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[NoMoreFun]

Dominion has been themed around the pre Industrial world - vaguely the late middle ages and Renaissance, and things that would have existed before then. But I'm feeling inspired by games like Innovation, the Civilization series, and "tech trees" in general.

So this week, your challenge is to design an anachronism. Design something in the supply that isn't out of place with Dominion's broad theme, that also lets you gain something that is much more modern, or even futuristic. This means 2 or more cards (or card shaped things).

The rule is that the modern/futuristic card can't be "visible" in the supply or starting decks at the start of the game. It needs to be "invented" or "discovered" during the course of the game.

So the modern card can be lower in a split pile (Empires/Allies style), a non supply card (Like Mercenary or Madman), a traveller, or an Artifact, or starts outside the supply and decks (Necromancer's Zombies) or any other mechanic I've forgotten. I don't count heirlooms or cards costing $P (if they're at the top of their supply piles) as they're visible at start of game.

Try stick to the spirit of the challenge. You can make the cards very simple, but if you start with an event, it should involve you doing something to get the card (like Quest or Peril) rather than just a purchase (like Ride or Looting).

I'll try not to be strict about what was technically around or not around before the "Dominion Era" (the Renaissance and age of sail). I like learning about history but the idea is to go from a card that "belongs" to one that doesn't.

I'll be judging based on how fun the cards seem to play with. But as a theme challenge flavour matters too. As one idea, Cards from the future may be powerful or mess with mechanics more or just be "weird" in some other way. But they don't have to be.

[fika monster]

How many cards are we allowed to submit?

[BryGuy]

                                                                                                           

                                                                                                           

Ares Cult / Timed Bomb • Randomizer
Set-aside two Ares Cult. Mix the other cards. Place the two set-aside Ares Cult on top.

Ares Cult • $5 • Action • Quantity: 9
+1 Buy
+$2
Choose one: gain a Curse; or discard two cards.
Choose one: discard a Curse for +4 Cards and +1 Action; or +3 Cards.

Timed Bomb • $4 • Reaction • Quantity: 1
When this is uncovered, immediately set-aside the top card of every supply pile, including this.

Here is my entry - a split pie with a Count variant and an anachronism in the form of a semi-random explosion that removes one of each Supply piles cards from the game.

                                                                                                             

[segura]

I think this is a very cool idea. I would consider adding more bomb copies though an consider trashing the cards. Not for deep mechanical reasons, but simplicity reasons .(one fewer game area) and flavour reasons.

[NoMoreFun]

How many cards are we allowed to submit?

As many as you want but more than a traveller line or Castles style pile might not get the results you're hoping for

[Augie279]

Gears
Action - $5
You may discard a Gears from your hand for +3 Cards and +2 Actions. If you did, you may trash a Gears from your hand to gain a Factory.

Factory
Action-Duration - $6*
At the start of each of your turns for the rest of the game, gain a card costing up to $4. For the rest of the game, when a player gains a card on your turn, they put it into their hand.
(This is not in the Supply.)

It's the Industrial Revolution! Here's a Lost City that needs a bit of collision to get going. Once it does, though, it can create incredible things, including a way for everyone to get more use out of what you produce.

[segura]

How is the splitt? 5-5 makes no sense because in the absence of cards that gain from the trash, like Lurker or Rogue, there could be only one Factory.

Also, wouldn't it make more sense to make Factory a non-Supply?

[infangthief]

I assume the intention is for Gears to be a 10-card pile and Factory to be non-Supply (because of the * in its cost). But Factory should say so explicitly.

[4est]

A cantrip gainer that only works if you reveal something other people don't have. Once you've got a Gold, you can pay up for the Telescope to spy on opponents hands.

[Augie279]

I assume the intention is for Gears to be a 10-card pile and Factory to be non-Supply (because of the * in its cost). But Factory should say so explicitly.

Sorry, yes. Fixed, thank you.

[JW]

Steamboat
- Action Duration
+2 Cards
If you have 5 or more differently-named Actions in play, you may exchange this for a Factory. Otherwise, at the start of your next turn, +2 Actions.
 
Factory
- Action Duration (not in the Supply)
At the start of each of your turns for the rest of the game, +1 Card, +1 Action, and trash a card from your hand. Gain a card costing exactly more than it.

