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[yuma]

and I do agree with some of the points that xeiron made about Jimmmm... I feel like he has been one of the least talked about players this game....when xeiron voted for him I was confused...welll initially I was confused because I thought it said "jotheonah" for some reason and he obviously isn't in the game (but then I was confused again that Jimmmm was in the game)...

[XerxesPraelor]

I actually kept on trying to post and then having computer problems, but what I've meant to do all along is vote: ashersky and he just reminded me. I'd be okay with a sudgy lynch as well as Andrew or ash.

[AndrewisFTTW]

I've been getting a scum read on Xeiron all game. I could do either him or Sudgy. I'm interested in seeing the rest of ash's targeted reads.

[sudgy]

If Andrew isn't going to be lynched, I would be okay with xeiron too for lurking.  I would still prefer Andrew though.

[ashersky]

I actually kept on trying to post and then having computer problems, but what I've meant to do all along is vote: ashersky and he just reminded me. I'd be okay with a sudgy lynch as well as Andrew or ash.

Such a compelling case you have there, omguspraelor.

[xeiron]

Recent blitz experiences (and I'm sure Yuma would agree here) has taught me that super fast wagons and deadline crunches are not only a great tool for reading interactions, but also they have just as high a chance of hitting scum than a wagon that forms slowly

I find this true as well. The Mcmcsalot quick lynch in the last Blitz game made his partners really obvious.

But the mcmcsalot wagon was on scum.
I agree that scum is usually hesitant to blitzbussing, and if Sudgy ever flips scum I agree that then yuma, Twistedarcher, AndrewisFTTW, Archetype and A Drowned Kernel is all probably town.

I think Sudgy is town, though. And I also think scum is just as likely to join blitzwagons on a town player as town is.

[XerxesPraelor]

I'm not much of a person for cases; you haven't voted me yet, so it's not true OMGUS. What looks scummy to me is that whenever you mention me, it's to cast suspicion on without reasons scum would act the way I'm acting and without a vote that would be visible later.

It's not inconsistent to think that you have a higher than average chance of being scum and that Andrew does too without thinking both of you are scum. I'd still be voting Andrew except that it looks like it's going nowhere and fewer people have noticed your scumminess.

[shraeye]

Faust, xeiron, you are not really talking about why this wagon is scummy...just that the fact that there is a wagon. Wagons happen towards the end of days. Why is this one scummy? I didn't see anything from either of you that makes me want to unvote. I'm not scared just cause its a wagon why would I be? We need wagons to make lynches.

It is scummy because it happened so fast, and because there is thin reasononing for the votes given. At least there is nothing there that convinces me that sudgy is scum.

I agree with yuma.  Why do people always say fast wagons are scummy?

[shraeye]

I still find Andrewis to be the most guilty acting.. it just feels like he's hiding something.  I don't really have any reason to think differently about him, so I'll leave my vote where it is for now. 

I'd like more elaboration on the "it feels like he's hiding something" thing, that feels incredibly vague.

I'm having a hard time with this game, especially since the whole RMM thing might give people any number of motivations for doing or saying odd things based on their roles. But as I pointed out way back when, when the thing with Andrew and me happened, Sudgy originally was voting for me, then switched to Andrew when Andrew started getting more heat. His justifications for voting for Andrew were, as has been pointed out, flimsily based on a misinterpretation of a previous game. To me it looks like he was eager for a mislynch. For me it's all enough to

Vote: Sudgy

That is L-1.

Did the bolded line above strike anyone else as very odd?  It's either rolefishy or...I don't know.  Something off about it.  It's completely unconnected to the rest of the paragraph, too, which is about voting and such.

I don't know what it means, but I'm not a big fan.

Doesn't seem odd to me at all.

[shraeye]

vote: ash

I'm down with a snap wagon on ash.

[Witherweaver]

Well, I don't really have a scum read on Sudgy.  I see what people are saying, but I think it's more likely a case of someone not playing very carefully.  If he was scum he'd probably be much more conscious about what he's posting.  Or else he's just going for crazy randomness.

My opinion on Andrewis hasn't changed.  I don't think there's any more to be said about it, though.  It would just be rehashing what has been said before, and I can't see me suddenly seeing it in a new light.  I would really like to know his alignment, though.

I think out of all the options other than Andrewis, Ash comes off as the most scummy.  It makes more sense to me for super aggression to come from scum rather than town.  To me it would get a mislynch more likely as some of the town can get convinced by the argument, scum can hop on the wagon without much suspicion, and people that are on the fence can look to flaws in the other person's defense.  In fact, that could have indeed been what happened here.  If Andrewis was town, he got put in an uncomfortable spot pretty quickly, and most of the people that voted against him (including me) did so because of issues with how he defended himself, not because of the original accusation.  And then when the mislynch happens, you have the wine-in-front-of-me defense "Why would I have been so aggressive about it if I was scum?  Scum is more likely to come in later and dodge suspicion."  And people would probably buy that, because it would take a lot of guts.

Well, I'm back to being uncertain about the Andrewis/Ash thing.  I have trouble reconciling scum reads on both of them. Maybe it's an act to confuse us, but Ash was pushing it pretty hard, and that seems like a really risky idea.  Though maybe the goal could have been to get town on the wagon and then cast them as scum that were trying to sneak on the mislynch without raising much attention. 

I suppose there is a chance they're both scum, but not on the same team.  One could be a third party (serial killer or whatever). 

