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[skip wooznum]

Wall post

So I'm not going to quote the whole wall post but I will address the points made, even though I feel like I've already done so, and I feel like it won't change your mind. Maybe I'll convince Joseph or pasta. I hope it's clear which point I'm responding to with each of my statements.

1)It would be trivially easy to explain my use of the word rope as just a random use of the word rope. Moreover, it is fairly unlikely anyone would have ever even have noticed it. The rope giver would have just given the rope to mail-mi, and that would be that. Why would they scour the thread for crumbs once mail-mi explicitly listed rope? (This is the main reason everyone should know I'm town.)

2)I deliberately waited to counterclaim mail-mi because I didn't want him to know initially that he was the one I was countering, and the only way to do that was by waiting for others to claim.

3)The doubt I was expressing in my post of doubt-expression was that I was unsure if getting a reaction (or non-reaction, as it were) from mail-mi and others was worth the risk of, say, Joseph inadvertently revealing more about the stuff he needs. This was genuine doubt I felt at the time. I made a decision, but I was unsure if it was the right one.

4)You seem to be saying that my reason for doing all this is to get mail-mi lynched and get the rope. I think it's fairly obvious that if mail-mi flips town, I won't be getting the rope.

[sudgy]

Also, keep in mind that I like on the west coast, so I'll only be around very close to the deadline.

[scolapasta]

1)It would be trivially easy to explain my use of the word rope as just a random use of the word rope. Moreover, it is fairly unlikely anyone would have ever even have noticed it. The rope giver would have just given the rope to mail-mi, and that would be that. Why would they scour the thread for crumbs once mail-mi explicitly listed rope? (This is the main reason everyone should know I'm town.)

Are you saying that you didn't use the word rope there purposefully? Why #1 a reason we should know you are town?

[sudgy]

Also, keep in mind that I like on the west coast, so I'll only be around very close to the deadline.

live, not like

[sudgy]

1)It would be trivially easy to explain my use of the word rope as just a random use of the word rope. Moreover, it is fairly unlikely anyone would have ever even have noticed it. The rope giver would have just given the rope to mail-mi, and that would be that. Why would they scour the thread for crumbs once mail-mi explicitly listed rope? (This is the main reason everyone should know I'm town.)

Are you saying that you didn't use the word rope there purposefully? Why #1 a reason we should know you are town?

He's saying that as scum, he could have explained it like that.  Instead, he chose to go into the 1v1.

[skip wooznum]

1)It would be trivially easy to explain my use of the word rope as just a random use of the word rope. Moreover, it is fairly unlikely anyone would have ever even have noticed it. The rope giver would have just given the rope to mail-mi, and that would be that. Why would they scour the thread for crumbs once mail-mi explicitly listed rope? (This is the main reason everyone should know I'm town.)

Are you saying that you didn't use the word rope there purposefully? Why #1 a reason we should know you are town?

He's saying that as scum, he could have explained it like that.  Instead, he chose to go into the 1v1.

Yes. This.

[faust]

It's curious that multiple people floated the idea of creating a non-skip/mail-mi wagon, but noone really put any effort into making that happen. Unfortunately, it doesn't provide much insight into the situation; scum has an incentive to behave this way if there is scum among them (they want to get another lynch, but don't want to be seen pushing that angle hard) or not (they are content with the situation, but want to distance themselves).

It will be a good thing to look back on once we know more.

[Eevee]

Anyone interested in vote: awaclus?

Fits scum avoiding doing anything controversial and just skating by to a T.

[jotheonah]

Well, skip v mail-mi here has been a tough decision. And Galz never came back and explained how he felt about ADK, which is a little annoying.

I'm townreading MiX ridiculously hard right now, so I'm tempted to sheep him, but I still don't really buy his skip case. I think he's trying too hard to make the square peg fit in the round hole. In many ways this is like a cop claim situation, where townie A says "I'm a cop and I investigated townie B and he's scum" and townie B says "No, I'm town, so townie A must be lying and saying he's a cop". What do we usually do in that situation? If it's not LyLo, we just lynch townie B, and then we lynch townie A the next day if townie B flips town. Because in our experience, it's very rare for scum to put themselves out there, especially on day 1 when all they need is a mislynch.

