your whole deck, you probably want to play your Spoils each time to keep your deck thin. So the Spoils make your draw engine more unreliable. But if you are still able to draw your deck, then Bandit Camp effectively gives you $3 instead of $1 and is way better than Bazaar. But if your engines falls apart, it's hard to get it back running.
#29 ▼12 Vault (Prosperity) Weighted Average: 55.7% ▼12.4pp / Unweighted Average: 56.2% / Median: 56.9% ▼16.4pp / Standard Deviation: 22.8%

Vault is one of the big losers this year. It lost 12 ranks and over 12pp, that's a lot. It would be still 3 ranks higher in the unweighted list. It was voted 9 times below 20% and 22 times above 80%.

The +2 Cards that make the difference between Secret Chamber and Vault are very important to make Vault a much better card than Secret Chamber. With every play of Vault you are guaranteed a Gold or even better - a Grand Market. And if you have a Gold in hand or draw one you can buy a Province for sure. This makes Vault a great counter to cursing attacks and is still great after you've gone green. No surprise your opponent has the chance to make his hand better too, because this effect is very strong. This effect makes it also a good card for Duke. Like Secret Chamber it's also good if you can draw your whole deck for example with Scrying Pool, discard all actions for a lot of money, just to draw all actions again with another Scrying Pool. Similar to this, it's great in Double Tactician decks. Another combo is Vault/Tunnel and with Tunnel you could even profit from your opponents' Vaults. The big downside of this card is that it's very vulnerable to discarding attacks.
#28 ▼3 Bazaar (Seaside) Weighted Average: 55.8% ▼0.6pp / Unweighted Average: 55.1% / Median: 55.4% ▼1.3pp / Standard Deviation: 16.5%

Bazaar is now better than Bandit Camp. But it also lost a few ranks while having nearly the same average. It would be one rank better in the unweighted list. It has a very low deviation with only one vote below 20% and only 7 votes above 80%.

Bazaar is a village with an additional coin. At first glance a village for $5 looks really expensive. But if you see it as Cantrip Money + Bonus card like Market the additional Action is really one of the best bonuses. Especially in engines virtual money is pretty handy and more Bazaars help you to get easily even more Bazaars. Not much more to say about this vanilla card.
#27 ▲12 Knights (Dark Ages) Weighted Average: 57.1% ▲9.5pp / Unweighted Average: 53.9% / Median: 55.4% ▲8.7pp / Standard Deviation: 22.3%

Knights are a big winner of this list. They are 12 ranks and nearly 10pp better than last year. It would be 4 ranks lower in the unweighted list, so it's underrated by newer players. It was voted 9 times below 20% and also 9 times above 80%.

Many already said about Rogue applies also to the Knights. This is the highest rated trashing attack, but is still only average. They only hit cards costing between $3 and $6 and your opponent can choose if you hit two possible targets, 2 big downsides, but unlike Rogue at least they can attack every time you play them. Another downside, especially in multiplayer games is that it gets trashed if another Knight is trashed, but this makes it also an interesting pickup purely for defense. The different bonuses are probably responsible for the high deviation and it's what makes this card either ignorable or very strong. We look deeper into the different Knights another time, but if you get Dame Anna early or can get Sir Michael who can double attack, this can make a big difference. But when Sir Martin is the one on top, you don't want to be the one who opens the way to stronger Knights for other players. Like very trashing attack this card is very strong if you can guarantee to play at least one Knight every turn and can be devastating in thin decks as you are basically guaranteed to hit good cards and is ignorable in other cases.
#26 ▼2 Duke (Intrigue) Weighted Average: 57.4% ▲0.4pp / Unweighted Average: 53.1% / Median: 58.5% ▲0.2pp / Standard Deviation: 24.9%

Duke is slightly better, but still lost 2 ranks in comparism to last year. It would be 7 ranks lower in the unweighted ranking, so it's criminally underrated by newer players. It has the third highest deviation in this list as it was voted 18 times below 20% and 17 times above 80%.

With Duke on the board the objective often is that you need to get the Duchies and Dukes as fast as you can. Similar to Gardens or Silk Road rushes you need good supporter cards which help you getting to $5 even if you're already greening, like Vault, Hoard, Count, Duchess, Horse Traders and Silver-gainers like Explorer or Haggler to just name a few. Duke can be very strong as it can easily be worth 6-8 VP if your opponent doesn't deny your strategy and is better than Province in those cases. 3-piling isn't that hard afterwards as there are 2 piles already gone. The problem is to realize when a board is a good Duke board. With good attacks (Curser and Handsize-Reducer) and especially Swindler or Knights as Counter, you really have to be careful and want to ignore Dukes. What makes Duke strong is that you have to consider it in every game and can be a nice Plan B if you're behind in a mirror game and don't want to contest Provinces anymore. Why? 5 Provinces are worth the same as 5 Duchies and 3 Dukes, so that's only 3 cards more, but each of them costs way less. Your opponent has then the tough decision if you can outrace you with Provinces or if he has to contest you on Duchies (and Dukes).
#25 ▲3 Highway (Hinterlands) Weighted Average: 57.5% ▲2.1pp / Unweighted Average: 58.6% / Median: 60.0% ▲3.3pp / Standard Deviation: 19.8%

Highway is only 0.16pp better than Duke. It's 3 ranks and 2pp better than last year. It was voted 11 times below 30% and would be one rank higher in the unweighted ranking.

