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[xeiron]

Question for the group, especially the tvt crowd:

If you were allowed to lynch anybody (not just ash or volt), who would you be voting for and why?

I'd like to get some things on record before end of day.

I'll say faust, mostly because I didn't like his vote on me earlier, his reasons for it, or his subsequent backpedalling from those reasons.

I would probably go for faust as well. He does not feel quite right.

[faust]

@jotheonah: If I'm free to lynch anyone, it would probably be someone in the lurking area, like Archetype or Walrus.

Concerning Voltaire, I wanted to add that the claim that his role is compulsive D1 and only D1 doesn't sit right with me. As in, from a game design perspective, why would you do that?

[Voltaire]

Concerning Voltaire, I wanted to add that the claim that his role is compulsive D1 and only D1 doesn't sit right with me. As in, from a game design perspective, why would you do that?

You'll have to ask yuma post-game, I'm assuming there's something in the setup overall where it makes sense. Also, if I win this challenge, the role disappears, so it's not like it was "compulsive only D1," it's just gone.

[xeiron]

So you think gladiator is a better/more important role than redirector?
Why do you think so?

Non-compulsive Gladiator with role inheritance means we can mislynch a PR and still have that PR around. Redirector who can't redirect kills does nothing for town, as ashersky already stated.

I guess I should say, there's something that makes ash's claim more believable to me, but I do not want to reveal it at this point.

That is a good point about the Gladiator. It can actually be a quite useful role that way.

[EFHW]

Question for the group, especially the tvt crowd:

If you were allowed to lynch anybody (not just ash or volt), who would you be voting for and why?

This is based on feelings, I can't back it up.  I'd say Eevee or faust.

[EFHW]

Since the day could conceivably end soon, I want to mention that there is a passive part of my role that can have some negative utility to town if I am targeted by town overnight.

[Voltaire]

Mmmm. Mm.

[WalrusMcFishSr]

Hey guys there is a terrible flu going around and I've got it. Struggling through work and I may spend much of the weekend asleep. But I'll post when I have the inclination.

Ok so:

TvT would obviously suck, and probably that's the most likely thing by raw probability. But of course I had scumreads on both of them before, and then there's the question about how the roles fit, and so forth.

So I'm feeling SvT I guess. SvS would be a hell of a thing wouldn't it? I'd have to applaud their gumption, and I wouldn't put it past scum!ash at least. But I think improbable.

After a quick reread I think I'm still leaning towards scum!Volt. His style does seem off, and I agree with others that it seems like he should have approached this in a more pro-town manner. And yeah, why go for stealing the professed anti-town role? Did he just think ash would be a viable mislynch, with a known rivalry? Couple this with his (as I see it) unusual behavior, and something doesn't add up for me.

Idk about ash. The fact that he claimed so early is still feeling scummy to me, as I do not wish to be wish to be hornswaggled again a la Time War. Since the challenge, some of his posts have had sort of an AtE feel to them...but I would have expected scum!ash to get more angry and hostile. He's defending himself of course, but here he just seems kind of sad and disappointed and hopeful he will live. It seems townier and more genuine to me.

The flavors do make sense to me. The vertigo thing in particular is hilarious.

Here's something that I found a little curious though: this is a 9p game. yuma mentions in the OP that there may be mechanics to make the game longer than we expect. Is this one of those mechanics though? Seems like it's speeding the game along, *especially* if the gladiator is a scum power. Maybe that makes me think this is more likely TvT, or scum!ash. Bah.

I was just wondering whether we should be discussing other people. Interesting how the gladiator role has the effect of narrowing the spotlight so sharply. I too have a bad feeling about faust that's not going away. And Arch is still lurking along. But obviously my focus has been elsewhere.

[ashersky]

Want to mention it is the weekend here so I have less access until Monday.  I will keep up over the weekend, though.

I think the only question specifically for me was from Faust, asking why I claimed.

As mentioned, I really feel it was important to neutralize the misdirection mechanics built into the game when possibly, as they are not helpful for town.  My role was particularly anti-town, so I figured there must be strong town roles I would counter.  I don't want to.

I understand the point that I could have made these statements without claiming, but I think there would have been some suspicion of me that way, too.  It could look like scum role fishing for example.

I decided admitting to the anti-town role was the best method.


@EFHW, alignment switching would have been bastard, I meant.  Role stealing by itself isn't.  Role stealing is sort of universal backup-ish.


I was voting Voltaire before the challenge, which I find interesting.  As to joth's question, I'd probably be looking at joth, and then the quiet ones.

[yuma]

Vote Count 1.5

Voltaire (4): ashersky, Eevee, jotheonah, faust
ashersky (3): Voltaire, EFHW, xeiron

Not Voting (2): Walrus, Arch

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch.

The deadline for Day1 is 8 days. Day1 will end on Tuesday February 4 at 7:30 pm forum time.

[ashersky]

unvote

Don't like having an L-1 right now.  We've got time and things to discuss.

[faust]

Since the day could conceivably end soon, I want to mention that there is a passive part of my role that can have some negative utility to town if I am targeted by town overnight.

This reads scummy to me. I encourages town not to target you, and then, if you get targeted with an incriminating result, you can just say "The action got redirected"/"I am a Miller"/something else. Now it might be true of course, but I think in that case we'd be better of if you just claimed what negative utility you have.

[faust]

Also, what's with everyone stating "I have a bad feeling about faust"? You mean just because it's not possible to vote for me today, it's okay to throw around baseless suspicion on me? Well, it isn't. If you think I'm scummy, go and point out why, so I have a possibility to respond.

[EFHW]

Since the day could conceivably end soon, I want to mention that there is a passive part of my role that can have some negative utility to town if I am targeted by town overnight.

