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Author Topic: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity  (Read 97989 times)

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Dsell

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #125 on: September 02, 2013, 04:45:37 pm »
+1

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Relic
Types: Treasure
Cost: $6
Worth $2. When you play this, you may trash up to 2 cards from your hand and play area. If you trashed at least one Action card,  +$2 and +1 VP.

This has some interesting/funky combos with Dark Ages cards (especially ruins), and that seems probably fine. I have always wanted something besides Mint that lets you trash from play, and I think this is good.

(and besides Procession)

And counterfeit! I was meaning trashing after the fact, which gives a little more flexibility and makes the puzzle people very, very happy. It's a pretty small distinction though.

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The 7 cost cards are "big" versions of some of the basic functions of the game: Forge is big trashing, Bank is big money, King's Court is big actions (and big anything else, depending on the other action), Expand is big trash-for-benefit.

Hey, this is a really good way of looking at it.

Hey thanks!

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Palace
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Buy. +$1.

While this is in play, during the Buy phase, Colonies cost $2 less, but not less than $0. While this is in play, when you buy a Platinum, +2 VP.
Setup: Add Colony and Platinum to the Supply.

Should probably be +$1 then +1 Buy, but that's semantics.

Actually, it's syntax.  :P

You are so right!

Now for the rest of the submissions:


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Clearing House
Types: Action
Cost: $6
+2 Cards. +1 Action. You may trash any number of Treasure cards from your hand. +1 Card per card trashed in this way.

Do we really need more Lab variants? This is fine I suppose, except that the $6 mark makes it significantly harder to get than the other Labs, but I'm just not sure it's exciting enough.

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Workhouse
Types: Action
Cost: $7
+$4.

To paraphrase John Cochran:
I’m tempted to say that Workhouse is too vanilla, but I feel like that would be doing a great disservice to the flavor of vanilla. I mean, people actively seek out vanilla-flavored products. Children clamor to get a vanilla ice cream cone. Nobody’s clamoring for anything Workhouse flavored.

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Gemstone
Types: Treasure
Cost: $4
Worth $1. Rarity cards cost $6 less this turn, but not less than $0.

Setup: Add an extra Kingdom card pile costing $5 or more to the Supply. Cards from that pile are Rarity cards and cost $5 more.

The supply pile thing is cool, but making it cost $5 more is too much. Gemstone is realistically the only way to get that card, so it's almost like Gemstone isn't in the supply at all, but is an awkward embargo to a card you'd really rather have.

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Ascetic
Types: Action
Cost: $2
Trash this and any number of Treasures from your hand. +1 VP for each Treasure trashed this way.

Seems rather weak, even for 2. I don't think it needs to self trash.

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Dividends
Types: Treasure
Cost: $6
Worth $1. When you play this, gain a Treasure card costing less than this, putting it into your hand.

Ok, so I like the flexibility of being able to gain alt-treasures. In a game with a lot of alt-treasures I can see this being really exciting. Without them, silver flood isn't bad but it's also been done a lot.

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Villa
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Action. Play up to 2 Treasures from your hand. Draw until you have 4 cards in hand.

So this is another way to play treasures during your action phase, which is pretty cool. It's a different take on Lab because sometimes it will draw you 4 cards and sometimes nothing.

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Golden Touch
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Trash the top card of your deck. Gain a Gold, putting it on top of your deck.

I am too much of a coward for this card. Unless I get a 5/2 split. And then it's just a no-brainer. Also, at least call it Midas or something.

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Aqueduct (B)
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Action. +$2. Discard a card. If you do, +1 Card.

While this is in play, Attack cards you play have no effect on other players.

But I like attacking people! I don't know, the bottom line feels a little contrived, because it matters not at all in games without attacks, but is like a huge drawback in games with them. It is a whole lot like Mystic, too.

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Inheritance
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Buy.

While this is in play, Treasure cards costs $3 less, but not less than $0.

So it's a terminal gold for treasures only, and the +1 Buy ensures that you'll at least be able to get double silver. Again, silver flood is already a thing. I sort of like this, but I think it leads to somewhat boring plays.

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Crown (B)
Types: Treasure
Cost: $7
Worth $4.

When you gain this, each other player gets +2 VP.

I think I'd smile every time my opponent chose this over Gold, except maybe colony games. Just not exciting.

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Standard Bearer
Types: Action
Cost: $7
Trash this card. Put your deck (not including your discard pile) into your hand.

Swingy, especially since it only happens once! I don't like cards that just make it super easy (on their own) to draw your deck, it takes some of the fun out of building a draw-your deck engine.

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Griffin
Types: Treasure
Cost: $5
When you play this, reveal your hand. This is worth $1 per Victory card revealed.

Once per turn, while this is in play, when you buy a Victory card, +1 Buy and +$1.

This is very similar to a card in the old contest by Robz888 called Emerald. The bottom line is different, I believe, but this doesn't feel like a new idea.

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Charity (B)
Types: Treasure
Cost: $5
Worth $1. When you play this, choose one: Each player gains a Copper; or each player gains a Silver. Either way, put the card you gained into your hand.

This is some neat interaction, and since it's a treasure, you'll know exactly what you need to get to the threshold you want (barring venture). Seems good. I want to play this with Counterfeit.

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Fountain
Types: Treasure
Cost: $6
Worth $0. When you play this, if you have no other Treasures in play, +2 VP. You may trash this immediately. If you do, +$2.

Play this first every time, count up your money and trash it only if you need +$2 to get to your threshold. Too basic for an expensive alt treasure.

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Savant
Types: Action
Cost: $6
+3 Cards. +1 Action. Each other player draws a card, then reveals and discards one or more cards. He gets +1 VP per Action or Treasure card he discards.

This is worse than Governor at a higher price point.

Edit: ok, I see that the opponents have to discard at least one card, so it's not strictly worse than Governor. But I still think it's worse, and especially at the $6 price point.

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Patent
Types: Treasure
Cost: $5
Worth $2.

While this is in play, when you buy a card that is not a Victory card, you may gain a copy of it, putting it on top of your deck. If you do, trash this.

Suped up talisman that works one time. Also a bit like Royal Seal. It's fine, I think. Buy this card now, it's useful, then trade it in later for something better. Appropriately named.

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Queen's Palace
Types: Action
Cost: $6
+1 Action.
You may return a VP token. If you do, +3 Cards, +1 Buy, and each other player gets +1 VP.

Setup: Each player gets +2 VP.

The VP mechanic doesn't feel natural on this card. I have no idea if this is balanced. Not a clue. I don't want to give VP to my opponents, though.

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Mafia
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $7
Each other player reveals the top 3 cards of his deck, trashes a revealed Treasure that you choose, and discards the rest. You may gain any or all of the trashed cards. +1 VP per card you gain this way.

Someone is going for the forum gamers' vote. ;) Very very suped up Thief, but it has some of the same issues. It's way, WAY better in a 4+ player game than in 2p. I can't say I like it.

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Witch's Trove
Types: Treasure
Cost: $6
Worth $2. When you play this, reveal you hand and discard all revealed Curses. +$3 for each Curse discarded. You may gain a Curse.

Woah, this is crazy. I dunno, I like crazy cards, and have submitted some myself to past contests. I think this might just be too strong in cursing games or draw-your deck engines, but I like the idea! With some tweaks it might be just right.

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Palladium
Types: Treasure
Cost: $7
Worth $4. +1 Buy. When you play this, trash all Treasures you have in play. +1 VP for each card trashed.

I am not getting to $7 if all I have is coppers, but I suppose this could be a good trasher. And gives you lots of money. And VP. I guess it doesn't stack. Yeah, this is probably too strong but also not very exciting.

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Banknote
Types: Treasure
Cost: $6
Worth $2. +1 Buy. If you have 4 or more differently named Treasures in play, +$2.

Yaaaaaay now here is an expensive treasure that (potentially) gives you $4 that I could get behind. It's still not, like, the most exciting, but variety in treasures is a cool design space, and you always have the potential since this is in the kingdom. With other alt treasures, this is usually going to be better than Gold, but it still encourages you to get Gold for variety's sake.

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Reputation
Types: Treasure
Cost: $10*
Worth $4.

Unless in play, this costs $2 less per card costing $6 or more you have in play, but not less than $0.

I don't understand the wording on this card, sorry... I guess I just don't get the beginning. Unless this is in play? The cost cannot be reduced while in play? So that it can count towards purchasing more Reputations at a cheaper rate? Ok, maybe I get it, but I don't like it much.

