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[LaLight]

I think most reactions are more based in "i'd like to keep playing this game", rather than "it's bad for me to die as scum" vs. "it's slightly less bad for me to die as town".

I'd like to keep playing, but I definitely would want to keep playing more as scum than as town.

I guess people in this game slightly less want to die even as VTs because, well, it's M100

[faust]

People should arrange their longer posts. Put the important stuff to the top, like votes and such.

(This is in response to:)

Oh my god. The giant wall quotes. Make them stawp! Like this thread isn't long enough without giant wall quotes. Snip snip!

[faust]

TWM sheeping faust on voting sudgy looks terrible for both of them.

Because it means we are scum partners?

[faust]

I really dislike what o is doing, continually bringing up claiming things, and pushing the point that the first pr taken would obviously be a 2-shot vig is crazy. He's just pr hunting day one.

I dün't necessarily like it, but it's townie.

[faust]

After going through this, amended list:
RR
LaLight
TWM
iguana
O

[Eevee]

I'm traveling for the day, back in the evening though.

I'm finding it hard to differentiate between town reads and people who I agree with.

I think accusing others of looking like scum caught for the wrong reasons might be starting to be a
scumtell, I feel it's been one of the easier arguments to push for myself in my recent scum games.

[Awaclus]

I'm not going to read any posts longer than 2 lines if this posting rate keeps up.

[SpaceAnemone]

I think who has PRs and doesn't is irrelevant to who is scum and town, considering we got the order before we were given alignments.

If we have a werewolf faction, then the second of them will have been drawn from a player who would otherwise have been a VT. It's quite an interesting mechanism from a design point of view, because it makes those of us more likely to be VTs (relative newbies other than people like LL who've read everything) fractionally more likely to be scum from the perspective of every other player who knows nothing about what happened with the bidding in slot 8.

[Calamitas]

I think who has PRs and doesn't is irrelevant to who is scum and town, considering we got the order before we were given alignments.

If we have a werewolf faction, then the second of them will have been drawn from a player who would otherwise have been a VT. It's quite an interesting mechanism from a design point of view, because it makes those of us more likely to be VTs (relative newbies other than people like LL who've read everything) fractionally more likely to be scum from the perspective of every other player who knows nothing about what happened with the bidding in slot 8.

That's obviously true but I think it's pretty unlikely that we have wolves which puts the overall effect on the estimates very close to zero.

[pingpongsam]

TWM sheeping faust on voting sudgy looks terrible for both of them.

Because it means we are scum partners?

Deja vu much? I'm going to assume you've seen my response to this exact same assumption from TWM by now.

[pingpongsam]

TWM sheeping faust on voting sudgy looks terrible for both of them.

And are you suggesting Faust and I are partners?

I'm not jumping to contrived conclusions. The crappy vote on miss komen was bad and the sheeping was worse. That stands regardless of any other implications which aren't relevant right now. You can't diffusé the crappiness because I refuse to make an equally crappy rash analysis. At this point either or both of you could be scum or town making crappy plays.

Quotes abridged for brevity.

[SpaceAnemone]

I think who has PRs and doesn't is irrelevant to who is scum and town, considering we got the order before we were given alignments.

If we have a werewolf faction, then the second of them will have been drawn from a player who would otherwise have been a VT. It's quite an interesting mechanism from a design point of view, because it makes those of us more likely to be VTs (relative newbies other than people like LL who've read everything) fractionally more likely to be scum from the perspective of every other player who knows nothing about what happened with the bidding in slot 8.

That's obviously true but I think it's pretty unlikely that we have wolves which puts the overall effect on the estimates very close to zero.

Tee hee.. my next idea for saying/asking things on here was going to be to try to draw you into conversation, given that you're the only person I can think of who struggles even more than I do with saying things D1 in a big game.

I do agree that the effect is essentially negligible, but as I said before the game started, I'm excited at the possibility of werewolves :-)

[Cuzz]

but yes i am the two shot vig.

O are you the two shot vig?

[iguanaiguana]

I feel like it's all crazy talk here. I'm talking about just discussing the PRs out there and how the voting might have went and you're all going "massclaim bad" "we can't hunt PRs"

I'm not really proposing some revolutionary discussion, but the complete shutdown of discussion by most of the people here is really surprising to me.

I feel like from my perspective anything I could say would be a shot in the dark, because I don't know what info scum has nor what info other towns may want/need. But since scum start with an information advantage, it seems more likely that scum will be able to use any information I offer than town. So that makes me think it is not helpful to talk about even though I'm curious and honestly kinda want to have the conversation later in the game / after the game.

