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[xeiron]

If my information turns out to be incorrect, I will not need any out, as i have already lost (or won, if I am scum).

My comprehension skills are failing here.  Can you clarify, Xeiron, or can someone else explain it?

We lynch TA+ 1NK+ Lynch Sugdy+ 1nk+ Lynch Eeevee+ 1 nk  = three players left. If I am wrong, all dead players are town and scum win.
This is assuming no lovers. With lovers scum win even faster.

[sudgy]

Anybody not voting xeiron: If you are don't want to lynch him, please say why.  If you would be fine with lynching, him, VOTE.

[xeiron]

Maybe that if he's incorrect, and me, sudgy and eevee are all town, then we'll have 3 mislynches and town will have already lost? Not sure but that's my interpretation.

It seems ridiculous that we'd let this information determine our next 3 lynches, though.

I want this information to determine the lynch today.
I am pretty sure it is time for a massclaim tomorrow.

[nkirbit]

Maybe that if he's incorrect, and me, sudgy and eevee are all town, then we'll have 3 mislynches and town will have already lost? Not sure but that's my interpretation.

It seems ridiculous that we'd let this information determine our next 3 lynches, though.

I want this information to determine the lynch today.
I am pretty sure it is time for a massclaim tomorrow.

There's no way we're allowing your information to determine a lynch today without you claiming.  No way.

[nkirbit]

And we'll worry about massclaiming tomorrow when we get there.  I don't see a reason why we should yet, but we'll see.

[nkirbit]

I'm frustrated that EFHW seems to have gone away without either voting for Xeiron or explaining why she's unwilling to vote Xeiron.

[Twistedarcher]

Maybe that if he's incorrect, and me, sudgy and eevee are all town, then we'll have 3 mislynches and town will have already lost? Not sure but that's my interpretation.

It seems ridiculous that we'd let this information determine our next 3 lynches, though.

I want this information to determine the lynch today.
I am pretty sure it is time for a massclaim tomorrow.

There's no way we're allowing your information to determine a lynch today without you claiming.  No way.

Agree with this.

Also, I will not be claiming tomorrow unless I have a very very very very good reason to do so. And I encourage everyone else to not claim unless they feel they must.

[nkirbit]

Okay, Xeiron, if you think we should lynch on your information, why should we lynch Sudgy instead of TA or Eevee?  Because it's convenient?

Convenience isn't a good way to catch scum.

[xeiron]

Maybe that if he's incorrect, and me, sudgy and eevee are all town, then we'll have 3 mislynches and town will have already lost? Not sure but that's my interpretation.

It seems ridiculous that we'd let this information determine our next 3 lynches, though.

I want this information to determine the lynch today.
I am pretty sure it is time for a massclaim tomorrow.

There's no way we're allowing your information to determine a lynch today without you claiming.  No way.

Agree with this.

Also, I will not be claiming tomorrow unless I have a very very very very good reason to do so. And I encourage everyone else to not claim unless they feel they must.

We can talk about claiming tomorrow.

But I would be interested in having Julia or Silvia flavor claim today. That way we would know Sudgy is not outright lying.

[sudgy]

Maybe that if he's incorrect, and me, sudgy and eevee are all town, then we'll have 3 mislynches and town will have already lost? Not sure but that's my interpretation.

It seems ridiculous that we'd let this information determine our next 3 lynches, though.

I want this information to determine the lynch today.
I am pretty sure it is time for a massclaim tomorrow.

There's no way we're allowing your information to determine a lynch today without you claiming.  No way.

Agree with this.

Also, I will not be claiming tomorrow unless I have a very very very very good reason to do so. And I encourage everyone else to not claim unless they feel they must.

We can talk about claiming tomorrow.

But I would be interested in having Julia or Silvia flavor claim today. That way we would know Sudgy is not outright lying.

NONONONONONONONONO  THEN SCUM COULD EASILY KILL ME OR THEM AND WE BOTH DIE

With just me claiming, someone else can protect me if possible.  With two, that would be almost impossible.

[Twistedarcher]

No, no, no!!!

If we have a confirmed pair of lovers, known to scum, then they have TWO choices of who to night kill tonight to get 2 people. If we only have 1 doctor, or JK, or whatever, they can't protect both lovers at the same time.

Why do you want scum to know who both lovers are? Don't you see how that's just awful for town?

[nkirbit]

But I would be interested in having Julia or Silvia flavor claim today. That way we would know Sudgy is not outright lying.

This is a horrible idea.

We should absolutely NOT give mafia multiple targets for try and hit two town at once with a NK.

[nkirbit]

Wow, that idea got shot down quickly.  Haha.

[xeiron]

Okay, Xeiron, if you think we should lynch on your information, why should we lynch Sudgy instead of TA or Eevee?  Because it's convenient?