Notes: 10 Factories in the (non-Supply) pile. Steamboat counts itself.

Steamboat is a reverse Longship, which is a more awkward variation on an already awkward card. It can transform into a Factory.

Factory is a Hireling with extra benefits, but the start of turn mandatory trashing effect is typically awkward. Which means that you probably won’t automatically try to gain and play as many Factories as you can. Thematically, industrialization caused a lot of disruption, embodied here by Factory trashing your cards.

The theme is inspired by faust’s entry Industrialization in the previous contest. Thoughts on the power level appreciated.

[binbag420]

There are 10 Trackmen and 15 Railway systems (to account for extra piles like young witch? idk if there can be more than 11 but maybe Rising sun can have more)

(edited)

[segura]

Fugitive for $4 is already OP.

[infangthief]

Abacus School
$2 Action

+1 Buy
This turn, when you gain an Action card, +$2.
-
Setup: Place a Bitcoin halfway through each Kingdom Supply pile.

Bitcoin
$0 Treasure - Duration

For the rest of the game, when you gain a Bitcoin, +1 Buy and +$2.
-
This is not associated with any particular pile.

Preparation:

• If Abacus School is in the game, add one Bitcoin card to each Kingdom Supply pile, so each one is effectively a split pile.
• Normally Kingdom piles have an even number of cards; place the Bitcoin so that there are the same number of cards above it as below it, without changing the order of other cards in the pile.
• If a Kingdom pile has an odd number of cards at the start of the game (such as an Inherited pile with an odd number of players), place the Bitcoin so that there is one more card above it than below it.
• Do not place Bitcoins in non-Kingdom piles (such as Ruins, Potion, Curse, Copper etc) or non-Supply piles (such as the pile chosen for Ferryman).
• If Knights are in the Supply, do the normal setup for Knights first, then place a Bitcoin face up halfway through the pile.
• If the Inherited trait is in the game, do the setup for Inherited first, then place a Bitcoin in the Inherited pile afterwards.
• There are 11 copies of Bitcoin, enough for each Kingdom Supply pile in a game with Young Witch. In games without Young Witch, leave one copy of Bitcoin in the box.
• Do not use Bitcoin in games without Abacus School; there is no Bitcoin randomizer.

FAQ:

• In most ways, a Bitcoin in a Supply pile follows the normal rules for cards in split piles; it can be bought, gained or exiled if it is at the top of the pile, and it affects the rotation of that pile (with Battle Plan).
• However, Bitcoins are not associated with any one particular pile. This means:
• A Bitcoin is unaffected by things which care about which pile it is from, even if it is still in the pile: it cannot be a Bane, does not count for Obelisk, is unaffected by traits and is unaffected by any kind of token on any pile.
• For example:
• If a pile affected by Fawning has a Bitcoin on top, you cannot gain it via Fawning.
• If a pile with Debt tokens on it (from Tax) has a Bitcoin on top, you can gain it without taking the Debt tokens.
• A Bitcoin cannot be returned to a pile (with Ambassador) or exchanged (with Trader).
• If there are Bitcoins at the top of two or more Supply piles and you are instructed to gain a Bitcoin (such as with Mint), you may choose which one you gain.

Apologies for the lengthy Preparation/FAQ. There are probably various ways to handle having a card in more than one pile, but seem to need a lot of rulings. I feel this is the simplest.


So you have these students working away at an Abacus School, learning how to be efficient tradespeople, when suddenly one of them completes the calculations required for a Bitcoin. Not much use on its own, but maybe it's worth mining through the other piles to uncover some more.

[binbag420]

Fugitive for $4 is already OP.

As is Wharf for $5, and Silk Merchant for $4. These cards can exist because 'OP' isn't really a problem in dominion, both players have access to the trackman pile. The problem is when a card is so centralising it becomes an autobuy making each game run the same, or it means other cards that also draw/give payload/whatever the card does don't get bought that game. Since trackmen dont draw, give payload, act as a village it doesnt really step on the toes of any other card. Also it can gain itself so multiple buys arent spent just buying them as opposed to other low cost cards.

