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[yuma]

And again I feel like I should throw in words like "invented" and "modified" as we have already seen some of that...

We shouldn't rely on that but should take it into consideration that we may not know of a possible explanation because there has never been one like that before, so ultimately I need to go back to my reads of how the scenario played out, reactions, etc and that leads me to wanting to kynch elsewhere and see how the two players and their roles play out over a longer sample size with hopefully more information coming in from other areas...

I'm coming around to this way of thinking as well. I don't like it though.

Well sure. I mean it would have been nice to get a solid result out of two people claiming and get a higher % of being scum lynch....

But it isn't like we are at mylo right now. We have time to work through some of this and get more information while we are at it...

[Haddock]

I'm torn between faust and e here.

But e has seemed townier lately.

I don't want to vote faust without counting up votes first.

[yuma]

Let's try

Vote: e

I would be loathe to lynch 2.7. If he is mafia then he has been the "let's make good solid sense and be townie" approach, which is a legitimate approach to take. But if he is town then we are eliminating a player who I think has approached the game really well thus far this game (many of his reads and thoughts have correlated almost exactly with mine, but he has been able to express those ideas better than me and convince others better than me)

[Teproc]

I'm torn between faust and e here.

But e has seemed townier lately.

I don't want to vote faust without counting up votes first.

If my count is correct, no one has more than one vote on them (faust has Ampharos).

@yuma : I disagree so much, both on e in particular and in principle. Because I don't think e has been all that great, he has simply agreed with you a lot. That's not alignment-indicative. The equivalent for me is Haddock, and that makes me suspect him more rather than less.

I think I'll vote: Egork

[yuma]

@yuma : I disagree so much, both on e in particular and in principle. Because I don't think e has been all that great, he has simply agreed with you a lot. That's not alignment-indicative. The equivalent for me is Haddock, and that makes me suspect him more rather than less.

I think I'll vote: Egork

Well, agreeing with me is a good way to go. And often it has been me agreeing with him.

And sure I can go for that... vote: EgorK

[EgorK]

What's the case on me?

Anyway, if both faust and WW are telling truth, I do not see how Hydrad is town. Vote: Hydrad

[Teproc]

What's the case on me?

Anyway, if both faust and WW are telling truth, I do not see how Hydrad is town. Vote: Hydrad

The case on you is PoE and general scumminess (I'll dig up my D1 case at some point)...

I don't follow your Hydrad logic.

[EgorK]

What's the case on me?

Anyway, if both faust and WW are telling truth, I do not see how Hydrad is town. Vote: Hydrad

The case on you is PoE and general scumminess (I'll dig up my D1 case at some point)...

I don't follow your Hydrad logic.

I do not see any town redirecting role, and scum redirection would target scum as one of targets, otherwise it does not make sense

[Teproc]

What's the case on me?

Anyway, if both faust and WW are telling truth, I do not see how Hydrad is town. Vote: Hydrad

The case on you is PoE and general scumminess (I'll dig up my D1 case at some point)...

I don't follow your Hydrad logic.

I do not see any town redirecting role, and scum redirection would target scum as one of targets, otherwise it does not make sense

If I'm understand this right, you're assuming
1) there was redirection
2) WW's action got redirected from Hydrad to silverspawn

I suppose 1 is covered by "if they're both town", so ok, but : why are your rejecting the possibility that faust's action was redirected from Witherweaver to scum performing the kill ? That also explains the situation in the scenario where they're both scum, and doesn't make Hydrad scum.

[faust]

WW's action cannot have been redirected to silverspawn or else WW would have seen the kill. (Unless that was Ninja also. Which would be hilarious.)

[faust]

I'm torn between faust and e here.

But e has seemed townier lately.

I don't want to vote faust without counting up votes first.

How am I scum?

[Haddock]

I found you mildly scummy before.  And now with the claims I find WW's slightly more believable.
The only reason I'm torn is the redirect possibilities.  I will keep thinking.

[Witherweaver]

WW's action cannot have been redirected to silverspawn or else WW would have seen the kill. (Unless that was Ninja also. Which would be hilarious.)

Yeah, I guess this debunks (modulo ninja) the Nexus!Hydrad theory. 

[faust]

I found you mildly scummy before.  And now with the claims I find WW's slightly more believable.
The only reason I'm torn is the redirect possibilities.  I will keep thinking.

Why would scum!me make that claim?

[EgorK]

Teproc, faust, you are probably right. This game is just a bit too crazy. Probably time to do a read list. unvote

[Haddock]

I found you mildly scummy before.  And now with the claims I find WW's slightly more believable.
The only reason I'm torn is the redirect possibilities.  I will keep thinking.

Why would scum!me make that claim?

"Cop me! (I'm a godfather!)".

I'm aware that's not a fair comparison.
But there could be all kinds of reasons.

I'm probably more inclined to vote elsewhere though.

[Roadrunner7671]

This is very complicated.

I will let Teproc, Faust and WW figure this out, unless someone needs me for something.

[2.71828.....]

This is very complicated.

I will let Teproc, Faust and WW figure this out, unless someone needs me for something.

I need you to tell me who you think is scum that is not named faust or WW

[faust]

I found you mildly scummy before.  And now with the claims I find WW's slightly more believable.
The only reason I'm torn is the redirect possibilities.  I will keep thinking.

Why would scum!me make that claim?

"Cop me! (I'm a godfather!)".

I'm aware that's not a fair comparison.
But there could be all kinds of reasons.

I'm probably more inclined to vote elsewhere though.

There are all kinds of reasons, yet you conveniently fail to name any of them...

[Roadrunner7671]

This is very complicated.

I will let Teproc, Faust and WW figure this out, unless someone needs me for something.

I need you to tell me who you think is scum that is not named faust or WW

My reads are so bad, but I still think Amaphoros.

[Haddock]

There are all kinds of reasons, yet you conveniently fail to name any of them...

Huh?
I'm saying there could be all kinds of reasons why scum!you would claim like you did.  They would depend on the exact nature of your scumness. 
I'm saying it's possible.  And something rings funny.

This is WIFOM anyway - the most obvious reason for you to claim how you did is precisely so that you can make this defense.

I need to reread here.  but vote: e for now.

[Teproc]

This is very complicated.

I will let Teproc, Faust and WW figure this out, unless someone needs me for something.

It is, but you really should try to figure it out for yourself. Basically it comes down to how you read faust and WW in the end, and the circumstances of their claim.

[Hydrad]

Oh man things are happening. At work and reading a bit. In 4 hours I'll be home!

[ashersky]

Vote Count 2.6:

2.7 (3): faust, WW, Haddock
Ampharos (1): Hydrad
WW (1): Ampharos
egork (2): Teproc, yuma
Hydrad (1): EgorK

Not Voting (3): 2.7, RR, iguana

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.

Day Two ends at 3:00 a.m. on December 19.

[iguanaiguana]

Vote: EgorK