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##### Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Idea for an expansion with RNG?
« on: May 15, 2024, 04:24:25 pm »
In your designs, strive to minimize the randomness. Here is an example of a card that would minimize randomness.[/font][/size][/color]

Quote
Name0107 • \$4 • Action - Dice
2 or 3, +1 Buy and +\$1
11 or 12, +\$3
otherwise, +\$2
You can't buy a card costing the highest of the two dice rolled this turn.[/color][/font][/size]

This includes the type Dice to clue a player that they are to follow some prescribed rule. Here we can say the rule is to roll two D6 dice upon playing the card.

For Name0107, there is a 3/36 or 1/12 chance you get the low end, 3/36 or 1/12 chance you get the high end, and 30/36 or 5/6 change you just get the middle.[/font][/size][/color]

Hello BryGuy and thanks for the suggestion but I think that minimizing the randomness might go against the theme for this expansion. That being said, Dominion players don't like randomness on the whole so I understand your meaning. If the randomness can swing the game too much, players will be frustrated.

Just to be clear, you are saying that the card which you quoted minimized randomness because all three of the random outcomes are somewhat similar? Or did you mean something else by "minimize randomness?"

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##### Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Idea for an expansion with RNG?
« on: May 15, 2024, 04:16:48 pm »
The dice idea isn't necessarily a bad one, but in my opinion it doesn't add much (besides frustrating people when they get unlucky).
I'll give some thoughts about each of your cards. Sometimes I might sound a bit harsh, if that is the case I'm sorry and I assure you it isn't intended.
RNG Laboratory:If it is on average a lab, it shouldn't cost \$3. It's maybe a little weaker than lab, but not enough to cost less than \$5.
Snake Eyes Hex: Doesn't need "OR". If I understand right, "the card goes into your discard pile after playing" isn't necessary; but I'm not entirely sure if it's referring to SEH or the card that rolled dice. As a cantrip, it is still useless without other RNG cards, it just isn't actively harmful to your deck. (Each Action can be considered as having a net -1 card -1 action on top of everything else).
Lucky Charm: You noted its biggest flaw. It also might be too weak, being a terminal stop card.
Lottery: 1/36 chance for big upside is just too little, and the Curse means you just won't get this ever. The worst part is that if you get it, you want it early to maximize odds of triggering, but if it does trigger early it adds 4 stop cards at a time when you can't support them and also has a decent chance of ending your turn then and there.
RNG Sifter: I don't want to get into the odds here since that would take forever, but I think it's balanced. Would be pretty frustrating as the only draw though.
Underdog: Calling out another Kingdom card is bad design, and there's no accountability for a player with SEH in hand. Current numbers seem way to strong.
Platoon: "Each other player discards down to 4 cards in hand. Until the start of your next turn, the first time each other player rolls two dice, they get 2 pips less (but not less than 2)." Seems either a bit weak or very strong, depending on the kingdom. Not sure how I feel about this one.
Four Leaf Clover: You saw above how I would word the pip modification. Perhaps the limits could even be in the rulebook, like how costs being unable to go below zero now is. The entire "You may play multiple Four Leaf Clovers on the same roll of the dice, if you have enough. This card can only be played in reaction, and does nothing if nobody is rolling the dice. If you play this on your own turn it does not deplete an Action." is unnecessary, and just implicitly true (check out Hinterlands and Menagerie if you want to see examples). A Reaction that is only a Reaction is also generally a bad idea (although DXV did make it work with Hovel).
War Bonds: I like this one! Maybe it could be worded a bit more cleanly, like "When scoring, 1 D6 is rolled. All War Bonds make 1 VP per pip." (The lack of modifiers is implicit, once the game is over.)

Hello StrangerSon712 and thank you for the suggestions! Overall your wording is super clear and concise. You are pretty good at writing card rules. I think I will modify my post to include some of your suggestions.

RNG Laboratory was priced wrong because of the embarrassing mix-up that segura pointed out to me.

Underdog was a little wacky when I was writing it and I wasn't sure how to handle it.

I can delete the extra stuff from Four Leaf Clover but I didn't know exactly how to write a Reaction-only card.

The verbose wording in the thing about pips was only because I didn't want RNG Sifter to be confusing if you tried to modify your roll. RNG Sifter requires looking at both dice separately so then I had to write how you are going to modify each die separately.

You are right, most of these would not work if you added them without having any other cards from this collection to go with them. I think especially Platoon and Lottery are not good but then become better if you can have Four Leaf Clover or something.