This reads scummy to me. I encourages town not to target you, and then, if you get targeted with an incriminating result, you can just say "The action got redirected"/"I am a Miller"/something else. Now it might be true of course, but I think in that case we'd be better of if you just claimed what negative utility you have.

It's scummy unless it's true, which it is.  It's really ideally left as is, I can't add anything that would make it provable or useful.  It's just a head's up to town, and if I do those other things then you can say I'm scum.

[jotheonah]

Also, what's with everyone stating "I have a bad feeling about faust"? You mean just because it's not possible to vote for me today, it's okay to throw around baseless suspicion on me? Well, it isn't. If you think I'm scummy, go and point out why, so I have a possibility to respond.

I did point out why.

[pingpongsam]

Peering about with beady eyes

[Archetype]

I could probably go for Faust or X. But Xeiron can be really valuable later in these RMM games.

[Archetype]

Voltaire not picking a different target is really the only thing that's stopping me from voting for ashersky. However, after thinking about it a lot more I'm going to vote for ash.

Here's why:

- Scummy behavior: Since he claimed negative utility I've had a scumread on him. His claim seemed totally truthful, but that doesn't make him Town.

- Least Likely to Flip Scum: Power-wise, of course. I find it very unlikely that Yuma would make a Gladiator scum in this small of a game. Based on my power, I also think Voltaire is more likely to be Town.

- Inheritence Business: Goes along with the last one. I'm pretty sure Voltaire is Town and wouldn't use the power. Ash getting Gladiator wouldn't really do anything.

So I'm ready to vote, but will hold off for discussion.

[EFHW]

Unless someone else changes their mind, looks like it's on Walrus to decide.  An unenviable position!  (unless you are scum, I guess)

[WalrusMcFishSr]

Aw jeez. I'm in no condition health-wise for this level of responsibility!

I'll look at this more tomorrow when I'm hopefully less dilirious.

[xeiron]

Also, what's with everyone stating "I have a bad feeling about faust"? You mean just because it's not possible to vote for me today, it's okay to throw around baseless suspicion on me? Well, it isn't. If you think I'm scummy, go and point out why, so I have a possibility to respond.

It is only a feeling,baseless sucpicion if you want, not a case.
There is not really much point out for you to respond on. And you do not really have to respond as you will not be lynched today.

I think it is very interesting that I am not the only one with that bad feeling about you.

[Voltaire]

Aw jeez. I'm in no condition health-wise for this level of responsibility!

I'll look at this more tomorrow when I'm hopefully less dilirious.

If you have any questions/issues please please please give me a chance to address them before voting.

[WalrusMcFishSr]

Well I'm alive at least. Barely.

I was leaning towards Voltaire before. But the more I think about it, the more I doubt myself. Honestly, the more it looks like TvT, which is annoying.

Volt's behavior seemed weird to me at the beginning, but on a reread it seems understandable given that he had this weird, game-warping thing to reveal. His semi-desperate, "please don't lynch me" attitude since the claim reminds me of when it came down to me vs. him in Game of Thrones, when both of us were town.

Here's a question for you Volt: I still don't understand why you didn't claim and allow the target to be decided democratically. Using your power in this fashion is akin to a vig or SK, I guess, in that it allows a single player to influence who dies in a serious way. Did you think your judgment was better without collective input?

I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around the idea of a compulsive gladiator as a scum role. It doesn't exactly make sense as a town role either, but it makes *more* sense--it just seems so weird if scum were forced to be out in the open like that, especially in a game of this size.

ash's claim at the beginning still doesn't sit right with me. I think his behavior has been towny but with ash it's hard to tell. So I hope I'm not being forced to choose between one mislynch or another.

faust, to answer your question it's mostly just a gut feeling, as others have said. My attention has been elsewhere obviously as you are not a lynch candidate today, so you'll get more focused rereads later. If I had to pin it down I'd say that in previous games I suspected you for being more talkative than I expected at the beginning of the game, and you turned out as town, but now you are quieter than I expected, so I suspect you based on updated Bayesian reasoning.

I will think and sleep more before I vote. My brain is still pretty foggy. It's kind of weird being the tiebreaker here, almost as if I were the third party targeted by the gladiator event.

[ashersky]

I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around the idea of a compulsive gladiator as a scum role. It doesn't exactly make sense as a town role either, but it makes *more* sense--it just seems so weird if scum were forced to be out in the open like that, especially in a game of this size.

I've mentioned before, but if you are going to have a scum gladiator, it basically must be compulsive, or scum just won't use the power.  If you check out LOTR2, you'll see it in use there (compulsive once on D1 or D2, non-compulsive after that).  It's basically how Voltaire's role sounds now, almost a copy.  So it's very possible that he's a scum gladiator (from a setup perspective, at least).

[ashersky]

ash's claim at the beginning still doesn't sit right with me. I think his behavior has been towny but with ash it's hard to tell. So I hope I'm not being forced to choose between one mislynch or another.

A few people have said this, that my early claim is off-putting.  I get that I just recently did this as scum, and that would definitely affect how folks view the claim.

I actually think Voltaire's actions without claim is the perfect support for why I claimed the way I did.  I have an anti-town power; I claimed and urged others not to use their anti-town powers if they have them.  Voltaire, on the other hand, has an anti-town power, but he unilaterally used it without discussion.  (I get that it may be compulsive, but you could have used it later in the day, after discussion.)

I claimed how and when I did because I felt yuma built in misdirection as a major component of night actions in this RMM game.  I claimed to directly counter that mechanic, which is sort of lame for yuma's plans but I believe is best for town's chances.