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[EFHW]

The absence of a second death overnight makes it hard to know what sudgy's death means.

[yuma]

I also think we should start with people who were off the Archetype wagon in looking for lynch targets for today.

start yes, but this line of thought has gotten us into deep trouble before in bankers and MXI where scum was lynched day1. We thought partners wouldn't have bussed, but turns out a lot did and we nearly lost MXI because of this thought and did lose Bankers because of this...

[yuma]

I'm down. vote: joth

I also think his posts against me at the end of yesterday have some veiled frustration at being forced to lynch his own partner day1.

[EFHW]

Updated, color-coded Day 1 voting records. 

sudgy v. EFHW (rvs)
2.7 v. Joth (RVS)
Ashersky v. sudgy (rvs)
Archetype v. Joth(RVS)
sudgy v. ashersky
2.7 v. Archetype (rvs)
EFHW v. sudgy (2)
Archetype v. ashersky (2) [unv. Joth (0)]
Jimmmmm v. sudgy (3)
Jimmmmm v. Archetype (2) [unv. sudgy (2)]
faust v. Archetype (3)
EFHW unv. sudgy (1)
Archetype unv. ash (1)
Joth v. ash (2)
     sudgy unv. ash (1)
xeiron v. Archeype (4)
sudgy v. Archetype (5)
     2.7 unv. Archetype (4)
Joth v. xeiron (1) [unv. Ash (0)]
Archetype v. xeiron (2)
sudgy v. xeiron (3) [unv. Archetype (3)]
Walrus v. sudgy (2)
ashersky unv. sudgy (1)
chairs v. xeiron (4)
faust v. joth (1)  [unv. Archetype (2)]
walrus v. nkirbit (1) [unv. sudgy(0)]
nkirbit v. Walrus (1)
faust v. Archetype (3) unv. Joth (0)
Joth v. nkirbit (2) unv. Xeiron (3)
pps v. sudgy (1)
faust v. sudgy (2) unv. Archetype(2)
chairs v. sudgy (3)
     sudgy claims weak modifier to his role
     faust unv. sudgy (2)
ashersky v. sudgy (3)
nikirbit v. sudgy (4) unv. Walrus (0)
faust v. Archetype (3)
     chairs unv. sudgy (3)
walrus v. sudgy (4) unv. nkirbit (0)
chairs v. Galzria (1)
faust v. Walrus (1)
     pps unv. sudgy (3)
     nkirbit unv. sudgy (2)
2.7 v. xeiron (4)
Joth v. walrus (2)
Walrus v. joth (1) unv. sudgy (1)
xeiron v. ashersky (1) unv. Archetype (2)
nkirbit v. walrus (3)
ashersky v. walrus (4)
walrus v. Archetype (3) unv. Joth (0)
xeiron v. Walrus (5) unv. Ashersky (0)
pps v. walrus (6)
Archetype v. Walrus (7) unv. Xeiron (3)
     Archetype unv. Walrus (6)
Archetype v. Walrus (7)
xeiron v. ashersky (1) unv. Walrus (6)
faust v. Archetype (4) unv. Walrus (5)
nkirbit v. Archetype (5) unv.Walrus (4)
Archetype v. xeiron (4) unv. Walrus (3)
xeiron v. walrus (4) unv. Ashersky (0)
Archetype v. walrus (5) unv. Xeiron (3)
joth v. xeiron (4)
yuma v. Jimmmmm (1)
EFHW v. no lynch
yuma v. no lynch (2) [unv. Jimmmmm (0)]
sudgy v. Archetype (5) unv. Xeiron (3)
chairs v. no lynch (3) unv. Yuma (0)
yuma v. Jimmmmm (1) unv. no lynch (2)
yuma v. Joth (1) unv. Jimmmmm(0)
2.7 v. Archetype (6) unv. xeiron (2)
Joth v. Archetype (7) unv. xeiron (1)
xeiron (derp?)hammers Archetype (eight) unv. Walrus (3)

[nkirbit]

I'm down. vote: joth

I also think his posts against me at the end of yesterday have some veiled frustration at being forced to lynch his own partner day1.

