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Author Topic: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!  (Read 38423 times)

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brokoli

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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #75 on: August 01, 2012, 11:18:01 am »
0

Shortly :

I like trasher-villages, it's an interesting idea we haven't seen in the official Dominion. I hope there will be one in Dark ages. But my favourites are the villages that care about victory cards, because I love victory cards.

I'll probably vote for Cumin, Mustard, Turmeric, Patchouli or Juniper.
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nopawnsintended

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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #76 on: August 01, 2012, 11:39:36 am »
0

Quote
Patchouli
$5 - Action
Gain a Copper, Silver, or Gold in hand.
If you gain a Copper, +2 Cards, +2 Actions.
If you gain a Silver, +1 Action.
If you gain a Gold, discard two cards.
The Silver option is superior to Explorer's (unless you gain a gold with Explorer), it's a non-terminal Explorer. Also this card has more flexibility, you obviously choose what to gain based on how many actions you need. All these options are quite powerful. If you choose gold, and has a single silver and copper in hand, you can discard the two other cards and have a double-gold turn. Gaining a gold in hand is quite powerful.

I'm almost thinking this was a typo at 5. It seems like a 6 or 7.

Don't agree. The penalty for Gold might not be harsh enough, but it doesn't seem all that broken. Sure, the silver option is a non-terminal Explorer unless you gain a gold with Explorer. That's a pretty big unless to me.

No, really.  The card is broken in half. 

Magic Ingot
5$ - Treasure
Worth 2$
When you play this, gain a Silver.

Magic Ingot is almost strictly worse than this card and it'd never see print.

I don't understand... what's so powerful about Magic Ingot?  From the context, I presume you're saying that Magic Ingot is overpowered, and that's why it wouldn't see print.  Maybe I'm missing the point.

To the card in question, rinkworks' posts convinced me that the penalty isn't harsh enough for gaining Gold in hand.  Maybe the card would be better balanced if it read "If you gain Gold, gain an Estate and discard 5 cards."  Then, that option would be more like a gimped Vault.  In that case, it would still be a strong card, but I don't think overpowered.
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popsofctown

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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #77 on: August 01, 2012, 12:26:36 pm »
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You really don't see how much better Silver gain is than Royal Seal or Stash?  Who needs to manipulate where your cards are if you can just get more of them?  It's... I guarantee you Magic Ingot never sees print.
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nopawnsintended

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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #78 on: August 01, 2012, 12:49:41 pm »
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You really don't see how much better Silver gain is than Royal Seal or Stash?  Who needs to manipulate where your cards are if you can just get more of them?  It's... I guarantee you Magic Ingot never sees print.

I see MI being better than Stash and not quite comparable to Royal Seal (board dependent).  About the Silver gain, I'll keep that in mind.

The card that is most comparable to MI is Jack, isn't it?  Compare with Jack -- you get +$2 in the buy phase (so +Action, too) instead of self-spying, drawing up to 5, and trashing non-Treasures.  That comparison is a little hard for me to think about.  I suppose MI is way better.
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rinkworks

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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #79 on: August 02, 2012, 11:09:03 am »
+3

Quote
Nutmeg
$3 - Action
+3 Actions
--
At the beginning of your Buy phase, if you did not play any actions after this card, gain an Action card costing up to $4.
Either +3 actions, ór a slightly delayed workshop. Almost strictly better than workshop, but doesn't add much of interest. The games where workshop is of use, +actions usually aren't.

