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[Twistedarcher]

My main reasons for finding Mcmc scummy are his vote/unvote on Ash at weird times, and his interaction with Robz. I really do think that Mcmc calling Robz towny for weak reasons make it more likely that Mcmc is scum, and Robz towny. It's an easy way to pick up towncred, and easily justifiable by the fact that he knows Robz better than the rest of us if he's questioned on it.

[ashersky]

Ashersky, why do you want volt to claim? he shouldn't claim unless he's getting lynched for sure if he doesn't. If volt is town and he claims and we just lynch chairs that's bad... and if chairs is town and we lynch volt that's bad too. I think chairs is more likely to flip scum AND the lynch that hurts town less if he   is town, because he is a claimed VT.

I want Volt to claim if he's at L-1.  Same as chairs.  So I'd like to put him in that position.

Here's the thing on "if chairs is town."  His VT claims helps scum narrow down their NK choices, since they'll be PR hunting, right?  Likely to survive (great choice for the Hider, fyi).  So some town will argue "let's just kill VT chairs, since he won't be NKed."

If that's the stance we're taking, what's the difference between lynching chairs and a no lynch?  Like, you're stating "hey let's kill town so that we don't need to worry about it."  If killing the VT is the best course of action, that's at the very least equal to a no lynch, since he isn't dying at night.

If you believe chairs is scum, that's fine.  That's an opinion.  But I think the "less likely to hurt town since he's just a VT" is a terrible argument to make.

Also, when you say "if chairs is town and we lynch volt that's bad" sounds really bad.  Like, you can parse that to say "if chairs is town and we don't mislynch him, that's bad."  That's scum talk there.

[Twistedarcher]

Shame straight on my face??? Um...thanks? I don't know what you have against me, I really really don't, but please don't shame straight on my face, thanks.

I've also been very clear about who is my preferred lynch. I think Ashersky is scum, but that wagon isn't happening.

I am not the main proponent of the Volt lynch, and I don't have anything better to offer on why he's scummy. I just think there's a much, much better chance of Volt flipping scum than Chairs. I think Chairs is VT as he claims.

[shraeye]

What I find interesting about your analysis is that it reeks of trying to find reasons to paint me scummy. You're taking differences/similarities in my game play, and analyzing them in a scummy light.

This is just such an easy counter-accusation to make when one has no reasonable defense to make.

[ashersky]

Shame straight on my face??? Um...thanks? I don't know what you have against me, I really really don't, but please don't shame straight on my face, thanks.

I've also been very clear about who is my preferred lynch. I think Ashersky is scum, but that wagon isn't happening.

I am not the main proponent of the Volt lynch, and I don't have anything better to offer on why he's scummy. I just think there's a much, much better chance of Volt flipping scum than Chairs. I think Chairs is VT as he claims.

We agree here, that Volt is more likely than chairs to flip scum.  I'm also anti shame on the face.  Sounds...like it needs to be in the out of context thread.

[ashersky]

What I find interesting about your analysis is that it reeks of trying to find reasons to paint me scummy. You're taking differences/similarities in my game play, and analyzing them in a scummy light.

This is just such an easy counter-accusation to make when one has no reasonable defense to make.

You do this, though.  We all do.  We think someone's scummy, then we find proof.  Sometimes the other way around.

It doesn't make shraeye scummy, is what I'm saying.

[Twistedarcher]

What I find interesting about your analysis is that it reeks of trying to find reasons to paint me scummy. You're taking differences/similarities in my game play, and analyzing them in a scummy light.

This is just such an easy counter-accusation to make when one has no reasonable defense to make.

What reasonable defense do you expect? You're saying I'm purposely posting less to get town cred, as scum. What possible defense do you expect other than "No I'm not!" I can't prove to you that I'm posting less for any other reason, and it's very clear to me that you're analyzing things that aren't necessarily scummy in a scummy light.

Now, I know I'm town. I don't know if you're town or scum. But given what I know, the fact that you're choosing to interpret my actions one way rather than another reads fishy to me.

[ashersky]

My main reasons for finding Mcmc scummy are his vote/unvote on Ash at weird times, and his interaction with Robz. I really do think that Mcmc calling Robz towny for weak reasons make it more likely that Mcmc is scum, and Robz towny. It's an easy way to pick up towncred, and easily justifiable by the fact that he knows Robz better than the rest of us if he's questioned on it.

mcmc-Robz is always tough.  I never know what to think.  My gut tells me mcmc is usually right about Robz, regardless of his alignment, while Robz is usually wrong about mcmc, regardless of purpose.

