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Author Topic: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer  (Read 7335 times)

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Gubump

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #75 on: January 31, 2023, 12:35:11 pm »
+4

I know this is supposed to be a weekly design contest, but I won't have time to judge until this Thursday. Just a heads up.
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Xen3k

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #76 on: January 31, 2023, 07:57:43 pm »
+3



Quote
Midnight Witch - $5
Night - Duration - Attack
Each other player gains a Curse.
At the start of your next turn, +2 Cards, then discard a card.
---
In games using this, Curse is also a Night-Duration card with "At the start of your next turn, +1 Card, then discard a card."

A Witch variant. Non-terminal as it is a Night card, but now has a delayed Fugitive draw and Curses don't clog the deck as bad as they normally do. Was originally going to have this cost $4, but figured that would be too good. Not sure if the delayed draw 2 then discard is too weak or not. Feedback is appreciated.
« Last Edit: January 31, 2023, 08:52:49 pm by Xen3k »
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Ethan

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #77 on: January 31, 2023, 10:29:33 pm »
+3


Quote
Elixir -
Treasure
+2 Cards
If it is your first Buy phase this turn, you may pay to return to your Action phase and +1 Action.
-
In game using this, at the start of your Buy phase, you may discard an Action card for +.
« Last Edit: February 01, 2023, 11:21:47 am by Ethan »
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Gubump

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #78 on: February 01, 2023, 02:54:59 am »
+1


Quote
Elixir -
Treasure
+2 Cards
If it is your first Buy phase, you may pay to return to your Action phase and +1 Action.
-
In game using this, at the start of your Buy phase, you may discard an Action card for +.

I assume this is supposed to be "if it is your first Buy phase this turn"? As worded, you only get the return-to-Action-phase effect if it's your first Buy phase, period.
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silverspawn

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #79 on: February 01, 2023, 06:12:05 am »
+3

I think Elixir makes potions too easy to get.

Turn 1. I draw Copper, Copper, Copper, Necropolis, Overgrown Estate. I discard Necropolis for +Potion and buy a Familiar.

faust

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #80 on: February 01, 2023, 07:07:54 am »
+3

I think Elixir makes potions too easy to get.

Turn 1. I draw Copper, Copper, Copper, Necropolis, Overgrown Estate. I discard Necropolis for +Potion and buy a Familiar.
To be fair though, Necropolis makes a bunch of stuff easy to get that shouldn't be easy otherwise.

Necro + Advance? Open with a $6.
Necro + Peril? Open with a Loot.

Necro + Woodworkers' Guild allows you to open Familiar already.
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Ethan

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #81 on: February 01, 2023, 09:31:57 am »
0


Quote
Elixir -
Treasure
+2 Cards
If it is your first Buy phase, you may pay to return to your Action phase and +1 Action.
-
In game using this, at the start of your Buy phase, you may discard an Action card for +.

I assume this is supposed to be "if it is your first Buy phase this turn"? As worded, you only get the return-to-Action-phase effect if it's your first Buy phase, period.
Thank you. I have corrected it.
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silverspawn

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #82 on: February 01, 2023, 10:49:55 am »
+4

I think Elixir makes potions too easy to get.

Turn 1. I draw Copper, Copper, Copper, Necropolis, Overgrown Estate. I discard Necropolis for +Potion and buy a Familiar.
To be fair though, Necropolis makes a bunch of stuff easy to get that shouldn't be easy otherwise.

Necro + Advance? Open with a $6.
Necro + Peril? Open with a Loot.

Necro + Woodworkers' Guild allows you to open Familiar already.

granted, but even without Necropolis, any action card is now almost strictly better than Potion, which makes Potion cards very easy to get. Which you can defend as a desired effect but I don't think it's good. I think it would make most potion cards dominate whatever game they're in.

segura

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #83 on: February 01, 2023, 11:59:19 am »
+1

How high are the chances that there is another Potion card in the Kingdom besides Elixir? Also, if you run a deck without a Potion in it you cannot use the Villa-style effect of Elixir and buy another Elixir at the same time which is highly dubious.
So you most likely want to run a Potion in your deck in an Elixir Kingdom.

I really like Elixir, it is a cool Treasure drawer which is anything but easy to design. I think it could be buffed though, i.e. get rid of the limitation to only only Villa effect per turn.
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Ethan

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #84 on: February 01, 2023, 12:02:49 pm »
0

granted, but even without Necropolis, any action card is now almost strictly better than Potion, which makes Potion cards very easy to get. Which you can defend as a desired effect but I don't think it's good. I think it would make most potion cards dominate whatever game they're in.
I understand your criticism, my design intent did include making potion more accessible (and providing more way to use potion, also, linking the Actions theme of Alchemy), but I seem to have gone too far.
Anyway, I'd rather keep it as it is, as I can't think of the perfect way of tweaking it.
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czzzz

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #85 on: February 01, 2023, 12:15:05 pm »
0

If you were wanting to reduce potion accessibility, you could raise the discard requirement -- discard two Action cards, or maybe discard an Action and some other type.
But it seems like there are some that want you to buff it and others that want you to nerf it. You're wanting to keep it as-is and I think that's totally justified. It's a cool card  :D I personally don't think you've gone too far
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BryGuy

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #86 on: February 01, 2023, 01:20:57 pm »
+1

granted, but even without Necropolis, any action card is now almost strictly better than Potion, which makes Potion cards very easy to get. Which you can defend as a desired effect but I don't think it's good. I think it would make most potion cards dominate whatever game they're in.
I understand your criticism, my design intent did include making potion more accessible (and providing more way to use potion, also, linking the Actions theme of Alchemy), but I seem to have gone too far.
Anyway, I'd rather keep it as it is, as I can't think of the perfect way of tweaking it.