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Silk Merchant
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+$2. You may trash two cards from your hand. If you do, +1 VP per token on the Trade Route mat.

Setup: Put a token on each Victory card Supply pile. When a card is gained from that pile, move the token to the Trade Route mat.

Clarification: The Trade Route mat and tokens referred to by Silk Merchant are the same as those referred to by Trade Route.  If both Trade Route and Silk Merchant are in the kingdom and/or Black Market deck, use only one token on each victory card pile.

This has a lot going on, but still seems fairly vanilla.

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Indulgence
Types: Treasure
Cost: $5
Worth $2. +1 Buy. When you play this, the player to your left names a card in the Supply costing between $3 and $6. If you buy that card this turn, +2VP.

This is great. Really cool interaction, but does not make the other $5 silvers look too bad.

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Smelter
Types: Action
Cost: $6
Reveal cards from your deck until you reveal an Action card, a Treasure card, and a Victory card. Trash an Action card, a Treasure card, and a Victory card from the revealed cards. If you do, gain 3 Golds.

Forced trashing of ALL THREE? But I want the stuff in my deck to be good, I don't want to have to trash it! I know, I know, there will probably be multiples, but still, this is really high risk. Instead of buying the first Smelter I could have bought a gold, and instead of playing this and trashing my precious cards, I could have played that gold. I would not expect this to be good.

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Rosary
Types: Treasure – Attack
Cost: $5
Worth $2. When you play this, each other player may trash a Treasure or Action card from his hand. If he does not, he gains 2 Coppers, putting one into his hand.

This will be really good for your opponents early. I can't really see a point in the game where I want to be buying this. Potentially a good copper flooder, but playing more copies of this weakens the former attack. Maybe ok, but I'm not convinced that this would be exciting, I guess.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2013, 05:07:45 pm by Dsell »
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SirPeebles

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #126 on: September 02, 2013, 04:51:39 pm »
+6

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Charity (A)
Types: Treasure
Cost: $7
Worth $4. +1 Buy.

While this is in play, when you buy a card, each other player gains a card costing at most $2 less than it.

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Dsell

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #127 on: September 02, 2013, 05:04:55 pm »
+3

Prosperity is a place to put interesting cards which just happen to be expensive.  If you have a cool idea, but the idea does not justify a $7 price tag, then save it for a different set.  Piling on the vanilla probably won't do the trick.

Interestingly, this seems like just the opposite of Dsell's opinion about $7 cards.

I don't actually disagree with him. The $7 cards are big versions of the basic functions of the game, but they're still done interestingly. Bank doesn't just give +$4 or something, it depends on what you've already played. King's Court doesn't just give +3 or +4 Actions, it's the "big actions" cards but it's way more exciting than that. I guess that Expand would be the most "vanilla" since it's just a better version of a cheaper card, but the effect on that cheaper card is really not that vanilla in practice.
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scott_pilgrim

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #128 on: September 02, 2013, 05:25:46 pm »
+1

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Fountain
Types: Treasure
Cost: $6
Worth $0. When you play this, if you have no other Treasures in play, +2 VP. You may trash this immediately. If you do, +$2.

Play this first every time, count up your money and trash it only if you need +$2 to get to your threshold. Too basic for an expensive alt treasure.

That was my initial thought on this card also, but I think you're missing an at least interesting point.  If you have two Fountains, you might want to trash the first one for $2 so that you can also play the second one for 2 VP, even if you don't need the $2 (particularly if you could use it but don't need it).  I think it could lead to some interesting decisions in those cases, although I'm not sure how often it would come up.  Sounds maybe too expensive.
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Dsell

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #129 on: September 02, 2013, 05:44:10 pm »
0

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Fountain
Types: Treasure
Cost: $6
Worth $0. When you play this, if you have no other Treasures in play, +2 VP. You may trash this immediately. If you do, +$2.

Play this first every time, count up your money and trash it only if you need +$2 to get to your threshold. Too basic for an expensive alt treasure.

That was my initial thought on this card also, but I think you're missing an at least interesting point.  If you have two Fountains, you might want to trash the first one for $2 so that you can also play the second one for 2 VP, even if you don't need the $2 (particularly if you could use it but don't need it).  I think it could lead to some interesting decisions in those cases, although I'm not sure how often it would come up.  Sounds maybe too expensive.

Yeah, I guess that adds an element of decision, which was my primary complaint with the card in the first place. In an endgame situation the extra 2 vp from another copy could really matter, so it's not as bad or "solved" as I thought it was.
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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #130 on: September 02, 2013, 05:59:12 pm »
+6

Here's my thoughts, in video form!



As an aside, I've looked through the comments on my card, and I've seen mostly positive thoughts, AND at least one person saying it looks too weak and at least one saying it looks too strong, which I think is pretty awesome.
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...spin-offs are still better for all of the previously cited reasons.
But not strictly better, because the spinoff can have a different cost than the expansion.

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #131 on: September 02, 2013, 06:58:43 pm »
+3

General thoughts:

- I am most interested in novel concepts.  This is a pretty vague descriptor.
- Some cards are probably fine but I just don't like them that much due to personal taste.

Now to read what other people think...

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Relic
Types: Treasure
Cost: $6
Worth $2. When you play this, you may trash up to 2 cards from your hand and play area. If you trashed at least one Action card, +$2 and +1 VP.

Concept: Expensive silver that trashes from hand AND play.  Big bonus for trashing actions.
Prosperity fit: Expensive, treasure, VP tokens.
Comments: I don't see the reason for rewarding action trashing.  It does make it play interestingly with looters (which is a decent fit with the card name).  Seems OK.

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Artist
Types: Action
Cost: $6
+$3. You may trash this. If you do, the first time you buy a Victory card this turn, +3 VP.

While this is in play, when you buy a Victory card, +1 VP.

Concept: Terminal Gold that grants extra VP when you buy VP.
Prosperity fit: Expensive, VP tokens.
Comments: On a terminal action, this is actually quite similar to Goons, at least on a superficial level.  This lacks the attack and the +Buy, and it restricts +VP to Victory card purchases only.  In exchange, it grants an extra $1 and it can increase the VP token earning if you trash it.  This probably promotes a strategy similar to Goons except with more focus on buying green (which Goons engines often skip), eventually culminating in a final blitz by trashing every Artist.

I like the idea of VP tokens for buying Victory cards, but I don't like that this implementation of it makes it like a restricted Goons.

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Usurer
Types: Action
Cost: $6
+1 Card. +1 Action. Reveal cards from your deck until you reveal a Treasure. Discard the rest. Trash the Treausre; gain a Treasure costing up to $3 more than it, putting it on top of your deck. Each other player may gain a Copper, putting it into his hand.

Concept: Rebuild for Treasure instead of Victory.
Prosperity fit: Expensive.  Interacts with Treasure.  Makes decks filled with better Treasure.  Interactive.
Comments: There's a typo!  Compared to Rebuild, this is more expensive and it can give opponents a benefit, but it's a cantrip and it topdecks the new Treasure.

I like it.  I would suggest the name "Reinvest".

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Treasure Chest
Types: Treasure
Cost: $4
Worth $1. When you play this, discard the top card of your deck. If it is a Treasure, gain a Silver

Concept: Copper that can gain Silver.
Prosperity fit: Treasures.
Comments: Prosperity has alt Coppers that do very interesting things.  Quarry is a Gold for actions, while Talisman can gain an entire extra card.  This sometimes gains a Silver... I think it may work, but it doesn't seem all that exciting most of the time.  When it would be, I think Trader and Masterpiece do just as well.

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Strong Room
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+4 Cards. +1 Action. You may return up to 4 VP tokens. Discard 4 cards, minus 1 card per VP token returned.

In games using this, at the beginning of each turn of the player who went first, each player gets +1 VP.

Concept: Big non-terminal sifting that becomes big draw if you pay VP.
Prosperity fit: Big effect, VP tokens.
Comments: Very, very interesting.  Hard to theorize on the balance; likely depends on the game (probably benefits a lot from other VP token cards).  If one player opts to pay VP tokens and the other never does, how often will that difference matter?  Constantly accumulating VP is kind of a neat thing too.  Novel concept, I like it.

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Metropolis
Types: Action
Cost: $7
+1 Card. +2 Actions. Treasure cards other than Copper produce an extra $1 this turn.

