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[EFHW]

Has everyone released there round order yet? Did I just miss Faust?

no, and there's no guarantee that everyone will, so stop saying "yet".

Pretty scummy for one or few people to withhold info, everyone else has shared, without good reason

raptor is saying that people who haven't claimed are scummy. You're saying that the people who claimed quickly are scummy

Different thing that he said. He said he claimed round so he wouldn't look scummy.

[EFHW]

vote: ashersky

Raptor has just echoed a thought I was having a moment ago (clairvoyant? which one of us?), which was that scum are likely to have meekly given their round rather than drawing attention to themselves and in hopes of getting the info.

Are your vote and your comment related?

I was not meek in round claiming.

No, they are not connected. I voted you for rolefishing. Then I thought about the people who claimed and why they did that when it seems so counterproductive to me.

I read raptor as saying that he claimed so as not to look scummy, which echoed the thought I was already playing with. There seem to be some other readings of him floating around, but that was the one I was going with.

I'm intending this post as answer to several questions raised recently with regard to my comments.

[shraeye]

You will when we're done, because ash has promised to explain.

And when we're done revealing everybody's draft number, I'll explain how that leads to actual scumhunting instead of just "now ash knows which items aren't used" or some other bizarrely specific, clairvoyance-dependent, unhelpful information

I can't tell how that helps other than scum's going to kill whoever was #1. Can you come up with a way to claim in "groups", like top 4, bottom 4, etc. that still helps "actual scumhunting"?

Nope.  But I CAN promise that scum won't kill #1.

[shraeye]

Pretty scummy for one or few people to withhold info, everyone else has shared, without good reason

if all your friends jumped off a bridge, would you do it too?

If all of the town jumped off a bridge, I would also jump off a bridge, because otherwise I'm endgamed.

See team, THIS is the joke we all need.  I love it.  That's forum-signature level stuff right there

[shraeye]

Hey Glooble, how are you? Why Ashersky?

Also why not scolapasta?

[shraeye]

And to give more reasoning to my "case", the reason scolapasta is scum based on QT is the words/reasons I was seeing.  They did not sound organic.  They did not sound like they came from a new-to-forum player.  They sounded like words passed on from another source.

[cayvie]

And to give more reasoning to my "case", the reason scolapasta is scum based on QT is the words/reasons I was seeing.  They did not sound organic.  They did not sound like they came from a new-to-forum player.  They sounded like words passed on from another source.

Oh interesting. At what point in the game did you suspect you were neighbors with scum? While discussing player rankings? After you found out rankings? During day chat today?

[cayvie]

Also I'm thinking shraeye is town now.

Shraeye, faust, EFHW, these are my top town reads ATM

[scolapasta]

And to give more reasoning to my "case", the reason scolapasta is scum based on QT is the words/reasons I was seeing.  They did not sound organic.  They did not sound like they came from a new-to-forum player.  They sounded like words passed on from another source.

Man, I'm not sure if you're just trying to mess with me - I just went back and reread the QT to see what I might have said that was not "organic". Anyway, I give you permission to reveal anything specific I've said there rather than these hand-wavy generalizations.

I guess I should take it as a compliment that I don't seem like a new-to-forum player?

[scolapasta]

Also I'm thinking shraeye is town now.

Shraeye, faust, EFHW, these are my top town reads ATM

It's weird being at odds with my district mate. Oh well.

I do read you (cayvie) as town, but I think you're all wrong here. Well, except for EFHW - she seems town, so far.

[WestCoastDidds]

You will when we're done, because ash has promised to explain.

And when we're done revealing everybody's draft number, I'll explain how that leads to actual scumhunting instead of just "now ash knows which items aren't used" or some other bizarrely specific, clairvoyance-dependent, unhelpful information

I can't tell how that helps other than scum's going to kill whoever was #1. Can you come up with a way to claim in "groups", like top 4, bottom 4, etc. that still helps "actual scumhunting"?