It's probably worth pointing out here that the reason Workshop often isn't good with +Actions is because what you usually use Workshop for is Gardens/SR.  But Nutmeg is "gain an Action card up to..." not "gain a card up to...."  This completely shifts the focus.  You can't use Nutmeg for alt VP rushes, but I think the theory is that you can use Nutmeg to construct engines that Workshop is ill-suited for, simply by virtue of the fact that Workshop is a terminal.  With Nutmeg, the gainer and the Village component of the engine are bundled into one card, so with Nutmeg you would be free to gain terminal actions to a degree that would be suicidal with Workshop.
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Dubdubdubdub

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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #80 on: August 02, 2012, 11:37:29 am »
0

Quote
Nutmeg
$3 - Action
+3 Actions
--
At the beginning of your Buy phase, if you did not play any actions after this card, gain an Action card costing up to $4.
Either +3 actions, ór a slightly delayed workshop. Almost strictly better than workshop, but doesn't add much of interest. The games where workshop is of use, +actions usually aren't.

It's probably worth pointing out here that the reason Workshop often isn't good with +Actions is because what you usually use Workshop for is Gardens/SR.  But Nutmeg is "gain an Action card up to..." not "gain a card up to...."  This completely shifts the focus.  You can't use Nutmeg for alt VP rushes, but I think the theory is that you can use Nutmeg to construct engines that Workshop is ill-suited for, simply by virtue of the fact that Workshop is a terminal.  With Nutmeg, the gainer and the Village component of the engine are bundled into one card, so with Nutmeg you would be free to gain terminal actions to a degree that would be suicidal with Workshop.

Hm. Good points. I find this very hard to judge now, would love to test.
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popsofctown

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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #81 on: August 02, 2012, 03:12:42 pm »
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Quote
Nutmeg
$3 - Action
+3 Actions
--
At the beginning of your Buy phase, if you did not play any actions after this card, gain an Action card costing up to $4.
Either +3 actions, ór a slightly delayed workshop. Almost strictly better than workshop, but doesn't add much of interest. The games where workshop is of use, +actions usually aren't.

It's probably worth pointing out here that the reason Workshop often isn't good with +Actions is because what you usually use Workshop for is Gardens/SR.  But Nutmeg is "gain an Action card up to..." not "gain a card up to...."  This completely shifts the focus.  You can't use Nutmeg for alt VP rushes, but I think the theory is that you can use Nutmeg to construct engines that Workshop is ill-suited for, simply by virtue of the fact that Workshop is a terminal.  With Nutmeg, the gainer and the Village component of the engine are bundled into one card, so with Nutmeg you would be free to gain terminal actions to a degree that would be suicidal with Workshop.
Workshop is good with Vineyards too, and so is this.
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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #82 on: August 05, 2012, 10:07:51 am »
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In my opinion, this is the strongest set of cards submitted for a challenge yet! Good job everyone coming up with lots of good cards. I'm sending more votes for this one than any previous challenge.  :D
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ChocophileBenj

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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #83 on: August 06, 2012, 10:19:07 am »
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Now, submissions for vote are over ! I hope you've been many to vote for my cards from this challenge and the #8 :D
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rinkworks

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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #84 on: August 06, 2012, 03:43:29 pm »
+2

The results for the Village contest are in!

As a reminder, here are the criteria for this challenge:

Quote
Design a Village card.  This is a card that must provide the player with at least +2 Actions each time it is played.  A Duration card may instead or in addition provide at least +1 Action on a future turn (e.g., Tactician).  Receipt of the extra Actions may be optional so long as it is within the player's control to receive it or not (e.g., Nobles, Hamlet), barring only marginal edge cases (i.e., deck with only a Hamlet in it; Tactician as the last card in hand).

Shockingly, I don't actually have a Village card to show off.  I regularly play with three Village fan cards which I quite enjoy.  One of them is this one, another is the same idea for $4 but the other two cards go back on the deck instead of in the discard (also a product of that thread).  And one is from WanderingWinder's Conquest expansion specifically the one called Medical Tent here, only I price it at $3.

But now let's get to to the contest results.  We've had some close votes in the past, but not this week!  The winning cards for this challenge and the Non-Attack Interaction challenge won in landslides.

#1 - Production Village by WanderingWinder with 30 points (Oregano)
$4 - Action
+2 Actions
Draw until you have 5 cards in your hand.


