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[theorel]

I'm not comfortable claiming until everyone has weighed in.  I believe some people haven't.  The essential issue (as already stated) is that we can only prove one of the claims is lying through this, NOT that both claims are true.  If we could prove both claims were true, 3 named townies, I think, would be worth the claim.  So, I think the question we have to ask is what do we do if we do get a jailkeeper claim?  And decide if that scenario works out well enough to merit the claiming.  With 3 people already claiming non-JK...(5 if you count the doctors), that leaves 4 people unclaimed.  Is it enough to keep the JK a mystery within that group?  I dunno.  I'd like to hear Insom weigh in on the claims (unless I missed his comment...I'll be double-checking)

[Insomniac]

I'm still vla but I don't want to hold up this game to much and I have been keeping up in between games. I don't think it's worth the chance of outing a pr to say one of them might not be lying. There is such a slim chance we have 3P's that while possible is not something worth outing a jk to the mafia for IMO. That said if the consensus ends up being pro jk/no jk claim I will go along with it. (If a jk actually guaranteed that gruj/cuzz aren't lying it would be a different story. It doesn't do that)

[Robz888]

Vote: Grujah

I don't think there's a Jailkeeper, and some of his mafia friends are trying to cover for him.

[Cuzz]

So here are the 5 possibilities from my perspective. I do not include my thoughts on what anyone should do because I'm not sure:

A. JK/not JK claim stalls. We have no new info other than that a couple of particular people are not JK. But still a chance there is a mystery JK who can protect me! In terms of a lynch for today, we probably should try to get Grujah to talk more and get a better sense of whether he's lying the old fashioned way. Or perhaps we move on to other targets to be safe since there is more scum out there for the lynchin'.

B. JK claims and everyone believes him. We are unsure whether Grujah is lying (I know myself to be not lying). So again, we either try to deduce if he's lying or lynch someone else. But we've outed another PR, and WIFOM all around for the NK tonight.

C. JK claims but might be lying. This seems more likely than B. After all, not believing Grujah's doctor claim is what got us to this debacle in the first place. If Grujah is scum, a scumbuddy has incentive to fake claim JK to avoid scenario D.

D. Everyone claims not JK. Easy. Lynch Grujah. No other protective roles, though, so I die tonight.

E. Multiple people claim JK. Ugh.

[O]

vote:grujah

I agree with Robz and think we don't have a JK. This whole refusing to claim business is quite suspicious.

[O]

unvote fuck thought I hammered there for a second

[O]

either way we don't need to be at L-1 now and if I did put him l-1/hammer I'm pretty sure I'm lynched next. Forgot there were previous votes on him.

[Cuzz]

Not a hammer by my count. Would be L-1.

[O]

Not a hammer by my count. Would be L-1.

obviously if it was a hammer me unvoting would have been useless. I still didn't want L-1 

[Cuzz]

Not a hammer by my count. Would be L-1.

obviously if it was a hammer me unvoting would have been useless. I still didn't want L-1 

I get it. Just clarifying.

[Voltgloss]

Vote Count 2-14

O (1): theorel
Grujah (3): Cuzz, Insomniac, Robz888
Insomniac (1): Grujah
Robz888 (1): jotheonah
jotheonah (1): Captain_Frisk
Captain_Frisk (1): sparky5856

Not voting {1}: O

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch

Lynch deadline: Saturday, October 13, 3:00 p.m. EDT

[Robz888]

Here's all the evidence against Grujah:

• Suspicious hardcore lurking, not in keeping with active town personality of previous games MVI and MIX
• Re-appeared when he was in trouble, but didn't make original arguments
• Has the significantly weaker of two doctor claims, in a game where the odds of two doctors are low (but still exist)
• Doctor is the go-to fake claim
• Half the town affirmed they are not Jailkeepers, but several players have refrained from weighing in--likely scum there not wanting to fake claim Jailkeeper and risk losing both themselves and Grujah, so have tried to save him instead by not letting the JK claiming finish.
• I do not see any player defending Grujah. And if there is a secret Jailkeeper among us, I would expect that person to be saying things like, "I do not find Grujah suspicious, the case against him is bad."

Keeping in mind the clock, I think there's sufficient evidence to kill Grujah at this point. There is a benefit to doing it without any more JK claiming, to protect the JK, obviously. So, I personally am fine with Grujah being hammered, but he's two votes away, so I guess there needs to be a bit more discussion. Although I say give him the axe at this point. Let's not drag this out too much longer.

[sparky5856]

Let me see if I got this deadline thing straight. The day started one week ago. (Boy, how often do you say THAT in real life.) We have three guaranteed real days every game day, so so far we've spent four real days. We've spent four days in Day 1 as well. So, we have thirteen real days left. Yeah, my math is correct. I've taken discrete math, multivariable calculus, and linear algebra classes, so I should know basic addition.

I think now is a good time to switch to night. We want to leave in a lot of discussion time for Day 3 I feel.

Multiple players have now expressed non-willingness to claim or not claim JK. I shouldn't hold just Frisk against that. UNVOTE: Captain_Frisk. Plus after my brainfart I need to reconsider the other side of the JK argument.

VOTE: Grujah. I'm okay with L-1.

[O]

will hammer tonight if there's no objections (10-12 hours).

[Robz888]

will hammer tonight if there's no objections (10-12 hours).

Sounds good to me.

[Cuzz]

No objection here. Will be good timing with a certain other game coming out of night shorty. Since I expect to die overnight, so I'll mention now that captain frisk is my number one suspect for D2.

[Cuzz]

Shortly* Was not commenting on O's stature. Damn phone.

[O]

FYI I'm 6-5 to 6-6. 

[Robz888]

FYI I'm 6-5 to 6-6. 

For some reason, I picture you shorter and rounder... don't know why...

[sparky5856]

No objection here. Will be good timing with a certain other game coming out of night shorty.

Indeed. I still need to read the last half of that game. >_<

[Cuzz]

FYI I'm 6-5 to 6-6. 

For some reason, I picture you shorter and rounder... don't know why...

For some reason I always picture you as a shield-wielding Hylian.

[Robz888]

FYI I'm 6-5 to 6-6. 

For some reason, I picture you shorter and rounder... don't know why...

For some reason I always picture you as a shield-wielding Hylian.

You wouldn't be so far off.

[Captain_Frisk]

I object.  Weekend hammering I don't like.   Joth is at maker faire - I'm golfing and watching football

[jotheonah]

Just got back! Good faire. Saw some interesting NASA-related talks, which was super convenient as I have a job interview tomorrow morning with SPACE.com. Wish me luck!

Mafia: This Grujah lynch seems like a town consensus, making the JK claim game unnecessary, I guess. I don't object to O hammering and I appreciate his waiting to do so.

[Captain_Frisk]

Do not lynch Grujah.

I want to mass claim. Starting with O