Nope.  But I CAN promise that scum won't kill #1.

Again, big loaded sentences with no explanation. How can you make that promise?

[WestCoastDidds]

My townsfolk right now are Ash, MiX, cayvie, and ADK. Maybe Shraeye.

Not Glooble, LL, or EFHW

[MiX]

And to give more reasoning to my "case", the reason scolapasta is scum based on QT is the words/reasons I was seeing.  They did not sound organic.  They did not sound like they came from a new-to-forum player.  They sounded like words passed on from another source.

Man, I'm not sure if you're just trying to mess with me - I just went back and reread the QT to see what I might have said that was not "organic". Anyway, I give you permission to reveal anything specific I've said there rather than these hand-wavy generalizations.

I guess I should take it as a compliment that I don't seem like a new-to-forum player?

I'm not sure it's allowed to quote from a neighbor QT. But most importantly, I think the drive to call your neighbor scum is...weird. But I expect scum!shraeye to be more relaxed than this.

vote: ashersky

Raptor has just echoed a thought I was having a moment ago (clairvoyant? which one of us?), which was that scum are likely to have meekly given their round rather than drawing attention to themselves and in hopes of getting the info.

Are your vote and your comment related?

I was not meek in round claiming.

No, they are not connected. I voted you for rolefishing. Then I thought about the people who claimed and why they did that when it seems so counterproductive to me.

I read raptor as saying that he claimed so as not to look scummy, which echoed the thought I was already playing with. There seem to be some other readings of him floating around, but that was the one I was going with.

I'm intending this post as answer to several questions raised recently with regard to my comments.

Thinking more about your thought, I think this has to do with players more than alignment. Scum does things to not look scummy...so does town. Except in their eyes it's a towny thing to do, which also happens to be the same in scum's eyes, but for different reasons. Besides, leaving this unfinished gives scum the same information except nothing useful for town.

[A Drowned Kernel]

And to give more reasoning to my "case", the reason scolapasta is scum based on QT is the words/reasons I was seeing.  They did not sound organic.  They did not sound like they came from a new-to-forum player.  They sounded like words passed on from another source.

I was under the impression that scum didn't have communication during the whole ranking phase

[ashersky]

Has there been a vote count this game?

Is that a mechanic?  Do votes count?

Just raising this, since no one answered.  Am I the only person not in the know?  We're at almost 20 pages -- if I just missed it, let me know.

[ashersky]

And to give more reasoning to my "case", the reason scolapasta is scum based on QT is the words/reasons I was seeing.  They did not sound organic.  They did not sound like they came from a new-to-forum player.  They sounded like words passed on from another source.

I was under the impression that scum didn't have communication during the whole ranking phase

That seems counterintuitive.  If they couldn't talk, when did they talk at all?  My assumption has to be that they got their alignment and scum QT, and then got to talk.  They could have done all their ranking and planning at that point together (the same as was possible in district QTs) as well as share district partner info.  They would also have preset their selections as much as possible with whatever info was known at each step. 

That's how I would have tried to plan it, anyway.

If scum didn't have a QT until after all drafting was done, there really was no time for N0 talk/planning at all, right?  I haven't gone back to check time stamps or anything, though.

[ashersky]

Yeah, just looking at the district QT open and close dates and times, the scum QT had to have existed and been open for talk, so I think ADK is wrong.

That's a towntell, or a scum-planned fake towntell.

[cayvie]

Has there been a vote count this game?

Is that a mechanic?  Do votes count?

Just raising this, since no one answered.  Am I the only person not in the know?  We're at almost 20 pages -- if I just missed it, let me know.

Yeah there have been a couple vote counts

[cayvie]

Yeah, just looking at the district QT open and close dates and times, the scum QT had to have existed and been open for talk, so I think ADK is wrong.

That's a towntell, or a scum-planned fake towntell.

