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Author Topic: Inherited is underwhelming and needs to be eliminated in the third edition  (Read 1677 times)

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Honkeyfresh

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I really like the addition of all of the different side things whether they be Landmarks, Traits, Events, Ways etc what the hell is Inherited? All of the other non-supply pile interactions have extremely intricate and interesting effects on a game. They essentially take a normal deck and cause something unique to affect everything. There is a lot of strategy associated with when to buy or even if to buy certain things. Which makes it interesting and allows for a lot of interesting strategic decisions. Inherited does none of these things. First off it's literally over after the first move or really before the first Move actually. That's it.  You both gain and lose one card. In like 3% of cases ever there is a very slight strategic decision on whether to give a copper or an estate. After that, the trait is over. It's just given to you before the first turn. There's no decision given to the player. It doesn't impact the deck in any way other than giving us slightly more buying power or something. And it gives it to both of us so it's just kind of like a non-event really let's just say that there are a lot of other landmarks events traits etc. that I get very excited but I see you up here on the board. There are a lot of other ones that I hate or just don't like seeing because I don't like them. But like I see inherited on the board it's basically just a collective "whatever".  It's just kind of pointless really.
« Last Edit: October 05, 2023, 07:10:04 pm by Honkeyfresh »
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LibraryAdventurer

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You mean the Inherited trait, not Inheritance.

Honkeyfresh

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You mean the Inherited trait, not Inheritance.
ya brain fart.
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"Sometimes I say some things people may think are just outlandish, but I'm going to have the last laugh." -- Riff Raff  Exodus 6:66

Imrahil3

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I’m… sorry you don’t like it? There are ways to spice up the game without adding a specific choice. I think it’s awesome that Inherited just chucks a Workshop or a Sanctuary at you to start the game. Despite not giving you a consistent “oooh game has more choices” vibe throughout the entire round, this single Trait has probably the widest variation in effect and impact of anything in Dominion, with the possible exception of Way of the Mouse.

I’m sorry you find it boring, but… it’s a great card anyways. In the top half of Traits for sure.
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Snorka

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it's just kind of like a non-event
Well of course, it's a Trait not an Event after all.
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GendoIkari

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I dislike the name because people used to use "Inherited" to refer to the card that you had chosen to use Inheritance on. And the card auto-linker respected that, by making "Inherited" autolink to "Inheritance". Now that's all gone.
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Honkeyfresh

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I’m… sorry you don’t like it? There are ways to spice up the game without adding a specific choice. I think it’s awesome that Inherited just chucks a Workshop or a Sanctuary at you to start the game. Despite not giving you a consistent “oooh game has more choices” vibe throughout the entire round, this single Trait has probably the widest variation in effect and impact of anything in Dominion, with the possible exception of Way of the Mouse.

I’m sorry you find it boring, but… it’s a great card anyways. In the top half of Traits for sure.

In the top half of traits for sure?  Name me any traits you find it better than.  And certainly half if them. The event literally involves 0 skill and just adds to the swingy luck effects that I think most people dislike in Dominion.  But at least for most of those you have to make the choices that give you the chance for that kind of luck. Plus, it's over before turn one.  Don't you like how the other traits weave and interact together throughout the game?  Other traits/landmarks/events/ways reward skillful play and thinking about synergies and anti-synergies.  Inherited just is.

It essentially just adds one more random element.  Like if Animal fair, or a curser etc is on the board and it misses the reshuffle it just a rediculous advantage.
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"Rap game Julio Franco, Chuck Norris, Texas Ranger/ Ice on my fingers look like I slap-boxed a penguin." -- Riff Raff Proverbs 4:20

"Sometimes I say some things people may think are just outlandish, but I'm going to have the last laugh." -- Riff Raff  Exodus 6:66

Honkeyfresh

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it's just kind of like a non-event
Well of course, it's a Trait not an Event after all.

:rimshot: 

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"Sometimes I say some things people may think are just outlandish, but I'm going to have the last laugh." -- Riff Raff  Exodus 6:66

Jonatan Djurachkovitch

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it's just kind of like a non-event
Well of course, it's a Trait not an Event after all.
I'm sorry to go out of topic Snorka, but, is the suit on the man in your signature getting... larger?
« Last Edit: October 08, 2023, 01:18:17 pm by Jonatan Djurachkovitch »
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segura

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The notion that Inherited involves no skill is ridiculous. Precisely because it messes with the opening, it rewards players who can deal with this huge opening change. It is similar to Baker („What, everybody gets a Coffers at the start of the game? What random, swingy nonsense!“) and Cursed Gold in this respect.

It is like playing Fischer random instead of normal chess. While the setup is indeed random, it rewards skill quite heavily.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2023, 02:26:22 am by segura »
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Imrahil3

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Re: Inherited is underwhelming and needs to be eliminated in the third edition
« Reply #10 on: October 08, 2023, 09:17:43 am »
+2

Cheap, Rich, and Pious are the only Traits I would confidently say I like as much as or more than Inherited.