So if there's scum amongst mail-mi and skip, it just makes sense to vote for mail-mi, because he was the one who got caught up in this vs the one who initiated this. To me, that's the heart of the matter.

Now, you can ask whether the situation is really analogous. And you can ask whether we really will lynch skip if mail-mi flips town -- I suspect there are many ways for him to wriggle out in that case. And you can ask, as many have, if this 1 v 1 thing is really a thing. But the fact is, this is where we've arrived and I just can't defend the people who are saying 'lynch skip'.

vote: mail-mi. That's L-1.

[MiX]

Intent to hammer

Where's mail-mi?

[Awaclus]

Anyone interested in vote: awaclus?

no

[jotheonah]

Intent to hammer

Where's mail-mi?

idk. We've waited this long. I guess I'd rather wait the last 4 hours in case he turns up with a claim or useful info.

[MiX]

Wall post

So I'm not going to quote the whole wall post but I will address the points made, even though I feel like I've already done so, and I feel like it won't change your mind. Maybe I'll convince Joseph or pasta. I hope it's clear which point I'm responding to with each of my statements.

1)It would be trivially easy to explain my use of the word rope as just a random use of the word rope. Moreover, it is fairly unlikely anyone would have ever even have noticed it. The rope giver would have just given the rope to mail-mi, and that would be that. Why would they scour the thread for crumbs once mail-mi explicitly listed rope? (This is the main reason everyone should know I'm town.)

2)I deliberately waited to counterclaim mail-mi because I didn't want him to know initially that he was the one I was countering, and the only way to do that was by waiting for others to claim.

3)The doubt I was expressing in my post of doubt-expression was that I was unsure if getting a reaction (or non-reaction, as it were) from mail-mi and others was worth the risk of, say, Joseph inadvertently revealing more about the stuff he needs. This was genuine doubt I felt at the time. I made a decision, but I was unsure if it was the right one.

4)You seem to be saying that my reason for doing all this is to get mail-mi lynched and get the rope. I think it's fairly obvious that if mail-mi flips town, I won't be getting the rope.

1) Depends on who has the rope. Besides, I don't think scum can run away from all of these conflicts, I'm sure at least one of them is town vs town, it can't be the only one.

2) Right, but what did you gain with it? From what I'm seeing, you just stalled.

3) I didn't see any deliberation with anyone else regarding the best thing to do. A bunch of people chimed in, but you seemed indifferent, as if you already had the plan to out mail-mi. Which I believe is the correct play, but still.

4) Whoever doesn't give you the Rope is scum. Given no one else needs it, it would be anti-town to not give it to you if mail-mi flips, regardless of what he is.

Intent to hammer

Where's mail-mi?

idk. We've waited this long. I guess I'd rather wait the last 4 hours in case he turns up with a claim or useful info.

What's mail-mi's time zone?

Anyone interested in vote: awaclus?

no

Yes, Eevee is interested. Lynch all Liars!

[Glooble]

The clue in my luggage. The Russian. The artifact. Madrid. And now this business with the rope. I couldn't help but feel everything was connected.


With 15 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Deadline is April 29th at noon ET. That's in two and a half hours.

Vote Count 1.7:

skip wooznum (5): Awaclus, mail-mi, scolapasta, MiX, Joseph2303
mail-mi (7): skip wooznum, LaLight, faust, WestCoastDidds, A Drowned Kernel, sudgy, jotheonah
A Drowned Kernel (1): Galzria
Awaclus (1): Eevee
Not voting (1): DatSwan

[WestCoastDidds]

I’m just catching up...give me a minute to read.

Mail-mi is in Utah, I think, so mountain time.

[WestCoastDidds]

Alright, caught up. Not as much happened as I expected.

Sudgy, where on the west coast are you? Contrary to my name, I’m in Texas but still San Diego has stayed with me.

Skip, what about you? Where are you located?

