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[schadd]

Vote Count 3.1

The_Wine_Merchant (1): ashersky

Not voting (7): The_Wine_Merchant, Awaclus, EFHW, Joseph2302, mcmcsalot, Roadrunner7671, gkrieg13

With 8 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. Day 3 ends January 25th at 1:00 pm forum time.

[EFHW]

Yea I have always felt the claim pushing is scummy. I need to reread basically the whole game with town!faust in mind before I jump to conclusions but gkriegs first post of the day reads pretty scummy to me. Specifically when comparing ash and gkrieg who both missed deadline, ash is how I expect town to return, quick apology and right down to business, not more disinterest and a lazy push for anti-town behavior.

I don't think that's how my post reads at all.  I said I would reread, and I thought we at least needed to discuss a massclaim.  The points that people have put out have been good ones against it.

I also agree that we should 100% go for a no lynch today.  I understand now that with so much unknown, and the fact that we probably don't have too many letters, a mass claim is not good for today.

It wasn't more disinterest, it was stating that I hoped I would be dead.  Those are two very different things.  I don't think I've been playing super well, and I was hoping that scum would've killed me last night.  I still need to reread how the EoD went yesterday.

Why would they have killed you?

[EFHW]

The strong likelihood of scum also having a roleblocker also means they can claim their role and targets truthfully, unless there is some huge disparity between their expressed reads and the roleblocking.

Doesn't deciding to no lynch now kind of kill the conversation?  It's like giving scum two nk's in a row.

[The_Wine_Merchant]

I read a previous game where no-lynch was discussed, but wasn't followed (can't remember which one), but can't remember the theory behind it. Is it just trying to get numbers to a point where it is more favorable for town?

How does it impact the flow of the game? Does it act like a time-out in a basketball game? Not that this game has been flowing very well for town, so maybe that would be a good thing.

[mcmcsalot]

It definitely quells a bit of discussion because there is no sense of urgency to "use all the time" though we would want to use all the time we have to analyze and then no lynch.

Also the point being we are at 8p,5t/3s and a no lynch gets us to 7p,4t/3s which means our chances of finding scum go up as there are less townies and we get one more night to possibly get a helpful result.

Wait, no lynch might be bad scum can just kill the ub and we are still at the same odds of finding scum except we have no ic. I mean maybe scum doesn't do that and we still have the chances of night results but I'm not sure it's a clear cut good thing to do.

[ashersky]

Mcmc makes a great point.  Townie.

[Joseph2302]

Mcmc makes a great point.  Townie.

Yh I guess that was pretty towny.

Although so far today, ash has suggested a massclaim and a no lunch, both of which seem bad.

Either he's not thinking before posting, or he's being a manipulative scum.

[EFHW]

Although so far today, ash has suggested a massclaim and a no lunch, both of which seem bad.

Either he's not thinking before posting, or he's being a manipulative scum.

ash didn't suggest the massclaim, gkrieg did.

[EFHW]

Mcmc makes a great point.  Townie.

He could easily make that post as scum.

[ashersky]

Mcmc makes a great point.  Townie.

He could easily make that post as scum.

Could say that about any post.

I think no lynch and the attached slow down help scum here -- atypically.  The usual pro town reasons don't apply, and he decided to highlight that.

Basically, with no counter now, Joseph IS an IC.  All townies have the same of finding scum odds now.  No lynch + Joseph kill does nothing.  Better to have Joseph alive for this important day.

[Joseph2302]

Although so far today, ash has suggested a massclaim and a no lunch, both of which seem bad.

Either he's not thinking before posting, or he's being a manipulative scum.

ash didn't suggest the massclaim, gkrieg did.

Oh. My mistake

[Roadrunner7671]

I disagree with Ash here. Someone would've figured that out at one point or another, and mcmc just happened to figure it out first, so he decided to point it out to get town points. Providing factual information isn't towny, it's non-alignment indicative.

[The_Wine_Merchant]

I suggest we do mass claim, but not No Lynch.

[EFHW]

I suggest we do mass claim, but not No Lynch.

What makes you still say yes to massclaim after all the objections that have been raised?

[ashersky]

I suggest we do mass claim, but not No Lynch.

What makes you still say yes to massclaim after all the objections that have been raised?

Probably his scum alignment.

[EFHW]

Mcmc makes a great point.  Townie.

He could easily make that post as scum.

Could say that about any post.

I think no lynch and the attached slow down help scum here -- atypically.  The usual pro town reasons don't apply, and he decided to highlight that.

Basically, with no counter now, Joseph IS an IC.  All townies have the same of finding scum odds now.  No lynch + Joseph kill does nothing.  Better to have Joseph alive for this important day.

I understood why you found it towny.  I'm saying mcmc is capable of constructing that kind of towny post, as RR described well above.

[EFHW]

I suggest we do mass claim, but not No Lynch.

What makes you still say yes to massclaim after all the objections that have been raised?

Probably his scum alignment.

Is that based on anything else?

[Joseph2302]

I suggest we do mass claim, but not No Lynch.

What? This needs an explanation, since it seems to be the worst of both worlds

[The_Wine_Merchant]

I suggest we do mass claim, but not No Lynch.

What? This needs an explanation, since it seems to be the worst of both worlds

Well no lynch is obviously bad. It will just likely result in you dying. So I don't know why you think that would be a good idea.

And I feel like mass claim will at least give us some information to go off. It might not be perfect information, but it will be a good starting point and at this point in the game I feel like we need something substantial to go off. I understand that others might not want it, which is understandable and is why I am not insisting on it.

No lynch seems like it is strictly bad. Mass claim seems like it is both good and bad and since we are getting close to a place of no return, why not put it all out there? We really need a correct lynch today.

[EFHW]

I'm going to back off the gkrieg thing for now.  Knowing Jake was town is helpful.  The town narratives fit gkrieg's posts well enough for doubt to creep in.  I found his second post on me really distorted, but I guess that's understandable given the pressure I was putting him under.

This means mcmc, ashersky and RR are the current question marks for me. I have a town read on TWM and Awaclus's claim would be unlikely from scum.  I keep toying with the idea that the town roleblocker should claim, but we couldn't really trust that anyway, so Awaclus isn't IC but also not a scumread at the moment.

[EFHW]

Just realized that POE (from my perspective) means 3 out of gkrieg, RR, mcmc and ashersky are scum.

[ashersky]

My POE has me at 3 of gkrieg, TWM, RR, and EFHW are scum.

Joseph is IC, I believe Awaclus, and I read mcmc as towniest of the rest of those alive.

Why do you see TWM as town, EFHW?  I'm not seeing a town narrative there.

[EFHW]

I'm interested to hear how other people's POEs sort out.

PPE: ash

[ashersky]

Time for a popsquiz from everyone, I think.

Scummiest to Towniest:

TWM = gkrieg ?= RR >>>>> EFHW >>> mcmcsalot >>> Awaclus ≥ Joseph > ashersky

[EFHW]

My POE has me at 3 of gkrieg, TWM, RR, and EFHW are scum.

Joseph is IC, I believe Awaclus, and I read mcmc as towniest of the rest of those alive.

Why do you see TWM as town, EFHW?  I'm not seeing a town narrative there.

Day 1 especially I thought he had really good points and I think Jake and RR riled him up so much that he seemed scummy Day 2 but was just upset. I don't think newbie scum would try to pull off the back and forth from the end of Day 2. I'm hoping now that Jake is gone we can hear TWM's reads of other players besides him and RR.