Highway is highly dependant for supporter cards to make it useful. One vanilla Highway is bad and even worse than Market or Treasury, it's just a Peddler, so basically only worth $4. It seems similar to Bridge, but in fact it isn't. You can use it as a cantrip Bridge, but most of the times this isn't worth it, because you need +Buy and either need a small deck to play multiples or big drawing power what also means you need villages. So that is really slow. The only real combo is Highway/Market (or Worker's Village or Market Square) in a small deck. But you can do things with Highway what would be very difficult with Bridge. It can combo nice with trash-for-benefit cards, so you can at best replace Coppers with Provinces. Its best use may to use it with cards with fixed cost in the card text like Saboteur, Smugglers, Feast, Ironworks, Horn of Plenty, Altar etc to gain (or trash) Provinces with these cards. So while it can be worse than Market or Treasury it can - unlike those cards - really shine in some situations.
#24 ▼6 Embassy (Hinterlands) Weighted Average: 58.5% ▼9.6pp / Unweighted Average: 57.6% / Median: 60.9% ▼11.4pp / Standard Deviation: 22.0%

Embassy is significantly worse than last year, nearly 10pp and 6 ranks. It would be one rank lower in the unweighted list and was voted 15 times below 30%.

Embassy is a great Big Money card. An early Embassy is so good that your opponent gets a Silver for free. The mix of a terminal drawer and a Warehouse-like filter makes it that powerful. Yes, basically it's only +2 cards, but every time you play it, you can choose the best 6 cards out of 9 cards. Similiar to Envoy: If you have 5/2 and have the luck to draw it on turn 3, you may draw it in turn 4 and 5 again and will probably have already a huge lead, due to quick cycling. But it is also decent in engines if you can guarantee to draw it with a village.
#23 Baker (Guilds) Weighted Average: 60.3% / Unweighted Average: 62.4% / Median: 63.1% / Standard Deviation: 19.8%

Baker is the third out of 5 Guilds cards. It would be 2 ranks higher in the unweighted list. It was voted only 6 times below 30%.

Coin tokens are powerful, therefore Baker is powerful as well, the highest rated Market variant in this list. As Baker is a cantrip it rarely hurts in a deck and coin tokens are useful no matter if you add it to a money-centered deck or an engine. It's also a good addition in Double Tactician decks if you have additional buys as you can delay your Province buys by a few turns. The additional setup coin token doesn't affect the power of the card, but at least you can always open with it if you want to.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2014, 10:13:06 am by Qvist »
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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2014, 07:11:07 am »
+6

The Best $5 Cards - Part 5/6

#22 ▼2 Stables (Hinterlands) Weighted Average: 63.7% ▲2.8pp / Unweighted Average: 61.8% / Median: 66.2% ▲6.2pp / Standard Deviation: 20.1%

Stables is nearly 3pp better, but still lost 2 ranks. It was voted 12 times below 30%.

When you try to evaluate Stables, the comparism to Laboratory is very obvious. Both give you an action and a hand with one card more. In games with no trashing a few Stables can even be stronger, because you get an additional Warehouse-like cycling effect. Just discard your Coppers and you'll see your valuable cards more often. If you buy Stables and don't play Big Money, then your action density increases and the chances that you draw no treasure cards with Stables in hand increases too. Then Stables may be a dead card in hand. Especially in cursing games Stables is weaker. And even if your only treasure card is a Gold it highly depends on your deck if you really want to discard the Gold for 3 new cards. But a few Stables, Silvers and a +Buy card like Horse Traders or Baron can make a pretty good Hunting-Party-like deck. An early Stables is great and superior to Laboratory on a board with no trashing, but with more Action Cards, Victory Cards or Curses, Stables is getting weaker, so just don't buy too many. Just compare a hand of 5 Laboratories and 5 Stables.
#21 Butcher (Guilds) Weighted Average: 64.3% / Unweighted Average: 60.0% / Median: 63.1% / Standard Deviation: 23.3%

Butcher is the second last new Guilds card. It would be 2 ranks lower in the unweighted list, so newer players underrate it. It has a pretty high deviation and was voted 13 times below 30%.

Butcher is the new strong remodel variant. While remodel can be a dead card in a hand with no remodel targets, a big advantage in Butcher is that trashing is optional so that you can use it for taking 2 coin tokens which is already quite strong as coin tokens smooth out your buys and help you to reliably hit Province in the end game. Similar to Remodel you generally don't want to replace Coppers, but trashing Estates for Silvers and saving 1 coin token is strong in money focussed strategies, but trashing them for strong cheap engine pieces like Hamlet and saving both coin tokens is even stronger when you are building an engine. Another big bonus is that you can use more than 2 coin tokens to trash and replace a card if you have coin tokens spare. That's great in the end game where you want to keep at least one coin token so that you can expand your $5s (e.g. another Butcher) into Provinces. Of course Butcher synergizes even better with cards like Peddler, Border Village and Fortress or other cards that like TfB cards, also Gold gainers like Market Square which Butcher itself can activate.
#20 ▼3 Laboratory (Base) Weighted Average: 64.9% ▼0.5pp / Unweighted Average: 66.0% / Median: 66.2% ▼1.9pp / Standard Deviation: 15.5%

Laboratory has nearly the same average value, but is 3 ranks worse than last year. It would be 3 ranks higher in the unweighted list, so it's a bit overrated by newer players. It has a low deviation with only 2 votes below 30% and 19 votes below average.

