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[Schneau]

After some discussion about Promos on Goko, I'm wondering which Promo people like best.

[jsh357]

I really love the wackiness of Black Market.  It has some exclusivity problems like Tournament, but it feels more like taking a gamble when you play it (at least going by its official rules, not the isotropic ones).  Also enjoy BM/Tactician/Watchtower/etc shenanigans. 

My second-favorite is Walled Village.  The effect is nice when you're building an engine that relies on just a few action cards (and of course, it adds another Village to the randomizers). 

The rest, I'm either not as fond of or consider just another Dominion card.

[mail-mi]

Also probably BM. (Black Market, don't like Big Money all that much  )

[Robz888]

Walled Village is a stupid card, bu I'd rather play with 100 Walled Villages than a single Black Market.

And Governor rules.

[brokoli]

I just hate Governor.
I don't like Walled village and Envoy...
But I can sometimes tolerate Black market and Stash.

[Awaclus]

Envoy. It changes the game just by being in the kingdom even if nobody buys it. Governor changes the game just by being in the kingdom, too, but that's because everyone always buys it, and that's slightly less attractive. I'm not really a fan of Black Market without Tactician, and the others are just weak.

[PSGarak]

As a card, I think Governor's power curve is a bit steep, but I really like it as a piece of design. The point of the card was to feel like a game of Puerto Rico, and in that sense I think it does an excellent job of capturing the key aspect of gameplay, while doing so in a very Dominion-y way.

I hate hate hate Black Market, both from a card and design perspective. From a card perspective, it's too damn swingy depending on which cards you get dealt out. From a design perspective... the most important effect of the card (playing treasures during the action phase) is something that's not explicitly acknowledged in the card text! It feels like the awkward first draft of a decent idea, that got released before the edge cases were exposed and the exact mechanics were buttoned down into something that didn't necessitate breaking the game in ways unrelated to its intended functionality.

Compare BM against, say, Possession, another card that has a FAQ section the size of War and Peace. Possession messes with an absolutely fundamental aspect of the game, but it implemented the mechanics in an elegant and tidy fashion, where all the relevant effects are explicit and fit into the card text. The repercussions are significant, but they're all obvious in hindsight as direct applications of what the card says. BM on the other hand, breaks the game once by design, and then breaks the game again even moreso by accident, and the second way is not immediately obvious from the first.

[Drab Emordnilap]

Stash is the best example of a simple effect that's so outside the box that it makes you say "What?" the first time, but works perfectly intuitively. I think Stash is the example all promos should follow.

[Archetype]

I'm going to have to go with Stash too, but mainly because of PoE.

Walled Village is stupid
Black Market is too swingy
Governor dominates games
I'm just not a fan of Envoy.

So Stash. Though I really only buy it if there are some good enablers (Chancellor, Scavenger) or I want to try some wacky strategy.

[Eran of Arcadia]

Black Market. It's a pain to set up IRL, but the randomness of it all keeps things interesting.

[liopoil]

Oooh I just realized that scanvenger is way better with stash than chancellor. you just need 3 stashes and 3 scavengers for a province every turn, or 4stashes and 2 scavengers, or 3 stashes and 2 scavengers and a little bit of luck. that's kinda crazily good. anyway, stash and envoy are my favorites by POE  like arch.

[Lekkit]

Stash is by far ny favorite. Walled Village can be kind of fun in otherwise petty boring BM domianated games. Black Market is annoying to set up and ia swingy when played. Governor is just silly.

[Wingnut]

Envoy and Governor are my favorites. Governor for its sheer power and implementation of theme and Envoy because it changes game strategy and changes the thought process. If I had to pick one, it would be Envoy.

As for the others. Walled Village is a village. Nothing more, nothing less. Anything to add another village to the randomizer pool is fine with me. Stash is just dumb to me. At least at that price point. And Black Market. Well, its Black Market. Swingy and sometimes completely infuriating. Not a favorite but I will gladly play it every so often.

[yudantaiteki]

Governor is clearly the most powerful of the cards but I don't like it because it's a strategy in itself, and a pretty good one.  For me it's the only card besides Ill-Gotten Gains that's annoying for this reason.

Black Market is my favorite just for the craziness value, even though it's a questionable purchase on most boards.

