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51

Dominion Articles / Re: Reasons for the 1st-player vs 2nd-player advantage

« on: January 19, 2012, 05:32:33 pm »

Further I believe that if skill and card distribution are held equal, then position would be determining in all but the simplest engines where the final determinant - the tie breaker rule - would dominate.

Strictly speaking, if two players play the same (which I assume is what you mean by "skill held equal") and card distribution is held equal, I don't believe the tie-breaker rule will ever come into play.  Either the setup will be such that one player can pull off something like a double Province buy to end the game (in which case position is the determinant), or the players will perfectly mirror one another and the game will be a draw.  The tiebreaker rule only comes into play when the second player gets ahead - through inequalities in skill or luck, which you are saying are held equal here - and then the first player leverages positional advantage to tie the score.

I guess there could be situations where two equally skilled, equally lucky players don't play the same (say, because the optimal strategy differs depending on position...like buying a turn-2 IGG is very good for player 1 but only pretty good for player 2), but I don't think those cases can be summarized as "only the simplest engines."

52

Dominion Articles / Re: Scheme

« on: January 18, 2012, 07:45:50 pm »

Also, not that it matters, but you should have loaded up on the Torturers.

Since there were no actual villages on the board and I was expecting to play from a 3-card hand every turn, I didn't think I'd be able to draw enough TR+Scheme pairs to get a real Torturer chain going.  Could be you're right, though; I only realized late in the game that TR>TR>Torturer was pretty much always going to draw a Scheme that I could play to avoid dead draws, which would help make an engine out of it.

53

Dominion Articles / Re: Scheme

« on: January 18, 2012, 07:35:11 pm »

Since, if you don't use them to top-deck anything but themselves, Schemes are just cantrips, is top-decking all your schemes any better than just top-decking nothing vs. Minion?  Either you discard a bunch of schemes and draw a random sample of the rest of your deck, or you discard a random sample of the rest of your deck and draw another random sample of the rest of your deck.

There is one case I can think of where top-decking schemes could be really good against Minion, though, and that's where you're playing enough of them every turn that you can arrange to make the 6th-9th cards in your deck be the good ones (i.e., if you play 3KCed schemes, you can arrange the top of your deck to be, in descending order, (scheme, scheme, scheme, scheme, scheme, KC, KC, scheme, good terminal).  Then you draw 5 schemes, discard them to minion, and draw your good 4-card combo.  That sounds hard to pull off, though.

54

GokoDom / Re: IsoDom 3 Sign-up

« on: January 18, 2012, 07:24:32 pm »

Didn't Theory say he was gonna post the submissions to the Kingdom Challenge, along with some comments (*edit* here)?  If they're out in time (or even if they're only out in time for the later rounds), we could play some of the ones that looked interesting but didn't make it into the main tournament.

55

Dominion Articles / Re: Scheme

« on: January 18, 2012, 07:19:57 pm »

Nice article.  I think there's one more item that belongs in the "Particularly Good Combos" section, which is "any good attack."  It's the same basic principle you're getting at with the "non-colliding terminals" thing, but it's particularly crushing to get hit with a Mountebank or Militia every single turn.

Also, was playing this game right as I read your post...thematically appropriate:

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201201/18/game-20120118-161158-3b527516.html

56

GokoDom / Re: IsoDom 3 Sign-up

« on: January 18, 2012, 04:45:28 pm »

I'd like to sign up.

57

Game Reports / Re: Games where you were SURE you'd lost

« on: January 18, 2012, 12:58:24 am »

From just now:

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201201/17/game-20120117-215423-842a86f3.html

On a Colony board, I misplay by not picking up any Moats against a Young Witch, which results in my opponent getting up 7-3 on me in the Curse split.  That allows him to build a much better Scrying Pool engine than the half-hearted one I put together.  However, my desperate rush for green along with several Inn-enabled Scrying Pool megaturns out of my deck allow me to pick up Colony+Farmland>Province on my last turn to secure a 3-point victory.

58

Dominion General Discussion / Re: Amb/Amb or Amb/Silver?