Unlike Stables, like mentioned before, Laboratory is a good card in nearly every deck. It increases the hand size by one which is a often underrated benefit. And if you have multiple Laboratories in your deck you have a draw engine which is more consistent and reliable than a Village+Smithy draw engine as it isn't possible to draw dead. So, it's a engine on its own and you best begin early to build it.
#19 ▼1 Haggler (Hinterlands) Weighted Average: 65.9% ▲2.9pp / Unweighted Average: 64.3% / Median: 67.7% ▲4.4pp / Standard Deviation: 20.3%

Haggler is nearly 3pp better, but still lost one rank. It was voted four times on #1 and has 7 votes below 30% on the other side. It would be one rank lower in the unweighted list.

Haggler is very good for building up engines with multiple components. It adds the Border Village effect to any card you wish and also gives $2, so you can be pretty sure to get two good cards if you play Haggler. And in the middle to end game you can use it as a pseudo Hoard to get a Gold for a Province or even a Platinum on Colony boards. With Haggler you don't necessarily need +Buys early, you even have to beware that you don't use your additional buy for a low-cost card, so you have to get an additional Copper. It is a good starter for any good engine, for example Hunting Party, so you can get one more Hunting Party for every Province bought. But with discarding attacks and Cursers where you can get bad hands really often, Haggler isn't that good as you have to pick up a Copper or other cards you probably don't want. Similar is true with Potion cost cards as they have a lower coin value.
#18 Soothsayer (Guilds) Weighted Average: 66.8% / Unweighted Average: 66.7% / Median: 70.8% / Standard Deviation: 21.9%

Soothsayer is the highest ranked Guilds card. It was voted 3 times on #1 and 7 times below 30%. It would be 2 ranks higher in the unweighted list.

Soothsayer is a very tricky curser that gives an immediate advantage (drawing an extra card) and a delayed disadvantage (gaining a Curse) to your opponent while you have an immediate disadvantage (it gives you neither +cards nor money) and a delayed advantage (gaining a Gold). On engine boards with good trashing Soothsayer often isn't worth it as the extra card is big for your opponent and he can get rid of the Curses quite handily, and you don't want that many golds, at least not that early in the game. On Big Money boards with good trashing on the other hand, Soothsayer might still be a very good option as you rather gain those Golds than buying them. And if there's no good trashing available a Curser like Soothsayer is always a big deal. Soothsayer is different though as those games don't feel like normal slogs as the extra card and the Golds accelerate the game and you can buy Province quite early. Soothsayer loves sifters like Warehouse or Cellar as both the extra card and the high card variance (Golds and Curses) profit from good cycling. Also, as it is a Gold gainer, TfB cards like Apprentice or Remodel synergize well with Soothsayer.
#17 ▼5 Apprentice (Alchemy) Weighted Average: 67.0% ▼7.8pp / Unweighted Average: 65.0% / Median: 69.2% ▼6.6pp/ Standard Deviation: 20.4%

Apprentice lost 5 ranks and nearly 8pp. It would be 2 ranks lower in the unweighted list. It was voted 8 times below 30% and 22 times below average.

Although you can use an early Apprentice to trash your Coppers, Apprentice epitomizes (just like Salvager) Trash-for-Benefit cards; because the benefit is huge. If you don't hesitate to trash e.g. a Gold to get 6! cards and draw at least a card with +Buy or a Gainer you can really fasten the game. That's especially true with Gold gainers like Hoard and Haggler. You can buy a Province nearly every turn. With Market Square it is just crazy - leading to Hermit/Market Square-like mega-turns. It combos also nice with Border Village and Peddler and cards with on-trash benefits like Rats and Fortress. And as being one of the strongest Trash-for-Benefit cards, I especially mention the danger in Possession games. Your opponent won't hesitate to trash a Province or even a Colony for drawing nearly your whole deck.
#16 ▼5 Tactician (Seaside) Weighted Average: 67.9% ▼11.6pp / Unweighted Average: 68.4% / Median: 72.3% ▼9.4pp / Standard Deviation: 20.2%

Tactician also lost 5 ranks, but fell even deeper, more than 11pp. It has one first rank, was voted 4 times below 30% and 20 times below average. It would be 2 ranks higher in the unweighted list.

Tactician makes use of the phrase "One big turn is better than 2 mediocre ones". So in a deck in that you can't guarantee a Province each turn, with Tactician it's still very likely to get 2 Provinces each 2 turns. This applies especially to cards that take profit of big hand sizes like Forge, Bank or Tournament+Province. It's also great to get key cards like King's Court early or as a defense against discarding attacks (0/8 is definitely better than 3/3). And in combination with Black Market or Action cards that let you gain virtual money like Vault/Secret Chamber/Storeroom, Baron or a bunch of Festivals/Conspirators/Grand Markets you can even setup a Double Tactician strategy. You can play your second Tactician in your Tactician turn and still have enough money to buy something and get another 10 card hand in the next hand.
#15 ▲4 Upgrade (Intrigue) Weighted Average: 70.5% ▲9.6pp / Unweighted Average: 65.4% / Median: 70.8% ▲9.1pp / Standard Deviation: 22.4%

After being nearly 10pp and 5 ranks better last year, Upgrade did nearly the same jump this year again: 4 ranks and nearly 10pp. It would be 3 ranks lower in the unweighted ranking, so it's underrated by newer players. It was voted first once and 11 times below 30% and 27 times below average.

