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[Seprix]

I don't really trust Silverspawn, Xerxes, or Chairs. None of them have been outstandingly scum, but each of them have been a bit odd. Silver was a bit inconsistent in voting, Xerxes flipped out a bit with an apparent OMGUS vote, and Chairs has been inactive (though this too was explained).

I don't know about Faust or Hydrad, and I'm inclined to lean towards Ichi Gin as town. Hrm.

[faust]

So, rereading Hydrad.

Day 1.
- takes a stance early on, thinking that Joseph is town.
- more defending Joseph
- OMGUS votes silver
- now he gives up his town read on Joseph
- thinks Ichi and WW are scummy
- now he goes back to defending Joseph
- votes Awaclus, saying he doesn't really think he's scummy.

So the thing that sticks out most D1 is his defense of Joseph, which could be correct read or white knighting. His Awaclus vote is actually relatively towny.

Day 2.
- he goes after silver early for being inconsistent in his reads.
- calls the night kill "unexpected", and tries to use WW's death for a case against silver
- defends chairs, saying he's towny, a bit later chairs is null.

This is it. So Hydrad is looking worse here. I don't think silver and Hydrad are scum together, as I don't think Hydrad would bus this hard. If Hydrad is scum, I'd look at chairs as a partner.

Day 3.
- again uses the night kill against silver.

Overall: Hydrad has formulated very little reads this game. He thought Joseph is town, silver is scum, and he apparently thinks I am town. That's mainly it, and it's problematic.

[faust]

Now for silverspawn.

Day 1.
- jokes about the scum team. Two of the three players he mentions have flipped town, and one I think is not his partner. So would scum!silver put down three town names here? Hmmm...
- thinks WW is scum
- puts Joseph to L-2
- argues against quicklynching
- thinks Hydrad is scummy
- thinks ADK and Seprix are towny
-calls the Joseph lynch convenient for scum
- continues to oppose the Joseph wagon, votes chairs and WW
- Votes for Joseph without much enthusiasm
- sheeps the Awaclus vote, contradicting his earlier reads. Now rereading silver's D1, this doesn't look as bad anymore. I mean, he was never feeling good about the Joseph wagon, now another wagon comes up, I can imagine town!silver to just jump it without really thinking. It's still not good, but also not as bad as I thought earlier

So yeah. I don't think scum!silver would act the way he did towards the Joseph wagon. He'd either push it or be against it, not in a weird "I think he's scummy, but not scummy enough to lynch" position.

Day 2.
- starts going after chairs
- continues to push a chairs lynch
- defends himself by saying "I don't mess up as scum". Well, that's not a good defense.
- votes for me after I say I think he's scummy. OMGUS, null tell really.

Day 3.
- this actually makes sense.
- the whole scumslip thing, which ends with him dropping his suspicion on me... I don't now, doesn't look like a scum move.

Okay, there are still things about silver that make me feel uncomfortable, but overall I think I prefer Hydrad.

Vote: Hydrad

[Hydrad]

Hmmm. that does make me look worse then silver.

I still think faust is towny though.

Now I have to think of how to defend myself.

[faust]

I think Faust and silverspawn are both good choices, and to act like it has to be exactly one of them is scummy. Maybe scum only needed 1 or even noone on the wagon.

If Xerxes is scum, and I think there's a decent chance that he is, this makes me think all scum could be on wagon.

[silverspawn]

So, my opinion about this game right now is that I don't feel any of the people who have gotten a lot of attention feel like good lynches. Instead, I want to look at everyone who's been flying under the radar...

Hydrad
Egork
Ichimaru Gin
A Drowned Kernel
Joseph2302
XerxesPraelor
Awaclus
silverspawn
faust
Witherweaver
Seprix
Twistedarcher
chairs

Green are town, crossed are dead.

Last time I reread Hydrad, I came to the entirely wrong conclusion, even though I tried really hard. Right now, I'm not confident enough. Faust's case isn't bad, but mh. Before I vote for that, I want to try if I like someone else better.

Faust gets a pass for not supporting Joseph lynch and defending me. Seprix I still think is town because of the early day one stuff.

