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[DooWopDJ]

Updated to reflect the recommendations and rules clarifications.
DooWopDJ

Hello, hello
I have been playing Dominion for about 3 years and hope to become a contributing member to this forum.  So forgive my newbieness.

My first question.  I am interested in knowing the largest Kingdom setup possible using all of the available cards (and card-like (events and landmark cards).  Yes I understand Black Market give you the chance to use all Dominion card, but I prefer supply piles option at this point.

So here is my current 'largest Kingdom' setup

5 Base card piles
  4 - Base Victory Card piles - Estates, Duchy, Providence, Colony
  4 - Treasure Card piles - Copper, Silver, Gold, Platinum
  1 - Curse card
  1 - Potion card pile (see Vineyard)
  3 - Shelters (Hovel, Necropolis, Overgrown Estate)
Total = 13 differently named cards

10 Supply card piles (with their associated setup card piles)
  1  10 - Knight's pile (Sirs Bailey, Destry, Martin, Michael, Vander, Dames Anna, Josephine, Molly, Natalie, Sylvia)
  2    8 - Castle pile (Humble, Crumbling, Small, Haunted, Opulent, Sprawling, Grand, King's Castles)
  3    7 - Marauder and Spoils and 5 Ruins piles (Survivors, Abandoned Mine, Ruined Library, Ruined Market, Ruined Village) 
  4    6 - Tournament and Prize pile (Bag of Gold, Diadem, Followers, Princess, Trusty Steed)
  5    5 - Page Series piles - (Treasure Hunter, Warrior, Hero, Champion),
  6    5 - Peasant series (Soldier, Fugitive, Disciple, Teacher)
  7    3 - Young Witch/Urchin (and Mercenary) as bane card
  8    2 - Catapult/Rocks pile
  9    1 - Vineyard pile (required to add Potion Treasure card pile) (rules say only put out Potion card if 1 supply card has a Potion in cost)
  10  1 - Trade Route (required to add Colony and Platinum card piles)
Total = 48 differently named cards

Extra card piles 
     1 - Landmark card (per recommended 2 maximum per Kingdom setup) (Museum)
     1 - Event card (per recommended 2 maximum per Kingdom setup) (Advance)
Total = 2 differently named cards

Grand Total = 63 Differently Named Cards Kingdom setup.

Thanks
-DooWopDJ

[GendoIkari]

Welcome to the forum! A few various comments about your setup:

The Landmarks recommendation is actually at most 2 combined Events+Landmarks, not 2 of each. So if you're following that, you should remove 2 cards. If you aren't following that (it's only a recommendation, not a rule), you should use all Events and all Landmarks.

Also, you are using Colony and Platinum piles, but there is no Prosperity card in the Kingdom, which isn't technically allowed.

If I'm reading it right, you list Shelters as a Supply card pile? That's not right, so you actually have room for 1 more supply pile (Something from Prosperity for maximum cards).

Also, are you going for most number of different cards? Or total number of cards? If the latter, then you'd want Rats. But if the former, then Split piles are better.

Not sure if you can count the Trash card... in the second edition it's been replaced with a mat, and it's really not a card or part of the Kingdom or game in any way; it's just a place to put trashed cards.

[liopoil]

Looks like he's going for maximum number of differently named things that are part of the kingdom. If you take all of Gendo's suggestions I think it ends up at a total of 58 cards.

[DooWopDJ]

Update on my current 'largest Kingdom' setup, based on previous post clarifications from Gendo. 