Non-terminal trashers or trash-for-benefit-cards are really strong. No surprise that Upgrade costs $5 so you can't open with it most of the times. With Upgrade you can trash your Coppers and Curses or turning your Estates into Silver without spending an action and keep playing all your other valuable action cards. It's great against cursers so that you might even want to ignore that curser - just be sure that there's no Poor House. Spamming Upgrades just to upgrade from $2s to $3s to $4s etc. seems nice, but is very slow as you rather play these action cards. But Upgrading an Upgrade into an early Grand Market can be very strong. It's also pretty similar to Junk Dealer which is better at the start, but you can use the trash-for benefit effect later to get Duchies what's really good with Rats or Fortress on the board.
#14 ▼1 Margrave (Hinterlands) Weighted Average: 72.3% ▼0.5pp / Unweighted Average: 73.1% / Median: 75.4% ▲0.9pp / Standard Deviation: 16.5%

Margrave stayed nearly where it was, lost only 1 rank. It would be 2 ranks higher in the unweighted list. It was voted first twice and 11 times below average.

Terminal drawers with +Buy are very strong as they tend to let you have many money in hand, more than you often need for a Province. Council Room has the drawback of give your opponent another card, but Wharf is still to come in this list. Margrave gives you an additional discard attack. The discard attack itself is not as strong as Militia's or Goons' discard attack because your opponent may draw a card first. But the discard attack is still very strong. It's just like you play Council Room+Militia or Governor+Militia. Margrave is another good Big Money card. With $11 you can buy an additional Silver to your Province. And terminal draw and +Buy is all Fool's Gold needs. It's also a good addition to your engine, but you have to be careful to add not too many Margraves to your engine, because every time you play a Margrave your opponent has another chance to draw the village that he desperately needed.
#13 ▲20 Counterfeit (Dark Ages) Weighted Average: 73.9% ▲24.8pp / Unweighted Average: 67.9% / Median: 75.4% ▲23.7pp / Standard Deviation: 25.6%

Counterfeit is the first of the three cards in this list that was criminally underrated last year. It is 20 ranks and nearly 25pp better now. It's still underrated by newer players as it would be 2 ranks lower in the unweighted list. It is also the card with the highest deviation in this list as it was voted 15 times below 30% and 25 times below average.

Counterfeit is a Throne Room for Treasures combined with a Trash-for-Benefit card. It's a way better Moneylender as it gives also $3 for trashing Coppers, but gives also a +Buy, doesn't cost an Action and isn't limited to Coppers. It's therefore a very strong opener and strong in the end game when you can trash Golds that you don't need anymore which is still stronger than Salvager which costs an Action an can trash Golds only for $6 while Counterfeit gives $7. It comboes therefore well with Gold gainers like Hoard. The best combo may be Counterfeit+Spoils. This gives you $7 for a card that you had to trash anyway. So it is a trasher that is very useful on nearly every board, no matter if you go for engine or for Big Money.
#12 ▼2 Ghost Ship (Seaside) Weighted Average: 74.8% ▼6.6pp / Unweighted Average: 73.7% / Median: 78.5% ▼6.5pp / Standard Deviation: 18.0%

Ghost Ship dropped 2 ranks again and is over 6pp worse than last year. It would be still 2 ranks higher in the unweighted list. It was voted 16 times below average.

Ghost Ship is very strong because it's a discard attack in which you don't have to discard, you have to top deck. So this messes up this turn and the next turn. You have then to choose to get 2 mediocre turns or a bad turn and hopefully a better next turn if you aren't getting "ghostshipped" again. This results in really slow games in which it takes long until you reshuffle and see the newly bought cards the first time. The difference to all other strong attack cards is you don't want to play as many as you can in one turn, you just want to constantly play it each turn. That's the reason why Ghost Ship with Schemes can be devastating. If there are no good defense cards / counters like Menagerie, Wishing Well or Mystic, you are in a soft pin you aren't likely to get out soon. So in comparism to Torturer and Minion a single play is stronger.
« Last Edit: April 23, 2014, 05:31:43 am by Qvist »
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Qvist

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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2014, 07:11:35 am »
+9

The Best $5 Cards - Part 6/6

#11 ▲21 Junk Dealer (Dark Ages) Weighted Average: 74.8% ▲25.3pp / Unweighted Average: 69.6% / Median: 73.9% ▲20.6pp / Standard Deviation: 22.0%

Junk Dealer is the second out of 3 Dark Ages cards that were criminally underrated last year. It's 21 ranks and over 25pp better now. It's still a bit underrated by newer players as it would be 2 ranks lower in the unweighted ranking. It was voted 25 times below average.

The obvious comparism to Junk Dealer is Upgrade. Both are cantrip trashers. While Upgrade gets you a potential extra card, Junk Dealer gives you $1. What's better really depends on the board. Unless you want those free Poor Houses, Junk Dealer is way better than Upgrade in trashing Coppers because the $1 extra helps you a lot in not losing the tempo. Trashing Shelters depends on if there are spammable $2 cards like Hamlet that you need and with Estates it's similar although Silvers are rarely a bad choice. But in engines you rarely want that many Silvers, so Junk Dealer is just better early on. But later in the game Junk Dealer is probably a dead card while Upgrade could still trash $4s into Duchies or themselves into Gold.
#10 ▼5 Ill-Gotten Gains (Hinterlands) Weighted Average: 76.0% ▼9.9pp / Unweighted Average: 73.3% / Median: 83.1% ▼8.4pp / Standard Deviation: 23.0%

Ill-Gotten-Gains took quite a hit, it's 5 ranks and nearly 10pp worse than last year. It was voted 15 times below average and first once. It would be one rank lower in the unweighted list.