(Those questions are just because I like to have a complete map in my head)

Sudgy, I appreciate the careful reread of everyone. I don’t disagree with much you have posted there. Awaclus and Jospeh are noticeable to me for their lack of interaction. LL participated in the have stuff/need stuff conversation that has him more towny for me for now.

My would lynch list is based on lurkiness or lack of helpfulness, but not much that is actually scummy, plus MM who is on the not-as-town side of the 1v1. So:
Mail-mi
Joseph
Awaclus
Galzy

If there is a real desire for folks to shift away from MM, those are the folks for whom I’d move. I’m aroundish from now until deadline.

[mail-mi]

Intent to hammer

Where's mail-mi?

Just woke up, hold on.

[WestCoastDidds]

Which position is that?

Honestly, I was a bit taken aback by people being so quick to follow my plan, but my gut reaction is that getting this kind of thing out there is at least useful in getting the game going

If there is scum in mix and skip: scum is probably in the sidelines, because in that case lynching in the 1v1 is bad for them regardless of which one flips. As someone who was scum in the gladiator game being in position where you're forced into that dichotomy is very uncomfortable, and I think they would want to shift away from that

If it's town vs town... then scum's wherever.

The position that this is town v town, and that MM is on the not-as-town side of it, but that scum is probably just watching.

I think that most people either have stuff or need stuff, so some plan is better than no plan, especially as a counter to Skip’s plan that we just causally mention the time in a post which maybe worked for him but is going to be a lot harder for more obviously valuable items.

Thanks for the insight. I am of the opinion that you are smart, level headed, and observant and are not as easily swayed in the emotion of a moment or exchange as I am, so your take- when I think we are starting from a similar place- is helpful. 

[mail-mi]

So honestly I saw this coming. I mean realistically it was either me or skip. It's skip of course, and you'll see that once I flip town. I made a little case, though it wasn't the most thorough or convincing thing in the world but hey it was a case. I also love how no one has actually seriously made a case on me other than "he's antitown" which isn't much of a case (especially because I wanted to just take some time to have fun because of some other intense games) and being on the other side of the skip 1v1

In fact, isn't it telling how my wagon just formed without a case, while there have been actual cases on skip that have been okay at least and his wagon has just stalled?

[WestCoastDidds]

Mail-mi, if it is town v town....who is scum?

[mail-mi]

Mail-mi, if it is town v town....who is scum?

I say there's a good mix between the people who are insisting it's a 1v1 and those who are sitting back and letting it happen. I'd have to look back and see exactly who was doing what. From off the top of my head, joth was one of the latter type, and Galz and Eevee.

[jotheonah]

So honestly I saw this coming. I mean realistically it was either me or skip. It's skip of course, and you'll see that once I flip town. I made a little case, though it wasn't the most thorough or convincing thing in the world but hey it was a case. I also love how no one has actually seriously made a case on me other than "he's antitown" which isn't much of a case (especially because I wanted to just take some time to have fun because of some other intense games) and being on the other side of the skip 1v1

In fact, isn't it telling how my wagon just formed without a case, while there have been actual cases on skip that have been okay at least and his wagon has just stalled?

I just can't get past what I posted ... if you can sell me on why scum!skip would take this unnecessary risk on day 1, I will switch my vote to him.

[MiX]

Mail-mi, fakeclaim.

[MiX]

Mail-mi, fakeclaim.

Hahahahahahahahaha

Mail-mi, fullclaim.

[mail-mi]

So honestly I saw this coming. I mean realistically it was either me or skip. It's skip of course, and you'll see that once I flip town. I made a little case, though it wasn't the most thorough or convincing thing in the world but hey it was a case. I also love how no one has actually seriously made a case on me other than "he's antitown" which isn't much of a case (especially because I wanted to just take some time to have fun because of some other intense games) and being on the other side of the skip 1v1

In fact, isn't it telling how my wagon just formed without a case, while there have been actual cases on skip that have been okay at least and his wagon has just stalled?

I just can't get past what I posted ... if you can sell me on why scum!skip would take this unnecessary risk on day 1, I will switch my vote to him.

I already wrote up a small case for it. It wasnt completely correct but that doesn't change the gist of the case.