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[liopoil]

reasoning behind wanting to choose people who will make the proposal more likely to be accepted:

let's have an extreme case; say I'm like 99% sure mail-mi is resistance (I'm not 99% sure of that), and also 100% sure I'm resistance. From that I should be like "oh, cool, if I put the two of us on the mission it is very likely going to succeed!" However, I shouldn't put mail-mi on the mission because the proposal will not be accepted and so it would be pointless. I would be better off proposing a mission that has a slightly lower chance of success, but might be accepted. Since a mission with me on it from my perspective is a better mission than most, I'm willing to put people I'm a bit unsure about on my mission if it makes the mission more likely to happen.

Let's look at proposing the arch-liopoil team: arch has said he will vote against this mission because he thinks I'm a spy. So this mission would need 3/4 of the people not on the mission to agree to it. This seems very unlikely to happen, especially since TA almost certainly won't. This combined with the fact that I do not have any more reason to think he is resistance than anyone else,  (and I don't think anyone else does either), is enough for me to cross that team off the list.

munch: why do you think TA is resistance?

[Twistedarcher]

If Munch is willing to put me on a mission, then I'll almost certainly reject all the way down the line to his nomination on any mission that doesn't have me.

[EFHW]

/tag

[Twistedarcher]

Lio, I don't think I'd accept anything that didn't have me on it...

[liopoil]

I realize that, especially since it seems if it gets to munch then he will pick you. But, you know, it's possible to get a mission accepted without your vote. I also think that munch will likely reject anything that doesn't have himself or TA on it. arch will be rejecting whatever I propose. So if I choose jimmmmm I probably get rejected.

So, I think I'm choosing either TA or Munch. If I choose munch I need Jimmmmmm and mail-mi's vote. If I choose TA I just need one of those two.

mail-mi/jimmmm, what teams are you willing to accept?

[mail-mi]

Not with TA, maybe with TheMunch, probably with Jimmmmm

[Twistedarcher]

Why Jimmm, mail-mi?

Also how do you feel about Arch?

[mail-mi]

Why Jimmm, mail-mi?

Also how do you feel about Arch?

Because he seems the least spy-y out of all of y'all. Also, probably wont with arch.

[TheMunch]

If Munch is willing to put me on a mission, then I'll almost certainly reject all the way down the line to his nomination on any mission that doesn't have me.

While I appreciate the sentiment, I dont know how wise it is to categorically reject 4 in a row, just to get to me cause you "know" I'll put you on the mission.  Just because up until this point you were a strong read for me, this doesn't make you infallible.  Nothing has happened yet.

@Liopoil: My conviction is not as strong as you seem to think it is.  I wont necessarily reject anything that is not lio/TA or lio/Munch.  This might be the most likely that I would accept at this point in time, but that doesn't mean I cant be convinced.  I will reject anything that has MM on it (but naturally you wont propose that again).  After TA's comment (quoted above) I appreciate the concern for getting a mission passed that will get passed, especially when TA is prepared to reject until it is my turn to propose.  On further thought, I think I would accept any mission at this point (since MM is off the table).

Follow up for TA:  What happens if every mission gets rejected and I propose a team that doesnt include you?  What then?

[liopoil]

In that case, I will most likely choose Jimmmmmm. he is probably my biggest resistance-read. The votes of munch, mail-mi, lio, and jimmmmm are enough to get it accepted.

[Twistedarcher]

Follow up for TA:  What happens if every mission gets rejected and I propose a team that doesnt include you?  What then?

Well, then we're stuck with it, of course. I will obviously accept your proposal regardless if we get that far.

I might be willing to accept a team of Lio/Munch.

[Twistedarcher]

Actually,
I don't want Lio to go on this mission at all. He stated that if he was on the first mission with a non-spy, he would fail the mission.

He's also trying very, very, hard to get this proposal passed.

[liopoil]

Actually,
I don't want Lio to go on this mission at all. He stated that if he was on the first mission with a non-spy, he would fail the mission.

He's also trying very, very, hard to get this proposal passed.

I am. No reason putting a proposal forth if it isn't going to get accepted. Also, I have a feeling if it doesn't pass then I am not going to be on the mission, and so there would be two people who I don't know the alignment of on the mission.

I have said that. However, if you think that failing it as a spy is a bad move, then why is this a reason for you to not want me to go? Or do you think I'm a spy but lying about that so when I make the mission succeed I can say "I must be resistance because I said if I was spy I would sabotage it"? Either way, having spy!liopoil on the mission is no worse than having spy!anyone else on the mission.

...And if I see that any proposal with me on it is going to get turned down I will propose a mission that doesn't have me on it.

[Jimmmmm]

mail-mi/jimmmm, what teams are you willing to accept?

I will accept a team with me on. Any other I'm willing to consider. Really at this point I'll probably accept any unless I have a good reason not to.

[liopoil]

Specifically, want do you think about TA? munch?

[liopoil]

what*

[Jimmmmm]

I disagree with what TA is doing, but that doesn't necessarily make him a Spy. Not sure about Munch.

[liopoil]

Did a little reading, and I'm the most confident in Jimmmmm. Munch, since you're online, what do you think of Jimmmmm/do you want him on the mission?

[liopoil]

Propose mission of liopoil and Jimmmmm

[shraeye]

Propose mission of liopoil and Jimmmmm

Proposed mission team is liopoil/Jimmmmm.  Please PM me with "accept" or "reject" in the next 12 hours.

[Twistedarcher]

Sent in my vote. Not a fan of this mission really.

I find it harder to read people who vote yes on a mission because "why not". If you're resistance, more reasons to analyze are good. If you're a spy justifying a vote because "why not" makes it harder for people to read you're a spy.

[shraeye]

Mission 1, Proposal #2 -- team proposed by liopoil: jimmmm, liopoil

Accept mission team: jimmmmm, liopoil, mail-mi, TheMunch
Reject mission team: archetype, Twistedarcher

The mission is accepted.  Now liopoil and Jimmmm need to PM me privately with their intent for this mission; do you want to pass the mission, or sabotage the mission?  Remember that the good, loyal resistance members MUST pass the mission (also it's the only non-stupid option for them).  Evil spies may either pass or sabotage the mission.

[Twistedarcher]

Munch, why did you accept this one?

[liopoil]

sent in mine

[Jimmmmm]

Sent in my pass.