[mcmcsalot]

So I very much agree with what iguana said. Also (and this is going to be the last in going to say on this because I think it is derailing actual scumhunting) I am most worried that what you want is to discuss what slots we think were taken earlier and what were taken later. I think everyone is going to have vastly more different opinions than you expect and I think discussing that will only give scum the knowledge of which players if they got a high draft spot would have picked dangerous powers. Add in the fact that as you said scum knows what they got. So if anyone says they value a slot scum has, scum knows they didn't get that slot and therefor that player most likely has a lower draft position and they don't need to nk them. I find it especially frustrating because you keep asserting 2-shot vig as the obvious number one power in the game, this is just asking for people to say know it would obviously be X and again then scum has that knowledge.

So yea I don't care if you respond, I think everyone if your town should just ignore any and all discussion about the setup for the rest of the day, in a game this large things are going to get out of hand, we need to cut the fluff as much as possible. I would also say if your town try really hard to read your post and if it doesn't have some real conclusions or opinions or reactions to just not post it. Every time a town player posts a fluff post it lets scum do the same, and scum want to post as much fluff as possible making the days unreadable.

[mcmcsalot]

In fact vote: O this will be removed depending on how you respond and continue to play. Currently I think you are smart enough to know everything I said and are using "it's day one and scumhunting is hard/unhelpful" to sabotage town. Because yes scumhunting day one is hard and much less helpful than scumhunting later days, but it doesn't mean we shouldn't try and that way if we get it wrong today, as we often do, we can at least gain something from the reactions people had to the wagons ect. ect.

[Cuzz]

I feel like it's all crazy talk here. I'm talking about just discussing the PRs out there and how the voting might have went and you're all going "massclaim bad" "we can't hunt PRs"

I'm not really proposing some revolutionary discussion, but the complete shutdown of discussion by most of the people here is really surprising to me.

I feel like from my perspective anything I could say would be a shot in the dark, because I don't know what info scum has nor what info other towns may want/need. But since scum start with an information advantage, it seems more likely that scum will be able to use any information I offer than town. So that makes me think it is not helpful to talk about even though I'm curious and honestly kinda want to have the conversation later in the game / after the game.

Vote: iguana

This is a nothing post, and it reeks of "oh I'm just town how could I possibly know anything?"

Literally everyone in the game can deduce some portion of what the scum team(s) know, as well as what town PRs might be interested in.

[Cuzz]

mcmc I find it interesting that you say

So I very much agree with what iguana said.

and then say this

I would also say if your town try really hard to read your post and if it doesn't have some real conclusions or opinions or reactions to just not post it. Every time a town player posts a fluff post it lets scum do the same, and scum want to post as much fluff as possible making the days unreadable.

Iguana's post struck me as the definition of fluff (including a useless reference to post-game conversation). What do you think?

[Cuzz]

also mcmc, why do you vote O and then remove all the teeth from that vote by talking about how you're likely to remove it?

[The_Wine_Merchant]

Back to Vote: mcmc

[mcmcsalot]

also mcmc, why do you vote O and then remove all the teeth from that vote by talking about how you're likely to remove it?

Because I'm open to the possibility that O is going to change his behavior

[mcmcsalot]

mcmc I find it interesting that you say

So I very much agree with what iguana said.

and then say this

I would also say if your town try really hard to read your post and if it doesn't have some real conclusions or opinions or reactions to just not post it. Every time a town player posts a fluff post it lets scum do the same, and scum want to post as much fluff as possible making the days unreadable.

Iguana's post struck me as the definition of fluff (including a useless reference to post-game conversation). What do you think?

I specifically felt that iguana hit the nail on the head with

I feel like from my perspective anything I could say would be a shot in the dark, because I don't know what info scum has nor what info other towns may want/need. But since scum start with an information advantage, it seems more likely that scum will be able to use any information I offer than town. So that makes me think it is not helpful to talk about even though I'm curious and honestly kinda want to have the conversation later in the game / after the game.

The boldest point is exactly what I think ozzle was glossing over. He was saying scum has an informational advantage so we should discuss. But because they know there slots as I pointed out in my post, scum get way more out of knowing even the slots that town players value as strong.

[The_Wine_Merchant]

also mcmc, why do you vote O and then remove all the teeth from that vote by talking about how you're likely to remove it?

Because I'm open to the possibility that O is going to change his behavior

How is that indicative of his alignment?

[Cuzz]

who is ozzle?

[iguanaiguana]

The purpose of my post was to get O to understand why everyone is against him. If that's fluff then, uh, woops.