I remember reading Ill-Gotten-Gains the first time and it seemed not that strong. You have only a one-shot curser to get a better Copper? But that's not like it is. A Ill-Gotten-Gains Rush is really strong. Just buy Ill-Gotten-Gains every time you get to $5. The optional extra Copper makes that possible. With a 5/2 opening it's even possible to deal out a Curse before the opponent's first reshuffle, especially for the first player. When the IGGs are gone, the Curses are usually gone too, so you just have to empty the Duchy pile to win the game and IGGs give enough money to accomplish exactly this. Often you are even able to pick up a Province in between. But you have to be sure to hit your opponent. While these Curses are nearly unstoppable, not even with Moat or Lighthouse (making IGG even stronger), with Trader or Ambassador on the board the Curse pile won't be empty if you empty the IGG pile and your opponent may have enough time to pick up enough Provinces before you empty 2 piles. The same applies with other Cursers on the board. But in all other cases when IGG is on the board, a IGG rush is probably the dominant strategy. On Councilroom it had the highest per gain win rate of all kingdom cards (1.21), even higher than Grand Market or any alternative victory card.
#9 =0 Minion (Intrigue) Weighted Average: 78.1% ▼4.7pp / Unweighted Average: 77.0% / Median: 80.0% ▼6.7pp / Standard Deviation: 16.2%

Minion is the 5th best $5 Attack card and stays on the same rank while being nearly 5pp worse. It was voted 11 times below average and first once.

Minion's discard attack can hit even stronger than any other discard attack. You have one card more than with Militia, but against Minion you cannot choose which card to keep. The non-terminal $2 is great in every engine and the discard option helps you to cycle faster. Those two benefits make it a self-working engine. If you win the Minion split, you can play the first Minions in your hand to get $2 and the last one to get the next 4 cards, then just proceed. And every non-terminal card with virtual coins and/or a non-terminal trasher fit very well in a Minion deck. Yes, there has to be some requirements: You are playing a 2-player game and have a thin deck and don't play with Colony, ... to name the major issues. At least without these requirements it's a lot weaker, but otherwise a Minion deck is super strong.
#8 =0 Torturer (Intrigue) Weighted Average: 79.3% ▼4.1pp / Unweighted Average: 77.9% / Median: 82.8% ▼2.2pp / Standard Deviation: 16.1%

Torturer is the 4th best $5 Attack card and is also around 4pp weaker and stays on the same rank, just like Minion. It was also voted 11 times below average and first once, again just like Minion.

A single Torturer is not that great. You can choose to take a Curse in hand or discard. Taking the Curse in hand is not that great as getting it onto your discard pile or even on top. If you have a Forge, Trading Post or a Jack of All Trades in hand, a Curse in hand doesn't hurt you that much. In all other cases it's just a Militia-like discarding attack. But multiple Torturers can really torture you, especially because you have a choice, but still are between the devil and the deep blue sea. So Torturer highly depends from Villages; especially with Border Villages, Fishing Villages or Crossroads a Torturer Chain is definitely the way to go. The first one that gets this set up is likely to win. When the Curses are gone, Torturers are no danger anymore. But the Curse split is likely highly in your favor and you already have a good running engine to maybe pick a few more treasures and then go green. Only with direct Cursers you may still skip them, because until you've set up this chain, there are few Curses left. Necropolis makes going for Torturers even a little bit more viable.
#7 ▼1 Governor (Promo) Weighted Average: 82.5% ▼2.6pp / Unweighted Average: 79.3% / Median: 86.2% ▼1.6pp / Standard Deviation: 18.4%

Governor is the fourth highest $5 non-Attack card and is one rank and over 2pp worse than last year. It was voted 9 times below average and 3 times first.

The different options make it difficult to play. And depending on what you choose it can a really bad card or a great one. Like Council Room, the +1 card may pretty huge for your opponent if you choose +3 cards. And if you even choose that multiple times in a row, you give your opponent a great hand too. So either do that only if you a) play a discard attack afterwards, b) can end that game in a mega turn or c) possess your opponent afterwards. In all these 3 cases Governor is really powerful. The remodel effect is bad in the early game, you're helping your opponent even more for letting him trash his Coppers or get a Silver for an Estate, you can use it in the end game to remodel your treasure card in respective Victory card. The best option without above mentioned supporting cards may be the Gold gaining. The Silver can be really bad for your opponent in a Colony game or if he builds a deck with high action density. And you can pick up Governors over Golds because you can get Golds with Governor later. That leads to a state where Governor can combo with itself. Gain many Governors, choose the gain Gold option every time. With many Governors and Gold in your deck use a few Governors for +3 cards and the rest to remodel your Gold into Provinces in a mega turn. Governor/Chapel used to be one the prime openers on Councilroom.
#6 ▼2 Hunting Party (Cornucopia) Weighted Average: 83.0% ▼7.5pp / Unweighted Average: 80.2% / Median: 86.2% ▼5.5pp / Standard Deviation: 17.3%

Hunting Party is the third highest $5 non-Attack card, slightly ahead of Governor. It dropped 2 ranks and over 7pp. It was voted 7 times below average and first once.