3
##### Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Idea for an expansion with RNG?
« on: May 15, 2024, 12:25:08 am »
It has been done before. Here is one example <https://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=21390.msg896699#msg896699> and another <https://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=455.msg6816#msg6816>. Since neither garnered much positive feedback, one may surmise that this concept is very difficult to successfully accomplish.

My first set of cards used dice. They are still in my ideas file, and don't look like how they first started. Also, I have not printed any of these ideas yet and i have printed five yellow boxes worth of fan made cards.

Hello BryGuy and thanks for reading my idea! I took a brief peek at those two topics. I didn't look at it super in-depth but I think the first one (Vikings) is a bit more focused on the Conquests and maybe tacked on the die rolling as an extra gimmick. Maybe some players didn't like it because the dice felt out of place? On the Dominion Vegas one I found that the idea of buying dice was really cool but also very weird. In my opinion the dice should be accessible to everyone at any time. You are already putting in enough effort by simply buying those RNG cards, aren't you?

Nice to talk to some experienced fan card designers who know what they are doing!

4
##### Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Idea for an expansion with RNG?
« on: May 15, 2024, 12:21:24 am »
DXV does not read the fan cards subforum for obvious reasons.

Adding dice to a card game is adding randomness to randomness. I think you confused Village with Lab with your very first card.

Thank you segura for that correction. Wow village is such a common card I am surprised and embarrassed that I confused it with Lab. I will definitely edit that for the correction.

Yeah I can see why DXV would not read this subforum. Anyway for some reason I got way too excited about having had my first idea for an expansion theme. So I just wanted to write it down somewhere.

Nice to talk to some experienced fan card designers who know what they are doing!

5
##### Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Idea for an expansion with RNG?
« on: May 14, 2024, 08:58:39 pm »
One more thing to add is I didn't playtest it yet because I am very inexperienced in Dominion fan card design and I don't even know whether or not I would have enough blank cards to do that (probably not). So these cards are really just the raw unfiltered idea without any kind of editing.

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##### Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Idea for an expansion with RNG?
« on: May 14, 2024, 08:42:58 pm »
Oh yes right I forgot I also wanted to add an attack whose effectiveness depends on a die roll like the more pips you get the more cards the other player has to discard.

7
##### Variants and Fan Cards / Idea for an expansion with RNG?
« on: May 14, 2024, 08:40:54 pm »
INTRODUCTION

Hello guys, I have just joined the forum and I don't really know how to use the forum that well.

To introduce myself I am a new Dominion player and not very good. I will most likely embarrass myself if I try to talk about expansions because the only ones I have are Dominion (base), Intrigue, Seaside, and the Base Cards accessory. So I will try not to pretend like I know more than I actually do.

I am very fascinated with the Dominion community because it seems that people are very friendly about discussing the game and my favorite part is how Donald X. frequents the forum and answers questions. So I have got an idea about an expansion.

Also, if someone has already suggested an expansion that is pretty much like this, I am very sorry for repeating what has already been said.

And basically my biggest fear is that there already is an expansion like this available for sale. If that is true, just tell me so and I will run away in shame and apologize profusely.

THE EXPANSION

Alright, so as I understand it every expansion has a theme. The theme of this expansion will be dice rolling, so that a player can shrewdly manipulate the probabilities to win, but even an inexperienced player could get lucky and do well. The set itself must come with at least 2 dice. If Rio Grande Games wants to put more dice, maybe 2 dice for each player would allow for wider possibilities.

The dice will be D6 dice as far as I can think up.

As in many other games, the fact that 2 dice are included allows for a probability curve rather than the linear distribution seen on a single D6. For example with two D6s then it is much more likely to roll a 7 than a 2.

Now, some people would protest that this makes Dominion less skillful and more random. However this will be counteracted with the addition of more cards that are going to change the probabilities. I got this idea from the game "Here to Slay" by Unstable Games. Essentially you will be able to increase or decrease the number on the die after rolling by playing cards called Modifiers. For example what you could do is increase the die value by 1 pip (pips referring to the dots on the dice) but not exceed 6 on either die.

So now that I have laid out the theme I want to make up some sample cards. Otherwise it would not be possible to imagine what a game with this type of expansion would look like.

Let me know if the names of the cards have already been used.

SAMPLE CARDS

Untitled RNG Laboratory for \$5 {Action}
+1 Action
Roll 2 D6 and add up the number of pips
2-5 pips: +1 card
6-8 pips: +2 cards
9-12 pips: +3 cards
My notes ... in terms of average drawing it is the same as an original Laboratory but just a bit more spicy. Overall, it might need some improvements to the design of this card just to make it different from the Laboratory.