[markusin]

It's hard to say which promo I like the best. Probably Envoy, although I picked Walled Village first for Goko because I wanted another village in the randomizer. Governor calls a bit too much attention to itself, but I don't mind Black Market so much, and stash, uh...I don't have much to say about it.

[SCSN]

Black Market because I love Double-Tactician

[Robz888]

I can't believe Black Market is winning. I thought it was the most universally despised Dominion card. The fact that very few people have it is like Goko's one advantage over Isotropic, in fact.

[Kirian]

I'm going to have to go with Stash too, but mainly because of PoE.

I must have missed an acronym somewhere.  What's POE?

[michaeljb]

Process of Elimination, I think

[werothegreat]

I can't believe Black Market is winning. I thought it was the most universally despised Dominion card. The fact that very few people have it is like Goko's one advantage over Isotropic, in fact.

I thought that was any of Scout, Thief or Saboteur.

[Awaclus]

If Black Market wins, does that mean that we like the base/expansion cards more than the promo cards?

[Robz888]

I can't believe Black Market is winning. I thought it was the most universally despised Dominion card. The fact that very few people have it is like Goko's one advantage over Isotropic, in fact.

I thought that was any of Scout, Thief or Saboteur.

Those are just bad cards, in that they are weak. They aren't despised, I don't think. Scout is actually sort of loved in like a hispter way.

[mameluke]

I don't like Governor at all. I'm not a fan of fast cards or of cards where having lots of just one card is the dominant strategy (ahem, Minion). It's just not interesting. I like having to buy at least 4-5 of the cards on the table.

[Robz888]

The reason Governor is more interesting than Minion, though, is because it takes much more skill to play. Sure, you generally buy as many of both as you can, but Governor requires a lot of concentration concerning whether you should gain, remodel, or draw.

[liopoil]

I just played a game on goko with fishing village, governor, council room, and militia. That was fun...

[HiveMindEmulator]

I can't believe Black Market is winning. I thought it was the most universally despised Dominion card. The fact that very few people have it is like Goko's one advantage over Isotropic, in fact.

I always got the feeling that the most universally despised cards were Possession, Governor, Tournament, and various attacks. At least that's what I heard people on iso complain about.

Before I played online, I didn't like Black Market, mostly because it was too much trouble to set up. And also because I avoided playing with it, which resulted in me not using it enough to really understand it. But now that I've played with a lot, I really enjoy it.

[Stealth Tomato]

I can't believe Black Market is winning. I thought it was the most universally despised Dominion card. The fact that very few people have it is like Goko's one advantage over Isotropic, in fact.

I think it gets the same sort of love-it-or-hate-it reaction that Goons, Possession, or Tournament does, where a lot of top-flight players despise the luck factor and/or the sheer brokenness of the card in certain situations, while others both top-flight and otherwise enjoy the interesting situations it causes and/or the sheer brokenness of the card in certain situations.

[soulnet]

I like Governor the most, but I find Black Market interesting. Sure, its something with a lot of strange holes, but is interesting, and that's neat for a promo. Much better than Stash, which adds almost nothing interesting to the game, even its good combos with Scavenger or Chancellor are weak.

[StrongRhino]

My favorite is Black Market, it's just so wacky in a fun sort of way. Must admit I have little experience with governor though.

[Witherweaver]

Speaking of Black Market and the weird things it can do, has anyone effectively gotten Black Market + Poor House to work out particularly well?  Seems like it has a high opportunity cost to set up and needs a lot of enablers, but so does Black Market and double Tactician.

[eHalcyon]

Speaking of Black Market and the weird things it can do, has anyone effectively gotten Black Market + Poor House to work out particularly well?  Seems like it has a high opportunity cost to set up and needs a lot of enablers, but so does Black Market and double Tactician.

Black Market + double tac doesn't really need any support other than those two, does it?  BM-PH needs Village support, potentially +Buy as well.  Tactician comes with both already.

[Witherweaver]

Speaking of Black Market and the weird things it can do, has anyone effectively gotten Black Market + Poor House to work out particularly well?  Seems like it has a high opportunity cost to set up and needs a lot of enablers, but so does Black Market and double Tactician.

Black Market + double tac doesn't really need any support other than those two, does it?  BM-PH needs Village support, potentially +Buy as well.  Tactician comes with both already.

