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[Robz888]

At the risk of doing more coaching, "scum" means "not aligned with the town." All mafia are scum, but not all scum are mafia. A Serial Killer is scum, for example.

"Scummy" behavior is a synonym for "suspicious" or "indicating that you are a mafia/SK affiliation".

[Galzria]

@Galz (and kinda C_F), could you explain the difference between scum and Mafia?
Mafia means Mafia, I figure.
But scum just means someone who is lying or being otherwise deceitful?

Scum, or scummy behavior, is basically like... Suspicious. People who make you raise your eyebrows and go "wait a second...". Hedging (showing uncertainty) is a very scummy behavior, but it's not necessarily a Mafia one (which was my point before). The Mafia actually have an easier time of not appearing suspicious because there is a natural level of confidence in their play. Thus their uncertainty is forcedand possible (if difficult) to pick up.

[Robz888]

Nick, I don't think I'll be able to mislead the newbies via coaching. Galzria, Frisk, and Eevee should be able to point out such behavior. And as for everybody else, I'm sure you're smart people. I'll just come off looking like Pops in MIV if I try to play referee. So those first two posts of mine were just pointing out info that I think was important, especially given PPS's confusion.

But I don't mind that you have voted for me, either.

[Young Nick]

Defended and thus backing up my claim.

Unvote

Again, I don't mind guidance, as long as you aren't accusing while "coaching."

[Galzria]

Where's Fuzzy (Eevee)?

[pingpongsam]

I find coaching a pretty pro-town thing to do because it minimizes confusion and because as a new player I can use it.

I personally find Robz coaching in this game to be the most town vibe I've received. Galzria's backup coaching is vibing good as well.

Young Nick's early vote feels kind of scummy but it certainly jives with new play and just trying to get things started so I'm letting it slide... for now.

Captain_Frisk's quick FoS for just getting the game off the ground, however... well, that feels the scummiest of all the plays so far so I point the Fos at C_F.

[manda2014]

Coaching, in and of itself, is very pro-town I think, given that this is a newbie game. What I think we really need to be careful of, though, is letting the more experienced players run the show. It's one thing to give advice/information on things such as what various terms mean or how the various available roles work, but it's not a long jump from trusting robz, galz, etc. on generic game advice to sub-consciously trusting their analysis and intuitions because of their experience. IF any of them are scum (and this is not an FOS), they know this and won't hesitate to use it to their advantage. That's not to say coaching is bad, obviously; the whole point of a newbie game is so less experienced players can learn to play in a game that's a little less intense than, say, Mafia IV.... just be careful not to let yourself trust everything someone with experience says.

[manda2014]

I place no faith in claimed PR's in the face of the noose.

It gives us a ton of information (basicly, either the guy is legit or scum. VT's never fakeclaim).

Oh, I agree but I still place no faith in the claim at the time. Scum or Town will both claim to save their necks. The analysis after the fact is where the faith is properly placed.

Well, placing no faith is certainly stupid. Town wont lie to save his/her neck, and we certainly arent lynching anyone who claims until we have investigated the situation some. Yes, that means last minute claims will always buy scum at least one day but nothing can really be done about that, lynching power roles is catastrophic for town. Its also pretty hard to make a believable PR claim (you often have said or done something earlier to make it not believable).

Trusting a claim (or at least, not lynching the claimer) this early is the best move. Like eevee said, lynching a power role, ESPECIALLY this early, could spell disaster for the town. Towards the end of the game, when the town is in crisis. This may not hold true. If the town had ignored DSell's fakeclaim in Mafia IV, they very well might have won...

[Young Nick]

manda says my thoughts better than I do. The subconscious trusting is the point I was trying to get at. I guess I don't see coaching as pro- or anti-town. It just feels...neutral. Like something I would have read off the wiki page.

[manda2014]

manda says my thoughts better than I do. The subconscious trusting is the point I was trying to get at. I guess I don't see coaching as pro- or anti-town. It just feels...neutral. Like something I would have read off the wiki page.

Exactly. It's when it goes beyond something you could find on a wiki page that everyone really needs to be on their guard.

[shark_bait]

Just wanted to say, yes I'm here.  I've been moving to a different apartment all day.  I'm rather exhausted now, will be around more tomorrow.

[Young Nick]

Yeah, I'm not going to be able to consistently post during the week. Maybe an afternoon post and/or a few night checks, I guess.

[manda2014]

Man, after following IV and seeing how fast posts accumulated there, this feels soooooo slow. Not necessarily a bad thing, of course, but it's gonna take some getting used to. XD

[Galzria]

I remember playing M-II and thinking how blazingly fast it moved, and how much information there was to compile on the final day. Boy how times have changed! This is such a relaxing pace now.

