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[Teproc]

As far as flavor and "villains" go, I think we aren't going to be able to guess.  I mean, you can make Sawyer a villain if you want.  Plus, I'd guess scum have safe claims.

I disagree with the first part. There are characters (Sawyer being one of them) that I have a very hard time seeing as villains.

Scum certainly has fakeclaims, but for example I don't see how Sun or Jin could be scum, the fact that they're in a neighborhood corroborates their claim.

That's not an absolute : of course faust could have taken liberties, but I certainly don't want to lynch either TA or reinoe for that reason, at least for now.

[ashersky]

As for the game...

vote: reinoe

I have a longstanding "don't lynch new players on D1" rule, but I'm willing to waive that here.  Why?

1) He's crying wolf at the top of his lungs.  Some choice bits include "he's claimed scum" and "he's done zero scum hunting" as undeniable truths about TA.  These are disingenuous at the least and overtly hostile at worst.

2) He's being purposefully obtuse.  Acting as if he didnt understand what TA and others meant about the neighborhood, utility, scum knowledge, etc.  He's obsfucating.

3) The early, unprovoked, unneeded, useless claim.  All of those adjectives are why scum wants to pull off that claim and why town wouldn't do it recklessly.  It was completely safe, give town zero useful knowledge, and could seemingly buy the claimant town cred.

4) Overt hostility for (seemingly) no reason.

Why those specific things?  He actually reminds me of me in my earlier scum days.  I've successfully railroaded town into turning against each other by doing all of those things.  It got to the point where a longtime mod/player/pal here on f.ds accused me of trying to break people to the point of /outing from the game to have less town players to mislynch. (I wasn't.)

tldr: Everything I noted about reinoe's play is what I expect from an aggressive scum style.

[ashersky]

As far as flavor and "villains" go, I think we aren't going to be able to guess.  I mean, you can make Sawyer a villain if you want.  Plus, I'd guess scum have safe claims.

I disagree with the first part. There are characters (Sawyer being one of them) that I have a very hard time seeing as villains.

Scum certainly has fakeclaims, but for example I don't see how Sun or Jin could be scum, the fact that they're in a neighborhood corroborates their claim.

That's not an absolute : of course faust could have taken liberties, but I certainly don't want to lynch either TA or reinoe for that reason, at least for now.

You sir, are cra-cra.  Or you forgot about season 1, the gun, hoarding, etc.  Sawyer was a bad dude.  He was redeemed, though.  But not at first.  What was his job before the crash?  Oh right.

[Teproc]

I don't disagre that he was a bad dude, I disagree that he could be in a scum faction. But whatever, let's not talk too much about that.

I disagree with your case on reinoe. People can be aggressive as town too... in fact you've done it multiple times (not to that extent but still).

[Ichimaru Gin]

I'm with ash on this one. vote: reinoe. He could be trying to frame him, but I don't like the subtle defenses people have given reinoe (Teproc and ADK iirc). I am a firm, firm believer that scum defends their partners obviously, and I have like no trust of Teproc at the moment.

[Hydrad]

oh i thought reinoe was a completely new player. I'm guessing he plays on mafiascum though?

Hmm if so that changes my read on him as I felt a first time player this would be town behaviour. But now i'm seeing a scum possibility from him if hes played this game before.

Although I'm a bit worried that the metas of mafiascum and fds might just not get along well.

Still i'm ok with a vote: reinoe

[Witherweaver]

I'm with ash on this one. vote: reinoe. He could be trying to frame him, but I don't like the subtle defenses people have given reinoe (Teproc and ADK iirc). I am a firm, firm believer that scum defends their partners obviously, and I have like no trust of Teproc at the moment.

Get one MVP scum award and all the sudden you're mister suspect.

[xeiron]

I am not sure how to read Reinoe, but I think he is the best lynch today.
I'll join in on:
vote: reinoe

[ashersky]

I'm with ash on this one. vote: reinoe. He could be trying to frame him, but I don't like the subtle defenses people have given reinoe (Teproc and ADK iirc). I am a firm, firm believer that scum defends their partners obviously, and I have like no trust of Teproc at the moment.

Get one MVP scum award and all the sudden you're mister suspect.

Are you talking about Teproc or you?

[Hydrad]

I'm with ash on this one. vote: reinoe. He could be trying to frame him, but I don't like the subtle defenses people have given reinoe (Teproc and ADK iirc). I am a firm, firm believer that scum defends their partners obviously, and I have like no trust of Teproc at the moment.

Get one MVP scum award and all the sudden you're mister suspect.

Are you talking about Teproc or you?

Teproc got the MVP scum award in M54.