Quite frankly I much prefer the traits that do one simple thing when you buy them over the ones that have a lot to resolve any time you play them (i.e Reckless, Hasty). More choices and more strategic depth is good, but simplicity of gameplay is also good. Cluttering up a card with an extra paragraph of text (when some cards are ALREADY convoluted paragraphs) is NOT better than adding an elegantly simple “neat” factor, and I defy anyone to prove that straight-up complexity for it’s own sake is inherently the better idea.
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Snorka

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Re: Inherited is underwhelming and needs to be eliminated in the third edition
« Reply #11 on: October 09, 2023, 10:00:06 am »
+2

I'm sorry to go out of topic Snorka, but, is the suit on the man in your signature getting... larger?
Yes. Watch out.  :o
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mxdata

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Re: Inherited is underwhelming and needs to be eliminated in the third edition
« Reply #12 on: February 27, 2024, 03:34:46 pm »
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I’m… sorry you don’t like it? There are ways to spice up the game without adding a specific choice. I think it’s awesome that Inherited just chucks a Workshop or a Sanctuary at you to start the game. Despite not giving you a consistent “oooh game has more choices” vibe throughout the entire round, this single Trait has probably the widest variation in effect and impact of anything in Dominion, with the possible exception of Way of the Mouse.

I’m sorry you find it boring, but… it’s a great card anyways. In the top half of Traits for sure.

In the top half of traits for sure?  Name me any traits you find it better than.  And certainly half if them. The event literally involves 0 skill and just adds to the swingy luck effects that I think most people dislike in Dominion.  But at least for most of those you have to make the choices that give you the chance for that kind of luck. Plus, it's over before turn one.  Don't you like how the other traits weave and interact together throughout the game?  Other traits/landmarks/events/ways reward skillful play and thinking about synergies and anti-synergies.  Inherited just is.

It essentially just adds one more random element.  Like if Animal fair, or a curser etc is on the board and it misses the reshuffle it just a rediculous advantage.

Random, yes, but not swingy. Both players start out with the same Inherited card (with the exception of the Knight pile being chosen, which would indeed be very swingy), so there's no element of chance in getting it, unlike, say, certain strong $5 cards where a 5/2 or 2/5 opening can be a massive advantage. Inherited discard attacks can add an element of swinginess to the opening, but most Inherited cards are the opposite of swingy
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AJD

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Re: Inherited is underwhelming and needs to be eliminated in the third edition
« Reply #13 on: February 27, 2024, 04:37:42 pm »
+2

Random, yes, but not swingy. Both players start out with the same Inherited card (with the exception of the Knight pile being chosen, which would indeed be very swingy), so there's no element of chance in getting it, unlike, say, certain strong $5 cards where a 5/2 or 2/5 opening can be a massive advantage. Inherited discard attacks can add an element of swinginess to the opening, but most Inherited cards are the opposite of swingy

I'm not sure I agree with this! If the Inherited card is a terminal silver, for example, the difference between a 6/3 opening and a 5/4 opening can be very important (and the two possibilities are almost equally probable, unlike the relatively low-probability 5/2 opening in an ordinary game). If the inherited card draws, having it on your first turn vs. your second turn can have major implications for reshuffle timing.
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Holger

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Re: Inherited is underwhelming and needs to be eliminated in the third edition
« Reply #14 on: February 27, 2024, 06:26:12 pm »
+3

Random, yes, but not swingy. Both players start out with the same Inherited card (with the exception of the Knight pile being chosen, which would indeed be very swingy), so there's no element of chance in getting it, unlike, say, certain strong $5 cards where a 5/2 or 2/5 opening can be a massive advantage. Inherited discard attacks can add an element of swinginess to the opening, but most Inherited cards are the opposite of swingy

I'm not sure I agree with this! If the Inherited card is a terminal silver, for example, the difference between a 6/3 opening and a 5/4 opening can be very important (and the two possibilities are almost equally probable, unlike the relatively low-probability 5/2 opening in an ordinary game). If the inherited card draws, having it on your first turn vs. your second turn can have major implications for reshuffle timing.

With a terminal silver instead of the 3rd Estate, a 6/3 opening (i.e. drawing 4 Coppers with the silver) has probability (7 over 4)/(9 over 4) = 35/126= 27,78%. That's higher than 16,67% for 5/2, but still far below 50%.
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AJD

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Re: Inherited is underwhelming and needs to be eliminated in the third edition
« Reply #15 on: February 27, 2024, 06:39:20 pm »
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Oops! Did my mental math wrong.
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Awaclus

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Re: Inherited is underwhelming and needs to be eliminated in the third edition
« Reply #16 on: February 28, 2024, 07:39:56 am »
+1

Random, yes, but not swingy. Both players start out with the same Inherited card (with the exception of the Knight pile being chosen, which would indeed be very swingy), so there's no element of chance in getting it, unlike, say, certain strong $5 cards where a 5/2 or 2/5 opening can be a massive advantage. Inherited discard attacks can add an element of swinginess to the opening, but most Inherited cards are the opposite of swingy

Inherited has a skill multiplier of 0.89, so it is actually statistically very swingy. There are only 40 card-shaped things in the game whose presence in the kingdom is more likely to cause the less skilled player to win the game than Inherited — including removed cards.
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