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[Tables]

I will assume you're familiar with the rules from the signups thread. For plot cards, only the first leader gets one. The deck consists of:

2x Strong Leader
2x Keeping a Close Eye on You
1x No Confidence
1x Opinion Maker
1x Take Responsibility

Whose effects can be found here.

Deadlines:

For the first leader in each round, the leader will have a 5 day deadline for giving out the plot card, and a 6 day deadline running concurrently to propose a team (the plot card must be distributed first). Missing the plot card deadline will result in a random person chosen, missing the team proposal deadline will result in a random team being chosen.

For the second and onward leader in each round, the leader will have a 5 day deadline for proposing a team.

Voting will have a 2 day deadline from the team being proposed. Failure to vote will result in a no vote being cast. Voting will end early once all votes are in and I have seen them all.

Missions will have a 1 day deadline. Only spies need to submit a decision for the mission. They may submit their choice in advance with their vote for the mission. Missions will never end early unless the game will end as a result of the mission - this is to protect the spies right to think in cases they need to make a non-trivial decision (e.g. both are on a mission). In the rare case of a spy missing the submission for a mission they will default to sabotage.

I will not wait for plot cards people have in cases they can be played, with the exception of Opinion Maker (see below). If you have a plot card, please leave CO (conditional orders) for when you want to use them. If you are very likely to want to use a plot card but need to see certain results to decide on whom (this mostly applies to Keeping a Close Eye on You) I will allow you to CO for me to wait for you on that.

If/when opinion maker is in the game, I will give a minimum of 1 day for voting after the opinion maker's vote has been cast. You may still wish to CO (conditional order) your vote depending on how the opinion maker does vote.

The role PMs in this game look like this:

You are a resistance operative



You win if the resistance succeed on 3 missions. You lose if the spies sabotage 3 missions

You are a spy



The two spies are:
X
Z

You win if the spies successfully sabotage 3 missions. You lose if the resistance complete 3 missions

Finally rules. Shamelessly stolen and adapted from Axxle, who stole them from Mafiascum.

General Gameplay and Etiquette:
1. You may not quote private Moderator-supplied information (either real or fabricated) of any kind. Paraphrasing is acceptable.
2. There is to be NO personal communication outside of the forum postings. This includes Spies!
3. As a general rule you should aim for one post every 48 hours, minimum, to keep the game moving.
4: You may talk at ALL stages of the game. This means during proposals, voting, and missions. There is never a period where communication is banned.

Miscellaneous/Mechanics:
1. Bold, blue text is reserved for the Mod.
2. No invisible/small text is allowed, nor is cryptography, or obscuring text in any way.
3. If you have an issue/problem with the game, please PM the Mod privately. Do not post issues/complaints in the game thread.
4. The Mod may make mistakes - please point out any mistakes gently. Mistakes will be corrected where possible, but sometimes mistakes are made that cannot be reversed. These will stand as final to be commiserated over after the game.
5. Please bold and double hashtag ## all requests to the Mod so that they don’t get missed. This includes all final actions (giving out plot cards, proposing a team, public vote if you have Opinion Maker).
6. Prods of missing players will be issued automatically after 72 hours of no activity or upon request after 48 hours of no activity. A prodded player has 48 hours to respond or risks replacement. A player who has been prodded 3 times is subject to replacement without further notice.
7. Rule violations will be dealt with according to their severity.
8. If you anticipate being unavailable for more than a 48-hour period please post a notice to that effect in the thread. Treat this game as a commitment. Be considerate – don’t leave us hanging.

The next post is reserved as the information dump. Please do not post until the game has been started.

[Tables]

Players (inorder of leadership, this has been randomised):
WrathOfGlod
Morgrim7
Thisisnotasmile
Galzria
eHalcyon
Robz888

Missions list:

Mission 1 - 2 operatives: Sending thieves to the Silk Road - Mission successful
Mission 2 - 3 operatives: Smuggling Spies into the Gardens - Mission successful
Mission 3 - 4 operatives: Setting up Saboteurs into the tunnel
Mission 4 - 3 operatives: Getting Minions onto the Island
Mission 5 - 4 operatives: Turning the Followers against the Duke