That makes two solid Village cards WanderingWinder has created.  This one is terrific with non-drawing terminals, although you have to accumulate multiples in hand before you start to see a benefit over vanilla Village.  With terminal discarders (Young Witch, Horse Traders) the effect is magnified, but you still need two in hand to activate the combo.  It shines against discard attacks, but the big drawback is that it fizzles if you try to construct a draw engine out of it.  In a mixed engine of other types of Villages, terminals, and drawers, you have to think about the order you play your cards, so as to maximize the benefit.

It's a long drop to second place, but that doesn't mean there weren't plenty of other solid and interesting Village cards in play.  As others have said, this was one of the strongest batches of competing cards yet.


#2 (tie) - Retirement Village by Michaelf7777777 with 19 points (Cumin)
$3 - Action-Victory
+2 Actions
+1 Buy
--
1 VP

#2 (tie) - Survivor's Village by ChocophileBenj with 19 points (Arrowroot)
$5 - Action
+1 Card
+2 Actions
--
When you gain this, gain a Survivor's Village token.
--
At the start of any turn, you may return one Survivor's Village token before you play your first action. If you do, +1 Action.

#4 - Holiday Village by Tejayes with 18 points (Mustard)
$4 - Action
+1 Card
+2 Actions
You may put a Victory card from your hand on top of your deck. If you do, +1 Buy, +$2.

#5 - Declining Village by yuma with 16 points (Chervil)
$5 - Action
If played for the first time this turn: +2 Cards, +2 actions, +$1.
All other plays: +$1, +2 Actions.

#6 - Mining Settlement by nopawnsintended with 15 points (Patchouli)
$5 - Action
Gain a Copper, Silver, or Gold in hand.
If you gain a Copper, +2 Cards, +2 Actions.
If you gain a Silver, +1 Action.
If you gain a Gold, discard two cards.

#7 (tie) - Convoy by Saucery with 13 points (Vanilla)
$4 - Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
Choose one: +1 Action, or discard your hand and draw 4 cards.

#7 (tie) - Abandoned Village by Graystripe77 with 13 points (Cinnamon)
$4 - Action-Reaction
+1 Card
+2 Actions
--
When a player gains a Victory card, you may set this aside. If you do, gain a Silver in hand. Return this to your hand at the start of your next turn.

#9 - College Town by Polk5440 with 12 points (Stevia)
$3 - Action
Choose one: +2 Actions, or all players draw up to 6 cards in hand. You may set aside any Treasure cards drawn this way, as you draw them; discard the set aside cards after you finish drawing.
--
(Rules clarification: If the draw option is exercised, only the player who played the card may set aside Treasure cards as he draws up to 6 cards in hand; all other players simply draw up to 6 cards in hand.)

#10 (tie) - Posh Village by popsofctown with 11 points (Lemongrass)
$4 - Action
+1 Card
+2 Actions
--
When you discard this from play, you may put it on top of your deck if you bought a Treasure this turn.

#10 (tie) - Encampment by Nicrosil with 11 points (Garlic)
$3 - Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
You may trash this card immediately. If you do, +1 Action.
--
When you buy this card, gain two copies of it.
--
Special rule: The supply pile for Encampment has 30 copies of it.

#10 (tie) - Philosopher by Dubdubdubdub with 11 points (Cayenne)
$3P - Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
Choose one: +1 Card, +1 Action, +$1, +1 Buy.

#13 (tie) - Gambling House by Kirian with 10 points (Savory)
$4 - Action-Attack
+2 Actions
+$1
Each other player may discard a Treasure card.  If he doesn't, he gains a Copper.

#13 (tie) - Royal Village by brokoli with 10 points (Juniper)
$4 - Action
+1 Card
+2 Actions
You may discard an Province. If you do, +1 Card.
--
In games using this, when you gain an Estate, you may gain a Royal Village.

#13 (tie) - Merchants' Village by zahlman with 10 points (Dill)
$5 - Action
+1 Card
+2 Actions
--
While this is in play, when you gain a card worth $3 or more, +1 VP.

