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Author Topic: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested  (Read 2395 times)

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Augie279

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Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« on: November 20, 2023, 07:20:15 am »
+2

Weekly Design Contest 205: Permission Requested

Challenge: Design a card(-shaped object) that uses the phrase "You must", "You may", or "You can't".

Simple one this time, but I think this can be pushed pretty far. Anything goes: Travellers, split piles, whatever. Contest closes on November 27th. Good luck to all entrants!
« Last Edit: November 20, 2023, 11:01:38 am by Augie279 »
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Ethan

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #1 on: November 20, 2023, 07:29:18 am »
+2

FYI, official cards that would qualify includes Contraband, Grand Market, Souk, Poor House, Mission, Mountain Village.
I am not sure if Bad Omens, Fear and Deluded did.
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SignError

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #2 on: November 20, 2023, 10:01:50 am »
+1

Yep, those are the 9 examples that use “you can’t” in the card list.

I don’t think there are any official cards that use “you must.”  If “you may” is not used, it’s assumed you have to do the thing.  For example, Haggler doesn’t use “you may,” so you always have to gain a cheaper card, even if you don’t want to (i.e. forced Copper gain).

So how do we handle “you must”?
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Augie279

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #3 on: November 20, 2023, 11:04:51 am »
0

Completely forgot about "You may" for some reason. That's been added.

FYI, official cards that would qualify includes Contraband, Grand Market, Souk, Poor House, Mission, Mountain Village.
I am not sure if Bad Omens, Fear and Deluded did.

These three qualify.

So how do we handle “you must”?

Didn't realize that that specific wording hasn't been used on a card yet. Uh, there's probably some way to get use out of it (e.g. requiring the player to do something specific on an extra turn), but if not, then there's two other clauses you can use as well. Might not get used, and if so oh well.
« Last Edit: November 20, 2023, 11:06:20 am by Augie279 »
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segura

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #4 on: November 20, 2023, 11:35:42 am »
+7

"You must"is never used because all card instructions are mamdatory anyway.
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Will(ow|iam)

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #5 on: November 20, 2023, 01:01:44 pm »
+2

Dog Breeders
Ally

At the start of your turn or directly after playing an Action, you may spend an Action and a Favor for +2 Cards.
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JW

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #6 on: November 20, 2023, 06:54:30 pm »
+1

Queen’s Court

Action
Choose one: gain up to two differently-named cards costing up to ; or you may play an Action from your hand twice.

Notes: The “differently-named” limitation is to help prevent it from empting piles too quickly.

FAQ: You can choose to gain only a single card costing up to (or no cards at all).
« Last Edit: November 21, 2023, 07:27:45 pm by JW »
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BryGuy

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #7 on: November 20, 2023, 09:36:41 pm »
+1

.          :)
Quote
Smithy Village/Gold Smith • Randomizer
This pile starts with as many copies of each card as players, but minimum three and maximum five. All copies of Smithy Village are on top.
.                    :)
Smithy Village • $4 • Action
+1 Card
+3 Actions

You may let all players trash a card from their Hand.
.               :)
Gold Smith • $6 • Action - Duration
Now and at the start of your next turn, +2 Cards and all players may discard a card for +1 Card and you may discard a non-Victory card for +1 Action.
.          :)
So both cards in this pile have "may" clauses. I enjoy cards that allow other-players action on your turn.
My set uses these in a four-split pile using two cards designed by others at the $3 and $5 price spots.