If people disagree and think this card is still a problem I can give it a downside or make it $5 but I dont see too much of an issue. It's supposed to be a card that piles most games so Railway System can be revealed.

[segura]

Fugitive for $4 is already OP.

These cards can exist because 'OP' isn't really a problem in dominion

Nope. You cannot ignore powerlevel, especially not around the critical 4-5-threshold.

It is well established that Fugitive as a Kingdom card would be a $4.5 which is why it does not exist and why Ferryman, Fugitive with a bonus, costs $5.

[binbag420]

Fugitive for $4 is already OP.

These cards can exist because 'OP' isn't really a problem in dominion

Nope. You cannot ignore powerlevel, especially not around the critical 4-5-threshold.

It is well established that Fugitive as a Kingdom card would be a $4.5 which is why it does not exist and why Ferryman, Fugitive with a bonus, costs $5.

Explain to me why I cannot ignore it around the 4-5 threshold. I understand this is a powerful card but i dont see the problem, its supposed to get piled often, it doesnt affect what strategies you use that much and doesnt make almost any other card unbuyable in any kingdom its in, you still need draw payload and villages if you wanna build a functional deck. Journey costs 4 and is far more busted than this card, as is silk merchant I would imagine.

[Tiago]

Fugitive for $4 is already OP.

These cards can exist because 'OP' isn't really a problem in dominion

Nope. You cannot ignore powerlevel, especially not around the critical 4-5-threshold.

It is well established that Fugitive as a Kingdom card would be a $4.5 which is why it does not exist and why Ferryman, Fugitive with a bonus, costs $5.

Explain to me why I cannot ignore it around the 4-5 threshold. I understand this is a powerful card but i dont see the problem, its supposed to get piled often, it doesnt affect what strategies you use that much and doesnt make almost any other card unbuyable in any kingdom its in, you still need draw payload and villages if you wanna build a functional deck. Journey costs 4 and is far more busted than this card, as is silk merchant I would imagine.

If this card is fun as well as OP, that's great, but I don't think it's a good idea to say "well some cards are overpowered and fun so we don't have to worry about it." Cards like Mountebank, Ghost Ship, Ambassador, and Cultist do happen.

[segura]

Fugitive for $4 is already OP.

These cards can exist because 'OP' isn't really a problem in dominion

Nope. You cannot ignore powerlevel, especially not around the critical 4-5-threshold.

It is well established that Fugitive as a Kingdom card would be a $4.5 which is why it does not exist and why Ferryman, Fugitive with a bonus, costs $5.

Explain to me why I cannot ignore it around the 4-5 threshold.

You really want an explanation for why one should not cost a $5 as a $4? Like, seriously dude?

If you don’t care about basic design principles, that is your prerogative. Just don’t expect a round of applause for mispricing cards.

[binbag420]

Fugitive for $4 is already OP.

These cards can exist because 'OP' isn't really a problem in dominion

Nope. You cannot ignore powerlevel, especially not around the critical 4-5-threshold.

It is well established that Fugitive as a Kingdom card would be a $4.5 which is why it does not exist and why Ferryman, Fugitive with a bonus, costs $5.

Explain to me why I cannot ignore it around the 4-5 threshold.

You really want an explanation for why one should not cost a $5 as a $4? Like, seriously dude?

If you don’t care about basic design principles, that is your prerogative. Just don’t expect a round of applause for mispricing cards.

Yes I do want an explanation. I understand why overpowered cards aren’t healthy for the game and I’ve explained why I don’t think my card has the same problems. You’re welcome to disagree but you haven’t provided any points other than ‘this isn’t how dominion cards are usually priced’. Nobody breaks the ‘rules’ of dominion harder than the creator himself there’s constantly exceptions to fanmade ‘rules’.

 If you disagree with me and think this is the kind of overpowered that is unhealthy for the game please give me substantial criticism that goes further than ‘you just can’t’. Or don’t, you’re not under requirement to give any feedback at all.

[segura]

Dude, your card is a $5, you mispriced it at $4 and don’t care. There is nothing else to say if you are willfully ignorant and don’t care.

It is like designing a Lab variant (not a nerfed Lab like Advisor or Lab but Stables or Hunting Party), pricing it at $4 and asking for an explanation for what the issue with that is supposed to be.