#16 (tie) - Pristine Village by Garth One-eye with 9 points (Paprika)
$5 - Action
+2 Actions
Put a card in play other than a Pristine Village into your hand.

#16 (tie) - Township by One Armed Man with 9 points (Nutmeg)
$3 - Action
+3 Actions
--
At the beginning of your Buy phase, if you did not play any actions after this card, gain an Action card costing up to $4.

#16 (tie) - Workhorse by Drab Emordnilap with 9 points (Mace)
$2 - Action
Choose one: +2 Cards; or +2 Actions; or +$2; or +2 Buys.

#19 (tie) - Flying Machine by FishingVillage with 8 points (Thyme)
$4 - Action-Reaction
Choose one: +2 Cards or +3 Actions.
--
When you discard this from play, you may put it on top of your deck.
--
When you discard this other than during a Clean-Up phase, you may reveal it. If you do, set this aside, then at the start of your next turn, return it to your hand.

#19 (tie) - Kolkhoz by Qvist with 8 points (Sesame)
$4 - Action
Choose one: Draw until you have 6 cards in hand; or: +2 Actions, +$1, +1 Buy.

#19 (tie) - Metalworking Village by Schneau with 8 points (Lavender)
$4 - Action-Reaction
+1 Card
+2 Actions
--
When another player gains a Treasure, you may discard this card from your hand and gain a copy of the Treasure card they gained.

#19 (tie) - Micro Village by Powerman with 8 points (Clove)
$2 - Action
+2 Actions
You may gain a Copper in hand.

#23 (tie) - Observatory Village by Dsell with 7 points (Borage)
$5 - Action
+4 Cards
+2 Actions
Put 4 cards on top of your deck in any order.

#23 (tie) - Community by Tables with 7 points (Anise)
$3 - Action
+2 Actions
+$1
+$1 for every three actions in play, including this.

#25 (tie) - Contractor by dnkywin with 6 points (Turmeric)
$4 - Action
+1 Card
You may trash or discard 1 card from your hand. If you do, pick one: +2 Actions, +2 Cards, +$2.

#25 (tie) - Trading Village by Davio with 6 points (Tarragon)
$5 - Action
+2 Actions
Trash up to 2 cards from your hand.  +1 Card for every card trashed this way.

#25 (tie) - Village Square by Bella Cullen with 6 points (Poppy)
$4 - Action
+1 Card
+2 Actions
Choose one: +1 Card, +$1, or trash a card from your hand.  If you choose...
+1 Card, each other player draws a card.
+$1, each other player gains a Copper in hand.
Trash a card, +1 VP, and each other player may trash a card from his hand.

#25 (tie) - Underground Village by NoMoreFun with 6 points (Fennel)
$2 - Action
+2 Actions
Place any number of cards on the bottom of your deck.
For each card you do, +1 Card.
Place any number of cards on top of your deck.
For each card you do, +$1.

#25 (tie) - Refuge City by heatthespurs with 6 points (Cilantro)
$4 - Action-Reaction
+1 Card
+2 Actions
--
When another player plays an Attack card, or during your Buy phrase, you may reveal this together with any number of Action cards from your hand. Put all revealed cards on top of your deck in any order.

#30 (tie) - Prospector by Guy Srinivasan with 5 points (Rosemary)
$7 - Action-Duration
At the start of each of your turns, choose two: +1 Action; +1 Buy; put a Prospector token on this card; +$1 per token on this card, then trash this card. (The choices must be different.)

#30 (tie) - Population Boom by Auto-Destruct Sequence with 5 points (Parsley)
$3 - Action
+2 Actions
If you have played Population Boom at least...
2 times: +1 Card
3 times: +$1
4 timec: +1 Buy
5 times: +1 VP

#30 (tie) - Railway Town by Jack Rudd with 5 points (Fenugreek)
$5 - Action
+1 Card
+2 Actions
If you have played Railway Town two or more times this turn, +1 Buy.
If you have played it three or more times this turn, +$1.
If you have played it four or more times this turn, +1 Card.
If you have played it five or more times this turn, +1 VP.