« on: January 17, 2012, 04:59:25 pm »

Semi-related question:  When (if ever) should you return less coppers to retain buying power for a turn.  If you opened amb/amb, is it worth returning 0 or 1 coppers so you can buy your silver on turn 3/4?

59

Game Reports / Re: *sigh* Friggin' Possession

« on: January 15, 2012, 12:42:55 am »

Why didn't you buy a Copper on Turn 2?

Not smart enough.

Good call on Warehouse; shoulda picked it up.

60

Game Reports / *sigh* Friggin' Possession

« on: January 13, 2012, 03:58:52 pm »

From today:

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201201/13/game-20120113-125335-aaf14822.html

I go Counting House/Bank on a Colony board and rush Colonies.  My opponent trashes his deck down to nothing so he can play Possession every turn (often more than once).  With a lot of good luck and one obvious mistake by my opponent (playing a Bank before Coppers while Possessing me), I get up 6-0 in Colonies, but then get nailed by a turn where my opponent plays all 3 of his Possessions, then plays an Outpost to play them all again, and uses my deck to clear out the last two Colonies and most of the Provinces, beating me by 3 points.

Awesome game that would only have been more awesome if I'd narrowly won instead of narrowly losing .

61

Dominion Articles / Re: Crossing The Lvl 30 Barrier

« on: January 12, 2012, 01:31:33 am »

In the end it's just idle to say 'this topic is important to get from 10 to 20', 'that is important to get from 30 to 40' and so on. All are important, and noone can really put them in an exact order.

Maybe not an exact order, but I think there are some regularities to both the order and the skill levels at which people tend to learn specific things as they get better, and it's useful (to me, at least, as someone who just hit 30 for the first time but still feels like I could brush up on some of this stuff) to read an article like this one that basically says, "Feel like you've learned a bunch of stuff that's made you a better player but not enough to be great yet?  Here's what you probably still have left to learn."

There are stages of skill we all talk about, and the early ones are easy to spot:  Buying way too many actions because they're cool, not realizing that money is good.  Being a Village Idiot.  Buying only Provinces without understanding the dynamics underlying the PPR.  And I think pretty much everybody learns those early lessons in a somewhat similar order:
-The basic rules of the game.
-Trashing can be good.
-Money is better than you think.
-Some basic combos.
-How to build an engine.

But the equivalents of those lessons at higher level play are a little less obvious (involving things like deck control, knowing when money isn't better than you used to think, when to ignore the PPR and rush the last two Provinces, etc.), and I think it's nice to have an article focused on the stage where these things are what you should be working on.  It's not just that "all are important," because if you told someone who doesn't get why money is good that he should work on managing his reshuffles, I doubt it's going to improve his game, but if I start working more on managing my reshuffles, it's probably going to help me out a lot.

62

Simulation / Re: Simulation Challenge: I Like Big Decks And I Cannot Lie

« on: January 10, 2012, 06:34:04 pm »

Someone go ahead and beat it, then I'll optimize.

Opening IW/Workshop instead of IW/Silver beats that ~64-33:

Code: [Select]

<player name="I/W/SR/G with Border Village"
 author="WW/A_S00"
 description="No description available">
 <type name="UserCreated"/>
 <type name="Province"/>
 <type name="Bot"/>
 <type name="TwoPlayer"/>
   <buy name="Province"/>
   <buy name="Border_Village"/>
   <buy name="Silk_Road">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Ironworks"/>
         <operator type="greaterThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="1.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Ironworks">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInHand" attribute="Ironworks"/>
         <operator type="greaterThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="0.0"/>
      </condition>
      <condition>
         <left type="isActionPhase"/>
         <operator type="equalTo" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="1.0"/>
      </condition>
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInPlay" attribute="Border_Village"/>
         <operator type="smallerThan" />
         <right type="countCardsInPlay" attribute="Ironworks"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Gardens">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInSupply" attribute="Silk_Road"/>
         <operator type="smallerThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="3.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Duchy">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInSupply" attribute="Gardens"/>
         <operator type="smallerThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="2.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Estate">
      <condition>
         <left type="gainsNeededToEndGame"/>
         <operator type="smallerThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="5.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Ironworks"/>
   <buy name="Silk_Road"/>
   <buy name="Gardens"/>
   <buy name="Workshop">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Workshop"/>
         <operator type="equalTo" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="0.0"/>
      </condition>
      <condition>
         <left type="countTurns"/>
         <operator type="smallerThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="3.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Silver"/>
   <buy name="Estate">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInSupply" attribute="Silk_Road"/>
         <operator type="smallerThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="5.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Copper"/>
</player>