From the second setup post:

"2. Role Information - At this point, all players will ONLY KNOW THEIR ALIGNMENT. They will not have any information what-so-ever outside of which Faction to which they belong."

[cayvie]

My read was that scum did not know each other during player ranking, but did know each other during bidding on items.

[ashersky]

yeah you know what?

vote: Ashersky

the bandages were available in round 2. i think he's searching for the doctor.

Let me explain the multitude of ways that doesn't work.

So, first let's make an assumption and see how it sorts out.  "ashersky made an appeal to get players to claim their round in an effort to find who has the bandages, because ashersky believes the bandages are a doctor."

The assumptions within the assumption:
1) ash believes bandages = doctor
2) scum!ash cares about the doctor
3) scum!ash thinks knowing the rounds of players tells him the doctor

Based on my item, I think #1 is rubbish.  But hey, not everyone does, as I'm sure some players might have made such a connection.  And some items may make more thematic sense than mine, but who knows.  Scum cares about investigative roles much more than protective roles, so #2 is weak.  But both of these are subjective opinions anyway.  Let's look at #3.

In an effort to help cayvie's argument, let's create the most perfect scum scenario for this.  I went r2.  Let's say there are 4 scum and we all went r2.

There were 10 items available in round 2.  For this bandage fishing to be a thing, all four of us scum got something else.
We started with 20 items, so there should be 10 first rounders (this was what my actual plan was trying to confirm).  That leaves 6 2rs.  If 4 scum were in those six, I want to know the other two.  At that point, I have a 50/50 chance at the player who MIGHT have taken bandages.

Is that your basic argument for my rolefishing?  If you reduce the number of scum partners I have in r2 with me, that only decreases my odds.

But we can add my draft place into the mix -- so if I tried to choose bandages (from last place) but didn't get them, that at least confirms they were taken.  So now scum!ash knows bandages are in the game, doesn't know what they are, and wants to find out who has them by narrowing the pool of possible players through a round claim.

Is that about right?

Man, that seems like a ton of work/risk for a small reward, where in the best case scenario I have a 50/50 chance of knowing who has the bandages (where if there are four scum AND I put bandages in my draft list).

Yeah, that seems worth it.

[ashersky]

Yeah, just looking at the district QT open and close dates and times, the scum QT had to have existed and been open for talk, so I think ADK is wrong.

That's a towntell, or a scum-planned fake towntell.

From the second setup post:

"2. Role Information - At this point, all players will ONLY KNOW THEIR ALIGNMENT. They will not have any information what-so-ever outside of which Faction to which they belong."

So they knew alignment, but not partners (even if they shared a district), and had zero talk on N0?  Sucks to be scum in this setup.

[ashersky]

Yeah, just looking at the district QT open and close dates and times, the scum QT had to have existed and been open for talk, so I think ADK is wrong.

That's a towntell, or a scum-planned fake towntell.

From the second setup post:

"2. Role Information - At this point, all players will ONLY KNOW THEIR ALIGNMENT. They will not have any information what-so-ever outside of which Faction to which they belong."

So they knew alignment, but not partners (even if they shared a district), and had zero talk on N0?  Sucks to be scum in this setup.

If that's true, actually, that's really bad.  I wonder if mods would confirm.

Mods, setup question: if a non-town faction were to normally share a QT in the setup, would they have had normal access to it at some time during N0 before the game started per SOPs of other normal and RMM games?

I guess a mitigating factor would be if scum just have daychat.

[ashersky]

At this point:

1r: WCD, mail-mi, raptor, LL, Glooble, 2.7, Lekkit, Jimmmmmm, ADK
2r: cayvie, ash, MiX, shraeye

13 of 16 claimed so far.  scola, faust, EFHW have not.  If the numbers match the items, one of those three is 1r, the other two are 2r.

Draft order, since it is out there:
Lalight - high up
shraeye - 13
ash - 16

[ashersky]

Also, on re-read, I found a vote count!

So that's all good.