Mission 1: WrathOfGlod draws the plot card No Confidence and gives it to Galzria
Mission 2: eHalcyon draws the plot card Opinion Maker and gives it to Morgrim7
Mission 3: Thisisnotasmile draws the plot card Strong Leader

Mission 1.1 by WrathOfGod:
Team: WrathOfGlod, eHalcyon,
Yes: Morgrim7, eHalcyon,
No: WrathOfGlod, Thisisnotasmile, Galzria, Robz888,
Result: Yes - 2, No - 4
Proposal Fails

Mission 1.2 by Morgrim7:
Team: Morgrim7, Thisisnotasmile,
Yes: Morgrim7,
No: WrathOfGlod, Thisisnotasmile, Galzria, eHalcyon, Robz888,
Result: Yes - 1, No - 5
Proposal Fails

Mission 1.3 by Thisisnotasmile:
Team: Thisisnotasmile, Robz888,
Yes: Morgrim7, Thisisnotasmile, Robz888,
No: WrathOfGlod, Galzria, eHalcyon,
Result: Yes - 3, No - 3
Proposal Fails

Mission 1.4 by Galzria:
Team: Galzria, eHalcyon,
Yes: WrathOfGlod, Morgrim7, Thisisnotasmile, eHalcyon, Robz888,
No: Galzria,
Result: Yes - 5, No - 1
Proposal passes

Mission 1 Results
Co-operate
Co-operate
Mission succeeds. Score is now Resistance - 1, Spy - 0

Mission 2.1 by eHalcyon:
Team: Thisisnotasmile, eHalcyon, Robz888,
Yes: Thisisnotasmile, Robz888,
No: WrathOfGlod, Morgrim7, Galzria, eHalcyon,
Result: Yes - 2, No - 4
Proposal Fails

Mission 2.2 by Robz888:
Team: WrathOfGlod, Thisisnotasmile, Robz888,
Yes: WrathOfGlod, Thisisnotasmile, Robz888,
No: Morgrim7, Galzria, eHalcyon,
Result: Yes - 3, No - 3
Proposal Fails

Mission 2.3 proposed by: WrathOfGlod:
Team Proposed: WrathOfGlod, Thisisnotasmile, Robz888
Voting YES: Thisisnotasmile, Galzria, Robz888
Voting NO: WrathOfGlod, Morgrim7, eHalcyon
Result: Yes - 3, No - 3
Proposal Fails

Mission 2.4 proposed by: Morgrim7:
Team Proposed: WrathOfGlod, Morgrim7, Galzria
Voting YES: WrathOfGlod, Morgrim7, Thisisnotasmile, Galzria, eHalcyon
Voting NO: Robz888
Result: Yes - 5, No - 1
Proposal passes

Mission 2 Results
Co-operating: 3
Sabotage: 0
Mission succeeds. Score is now Resistance - 2, Spies - 0

[Tables]

All role PMs have been distributed. The game has now begun.

Mission 1: Two operatives must be sent

WrathOfGlod draws the plot card No Confidence.

Deadline for giving out the plot card is 14:43:54 GMT on Wednesday 30th May. Deadline for proposing a team is 14:43:54 GMT on Thursday 31st May[/color.

[WrathOfGlod]

###I give the plot card no-confidence to Galzria
 (I have no information so am basically choosing randomly)

[Thisisnotasmile]

I think for now I should

[Galzria]

Man, I wake up, open the forums, and go "Oh boy! *unrealistic cartoon excitement* A new game has started! Open link, open link, open link! ... And already I've got a vote of no confidence??? Man I must suck at these games!

... Ok, now I should follow up and read what that actually means and what I'm supposed to do...

[Galzria]

 

[Thisisnotasmile]

Ahahahahaha. It's a good thing. It means YOU can vote a mission down whenever you choose, no matter what everyone else wants.

[WrathOfGlod]

## I propose WrathOfGlod and eHalycon ##

[Galzria]

## I propose WrathOfGlod and eHalycon ##

So let me see if I understand this:

Outcome of round 1: Fail or Pass. 2 Players involved.

There is a 33% chance that one of you is a spy. If we fail, then we have 2 *may be spies*, and 4 *don't know*. If we pass, most likely we have 2 Resistance, and 4 *don't know* (Although a spy may pass a first round mission to cover himself for future rounds).