.     :)
« Last Edit: November 21, 2023, 12:58:04 pm by BryGuy »
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Cutepelican126

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #8 on: November 20, 2023, 11:58:42 pm »
0



I accidentally said cannot instead of can't but I assume it's fine...
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fika monster

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #9 on: November 21, 2023, 04:41:46 am »
+1

v2



Quote
Coach
Action $5
You may gain an Action card from the Supply costing up to $5 (other then coach), and play it twice. Each other player may discard two cards from their hand to gain a copy of it (or a horse) to their hand.
« Last Edit: November 22, 2023, 05:19:05 am by fika monster »
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faust

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #10 on: November 21, 2023, 08:15:10 am »
+1




Quote
Coach
Action-Command. $5
You may gain and play a non-Command Action card from the Supply costing up to $5 twice. Each other player may discard two cards from their hand to gain a copy of it (or a horse) to their hand.
Do you gain two Action cards or do you gain one and play it twice?
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fika monster

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #11 on: November 21, 2023, 08:26:57 am »
0




Quote
Coach
Action-Command. $5
You may gain and play a non-Command Action card from the Supply costing up to $5 twice. Each other player may discard two cards from their hand to gain a copy of it (or a horse) to their hand.
Do you gain two Action cards or do you gain one and play it twice?

you gain it once, and play it twice. Updating wording.
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SignError

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #12 on: November 21, 2023, 10:21:44 am »
+2



Quote
Coach
Action-Command. $5
You may gain a non-Command Action card from the Supply costing up to $5, and play it twice. Each other player may discard two cards from their hand to gain a copy of it (or a horse) to their hand.

I don’t think this needs the Command type; it doesn’t use “leaving it there” wording.  You definitely need to make sure it can’t gain itself, but that can be done by saying “other than Coach,” like what Vampire does.  You could also make it cost $6 and say “costing less than this,” like Berserker, but that significantly impacts the card’s balance.
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anordinaryman

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #13 on: November 21, 2023, 03:56:23 pm »
+3



Quote
Night Market | Action - Duration | $4
The next time you buy a Curse, trash this.

While this is in play, you can't buy Provinces, and at the start of your turns +$1 +1 Buy

It's kind of like a treasury, sitting around and giving you $ and a buy every turn! Well, maybe it's kind of like a Market. Except, you can't buy Provinces when it's in play, you'll have to buy a curse to trash them -- they are immediately removed from play so that means the turn you buy a curse you can buy Provinces. Good thing they have a +Buy. You could also attempt to forgo Provinces entirely, trying for a 3-pile with alt victory cards.

Costing them at a $4 with the knowledge that once you start greening they go away, and comes with the expense of a curse in your deck.

I'm open to feedback. Treasury is quite weak for a $5 -- is this un-fun strong for a $4? I'd consider making it gain a Copper when you trash it but that might be too prohibitive. I think the cost may work as is, since it is terminal and does nothing on your first play.
« Last Edit: November 21, 2023, 03:57:39 pm by anordinaryman »
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JW

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #14 on: November 21, 2023, 07:55:10 pm »
0



Quote
Night Market | Action - Duration | $4
The next time you buy a Curse, trash this.

While this is in play, you can't buy Provinces, and at the start of your turns +$1 +1 Buy

I don't think it's too strong in most kingdoms, but I could see it leading to un-fun games when combined with fast cursing. Suppose no one wants to buy one of the last Curses and lose their Night Markets just to preserve their ability to buy Provinces later. Then all players end up unable to buy Provinces which promotes three-piling on, say, Curses, Duchies, and Estates.
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RovingBear

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #15 on: November 22, 2023, 04:55:44 am »
+4



Because when youre at the top, nobody can dethrone you.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2023, 02:33:59 am by RovingBear »
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Holger

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #17 on: November 22, 2023, 07:23:43 am »
+1



Quote
Night Market | Action - Duration | $4
The next time you buy a Curse, trash this.

While this is in play, you can't buy Provinces, and at the start of your turns +$1 +1 Buy

I don't think it's too strong in most kingdoms, but I could see it leading to un-fun games when combined with fast cursing. Suppose no one wants to buy one of the last Curses and lose their Night Markets just to preserve their ability to buy Provinces later. Then all players end up unable to buy Provinces which promotes three-piling on, say, Curses, Duchies, and Estates.