Well I meant in terms of opportunity cost.  Though maybe it also needs some kind of drawing/filtering to get it going?  I've never actually done it.

I would think Black Market + Poor House would need some drawing, too.  You need at least village, poor house and black market in hand (or a previous fishing village), as well as some treasure (or else the black market would be moot). And I would think definitely +buy or there wouldn't be a return of investment.

[ftl]

Black Market/Poor House isn't a strategy all on its own. It's a good combination that you can stick into an engine of any sort to provide you with a lot of money, but you need an engine to make it work - so you need all the other components of an engine (villages, card draw, +buy, possibly light trashing to get it going, especially estate trashing. But not heavy trashing like chapel, because then the black market is redundant and you can just trash all your treasures).

[Schlippy]

Black Market, although it could have slightly less swingy implementation, like a seperate BM-deck for every player or something.

[Beyond Awesome]

I am going to guess that Prince will be my favorite promo, but I haven't had a chance to play with like pretty much everyone here. The more and more I play with Envoy though, the more I enjoy it. It is great for both BM and engines. Honestly, since DA came out, I have no idea how to properly play Governor anymore. Black Market is cool, but can also be quite swingy like Tournament.

Stash is meh....
Walled Village is another village, which isn't bad, but not great either.

For now, Envoy is my favorite until I experience playing with Prince.

[silverspawn]

wv i think. It's harmless and it can sometimes turn frustrating draws into not-frustrating draws. good stuff.

[SirPeebles]

I am going to guess that Prince will be my favorite promo, but I haven't had a chance to play with like pretty much everyone here. The more and more I play with Envoy though, the more I enjoy it. It is great for both BM and engines. Honestly, since DA came out, I have no idea how to properly play Governor anymore. Black Market is cool, but can also be quite swingy like Tournament.

Stash is meh....
Walled Village is another village, which isn't bad, but not great either.

For now, Envoy is my favorite until I experience playing with Prince.

I suspect that Prince will prove to be the swingiest of all the promos, due to it's highest price (favoring lucky spikes) and the combination of its one shot nature with needing to be paired with an Action card.  Sure, a T3 Rats out of the BM during an otherwise trashless Sea Hag slog may be swingier, but I still see Prince's swinginess being decisive in more games.

[LastFootnote]

wv i think. It's harmless and it can sometimes turn frustrating draws into not-frustrating draws. good stuff.

You know what I realized recently? I wish that Walled Village were this:

Walled Village
Types: Action
Cost: $4 or $5
+1 Card. +2 Actions.
At the start of Clean-up, you may spend an Action put this on top of your deck.

Maybe it would be too strong, I don't know. But I really hate how buying other cantrips prevents you from using Walled Village's ability.

[pacovf]

wv i think. It's harmless and it can sometimes turn frustrating draws into not-frustrating draws. good stuff.

You know what I realized recently? I wish that Walled Village were this:

Walled Village
Types: Action
Cost: $4 or $5
+1 Card. +2 Actions.
At the start of Clean-up, you may spend an Action put this on top of your deck.

Maybe it would be too strong, I don't know. But I really hate how buying other cantrips prevents you from using Walled Village's ability.

I don't like "spend an action", but that may just be me (also, it might be a bit too crazy with diadem?). What about the wackier and somewhat stronger:

Walled Village
Types: Action
Cost: $4 or $5
+1 Card. +1 Actions. Set this card aside.
During your turn, if this card is set aside, you may put it into play. If you do, +1 action.

I also like it thematically: the village is staying behind its walls until you call it to your help.

[LastFootnote]

wv i think. It's harmless and it can sometimes turn frustrating draws into not-frustrating draws. good stuff.

You know what I realized recently? I wish that Walled Village were this:

Walled Village
Types: Action
Cost: $4 or $5
+1 Card. +2 Actions.
At the start of Clean-up, you may spend an Action put this on top of your deck.

Maybe it would be too strong, I don't know. But I really hate how buying other cantrips prevents you from using Walled Village's ability.

I don't like "spend an action", but that may just be me (also, it might be a bit too crazy with diadem?). What about the wackier and somewhat stronger:

Walled Village
Types: Action
Cost: $4 or $5
+1 Card. +1 Actions. Set this card aside.
During your turn, if this card is set aside, you may put it into play. If you do, +1 action.