Convenience isn't a good way to catch scum.

I have moved my vote to TA, so TA is fine.

I would prefer not to lynch eevee as I find him townier than the others..

[sudgy]

Okay, Xeiron, if you think we should lynch on your information, why should we lynch Sudgy instead of TA or Eevee?  Because it's convenient?

Convenience isn't a good way to catch scum.

I would prefer not to lynch eevee as I find him townier than the others..

Why is that?

[Twistedarcher]

Okay, Xeiron, if you think we should lynch on your information, why should we lynch Sudgy instead of TA or Eevee?  Because it's convenient?

Convenience isn't a good way to catch scum.

I have moved my vote to TA, so TA is fine.

I would prefer not to lynch eevee as I find him townier than the others..

Why did you not announce this information the first time you voted for me? When I had 3 votes on me? Especially if you found me scummier than Sudgy?

I just don't get why you saved the information when I was the target, then used it when Sudgy was the target, and are now justifying it to switch back to me.

It just seems like you're more concerned with trying to save yourself rather than actually lynch scum.

[nkirbit]

From EFHW:

Nkirbit - I agree on your observations of xeiron's seemingly arbitrary voting. 

I think Xeiron and sudgy are scummier than TA and would vote for either of them.

I'm not comfortable lynching xeiron without a claim.

Yet, we see no fourth vote to pressure Xeiron into a claim.  No vote to try and force a lynch through.  Actions and words aren't adding up here.

[EFHW]

From EFHW:

Nkirbit - I agree on your observations of xeiron's seemingly arbitrary voting. 

I think Xeiron and sudgy are scummier than TA and would vote for either of them.

I'm not comfortable lynching xeiron without a claim.

Yet, we see no fourth vote to pressure Xeiron into a claim.  No vote to try and force a lynch through.  Actions and words aren't adding up here.

I'm not done with responding to people.  Then I will decide where to vote.

[nkirbit]

From EFHW:

Nkirbit - I agree on your observations of xeiron's seemingly arbitrary voting. 

I think Xeiron and sudgy are scummier than TA and would vote for either of them.

I'm not comfortable lynching xeiron without a claim.

Yet, we see no fourth vote to pressure Xeiron into a claim.  No vote to try and force a lynch through.  Actions and words aren't adding up here.

I'm not done with responding to people.  Then I will decide where to vote.

Okay, fair enough.  I thought you had headed off.

[sudgy]

Oh my, eight members are viewing the thread.

[xeiron]

Okay, Xeiron, if you think we should lynch on your information, why should we lynch Sudgy instead of TA or Eevee?  Because it's convenient?

Convenience isn't a good way to catch scum.

I have moved my vote to TA, so TA is fine.

I would prefer not to lynch eevee as I find him townier than the others..

Why did you not announce this information the first time you voted for me? When I had 3 votes on me? Especially if you found me scummier than Sudgy?

I just don't get why you saved the information when I was the target, then used it when Sudgy was the target, and are now justifying it to switch back to me.

It just seems like you're more concerned with trying to save yourself rather than actually lynch scum.

Originally, I did not plan on saying anything at all. This was back when I voted TA.
I changed to Sudgy when we approached deadline with one vote on each person.
At the same time Sudgy voted for me, and asked for an explanation of my vote on him.
I found out I had nothing in thread to call him out on, so I felt I had to soft claim to justify my vote. 

[EFHW]

Also, while I share everyone's curiosity about xeiron's claim, I disagree with forcing him to fully claim.  We don't know the possible consequences of his claiming, but he does.  It's up to him to figure out the best time. 

I also agree with Eevee that it is very easy to mess up the timing of sharing information, and

if xeiron thought the TA lynch could go through without him claiming then not claiming would have been the better course.

That said, I won't be using his claim to in any way affect my voting today.  We don't know if it's true or if his reasoning is sound (though xeiron's reasoning usually is) and even he says he isn't sure.

Finally, while I gave reasons potentially explaining xeiron's behavior, he himself did not give those reasons, which does raise questions for me.

PPE: just saw his last post, where he does give some of his reasoning.

[nkirbit]

Ultimately, all of my suspicion on Xeiron comes from his decision to semi-claim.  Maybe he just horribly botched it.

[nkirbit]

Assuming a player made a mistake is not an assumption that I would be inclined to make, though.

[nkirbit]

I also find it odd that Xeiron has been discussing issues such as should we believe Sudgy's claim or not, should lovers claim or not, should Sudgy announce his whisper target enough, etc. despite the fact that we came to a near universal consensus on these issues.  And that he realistically expects us to lynch on a semi-claim of a player under pressure when we have 750 posts to work with.