63

Simulation / Re: Simulation Challenge: I Like Big Decks And I Cannot Lie

« on: January 10, 2012, 06:09:05 pm »

It says v1.2.0, released December 2011...it's the one linked from Geronimoo's Wordpress.  I assume it's the newest.  Oh, I know what happened, I deleted the trailing > by accident when I took out the description line.

Code: [Select]

<player name="Yo Deck So Fat"
 author="A_S00"
 description="I like squirrels.">
 <type name="UserCreated"/>
 <type name="Combo"/>
 <type name="Province"/>
 <type name="Bot"/>
 <type name="Competitive"/>
 <type name="TwoPlayer"/>
   <buy name="Border_Village"/>
   <buy name="Ill_Gotten_Gains">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Ill_Gotten_Gains"/>
         <operator type="smallerThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="2.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Ironworks">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInSupply" attribute="Province"/>
         <operator type="smallerThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="8.0"/>
      </condition>
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Ironworks"/>
         <operator type="smallerThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="4.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Workshop">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInSupply" attribute="Province"/>
         <operator type="smallerThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="8.0"/>
      </condition>
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Ironworks"/>
         <operator type="smallerThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="4.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Gardens">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Ironworks"/>
         <operator type="greaterThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="1.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Silk_Road">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Ironworks"/>
         <operator type="greaterThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="1.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Ironworks"/>
   <buy name="Workshop"/>
   <buy name="Estate"/>
   <buy name="Silver"/>
   <buy name="Copper"/>
</player>

Try that?

*edit*

There's a line missing (description). Did you modify your clipboard after clicking Copy/Paste in the simulator? If you did... don't.

Roger o7

64

Simulation / Simulation Challenge: I Like Big Decks And I Cannot Lie

« on: January 10, 2012, 05:53:19 pm »

So, I was just reading another thread from this section, and I noticed that some people would like more simulation challenges, and I thought, "you know, I might not be good enough at the simulators to win those things, but I'm good enough at posting topics to make one."

And I remembered that there's been some interest in Gardens on the forums lately, and some interest in Silk Road, and even some interest in how they compare, and what to do when both of them are on the board.  And then I thought about all the cool mass-card-gaining options that have been added with Hinterlands, and how I've been wondering which of them work with Gardens, and all that stuff...so I says to myself, I says, "this sounds like a problem for the simulators!"

-----

Kingdom (Provinces):
$6 - Border Village
$5 - Ill-Gotten Gains, Cache, Haggler
$4 - Gardens, Silk Road, Ironworks, Trader
$3 - Workshop
$2 - Hamlet

And here's my best effort so far:

Code: [Select]

<player name="Yo Deck So Fat"
 author="A_S00"
 description="I like squirrels.">
 <type name="UserCreated"/>
 <type name="Combo"/>
 <type name="Province"/>
 <type name="Bot"/>
 <type name="Competitive"/>
 <type name="TwoPlayer"/>
   <buy name="Border_Village"/>
   <buy name="Ill_Gotten_Gains">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Ill_Gotten_Gains"/>
         <operator type="smallerThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="2.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Ironworks">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInSupply" attribute="Province"/>
         <operator type="smallerThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="8.0"/>
      </condition>
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Ironworks"/>
         <operator type="smallerThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="4.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Workshop">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInSupply" attribute="Province"/>
         <operator type="smallerThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="8.0"/>
      </condition>
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Ironworks"/>
         <operator type="smallerThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="4.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Gardens">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Ironworks"/>
         <operator type="greaterThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="1.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Silk_Road">
      <condition>
         <left type="countCardsInDeck" attribute="Ironworks"/>
         <operator type="greaterThan" />
         <right type="constant" attribute="1.0"/>
      </condition>
   </buy>
   <buy name="Ironworks"/>
   <buy name="Workshop"/>
   <buy name="Estate"/>
   <buy name="Silver"/>
   <buy name="Copper"/>
</player>