I'm actually unsure about this.  This is the bit that's making me the most uneasy about this vote... would scum!Joth really do that?  On one hand, I can see it as sort of trying to set the agenda tomorrow... "Let's lynch Yuma, he's anti-town!".  I know in the past you and others have found people scummy for trying to do so, whether it be at the start of the day or the end of the last day... Liopoil in Back to Basics and Theorel in Dynasty Warriors are two examples of scum doing this that come to mind.

But the thing that's giving me pause is the fact that he was just so forward about it.  Were he scum, he would have known that his actions as the Archetype wagon built up were at least a little bit incriminating, and spending time yelling at Yuma about the no-lynch just seems risky and unproductive.  Are we really going to lynch Yuma for pushing no-lynch, especially when it's something that EFHW supported?  Surely he's going to at least draw a little of attention to himself for that crusade (and he in fact did, with you promising to vote him the next day...).  Is it really worth it for Joth to fight that fight were he scum?  I'm not convinced.

[nkirbit]

Archetype's main actions yesterday were on the Xeiron and Walrus wagons.  Strong town points for both those players in my book.

[2.71828.....]

Archetype v. Walrus (7) unv. Xeiron (3)
     Archetype unv. Walrus (6)
Archetype v. Walrus (7)

I totally believe Walrus right now.  Some things I thought about overnight:
1) There is absolutely no way someone fake-claims River Song.  I have only watched the Matt Smith Dr. Who episodes, but she is way to important to be handed out as a fake-claim for scum to use.
2) Archetype would believe the claim if Walrus were his scum partner.

[EFHW]

players who have voted Archetype: Jimmmmm, faust, xeiron, sudgy, Walrus, nkirbit
players who have voted xeiron: joth, Archetype, sudgy, chairs,  2.7
players who have voted Walrus: nkirbit, faust, joth, ashersky, xeiron, pps, Archetype

There is no overlap between the people voting Arch and those voting xeiron.  The walrus wagon has two Arch voters and two xeiron voters.

It could be helpful to look at this again.

[EFHW]

P: I target xeiron (if lynched, I target Walrus)
D: I target Archetype (if lynched, I target xeiron)
R: I target Walrus (if lynched, I target Archetype)

Oh wait, he told us.  He did target Walrus.

Hm.  Did we really run up our two biggest wagons on scum?  That just can't have happened...

Scum could very well have seen that post, known that xeiron and Walrus were both town, and NKed sudgy.  I am not comfortable lynching someone because of this, although it does not help their case.

I just wish he had done a full list of players.  wouldn't have been too hard to assign random letters of the alphabet

How would that have helped?

[EFHW]

I'm down. vote: joth

I also think his posts against me at the end of yesterday have some veiled frustration at being forced to lynch his own partner day1.

Can you show us which posts you mean?

[2.71828.....]

P: I target xeiron (if lynched, I target Walrus)
D: I target Archetype (if lynched, I target xeiron)
R: I target Walrus (if lynched, I target Archetype)

Oh wait, he told us.  He did target Walrus.

Hm.  Did we really run up our two biggest wagons on scum?  That just can't have happened...

Scum could very well have seen that post, known that xeiron and Walrus were both town, and NKed sudgy.  I am not comfortable lynching someone because of this, although it does not help their case.

I just wish he had done a full list of players.  wouldn't have been too hard to assign random letters of the alphabet

How would that have helped?

It would have just made the person he targeted more random, and scum (who may or may not have actually killed anyone tonight) would think twice about killing sudgy outright (if that indeed is what happened) for fear that he would have targeted them.  It would not have actually helped our situation here any since there was only one death overnight, but I was just thinking that might have been a little better for sudgy to do

[Voltaire]

Vote Count 2.1

jotheonah (2): nkirbit, yuma

Not voting (9): ashersky, EFHW, faust, Jimmmmm, jotheonah, pingpongsam, Walrus, xeiron, 2.71828.....

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.

D2 ends on Monday, January 6 at noon forum time

[ashersky]

vote: walrus

It's not foolproof, but sudgy was a weak doctor, and I can account for a lack of nightkills.

[ashersky]

Assuming chairs is the tree stump he claimed (he hasn't posted yet, right?), I am going to assume he is town.  There's no way we can lynch a tree stump, which makes a scum tree stump invincible, and therefore unfair to town.

What I don't know if how tree stumps affect win conditions.  Do they count at all?  Mafiascum is silent on the matter.

[nkirbit]

vote: walrus

It's not foolproof, but sudgy was a weak doctor, and I can account for a lack of nightkills.