[Witherweaver]

I'm with ash on this one. vote: reinoe. He could be trying to frame him, but I don't like the subtle defenses people have given reinoe (Teproc and ADK iirc). I am a firm, firm believer that scum defends their partners obviously, and I have like no trust of Teproc at the moment.

Get one MVP scum award and all the sudden you're mister suspect.

Are you talking about Teproc or you?

Teproc; he got MVP in the game that Ichi is referencing. 

[XerxesPraelor]

I can go with

vote: reinoe

[ashersky]

I don't disagre that he was a bad dude, I disagree that he could be in a scum faction. But whatever, let's not talk too much about that.

I disagree with your case on reinoe. People can be aggressive as town too... in fact you've done it multiple times (not to that extent but still).

I'd probably mix it up on purpose, given the Lost afficianados I would have expected to have in the game (Robz, me, etc.).  Like, Juliet is another example of bad turned good.  Lost had a lot of that.  Linus was bad gone good.  Etc.

Personally, I hope there's some Jacob/Man-in-Black stuff.

[Awaclus]

I'm not opposed to a reinoe lynch. I don't really get a scum feel from his posts in a vacuum, but I don't really get them from a town perspective either, and assuming without checking that Ichi is correct and telling the truth about people subtly defending reinoe, I agree that it's suspicious.

vote: reinoe

[ashersky]

I'm with ash on this one. vote: reinoe. He could be trying to frame him, but I don't like the subtle defenses people have given reinoe (Teproc and ADK iirc). I am a firm, firm believer that scum defends their partners obviously, and I have like no trust of Teproc at the moment.

Get one MVP scum award and all the sudden you're mister suspect.

Are you talking about Teproc or you?

Teproc; he got MVP in the game that Ichi is referencing.

Gotcha.

I will say, doing well as scum one game can affect your ability to survive as town in a future game.  Trust me, I KNOW.

[Awaclus]

Also I think this is L-2.

[Teproc]

I'm with ash on this one. vote: reinoe. He could be trying to frame him, but I don't like the subtle defenses people have given reinoe (Teproc and ADK iirc). I am a firm, firm believer that scum defends their partners obviously, and I have like no trust of Teproc at the moment.

Get one MVP scum award and all the sudden you're mister suspect.

Thats fair though. I certainly got more suspicious of you after you fooled me five hundred times, that's only natural.

I don't think I'm "subtly" defending reinoe though, I'm plainly doing it. I can't say I have a great alternate case, but I think scum is mostly silent right now.

PPE : That being said...

vote : Awaclus

One of the few active people I don't have a town read on. I'll investigate that in a minute.

@ash : Yeah Juliet and Ben could have both alignments, definitely. I'm arguing that Sawyer couldn't really, though he could easily be a provided fakeclaim. Also man-in-black is more or less confirmed to be in the game since xeiron asked about it earlier.

[Awaclus]

vote : Awaclus

Does this syntax work now?

[Teproc]

Wanting to lynch someone because people are defending him is crazy. There could be a million different reasons for that, the main of which would be that it's what town does. If people want to lynch someone who I think is town, I'll defend them. And if you're town, you should do that to. Scum gets uncomfortable when they face resistance. There's nothing scum loves more than the "eh, why not" wagons.

[Teproc]

Ugh.

vote: Awaclus

[Hydrad]

I'm trying to keep up with this flavor by using google to read up on who the people are... I don't know if that will help at all or not though.

I'm just probably going to trust the people that know the flavor instead of trusting google because on man I have no idea what they are talking about lol.

[Awaclus]

Wanting to lynch someone because people are defending him is crazy. There could be a million different reasons for that, the main of which would be that it's what town does. If people want to lynch someone who I think is town, I'll defend them. And if you're town, you should do that to. Scum gets uncomfortable when they face resistance. There's nothing scum loves more than the "eh, why not" wagons.

Yes, but town doesn't have to defend people subtly.

[Teproc]

Rereading Awaclus, he does have some content. He went along with the L-1 plan which I don't fully understand but too many people did it for it to be scummy. He has the weird XP unvote and not much else, except for a reasonably townie reactoin to ash's big reads post.

Not that great a lynch today probably. unvote

PPE : Sure, but Ichi caracterized me as subtly defending him, and I'd disagree with that.

[Awaclus]

PPE : Sure, but Ichi caracterized me as subtly defending him, and I'd disagree with that.

I quickly re-read you and ADK and you're right. And ADK defending reinoe wasn't really all that suspicious either.

[Hydrad]

I'll let you guys know I'm going to be claiming something before night about my role. I'm just debating waiting till twilight or not. I think 24 hours should be enough to discuss a couple things about the night.

This is probably where me not knowing the flavor could hurt us a bit though.