[Galzria]

Hey Frisk, when you were planning you're pregame strategy with your partner, what did you guys determine to be the best course of action? While you're answering that, wanna tell me if your teammate is Eevee or Cayvie? I'm honestly not sure.

[Galzria]

Wow. Mixup. Eevee or Timchen* (don't have multiple games on the mind)

[Robz888]

Hey Frisk, when you were planning you're pregame strategy with your partner, what did you guys determine to be the best course of action? While you're answering that, wanna tell me if your teammate is Eevee or Cayvie? I'm honestly not sure.

Oh, I remember getting yelled at for doing this, Mr. Galzria.

[Galzria]

Hey Frisk, when you were planning you're pregame strategy with your partner, what did you guys determine to be the best course of action? While you're answering that, wanna tell me if your teammate is Eevee or Cayvie? I'm honestly not sure.

Oh, I remember getting yelled at for doing this, Mr. Galzria.

I never yelled at you! I said that I don't think it's anywhere NEAR as effective on the forums as real life. It's not my preferred method, but it is a method. I just have yet to see anything of value come from it. Doesn't mean it isn't worth trying however.

[manda2014]

Hey Frisk, when you were planning you're pregame strategy with your partner, what did you guys determine to be the best course of action? While you're answering that, wanna tell me if your teammate is Eevee or Cayvie? I'm honestly not sure.

Oh, I remember getting yelled at for doing this, Mr. Galzria.

I never yelled at you! I said that I don't think it's anywhere NEAR as effective on the forums as real life. It's not my preferred method, but it is a method. I just have yet to see anything of value come from it. Doesn't mean it isn't worth trying however.

Hey, anything's worth trying! And I got a chuckle out of it, at any rate.

[Eevee]

Where's Fuzzy (Eevee)?

I'm here. Not much to say yet, timchen is the only one who has stood out to me. You seem to attack me one way or another in every game we are in together, why is that?

[Galzria]

Where's Fuzzy (Eevee)?

I'm here. Not much to say yet, timchen is the only one who has stood out to me. You seem to attack me one way or another in every game we are in together, why is that?

I don't trust Pokemon.

Anyway, wait, I attacked you here? Edgy a bit? I asked where you were...

[Captain_Frisk]

Hey Frisk, when you were planning you're pregame strategy with your partner, what did you guys determine to be the best course of action? While you're answering that, wanna tell me if your teammate is Eevee or Cayvie? I'm honestly not sure.

I thought you and I agreed only to bus me only if I had some real suspicion.  This is way too early.

[Galzria]

Hey Frisk, when you were planning you're pregame strategy with your partner, what did you guys determine to be the best course of action? While you're answering that, wanna tell me if your teammate is Eevee or Cayvie? I'm honestly not sure.

I thought you and I agreed only to bus me only if I had some real suspicion.  This is way too early.

[Captain_Frisk]

How many emoticons do we need to get RobZ to vote?

@Pingpongsam - regarding early voting - here's my thinking (should be similar to what I've said in previous games).  This is a viewpoint that RobZ and I do not share.

Pointing the Finger of Suspicion on day 1 is pretty damn useless.  It provides 0 pressure to the person fingered.  Even if all 8 people here are FOSing me, I don't care.  I'm not going to roleclaim. 

However, if 4 people are VOTING for me, then I'm in a completely different position.  I'm panicked - 1 more person and I'm dead.  It also provides a bunch of information.  4 people have basically gone on record saying "Frisk is so scummy that I'm comfortable with him dying".   In an ideal world, I would want everyone to get up to 4 votes real votes and claim... then you have all sorts of good information... but there's just no way to accomplish this - because the pressure doesn't exist without the thread of being lynched.

So - at least in the games I've been in (this is my 5th, but only 3 are actually finished) - there was an early silly stage... in which we voted on people for no reason.  Then eventually someone said something that someone else thought was scummy and we moved on to some real discussion. 

Now - once we have some votes on people, or we're on day 3 or so, then voting is very dangerous - and the FOS becomes much more useful.

[Eevee]

Where's Fuzzy (Eevee)?

I'm here. Not much to say yet, timchen is the only one who has stood out to me. You seem to attack me one way or another in every game we are in together, why is that?

I don't trust Pokemon.

Anyway, wait, I attacked you here? Edgy a bit? I asked where you were...

Yeah edgy, apologies. Wrote that post in a hurry, didnt mean to come off that butthurt. However, what i meant to say was "I'm getting a vibe you generally dont trust me" which apparently is true. Okay.

I never know what to say day1 before anything has really happened. I do realize its important to post just to make something happen, but I dont much believe in the "Galzria, how did you feel when your role pm said its mafia time?" method either so.. :/