Now, I'm no expert with the simulator, nor am I any better than decent at Dominion, so I'm probably setting the initial bar to beat pretty low...but I do love my Silk Roads and my Gardens, and I enjoy reading these simulation threads...so who wants to do it better?

Go ahead!

*edit* Un-broken'd the bot.

65

Game Reports / Re: Dear My Opponent: I am Sorry

« on: January 07, 2012, 05:37:30 pm »

http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20120105-162906-42dc7ba8.html

I got the King's Court +Masquerade part of the pin going, so I was trashing pieces of my opponent's hand every turn, but there were no discard attacks in the kingdom, so I couldn't completely lock them down.  Which meant they spent a huge number of turns sitting through my long-drawn-out Highway>KC+Masq turns, watching their deck be slowly trashed, trying desperately to see if there was something they could do to stop me from destroying their whole deck...and they did slow me down; each card they Masqueraded into my deck was one less that I could trash from their hand on the next turn, and at one point they even forced me to pass them one of the highways I wanted to keep, but really, I think they were doomed.

First time I've ever used KC+Masq...it's stupid.

66

Dominion General Discussion / Re: Nice Combo: Silkroad / Remake

« on: January 06, 2012, 05:46:44 pm »

I'll bet this would work with Silver/Develop, using the Develops to make a whole bunch of Estates and Silk Roads from each other and your Silvers...time to play with the simulator.

As a general rule, Develop isn't great for gaining Victory cards; they go right on top of your deck.

Yeah, it totally failed .

67

Game Reports / Re: Adventurer/Tunnel vs. IGG/Remake

« on: January 06, 2012, 05:07:56 pm »

Oops, Adventurer, not Ambassador; thanks for the edit, Mystery Mod.  And yes, the Adventurer did need the trashing support, doubly so when comboing it with Tunnel (since if it finds treasure too quickly, it's less likely to flip over Tunnels).

Highway/+Buy never seems like it's going to be worth it to me if there's no +actions/+cards engine to support it, but I do seem to keep losing to it, so maybe that'd be worth it.  Thanks for the feedback!

68

Dominion General Discussion / Re: Nice Combo: Silkroad / Remake

« on: January 06, 2012, 04:37:18 pm »

I'll bet this would work with Silver/Develop, using the Develops to make a whole bunch of Estates and Silk Roads from each other and your Silvers...time to play with the simulator.

69

Game Reports / Adventurer/Tunnel vs. IGG/Remake

« on: January 06, 2012, 04:31:31 pm »

Just played a game I felt like sharing:

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201201/06/game-20120106-131806-6bbbf0de.html

I bought up Tunnels along with some light trashing and an Adventurer to trigger the Tunnel reaction.  My opponent rushed Ill-Gotten Gains with Remakes to turn them into Golds.  Due to IGG emptying two piles, rushing tunnels turned out to work in my favor, as I was able to end the game on piles early and win despite being down 1-2 in Provinces.

-----

What I think I should have done differently:
-I think I should have recognized that ending the game early was in my favor earlier, and bought an IGG (or maybe a Tunnel, or a second Adventurer) instead of that Highway on turn 9.
-The turn 16 Duchy buy was a mistake.  If I'd bought a Tunnel instead, I could have denied my opponent his second Province buy.

What I think my opponent should have done differently:
-Rushed Duchies earlier.
-Maybe contested me on Tunnels?