After Stables and Laboratory, Hunting Party is the best non-terminal hand-size increasing $5 card. The advantage is the even better filter effect than Stables to get the cards in hand you really need. It's also an engine on its own, just have one Gold and at least a Silver and a good terminal action which gives you at least $2, like Goons, Monument, Horse Traders, Haggler or Baron. With at least 5-6 Hunting Parties you are almost guaranteed a Province each turn because you only have few different cards in your deck and get those all in hand. Going green doesn't hurt you much (only Duchies) and with Cursers you only need a Hunting Party more to filter Curses. It's not strictly better than Laboratory if there are no different cards left in your deck, but that mostly occurs only if you already have a very strong deck or you have a heavily trimmed deck what you don't need when you go for Hunting Parties. The only thing you have to watch out in such a deck is when to trigger the reshuffle so you get at least a Hunting Party in the next hand again. With Dark Ages it got a little bit worse. Shelters hurt a Hunting Party deck a lot and Ruins from Looters also hurt a lot more than Curses.
#5 ▼3 Witch (Base) Weighted Average: 89.1% ▼7.9pp / Unweighted Average: 88.1% / Median: 93.9% ▼4.4pp / Standard Deviation: 14.0%

Witch lost 3 ranks and is nearly 8pp worse, but is still in the Top 5. It is the third best $5 Attack card and has the third lowest deviation with 4 votes below average and 6 first votes. It is one rank higher in the unweighted list.

Cursers are the strongest cards in the game, I think everyone agrees. There are only 6 guaranteed Cursers, one gives you no benefit and only costs $4, another one is a one-shot and ranked #10 on this list, the third one let your opponent draw one card, the fourth one has Potion in its cost and the fifth is a Prize Card. So Witch is a guaranteed Curser with no drawback and definitely one of the strongest cards in the game. Not only you can curse your opponent, you get 2 additional cards. King's Courting a Witch is basically "Game Over" for your opponent. The defense with Witch on the board is mostly to get it for yourself, faster than your opponent and play it more often.
#4 ▲3 Cultist (Dark Ages) Weighted Average: 89.3% ▲4.3pp / Unweighted Average: 85.5% / Median: 92.3% ▲4.0pp / Standard Deviation: 18.5%

Cultist is 3 ranks and over 4pp better and is now in the Top 5 and is the second best $5 Attack card. It was close, but it's 0.13pp better than Witch. It was voted 6 times below average and 9 times first. It's one rank lower in the unweighted list.

Cultist is the Looter pendant to Witch. As Ruins are not as bad as Curses it has the benefit of getting sort of +1 Action which can only be used to play more Cultists. So you are able to play multiple Cultists in a turn and therefore junk harder than Witch. In a chapeled down thin deck it can be devastating to get like 4 Ruins in a turn and can totally shut you down. And even if the Ruins are gone 4-5 Cultists give you really good draw and allow you to get a lot of money in hand. The second benefit is that it can be trashed for +3 cards what can be really strong with Procession for example or any trash for benefit card.
#3 =0 Wharf (Seaside) Weighted Average: 91.6% ▼3.7pp / Unweighted Average: 89.3% / Median: 93.9% ▼1.8pp / Standard Deviation: 12.1%

Wharf is the second best $5 non-Attack card. It stayed on the same rank, but is nearly 4pp worse. It has the lowest deviation in this list with only one outlier below average and 11 votes on #1. It would be even one rank better in the unweighted list.

+2 Cards are mostly weak. The benefit you get in this turn is pretty weak too. But the duration effect of +2 Cards without playing an action is like 2 Caravans or if you played 2 Laboratories at the start of your next turn. And Laboratory is already a strong card of the same cost. If you have 2 Wharves and you play them alternating each turn, you start each turn with 7 cards and basically each Wharf is a Council Room without the drawback of giving your opponent an additional card. And as already mentioned the +Buy for a terminal draw is really nice too, you need it with so many cards in hand. You can use Wharf for Big Money with less probability of colliding (because of the duration effect) or you can build an engine. In combination with Fishing Village you are almost guaranteed big hands (like you're playing Double Tactician) and even have enough Actions left for Attacks. No matter if you're going Big Money or build a engine with it, Wharf is so strong that those games are over very quick. Wharf's draw and +Buy is also good for Fool's Gold, making it a supreme opener. Yes, you rarely want to skip Wharf when it's on the board.
#2 ▲24 Rebuild (Dark Ages) Weighted Average: 92.2% ▲37.4pp / Unweighted Average: 88.7% / Median: 95.4% ▲43.7pp / Standard Deviation: 16.9%

Rebuild is the third criminally underrated card from last year. It's now 24 ranks and over 37pp better, being now the best non-Attack card in this list! It was voted 4 times below average and 32 times on the first rank. It is one rank lower in the unweighted list.

This card seems not so strong at first glance, but it really is. The big advantage of this card is that you can get guaranteed Victory Points and don't care that much about attacks. Rebuild lets you expand victory that aren't even in your hand and give also an additional action. Especially in non-Shelter games you can easily get 3 Provinces out of your starting Estates. If your opponent keeps on building you can easily deplete the Provinces if you trash them into more Provinces. Alternatively you could first try to deplete Duchies and then trash them for Provinces. That prevents your opponent with an good engine to catch up by buying Duchies while he fears buying Provinces because of depleting the pile too fast. Junking Attacks are still good against it as you won't draw Rebuilds that often anymore, but the effect isn't so bad anymore as you can just buy Estates and expand them later. Discarding Attacks can prevent you from buying Duchies, but might even help you as you can discard Victory cards from your hand which you would otherwise not have been able to expand. Also Rebuild combos with a lot of cards. In a deck full of Tunnels you get one Gold per Tunnel in your deck and you only need your starting Estates to get some of those. In a similar way Feoda are great as you can trash those for Silver and just get a new Feodum. Rebuild profits a lot from sifters as you don't need a big hand size, so Cellar, Warehouse and Wandering Minstrel will work well. Also, Victory card gainers like Baron and Count work well and also Trade Route will go up in value very fast while you profit from a thinner deck. Also Scavenger is really powerful with it as you want to play Rebuild as often as possible and Scavenger pretty much guarantees it. But be careful, if a Rebuild strategy doesn't work out because another strategy is faster and you are behind in points you often have lost because you probably haven't enough money to buy Provinces to catch up.
#1 =0 Mountebank (Prosperity) Weighted Average: 93.4% ▼4.9pp / Unweighted Average: 91.6% / Median: 96.9% ▼3.1pp / Standard Deviation: 13.1%

