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[Joseph2302]

Great, L-1. I'm not scum, and I'm not claiming, it's far too early. Not really sure what else I can do. I stand by the facts that I'm not scum, and aren't getting a scumread on anyone who's posted lots, which is why I want to start a wagon on someone who hasn't posted much. I don't see how L-1 is better than L-2 for town anyway either. It's not going to tell us anything extra.

[Joseph2302]

Also, PPE:2 on that last post.

[Seprix]

It could be a viable wagon if more people joined. Seriously, he's using as an argument against voting for him "remember that game where I got to L-1 super quickly and fakeclaimed and it screwed things up? You don't want that happening again, do you?"

I'm saying we should try to consider everyone, not just me. There seems to be a tendency on here to assume I'm scum- I guess I don't help this by claiming scum. But I think it's beneficial to look at other candidates too for scum.

PPE:1

Problem: Everyone thinks you're scum
Why: You say you're scum every game
Solution: Maybe stop joking you're scum? You pulled the same thing last time and you turned out to be Mafia though.

I'm pretty close to voting Joseph.

[Seprix]

no... vote: Joseph

L-2

No, don't vote Joseph, he's innocent. Let's do a different wagon, I like Vote: Seprix, primarily because it's a wagon that isn't me!

lol, really? I'm only not voting yet because you're at L-1 and I want to see your claim.

[Joseph2302]

Just to warn you, if you lynch me now, you'll just get lynched tomorrow, because lynching so early is scummy. Especially as I'm town.

[Seprix]

Not if you're scum.

[Joseph2302]

Not if you're scum.

But I'm not scum. But iI'm not revealing my identity yet.

[Seprix]

Not if you're scum.

But I'm not scum. But iI'm not revealing my identity yet.

I'm not going to speak for everyone else, but if you don't claim now, you're going to die, and you're likely to die anyways. So if you're really town, help town.

[silverspawn]

Not if you're scum.

But I'm not scum. But iI'm not revealing my identity yet.

I'm not going to speak for everyone else, but if you don't claim now, you're going to die, and you're likely to die anyways. So if you're really town, help town.

unvote
vote: Seprix

[Witherweaver]

Vote: Seprix

[Witherweaver]

Anyone ever hear about that thing where claiming is bad for us?

Hey, why don't we all just massclaim at Day 1 start every single game.

[chairs]

vote: seprix holy crap did you even read the IC

[A Drowned Kernel]

Seriously, what's so bad about the lynch here? What's the point of putting someone at L-1 if the threat of lynching is empty?

[silverspawn]

Seriously, what's so bad about the lynch here? What's the point of putting someone at L-1 if the threat of lynching is empty?

It's not necessarily bad. But I don't like saying "claim or I will hammer" this early in the game. You should confirm that everyone who votes for the person is serious about his vote, then you can ask for a claim

[A Drowned Kernel]

Is everyone voting for joseph serious about their vote? I am.

[Witherweaver]

Seriously, what's so bad about the lynch here? What's the point of putting someone at L-1 if the threat of lynching is empty?

There's, like, nothing that convinces me in any way that we'll hit scum.  I don't see this as any different than rolling a die at the beginning of the day.

[Awaclus]

Is everyone voting for joseph serious about their vote? I am.

My vote is a serious one, yes.

[Twistedarcher]

I don't get it, this just seems like a random continuation of RVS.

You guys are okay lynching Joseph because you think it's more likely scum would make that joke than town would make that joke? I disagree, but more importantly, I think it was just a dang joke. We're lynching someone over a joke?

It seems like it's this joke that's causing the votes, I haven't seen too much about Joseph's reactions as a reason for the vote. I don't get how this is good grounds for a lynch, it's not impossible he's scum but I don't think we've honestly learned anything about him.

[Twistedarcher]

Seprix, have you been scum before?

[Twistedarcher]

A Joseph lynch here seems meta-fueled more than anything else. This group of people has been playing a ton of mafia games together lately, but looking at the case with no meta-perspective on Joseph, it seems to be woefully lacking in facts or proof from this game.

[Witherweaver]

I don't get it, this just seems like a random continuation of RVS.

You guys are okay lynching Joseph because you think it's more likely scum would make that joke than town would make that joke? I disagree, but more importantly, I think it was just a dang joke. We're lynching someone over a joke?

It seems like it's this joke that's causing the votes, I haven't seen too much about Joseph's reactions as a reason for the vote. I don't get how this is good grounds for a lynch, it's not impossible he's scum but I don't think we've honestly learned anything about him.

This is precisely correct.  He may or may not be scum, but even if he is it has nothing to do with any of what's gone on so far.

[Twistedarcher]

Ichi reads scummiest to me out of all this, I'll pull some quotes in a minute

[silverspawn]

A Joseph lynch here seems meta-fueled more than anything else. This group of people has been playing a ton of mafia games together lately, but looking at the case with no meta-perspective on Joseph, it seems to be woefully lacking in facts or proof from this game.

well, meta reads are most valuable kind of reads. I disagree that there is nothing to go on. Just the way someone posts can be enough, you don't necessarily need content.

but that's just my general answer. As for this case, I don't think it's enough to lynch him yet.

[Twistedarcher]

From experience. Getting early, sincere suspicion on you as scum is very frustrating. I'm fairly certain he wasn't banking on people finding him scummy this soon into the game. And so far, his reactions seem to fit pretty well with him being frustrated scum.

PPE: 1

(Sorry, this is getting broken up into multiple posts since I'm having trouble formatting on my tablet).

Here's scummy post #1. Getting frustrated at suspicion definitely isn't a scum trait or a town trait, it happens to everyone -- no one likes being lynched, especially when the arguments appear to be fairly empty. What's scummy about this post is that Ichi's taking a neutral action and trying to turn it into Joseph being scummy. Rather than looking at the evidence and making a conclusion, this reads to me like Ichi starting with the conclusion (Joseph = scum) and fitting the evidence to that conclusion.

This can come from both scum trying to manufacture reasons (since they don't have gut reads or anything of the such), or town who's already made up their mind and wants to "prove" their read is correct.

[Twistedarcher]

I just don't see Joseph trying here at all. He claims scum. And how does he expect to avert people's scumreads on him for all of his "joking"? By doing the same thing and purposefully acting scummy--he's embracing it. This is our lynch today people.

Scummy post #2 -- the same traits as scummy post #1. People will try to avoid lynches as town or scum, there's nothing in Joseph's behavior that you've pointed out that I think is even close to an exclusive scum behavior, but once again you're attributing this to Joseph clearly being scum.