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[Axxle]

I know what it does I only wanted points.

...
Vote: Grujah

Regardless of roleclaim it's very clear his primary goal is survival, not scumhunting.

[jotheonah]

Since it's been told to us that we can actually win by getting 10VP - I don't see gaining VP as being necessarily scummy. 

I do this and get lynched! 

Thing is, you gain VP at the cost of taking it from others. That's anti-town, at least it is if you use it how you did.

[Grujah]

How is it anti-town if we are to lynch scum I can make lynch hurt even HARDER!

It is as anti-town as a vig or a lynch.

[Grujah]

How much do I have now?

[Grujah]

Votes.

[Grujah]

Also -4VP on Volt is obvframe, as Gloob said when he was mafia his main concert was to target somebody to frame somebody else. I am not sure but I think he revealed that after RMM1:N1.

[jotheonah]

How is it anti-town if we are to lynch scum I can make lynch hurt even HARDER!

It is as anti-town as a vig or a lynch.

Because you had no (or at the very least, light) reason to believe Volt was scum. You just fired it off at him, misleading others into enabling you by telling them they would get points.  That's not a how a pro-town player uses his power. Unless he wants to get lynched.

[Grujah]

How is it anti-town if we are to lynch scum I can make lynch hurt even HARDER!

It is as anti-town as a vig or a lynch.

Because you had no (or at the very least, light) reason to believe Volt was scum. You just fired it off at him, misleading others into enabling you by telling them they would get points.  That's not a how a pro-town player uses his power. Unless he wants to get lynched.

I just played stupidly and greedily, doesn't mean it is anti-town.
But you already said that in your last post (the way I used it was anti-town) but I read that post wrong.

[jotheonah]

UNOFFICIAL VOTE COUNT

Grujah (5): Voltgloss, yuma, Insomniac, Axxle, Tables
Tables (1): cayvie
Timchen (1): jotheonah
No Lynch (1): shark_bait


Not voting (: Captain_Frisk, Dsell, Eevee, Galzria, Grujah, Lekkit, Robz888, timchen

Takes 9 to lynch

[Tables]

Thing is you were #1 anti-claimer.

When there was no pressure to do so. In case you hadn't noticed, you're under a lot of supicion already. And I even said in that very post you shouldn't reveal exactly what your role does. Just the card.

Although now I think about it, even that probably won't help. Probably. We'll have no way of knowing if a given card is anti or pro town, and so you have no incentive to fake claim, and you've already demonstrated what your role does, so it's not like we won't believe it.

So eh, probably no point claiming your card. I won't unvote, though, because your behavior now has just gotten extremely mafia-like.

[Eevee]

How is it anti-town if we are to lynch scum I can make lynch hurt even HARDER!

It is as anti-town as a vig or a lynch.

Because you had no (or at the very least, light) reason to believe Volt was scum. You just fired it off at him, misleading others into enabling you by telling them they would get points.  That's not a how a pro-town player uses his power. Unless he wants to get lynched.

I just played stupidly and greedily, doesn't mean it is anti-town.
But you already said that in your last post (the way I used it was anti-town) but I read that post wrong.

Greedy guys are pretty damn bad for town (could be a mafia lie, could be a townie playing his own wincon/survival rather than towns best interest).

[shark_bait]

unvote

Grujah, I think a lot of us are dangerously close to voting for you.  You haven't really given us any reason not to vote for you.  For now.... Vote: No lynch

[jotheonah]

Thing is you were #1 anti-claimer.

When there was no pressure to do so. In case you hadn't noticed, you're under a lot of supicion already. And I even said in that very post you shouldn't reveal exactly what your role does. Just the card.

Although now I think about it, even that probably won't help. Probably. We'll have no way of knowing if a given card is anti or pro town, and so you have no incentive to fake claim, and you've already demonstrated what your role does, so it's not like we won't believe it.

So eh, probably no point claiming your card. I won't unvote, though, because your behavior now has just gotten extremely mafia-like.

I'd just like him to explain exactly what his VP-manipulating power does.  And then maybe if he promises to play nice with it and use it in a helpful way, we can talk about not lynching him.

[jotheonah]

unvote

Grujah, I think a lot of us are dangerously close to voting for you.  You haven't really given us any reason not to vote for you.  For now.... Vote: No lynch

Did you just unvote no lynch and then revote no lynch?

[shark_bait]

Ha ha... yup.  My way of emphasizing that my vote could be changing very soon.  But for the moment, it shall stay.

[jotheonah]

Welp, this timchen wagon is going nowhere fast. And the Grujah one seems to have some legs.