-----

Anyway, what with all the IGG hate of late, and as rare as it is to see Adventurer pull its own weight, I thought I'd post it.  Anybody have additional thoughts on what either of us could have done differently?  Or is there another dominant strategy that both of us just missed?

Thanks!

70

Dominion General Discussion / Re: More Fun With (Un)popular Buys

« on: January 04, 2012, 07:23:09 pm »

Most

Code: [Select]

$6 - Goons (96.2%), Border Village (93.3%)
$5 - Mountebank (91.7%)
$4 - Worker's Village (94.7%), Caravan (94.6%), Farming Village (90.6%)
$3p - Familiar (92.5%)
$3 - Fishing Village (94.1%)
$2 - Chapel (92.7%), Crossroads (89.7%)
GOONS ENGINE, WITCHES!  Too bad Caravan is the only real source of +Cards.  Also, apparently I buy a lot of villages (although only Border Village and Crossroads show evidence of me buying them too much).

Least (ignoring Archivist and prizes)

Code: [Select]

$5 - Horn of Plenty (7%), Counting House (4.5%), Harvest (4.3%), Explorer (4.2%), Contraband (4.0%)
$4 - Coppersmith (6.9%), Bureaucrat (6.8%), Thief (5.8%), Navigator (1.7%)
$3 - Chancellor (7.7%)
AKA, a bunch of terrible cards and I have no idea how to use Horn of Plenty.  Big Money it is.  Maybe Navigator/BM or Explorer/BM (depending on starting split).

71

Dominion General Discussion / Re: Evaluate your best and your worst board

« on: January 04, 2012, 07:06:48 pm »

Ooh, cool topic, didn't notice it until now.  Level 28 today:

Best

Code: [Select]

$7 - King's Court (63.5%)
$6 - Goons (69%)
$5 - Governor (81%), Upgrade (74%), Saboteur (69%)
$4 - Remodel (66%)
$3 - Steward (63.5%)
$2 - Embargo (64%), Pawn (63.5%), Hamlet (63.5%)

Colony/Platinum available.
Huh.  I guess I'd open Governor/Hamlet on 5/2 and gain a couple golds, then buy my way into some kind of Goons engine, using Upgrades for trashing, buying lots of Hamlets for +actions, and more Governors for +Cards, then eventually try to get some big KC/Goons turns going.  On 4/3, maybe open Remodel/Silver, Remodel Estates into more Silvers and Coppers into Hamlets, and buy a Goons as soon as possible, then transition into that same engine.  Not really a board I see a particularly obvious play on, though.

Interestingly, quite a few of these are cards where my Effect Without is much higher than my Effect With (Governor, currently my best card with 16 games, gives me a Win Rate Without of 2.00...apparently, every time I've decided not to buy Governor so far, I've won).  Colony and Platinum also have much higher Effect Without for me...I guess I'm good at figuring out when to rush Provinces on a Colony board?

As for what it says about me...I'm good with some engines and attacks, and also at not buying certain terrible cards?  Don't see much of any kind of pattern there.

Worst (ignoring Archivist, which I've never played)

Code: [Select]

$7 - Expand (44%)
$6 - Nobles (45.5%)
$5 - Counting House (42%), Mandarin (42.5%), Torturer (44.5%), Inn (46%)
$4p - Golem (42%)
$4 - Noble Brigand (39%), Sea Hag (44.5%)
$3 - Fortune Teller (42%)
Open Sea Hag/Silver or Torturer/nothing, transition into Inn/Torturer engine with some Silvers and Golds.  Buy Nobles instead of Golds late game (after the fourth Province gets bought, maybe?).  Not confident I'd win.

From my Council Room stats, looks like there are some cards (Counting House, Mandarin, Fortune Teller) that I just have no idea how to play, so I never buy them, resulting in terrible Effect Without (since on the rare occasions when I should buy them, I don't).  And then there's some cards I just suck with.

Cool beans.

72

Dominion General Discussion / Hamlet/Gardens?

« on: December 23, 2011, 02:52:58 am »

Hey, guys.

