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[Roadrunner7671]

But I'm willing to lynch pretty much anyone, not gonna lie. I don't trust my reads

[J Reggie]

Scum talked n1 and decided to be careful. Tread lightly. But then last night they decided to go all out and try to overpower and catch town off guard.

Thanks for the intel!

[SpaceAnemone]

I'm pretty darn scummy on SA and chairs

Both me and Chairs? You seriously think we could both be scum? :-P He's my number one frustration in this game because he's been so evasive and unhelpful!

Let me talk you through my fabulous D2 scum-catching plan, in case that sort of escaped you. With the events of N1, and the two town deaths, we know that scum was coordinating in the night in order to maximise their kills, e.g. by using a weapon like the minigun to mirror damage from their faction damage weapon and other air-strike-like things they may have had in their arsenal.

Now, it's clear that the order of play is really important, because the damage is only mirrored by a minigun if that's fired before the faction weapon, for instance. So my theory is that scums will have felt some pressure to claim their weaponry was used in an order different to what they actually did, especially with the minigun, and especially after Chairs tried to mis-represent it by claiming it as a sort of vig weapon when it most definitely wasn't.

When I first suggested claiming actions and turn order, I was really careful not to talk about the bids. That was because because I didn't want to give away to the scums that the order they claimed was something we could then verify. When I started the verification process after people had claimed the turn order, you'll notice that the main scum candidates got uncomfortable and uncooperative with continuing to talk about claims and bids. Notice there is no need to be protective of a used-up bid number unless someone's got reason to hide because they lied about their place in the turn order. And why would they lie about that if they don't have something scummy to hide?

It would have been best if we'd been able to analyse everything from N1 while it was till D2, because now it's D3 the scums have had another chance to talk, and may have straightened things out between them, talked about bids etc. They'll almost certainly not risk claiming out of turn for N2 actions now they realise it's possible to get caught out. That's why I want to go back to the N1 actions and pin the to their already-claimed order, and that's specifically why I want to start with Chairs.

Does that make sense to you if I lay it out like that? This question is mostly for RR, but I have a feeling there's some hesitance from town about this plan too, which is really stumping me.

[schadd]

alright, let's go let's go
i was second in the turn order. i used cluster bomb on chairs, which deals 30 damage to someone and 15 to the people before and after them in turn order. it hit


i nominate chairs to go next.
will hammer chairs, but sticking on e. they're both scum, it looks like; calling e/chairs/rr (d2 claim was still barf, all things considered, e defended it)/ss (not voting yesterday, and the other one of those, haddock, has been more active/transparent, in spite of a switcheroo)

[J Reggie]

Who claimed to not have done anything N1? Was it haddock?

[Roadrunner7671]

I'm pretty darn scummy on SA and chairs

Both me and Chairs? You seriously think we could both be scum? :-P He's my number one frustration in this game because he's been so evasive and unhelpful!

Let me talk you through my fabulous D2 scum-catching plan, in case that sort of escaped you. With the events of N1, and the two town deaths, we know that scum was coordinating in the night in order to maximise their kills, e.g. by using a weapon like the minigun to mirror damage from their faction damage weapon and other air-strike-like things they may have had in their arsenal.

Now, it's clear that the order of play is really important, because the damage is only mirrored by a minigun if that's fired before the faction weapon, for instance. So my theory is that scums will have felt some pressure to claim their weaponry was used in an order different to what they actually did, especially with the minigun, and especially after Chairs tried to mis-represent it by claiming it as a sort of vig weapon when it most definitely wasn't.

When I first suggested claiming actions and turn order, I was really careful not to talk about the bids. That was because because I didn't want to give away to the scums that the order they claimed was something we could then verify. When I started the verification process after people had claimed the turn order, you'll notice that the main scum candidates got uncomfortable and uncooperative with continuing to talk about claims and bids. Notice there is no need to be protective of a used-up bid number unless someone's got reason to hide because they lied about their place in the turn order. And why would they lie about that if they don't have something scummy to hide?

It would have been best if we'd been able to analyse everything from N1 while it was till D2, because now it's D3 the scums have had another chance to talk, and may have straightened things out between them, talked about bids etc. They'll almost certainly not risk claiming out of turn for N2 actions now they realise it's possible to get caught out. That's why I want to go back to the N1 actions and pin the to their already-claimed order, and that's specifically why I want to start with Chairs.

Does that make sense to you if I lay it out like that? This question is mostly for RR, but I have a feeling there's some hesitance from town about this plan too, which is really stumping me.

No. I'm sorry, that just makes virtually no sense to me. If you're town then you have good intentions, but I just don't see what you see

[Roadrunner7671]

Who claimed to not have done anything N1? Was it haddock?

Might've been me? I effectively did nothing

[chairs]

Feeling towny on e.

vote: SA.

I don't bid for my position, I just pick one, which I -thought- I mentioned yesterDay.

[silverspawn]

Who claimed to not have done anything N1? Was it haddock?