Concept: Coppersmith for everything but Copper.
Prosperity fit: Expensive, Treasure interaction, big effect.
Comments: I actually think that this will be too powerful, and it would be hard to tweak this to make it work.  Coppersmith is terminal and only works on Copper, thus promoting an odd strategy.  This doesn't do that -- as a village, it fits into pretty much any deck and it benefits you for having good treasures, which you often want anyway.  Being a village just helps you stack it better, because it naturally supports terminal draw to let you draw more Metropolises and treasures.

Granted, typical villages want to be in an engine with few treasures.  But this still fits in with that because it doesn't want the Copper.

Am I overestimating this card?

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Stock Exchange
Types: Treasure
Cost: $7
Worth $2.

While this is in play, when you buy a Victory card, you may buy any number of VP tokens for $1 per token.

Concept: Expensive silver that can let you buy extra VP.
Prosperity fit: Expensive, VP tokens.
Comments: I'm gonna say that this is a fairly interesting concept, but the "while in play" just smacks of overpay.  It could probably be reworded better with overpay.  I think this would be better in a future Prosperity/Guilds challenge.

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Chalice
Types: Treasure
Cost: $4
Worth $3.

While this is in play, when you buy a Treasure card gain 2 Coppers, when you buy a Victory card gain a Curse.

Concept: Cheap Gold that penalizes you for buying Treasure or VP.
Prosperity fit: Treasure.
Comments: IMO, not that different from Quarry.  The difference is that Quarry is only a Copper for other cards, whereas this is still a Gold but slaps you for buying a non-action.  But at the end of the day, both are Golds for actions.

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Surveyor
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Card. +1 Action. +$1. You may reveal a Province or Colony from your hand. If you do, +1 VP. You may return 3 VP to the supply. If you do, gain a Province.

Concept: Peddler that sometimes gives VP tokens.  You can trade in VP tokens for a Province.
Prosperity fit: VP tokens, big effect.
Comments: I believe that this is too strong as it is, especially considering how it combos with other VP token cards.  But I think that it is solvable with a cost increase.  Trading in VP tokens is a fairly interesting premise.

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Gilded Statue
Types: Treasure
Cost: $7
Worth $2. When you play this, you may discard a Treasure. If you do, gain a Gold.

When you gain this, gain an Action card costing up to $4.

Concept: Expensive Silver that can gain Golds by discarding other treasure.
Prosperity fit: Expensive, treasure.
Comments: The on-gain feels very tacked on.  Perhaps it is to compensate for paying $7 just for a Silver?  I think this works out to be fairly weak, but I'm not sure how the on-gain changes that balance.  Overall, the concept does not excite me.

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Railway Town
Types: Action
Cost: $6
+1 Card. +2 Actions. +$1. If you have played railway town at least twice this turn, +1 Buy. If you have played it at least three times this turn, +1 VP. If you have played it at least four times this turn, +$1. If you have played it at least five times this turn, +1 Card.

Concept: Expensive card that gains more and more bonuses as it stacks.
Prosperity fit: Expensive, big effect.
Comments: With the second play this is already better than Grand Market, and it just gets crazier from there.  Maybe it works if you increase the cost and/or add a GM-esque buy restriction...

I'm just not fond of these monolithic stacking cards though.

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Charity (A)
Types: Treasure
Cost: $7
Worth $4. +1 Buy.

While this is in play, when you buy a card, each other player gains a card costing at most $2 less than it.

Concept: Big treasure that is a Haggler... for your opponents.
Prosperity fit: Treasure, interaction.
Comments: Probably needs to make the opponents' gains optional.  As it is, you can make this an attack by buying $3 cards.  Other than that, looks alright.  Might even work at $6, because that benefit to opponents is pretty big.

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Wedding
Types: Action
Cost: $7
+1 Action. Reveal cards from the top you your deck until you reveal an Action card, a Treasure card and a Victory card. If you do reveal a card of each of these types, put an Action card, a Treasure card and a Victory card from among the revealed cards into you hand. Discard the other revealed cards.

Concept: Big non-terminal draw that hits a rainbow of types.
Prosperity fit: Expensive, big effect.
Comments: Rules question -- what if you reveal a hybrid?  I expect that it would count as both types, so if you reveal a Copper and a Nobles, that's all you get for drawing.  But maybe you reveal Nobles, Nobles, Estate, Harem, you should be able to choose two Nobles and Harem (with Harem being your treasure and each Nobles filling in a different slot).  So Wedding+hybrid cards is a double-edged sword.  Overall, fairly interesting.

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Palace
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Buy. +$1.

While this is in play, during the Buy phase, Colonies cost $2 less, but not less than $0. While this is in play, when you buy a Platinum, +2 VP.
Setup: Add Colony and Platinum to the Supply.

Concept: Terminal that explicitly encourages Plats and Colonies.
Prosperity fit: Plats and Colonies.  VP tokens.
Comments: "Instant Colonies!" is actually an interesting setup rule to put on a card.  The card itself is kind of odd though.  It is a terminal Gold for Colonies, but you won't be buying Colonies all the time.  When you aren't, this is an incredibly weak card.  It gives you VP for buying Platinum, but it is so weak that it makes buying Platinum more difficult when you have this in hand.

I like the idea of doing something specific with Colonies and Plats, but I don't think this implementation works.

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Crown (A)
Types: Treasure
Cost: $8*
Worth $1. When you play this, gain 2 Treasure cards.

During your turn, this costs $1 less per 2 VP chips you have.
When you gain this, +2 VP.

Concept: Treasure that gets cheaper over the course of the game.  Treasure gainer.
Prosperity fit: Expensive-ish, treasure, VP tokens.
Comments: The effect is incredibly powerful in games with Platinum.  Tying cost reduction with VP means that this can't be balanced with a price change, because you could always lower the cost with Monument.

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Cathedral
Types: Action
Cost: $7
Gain two action cards costing less than this and a Gold.

Concept: Expensive card that gains expensive things.
Prosperity fit: Expensive, big effect.
Comments: Maybe too powerful, depending on the board.  Hard to fix that with a cost increase, because any higher and it will be able to gain King's Court.  Besides that, it is just not that exciting an effect (in terms of gameplay -- it doesn't do anything new).

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King's Greed
Types: Action
Cost: $10
Put your deck into your discard pile. Look through your discard pile and set aside up to 3 Action cards from it. Play them in any order.

Concept: Instantly play any three actions anywhere in your deck.
Prosperity fit: Super expensive, super powerful.
Comments: Probably too powerful, such that it's hard to fix with a simple change.  This can easily chain into itself.  Playing ANY three actions means that it can very easily set up really wild combos.

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Mediator
Types: Action – Reaction
Cost: $3
+$3. Reveal 3 cards from your hand. The player to your left selects one of them. Discard it or put it on top of your deck.

When another player plays an Attack, you may set this aside from your hand. If you do, +1 Card, +1 VP, and at the start of your next turn, discard this.

Concept: Cheap terminal Gold with a drawback.  +VP reaction.
Prosperity fit: Big effect (for a $3 card at least).  VP tokens.  Non-attack interaction.
Comments: The reaction seems kind of tacked on, but without it the connection to Prosperity is kind of weak.  This doesn't actually hit any of the major themes as listed by LastFootnote, though it hits two of the minor themes.  I don't think it's a close enough fit for this contest.

For the designer: the reaction can just discard itself right away, no need to set aside.  The only reaction that sets itself aside is Horse Traders, and that's because it goes back into your hand later on.

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Prospector
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Buy. Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put the revealed Treasure cards into your hand. Discard the rest. Each other player may discard a Treasure. If he does, he draws a card.

Concept: Scout for Treasure.
Prosperity fit: Treasure interaction, interaction with other players.
Comments: I think it's a solid concept.  Not super exciting though.

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Jeweller
Types: Action
Cost: $6
+2 VP. Gain a Gold.

Concept: Gold and VP gaining.
Prosperity fit: Treasure interaction, VP tokens.
Comments: Quite vanilla.  Vanilla is cool too, but I'm looking for novel concepts.

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Hunter
Types: Action
Cost: $6
Trash any number of cards from your hand. For each card you trash, +1 Card and +$1.

Concept: Big trashing for big (non-scaling) benefit.
Prosperity fit: Expensive, big effect.
Comments: It's alright.  It's missing a certain flair, but I don't know how to explain.

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Forum
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Draw until you have 6 cards in hand.

