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[JaketheBaseballGod22]

If Eevee's lover doesn't want to claim, would everyone else be happy with a claim order if it was agreed upon by both mcmc and TWM? And/or faust?

I don't think any of us has reason to trust everyone, but most people here probably have townie feelings about at least one of that set, yes?

Why not just sign up order?

[mcmcsalot]

Caught up but busy at work today so probably won't be able to post till later.

Off the cuff, I also felt like galz/faust could be partners wanting to do this because they were both players heavily in the "mafia is screwed" camp when twm and me claimed. As posts went on Faust appeared to be a bit townier. Though I think cuzz is a likely kill mafia wants to make, I repeatedly posted how I was not going to be lynching cuzz and they were aware he was town. I also think scum!faust is likely to take vig in order to shoot and have a claim that fits why he is shooting.

@TWM I never said you lied about being v/la I don't get why you are so angry at everything I say. From my perspective you have done nothing to prove you are town other than claim a power and not use it so understand I'm still trying to figure out what you have done and why so I can put a town narrative to it. What I was suggesting was when did you input your action of "not hiding". I thought that we lynched early so you could safely put the action as "hide behind me". Then you were v/la untill Monday afternoon. Robz posted the rule change during your v/la on be 27th and then opened the thread Monday at 5pm. I guess robz did extend the deadline and ask for confirmation of actions I just found the timing pretty close and the way you said it seemed like you always planned on not hiding for fear of a buss driver even before robz posted the rule change.

Basically are you saying you put hiding behind me, and then after the rule change decided the best bet was to not hide, or are you saying you always feared the rule change and put not hiding right away?

[Roadrunner7671]

If Eevee's lover doesn't want to claim, would everyone else be happy with a claim order if it was agreed upon by both mcmc and TWM? And/or faust?

I don't think any of us has reason to trust everyone, but most people here probably have townie feelings about at least one of that set, yes?

Why not just sign up order?

Because we can be far more strategic

[mcmcsalot]

I dont thi k either galz or Faust are good lynches now.

Despite how badly I want to lynch them I totally agree. Lynching them without either more days or a mass claim is definitely not a good idea.

[2.71828.....]

Can someone explain to me in 4 sentences or less why faust must resolve to town due to the reveals of today?

The only towny thing I've gotten was he did claim to shoot the guy he tunneled hard all game and now looks like he is willing to do something besides that.

Faust and Galzria both have roles that are not alignment-indicative in any way. Of the two I think galzria is townier, but no way am I going to support the lynch of a claimed PR in faust, especially one that can be so damaging to scum.

That being said, I really didn't like his shot last night (knowing that it was his shot and not a scum kill). It does make sense to some extent with the wagon we had on Cuzz, but then, I didn't agree with the wagon either

[pingpongsam]

Right, so, everyone else is feeling pretty leery of faust as well... I can envision a faust delivered pep talk int he scum QT that got Galzria out of the dumps and the Robz ruling got ashersky back in the game.

I guess, the one thing I have trouble accepting is that for M100 we got a Galzria, ashersky, faust scum team. I'm more inclined to believe faust is an SK as that aligns with his claims.

The Galzria claim does seem relatively safe but still townish. It however, doesn't really jive with his hang dog attitude yesterday.

[mcmcsalot]

So the more I dwell on it the more I'm warming up to the idea of a massclaim

[The_Wine_Merchant]

If Eevee's lover doesn't want to claim, would everyone else be happy with a claim order if it was agreed upon by both mcmc and TWM? And/or faust?

If Eevee's lover doesn't want to claim and thereby doesn't want to mass claim I would prefer to leave it at that.

[The_Wine_Merchant]

@TWM I never said you lied about being v/la I don't get why you are so angry at everything I say. From my perspective you have done nothing to prove you are town other than claim a power and not use it so understand I'm still trying to figure out what you have done and why so I can put a town narrative to it. What I was suggesting was when did you input your action of "not hiding". I thought that we lynched early so you could safely put the action as "hide behind me". Then you were v/la untill Monday afternoon. Robz posted the rule change during your v/la on be 27th and then opened the thread Monday at 5pm. I guess robz did extend the deadline and ask for confirmation of actions I just found the timing pretty close and the way you said it seemed like you always planned on not hiding for fear of a buss driver even before robz posted the rule change.