Round 2, we have to send half the team. If we fail round 1 and round 2, then we are one win away from loosing, and sending a whopping FOUR round 3. In the case that we failed round 1, well, things seem bad. Do we choose 3 from the remaining 4 and risk two early failures (since unless BOTH were spies round 1, there is a 75% of hitting a spy by choosing 3 new members of the remaining 4), or try to pick the Resistance member from the first mission and add 2 new faces? Like I said, failing both would be catastrophic.

If we pass round 1, do we aim to keep the same two and add a third member (seems to be the safest?), or do we consider there may have been a spy bluffing?

Ah!! I don't know.  I can't see much to be gained from NOT letting the early mission go through. Unless you play this out like Mafia looking for tells until you have to vote? But here we gain actual useful information by a pass/fail, and with just 2 going out, our odds of passing will never be higher (until we can eliminate possible spies from future missions).

Thoughts? Am I understanding this correctly?

[Thisisnotasmile]

Yeah, you're understanding correctly. Basically, we have no information and during the course of the game, we're going to get some, but not really enough. The only way to increase the odds of mission one passing (i.e. better than choosing randomly), is to send me, because I am a guaranteed Resistance member (but hey, aren't we all?).

And for experience, Spies bluff mission one. It's pretty rare to see red on the first mission, but it's possible and the plot cards may change that (I usually play without them).

[Thisisnotasmile]

from experience*

(## Are we allowed to edit posts in this game?)

[eHalcyon]

## I propose WrathOfGlod and eHalycon ##

So let me see if I understand this:

Outcome of round 1: Fail or Pass. 2 Players involved.

There is a 33% chance that one of you is a spy. If we fail, then we have 2 *may be spies*, and 4 *don't know*. If we pass, most likely we have 2 Resistance, and 4 *don't know* (Although a spy may pass a first round mission to cover himself for future rounds).

Round 2, we have to send half the team. If we fail round 1 and round 2, then we are one win away from loosing, and sending a whopping FOUR round 3. In the case that we failed round 1, well, things seem bad. Do we choose 3 from the remaining 4 and risk two early failures (since unless BOTH were spies round 1, there is a 75% of hitting a spy by choosing 3 new members of the remaining 4), or try to pick the Resistance member from the first mission and add 2 new faces? Like I said, failing both would be catastrophic.

If we pass round 1, do we aim to keep the same two and add a third member (seems to be the safest?), or do we consider there may have been a spy bluffing?

Ah!! I don't know.  I can't see much to be gained from NOT letting the early mission go through. Unless you play this out like Mafia looking for tells until you have to vote? But here we gain actual useful information by a pass/fail, and with just 2 going out, our odds of passing will never be higher (until we can eliminate possible spies from future missions).

Thoughts? Am I understanding this correctly?

I don't really want to check over the math, but the logic seems about right.  However, as part of the Resistance, it's advantageous for us to vote no more often than not.  Here's an article about it.

Keep in mind that, although we don't know the roles of the others, we do know our own roles.  That means that, if you are a RO, you know the mission has a better chance of success if YOU are on the mission yourself.  For that reason, I will be voting yes for this mission proposal.  However, if WoG had not picked me, I would vote no.  If the proposal then fails, we get MORE information with which to pick out spies: who voted for the team to go through.  Of course, the spies will probably try to vote as much like RO as they can, but they may slip up.

An important rule that I don't think was mentioned above: if team proposal fails FIVE times in a row, the spies automatically win.  This makes cards like No Confidence extremely powerful, so be careful with the power you now wield, Galzria.

## I want a clarification from Tables -- Votes on mission proposals are to be PM'd directly to you, correct?  The reason is that those votes are supposed to be revealed simultaneously (unless someone has Opinion Maker).  Also, can you verify the rule I mentioned above?  I may have remembered it incorrectly, or perhaps you prefer running a variant.

[Galzria]

## I propose WrathOfGlod and eHalycon ##

So let me see if I understand this:

Outcome of round 1: Fail or Pass. 2 Players involved.

There is a 33% chance that one of you is a spy. If we fail, then we have 2 *may be spies*, and 4 *don't know*. If we pass, most likely we have 2 Resistance, and 4 *don't know* (Although a spy may pass a first round mission to cover himself for future rounds).