These are remaining:

Ichimaru Gin
XerxesPraelor
Awaclus
Twistedarcher
chairs

So, again I want to look at people who've been blending in. That's certainly not the case for TA, plus I've never seen him play scum, I wouldn't be able to judge it well. I briefly reread Ichi and he has some pretty extensive posts with lots of content that look genuine. He did support the Joseph lynch, but he was on it early (pretty much first), which I think is better.

That leaves

XerxesPraelor
Awaclus
chairs

I barely remember anything about either of them. I think that's where I want to look for scum next, so I'll go reread those three.

[silverspawn]

wait Awaclus is dead. Guh I'm so behind on this game

[silverspawn]

Right he was the one who lied VT when he was a PR. day 1 lynch .... sorry <.<

[silverspawn]

And he was our watcher too. I had forgotten. Watcher is really strong. well, that sucks.

[Seprix]

And he was our watcher too. I had forgotten. Watcher is really strong. well, that sucks.

How did you not know that? That happened day 1. This is day 3.

[Seprix]

And he was our watcher too. I had forgotten. Watcher is really strong. well, that sucks.

How did you not know that? That happened day 1. This is day 3.

Not an accusation, just thought I remembered you talking about it. Maybe not. I'd have to go look.

[faust]

And he was our watcher too. I had forgotten. Watcher is really strong. well, that sucks.

How did you not know that? That happened day 1. This is day 3.

Well, silver is certainly not the only one here who forgets stuff...

[silverspawn]

So, Xerxes

Day 1                       

Says Awaclus is an IC for scumhunting... really early... and he sounded serious.  Well, Awaclus was town.

Next there is a weird case where he attacks ADK in a strange way, but it doesn't stick.

Well, I'm at #250 now and there were like 5 posts

votes for me for no reason. Voting for me is bad. Also says Joseph is scummy but he doesn't want to vote for him.

Says his gut scum team is SS/ADK/Hydrad. well... whatever I guess.

(about the Joseph thing) Then TA says why don't you want to lynch him if you think he's scum and XP says "Because he's been lynched lately and it would be really frustrating as town to get lynched from basically nothing substantial." That's... interesting. So, scum!XP knows Joseph is town. Based on that, this is a really weird to way to treat someone, because you don't support the mislynch and you don't get towncred for keeping him alive. But he could be genuinely concerned about Joseph's feelings. I'm not sure.

Then he debates a little with faust. Basically, faust's question is, why isn't Joseph on XP's scum team (see above), and XP's answer is, "Interactions."

#363 TA votes for XP.

#373 XP says, "Sorry for leaving - so what's the caseon me?"

That completely... uhm, what's the english word if something is just doesn't get talked about anymore? well anyway, that happens. no-one cares.

Then #476 he just votes for WW out of nowhere. That's 9 hours before the deadline.

And that's it for day 1. He's the only vote on WW in the final count.


Day 2                                       

So,

I was telling people all of D1 awalcus was a bad lynch.

vote: chairs

vote: Joseph

Vote: silverspawn

Vote: Faust

Vote: hydrad

Vote: Joseph

wait, what? When did you do that? Let me double check that.

--

Right, so his "telling you all day 1" is his first three posts, where he calls Awaclus an IC. That's all. He never even mentioned the Awaclus case from that point on. So... yeah. What.

Next he says he refuses to believe that wagon was town driven. That's some serious and completely unjustified confidence.

#636 he tries to hammer Joseph but fails because he didn't read the vote count correctly. There was like an 80 post gap between this and the last one.

Then he asks others to hammer.

Next he says he wants to lynch Joseph or me. He does that twice.

That's it for Day 2.

Day 3 he pushes Faust and me, and that's basically it.

[silverspawn]

I don't really know what to make of all of that. It seems like pretty sloppy play. I think my conclusion is that he's probably town, because usually pays a little bit more thought to how others perceive them, right? But I'm also curious what others think. I think the essential question here is, how clean is scum!XP's meta. Right now I don't really recall any games where he was scum in. There probably were some, though.

[silverspawn]

because *scum usually pays ...

[silverspawn]

And his general activity is really low. Also, he got like zero suspicion so far.