Note: Correct, I am going for the the Most Differently Named cards (not the most actual cards)

Kingdom Setup card piles

5 Base card piles
  4 - All Base Victory Card piles - Estates, Duchy, Providence, Colony
  5 - All Treasure Card piles - Copper, Silver, Gold, Platinum
  1 - Curse card
  1 - Potion card pile (see Vineyard)
  3 - Shelters (Hovel, Necropolis, Overgrown Estate)
Total = 14 differently named cards

10 Supply card piles (with their associated setup card piles)
  1  10 - Knight's pile (Sirs Bailey, Destry, Martin, Michael, Vander, Dames Anna, Josephine, Molly, Natalie, Sylvia)
  2    8 - Castle pile (Humble, Crumbling, Small, Haunted, Opulent, Sprawling, Grand, King's Castles)
  3    6 - Tournament and Prize pile (Bag of Gold, Diadem, Followers, Princess, Trusty Steed)
  4    4 - Page Series piles - (Treasure Hunter, Warrior, Hero, Champion),
  5    4 - Peasant series (Soldier, Fugitive, Disciple, Teacher)
  6    3 - Young Witch/Urchin (and Mercenary) as bane card
  7    3 - Marauder and Spoils and Ruins piles (Survivors, Abandoned Mine, Ruined Library, Ruined Market, Ruined Village)
  8    2 - Catapult/Rocks pile
  9    1 - Vineyard pile (required to add Potion Treasure card pile) (rules say only put out Potion card if 1 supply card has a Potion in cost)
  10  1 - Trade Route (required to add Colony and Platinum card piles)
Total = 42 differently named cards

Extra card piles 
     1 - Landmark card (per recommended 2 maximum per Kingdom setup) (Aqueduct)
     1 - Event card (per recommended 2 maximum per Kingdom setup) (Advance)
Total = 2 differently named cards

Grand Total = 58 Differently Named Cards Kingdom setup.

Note: Although my goal was for the most.  I would probably replace the Catapult/Rocks split pile with the Fairgrounds, so that I can have a card where 'Differently named matters'

Note: I could not find the 'rule' that GendoIkari mentioned about the '... Landmarks recommendation is actually at most 2 combined Events+Landmarks, not 2 of each...'

Thanks
-DooWopDJ

[Mic Qsenoch]

Note: I could not find the 'rule' that GendoIkari mentioned about the '... Landmarks recommendation is actually at most 2 combined Events+Landmarks, not 2 of each...'

It's in the Empires rulebook under the "Preparation" section:

"For normal play we recommend using at most two Events and/or Landmarks per game; skip any further ones."

Rulebook on RGG site:
http://riograndegames.com/getFile.php?id=1987

[liopoil]

There are only four treasure card piles, not 5, unless you mean potion, in which case that's being double-counted. However, you aren't counting page/peasant themselves yet it seems, and you're also not counting the five ruins as separate. So I'm now counting 63 differently named cards.

[aku_chi]

If you want the kingdom to care about unique cards, you can make Museum the landmark.  No need to add Fairgrounds.

[JThorne]

Landmarks and Events are not cards. They are, officially, "card-shaped things" according to designer Donald X.

I wonder what the largest possible kingdom would be in terms of square inches of table space required? (Mats! Mats everywhere!)

[DooWopDJ]

I guess this was more of a 'semantics' debate then.   I was reading that as '... and/or ...' as 2 of each was the 'at most', thus a total of 4 at most.

Thanks for the rules clarification.

Note: I could not find the 'rule' that GendoIkari mentioned about the '... Landmarks recommendation is actually at most 2 combined Events+Landmarks, not 2 of each...'

It's in the Empires rulebook under the "Preparation" section:

"For normal play we recommend using at most two Events and/or Landmarks per game; skip any further ones."

Rulebook on RGG site:
http://riograndegames.com/getFile.php?id=1987

[DooWopDJ]

Museum is Perfect.  I figured there would be an event that would work.  I was too lazy to look at them all.
Thanks

If you want the kingdom to care about unique cards, you can make Museum the landmark.  No need to add Fairgrounds.

[DooWopDJ]

True.  So I will have to clarify my intent as being the total number of card and card-shaped things.  I will attempt the final game once I get the final results from this forum.
Thanks
DooWopDJ

Landmarks and Events are not cards. They are, officially, "card-shaped things" according to designer Donald X.

I wonder what the largest possible kingdom would be in terms of square inches of table space required? (Mats! Mats everywhere!)

[DooWopDJ]

The Potion is only counted once (I did not count it when I listed the Vineyard card that would allow the Potion card to be available in the the Kingdom.