*raises hand*

[2.71828.....]

I just went through and reread SpaceAnemone and I don't think I would be in favor of lynching them today.  They have a lot of content that I disagree with, and some stuff that I would say is scummy, but overall I think there is primarily a difference in attitude on how to approach this setup/game.

Space is very much about "solving" the setup and using it to our advantage to find scum. 

I am very much of the opinion that town should be trusted to do what they need to do to catch scum without attempting to reveal too much (if any) information until later in the game when I think we are more likely going to have a clearer picture of things and be able to use that information better.

While I disagree with SpaceAnemone about the method of going about playing this setup, space has been one thing for sure: consistent.  From the very beginning space was reading the setup, doing everything possible to figure out how town could best manipulate and use it to their advantage.  Coming from my perspective of much more of a "wait and see" mentality, ready to pounce on scum on D3/D4 using the information gained throughout the game, SA just came across scummy.  However, reading them I think we mostly just disagree.  Either way, I like giving SA a D3 pass.  I am much more interested in lynching from {schadd, J Reggie, Haddock} today and see what happens ifwhen one of them flips scum.  I think we give space some more time and see if they are still around as a scum candidate on D5/D6.  Who knows.

Mod edit: pronouns fixed.

[2.71828.....]

I also just really enjoy the argument and being contrary sometimes, and I feel like that was my primary method of engagement D2.  To no success.  I might try to switch it up a bit today.

[J Reggie]

Boo pronouns

[2.71828.....]

Boo pronouns

oops.  I was just typing, realized I had messed up a couple places and fixed it, but guess I didn't catch everything

[2.71828.....]

vote: J Reggie

[2.71828.....]

His D1 was full of overcautious posts about him getting lynched and him getting NKed, his opening of D2 was the quick vote then the unvote that I think is super scummy.

I still want to hear about his plan to IC himself and see how well it worked.

[mail-mi]

I'm towny on Silverspawn.

I'm only a little scummy on schadd, J Reggie and 2.7.

I'm reasonably scummy on Haddock

I'm pretty darn scummy on SA and chairs

So it's like: SA < chairs << Haddock <<<< 2.7 << J Reggie = schadd <<<< SS

*cries*

[2.71828.....]

I'm towny on Silverspawn.

I'm only a little scummy on schadd, J Reggie and 2.7.

I'm reasonably scummy on Haddock

I'm pretty darn scummy on SA and chairs

So it's like: SA < chairs << Haddock <<<< 2.7 << J Reggie = schadd <<<< SS

*cries*

Its ok, I remembered you.  I also left you out of my two little groups.....

[Roadrunner7671]

I'm towny on Silverspawn.

I'm only a little scummy on schadd, J Reggie and 2.7.

I'm reasonably scummy on Haddock

I'm pretty darn scummy on SA and chairs

So it's like: SA < chairs << Haddock <<<< 2.7 << J Reggie = schadd <<<< SS

*cries*

What, are my reads that bad?

[2.71828.....]

I'm towny on Silverspawn.

I'm only a little scummy on schadd, J Reggie and 2.7.

I'm reasonably scummy on Haddock

I'm pretty darn scummy on SA and chairs

So it's like: SA < chairs << Haddock <<<< 2.7 << J Reggie = schadd <<<< SS

*cries*

What, are my reads that bad?

no, you forgot to include mail-mi

[SpaceAnemone]

I'm towny on Silverspawn.

I'm only a little scummy on schadd, J Reggie and 2.7.

I'm reasonably scummy on Haddock

I'm pretty darn scummy on SA and chairs

So it's like: SA < chairs << Haddock <<<< 2.7 << J Reggie = schadd <<<< SS

*cries*

What, are my reads that bad?

no, you forgot to include mail-mi

The reads are at least moderately bad in some cases, too!

[Haddock]

Who claimed to not have done anything N1? Was it haddock?

Lots of people.  Me included, I did nothing N1.

I do think today is a great day for some reads lists. I am really seeing this game form two groups. A [silverspawn, chairs, RR, e] and [SpaceAnemone, J Reggie, schadd, haddock] groups. Mail-mi is just kind of there in the middle. The swing vote, of you will. I think scum are almost entirely (not sure, mail-mi could be scum I guess) in that second group.

Translation:
Everyone who disagrees with me is scum, everyone who agrees with me is town.

Yeuch.  My townread on e is starting to dissolve. 

[2.71828.....]

We can't let this day go to crap like all the others. Basically, people need to post more. We need claims (if they are going to happen) to happen early. We need wagons to form early.

So we can discuss and figure things out. We can't wait for the last 24 hours of day to do anything

[J Reggie]

Or in your case until a minute after the deadline.

[J Reggie]

Ok, here's a claim order:

e
chairs
RR
  s c h a d d
Mail-mi
Haddock
ss
   s p a c e a n e m o n e
 J r e g g i e

[J Reggie]

Please disregard the spaces between letters.