While this is in play, when you play a Silver, you may trash that Silver. If you do, +1 VP.

Concept: Trash Silver for +VP.
Prosperity fit: Treasure interaction.
Comments: The main action looks like it's just filler.  The reaction is kind of interesting.  Rules question: if you have multiple Fora, do you get multiple VPs?  I can see it going either way.  This could probably cost $4.

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Statue
Types: Action
Cost: $7
Discard up to 3 cards from your hand. +1 VP per card discarded.

Concept: Discard for VP.
Prosperity fit: Expensive, VP tokens.
Comments: Seems alright.  There is some danger of building a deck that just cranks out VP without moving the game towards an end.  The discard clause helps, but you can still build a deck to generate 3VP every turn.  Not great, but it can still be problematic.

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Aqueduct (A)
Types: Action
Cost: $7
+2 Buys. +$2. Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put the revealed Treasure cards into your hand and discard the rest.

Concept: Scout for Treasure.
Prosperity fit:  Expensive, Treasure interaction.
Comments: Just like Prospector (above) with some different vanilla bonuses.  Also drops the benefit to opponents.  This is probably fine as well.

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Deed
Types: Treasure – Reaction
Cost: $5
Worth $2

When you gain a Victory card, you may discard this from your hand. If you do, +2 VP.

Concept: Silver that can give a VP boost to a Victory card when you buy it.
Prosperity fit: Treasure, VP tokens.
Comments: I really like this.  Note that using the reaction implicitly adds a $2 surcharge on the Victory card you are buying, since you are not playing this as a Silver.  So this turns Estate into a cheap Duchy, Duchy into a mini-Province, Province into a mini-Colony.

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Philanthropist
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+3 VP. Each other player gains a card costing up to $5.

Concept: Big +VP with big benefit to opponents.
Prosperity fit: VP tokens, interaction.
Comments: Very strange.  It gives you VP, with no other benefit to yourself.  But it benefits opponents a lot and it does move the game towards an end by emptying piles.  I think it would probably be fairly interesting, maybe with some tweaks.

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Clearing House
Types: Action
Cost: $6
+2 Cards. +1 Action. You may trash any number of Treasure cards from your hand. +1 Card per card trashed in this way.

Concept: Lab that draws more cards by trashing treasure.
Prosperity fit: Treasure interaction, expensive.
Comments: Not that exciting.  I think it would be slightly more interesting if it were just a cantrip instead of a lab, and you get an extra +1 Card for trashing any number of Treasure cards.  In other words, it plays the same as written here if you trash at least one treasure, but it's only a cantrip if you don't.  Still no that exciting to me though. :P

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Workhouse
Types: Action
Cost: $7
+$4.

Concept: Terminal +$4.
Prosperity fit: Expensive.
Comments: This might be just fine, but for this contest I am not interested in vanilla cards.

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Gemstone
Types: Treasure
Cost: $4
Worth $1. Rarity cards cost $6 less this turn, but not less than $0.

Setup: Add an extra Kingdom card pile costing $5 or more to the Supply. Cards from that pile are Rarity cards and cost $5 more.

Concept: Treasure that is best used for buying cards not in the supply (sort of).
Prosperity fit: Treasure.
Comments: The extra card is actually in the supply, but costing it $5 more effectively removes it from the supply in most cases.  Playing with the cost instead of actually removing it from the supply has some other implications.  Multiple Gemstones will reduce the cost further.  Probably the bigger thing is what it means for TfB.  This will probably need tweaks, but it's an interesting concept.

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Ascetic
Types: Action
Cost: $2
Trash this and any number of Treasures from your hand. +1 VP for each Treasure trashed this way.

Concept: One-shot +VP for trashing treasures.
Prosperity fit: VP tokens, treasure interaction.
Comments: Probably best as an opener to clear out Copper.  The VP tokens don't really matter that much, I think.  The trashing is more impactful, and you are unlikely to build up lots of VP with this.

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Dividends
Types: Treasure
Cost: $6
Worth $1. When you play this, gain a Treasure card costing less than this, putting it into your hand.

Concept: Copper that gains other Treasure into hand.
Prosperity fit: Treasure, treasure interaction.
Comments: Mostly this is just a Gold that gains Silvers.  Sometimes it will have use for gaining alt Treasures.  Seeems alright. 

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Villa
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Action. Play up to 2 Treasures from your hand. Draw until you have 4 cards in hand.

Concept: non-terminal fixed draw that can play treasures
Prosperity fit: treasure interaction
Comments: From a normal 5 card hand, this can be a Lab.  It is sometimes better if you can lower your hand size further, it is sometimes worse if your hand gets bigger or if you have no treasure to play out.  I like this.  You can do some Black Market tricks with it but it uses the treasure playing for an additional purpose.

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Golden Touch
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Trash the top card of your deck. Gain a Gold, putting it on top of your deck.

Concept: Replace a random card from your deck with Gold.
Prosperity fit: Treasure interaction.
Comments: The effect is powerful in the early game and becomes scarier and scarier to use as the game progresses.  Looks OK.

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Aqueduct (B)
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Action. +$2. Discard a card. If you do, +1 Card.

While this is in play, Attack cards you play have no effect on other players.

Concept: Silver (as an action) with minor filtering that halts your own attacks.
Prosperity fit: uhh... interaction, sort of?
Comments: I don't really see any Prosperity theme here.  Blocking your own attacks is interaction, I suppose.  Tenuous at best though.

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Inheritance
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Buy.

While this is in play, Treasure cards costs $3 less, but not less than $0.

Concept: Quarry for Treasure instead of Actions
Prosperity fit: Treasure interaction
Comments: I think it works, but I'm not that interested in a card that actively promotes Big Money.

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Crown (B)
Types: Treasure
Cost: $7
Worth $4.

When you gain this, each other player gets +2 VP.

Concept: Big treasure worth negative VP.
Prosperity fit: Expensive, Treasure, VP tokens.
Comments: Giving others +VP is effectively giving yourself -VP.  I'm not so fond of using some VP value to try to balance a card.

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Standard Bearer
Types: Action
Cost: $7
Trash this card. Put your deck (not including your discard pile) into your hand.

Concept: Expensive one-shot to draw the rest of your deck, but not your discard.
Prosperity fit: Expensive, big effect.
Comments: Potentially game-breaking power.  Not including the discard makes it much swingier.  Terminal means that this is actually dead on many boards.  "Instantly draw your deck" is an interesting idea that would take a lot of work to get right.  I don't think this does it.  Too many changes would be necessary for me to give this a vote.

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Griffin
Types: Treasure
Cost: $5
When you play this, reveal your hand. This is worth $1 per Victory card revealed.

Once per turn, while this is in play, when you buy a Victory card, +1 Buy and +$1.

Concept: Treasure that counts Victory, with bonuses for greening
Prosperity fit: Treasure
Comments: Gets a little ambiguous when played in multiples.  If I have two in play, do I trigger the bonus twice for buying one Victory card?  I expect so, but I could see people going for different interpretations.

The idea of a card that grants coin for Victory cards in hand is fairly popular, I think, but it's just not one that I personally like.

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Charity (B)
Types: Treasure
Cost: $5
Worth $1. When you play this, choose one: Each player gains a Copper; or each player gains a Silver. Either way, put the card you gained into your hand.

Concept: Copper that makes everyone gain Copper or Silver.
Prosperity fit: Treasure, Treasure interaction.
Comments: This should be an attack.  Copper junking is an attack.  Perhaps the argument that it isn't an attack because you have to gain Copper yourself... but an attack with recoil damage is still an attack. ;) 

Since this is a treasure card, that makes it pretty easy to spam.  Junking yourself mitigates that though.

Hurting yourself might make this workable.  Hard to say though.

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Fountain
Types: Treasure
Cost: $6
Worth $0. When you play this, if you have no other Treasures in play, +2 VP. You may trash this immediately. If you do, +$2.

Concept: +VP Treasure
Prosperity fit: Treasure, VP tokens
Comments: This essentially grants +2VP non-terminally.  The clause means that only the first Fountain you play will grant VP, unless you choose to trash earlier played Fountains.  Aside from it being worth no coin, it's completely safe to get a single Fountain because you can always play it first, before your other Treasures.  May play just fine, but it doesn't work for me.

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Savant
Types: Action
Cost: $6
+3 Cards. +1 Action. Each other player draws a card, then reveals and discards one or more cards. He gets +1 VP per Action or Treasure card he discards.