[Twistedarcher]

What I find interesting about your analysis is that it reeks of trying to find reasons to paint me scummy. You're taking differences/similarities in my game play, and analyzing them in a scummy light.

This is just such an easy counter-accusation to make when one has no reasonable defense to make.

You do this, though.  We all do.  We think someone's scummy, then we find proof.  Sometimes the other way around.

It doesn't make shraeye scummy, is what I'm saying.

No, not necessarily. But it's one of the key things I look for when I scum hunt. Scum have to stretch to find their reasons unless someone's straight up scummy, while town should look for the proof first.

It's not slam dunk, of course, but I've found that it's really, really useful to look for this. Scum do this MUCH more often from my experience.

[ashersky]

What I find interesting about your analysis is that it reeks of trying to find reasons to paint me scummy. You're taking differences/similarities in my game play, and analyzing them in a scummy light.

This is just such an easy counter-accusation to make when one has no reasonable defense to make.

You do this, though.  We all do.  We think someone's scummy, then we find proof.  Sometimes the other way around.

It doesn't make shraeye scummy, is what I'm saying.

No, not necessarily. But it's one of the key things I look for when I scum hunt. Scum have to stretch to find their reasons unless someone's straight up scummy, while town should look for the proof first.

It's not slam dunk, of course, but I've found that it's really, really useful to look for this. Scum do this MUCH more often from my experience.

Some scum do it.  Other scum wait for someone to paint themselves into a scummy corner and then point it out.

[shraeye]

If that's the stance we're taking, what's the difference between lynching chairs and a no lynch?  Like, you're stating "hey let's kill town so that we don't need to worry about it."  If killing the VT is the best course of action, that's at the very least equal to a no lynch, since he isn't dying at night.

If you believe chairs is scum, that's fine.  That's an opinion.  But I think the "less likely to hurt town since he's just a VT" is a terrible argument to make.

Thanks for making this argument.  It's true people; and if you don't believe it's true, read ash's post again until you understand that it's true.

[nkirbit]

Shraeye:  You told TA to blow up Innovation with posts as scum, specifically because it's anti-town.  Sure, scum!TA could have an incentive to act differently, and post less.  I'll buy that.  But town!TA has that same incentive, simply because he doesn't want to do something that's anti-town!

I think both scum!TA and town!TA would have an incentive to post less, and have no reason to believe it's one or the other.  I don't know why you're convinced it's TA being scum, when he has incentives to post less as a town player.

Saying "He could be doing this as scum" isn't convincing to me when he just as easily could be doing this as town.  Yeah, he could be scum, but that doesn't make him scum.  If TA is scum, his actions make sense, but if TA is town, his actions make sense.  So I don't see how you can distinguish between town TA and scum TA at all on the postcount matter.  It's a complete null-read to me.

[liopoil]

re ashersky: Lynching chairs just because he claimed VT is terrible. But in the possible scenerario that volt and chairs are both town and we're gonna lynch one of them, chairs is the mislynch that hurts less. that's just something to take into account.

[Twistedarcher]

My main reasons for finding Mcmc scummy are his vote/unvote on Ash at weird times, and his interaction with Robz. I really do think that Mcmc calling Robz towny for weak reasons make it more likely that Mcmc is scum, and Robz towny. It's an easy way to pick up towncred, and easily justifiable by the fact that he knows Robz better than the rest of us if he's questioned on it.

mcmc-Robz is always tough.  I never know what to think.  My gut tells me mcmc is usually right about Robz, regardless of his alignment, while Robz is usually wrong about mcmc, regardless of purpose.

Yeah. I agree, it's tough.

But I know for me, also having a brother who plays, honestly I can't really read Nkirbit better or worse than anyone else. He's just another player who I try to read but it's not much easier for me. Given that Nkirbit's actually my twin, and I'm guessing I know him better than Robz and Mcmc know each other, Mcmc giving Robz a town read on little information just seems like him being more sure than he could possibly be. Like, if I can't see why Robz is towny, and most people can't, I doubt Mcmc would be able to, either. Therefore, when Mcmc calls Robz towny on slight information, it reads scummy to me.

[raerae]

Shame straight on my face??? Um...thanks? I don't know what you have against me, I really really don't, but please don't shame straight on my face, thanks.

I've also been very clear about who is my preferred lynch. I think Ashersky is scum, but that wagon isn't happening.

I am not the main proponent of the Volt lynch, and I don't have anything better to offer on why he's scummy. I just think there's a much, much better chance of Volt flipping scum than Chairs. I think Chairs is VT as he claims.

