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[pingpongsam]

This is sad. If you're so pessimistic about the game why are you playing?

I think he just got burned the last few times because of his party style so he is playing differently to avoid that this game. Doesn't mean he should stop playing.

This. I'm still playing just not how I typically do. You can kill me now but if you don't you'll see more activity as the game progresses.  I'm typically way more inclined to get the spotlight and hold it because it controls games and if you're not controlling it then someone else is. I'm happy to let D1 play out however it will and work with what is left. Also, I do think Joseph is a better lynch than say, ADK or Awaclus but not much better than anyone else. It's always fun to lynch Haddock but if we're going to do that then I am going to hammer him. I want to hear his sweet wails before I kick the chair out from under him.

[iguanaiguana]

This is a bad defense, because it's too defensive and feels too much pressure against what's just a simple vote in a reads list.

Do you know what this feels like to me? Most likely you do not. Do you want to know? Who am I even talking to? Anyway, it feels like iguanda came into this like "yeah, I'm going to be the towniest scum ever and make it until the end, let's goooo" and now he's like "wait I should be super towny, and that guy suspects me? Let's shoot it down in its roots!"

I feel like you are reading my attitude differently here than what I was feeling when I was typing it.

e's read on me was so ridiculously obviously fabricated that I responded to it with incredulity. And it's not so much that no one could ever feel that way, it's that the way in which e is playing this game is obviously and markedly different than the way that e normally plays.

If it had been anyone else, I wouldn't have responded the way I did. But because it was e, and because I felt so confident that the read on me was fabricated and coming from scum, I felt the desire to unravel the logic behind it as best I could.

You do have one thing right, though. I play every game to win, and I am fighting this day out as hard as I possibly can.

[EgorK]

Vote: iguana

Sheeping silver here, he has good argument

[iguanaiguana]

silverspawn, e, EgorK scumteam 

[iguanaiguana]

Go ahead and kill me now, my work here is done.

[A Drowned Kernel]

Uh, would lynch: joseph, iguana, silver, gkrieg, yeah let's say seprix
Wouldn't lynch: reggie, haddock, e
Is in this game? PPS, chairs, awaclus, egork

[gkrieg13]

Uh, would lynch: joseph, iguana, silver, gkrieg, yeah let's say seprix
Wouldn't lynch: reggie, haddock, e
Is in this game? PPS, chairs, awaclus, egork

Why no e Lynch?

[A Drowned Kernel]

Not feeling it.

[Seprix]

I want to hear his sweet wails before I kick the chair out from under him.

Welcome to the spotlight.

Uh, would lynch: joseph, iguana, silver, gkrieg, yeah let's say seprix
Wouldn't lynch: reggie, haddock, e
Is in this game? PPS, chairs, awaclus, egork

Why on earth would you want to lynch me D1? Joseph is not a good D1 lynch. Silver is a fine lynch, but I don't think he warrants a D1, I think it's down to e versus Iguana.

And why not e? Is it because you think I'm scum now because of one thing I said? Look at my body of work, dude. I'm probably going to die N1 if anything.

Not feeling it.

Well, can we at least agree on a Iguana lynch then? I'll do it, though I want to go on record to say that I much prefer e, and I'm not sold on the Iguana case, especially since e pretty much said whatever to try and squirm out of death. He gave everyone but me poor marks, and he only gave me good marks because of the perception people have of me at that moment.

[Seprix]

The Iguana case for me is basically this: Iguana reacted to the crazy stuff e was saying, and then people didn't like that he talked about it too much, though that's what Iguana does usually in mafia.

[A Drowned Kernel]

I want to hear his sweet wails before I kick the chair out from under him.

Welcome to the spotlight.

Uh, would lynch: joseph, iguana, silver, gkrieg, yeah let's say seprix
Wouldn't lynch: reggie, haddock, e
Is in this game? PPS, chairs, awaclus, egork

Why on earth would you want to lynch me D1? Joseph is not a good D1 lynch. Silver is a fine lynch, but I don't think he warrants a D1, I think it's down to e versus Iguana.

And why not e? Is it because you think I'm scum now because of one thing I said? Look at my body of work, dude. I'm probably going to die N1 if anything.

Not feeling it.