Concept: Big non-terminal draw that benefits opponents.
Prosperity fit: Expensive, interaction, VP tokens, minor Treasure interaction
Comments: The easy way to think of it is, Big non-terminal draw that sometimes gives opponents VP tokens.  It can benefit them in other ways -- sifting out dead cards, discarding extra cards for whatever reason (Tunnel, Menagerie).  Overall not that interesting to me.

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Patent
Types: Treasure
Cost: $5
Worth $2.

While this is in play, when you buy a card that is not a Victory card, you may gain a copy of it, putting it on top of your deck. If you do, trash this.

Concept: Silver that can be a super Talisman once.
Prosperity fit: Treasure.
Comments: Should play differently than Talisman, since Silver is better than Copper and this can copy something good.  Granted, it's not really worth getting Patent unless you pick up something worth at least $6.  If you pick up a $5, you could have just gotten that to start instead of a Patent, and you would have been able to play it one turn earlier.  You can always use it for Gold, and sometimes there are more expensive kingdom cards you'll want.  May feel a bit limited though.

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Queen's Palace
Types: Action
Cost: $6
+1 Action.
You may return a VP token. If you do, +3 Cards, +1 Buy, and each other player gets +1 VP.

Setup: Each player gets +2 VP.

Concept: Trade VP for non-terminal draw.
Prosperity fit: VP tokens, expensive.
Comments: Strong Room is a better implementation of this concept.  With Queen's Palace, you only get to use it twice before you run out of VP.  To get more uses, you need another source of VP tokens, or opponents need to play QP as well.  But why would they, if it means they can get a small VP lead and stick you with a dead card and wasted $6 buy?

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Mafia
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $7
Each other player reveals the top 3 cards of his deck, trashes a revealed Treasure that you choose, and discards the rest. You may gain any or all of the trashed cards. +1 VP per card you gain this way.

Concept: Super Thief.
Prosperity fit: Expensive, treasure interaction.  VP tokens.
Comments: It's Thief.  That's just not that interesting.

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Witch's Trove
Types: Treasure
Cost: $6
Worth $2. When you play this, reveal you hand and discard all revealed Curses. +$3 for each Curse discarded. You may gain a Curse.

Concept: Silver that turns Curses into Golds.
Prosperity fit: Expensive, treasure.
Comments: Really, really niche.  Gaining a Curse is probably never a good option.  That could be changed to +1 Buy, which allows the player to freely buy a Curse if he really wants but also makes it better than Silver in games without Cursing.  Discarding all the revealed Curses is a disincentive to getting more than one Witch's Trove because they don't stack.  This may work, but it isn't my taste.

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Palladium
Types: Treasure
Cost: $7
Worth $4. +1 Buy. When you play this, trash all Treasures you have in play. +1 VP for each card trashed.

Concept: One-shot Treasure that trashes Treasures for +VP.
Prosperity fit: Treasure, Treasure interaction, VP tokens.
Comments: Was it meant to be a one-shot?  As worded, it will trash itself.  Doesn't feel awesome enough to be a $7 one-shot, or even a $6 one-shot.  At $5 or less it compares favourably to Death Cart, giving a large amount of coin with possibility of trashing some Copper and getting some VP.

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Banknote
Types: Treasure
Cost: $6
Worth $2. +1 Buy. If you have 4 or more differently named Treasures in play, +$2.

Concept: Silver that can be better than Gold, given variety.
Prosperity fit: Treasure, expensive.
Comments: The Treasure check feels very Cornucopish.  Looks alright.

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Reputation
Types: Treasure
Cost: $10*
Worth $4.

Unless in play, this costs $2 less per card costing $6 or more you have in play, but not less than $0.

Concept: Expensive treasure that gets cheaper when you have expensive cards in play.
Prosperity fit: Expensive, treasure.
Comments: Wording could use some work, but I think the concept is pretty good.

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Silk Merchant
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+$2. You may trash two cards from your hand. If you do, +1 VP per token on the Trade Route mat.

Setup: Put a token on each Victory card Supply pile. When a card is gained from that pile, move the token to the Trade Route mat.

Clarification: The Trade Route mat and tokens referred to by Silk Merchant are the same as those referred to by Trade Route.  If both Trade Route and Silk Merchant are in the kingdom and/or Black Market deck, use only one token on each victory card pile.

Concept: +VP card that uses the Trade Route mechanic
Prosperity fit: VP tokens, interaction
Comments: Interaction is found in the Trade Route mechanic.  I like the idea of using that for a new card.  Makes a certain amount of thematic sense as well -- the more you've travelled along your trade route, the better your Silk Merchant does.  Not quite sure if trashing is the right effect to go with the VP gaining though.  Still, I like it.

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Indulgence
Types: Treasure
Cost: $5
Worth $2. +1 Buy. When you play this, the player to your left names a card in the Supply costing between $3 and $6. If you buy that card this turn, +2VP.

Concept: Silver than can earn VP tokens if you listen to your opponent's "advice".
Prosperity fit: Treasure, VP tokens.
Comments: Silver with +Buy, and you can get +2VP if you buy (presumably) the worst card on the board (costing between $3 and $6).  Although it is just another version of Advisor/Contraband, I like it.

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Smelter
Types: Action
Cost: $6
Reveal cards from your deck until you reveal an Action card, a Treasure card, and a Victory card. Trash an Action card, a Treasure card, and a Victory card from the revealed cards. If you do, gain 3 Golds.

Concept: Trash a variety of cards, gain a bunch of Gold.
Prosperity fit: Expensive, treasure interaction.
Comments: Feels more suitable for Cornucopia than Prosperity... OTOH, it only wants variety for the sake of erasing it. :P

Seems alright, but a bit... I don't know, messy?  The mechanics of the card just don't click for me.

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Rosary
Types: Treasure – Attack
Cost: $5
Worth $2. When you play this, each other player may trash a Treasure or Action card from his hand. If he does not, he gains 2 Coppers, putting one into his hand.

Concept: Treasure attack, copper junker.
Prosperity fit: Treasure, almost non-attack interaction
Comments: I generally don't like Treasure Attacks, and I generally don't like Copper junkers.  With the former, the attack can't be too strong because Treasures (being non-terminal) are inherently spammable.  With the latter, the problem is that the Copper pile doesn't scale with the number of piles and it often means an unending stream of junk.  This card attempts both.  The choice of trashing means that this "attack" is actually a friendly Cutpurse through most of the early game.  It is still friendly when junking, because one Copper goes in hand.  The Copper junk and the Cutpurse effect can still get annoying though.  This is just crazy enough that I have no idea if the concept is any good.  I kind of like it though.
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Just a Rube

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #132 on: September 02, 2013, 07:35:30 pm »
+5

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Mediator
Types: Action – Reaction
Cost: $3
+$3. Reveal 3 cards from your hand. The player to your left selects one of them. Discard it or put it on top of your deck.

When another player plays an Attack, you may set this aside from your hand. If you do, +1 Card, +1 VP, and at the start of your next turn, discard this.

Concept: Cheap terminal Gold with a drawback.  +VP reaction.
Prosperity fit: Big effect (for a $3 card at least).  VP tokens.  Non-attack interaction.
Comments: The reaction seems kind of tacked on, but without it the connection to Prosperity is kind of weak.  This doesn't actually hit any of the major themes as listed by LastFootnote, though it hits two of the minor themes.  I don't think it's a close enough fit for this contest.

For the designer: the reaction can just discard itself right away, no need to set aside.  The only reaction that sets itself aside is Horse Traders, and that's because it goes back into your hand later on.
Not my card, but I assume the reason for having it set aside is for the case where you have no cards in your draw or discard  pile, and someone plays an attack.

If it didn't go aside, as written you'd reveal it, discard it, get the VP and draw a card (which is the Mediator you just discarded), and could then react/reveal again, ad infinatum for infinite VP.

I'm not sure how I feel about the reaction, but I do appreciate the designer at least spotting that rules issue.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2013, 08:11:14 pm by Just a Rube »
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eHalcyon

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #133 on: September 02, 2013, 07:45:33 pm »
0

^ Good catch (both you and designer)!




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Palace
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Buy. +$1.

While this is in play, during the Buy phase, Colonies cost $2 less, but not less than $0. While this is in play, when you buy a Platinum, +2 VP.
Setup: Add Colony and Platinum to the Supply.