#30 (tie) - Resort Village by Mecherath with 5 points (Cardamom)
$5 - Action
+1 Card
+2 Actions
You may discard a Victory card from your hand.  If you do, +$ equal to one third its cost in coins, rounded up.

#30 (tie) - Installation by Morgrim7 with 5 points (Caraway)
$3 - Action-Attack
+1 Card
Discard any number of cards.  +1 Action per card discarded.
Each other player gains an Estate, putting it into their hand.

#35 (tie) - Sacked Village by eHalcyon with 4 points (Saffron)
$2 - Action
+1 Card
You may discard a card; if you do, +1 Action.  You may trash a card; if you do, +2 Actions.

#35 (tie) - Judge by Tdog with 4 points (Mint)
$5 - Action
+2 Cards
+2 Actions
--
When at least one Judge is in play and you gain a Province or Colony, every other player gains a gold, putting it into their hand.

#35 (tie) - Lost Village by Robz888 with 4 points (Marjoram)
$4 - Action-Duration
+2 Cards
At the start of your next turn, +2 Actions.

#38 - Allied Village by andwilk with 3 points (Allspice)
$4 - Action-Reaction
+1 Card
+2 Actions
If any Supply Victory card pile is empty, +1 Card.
--
When an opponent plays an attack card, you may reveal and set this aside from your hand.  If you do, +1 VP.  Restore this to your hand at the start of your turn.

#39 - Greenhouse by DWetzel with 2 points (Coriander)
$3 - Action-Duration
Now and during your next turn: +1 Action, and you may play Victory cards as though they are Treasure cards.  Victory cards played in this manner provide $1, plus $(1/3 of the printed VP on the Victory card, rounded down).
--
(Rules clarifications: The "printed VP" refers to the victory points provided by the card, e.g. Estate = 1 VP, Duchy = 3 VP, etc.  Victory cards with no printed VP total on them, e.g. Gardens, Silk Road, and Fairgrounds, provide just the flat $1.  Victory cards played in this way are not Treasure cards and do not count for cards which look at Treasure cards, like Bank, Venture, and Loan.)

#40 (tie) - Factory by A Drowned Kernel with 1 point (Sage)
$6 - Action-Duration
At the beginning of every one of your turns, +1 Action, +1 Buy.
--
While this card is in play, during your turn, Victory cards cost $2 more and non-Victory cards cost $1 more.

#40 (tie) - Precinct by Adrienaline with 1 point (Ginger)
$1 - Action
+1 Card
+2 Actions
If you have 2 or more unused actions left at the end of your turn, during the clean-up phase, draw 7 cards instead of 5.
--
This card cannot be bought if you have any treasures in play.

#40 (tie) - Plaza by Fragasnap with 1 point (Basil)
$4 - Action
+2 Actions
+$1 for each differently named card you have in play (including this).
--
When you buy this, you may gain a Plaza.

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Kirian

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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #85 on: August 06, 2012, 03:55:22 pm »
0

Congrats WW!
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One Armed Man

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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #86 on: August 06, 2012, 04:01:04 pm »
0

Congrats!

Also, I made Township-Nutmeg. I tested it out. It barely lost in a few games, including when I had a Conspirator chain with Townships compared to with Mining Villages. Township actually works best when you are using cantrips like Tournament, Caravan, and Menagerie, since it lets you safely gain the actions at the end. I didn't think it was great, just that it was a useful village sometimes.
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Robz888

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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #87 on: August 06, 2012, 04:10:08 pm »
0

Really liked my village, thought it was better than my other submitted cards, glad to see it... tie for 35th place? Ack, my worst finish yet!
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ChocophileBenj

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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #88 on: August 06, 2012, 04:15:15 pm »
0

Well done, WW !!
And thanks to everybody who voted for me, and everybody who voted too. It's true, there were many great villages among these, and the key was to find the right thing that should come with the 2 actions.