Snake Eyes Hex for \$3 {Action/Reaction/Attack}
+1 Action
+1 Card
---OR---
When another player rolls 2 dice, you may first play this, to change their roll to a 1 and a 1. The card goes into your discard pile after playing.
My notes ... this is the attacking modifier and would be one of the most spicy cards in the expansion by allowing you to totally screw over your opponents at will. I added the cantrip so it's not useless when you don't have other RNG cards in your Supply. I hope this card is not overpowered; it will need to be balanced.

Lucky Charm for \$2 {Action}
For all future dice rolls on this turn you must either increase each die by 1 pip or increase one die by 2 pips; however, don't exceed 6 pips on either die.
My notes ... this needs a better design so it won't be useless when there aren't other RNG cards in the Supply. It is the most basic modifier you could really have.

Lottery for \$4 {Action}
Roll 2 D6 and add up the number of pips
2 pips: gain a Curse
3-11 pips: +1 card +1 action
My notes ... in Seaside we had the Treasure Map but this is roughly the equivalent of what it does. By calling it the Lottery I put the theme tie-in that it gives you a high yield but with a super low frequency.

Untitled RNG sifter for \$5 {Action}
Roll 2 D6. Look at the D6 with the higher value of the two. Draw that many cards. Look at the D6 with the smaller value of the two. Discard that many cards.
My notes ... so this is similar to a Cellar if you roll the same number on both dice, except that you draw before you discard. I think this card might become overpowered if you roll 6s. Then again, on average it's going to be sifting 3.5 cards or so? I'm hoping that because it is a terminal then it won't be too overpowered, but it really needs balancing.

Untitled Underdog Card for \$2 {Action}
+1 action
If another player has Snake Eyes Hex they must play one Snake Eyes Hex card.
Roll 2 D6 and add up the number of pips.
2-3 pips: +5 cards
4-6 pips: +3 cards
7-10 pips: +1 card
My notes ... this card needs balancing on the different numbers but the idea is that it's going to be payback if your opponent keeps doing lower Modifiers on you.

Platoon for \$4 {Action/Attack/Duration}
+ \$2
All other players must discard until they are holding 4 or fewer cards.
--------
Until the beginning of your next turn, if another player rolls two dice for the very first time on their turn, they must decrease the roll by 1 pip on each die or 2 pips on one of the dice, whichever decreases their roll more (but don't go below 1 pip on each die).
My notes ... this is the Militia of my new expansion. You can see how it is mostly like Militia but also interferes with lucky strategies that might be using die rolls. Of course, with Throne Room it would decrease by 2 pips per die.

Four Leaf Clover for \$4 or maybe \$5 {Action/Reaction/Attack}
When any player (including you) rolls 2 D6 dice, you may first play this from your hand, to increase each die's value by 1 pip, or increase one die's value by 2 pips, or decrease each die's value by 1 pip, or decrease one die's value by 2 pips. Don't let any die's value go below 1 or above 6.
My notes ... this is the other basic modifier. Unlike Lucky Charm it's a one-and-done rather than lasting for the turn. I wanted to make it so you could really spam these if you wanted to tip the balance by a lot. For example, Four Leaf Clover and Lottery would have a very nice synergy. My only worry is that this will be too overpowered. If I had to nerf it I would do it by saying only one Four Leaf Clover can be used on a single roll of the dice. Also, it could be really useless if the Supply has no RNG cards.

War Bonds for \$5 {Alternate VP}
At the end of the game, roll a single D6 to determine how much each War Bonds is worth. It gives one VP per pip on this die. There will be no modifiers on this die roll. The same D6 applies to all players; there is no rolling individually for your War Bonds.
My notes ... on average this would be slightly better than a Duchy while costing the same as Duchy. This one I kind of threw in randomly and I think it severely needs balancing because it's one of the most annoyingly random ones here.

CONCLUSION

In the short time I took to write down these ideas, I did not think of that many other cards. That means that so far there are not enough ideas to fill up an entire expansion which typically needs more cards than that. Please let me know what you think of the cards. I know that they are not balanced, so you could add balancing suggestions. You could also suggest more cards.

If you are making some fan cards please feel free to borrow my ideas.

That's all for now,
Village Idiot

P.S. My first post! Yay!

P.P.S. I have edited it so the modifiers are a little bit more clearly defined in what they can do. This edit also included the Four Leaf Clover. This edit happened on May 14 2024.

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