Great catch on not counting the Page and Peasant cards themselves.  Thus adding 2 more to the total card (like) piles.

There are only four treasure card piles, not 5, unless you mean potion, in which case that's being double-counted. However, you aren't counting page/peasant themselves yet it seems, and you're also not counting the five ruins as separate. So I'm now counting 63 differently named cards.

[GendoIkari]

The Potion is only counted once (I did not count it when I listed the Vineyard card that would allow the Potion card to be available in the the Kingdom.

Great catch on not counting the Page and Peasant cards themselves.  Thus adding 2 more to the total card (like) piles.

There are only four treasure card piles, not 5, unless you mean potion, in which case that's being double-counted. However, you aren't counting page/peasant themselves yet it seems, and you're also not counting the five ruins as separate. So I'm now counting 63 differently named cards.

But you list 5 treasure piles, and then you list potion...  in the base card setup, before the kingdom.

You can also replace Vineyards with any split pile, keeping the count the same.

[DooWopDJ]

Oops - Good call.  It was not originally clear why my count was off.  Now I see the error.  So this bring the total down to 59.

I thought the 'rule' was that Potions can only be available if there is at least one pile from Alchemy, thus the reason why I added the Vineyards card.  Or was this recommendation on the Potion/Vineyards to keep count @ 59 by replacing Potion/Vineyards with a different 'split' pile.  Yes there were a few other '2 card' combos that could have been listed.

Thanks
-DooWopDJ

The Potion is only counted once (I did not count it when I listed the Vineyard card that would allow the Potion card to be available in the the Kingdom.

Great catch on not counting the Page and Peasant cards themselves.  Thus adding 2 more to the total card (like) piles.

There are only four treasure card piles, not 5, unless you mean potion, in which case that's being double-counted. However, you aren't counting page/peasant themselves yet it seems, and you're also not counting the five ruins as separate. So I'm now counting 63 differently named cards.

But you list 5 treasure piles, and then you list potion...  in the base card setup, before the kingdom.

You can also replace Vineyards with any split pile, keeping the count the same.

[GendoIkari]

Oops - Good call.  It was not originally clear why my count was off.  Now I see the error.  So this bring the total down to 59.

I thought the 'rule' was that Potions can only be available if there is at least one pile from Alchemy, thus the reason why I added the Vineyards card.

Thanks
-DooWopDJ

The Potion is only counted once (I did not count it when I listed the Vineyard card that would allow the Potion card to be available in the the Kingdom.

Great catch on not counting the Page and Peasant cards themselves.  Thus adding 2 more to the total card (like) piles.

There are only four treasure card piles, not 5, unless you mean potion, in which case that's being double-counted. However, you aren't counting page/peasant themselves yet it seems, and you're also not counting the five ruins as separate. So I'm now counting 63 differently named cards.

But you list 5 treasure piles, and then you list potion...  in the base card setup, before the kingdom.

You can also replace Vineyards with any split pile, keeping the count the same.

You have the rule correct. I was saying that if you use another split pile instead of Vineyard, then you would lose Potions, but gain another different card, keeping the count the same.

[liopoil]

What about the ruins? You seem to be counting all 5 of them as one card. So that's why I said I think it should be 63.

[DooWopDJ]

Another great catch.  This will bring it to 63.
Thanks
-DooWopDJ

What about the ruins? You seem to be counting all 5 of them as one card. So that's why I said I think it should be 63.

[GendoIkari]

Update with I think all the corrections:

5 Base card piles
  4 - All Base Victory Card piles - Estates, Duchy, Providence, Colony
  4 - All Treasure Card piles - Copper, Silver, Gold, Platinum
  1 - Curse card
  1 - Potion card pile (see Vineyard)
  3 - Shelters (Hovel, Necropolis, Overgrown Estate)
Total = 13 differently named cards