I also like it thematically: the village is staying behind its walls until you call it to your help.

Hmm, I guess that would work pretty well. It wouldn't be as good with Conspirator, Peddler, etc., but whatever. That's a small price to pay for a better effect. The real issue is that you'd probably want a mat for it, since it might be set aside for several turns. And including a mat with a promo is probably not ideal cost-wise. Like, Prince doesn't have a mat, but it effectively becomes one itself once you play it. So with that in mind, I like my version a bit better as a promo. But if it were practical to include a mat, I think I like your version better.

[pacovf]

Good point about the mat!

It's true that my version doesn't work as well with conspirator/peddler/horn of plenty. It does (usually) work better against discarding attacks, so I guess it just depends on whether "spend an action" or "put into play" is wackier. But the mat would definitely help my version...

[SirPeebles]

I think the "spend an action" wording is way more straightforward.  Sure, it is technically a new mechanic, but it is one that is so natural and intuitive that most people would never need to look it up.

[prom_vrt]

I vote Black Market. It is interesting and colourful in casual games with friends where one doesn't mind losing so much. But in competitive play it is much less interesting.

Governor is a very good card for me but I think it's OP since gaining a gold/remodel is self-synergy.

[silverspawn]

Maybe it would be too strong, I don't know. But I really hate how buying other cantrips prevents you from using Walled Village's ability.

or even other vw's. yea, I really like your version. I think it would be fine at $4, too. We have wandering minstrel, after all, and that doesn't break the game at 4$ either.

Walled Village
Types: Action
Cost: $4 or $5
+1 Card. +1 Actions. Set this card aside.
During your turn, if this card is set aside, you may put it into play. If you do, +1 action.

I don't know, I guess I don't really see the problem with "spend an action". What happens if you procession it? If I understand the lose track rule right, you get +2 card, +2actions, a card costing 5$ but wv isn't trashed?

[pacovf]

Maybe it would be too strong, I don't know. But I really hate how buying other cantrips prevents you from using Walled Village's ability.

or even other vw's. yea, I really like your version. I think it would be fine at $4, too. We have wandering minstrel, after all, and that doesn't break the game at 4$ either.

Walled Village
Types: Action
Cost: $4 or $5
+1 Card. +1 Actions. Set this card aside.
During your turn, if this card is set aside, you may put it into play. If you do, +1 action.

I don't know, I guess I don't really see the problem with "spend an action". What happens if you procession it? If I understand the lose track rule right, you get +2 card, +2actions, a card costing 5$ but wv isn't trashed?

I don't know why I don't like "You may spend an action to put this on top of your deck", it's just instinctive, it feels off somehow I can definitely see why other people don't have a problem with it though. EDIT: @LastFootnote: minor quibble that is easy to fix, but is there any "You may ... to ..." card in Dominion?

With procession, same result than with island, so exactly what you said.


WALL OF TEXT!
EDIT: re-read the original rules. "+X Actions: The player may play X number of additional Actions this turn". This would lead me to believe that "spend an Action" doesn't mean anything, because you don't store Actions, you are simply allowed to play more than one Action card this turn. Note that here "Actions" means "Action cards", from context.
But then again, the only other card that refers to remaining Actions, Diadem, says "When you play this, +1$ per unused Action you have", which is not consistent with the definition of +X Actions as defined in the rulebook, but is still perfectly understandable. So eh.

Yes, I am being overly pedantic.

I am also sad because the rulebook says: "The action phase ends when the player cannot or chooses not to play any more action cards". Which means that, unless you go through aggressive rule-lawyering or add a faq to the card, my version cannot put a walled village into play after drawing cards dead with, say, smithy; a problem that LastFootnote's version doesn't have. One more point in the favour of his version as a promo.

In other news, I should say "put into your play area" instead of "put into play" if I want to be consistent with the rulebook.

Move along, nothing to see here 

[Witherweaver]

Instead of 'spend an Action to return to the top of your deck,' just say, 'if you have any unused Actions, you may return this to the top of your deck.'  Makes it more consistent with Diadem.

[pacovf]

But then you can topdeck them all if you have at least one unused action, which is definitely not what we want it to do.