I slightly misunderstood your post and felt that you were suspicious of my VLA. I still feel that you, and others, are being critical of me for things completely outside of my control.

Your plan was good and I was going to follow it, but once the rule change occurred it was not wise to follow a plan that was telegraphed to mafia that they could potentially disrupt, especially when it could be accomplished following days with ease.

So do not blame me for rule changes or for deadlines that were extended or for things completely outside of my control. This was your plan. If you had not come up with it I would have gone on VLA and submitted an early night action before leaving on VLA and everything would have been fine. But with your plan, my action was dependent upon you hammering. I had to know whether that happened or not.

Then I went on VLA, submitted to hide behind you and expected to come back to find Day 3 underway and everything be fine. I came back to a thread locked and a rule change. So I, understandably, changed my night action using this new information. That people are mad about this is just ridiculous. New information, means new decisions. So my night action changed and day began. Robz was kind enough to extend the deadline.

Basically are you saying you put hiding behind me, and then after the rule change decided the best bet was to not hide, or are you saying you always feared the rule change and put not hiding right away?

The first. Obviously. Why would I fear a rule change that I had no way of knowing about. I feared there were some unknown possibilities with your plan, specifically not getting the hammer every single night. That is still a concern.

I will post what I plan on doing in my next post to continue with your plan to the best of my abilities.

[mcmcsalot]

That clears things up, I reread your post and it did sound more like your changed your position after the rule change(which I think was a fine thing to do). Sorry if it seemed like I was questioning your vla, I am merely paranoid. I have to keep reminding myself we just have different reads and stuff and the chances you are mafia are extremely extremely slim.

Actually I don't know if this is bad to claim but did you get hider in the actually slot or in a different slot?

[The_Wine_Merchant]

Condition 1:

1-shot Bus Driver does not claim and mcmc gets today's hammer.

1) hide behind mcmc
2) behind behind someone else (Y) that will be publicly stated in thread (town will help ID this person, but final decision is mine)
3) behind behind someone else (X) that will be publicly stated in thread (town will help ID this person, but final decision is mine)

If I live I won't state what I did and I'll do the same thing Night 4. Day 5 I will reveal what I did.

If I die and neither of mcmc/X/Y die, unfortunately we won't be able to know exactly what happened. Either 1) mcmc is mafia, 2) X or Y is mafia or 3) I was bus driven to hide behind mafia and died. I would suggest looking strongly at X or Y. I highly doubt mcmc is mafia at this point.

Condition 2:
1-shot Bus Driver claims or flips as scum and mcmc gets today's hammer.

1) hide behind mcmc

Condition 3:
mcmc doesn't get today's hammer in any scenario
1) Hide behind one of three players that will be publicly stated in thread.

[The_Wine_Merchant]

Actually I don't know if this is bad to claim but did you get hider in the actually slot or in a different slot?

I'll hold off answering until we have a better idea of whether or not my answer would be harmful or not. I am OK to share it, but think it should fit into the story of mass claiming rather than me just sharing it right now.

[The_Wine_Merchant]

Theory question for anyone that wants to answer it.

If you were mafia, would you have bus driven mcmc last night or would you have saved it for a later day?

[The_Wine_Merchant]

I am realizing I made a mistake today when I said I didn't hide behind mcmc and should have instead stated something like "I may or may not have hidden behind mcmc last night and depending on what I did I will do something tonight and Night 4 that will be revealed Day 5"

Sorry for my error.

[SpaceAnemone]

If Eevee's lover doesn't want to claim, would everyone else be happy with a claim order if it was agreed upon by both mcmc and TWM? And/or faust?

If Eevee's lover doesn't want to claim and thereby doesn't want to mass claim I would prefer to leave it at that.

Why? Eevee's lover doesn't have so much more information than the rest of us that they alone have the casting vote as to whether massclaim would be best for us here. They're effectively a VT, with only the benefit of probably having some of Eevee's reads recorded in a QT somewhere, which is additional info they can only share if alive and claimed.