I've been noticing recently (among a flurry of realizations of the variety "whoa, Hinterlands has some great cards for high-econ Gardens decks") that Hamlet pairs pretty well with Gardens (not particularly good example game).  Basically, in a garden game, you always have a ton of green to discard, you benefit a lot from +buy, and since Hamlet costs $2, it's a very easy third pile to empty.  This made me wonder how it would stack up against classics like Workshop, Woodcutter, and Ironworks in a gardening deck.

I tried to simulate the problem, but the play rules for Hamlet in Geronimoo's simulator don't work well with a Gardens strategy (if you have multiple Hamlets in your hand it will erroneously discard for +actions, it doesn't like to discard coppers for +buy even when doing so makes sense).  So, I'll try human expertise instead:  Has anybody tried this out?  How does it work in the long run?

To engage in some baseless theorycrafting, I'm guessing that Hamlets are better for buying up lots of estates and coppers later in a gardens game, and maybe better at ending a game early on piles (so good against someone who's not going gardens) because of being cheap, but not good at gobbling up the gardens early (since they don't really help you hit $4 on more turns, and don't let you gain cards without buying).  So, on a board with both Workshops and Hamlets, I imagine it's probably best to open with Workshops, and then maybe transition into Hamlets later in the game to pick up a ton of coppers...but I'm not sure when to start buying Estates instead.

Anyway, thought I'd share.

73

Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Can you beat the Lucky Chancellor ?

« on: August 12, 2011, 11:15:28 am »

Checked again; play2draw's solution actually works in the case where you go first without Great Hall.  Here's the worst-case scenario (I stopped when the pin is complete at the end of turn 11; getting yourself set up to pick up VPs works the same as before):

1 - 4c1e - buy IW
2 - 3c2e - buy Chapel

(reshuffle)

3 - 3e2c - do nothing
4 - 5c - buy Village

   DISCARD = Village, 7c3e; DECK = Chapel, IW

(draw IW, Chapel, reshuffle)

5 - Chapel, IW, 3c - IW (Island, draw 1c), chapel 4c
6 - village, 1c3e - village (reshuffle, draw 1c)

   DISCARD = Village, 2c3e; DECK = IW, Island, Chapel, 1c

7 - Chapel, Island, IW, 1c1e - IW (Village), Chapel (1c1e)

   DISCARD = Chapel, Island, IW; DECK = Village, Village, 2c2e

8 - Village, 2c2e - Village (draw Village), Village (draw Island)

   DISCARD = Village, Village, Island, 2c2e; DECK = Chapel, IW

9 - Chapel, IW, Island, Village, Village - Village (draw 1c), Village (draw 1c), Chapel (2c)

   DISCARD = Chapel, IW, Island, Village, Village; DECK = 2e

10 - IW, Village, Island, 2e - Village (draw Chapel), Chapel (2e), IW (Militia)

   DISCARD = IW, Village, Island, Chapel; DECK = Village, Militia

11 - Village, Militia, Chapel, Island, IW - IW (Masquerade), Village (draw Village), Village (draw Masquerade), Island (Chapel), Militia, Masquerade (nothing to draw, nothing to pass, trash incoming card)

-----

For the case where the Chancellor player goes first, the solution I posted above works (pin complete at the end of turn 10).

*edit* Actually, I'm wrong.  The solution from my previous post doesn't quite work, because of the VP stuff at the end.

Specifically, once you IW yourself a second Island, it becomes possible to draw (IW, Militia, Monument, Masquerade, Island) on any given turn.  With that hand, you can IW yourself a Great Hall to make it possible to draw your entire deck and continue the pin, but doing so makes it impossible to Island away your IW (since it's in play).