Well, can we at least agree on a Iguana lynch then? I'll do it, though I want to go on record to say that I much prefer e, and I'm not sold on the Iguana case, especially since e pretty much said whatever to try and squirm out of death. He gave everyone but me poor marks, and he only gave me good marks because of the perception people have of me at that moment.

I'm very eh on how based on meta most of your positions are. Why wouldn't I want to lynch you day one, if I think you're scum? I liked e's response to pressure with his reads list, maybe he's worth reevaulting later but I don't want to lynch him today. And I don't like that you're framing today as if we have to lynch either e or iguana, it's still early and there are lots of options.

[Seprix]

I didn't say it was down to e and Iguana, I said I think it was down to that. Things happen. Someone might say something incredibly dumb. Who knows. As it currently stands, those are the main two options for me.

[Haddock]

Iguana is trying to play like Awaclus (I don't know why), and sometimes he forgets and reverts to his normal playstyle, i.e. the huge argument trying to prove e wrong. That could potentially be revealing, as that written accusation by e (who was L-2 at the time) really cut deep into II's psyche. I don't think it's too much to read into until later on though. Seriously, can we get to the e lynch?

Actually seprix might not be town. This post is weird. "Here's why ii might be scum! But we can look at that later, Lynch e now."

I don't think this avenue is worth pursuing.  I don't think there's anything in Seprix's post there other than Seprix's best attempt at a helpful answer to my queries about II.  And I think it's a pretty good answer.

Even if we were to suppose that this was a scummy post from Seprix, it would be his first, basically.  Not nearly enough to make his lynch worth looking at today.  Not by a long shot.

I am like really surprised I have any votes on me. I feel I'm the towniest I've been in a while

My promised reread of you is coming up in a minute. 

I'm surprised so many people are still voting for Joseph. I thought we had determined he was probably town.

This.  All of this.   Joseph and Seprix are my two firmest townreads at the moment.  Seprix more so than Joseph, but still.

I'm surprised so many people are still voting for Joseph. I thought we had determined he was probably town.

No, we determined (and he admitted it) that he is definitely scum.

Sigh.  Move your vote, buddy.  I think you're wrong here.

It's always fun to lynch Haddock but if we're going to do that then I am going to hammer him. I want to hear his sweet wails before I kick the chair out from under him.

Wow.  Man.  That, just, wow. 

If we're being totally strict about our interpretations, I have to mention - noone actually knows whether or not it's fun to lynch me.  But I concede that you might well find it fun to vote for me a ton until I make some classic Haddock-style WTF-rant.  Please don't do that though.

PPE several.

[A Drowned Kernel]

Iguana is trying to play like Awaclus (I don't know why), and sometimes he forgets and reverts to his normal playstyle, i.e. the huge argument trying to prove e wrong. That could potentially be revealing, as that written accusation by e (who was L-2 at the time) really cut deep into II's psyche. I don't think it's too much to read into until later on though. Seriously, can we get to the e lynch?

Actually seprix might not be town. This post is weird. "Here's why ii might be scum! But we can look at that later, Lynch e now."

I don't think this avenue is worth pursuing.

I mean the more push-back I get against suspicion on Seprix the more I'll want to pursue it.

[Seprix]

Iguana is trying to play like Awaclus (I don't know why), and sometimes he forgets and reverts to his normal playstyle, i.e. the huge argument trying to prove e wrong. That could potentially be revealing, as that written accusation by e (who was L-2 at the time) really cut deep into II's psyche. I don't think it's too much to read into until later on though. Seriously, can we get to the e lynch?

Actually seprix might not be town. This post is weird. "Here's why ii might be scum! But we can look at that later, Lynch e now."

I don't think this avenue is worth pursuing.

I mean the more push-back I get against suspicion on Seprix the more I'll want to pursue it.

I welcome it. Whatever continues the game.

[Haddock]

gkrieg reread.

vote: ss

Clearly scummy

Disagree.

Totally RVS, I'll look at this game later

I've already commented on this I guess, but I think ADK is weird for making anything of this.  It's a clear RVS from gkrieg, not anything to make a fuss about.  And ADK already finds ss towny?  The hell?  Anyway.

OK I still don't like this post, no matter how much I read it:

So I popped in the thread earlier to see what people were saying, but I was busy with Mother's Day stuff, so instead I just plopped down an RVS vote on the first person I noticed when scrolling through the page, and that happened to be ss.