Yeah, it hasn't been happening, like, all day.  So you're telling me you don't have any stronger reads than that after this entire day?  Hello pot.  Nice to meet you.  I'm kettle.

[ashersky]

Given that Nkirbit's actually my twin,

You do realize that just because you are able to hear each other's thoughts that it isn't okay to think about the game with each other right?  Psychic discussion is just as off-limits!

[Twistedarcher]

Shame straight on my face??? Um...thanks? I don't know what you have against me, I really really don't, but please don't shame straight on my face, thanks.

I've also been very clear about who is my preferred lynch. I think Ashersky is scum, but that wagon isn't happening.

I am not the main proponent of the Volt lynch, and I don't have anything better to offer on why he's scummy. I just think there's a much, much better chance of Volt flipping scum than Chairs. I think Chairs is VT as he claims.

Yeah, it hasn't been happening, like, all day.  So you're telling me you don't have any stronger reads than that after this entire day?  Hello pot.  Nice to meet you.  I'm kettle.

#812 I listed four players I would rather lynch over Volt/Chairs

[Twistedarcher]

Given that Nkirbit's actually my twin,

You do realize that just because you are able to hear each other's thoughts that it isn't okay to think about the game with each other right?  Psychic discussion is just as off-limits!

It's like a neighbor QT that no one will ever be able to read!

[ashersky]

Given that Nkirbit's actually my twin,

You do realize that just because you are able to hear each other's thoughts that it isn't okay to think about the game with each other right?  Psychic discussion is just as off-limits!

It's like a neighbor QT that no one will ever be able to read!

If you guys are conjoined, I'm calling a mistrial on this game.

[nkirbit]

I'm not lynching Chairs because of the VT claim, either.  I think he scummily sheeped onto two wagons without a good reason for either, and never gave me any reason to make me think his reasons were less scummy.  I'm also uncomfortable with how he tried to push Voltaire off his wagon by threatening him that "he would be the lynch tomorrow when I flip town."  I can't imagine myself ever making such a statement as town, and it seems out of character from what I've seen from the couple of game I've played with Chairs.

[shraeye]

Shraeye:  You told TA to blow up Innovation with posts as scum, specifically because it's anti-town.  Sure, scum!TA could have an incentive to act differently, and post less.  I'll buy that.  But town!TA has that same incentive, simply because he doesn't want to do something that's anti-town!

I think both scum!TA and town!TA would have an incentive to post less, and have no reason to believe it's one or the other.  I don't know why you're convinced it's TA being scum, when he has incentives to post less as a town player.

At the time that I had pointed it out, Twisted was almost at the lowest end of the votecount, near me and chairs and other low-posters.  That is a HUUUGE switch from somebody who in Innovation had at least 3x as many posts as almost every player (for eevee it was  just under 3times, and for ashersky it's more like 2x)

[ashersky]

re ashersky: Lynching chairs just because he claimed VT is terrible. But in the possible scenerario that volt and chairs are both town and we're gonna lynch one of them, chairs is the mislynch that hurts less. that's just something to take into account.

This is one of the best sounding typos ever.

[shraeye]

re ashersky: Lynching chairs just because he claimed VT is terrible. But in the possible scenerario that volt and chairs are both town and we're gonna lynch one of them, chairs is the mislynch that hurts less. that's just something to take into account.

wait wait wait; why do you discount that Voltaire is also VT???

[nkirbit]

Shraeye:  You told TA to blow up Innovation with posts as scum, specifically because it's anti-town.  Sure, scum!TA could have an incentive to act differently, and post less.  I'll buy that.  But town!TA has that same incentive, simply because he doesn't want to do something that's anti-town!

I think both scum!TA and town!TA would have an incentive to post less, and have no reason to believe it's one or the other.  I don't know why you're convinced it's TA being scum, when he has incentives to post less as a town player.

At the time that I had pointed it out, Twisted was almost at the lowest end of the votecount, near me and chairs and other low-posters.  That is a HUUUGE switch from somebody who in Innovation had at least 3x as many posts as almost every player (for eevee it was  just under 3times, and for ashersky it's more like 2x)

Yeah, I know it's a huge change.  But I'm saying that both town and scum TA would have an incentive to make such a huge change... do you disagree with that?

[Twistedarcher]

re ashersky: Lynching chairs just because he claimed VT is terrible. But in the possible scenerario that volt and chairs are both town and we're gonna lynch one of them, chairs is the mislynch that hurts less. that's just something to take into account.

wait wait wait; why do you discount that Voltaire is also VT???

He means that if we lynched Chairs now, Volt wouldn't claim, so we'd have a larger pool for possible PRs, I believe