10 Supply card piles (with their associated setup card piles)
  1  10 - Knight's pile (Sirs Bailey, Destry, Martin, Michael, Vander, Dames Anna, Josephine, Molly, Natalie, Sylvia)
  2    8 - Castle pile (Humble, Crumbling, Small, Haunted, Opulent, Sprawling, Grand, King's Castles)
  3    6 - Tournament and Prize pile (Bag of Gold, Diadem, Followers, Princess, Trusty Steed)
  4    5 - Page Series piles - (Treasure Hunter, Warrior, Hero, Champion),
  5    5 - Peasant series (Soldier, Fugitive, Disciple, Teacher)
  6    3 - Young Witch/Urchin (and Mercenary) as bane card
  7    7 - Marauder and Spoils and Ruins piles (Survivors, Abandoned Mine, Ruined Library, Ruined Market, Ruined Village)
  8    2 - Catapult/Rocks pile
  9    1 - Vineyard pile (required to add Potion Treasure card pile) (rules say only put out Potion card if 1 supply card has a Potion in cost)
  10  1 - Trade Route (required to add Colony and Platinum card piles)
Total = 48 differently named cards

Extra card piles 
     1 - Landmark card (per recommended 2 maximum per Kingdom setup) (Aqueduct)
     1 - Event card (per recommended 2 maximum per Kingdom setup) (Advance)
Total = 2 differently named cards

Grand Total = 63 Differently Named Cards Kingdom setup.

61 actual "cards"... so Museum can be worth up to 30 122 points.

Since this basic question has come up as puzzles in the past, if we replace Vineyard with Fairgrounds, we can still get 60 differently named cards... so Fairgrounds can be worth 24 points each. (Without Black Market, of course.)

[DooWopDJ]

How can we '...  if we replace Vineyard with Fairgrounds, we can still get 60 (corrected to 63 now because of my math error) differently named cards...' ?
We still need Vineyards so that Potion can be used.  If we use Fairgrounds we lose one card.

Can you clarify the '...question has come up as puzzles in the past...' comment?  If my original quest was a previous 'puzzle', I would be curious to understand that quest.
Thanks
-DooWopDJ

Update with I think all the corrections:

5 Base card piles
  4 - All Base Victory Card piles - Estates, Duchy, Providence, Colony
  4 - All Treasure Card piles - Copper, Silver, Gold, Platinum
  1 - Curse card
  1 - Potion card pile (see Vineyard)
  3 - Shelters (Hovel, Necropolis, Overgrown Estate)
Total = 13 differently named cards

10 Supply card piles (with their associated setup card piles)
  1  10 - Knight's pile (Sirs Bailey, Destry, Martin, Michael, Vander, Dames Anna, Josephine, Molly, Natalie, Sylvia)
  2    8 - Castle pile (Humble, Crumbling, Small, Haunted, Opulent, Sprawling, Grand, King's Castles)
  3    6 - Tournament and Prize pile (Bag of Gold, Diadem, Followers, Princess, Trusty Steed)
  4    5 - Page Series piles - (Treasure Hunter, Warrior, Hero, Champion),
  5    5 - Peasant series (Soldier, Fugitive, Disciple, Teacher)
  6    3 - Young Witch/Urchin (and Mercenary) as bane card
  7    7 - Marauder and Spoils and Ruins piles (Survivors, Abandoned Mine, Ruined Library, Ruined Market, Ruined Village)
  8    2 - Catapult/Rocks pile
  9    1 - Vineyard pile (required to add Potion Treasure card pile) (rules say only put out Potion card if 1 supply card has a Potion in cost)
  10  1 - Trade Route (required to add Colony and Platinum card piles)
Total = 48 differently named cards

Extra card piles 
     1 - Landmark card (per recommended 2 maximum per Kingdom setup) (Aqueduct)
     1 - Event card (per recommended 2 maximum per Kingdom setup) (Advance)
Total = 2 differently named cards

Grand Total = 63 Differently Named Cards Kingdom setup.

61 actual "cards"... so Museum can be worth up to 30 points.

Since this basic question has come up as puzzles in the past, if we replace Vineyard with Fairgrounds, we can still get 60 differently named cards... so Fairgrounds can be worth 24 points each. (Without Black Market, of course.)