EDIT: I would like it if it was possible to reuse Diadem's phrasing, but I don't see a way to do it that isn't really clunky.

[Awaclus]

Instead of 'spend an Action to return to the top of your deck,' just say, 'if you have any unused Actions, you may return this to the top of your deck.'  Makes it more consistent with Diadem.

But then you can return 10 Walled Villages with just one action.

EDIT: Dammit, Sarnath'd by pacovf.

[SirPeebles]

I am also sad because the rulebook says: "The action phase ends when the player cannot or chooses not to play any more action cards". Which means that, unless you go through aggressive rule-lawyering or add a faq to the card, my version cannot put a walled village into play after drawing cards dead with, say, smithy; a problem that LastFootnote's version doesn't have. One more point in the favour of his version as a promo.

My turn begins.  I play Remodel.  Since I am now unable to play additional Actions, the action phase has ended and the buy phase has begun.  I trash Rats, draw a card, and gain a Peddler.

[pacovf]

I am also sad because the rulebook says: "The action phase ends when the player cannot or chooses not to play any more action cards". Which means that, unless you go through aggressive rule-lawyering or add a faq to the card, my version cannot put a walled village into play after drawing cards dead with, say, smithy; a problem that LastFootnote's version doesn't have. One more point in the favour of his version as a promo.

My turn begins.  I play Remodel.  Since I am now unable to play additional Actions, the action phase has ended and the buy phase has begun.  I trash Rats, draw a card, and gain a Peddler.

Hence my comment about rule-lawyering. Since your action phase doesn't actually end until you finish resolving your last action (despite what is literally said in the rulebook), then I should be able to "put into my play area" a walled village in the magical metatime after I draw three card with smithy, but before I finish resolving smithy, whatever that means.

You could defend this interpretation, but just having a faq would be easier.

[SirPeebles]

Since your action phase doesn't actually end until you finish resolving your last action (despite what is literally said in the rulebook)

Says who?

You could defend this interpretation, but just having a faq would be easier.

FAQs don't trump rules.

[pacovf]

Since your action phase doesn't actually end until you finish resolving your last action (despite what is literally said in the rulebook)

Says who?

Not sure what exactly you are disagreeing with? Since peddler's cost doesn't get reduced as soon as you play your last action, the action phase ends after you finish resolving your last action. However, the rules as written would imply otherwise.

You could defend this interpretation, but just having a faq would be easier.

FAQs don't trump rules.

What I mean here is that the rulebook has precedence over what the card says. See Throne Room and Band of Misfits as a one-shot, Donald X. has actually said that the way they interact contradicts the way the cards are written, but makes more intuitive sense.

[silverspawn]

FAQs don't trump rules.

they kind of do, otherwise you could use pirate ship coin tokens as coin tokens. or you could argue that it was a specific rule for that question, not a faq...

[Witherweaver]

But then you can topdeck them all if you have at least one unused action, which is definitely not what we want it to do.

EDIT: I would like it if it was possible to reuse Diadem's phrasing, but I don't see a way to do it that isn't really clunky.

I didn't think that was a huge problem.  But you're right, it probably is. 

[LastFootnote]

I don't know why I don't like "You may spend an action to put this on top of your deck", it's just instinctive, it feels off somehow I can definitely see why other people don't have a problem with it though. EDIT: @LastFootnote: minor quibble that is easy to fix, but is there any "You may ... to ..." card in Dominion?

Yes, you are correct! It should say, "At the start of Clean-up, you may spend an Action. If you do, put this on top of your deck."

EDIT: Or maybe "pay" an Action would be better than "spend"? Whatever. Either way it's clear what is meant.

[pacovf]

But then you can topdeck them all if you have at least one unused action, which is definitely not what we want it to do.

EDIT: I would like it if it was possible to reuse Diadem's phrasing, but I don't see a way to do it that isn't really clunky.

I didn't think that was a huge problem.  But you're right, it probably is.

Actually, I have no idea if it would be a huge problem or not, I'm here just for the challenge of finding a version that does what walled village tries to do but actually doesn't.

[amalloy]

But then you can topdeck them all if you have at least one unused action, which is definitely not what we want it to do.

EDIT: I would like it if it was possible to reuse Diadem's phrasing, but I don't see a way to do it that isn't really clunky.