Round 2, we have to send half the team. If we fail round 1 and round 2, then we are one win away from loosing, and sending a whopping FOUR round 3. In the case that we failed round 1, well, things seem bad. Do we choose 3 from the remaining 4 and risk two early failures (since unless BOTH were spies round 1, there is a 75% of hitting a spy by choosing 3 new members of the remaining 4), or try to pick the Resistance member from the first mission and add 2 new faces? Like I said, failing both would be catastrophic.

If we pass round 1, do we aim to keep the same two and add a third member (seems to be the safest?), or do we consider there may have been a spy bluffing?

Ah!! I don't know.  I can't see much to be gained from NOT letting the early mission go through. Unless you play this out like Mafia looking for tells until you have to vote? But here we gain actual useful information by a pass/fail, and with just 2 going out, our odds of passing will never be higher (until we can eliminate possible spies from future missions).

Thoughts? Am I understanding this correctly?

I don't really want to check over the math, but the logic seems about right.  However, as part of the Resistance, it's advantageous for us to vote no more often than not.  Here's an article about it.

Keep in mind that, although we don't know the roles of the others, we do know our own roles.  That means that, if you are a RO, you know the mission has a better chance of success if YOU are on the mission yourself.  For that reason, I will be voting yes for this mission proposal.  However, if WoG had not picked me, I would vote no.  If the proposal then fails, we get MORE information with which to pick out spies: who voted for the team to go through.  Of course, the spies will probably try to vote as much like RO as they can, but they may slip up.

An important rule that I don't think was mentioned above: if team proposal fails FIVE times in a row, the spies automatically win.  This makes cards like No Confidence extremely powerful, so be careful with the power you now wield, Galzria.

## I want a clarification from Tables -- Votes on mission proposals are to be PM'd directly to you, correct?  The reason is that those votes are supposed to be revealed simultaneously (unless someone has Opinion Maker).  Also, can you verify the rule I mentioned above?  I may have remembered it incorrectly, or perhaps you prefer running a variant.

I can understand that, however I think it's fair to note that the spies will be playing the same way (as you point out). They will be voting "no" until a mission is proposed with a spy in it. This last sentence is VERY important because they DO have more information than us. They know who their fellow spy is. So they don't HAVE to wait for themselves to get chosen as a mission operative.

Also, it was my understanding ##And clarification would be nice, that mission assignment votes were public, but mission success votes were private? Is this correct? Do we cast assignment votes here (I believe this was the case), or in a PM to Tables, who will reveal at the time all are cast? Can a vote be changed once cast (up until Table's either posts or recognizes the the acceptance/denial of mission assignments)?

[eHalcyon]

I can understand that, however I think it's fair to note that the spies will be playing the same way (as you point out). They will be voting "no" until a mission is proposed with a spy in it. This last sentence is VERY important because they DO have more information than us. They know who their fellow spy is. So they don't HAVE to wait for themselves to get chosen as a mission operative.

Yes.  This is one of the slip-ups that we can find.  If someone votes YES on a team they are not on, perhaps they are a Spy sending a fellow Spy on a mission!  (Or maybe they're just messing with everyone.)

Also, it was my understanding ##And clarification would be nice, that mission assignment votes were public, but mission success votes were private? Is this correct? Do we cast assignment votes here (I believe this was the case), or in a PM to Tables, who will reveal at the time all are cast? Can a vote be changed once cast (up until Table's either posts or recognizes the the acceptance/denial of mission assignments)?

In the official IRL game, mission assignment votes are cast publicly but simultaneously.  If this were not the case, the Opinion Maker plot card would be meaningless.  In a forum setting, the only way to ensure simultaneity is to PM the mod, who can post all votes at once (with names attached).  Mission success votes are private and secret, of course -- you don't see who voted what.

Official votes should not be change-able, but I believe we can discuss what we intend to vote without it being binding.  Above, I said that I would vote yes on this proposal.  We can continue to discuss it and I might change my mind in the end.  That's very unlikely in the first round though.  Similarly, if I'm not on the team, I will probably vote No straight through to the fifth proposal.

Oh, except that I would say to pass it on the FOURTH right now, because Galzria holds No Confidence.  If he's a spy and we end up in a fifth vote, Galzria could use it to end the game immediately (assuming that that rule is in effect).