Should probably be +$1 then +1 Buy, but that's semantics. With the expanded card pool, I actually like the idea of a card that automatically puts Colonies into the game. This is a neat card. It's amazingly strong but it's pretty bad early, so you'd want to build an engine that can gain a lot of these in the mid-game and then play them quickly. Possibly encourages a different style of play, which is great.

It's Buy before $ on the cards I've checked (Market, Grand Market, Festival).  Also, that actually isn't semantics?  Seems more syntactic to me.  But it's not even grammar so just... format?

I was doubtful of Palace because of how weak it is to start, but maybe you're right about the alternate play style (aiming to pick these up in the mid game).  But I still think the bonus for buying Platinum is superfluous.


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Prospector
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Buy. Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put the revealed Treasure cards into your hand. Discard the rest. Each other player may discard a Treasure. If he does, he draws a card.

Seems quite strong in BM, but it might not be significantly worse than Smithy. You do want a low density. I think the penalty on it is cool, but I don't really think we need a card that's awesome in BM and BM only.

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Aqueduct (A)
Types: Action
Cost: $7
+2 Buys. +$2. Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put the revealed Treasure cards into your hand and discard the rest.

This is kinda like a bigger version of Prospector and I'm not a huge fan of this one either. It's a bit better in engines (maybe stables engines) but it still feels like a BM card primarily, and $7 isn't a good price point for BM.

I missed how crazy good these are for BM because they just looked like "Treasure Scout" to me.  Oops.
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Nic

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #134 on: September 02, 2013, 07:48:38 pm »
+1

The cards I like have already gotten some love, and all the cards I hate have been kicked around enough. It might be better if I just say a sentence or two about the cards I would like given some editing.

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Charity (A)
Types: Treasure
Cost: $7
Worth $4. +1 Buy.

While this is in play, when you buy a card, each other player gains a card costing at most $2 less than it.
I agree with everyone else here; without a 'may', it's only gonna be used as an attack.

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Queen's Palace
Types: Action
Cost: $6
+1 Action.
You may return a VP token. If you do, +3 Cards, +1 Buy, and each other player gets +1 VP.

Setup: Each player gets +2 VP.

Might be worth 1VP per play, but not two. If it was

"+3 Cards
 +1 Action
 +1 Buy

+1VP to each other player."

then it'd be more balanced, wouldn't require a setup clause, and there'd be no problem with starving a player out of chips. You no longer have to make a decision about whether to use the power but as is, it only interacts with Golem and Herald. If you thought that was too risky, then you wouldn't have bought the card to begin with.

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Strong Room
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+4 Cards. +1 Action. You may return up to 4 VP tokens. Discard 4 cards, minus 1 card per VP token returned.

In games using this, at the beginning of each turn of the player who went first, each player gets +1 VP.

I suggest changing this to: +4 cards, +1 action. Do this 4 times: Discard a card; or each other player gets +1VP.
Oop, better than my idea. (In case you're curious, "Discard up to four cards. Each other player gets four VP, minus one for each card discarded." Either way, it removes the need for the wonky setup.)

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Gemstone
Types: Treasure
Cost: $4
Worth $1. Rarity cards cost $6 less this turn, but not less than $0.

Setup: Add an extra Kingdom card pile costing $5 or more to the Supply. Cards from that pile are Rarity cards and cost $5 more.
I feel like we have a discussion about this every time someone starts a thread about a cost-raiser. If I play two Gemstones, do Rarity cards cost max(5+5-6-6,0), or max(5-6-6,0)+5? In this specific case, it's pretty easy to guess which operation has precedence, but it's still completely undefined in the Dominion rulebook. If the point was to make Rares inaccessible without Gemstones, then why not just say so? "Cards from that pile are Rarity cards and cannot be bought [gained?] unless you have a Gemstone in play."

Of course, that could be a deliberate choice for the purpose of TfB shenanigans, and I don't think that would be a good idea. Bishop/Gemstone/Gemstone would be a much cheaper golden deck which you could hit earlier and transition out of, although who knows if you could eat two other piles in time. Anyways, Peddler's already done the 'buy low, trash high' thing, and this card would still be good without the added complexity.

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Ascetic
Types: Action
Cost: $2
Trash this and any number of Treasures from your hand. +1 VP for each Treasure trashed this way.

This would combo well with cards like Beggar, but a $2 trasher should be competitive as an opening buy. Like Peebles said, it needs a +2 Cards on it in order to collect a decent number of cards to trash, because it's not gonna help you with those Estates. Either you drew it with your estates and got very little benefit out of it, or it's just like opening Mint/- on a 5/2 split. "Gain a card costing up to $4" would also be a really good fix, but that might make this guy too powerful in the opening.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2013, 08:01:28 pm by Nic »
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eHalcyon

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #135 on: September 02, 2013, 07:53:37 pm »
+1

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Strong Room
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+4 Cards. +1 Action. You may return up to 4 VP tokens. Discard 4 cards, minus 1 card per VP token returned.

In games using this, at the beginning of each turn of the player who went first, each player gets +1 VP.

As Donald X would say, using VP tokens for benefit is an obvious idea, but I think it's a good one. I only think the player should discard 3 cards instead of 4, so you don't need to kill 2 VP per Laboratory.

Gonna disagree with that.  The sifting is strong enough that I think it should stay as discarding 4, especially since you get to look at your cards before you discard.

Hmm, now I'm worried that this may cause too much AP.

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Stock Exchange
Types: Treasure
Cost: $7
Worth $2.

While this is in play, when you buy a Victory card, you may buy any number of VP tokens for $1 per token.

This slows the game way down, almost to unending, but not quite. Consider that by the end of the game, the most profitable thing to do will be to buy an estate, and when they run out, a duchy, and trade all the rest of the money for VP, making a horribly long game. Sorry, but I don't like it.

The "slow down" effect you are describing is less than what you get from Goons.  But the point about buying Estate is a good one.  With $5, Estate is now worth 4VP.  With $8, 7VP.  With $11 it is worth 10VP, same as a Colony.  And you can go beyond that, of course.  Very strange.

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Dividends
Types: Treasure
Cost: $6
Worth $1. When you play this, gain a Treasure card costing less than this, putting it into your hand.

Not worth buying on boards without alternate treasure. Can't think of a way to fix this, honestly.

Maybe you didn't notice that the Treasure goes into your hand.  This makes this as good as Gold. 

Hmm, thinking more about this, I thought it was fine at first but now I'm not sure about that.  On boards where you want a Silver flood, this is easily better than gold.  On boards where you don't, it's easily worse.  Deciding whether you want a bunch of Silver is not that hard to figure out.  Maybe if it cost $7...

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Golden Touch
Types: Action
Cost: $5
Trash the top card of your deck. Gain a Gold, putting it on top of your deck.

Donald X has posted a lot before about how trashing the top card of a deck is way too swingy. I even can't think of any way to fix this.

I think that was more about an attack that did it to others.  But yeah, I guess it can be swingy if two players are playing it blindly into mid or late game.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #136 on: September 02, 2013, 08:18:38 pm »
0

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Deed
Types: Treasure – Reaction
Cost: $5
Worth $2

When you gain a Victory card, you may discard this from your hand. If you do, +2 VP.

Hey, now this is kinda cool. Looking at it from another perspective, it lets you overpay for any VP card by $2 one time to gain two VP tokens (as long as you keep this in your hand).

In other words, it's a less powerful and less flexible Stock Exchange.

Which works great, IMO.  No need to make everything unlimited.

Note 2:  A lot of cards give you VP tokens contingent on buying/gaining/possessing Victory cards.  I don't like that.  What I've always liked about VP tokens is that they are one way of enabling greenless decks.  If I'm still going to be buying green cards, I'd rather have new alt VP card.

Note 3:  As to be expected, a lot of these cards appear to just have vanilla bonuses tacked on or numbers inflated to have a high cost, presumably to fulfill the "spendy" theme.  I feel like that is misguided.  Prosperity is a place to put interesting cards which just happen to be expensive.  If you have a cool idea, but the idea does not justify a $7 price tag, then save it for a different set.  Piling on the vanilla probably won't do the trick.

I disagree with note 2.  I think VP tokens for Victory cards can work, depending on implementation.

Note 3 is great advice.

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Strong Room
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+4 Cards. +1 Action. You may return up to 4 VP tokens. Discard 4 cards, minus 1 card per VP token returned.