I didn't think that was a huge problem.  But you're right, it probably is.

Actually, I have no idea if it would be a huge problem or not, I'm here just for the challenge of finding a version that does what walled village tries to do but actually doesn't.

It would make Walled Village a huge card for engines, instead of just a more expensive Village that might help a mostly-money strategy.

Say I buy eight Walled Villages as part of my engine. As the card is now, they're basically just Villages, because I'm never playing less than three actions a turn. So, my top-end is playing nine terminals, but I might have to play as few as one on an unlucky draw.

But with this "if you have one action left, topdeck all of them" mechanic, I can guarantee I never run dry of actions, just by playing one less terminal. So, I play at most eight terminals per turn, in order to ensure that I top all eight of my villages every turn. Way, way better than the extra chance of playing nine, unless I'm somehow super-reliably drawing a village, in which case the "new" WV is just equivalent to the current one.

I think once you get to the late game you often are drawing villages reliably, but in the early engine build-up having some guaranteed villages every turn is a really big deal.

[pacovf]

It's true that it's vastly more powerful than village, but it's still only a village. It's not really doing anything by itself, afterall. You could compare with fishing village, and that one only costs 3$. Is this version at 4$ really as strong as it looks like?

[silverspawn]

It's true that it's vastly more powerful than village, but it's still only a village. It's not really doing anything by itself, afterall. You could compare with fishing village, and that one only costs 3$. Is this version at 4$ really as strong as it looks like?

fishing village is one of the best cards in the game though. and there is no such thing as "only 3$"

[enfynet]

At the start of cleanup, if you have any unused actions, you may use one to put this on top of your deck.

Or does that still allow any number to be returned?

[Donald X.]

When you discard this from play, if you then have more unused Actions than you have Walled Villages in play (Actions, not Action cards), you may put this on top of your deck.

Counting the Walled Villages given that one was just discarded is confusing but I at least addressed it. There's also

+1 Card
+1 Action
Choose one: +1 Action; or when you discard this from play this turn, you may put it on top of your deck.

which is different all the ways that it's different.

[LastFootnote]

When you discard this from play, if you then have more unused Actions than you have Walled Villages in play (Actions, not Action cards), you may put this on top of your deck.

That's elegant, but man is it difficult to parse.

[silverspawn]

When you discard this from play, if you then have more unused Actions than you have Walled Villages in play (Actions, not Action cards), you may put this on top of your deck.

Counting the Walled Villages given that one was just discarded is confusing but I at least addressed it. There's also

+1 Card
+1 Action
Choose one: +1 Action; or when you discard this from play this turn, you may put it on top of your deck.

which is different all the ways that it's different.

is there any reason why you didn't make it like that? is it a matter of simplicity over functionality? how would you make it now?

I guess I could ask that in the interview thread, but well I can also ask it here.

[Donald X.]

is there any reason why you didn't make it like that? is it a matter of simplicity over functionality? how would you make it now?

Well we didn't like the card much so it left Guilds, early on. Then I needed a promo that would seem appropriate for a Carcassonne tie-in. The name Walled Village (then on Fortress) sounded good and it seemed okay for this outtake.

There was never a point where I was trying to fix it up. I don't remember how much time I had when it turned out I needed the promo, but I sure didn't work on the card. And it was an outtake because it was boring and so there it is, still boring.

The unused Actions version seems too confusing to let loose on the world; the choose one version is fine but not exciting. I think I'd do Plaza instead, and figure that Plaza plus whatever fraction of Herald was enough villages for a small set.

[petrie911]

Is

"At the start of Clean-up, if you have any number of unused Actions, you may put up to that many Walled Villages from play on top of your deck. (Actions, not Action cards)"

any clearer?

[Donald X.]

Is

"At the start of Clean-up, if you have any number of unused Actions, you may put up to that many Walled Villages from play on top of your deck. (Actions, not Action cards)"

any clearer?

That would happen once per Walled Village; they would all say it, so they would all do it. So one unused Action would get them all back. You would need more text to make sure it only happened once.

[silverspawn]

Is

"At the start of Clean-up, if you have any number of unused Actions, you may put up to that many Walled Villages from play on top of your deck. (Actions, not Action cards)"

any clearer?