And Mountebank is #1 again, but it lost around 5pp, so it's not so clear anymore. It has the second lowest deviation with only one vote below average and 25 votes on the first rank, less first ranks than Rebuild.

Mountebank cannot deal out curses guaranteed, but dealing out 2 junk cards per play is really strong and if the opponent has a Curse in hand, he is mostly behind in the Curse split anyway. So, in comparism to Witch it's stronger in the beginning where junk hurts you more. Your deck can get clogged up so fast. Then it may not hit every time in the middle game, but when the Curse pile is empty, you can still deal out Coppers, that's another advantage. While $2 is mostly weaker than +2 cards (especially in Colony games), there's no big difference in Cursing games as your deck has more junk and it's more difficult to get a money average of $1 per card at the start anyway. So, it really depends on the board if Mountebank is stronger than Witch, but mostly it is Mountebank because it hurts more. Just beware with Trader on the board or you may be giving your opponent 2 Silvers. Also, Mountebank/Chapel used to be the overall best opening on Councilroom.
« Last Edit: April 29, 2014, 04:11:43 am by Qvist »
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ChocophileBenj

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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2014, 07:48:10 am »
0

First ! And as it's only cards before Dark Ages, I may comment, even though I didn't rank !

I think Explorer is lower than many treasures here, at least Royal Seal.
I think Harvest fits nicely in bottom 3, and I hope Tribute will be behind any Dark ages card (for instance).
I would have ranked Cache and Mine higher, although I know for all this time that treasures and BM-friendly cards suck at $5.
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MarkowKette

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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2014, 10:19:21 am »
+1

I think Tribute should be down there in the bottom 10. It only shines when your opponent gets dual-type victory cards and with the addition of Guilds that chance didn't really increase.  I even think its best use might be in Big Money vs Big money.
Where it's ofter a terminal $4 and usually at least $2. When you want it for actions  there is usually no other village.
When there is no other Village Big Money is very likely a good strategy. If your opponent goes for BM you won't get the needed actions out of it.

I would rate Mandarin a little bit higher though. It's still often usefull for some late-game shenanigans especially when you're behind and have to preak PPR.
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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #8 on: April 09, 2014, 10:27:43 am »
0

This list isn't all that bad, though I think Counting House should be right below Mandarin here.  The instances where I want it exceed where I want those treasures, generally.
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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #9 on: April 09, 2014, 10:33:14 am »
+4

Largely irrelevant, but I'd like to point out that the Stash + Scavenger combo works with 3 Stashes and 3 Scavengers too, which is cheaper than the 4+2 version.
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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #10 on: April 09, 2014, 10:38:57 am »
0

yea tribute should be lower and outpost should be a lot higher

MarkowKette

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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #11 on: April 09, 2014, 10:48:51 am »
0

yea tribute should be lower and outpost should be a lot higher

The thing with Outpost is it's very hard to rate.
Let's say your card rating comes from a function like:
p*(how often do i buy [at least one copy of] this card when it's on the board)+(1-p)*(how much impact has this card on the game when i buy it)   ;  0<p<1

If your p is close to 1 the card will very likely in the bottom 5! if your p is close to 0 this card might even be in the Top 10.
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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #12 on: April 09, 2014, 10:54:21 am »
0

yea tribute should be lower and outpost should be a lot higher

The thing with Outpost is it's very hard to rate.
Let's say your card rating comes from a function like:
p*(how often do i buy [at least one copy of] this card when it's on the board)+(1-p)*(how much impact has this card on the game when i buy it)   ;  0<p<1

If your p is close to 1 the card will very likely in the bottom 5! if your p is close to 0 this card might even be in the Top 10.

tis is true. i think my p is lower than it is for most people. but even with a high p, I'd probably have outpost >> tribute

MarkowKette

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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #13 on: April 09, 2014, 11:01:03 am »
0

yea tribute should be lower and outpost should be a lot higher

The thing with Outpost is it's very hard to rate.
Let's say your card rating comes from a function like:
p*(how often do i buy [at least one copy of] this card when it's on the board)+(1-p)*(how much impact has this card on the game when i buy it)   ;  0<p<1

If your p is close to 1 the card will very likely in the bottom 5! if your p is close to 0 this card might even be in the Top 10.

tis is true. i think my p is lower than it is for most people. but even with a high p, I'd probably have outpost >> tribute

yeah even with a variable p you can say that for a few cards in comparison to others. If for card 1 and card 2
x1>x2 and y1>y2  (fp(x,y)=px+(1-p)y) then card 1 is better than card 2 independant of the p-value ;)
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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #14 on: April 09, 2014, 11:14:17 am »
0

I think Tribute should be down there in the bottom 10. It only shines when your opponent gets dual-type victory cards and with the addition of Guilds that chance didn't really increase.  I even think its best use might be in Big Money vs Big money.
Where it's ofter a terminal $4 and usually at least $2. When you want it for actions  there is usually no other village.
When there is no other Village Big Money is very likely a good strategy. If your opponent goes for BM you won't get the needed actions out of it.