[silverspawn]

And he was our watcher too. I had forgotten. Watcher is really strong. well, that sucks.

How did you not know that? That happened day 1. This is day 3.

mostly because the last weeks sucked and I didn't pay much attention to mafia

[silverspawn]

and then god said shut up and there was silence

well, in any case, chairs is next

[silverspawn]

I'll always include the post index this time.

Day 1                                                                         

Well first vote (#63) is a jokevote for the IC. I don't like this, but it's not a serious scum tell. He does unvote in his second post.

Then there is a really early RVS wagon on chairs.

Next he jumps on the Joseph case because he joked about being scum and had done so in the past. This is true, and it was at a time were voting Joseph was still cool.

#378: he votes for Joseph again. He never unvoted though... oh, actually this counted as an unvote. Well I guess that's legit. But he never expressed a change in opinion.

#394 ADK says chairs makes short posts and opportunistic wagon jumping. That's... not really what happened, since he was first on the wagon. But his posts are short and, well, he was semi lurking.

The chairs wagon from the start has just kind of disappeared at this point.

#434:

Whee.

#452 he explains why he's been lurking.

#526: hammers awaclus. mh.


Day 2                                                         

vote count #586 another small wagon on chairs is forming

#606 Hydrad is defending chairs

#611 chairs wants to lynch Joseph. Bad.

#618: uww. Look at this:

I think a quicklynch does do one big thing for us - gets joseph's lynch out of the way, for good or for ill, and lets us move on with the game.  ADK is right - D1's dragging directly led to the Awaclus lynch, because we all waffled on the joe lynch long enough for an argument to be made.  Here we still have the same "should we lynch joe" moment going on, and it's shaping the conversation, distracting from other things.

vote: joseph L-1

#623 Hydrad continues to defend chairs, and IG agrees.

Then he encourages the hammer and goes back to lurking


#789:

I'm frankly just glad we got the "is Joseph scum or isn't he" issue out of the way, so we can move on.

...



#796 votes for faust. bad.

[XerxesPraelor]

Lots of people suspended me. My scum play is sloppy, so you don't need to worry about "he's too scummy to be scum" but I don't see anything scummy about my play so far. I'm pretty good at not revealing partners though, so Faust's "If XP is scum, scum were all on wagon" would be wrong even if the predicate were true.

I admit my Awalcus thing was wrong - that was just my first reaction finding out that a super-towny person was lynched while I slept and turned out to be a PR on top of that.

And I think Faust is scummier than ss, of the people suspecting me, because SS really looks like he's putting a lot of effort into scumhunting, whereas Faust's comments don't have the directness and responsibility(?) that town has more often.

[silverspawn]

What is worst about chairs is that, at several points in the game (in fact at least 3 times), wagons have been forming on him, and they never took off. This is, I think, a pretty good scum tell, and it makes me want to vote: chairs

I also really, really, really dislike the way he treats the Joseph lynch. It was a bad lynch. He was town. Lynching town is not good. I hate how he is just like "I'm glad this is out of the way" instead of "sorry for pushing this bad lynch that hurt town, I was wrong" or something. Unfortunately, this doesn't make me think he's scum more, I actually think it's a slight town tell. not enough though.

His wagon history is of course as bad as it gets. Hammered the first town and heavily pushed the second.

[silverspawn]

And I think Faust is scummier than ss, of the people suspecting me, because SS really looks like he's putting a lot of effort into scumhunting, whereas Faust's comments don't have the directness and responsibility(?) that town has more often.

well to be fair I put like no effort into this game until today. And I do have a town read on faust now. If we listened to him, Joseph would still be alive.

[silverspawn]

okay, so, does anyone have a good reason against the chairs lynch?

[XerxesPraelor]

vote: chairs

I prefer Faust. He was on the Awalcus lynch, right.

[silverspawn]

Yeah, but so was I.

I think, for faust, the best alignment tell is whether or not he seems like a really confident town player. I agree that he's been less of a presence than in past games, but that's a pretty high standard. I still feel that he's confident here.

And, of course, he wasn't on the Joseph wagon and he is defending me, which I think is big. I'm like a really good mislynch for scum right now. Why should scum!faust not push me? Especially after the scumslip thing.