However, the addition of Peddler to the kingdom makes the solution work.  Play the same game up through completing the pin on turn 10.  On turn 11, instead of IW (Monument), you IW (Peddler).  You do this four times, on turns 11-14 (you are guaranteed to be able to play your entire deck on these turns, so Peddler will always cost $0).  Then you IW (Island) on turn 15.  On 16, your turn is:

IW, Militia, Masquerade, Island, Great Hall - Great Hall (draw Great Hall), Great Hall (draw Village), Village (draw Village), Village (draw Peddler), Peddler (draw Peddler), Peddler (draw Peddler), Peddler (draw Peddler), Peddler (nothing to draw), Island (IW), Militia, Masquerade (nothing to draw, nothing to pass, trash incoming card), buy Monument

Your deck now consists of (Masquerade, Militia, Monument, Great Hall x2, Village x2, Peddler x4).  With only 3 terminals, you are guaranteed to be able to play your entire deck without gaining any cards every turn.  You can even pick up a second Monument to double your VP income rate without risking letting up the pin.

With that revision, the Kingdom becomes (Chapel, Chancellor, Village, Great Hall, Masquerade, Ironworks, Militia, Island, Monument, Peddler) for a total of 10 cards - just fits!

74

Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Can you beat the Lucky Chancellor ?

« on: August 12, 2011, 02:12:45 am »

This goes in the correct direction ! However it is too slow to achieve a 100% success (check the case when Estates and Coppers are on the top at every reshuffle).

I'm not done testing it yet, but I'm pretty sure that play2draw's solution only needs Great Hall added to it and it works, even with the worst possible shuffle luck.

*edit* Yep.  I'm pretty sure the following is the worst possible shuffle luck (note the delay of both opening buys until turn 5, followed by every shuffle putting as many terminals into the hand as possible):

1 - 4c1e - buy IW
2 - 3c2e - buy Chapel

(reshuffle)

3 - 3e2c - do nothing
4 - 5c - buy Village

   DISCARD = Village, 7c3e; DECK = Chapel, IW

(draw IW, Chapel, reshuffle)

5 - Chapel, IW, 3c - IW (Great Hall, draw 1c), chapel 4c, no buy
6 - village, 1c3e - village (reshuffle, draw 1c), no buy

   DISCARD = Village, 2c3e; DECK = Chapel, IW, Great Hall, 1c3e

7 - Chapel, IW, 1c2e - IW (Island, draw 1e), Chapel (1c3e)

   DISCARD = Chapel, Village, IW, Island, 2c; DECK = Great Hall

(draw Great Hall, reshuffle)

8 - Great Hall, Island, IW, Village, Chapel - IW (Village), Village (draw 1c), Great Hall (draw 1c), Chapel (2c)

   DISCARD = Village, Island, Chapel, Great Hall, Great Hall, IW; DECK = Village

(draw Village, reshuffle)

9 - Village, Village, Island, Great Hall, Great Hall - Village (draw Chapel), Village (draw IW), Island (Chapel), IW (Militia), Great Hall (draw Militia), Militia

   DISCARD = Village, Village, Great Hall, Great Hall, IW, Militia

(reshuffle)

10 - IW, Militia, Great Hall, Great Hall, Village = Village (draw Village), IW (Masquerade), Great Hall (draw Masquerade), Great Hall (nothing to draw), Militia, Masquerade (nothing to draw, nothing to pass, trash incoming card)

(reshuffle - at this point, the pin is complete)

11 - IW, Militia, Masquerade, Great Hall, Great Hall - Great Hall (draw Village), Great Hall (draw Village), Village (nothing to draw), IW (Monument), Village (draw Monument), Monument, Militia, Masquerade (nothing to draw, nothing to pass, trash incoming card)

...etc.

(Technically, on subsequent turns you'll have to IW yourself another village, then IW yourself another Island, then Island away your IW, so that you don't have to keep picking up an action card with IW every turn in order to avoid having it in your hand when you play Masquerade...but this won't be a problem.  Picking up extra villages and extra Monuments before you get rid of IW will help you pick up VP faster, which might actually be necessary, since at 1VP/turn, the silver pile might actually empty before you rack up enough VP to beat your opponent.)

75

Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Can you beat the Lucky Chancellor ?

« on: August 11, 2011, 05:35:24 pm »

Does his "perfect shuffle luck" mean he always draws Chancellor along with his biggest treasures, regardless of circumstance, or does it mean he draws whatever would be worst for you given whatever strategy you're pursuing?