If this turns out to be problematic, you could add a clause that Night Markets are also trashed when the curse pile empties.
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silverspawn

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #18 on: November 22, 2023, 08:57:21 am »
+2



Quote
Night Market | Action - Duration | $4
The next time you buy a Curse, trash this.

While this is in play, you can't buy Provinces, and at the start of your turns +$1 +1 Buy

I don't think it's too strong in most kingdoms, but I could see it leading to un-fun games when combined with fast cursing. Suppose no one wants to buy one of the last Curses and lose their Night Markets just to preserve their ability to buy Provinces later. Then all players end up unable to buy Provinces which promotes three-piling on, say, Curses, Duchies, and Estates.

If this turns out to be problematic, you could add a clause that Night Markets are also trashed when the curse pile empties.

My guess would be that it's very strong in general. I think there are a lot of cases where you don't care about the penalty since you don't want to buy provinces other than on the last turn anyway, and it's worded such that you can get rid of the restriction immediately (i.e., you don't have to set it up one turn in advance). And there's also Colonies, Dominate, Castles, Fairgrounds, etc.

segura

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #19 on: November 22, 2023, 04:12:28 pm »
+1

This, without any restrictions, would be the Market equivalent of Hireling. Hireling is not crazy strong and Lab is stronger than Market, especially in multiples. So we look at a $5 card effect.

Add the severe restrictions and this is suddenly supposed to be a powerhouse at $4? Nah. For building up you’d rather have Abundance and for the very thing you mostly want extra Buys, namely greening, this does not work at all.

I guess it would be even weak at $3.
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4est

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #20 on: November 23, 2023, 09:13:04 am »
+6



It seems like a great deal until you go to check out.

FAQ:
-On turns when you've played Shady Market, if you are able to spend a Buy (i.e. there are cards/landscapes available that you you can afford to purchase, and you aren't in Debt), you are required to do so.
-Suppose you have $8 and 3 Buys. If you buy Province for $8, you must still purchase 2 $0-cost cards/landscapes if available (e.g. 2 Coppers).
-If you can't buy cards (due to unpaid Debt or Mission), or if there aren't any available cards/landscapes left that you have enough $ to buy, you can proceed to your Clean Up phase, even if you still have Buys remaining.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2023, 03:13:52 pm by 4est »
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Will(ow|iam)

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #21 on: November 23, 2023, 12:21:15 pm »
0



It seems like a great deal until you go to check out.

What happens if the copper and curse piles are both empty?
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segura

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #22 on: November 23, 2023, 01:22:45 pm »
+1

The answer to your question is the same as the answer to the question: „what happens when you play Forager while having no cards in your hand?“.
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NoMoreFun

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #23 on: November 24, 2023, 12:05:41 am »
+2

The answer to your question is the same as the answer to the question: „what happens when you play Forager while having no cards in your hand?“.

There is still a problem. If you have $5 and 2 buys, and those piles are empty, are you allowed to buy a Duchy then claim you can't use all your buys, even though you could have bought a  Silver and an Estate? This will actually come up on games with Debt - can you buy Overlord and then nothing or do you have to gain a copper first. What about Mission?

I think "If you can buy cards, and there are cards in the supply costing up to the $ you have, you must spend  all your buys"  covers the edge cases.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2023, 12:06:50 am by NoMoreFun »
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faust

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Re: Weekly Design Contest #205: Permission Requested
« Reply #24 on: November 24, 2023, 03:48:09 am »
0

I think "If you can buy cards, and there are cards in the supply costing up to the $ you have, you must spend  all your buys"  covers the edge cases.
I mean, technically, this condition would trigger when you play Black Market, which is of course nonsensical. But: Do you have to buy a card from BM?

I alo would phrase is as "spend all your Buys" because that condition extends too far into the future. If you have a conditional check like this, you can just say "you must buy a card", and then see if the condition is still satisfied after the buy.
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