I would rate Mandarin a little bit higher though. It's still often usefull for some late-game shenanigans especially when you're behind and have to preak PPR.

One could state, that mirror matches are the important ones. The worst thing about Tribute is, that drawing cads for you means skipping green ones for your opponent, which is not that great after all. I agree, it's probably best in Big Money mirror. With those ruins it can be nice to gain actions, though.
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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #15 on: April 09, 2014, 11:36:04 am »
0

As someone who plays with 5 Prosperity cards at a time, I'd rank Counting House and Contraband significantly higher: above Royal Seal, probably. Contraband is a great opener when you have multiple cards in the $6-$7 range. Counting House is pretty niche, but it's just so good when it's good.

Either or Harvest or Cache should probably be last. I really want to like Cache, but it's just so seldom that I want to use a $5 buy on it. And unlike most $5 cards, I almost never want to buy it with $6 or more. Without Trader or Stables in the game, it's hard to justify buying it, and even then it's not an auto-buy. Harvest is nice when throned, but that's about it.
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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #16 on: April 09, 2014, 12:22:59 pm »
+2

Quote
As someone who plays with 5 Prosperity cards at a time, I'd rank Counting House and Contraband significantly higher: above Royal Seal, probably. Contraband is a great opener when you have multiple cards in the $6-$7 range. Counting House is pretty niche, but it's just so good when it's good.

I think Royal Seal deserves to be above Contraband. Contraband's extra +$1 and +1 buy comes at a very steep cost, the ability to buy what you need. In a good proportion of games, I'd probably take plain Silver over Contraband. I find the bonus from Royal Seal to be pretty nice - if you draw it at the top of your deck, it can accelerate your game by 2-3 turns with just one play.

That said, Contraband is sort of tricky to rank, because its value is directly dependent on how good a player your opponent is. There's usually a few obvious choices for what to block, but I've seen elite players make some savvy moves against Contraband with game-clinching results. Against weaker opponents, however, Contraband is a somewhat better card.
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Robz888

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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #17 on: April 09, 2014, 12:51:28 pm »
0

It seems the masses have not come around yet on Counting House.
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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #18 on: April 09, 2014, 01:11:15 pm »
0

For me, Rogue is dead last. The attack is bad and without a lot of help you are often grabbing junk from the trash. Too often it's an expensive terminal Silver. And games where it's good, like grabbing certain Knights out of the trash, are the games that are the least enjoyable to play. 
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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #19 on: April 09, 2014, 01:22:25 pm »
+3

For me, Rogue is dead last. The attack is bad and without a lot of help you are often grabbing junk from the trash. Too often it's an expensive terminal Silver. And games where it's good, like grabbing certain Knights out of the trash, are the games that are the least enjoyable to play.
it's mostly good to get good cards out of the trash. it's good in knight games, really good in rebuild games and often good in pillage games. that alone makes it better than lots of other $5's.

KingZog3

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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #20 on: April 09, 2014, 01:27:58 pm »
+4

For me, Rogue is dead last. The attack is bad and without a lot of help you are often grabbing junk from the trash. Too often it's an expensive terminal Silver. And games where it's good, like grabbing certain Knights out of the trash, are the games that are the least enjoyable to play.

I used to think this, but I've played a few games where Rogue is important. It's rare, but decks that use Apprentice or Salvager a lot need lots of fuel, and Rogue gives tons of fuel while taking it away from your opponent's Rogues. The card is only an attack to be able to put cards in the trash on its own. But buying it for the attack is a mistake, you buy it for the gaining.
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Robz888

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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #21 on: April 09, 2014, 01:32:57 pm »
0

For me, Rogue is dead last. The attack is bad and without a lot of help you are often grabbing junk from the trash. Too often it's an expensive terminal Silver. And games where it's good, like grabbing certain Knights out of the trash, are the games that are the least enjoyable to play.

No, Rogue should not be dead last. Dead last is Harvest.

In fact, I used Rogue productively, just yesterday, in an HP + X deck.
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KingZog3

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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #22 on: April 09, 2014, 01:44:28 pm »
0

For me, Rogue is dead last. The attack is bad and without a lot of help you are often grabbing junk from the trash. Too often it's an expensive terminal Silver. And games where it's good, like grabbing certain Knights out of the trash, are the games that are the least enjoyable to play.

No, Rogue should not be dead last. Dead last is Harvest.

In fact, I used Rogue productively, just yesterday, in an HP + X deck.

Yeah, harvest is last without question. People still see Counting House as last, but man it can be good sometimes (and fun).
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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #23 on: April 09, 2014, 02:20:39 pm »
0

I agree Harvest should be last, but for what it is worth, I think I buy them pretty much equally, which is about 1 out of 500 games. At least, that is what it seems like to me.
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Re: The Dominion Cards Lists 2014 Edition: $5 cards (Part 1/6)
« Reply #24 on: April 09, 2014, 02:27:20 pm »
+1

Counting House is good at least sometimes. Harvest is just pretty much never worth getting, even though it's less bad in the situations where Counting House is bad.
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