[Galzria]

Oh, great.  So the result of the first mission will rest on who *I* choose (leader #4)... 

[Galzria]

Perhaps it should be noted (for valuable information or not), that WoG DID choose me to give the Plot Card to, knowing that IF I were a spy and it got to vote 5, I could end the game. It is important because he would have known before assigning the plot card that I was leader #4.

[eHalcyon]

Perhaps it should be noted (for valuable information or not), that WoG DID choose me to give the Plot Card to, knowing that IF I were a spy and it got to vote 5, I could end the game. It is important because he would have known before assigning the plot card that I was leader #4.

That is, if he is a spy, you might also be a spy?

While it still matters (why wouldn't a spy give a power card to another spy? to throw people off?), the 5-fail rule doesn't indicate anything here because (unless I'm seriously failing at reading) it isn't in the OP.  WoG might not have known about the rule.

Also, the vote might *not* go all the way to vote 4.  It depends on the temperament of the group.

[Galzria]

Perhaps it should be noted (for valuable information or not), that WoG DID choose me to give the Plot Card to, knowing that IF I were a spy and it got to vote 5, I could end the game. It is important because he would have known before assigning the plot card that I was leader #4.

That is, if he is a spy, you might also be a spy?

While it still matters (why wouldn't a spy give a power card to another spy? to throw people off?), the 5-fail rule doesn't indicate anything here because (unless I'm seriously failing at reading) it isn't in the OP.  WoG might not have known about the rule.

Also, the vote might *not* go all the way to vote 4.  It depends on the temperament of the group.

Haha. I'm honestly not even sure! X.x I just thought that perhaps it might not be coincidence and might be worth noting.

Anyway, I know many of our members (well, Robz in particular) don't post until later at night, so I'll shush up for awhile and let others have their input. I've noted before though, I live on the forums now, so I'm never more than a simple click-of-the-heels away. 

[Robz888]

Hi everybody! Wow. Off to the races again! This is good, though, both Mafia games are in night right now.

Okay, I think I get it. Well, I get it, though I'm not sure about strategic considerations. So, I'm going last to be Leader, which means I absolutely won't be Leader before we vote down 5 teams and lose the game. So every team is pretty much the same to me--because I don't get to pick it--so wouldn't I just vote yes here?

Or wait, I want to vote yes when I'm on the team! Right? Do I? If everybody did that we would never agree on a team, though.

[eHalcyon]

Hi everybody! Wow. Off to the races again! This is good, though, both Mafia games are in night right now.

Okay, I think I get it. Well, I get it, though I'm not sure about strategic considerations. So, I'm going last to be Leader, which means I absolutely won't be Leader before we vote down 5 teams and lose the game. So every team is pretty much the same to me--because I don't get to pick it--so wouldn't I just vote yes here?

Or wait, I want to vote yes when I'm on the team! Right? Do I? If everybody did that we would never agree on a team, though.

I'm just going by stuff I've read.  I only learned the game about a week ago (a friend mentioned it and I was interested because of the thread that started this game off) and I went and read some theory and stuff.  Might be safer to go read that thread I linked, and maybe search for others if you're interested.

Typically you wouldn't end up voting 5 teams down unless the spies manage to pull some shenanigans usually involving Plot Cards (specifically No Confidence and Strong Leader).  It's *usually* safe enough to vote down 4 teams and approve the 5th.  The presence of No Confidence means that, until it is used, we can safely vote down 3 but then we'd have to approve the 4th.

[Galzria]

How long am I able to hold onto a Plot card unplayed? Until the end of a round... or until I play it?

[eHalcyon]

How long am I able to hold onto a Plot card unplayed? Until the end of a round... or until I play it?

Of the plot cards in this game, Opinion Maker is permanent and Take Responsibility is immediate use.  The others can be held onto until you want to use them, and they are single-use.

Take Responsibility forces you to immediately take someone else's plot card.  This is the only way that Opinion Maker can be moved.

[Robz888]

So, uh, TINAS is the mafia! (Oops, wrong game.) TINAS is a spy! There we go.

[Galzria]

Not a lot of chatter today. I think everyone has checked in except Morgrim. Sooo, what's new? Oh, and for the record, Robz is much to crafty. Don't listen to anything he says. He's the spy.