For the name "Survivor's Village", I imaginated some people that you would rescue from a catastrophe when you gain this, and they would be glad to help you back later, and I loved this idea (even if the name wasn't taken into account in the subset).
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Schneau

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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #89 on: August 06, 2012, 04:16:33 pm »
0

Congrats WW! We still don't have any overlapping inventors - shows the strength and depth of this community!
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FishingVillage

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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #90 on: August 06, 2012, 05:08:05 pm »
0

Nice job WW! :)

Given how much it got pooped on in here, I thought Flying Machine would finish way lower than it did, and I agree that this particular contest had a lot of cards that were pretty cool.
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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #91 on: August 06, 2012, 06:39:24 pm »
0

Hmm, a tie for 30th. Well, at least it got some votes.

One of these days, I suppose I'll have to design a card where the card name isn't so highly tied in with its mechanics.
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Tejayes

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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #92 on: August 06, 2012, 07:45:39 pm »
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4th place! I knew my justification that it was between Village and Festival would garner some extra points. Still, I'm very happy with the winner, as it was my favorite village. I also really liked the two other cards that beat me, so I'm delighted with this result.
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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #93 on: August 06, 2012, 07:54:06 pm »
0

Given how much it got pooped on in here, I thought Flying Machine would finish way lower than it did

I got that impression for Merchant's Village too. But then it wasn't really clear whether people were pooping on it or just imagining the craziness. FWIW I have my own thoughts on the card that I'll be sharing at the end of the contest. But basically, yeah, the whole time I was reading the thread I was thinking "b...b...but I thought people *like* Goons?"
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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #94 on: August 06, 2012, 08:24:37 pm »
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Given how much it got pooped on in here, I thought Flying Machine would finish way lower than it did

I got that impression for Merchant's Village too. But then it wasn't really clear whether people were pooping on it or just imagining the craziness. FWIW I have my own thoughts on the card that I'll be sharing at the end of the contest. But basically, yeah, the whole time I was reading the thread I was thinking "b...b...but I thought people *like* Goons?"

I think it's easier to get the impression that more people dislike your card than is really the case because I think people (myself to some extent, too) simply ignore the uninteresting/obviously broken cards and don't always say the most positive things about the ones they like. A person doesn't have to like everything about a card to vote for it. For instance, I was planning on giving Mustard/Holiday Village an approval vote even before Tejayes's justification about it's cost.

4th place! I knew my justification that it was between Village and Festival would garner some extra points. Still, I'm very happy with the winner, as it was my favorite village. I also really liked the two other cards that beat me, so I'm delighted with this result.

 By the way, I maintain it's under-priced.  :)
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WanderingWinder

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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #95 on: August 07, 2012, 12:19:42 am »
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You may be interested to know that I went back and forth for a long time between what I submitted, and a version that costed 5 and drew up to 6.

zahlman

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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #96 on: August 07, 2012, 11:36:27 am »
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You may be interested to know that I went back and forth for a long time between what I submitted, and a version that costed 5 and drew up to 6.

I think the submitted version is clearly better - it follows the existing theme of $4-Village-plus cards decently, and the $5 version would vary quite a bit in its utility - if you play it as the first action on a normal turn, it's a Trusty Steed, but it'll be a normal Village or worse so much of the time that it's used in a draw-your-deck engine. A part of me likes the idea of going even further and making it a Library-Village combination, but that would be amazingly OP in a lot of situations.
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One Armed Man

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Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #7: Village!
« Reply #97 on: August 30, 2012, 02:52:01 pm »
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The Medical Tent card rinkworks mentioned as maybe costing 3. A WanderingWinder card:  It had +2 cards. discard any number of cards, +1 action for each card discarded. At $3 or $4 it is is strictly better than +2 cards, +1 action, discard a card. That was a DXV idea. I wonder if a variant on that idea could work?
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