While it's nice to be able to do one's own thing with the roles we each have, especially in a game like this where most PR-holders "won" their roles in a more involved way than normal, I do think that playing for the greater good of the team, and not trying to be a hero single-handed, is important. Having an IC to help mediate a full claim may well be the best thing for town at this point. The fact that the other lover gets ICd and then possibly (modulo protective roles and wifom) killed thereafter is sad for that player, but may help win us the game even if they're not confident enough with their reads and leadership to perform strongly in a traditional IC role.

[ashersky]

Theory question for anyone that wants to answer it.

If you were mafia, would you have bus driven mcmc last night or would you have saved it for a later day?

With only 1-shot, it's in the scum team's best interest you use it with lots of info.  And the very public mod ruling would absolutely require that a scum bus driver save their shot.  That Robz post killed a lot of strategy space for scum.

[ashersky]

Awaclus should lead the massclaim.

[SpaceAnemone]

Another idea to throw out there: what if we do the claims in descending order of slot choice, i.e. starting with the player who picked last?

I was going to propose this as a good plan, but I think I may have argued myself out of it while composing this post.

My initial thinking had been that the longer scum wait to claim, in the hope of finding an innocent-looking un-claimed place in the order that doesn't imply they have a PR, the more they're going to have to take a risk because claiming one of the top slots will come with an expectation of holding a useful PR. I like the idea of ratcheting up the pressure on the scums and seeing who slips.

The reason this doesn't work so well is that those of us who did come low down in the picking order end up telegraphing which slots were already taken by the time the number got down to us, so those end up being safe spots for scum to claim, because they know somebody in the order above them took that slot. It also ends up meaning that inconsistencies only come out amongst the players with the highest picking priority.

OTOH, claiming starting with the top spots means that it's immediately obvious which slots are taken, so those become safe straight away, meaning that's an even worse ordering to use.

The best thing would maybe be for TWM and mcmc to each post a scum-to-town list, and go with some kind of synthesis of that.

[sudgy]

I don't believe in suboptimal play of Galzria. something pings me here

I'm not really V/LA right now. Just super drunk. Just fayi. Birthday brewery hopping. Yay!

[Galzria]

Hi! I'm still alive.

Calamitas looks like an SK shot? It's definitely more likely that there is one now. Or Werewolves I suppose.

There is something I may or may not want to talk about.

This was faust's first post yesterday. In it he's suggesting knowledge of night operations.

He's almost certainly not the SK as he's setting himself up to claim Vig here. Knowing that there was no IC means he would be counterclaimed - an instant losing strategy for SK.

So he's likely the Vig. From here it's simply a question of alignment. Sure, he could be scum - but to my mind:

A) I don't believe scum!Vig opens d2 by preparing to claim, period. But especially If he DID shoot but got no result from it. He now knows there's a blocker/doctor/something - why aim to bring it to town's attention when he can just wait for n2 to tell his buddies?

B) I really don't think scum!Vig does it in their first post following a teammates death the night before. Even if he had been planning on it the night before I think he would at least take some time to reevaluate the situation.

Essentially, to believe Faust to be scum would mean partners with Calamitas. I don't believe the above post suggests that to be likely.

Also, as per my provisional before on Faust shooting last night: vote: ashersky. Occam's Razor.

[sudgy]

Theory question for anyone that wants to answer it.

If you were mafia, would you have bus driven mcmc last night or would you have saved it for a later day?

With only 1-shot, it's in the scum team's best interest you use it with lots of info.  And the very public mod ruling would absolutely require that a scum bus driver save their shot.  That Robz post killed a lot of strategy space for scum.

Scum would know this a lot better than town would.  Vote: ashersky I think that's L-3.

I'm really busy again over the next couple of days.

PPE L-2

[mcmcsalot]

Umm I mean I'm not crazy against lynching ash.

[mcmcsalot]

request vote count

[faust]

Awaclus should lead the massclaim.

This is ridiculous. Awaclus is the most likely townie.

[Robz888]

Vote Count 3.2

iguanaiguana (1): RoadRunner7671
Galzria (1): faust
ashersky (4): O, 2.71828......, Galzria, sudgy

Not Voting (11): ashersky, Dylan32, SpaceAnemone, Awaclus, pingpongsam, JaketheBaseballGod22, iguanaiguana, Jimmmmm, mcmcsalot, The_Wine_Merchant, LaLight

With 17 alive it takes 9 to lynch. Day 3 ends on Monday, June 5th, at 5:00 PM Forum Time.