 :)
Here are two options that came to mind for tweaking the below line text:
Option-A: In game using this, at the start of your Buy phase, you may discard an Action card, costing more than $3 or $1, for +.

Option-B: In game using this, at the start of your Buy phase, you may spend $3 for +.
 :)

« Last Edit: February 02, 2023, 09:11:11 am by BryGuy »
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Gubump

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lompeluiten

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #88 on: February 02, 2023, 12:47:39 am »
+3

Local stable $4
Action
+1 action
Play up to 3 treasure.  +1 card per treasure played this way
-
In games using this, whenever an player gains an victory card, they gain an copper.



Might look strong, but it is an conditional libary, with some potential upside.
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Gubump

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #89 on: February 02, 2023, 01:33:41 am »
+3

Local stable $4
Action
+1 action
Play up to 3 treasure.  +1 card per treasure played this way
-
In games using this, whenever an player gains an victory card, they gain an copper.



Might look strong, but it is an conditional libary, with some potential upside.

I assume it's supposed to be "play up to 3 Treasures from your hand?"
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Ethan

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #90 on: February 02, 2023, 04:09:51 am »
+1

Thank you guys for the advice. These ideas have crossed my mind before. I think,
A) discard two Action cards is too mean.
B) pay coins to get potion, actually, this is first idea of my beta version for this card, before I finalized the effect above the line. Later, I wanted to link this card with the Action theme, so I changed it to what it is now, somehow inspired by Arena.
C) discard a costly Action card, for me it's the best way to tweak it. It is difficult to say which is better compared to the current version, so I decide to keep it as it is.
D) trash an Action card, well, I have considered this. Too mean and unpleasant.
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SignError

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #91 on: February 02, 2023, 10:34:49 am »
+3

Local stable $4
Action
+1 action
Play up to 3 treasure.  +1 card per treasure played this way
-
In games using this, whenever an player gains an victory card, they gain an copper.

Might look strong, but it is an conditional libary, with some potential upside.

I assume it's supposed to be "play up to 3 Treasures from your hand?"

Also, the below-the-line part can base its wording on Duchess:

In games using this, when you gain a Victory card, gain a Copper.
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Holger

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #92 on: February 02, 2023, 01:16:35 pm »
+3

Local stable $4
Action
+1 action
Play up to 3 treasure.  +1 card per treasure played this way
-
In games using this, whenever an player gains an victory card, they gain an copper.



Might look strong, but it is an conditional libary, with some potential upside.

I'd say it is a conditional double Lab, since it's nonterminal (unlike Library). So it seems very strong to me...
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silverspawn

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #93 on: February 02, 2023, 01:18:04 pm »
+3

Agreed, also the comparison to Storyteller is insightful

segura

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #94 on: February 02, 2023, 01:22:40 pm »
+2

Local stable $4
Action
+1 action
Play up to 3 treasure.  +1 card per treasure played this way
-
In games using this, whenever an player gains an victory card, they gain an copper.



Might look strong, but it is an conditional libary, with some potential upside.

I'd say it is a conditional double Lab, since it's nonterminal (unlike Library). So it seems very strong to me...
You draw one card less with every play so it becomes harder, even with a high Treasure density in your deck, to play this consistently as (Double)Lab.
I have a hard time to evaluate the strength but playing instead of discarding Treasures is a serious nerf compared to Stables.

So either this is used as a draw for pure money or as support draw (syncs quite well with DtX) in an engine. It can hardly be used as mono-draw like other Lab variants though.
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segura

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #95 on: February 02, 2023, 03:59:04 pm »
+2

Agreed, also the comparison to Storyteller is insightful
You mean, like the comparison between Lab and DoublePeddler?
Because that is literally what the two cards convert Silvers into. And the one card is non-terminal whereas the other is a cantrip.

So beyond the superficial „do buff Treasures“ the cards play very differently.
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silverspawn

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #96 on: February 02, 2023, 05:19:32 pm »
+2

I brought up the comparison for its powerlevel; I agree the cards are not similar.

Using this on a Copper is 1$ better than Storyteller, and storyeller is a medium strength 5$. And you use Storyteller on Copper all the time.

segura

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #97 on: February 02, 2023, 05:58:36 pm »
0

I brought up the comparison for its powerlevel; I agree the cards are not similar.

Using this on a Copper is 1$ better than Storyteller, and storyeller is a medium strength 5$. And you use Storyteller on Copper all the time.
Last time I checked, Peddler is worse than Lab.
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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #98 on: February 02, 2023, 06:19:16 pm »
+3

I brought up the comparison for its powerlevel; I agree the cards are not similar.

Using this on a Copper is 1$ better than Storyteller, and storyeller is a medium strength 5$. And you use Storyteller on Copper all the time.
Last time I checked, Peddler is worse than Lab.

When playing a Copper with Storyteller, you turn the Copper into a cantrip, not a Lab.  And Peddler is better than a vanilla cantrip.
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Gubump

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #176 - Game Changer
« Reply #99 on: February 02, 2023, 07:44:59 pm »
+2

Submissions Closed!

Judging will occur soon.
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