[binbag420]

Dude, your card is a $5, you mispriced it at $4 and don’t care. There is nothing else to say if you are willfully ignorant and don’t care.

It is like designing a Lab variant (not a nerfed Lab like Advisor or Lab but Stables or Hunting Party), pricing it at $4 and asking for an explanation for what the issue with that is supposed to be.

In that case the issues would be:
1) Making other draw variants obsolete on boards with this hypothetical card.
2) Strategies in games with this card becoming too similar, with enough easy to gain terminal draw you can just fill your deck with it.
3) The early buys of the game would too often just consist of trying to get as many of this card as you can, leading to the early game always looking the same.

I have explained why I don’t believe my card falls under the same issues other very powerful cheap cards could do, as deck filtering isn’t something that makes other kingdom cards obsolete and isn’t enough on its own to supplement an entire deck making all games look the same. It also self gains so you don’t spend many early game buys just buying this card every kingdom. If you disagree that’s fine I value useful constructive criticism but it seems you’re not interested in giving any criticism beyond ‘cards aren’t usually priced this cheap’ so let’s leave it, this thread is becoming bloated and this conversation is getting nowhere.

[segura]

Dude, your card is a $5, you mispriced it at $4 and don’t care. There is nothing else to say if you are willfully ignorant and don’t care.

It is like designing a Lab variant (not a nerfed Lab like Advisor or Lab but Stables or Hunting Party), pricing it at $4 and asking for an explanation for what the issue with that is supposed to be.

In that case the issues would be:
1) Making other draw variants obsolete on boards with this hypothetical card.
2) Strategies in games with this card becoming too similar, with enough easy to gain terminal draw you can just fill your deck with it.

I have no idea what you are talking about here. Your card does not net draw, it is a sifter. If you think that it is no biggie that you mispriced a $5 self-gaining sifter at $4 because sifters are somehow a card category that is somehow exempt from elementary design principles you are woefully mistaken.

[silverspawn]

Fugitive for $4 is already OP.

As is Wharf for $5, and Silk Merchant for $4. These cards can exist because 'OP' isn't really a problem in dominion, both players have access to the trackman pile. The problem is when a card is so centralising it becomes an autobuy making each game run the same, or it means other cards that also draw/give payload/whatever the card does don't get bought that game. Since trackmen dont draw, give payload, act as a village it doesnt really step on the toes of any other card. Also it can gain itself so multiple buys arent spent just buying them as opposed to other low cost cards.

If people disagree and think this card is still a problem I can give it a downside or make it $5 but I dont see too much of an issue. It's supposed to be a card that piles most games so Railway System can be revealed.

(would quintuple-upvote this but the interface won't let me)

[LTaco]

Fugitive for $4 is already OP.

These cards can exist because 'OP' isn't really a problem in dominion

Nope. You cannot ignore powerlevel, especially not around the critical 4-5-threshold.

It is well established that Fugitive as a Kingdom card would be a $4.5 which is why it does not exist and why Ferryman, Fugitive with a bonus, costs $5.

Explain to me why I cannot ignore it around the 4-5 threshold.

You really want an explanation for why one should not cost a $5 as a $4? Like, seriously dude?

If you don’t care about basic design principles, that is your prerogative. Just don’t expect a round of applause for mispricing cards.

Yes I do want an explanation. I understand why overpowered cards aren’t healthy for the game and I’ve explained why I don’t think my card has the same problems. You’re welcome to disagree but you haven’t provided any points other than ‘this isn’t how dominion cards are usually priced’. Nobody breaks the ‘rules’ of dominion harder than the creator himself there’s constantly exceptions to fanmade ‘rules’.

 If you disagree with me and think this is the kind of overpowered that is unhealthy for the game please give me substantial criticism that goes further than ‘you just can’t’. Or don’t, you’re not under requirement to give any feedback at all.

Apart from the points about Fugitive, one fundamental flaw with Trackman is that it can easily auto-pile two supply piles, its own and another, affording an unreasonable degree of pile control. Also the self gaining leads to an extreme run-away advantage for the first player to get through the deck. Similar to Magpie, but way more extreme, with the difference being that the Trackman split would tend to be way more lopsided than Magpies and having more Trackmen is more impactful.