Multiple?  Like, if there's a SK, you can account for a lack of both the SK and Mafia's NKs?

[ashersky]

vote: walrus

It's not foolproof, but sudgy was a weak doctor, and I can account for a lack of nightkills.

Multiple?  Like, if there's a SK, you can account for a lack of both the SK and Mafia's NKs?

Yes.  But why do you assume there are multiple kills?  Know something the rest of us don't?

[nkirbit]

vote: walrus

It's not foolproof, but sudgy was a weak doctor, and I can account for a lack of nightkills.

Multiple?  Like, if there's a SK, you can account for a lack of both the SK and Mafia's NKs?

Yes.  But why do you assume there are multiple kills?  Know something the rest of us don't?

Yeah, that's it. 

[2.71828.....]

vote: walrus

It's not foolproof, but sudgy was a weak doctor, and I can account for a lack of nightkills.

Multiple?  Like, if there's a SK, you can account for a lack of both the SK and Mafia's NKs?

Yes.  But why do you assume there are multiple kills?  Know something the rest of us don't?

apparently you do

[nkirbit]

Well, I really didn want to have to claim today, unlike some of our more eagle claimants. But it looks like I'm defaulting to a lynch and this might be my last chance todo so. So here's some of it:

I am River Song. I have several cool powders including the ability to time travel.
her not have to say more than that, but I will if I have to.

Would I like to joina larger wagon? Like the one on me? No thanks. On xeiron? He's a town read for me and two of my scumreads are currently a boarded. I am willing to join Jimmmmm and vote: Archetype though. I'm not sure what I think about a Galz lynch...I guess it's better than nothing?

It is extremely drunk and I am fairly late. I will probably be awake for another half hour or so if you ave questioned. Ill be around tomorrow morning as well.

I just can't believe an Archetype-Walrus scumteam given this post.  Walrus claims to try and get rid of the pressure... and immediately throws it on his teammate?  I just don't buy it.

Maybe Walrus is a SK or something, but that's speculative.  And scum knew that Sudgy was a weak role, and possibly knew that he was targeting a town member.  I guess they had lost their bus driver, so that's one way gone to tamper with Sudgy's result, but I'm still not comfortable voting Walrus based only on Ash's "I can account for a lack of nightkills."  I certainly don't plan on voting there right now.

[xeiron]

I think there is a lot to learn from analysing the last pages from D1, as I would think scum did try to bump the lynch over on someone else that Archetype.
Townpoints for Walrus, faust and Nkirbit for making a Archetype lynch viable when Walrus and I was the two biggest wagons.
Espesially Nkirbit had several good posts yesterday that give me a strong townread on him.

Jotheonah, yuma , and pingpongsam are the one I find coming out scummier.

Jotheonah for focusing on me and walrus, before jumping on Archetype at the last minute.
Yuma for trying to avoid a lynch at all.
Pingpongsam for staying on Walrus while still agreeing that we should lynch somebody.
and for this post during twilight.

That Arch is silent makes me think there is a good possibility we got a lucky lynch in...

[ashersky]

vote: walrus

It's not foolproof, but sudgy was a weak doctor, and I can account for a lack of nightkills.

Multiple?  Like, if there's a SK, you can account for a lack of both the SK and Mafia's NKs?

Yes.  But why do you assume there are multiple kills?  Know something the rest of us don't?

apparently you do

I do.  Do you?

[ashersky]

vote: walrus

It's not foolproof, but sudgy was a weak doctor, and I can account for a lack of nightkills.

Multiple?  Like, if there's a SK, you can account for a lack of both the SK and Mafia's NKs?

Yes.  But why do you assume there are multiple kills?  Know something the rest of us don't?

apparently you do

I do.  Do you?

I will point out that people can confirm what I know, but it's best if they don't.

[Jimmmmm]

Hmm. I'm not likely to follow ash into voting for Walrus without further explanation.

[2.71828.....]

I think as soon as D2, we'll have a good idea (at least I will) of whether we need to rid the game of the power I enable instead of protecting it.

So you are saying that your role is
a) an enabling role that is worth protecting
b) it is probably not best for you to discuss the details of your role
c) certain players know the same things that you know but it is best if all of you keep quiet about it

[yuma]

Yuma for trying to avoid a lynch at all.

why is this scummy?