Anyway, on a different note, I'm surprised two people voted me for that.

JReggie seems townie, II seems aggressive, which I think is a town tell for him.

Awaclus is Awaclus

The self-vote from Joseph seems to be the strangest thing.  I don't know what it says about him though.  I'm not sure I've played a game where he has been scum before though, so I think I will let it be for now.

ss seems like he is trying to move the game along anyway.

but then I just saw this, which I really sympathise with:

Kind of a gut feeling? Like you had some pressure on you and felt compelled to make a big townie post.

More like I had only made one post in the game thus far so I felt like catching up

I'm very familiar with the feeling that you're behind so need to contribute a bunch even if that means forcing yourself to make conclusions you wouldn't otherwise make.

vote: Joseph

This is, and always will be, a bad vote.

So it's L-1.

vote: Reggie

You may have miscounted, or maybe you haven't. Either way, this vote stays on until you back down.

What is this even supposed to mean?  He's on a great wagon!  A great L-1 too!

No, it's a terrible wagon. Joseph is the easiest target in the world.

I haven't read that many of his games. Is he always like this? It just seems like he's trying to distract from actual scumhunting.

Ppe

I agree with you here. It seems like he is trying to push us back into RVS.

This is a town!gkrieg kinda post.  town!gkrieg really really likes to get past RVS in my experience and it's normal for him to call people out for appearing to try to pull the game back to RVS.  I've been on the receiving end of that before.
scum!gkrieg is certainly aware of this aspect of his town meta.  Maybe that's a stretch though.

vote: Joseph

OK, the fakehammer.  I don't think scum!gkrieg does this.  Somehow I totally missed that it was him that had done it.  I mean, WIFOM WIFOM etc.  But that's an even bigger stretch.

I am like really surprised I have any votes on me. I feel I'm the towniest I've been in a while

Don't like this much.


That's it really.  Blah.  My gut is still saying something.  But no.  Gotta kick my gut in the gut here. 


 tl;dr: Don't know what I was thinking. unvote

PPE.

[Haddock]

I'm so tempted by an ADK vote right now.  But then I'm fully conscious that it would be motivated pretty much entirely by how strongly I disagree with him about Seprix.  So I'll reread him first.  But even before that, bed.

[Haddock]

(Reread ADK, that is.)

Night all!

[A Drowned Kernel]

Oh yeah, the fakehammer. gkrieg's off my lynch table today.

[Seprix]

I don't really agree with ADK, but disagreement =/= scum tell. (unless I'm Awaclus)

[Seprix]

Chairs and Awaclus: What do you think about all of this?

[A Drowned Kernel]

Chairs and Awaclus: What do you think about all of this?

I admire your optimism.

[iguanaiguana]

Oh my goodness, the scum is e; e is the scum. it's e, let's lynch e c'mon guys e

[iguanaiguana]

Look, I don't have a ton of time to break down his argument right now so I'm just going to do what I can in 5-10 minute and call it good. This is one of the scummiest paragraphs in his defense:

It is the sort of thing that people will vote for someone for doing.  And gkrieg pulled me in and got me.  The question becomes, did he get scum in his nice little trap?  No.  I think if you look at a vast majority of mafia games you will find that it is town, not scum, who fall into these sorts of "traps" way more often than scum.  And get mislynched for it.  Time and time again.  No, I am not going to go through and find historical data for such broad and sweeping claims, but it is the case.  Do scum get caught?  Sure, happens.  But are they more careful and less prone to an emotional knee-jerk reactionary vote?  Yes.  (for me at least)

It's full of phrases that e does NOT use as town to defend himself. "nice little trap." Putting 'traps' into quotation marks. The completely unnecessary "Time and time again" phrase. This paragraph and others from his defense are chock full of pathos and rhetoric because he has no evidence to prove he is town, and is therefore forced to fabricate things.

Add to that the fact that his argument against me is just the reverse of what I'm accusing him of, turning things around to say that I'm voting for him opportunistically, and that basically his defense of himself is just quoting silverspawn and saying "Yeah, it's definitely what silverspawn said."

Excuse my French, but how can anyone possibly be falling for this steaming heap of country pancakes?

[Seprix]

isn't voting based off of a fake hammer a knee-jerk reactionary vote? :p