In games using this, at the beginning of each turn of the player who went first, each player gets +1 VP.

I suggest changing this to: +4 cards, +1 action. Do this 4 times: Discard a card; or each other player gets +1VP.

This actually changes the card quite a lot.  Now you can always keep all 4 cards, whereas with the original you are restricted by the number of VP tokens you have, and opting not to spend them means you can save them up for later. 

But a wording change like this might be necessary for practical reasons in a physical game.

Quote
Rosary
Types: Treasure – Attack
Cost: $5
Worth $2. When you play this, each other player may trash a Treasure or Action card from his hand. If he does not, he gains 2 Coppers, putting one into his hand.

Argh, somebody did a Treasure-Attack! I thought that was my privilege!? On a more serious note, i tried cards like this for a long time, and i feel this has one of the issues i met - it takes forever to play, especially forever when comared to other treasures. Keep in mind you have to wait for the players to decide before you can play your second Rosary. Or your third.

There are certainly potential issues with Treasure-Attack typing, but is slowness really one of them?  I mean, OK, it takes a bit longer compared to other Treasures.  But it doesn't really take any longer compared to other Attacks.
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Asper

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #137 on: September 02, 2013, 08:20:41 pm »
0

Wow, the feedback makes me think my card is so horrible even i shouldn't vote for it...  :-\
Well, at least it also made me change my mind on something i thought was a good idea, so... I guess it had some good effect.

By the way, when will we know the next expansion? Wednesday?
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LastFootnote

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #138 on: September 02, 2013, 08:22:49 pm »
+3

By the way, when will we know the next expansion? Wednesday?

The next expansion is Hinterlands. Sorry I haven't gotten a chance to post the thread.
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Dsell

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #139 on: September 02, 2013, 08:24:40 pm »
0

Quote
Palace
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Buy. +$1.

While this is in play, during the Buy phase, Colonies cost $2 less, but not less than $0. While this is in play, when you buy a Platinum, +2 VP.
Setup: Add Colony and Platinum to the Supply.

Should probably be +$1 then +1 Buy, but that's semantics. With the expanded card pool, I actually like the idea of a card that automatically puts Colonies into the game. This is a neat card. It's amazingly strong but it's pretty bad early, so you'd want to build an engine that can gain a lot of these in the mid-game and then play them quickly. Possibly encourages a different style of play, which is great.

It's Buy before $ on the cards I've checked (Market, Grand Market, Festival).  Also, that actually isn't semantics?  Seems more syntactic to me.  But it's not even grammar so just... format?

You are right of course! I hadn't bothered to check, I simply misremembered! You are also right about it not quite being semantics (as AJD pointed out).

It's all just details. :P

Quote
Prospector
Types: Action
Cost: $4
+1 Buy. Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put the revealed Treasure cards into your hand. Discard the rest. Each other player may discard a Treasure. If he does, he draws a card.

Seems quite strong in BM, but it might not be significantly worse than Smithy. You do want a low density. I think the penalty on it is cool, but I don't really think we need a card that's awesome in BM and BM only.

I missed how crazy good these are for BM because they just looked like "Treasure Scout" to me.  Oops.

I just realized that Prospector is (sometimes) a better Adventurer for $4! :-X
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sudgy

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #140 on: September 02, 2013, 08:54:51 pm »
0

Wow, the feedback makes me think my card is so horrible even i shouldn't vote for it...  :-\
Well, at least it also made me change my mind on something i thought was a good idea, so... I guess it had some good effect.

By the way, when will we know the next expansion? Wednesday?

Well, I already knew my card stank, so...
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   Quote from: sudgy on June 31, 2011, 11:47:46 pm

eHalcyon

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #141 on: September 02, 2013, 08:55:15 pm »
0

Quote
Workhouse
Types: Action
Cost: $7
+$4.
Oh. Snap. Look I don't care I'm voting for this because it's so amusing.

I must be missing the joke...?

Quote
Villa
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+1 Action. Play up to 2 Treasures from your hand. Draw until you have 4 cards in hand.
Hm. So in theory, the first is a +1 Card +1 Action, and the second is +3 Cards +1 Action. But if you buy too many, they all collide and you get the Stables problem. Interesting.

Are you counting wrong or am I?  As I see it:

From a 5 card hand, you play this, then you play 2 Treasures.  You have 2 cards left.  Draw up to 4 means you draw 2 cards.  So the first on is a Lab, not a cantrip.


Quote
Gemstone
Types: Treasure
Cost: $4
Worth $1. Rarity cards cost $6 less this turn, but not less than $0.

Setup: Add an extra Kingdom card pile costing $5 or more to the Supply. Cards from that pile are Rarity cards and cost $5 more.

The supply pile thing is cool, but making it cost $5 more is too much. Gemstone is realistically the only way to get that card, so it's almost like Gemstone isn't in the supply at all, but is an awkward embargo to a card you'd really rather have.

I think the point is to make the Rarity card extra good for TfB, and extra easy to get with Gemstone.

Quote
Rosary
Types: Treasure – Attack
Cost: $5
Worth $2. When you play this, each other player may trash a Treasure or Action card from his hand. If he does not, he gains 2 Coppers, putting one into his hand.

This will be really good for your opponents early. I can't really see a point in the game where I want to be buying this. Potentially a good copper flooder, but playing more copies of this weakens the former attack. Maybe ok, but I'm not convinced that this would be exciting, I guess.

I think the main time you'd want to buy this is if there is strong trashing available.  If your opponent is already clearing out Coppers without your help, then giving him more can slow him down.


Here's my thoughts, in video form!



As an aside, I've looked through the comments on my card, and I've seen mostly positive thoughts, AND at least one person saying it looks too weak and at least one saying it looks too strong, which I think is pretty awesome.

I knew you were English, but actually hearing your accent suddenly gives you +3 Sophistication.

Quote
Gemstone
Types: Treasure
Cost: $4
Worth $1. Rarity cards cost $6 less this turn, but not less than $0.

Setup: Add an extra Kingdom card pile costing $5 or more to the Supply. Cards from that pile are Rarity cards and cost $5 more.
I feel like we have a discussion about this every time someone starts a thread about a cost-raiser. If I play two Gemstones, do Rarity cards cost max(5+5-6-6,0), or max(5-6-6,0)+5? In this specific case, it's pretty easy to guess which operation has precedence, but it's still completely undefined in the Dominion rulebook. If the point was to make Rares inaccessible without Gemstones, then why not just say so? "Cards from that pile are Rarity cards and cannot be bought [gained?] unless you have a Gemstone in play."

Of course, that could be a deliberate choice for the purpose of TfB shenanigans, and I don't think that would be a good idea. Bishop/Gemstone/Gemstone would be a much cheaper golden deck which you could hit earlier and transition out of, although who knows if you could eat two other piles in time. Anyways, Peddler's already done the 'buy low, trash high' thing, and this card would still be good without the added complexity.

The cost increase is a setup rule, so it doesn't run into any of that rules confusion.

Quote
Metropolis
Types: Action
Cost: $7
+1 Card. +2 Actions. Treasure cards other than Copper produce an extra $1 this turn.

I'd like some more thoughts about Metropolis.  It's an interesting concept but it looks too powerful to me in a way that can't be balanced with simple tweaks.  Others (Dsell, XerxesPraelor, scott_pilgrim) think it looks good though, maybe even too weak for $7.  I mean, I do get that it's more meant to be used in an engine with few treasures.  Still seems too good though?  I mean, in such an engine, it's reasonable that you'd have 3-4 treasures.  That's $3-$4 from Metropolis.
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Robz888

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #142 on: September 02, 2013, 08:56:37 pm »
+2

I make no apologies for submitting an insane card. No apologies, I say!!!
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Aidan Millow

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #143 on: September 02, 2013, 09:09:18 pm »
+1

Not really important but I just want to note the combo between Stock Exchange and Charity(A): SE makes estates as profitable for you as a more expensive victory card while Charity means that buying them junks your opponent.
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Dsell

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #144 on: September 02, 2013, 09:12:41 pm »
0


Quote
Gemstone
Types: Treasure
Cost: $4
Worth $1. Rarity cards cost $6 less this turn, but not less than $0.

Setup: Add an extra Kingdom card pile costing $5 or more to the Supply. Cards from that pile are Rarity cards and cost $5 more.