...which is a good reason to stay on timchen, come to think of it. But I'd love to see some nonvoters weigh in.

[Insomniac]

Welp, this timchen wagon is going nowhere fast. And the Grujah one seems to have some legs.



...which is a good reason to stay on timchen, come to think of it. But I'd love to see some nonvoters weigh in.

I'd like to see a bunch of people be more active here we have 16 players and its just dead in here. (been a bit better today though)

[shark_bait]

I think more the issue is that with the current set up (i.e. both sides being able to both grant and take away VP) it's very hard to scumhunt.  And most people don't want to scumhunt because they would be doing so with weak arguments, making themselves look a bit more scummy in the eyes of others.

[Eevee]

Welp, this timchen wagon is going nowhere fast. And the Grujah one seems to have some legs.



...which is a good reason to stay on timchen, come to think of it. But I'd love to see some nonvoters weigh in.

I've always thought the pro-town thing to do was to not vote at alll when you dont feel you have a good chance of voting for scum. Am I wrong?

[Insomniac]

Post counts!  (Ordered from eHal intro post)

Axxle - 24
Captain_Frisk - 37
cayvie - 27
Dsell - 24
Eevee - 52
Galzria - 58
Grujah - 102
Insomniac - 40 (41 with this post)
jotheonah - 41
Lekkit - 19
Robz888 - 29
shark_bait - 27
Tables - 41
timchen - 22
Voltgloss - 29
yuma - 24

This includes pre game banter

[Insomniac]

Welp, this timchen wagon is going nowhere fast. And the Grujah one seems to have some legs.



...which is a good reason to stay on timchen, come to think of it. But I'd love to see some nonvoters weigh in.

I've always thought the pro-town thing to do was to not vote at alll when you dont feel you have a good chance of voting for scum. Am I wrong?

Not at all you can use your vote to put pressure on people to get information. For instance in M2 Day 3 my vote gave information beyond that I thought Robz was scum, it proved beyond the shadow of a doubt one of us was scum. Early days it creates pressure and a case that people can respond to

[Galzria]

Welp, this timchen wagon is going nowhere fast. And the Grujah one seems to have some legs.



...which is a good reason to stay on timchen, come to think of it. But I'd love to see some nonvoters weigh in.

I've always thought the pro-town thing to do was to not vote at alll when you dont feel you have a good chance of voting for scum. Am I wrong?

Not at all you can use your vote to put pressure on people to get information. For instance in M2 Day 3 my vote gave information beyond that I thought Robz was scum, it proved beyond the shadow of a doubt one of us was scum. Early days it creates pressure and a case that people can respond to

For the record, Insomniac was scum.

No.

Really.

[Eevee]

Welp, this timchen wagon is going nowhere fast. And the Grujah one seems to have some legs.



...which is a good reason to stay on timchen, come to think of it. But I'd love to see some nonvoters weigh in.

I've always thought the pro-town thing to do was to not vote at alll when you dont feel you have a good chance of voting for scum. Am I wrong?

Not at all you can use your vote to put pressure on people to get information. For instance in M2 Day 3 my vote gave information beyond that I thought Robz was scum, it proved beyond the shadow of a doubt one of us was scum. Early days it creates pressure and a case that people can respond to

What if you feel like you cant back the vote up with reasonable arguments? "I have the feeling you are the scummiest of all, but I cant quite explain it and its not a very strong feeling anyways, just throwing my vote around to build pressure in hopes of finding scum" is not likely to grant a very useful reaction.

[Axxle]

Welp, this timchen wagon is going nowhere fast. And the Grujah one seems to have some legs.



...which is a good reason to stay on timchen, come to think of it. But I'd love to see some nonvoters weigh in.

I've always thought the pro-town thing to do was to not vote at alll when you dont feel you have a good chance of voting for scum. Am I wrong?

Not at all you can use your vote to put pressure on people to get information. For instance in M2 Day 3 my vote gave information beyond that I thought Robz was scum, it proved beyond the shadow of a doubt one of us was scum. Early days it creates pressure and a case that people can respond to

What if you feel like you cant back the vote up with reasonable arguments? "I have the feeling you are the scummiest of all, but I cant quite explain it and its not a very strong feeling anyways, just throwing my vote around to build pressure in hopes of finding scum" is not likely to grant a very useful reaction.

You'd be surprised.

[Eevee]

Vote: Grujah
Extra benefit, even if he isnt scum, we lose someone who doesnt have towns best interest at heart. (At least, despite my mistakes, I've always played to towns wincon rather than my personal one.)

Its interesting Grujah has that clear of a lead on posts this far. Kind of makes me want to lynch him even more.