[GendoIkari]

How can we '...  if we replace Vineyard with Fairgrounds, we can still get 60 (corrected to 63 now because of my math error) differently named cards...' ?
We still need Vineyards so that Potion can be used.  If we use Fairgrounds we lose one card.

Can you clarify the '...question has come up as puzzles in the past...' comment?  If my original quest was a previous 'puzzle', I would be curious to understand that quest.
Thanks
-DooWopDJ

Update with I think all the corrections:

5 Base card piles
  4 - All Base Victory Card piles - Estates, Duchy, Providence, Colony
  4 - All Treasure Card piles - Copper, Silver, Gold, Platinum
  1 - Curse card
  1 - Potion card pile (see Vineyard)
  3 - Shelters (Hovel, Necropolis, Overgrown Estate)
Total = 13 differently named cards

10 Supply card piles (with their associated setup card piles)
  1  10 - Knight's pile (Sirs Bailey, Destry, Martin, Michael, Vander, Dames Anna, Josephine, Molly, Natalie, Sylvia)
  2    8 - Castle pile (Humble, Crumbling, Small, Haunted, Opulent, Sprawling, Grand, King's Castles)
  3    6 - Tournament and Prize pile (Bag of Gold, Diadem, Followers, Princess, Trusty Steed)
  4    5 - Page Series piles - (Treasure Hunter, Warrior, Hero, Champion),
  5    5 - Peasant series (Soldier, Fugitive, Disciple, Teacher)
  6    3 - Young Witch/Urchin (and Mercenary) as bane card
  7    7 - Marauder and Spoils and Ruins piles (Survivors, Abandoned Mine, Ruined Library, Ruined Market, Ruined Village)
  8    2 - Catapult/Rocks pile
  9    1 - Vineyard pile (required to add Potion Treasure card pile) (rules say only put out Potion card if 1 supply card has a Potion in cost)
  10  1 - Trade Route (required to add Colony and Platinum card piles)
Total = 48 differently named cards

Extra card piles 
     1 - Landmark card (per recommended 2 maximum per Kingdom setup) (Aqueduct)
     1 - Event card (per recommended 2 maximum per Kingdom setup) (Advance)
Total = 2 differently named cards

Grand Total = 63 Differently Named Cards Kingdom setup.

61 actual "cards"... so Museum can be worth up to 30 points.

Since this basic question has come up as puzzles in the past, if we replace Vineyard with Fairgrounds, we can still get 60 differently named cards... so Fairgrounds can be worth 24 points each. (Without Black Market, of course.)

We do lose 1 card (Potion), but that takes the total from 61 to 60, which Fairgrounds doesn't care about.

For the puzzles, here's a thread (that apparently I created; didn't even realize that, lol): http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=13502. The Kingdom I suggest there is almost the same as yours; I just lose a couple points because Castles didn't exist yet.

[aku_chi]

61 actual "cards"... so Museum can be worth up to 30 points.

Correction: Museum could be worth up to 122 points.

[GendoIkari]

61 actual "cards"... so Museum can be worth up to 30 points.

Correction: Museum could be worth up to 122 points.

Oops!

[DooWopDJ]

I fixed the subject to reflect the correct total of 'cards', since events/landmarks are not cards.
But if you include the one landmark and one event and even the one 'trash' card as a 'card-like', then
the total # of card 'piles' (yes I know a stack of 1 card is not a pile), the total gets back up to 64.
I will be playing this Kingdom this weekend and will see how things 'play out'.
Thanks
-DooWopDJ

[DooWopDJ]

Update.  Wow this was a very challenging game to play.  Trying to remember which Ruin and 'Traveller' I still had was a challenge. 
The Knights pile just basically wiped out my 'Differently Named' cards.  The Point Total - Opponent = 130 Me = 100.
Differently Named totals - Opponent = 25 Me = 37.  I will play it again just to see if I can fix my errors (I failed to get a Marauder early enough, and I opted for Castles instead of Knights).
-DooWopDJ

[DooWopDJ]

Amazing so many new sets since I posted this
Has anyone tried to determine the 'largest' number of cards that are allowed without playing a variant, and have
Black Market have the recommended minimum (or all in the setup?)