So my choices are Andrewis or Ash.  I guess I'd be okay with either.. I'm going to Vote: Ashersky. 

[yuma]

vote: witherweaver

[Witherweaver]

vote: witherweaver

Why?

[yuma]

vote: witherweaver

Why?

stuff from before and your convenient vote on ash, despite not being able to reconcile scum reads on both of them when it is obvious just from probability alone that that is the least likely of the four possibilities...

[Witherweaver]

vote: witherweaver

Why?

stuff from before and your convenient vote on ash, despite not being able to reconcile scum reads on both of them when it is obvious just from probability alone that that is the least likely of the four possibilities...

Convenient?  I don't get it.  I think them both being scum is the least likely, but I think that one is. My argument against Ash was starting to sound better, and there might be something to be gained from the discussions there.

[yuma]

Convenient?  I don't get it.  I think them both being scum is the least likely, but I think that one is. My argument against Ash was starting to sound better, and there might be something to be gained from the discussions there.

convenient because the andrew wagon is disappearing, so time to jump ship, the ash wagon is growing... you are #3 or 4, and because ash is someone who has displayed some suspicion against you... nice to have someone like that out of the way if you are scum

[Witherweaver]

Convenient?  I don't get it.  I think them both being scum is the least likely, but I think that one is. My argument against Ash was starting to sound better, and there might be something to be gained from the discussions there.

convenient because the andrew wagon is disappearing, so time to jump ship, the ash wagon is growing... you are #3 or 4, and because ash is someone who has displayed some suspicion against you... nice to have someone like that out of the way if you are scum

I don't remember Ash displaying any suspicion against me.  If I was just jumping on a wagon, why wouldn't I jump on Sudgy? 

[yuma]

Convenient?  I don't get it.  I think them both being scum is the least likely, but I think that one is. My argument against Ash was starting to sound better, and there might be something to be gained from the discussions there.

convenient because the andrew wagon is disappearing, so time to jump ship, the ash wagon is growing... you are #3 or 4, and because ash is someone who has displayed some suspicion against you... nice to have someone like that out of the way if you are scum

I don't remember Ash displaying any suspicion against me.  If I was just jumping on a wagon, why wouldn't I jump on Sudgy?

he suggested you as a possible dayvig target... and you had already maintained that you didn't like the sudgy wagon and you couldn't just join it after saying as such

[Witherweaver]

Convenient?  I don't get it.  I think them both being scum is the least likely, but I think that one is. My argument against Ash was starting to sound better, and there might be something to be gained from the discussions there.

convenient because the andrew wagon is disappearing, so time to jump ship, the ash wagon is growing... you are #3 or 4, and because ash is someone who has displayed some suspicion against you... nice to have someone like that out of the way if you are scum

I don't remember Ash displaying any suspicion against me.  If I was just jumping on a wagon, why wouldn't I jump on Sudgy?

he suggested you as a possible dayvig target... and you had already maintained that you didn't like the sudgy wagon and you couldn't just join it after saying as such

But why would I say that I didn't like the Sudgy wagon at all?  Why not just get on board with it instead?

[Witherweaver]

I don't remember Ash saying to Dayvig me.. I'll look back.

[yuma]

But why would I say that I didn't like the Sudgy wagon at all?  Why not just get on board with it instead?

lots of reasons.

1. partners... not the most likely but possible?
2. scum needs to have town reads
3. I don;t remember when you first said it, but it might have been at a time when the andrew lynch looked like it was going through, getting off it would have created a vacuum and who knows where the lynch could have gone... to a partner?

and more i am sure

[Witherweaver]

But why would I say that I didn't like the Sudgy wagon at all?  Why not just get on board with it instead?

lots of reasons.

1. partners... not the most likely but possible?
2. scum needs to have town reads
3. I don;t remember when you first said it, but it might have been at a time when the andrew lynch looked like it was going through, getting off it would have created a vacuum and who knows where the lynch could have gone... to a partner?

and more i am sure

Well (1) is not true.  I don't know what (2) means. I don't think (3) is true at all.. The Andrewis lynch didn't look like it was going through, and Sudgy was definitely on the upswing. 

[yuma]

what i mean is that scum needs to sometimes say "i  think x is town" or "i don't like this lynch" otherwise the end up just going around finding everyone scummy and eventually that comes back to bite them once someone notices

[shraeye]

Convenient?  I don't get it.  I think them both being scum is the least likely, but I think that one is. My argument against Ash was starting to sound better, and there might be something to be gained from the discussions there.

convenient because the andrew wagon is disappearing, so time to jump ship, the ash wagon is growing... you are #3 or 4, and because ash is someone who has displayed some suspicion against you... nice to have someone like that out of the way if you are scum

why are scum looking to jump ship on a disappearing wagon?

[Jorbles]

Vote Count 1.10:

sudgy (4): Jimmmmm, Twistedarcher, Archetype, A Drowned Kernel
AndrewisFTTW (2): faust, sudgy
Jimmmmmmm (1): xeiron
ashersky (3): XerxesPraelor, shraeye, Witherweaver
Witherweaver (1): yuma

Not voting (2): ashersky, AndrewisFTTW

With 13 alive it takes 7 to lynch.

Day 1 ends April 3 at 8 PM forum time (that's in about 24 + 7 hours). (mail-mi won't be home at that time, but no more votes will be accepted after that time. Jorbles WILL be around and will post the flip, but no flavour.