The supply pile thing is cool, but making it cost $5 more is too much. Gemstone is realistically the only way to get that card, so it's almost like Gemstone isn't in the supply at all, but is an awkward embargo to a card you'd really rather have.

I think the point is to make the Rarity card extra good for TfB, and extra easy to get with Gemstone.

I know that's the point, but I don't think it would feel that way in practice. Costing $5 more will make it inaccessible to anyone without Gemstone 99.5% of the time, and Gemstone is bad enough that the only real reason to get it is for the rarity card, meaning that a) you are not really adding an extra pile, you're just shackling one card in the kingdom and b) if the rarity card sucks you're essentially playing a 9-card kingdom. The trash-for-benefit part is cool but I don't think that justifies the card and concept on the whole. You don't always have TfB! I think it could be a cool idea with tweaking, but making it completely inaccessible without a specific (otherwise weak) card is too much.

Quote
Metropolis
Types: Action
Cost: $7
+1 Card. +2 Actions. Treasure cards other than Copper produce an extra $1 this turn.

I'd like some more thoughts about Metropolis.  It's an interesting concept but it looks too powerful to me in a way that can't be balanced with simple tweaks.  Others (Dsell, XerxesPraelor, scott_pilgrim) think it looks good though, maybe even too weak for $7.  I mean, I do get that it's more meant to be used in an engine with few treasures.  Still seems too good though?  I mean, in such an engine, it's reasonable that you'd have 3-4 treasures.  That's $3-$4 from Metropolis.

I like the concept, I am not totally sure on the balance. But accumulating lots of $7 cards is not usually easy, even if it does seamlessly slip into any engine. It does snowball though, I admit.
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ConMan

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #145 on: September 02, 2013, 09:13:51 pm »
0

I'm going to look at these a few at a time, starting from the bottom (to give the lower cards a bit more love, and maybe have a different perspective on similar cards). Also, I've skimmed some of the reviews so far, but for now this is mostly my own opinions.

Quote
Queen's Palace
Types: Action
Cost: $6
+1 Action.
You may return a VP token. If you do, +3 Cards, +1 Buy, and each other player gets +1 VP.

Setup: Each player gets +2 VP.
Interesting decision involved here, as whoever plays this first either gives a 2VP swing to his opponent(s), or lets them get more plays out of this. Gets even uglier in 3p+ games. My gut feel is that this is a bit too niche to work well, but it's an interesting mechanic.

Quote
Mafia
Types: Action – Attack
Cost: $7
Each other player reveals the top 3 cards of his deck, trashes a revealed Treasure that you choose, and discards the rest. You may gain any or all of the trashed cards. +1 VP per card you gain this way.
How can a card called Mafia not involve a vote? But anyway, it's a souped-up Thief, probably a bit imbalanced - if two players both manage to get this, they could theoretically just go back and forth stealing the same treasures out of each others' deck for 1VP a play. It discourages picking up special Treasures, and probably encourages slogs since whoever plays this the most will have to choose whether to bloat their deck with Coppers for the points. I'm on the fence a bit with this one.

Quote
Witch's Trove
Types: Treasure
Cost: $6
Worth $2. When you play this, reveal you hand and discard all revealed Curses. +$3 for each Curse discarded. You may gain a Curse.
Probably quite nice in a game with a cursing attack, but without it I doubt I'd touch this - turning Curses into Gold sounds nice in theory, but unless I'm either drawing my deck or flooding it with Curses this is going to really hurt in turns when I don't get this to collide with my Curses. For Big Money in particular I think this will whiff heavily.

Quote
Palladium
Types: Treasure
Cost: $7
Worth $4. +1 Buy. When you play this, trash all Treasures you have in play. +1 VP for each card trashed.
A one-shot treasure with a huge pay-off. I don't think I'd use it to trash my starting Coppers, but as the final payload of a mega-turn this could be pretty cool. This + Venture + Bank + a few extra Buys would make for an extremely satisfying turn.

Quote
Banknote
Types: Treasure
Cost: $6
Worth $2. +1 Buy. If you have 4 or more differently named Treasures in play, +$2.
Hmm, kind of a Cornucopia+Prosperity card. If it's the only alt-Treasure, it won't pay off often but might provide a nice boost when you can't get rid of your Coppers. Would really shine in an all-Prosperity game, I think (especially once you pick up a Platinum).

Quote
Reputation
Types: Treasure
Cost: $10*
Worth $4.

Unless in play, this costs $2 less per card costing $6 or more you have in play, but not less than $0.
A variant on the Peddler mechanic, but a lot harder to get outside of all-Prosperity games. In most games, you'll only be able to afford this when you have lots of Gold, by which point you should probably be greening already. I don't think this quite works for me.

Quote
Silk Merchant
Types: Action
Cost: $5
+$2. You may trash two cards from your hand. If you do, +1 VP per token on the Trade Route mat.

Setup: Put a token on each Victory card Supply pile. When a card is gained from that pile, move the token to the Trade Route mat.

Clarification: The Trade Route mat and tokens referred to by Silk Merchant are the same as those referred to by Trade Route.  If both Trade Route and Silk Merchant are in the kingdom and/or Black Market deck, use only one token on each victory card pile.
Re-using an existing asset? I like that, and I kind of wish I'd thought of it (and I like how the card name and mechanic both hint at Silk Road). It's a decent trasher in early game, but maybe you want to hang onto a couple of junk cards for late game scoring. I'd particularly like to see a game where one player goes for this, and the other goes for Trade Route. Interesting enough that I'd like to see this playtested.

Quote
Indulgence
Types: Treasure
Cost: $5
Worth $2. +1 Buy. When you play this, the player to your left names a card in the Supply costing between $3 and $6. If you buy that card this turn, +2VP.
Hmm, a reverse Contraband? A cute way of trying to get you to buy cards that won't work well in your deck, makes for tricky decisions if your opponent picks a pile that's running low, could turn ugly if played multiple times. Would also be interesting with some Cornucopia setups since it will often incentivise variety anyway.

Quote
Smelter
Types: Action
Cost: $6
Reveal cards from your deck until you reveal an Action card, a Treasure card, and a Victory card. Trash an Action card, a Treasure card, and a Victory card from the revealed cards. If you do, gain 3 Golds.
It's Treasure Map, and yet ... it isn't. Not too bad to play once or twice if there's an Action that's either cheap or of limited utility, but very, very, very risky to play once there are a few nice cards in your deck. I don't think I'd be buying this.

Quote
Rosary
Types: Treasure – Attack
Cost: $5
Worth $2. When you play this, each other player may trash a Treasure or Action card from his hand. If he does not, he gains 2 Coppers, putting one into his hand.
And here we have Prosperity-Torturer. Probably a bit weak, since in early game it assists with Copper trashing, and in late game any half-way decent deck should be able to handle a couple of extra Coppers. I suspect this is so-so.
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SirPeebles

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #146 on: September 02, 2013, 09:20:46 pm »
0

I'm going to look at these a few at a time, starting from the bottom (to give the lower cards a bit more love, and maybe have a different perspective on similar cards).

You Aussies...  ;)
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Tables

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #147 on: September 02, 2013, 09:30:35 pm »
+2

Quote
Workhouse
Types: Action
Cost: $7
+$4.
Oh. Snap. Look I don't care I'm voting for this because it's so amusing.

I must be missing the joke...?

Oh I just got it. Poor House.

Quote
Here's my thoughts, in video form!



As an aside, I've looked through the comments on my card, and I've seen mostly positive thoughts, AND at least one person saying it looks too weak and at least one saying it looks too strong, which I think is pretty awesome.

I knew you were English, but actually hearing your accent suddenly gives you +3 Sophistication.

Sophisticated is not one of the things I would describe myself as, but I suppose it's a compliment so thank you.
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...spin-offs are still better for all of the previously cited reasons.
But not strictly better, because the spinoff can have a different cost than the expansion.

Kirian

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #148 on: September 02, 2013, 09:30:43 pm »
0

I make no apologies for submitting an insane card. No apologies, I say!!!

Just because it combos with Scout doesn't make it insane.
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SirPeebles

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Re: Treasure Chest Design Contest — Card #1: Prosperity
« Reply #149 on: September 02, 2013, 09:35:10 pm »
0

Quote
Workhouse
Types: Action
Cost: $7
+$4.
Oh. Snap. Look I don't care I'm voting for this because it's so amusing.

I must be missing the joke...?

Oh I just got it. Poor House.

Ah.  I totally missed that as well.
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