That would happen once per Walled Village; they would all say it, so they would all do it. So one unused Action would get them all back. You would need more text to make sure it only happened once.

Wouldn't it work if you just put it below a horizontal line? like so

+1 Card
+2 Actions
----
At the start of Clean-up, if you have any number of unused Actions, you may put up to that many Walled Villages from play on top of your deck. (Actions, not Action cards)"

if it's below a line, it means that it's just a general rule for games using this, right? Embargo says "When a player buys a card, he gains a curse per embargo token on that pile", and that also happens just once, not once per embargo. or am i missing something?

[Mr Anderson]

It should be "In games using this: …"

Highway's and Goons' ability that can't be throned is below a line as well.

[silverspawn]

It should be "In games using this: …"

Highway's and Goons' ability that can't be throned is below a line as well.

I don't think it needs to have "in games using this", Emargo doesn't have it. The only card that does is Duchess I think.

[Nevermind]

Can you put prince on the poll?

[Donald X.]

Wouldn't it work if you just put it below a horizontal line? like so

+1 Card
+2 Actions
----
At the start of Clean-up, if you have any number of unused Actions, you may put up to that many Walled Villages from play on top of your deck. (Actions, not Action cards)"

if it's below a line, it means that it's just a general rule for games using this, right? Embargo says "When a player buys a card, he gains a curse per embargo token on that pile", and that also happens just once, not once per embargo. or am i missing something?

The line means "these things happen at different times." Your text, by not limiting its scope to Walled Village being in play or some such, is just a general game rule, not even requiring that card to be used that game (except then it does nothing, phew). These days I think Embargo isn't clear enough, and I would probably say "In games using this" for clarity. But yes that would be a way to have the ability not happen multiple times.

[amalloy]

Wouldn't it work if you just put it below a horizontal line? like so

+1 Card
+2 Actions
----
At the start of Clean-up, if you have any number of unused Actions, you may put up to that many Walled Villages from play on top of your deck. (Actions, not Action cards)"

if it's below a line, it means that it's just a general rule for games using this, right? Embargo says "When a player buys a card, he gains a curse per embargo token on that pile", and that also happens just once, not once per embargo. or am i missing something?

The line means "these things happen at different times." Your text, by not limiting its scope to Walled Village being in play or some such, is just a general game rule, not even requiring that card to be used that game (except then it does nothing, phew). These days I think Embargo isn't clear enough, and I would probably say "In games using this" for clarity. But yes that would be a way to have the ability not happen multiple times.

Wow, I hadn't realized how important the horizontal separating line is here. I figured this wording would be like that of Scheme, which also doesn't mention Scheme being in play. But you're saying that because Scheme has no dividing line, it creates its end-of-turn effect when it's played, whereas with the line it would do that indiscriminately for the whole game, allowing you to topdeck any number of actions every turn? I knew Scheme's effect "happened" when it was played, but didn't realize what a dividing line would have done to it. Wild.

[Donald X.]

Wow, I hadn't realized how important the horizontal separating line is here. I figured this wording would be like that of Scheme, which also doesn't mention Scheme being in play. But you're saying that because Scheme has no dividing line, it creates its end-of-turn effect when it's played, whereas with the line it would do that indiscriminately for the whole game, allowing you to topdeck any number of actions every turn? I knew Scheme's effect "happened" when it was played, but didn't realize what a dividing line would have done to it. Wild.

No dividing line on Scheme means it's all following the implicit "when you play this." When you play Scheme, you set up something to happen later; same with duration cards (though they blew it on the old German cards).

Scheme says "this turn" and so doesn't even make sense if you just squeeze in a dividing line; you also have to rephrase it. Some versions did have a line, but they said things like "when you discard this from play."

[soulnet]

Scheme says "this turn" and so doesn't even make sense if you just squeeze in a dividing line; you also have to rephrase it. Some versions did have a line, but they said things like "when you discard this from play."

Herbalist-style basically?

[Donald X.]

Scheme says "this turn" and so doesn't even make sense if you just squeeze in a dividing line; you also have to rephrase it. Some versions did have a line, but they said things like "when you discard this from play."

Herbalist-style basically?

Yes (though there were different versions of that). You can see one of those in the Outtakes article.