Dominion Strategy Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Pages: [1]

Author Topic: New idea: Secondary deck  (Read 1280 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

King Leon

  • Witch
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 459
  • Respect: +371
    • View Profile
New idea: Secondary deck
« on: March 06, 2016, 07:39:01 am »
+1

Recently I thought of the idea of a secondary deck next to your actual deck. What do you think about this?

I called it the Politics deck. At the begin of your turn (except your very first turn per game), you play the top card of your Politics deck. You can never draw cards from the Politics deck and it has its own discard pile. If the Politics deck is empty and you are required to reveal or draw a card, it is shuffled like your regular deck you just flip the discard pile over.

The Politics deck starts with the following cards:
Boon
Type: Politics
Cost: $0
You may discard 2 cards from your hand. If you do: + 1$

Prosperity
Type: Politics
Cost: $0
As long there are no cards in your deck, all Action cards cost $1 less. (This gives Chancellor a small buff.)


New Year Trade Fair
Type: Politics
Cost: $0
+ 1 Buy
You may immediately put your Politics deck into your Politics discard pile.

The next cards are Kingdom cards and when you gain them, you put them on your Politics discard pile:

Printery
Type: Politics
Cost:  $0$2
You may gain 1 Copper and put it into your hand.

The next cards are Kingdom cards and when you gain them, you put them on your Politics discard pile:

Housekeeper
Type: Politics
Cost: $2
You may discard 1 card from your hand.
If you do: + 1 Card
You may discard 1 card from your hand.
If you do: + 1$

Outrider
Type: Politics
Cost: $3
Reveal the top 2 cards of your deck. Put the revealed Victory, Curse and Shelter cards into your hand. Put the other cards on top of your deck in any order.

Subsidies
Type: Politics
Cost: $3
+ 1 Buy
Treasury cards cost 1 less in this turn.

Church
Type: Politics
Cost: $2$4
+ 1$
Trash this or a card from your hand.

Meteorologist
Type: Politics
Cost: $3
Reveal the top 2 cards of your Politics deck. Discard 1 of them. Play the other card.

Council
Type: Politics
Cost: $4
+ 1 Card. Each player (including you) may discard 1 card and if he does, draw 1 card.

Reconstruct
Type: Politics
Cost: $5
You may trash 1 card from your hand which is not a Treasury card. If you do: + $3 and + 1 Buy.

Demonic Pact
Type: Politics
Cost: $4
+ 1 Card
Discard 1 card from your hand. If it is a Curse, gain 1 card costing up to $6. Otherwise, gain 1 Curse.

Corruption
Type: Politics / Attack
Cost: $4
You may discard 1 Treasury card. If you do: + 1 Card + 1 Action.
Each other player with 4 or more cards in hand discards a Treasury or Action card (or reveals a hand without any Treasury or Action cards).

Palace
Type: Politics / Victory
Cost:$3$4
1 VP for each 3 cards in your Politics deck (round down)+1 VP

Cloister
Type: Politics
Cost: $3$4
While this is in play, when you buy a card, you may reveal the top card of your deck. If you do, discard it and gain a Silver and put it on top of your deck.
« Last Edit: March 12, 2016, 08:51:11 am by King Leon »
Logged

ThetaSigma12

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1681
  • Shuffle iT Username: ThetaSigma12
  • Respect: +1788
    • View Profile
Re: New idea: Secondary deck
« Reply #1 on: March 06, 2016, 08:29:31 am »
0

Might have some issues with shuffle luck. Getting the perfect politics card at the right time and all that. As for the cards, they all seem pretty good except for palace and prosperity. Palace seems a little weak, and it has no on play ability. Personally I would give it victory tokens when you buy stuff like goons. Prosperity does buff chancellor, but only three cards have that ability so it looks like usually it would do nothing, barring lucky edge cases. Also if you get it on your second turn you have a chance to get a better action card, which is too lucky if you ask me.

Very unique, and definitely worth a shot.
Logged
My magnum opus collection of dominion fan cards is available here!

King Leon

  • Witch
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 459
  • Respect: +371
    • View Profile
Re: New idea: Secondary deck
« Reply #2 on: March 06, 2016, 08:52:47 am »
0

Boon, Prosperity, New Year and Printery are supposed to be bad cards, because you start with them. I know that there is the issue that Prosperity in your second turn can be very strong, that's why I made it that you don't draw a Politics card in your very first turn; making it much more difficult to calculate. I also moved the + Buy to New Year for balancing purposes.

Palace has the advantage of being a Victory card which does not clutter your regular deck. One Palace gives 1 VP, 2 Palaces 4 VP and 5 Palaces even 15 VP making them a decent alternative victory card.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2016, 08:58:21 am by King Leon »
Logged

trivialknot

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 687
  • Respect: +1062
    • View Profile
Re: New idea: Secondary deck
« Reply #3 on: March 08, 2016, 05:20:48 pm »
+2

This is a really cool idea.  Without commenting on specific cards, here are my general thoughts:

1. You should think of the starting politics deck the same way you think of the starting deck of 7 copper and 3 estates.  The starting deck should be basically junk.  After all, you want to encourage players to buy new politics cards, not stick to their starting deck.

2. Along those lines, the starting shuffle should only take two turns to get through a shuffle.  Four turns (five turns if you skip the first one) is way too long to wait.

3. Think hard about how the starting politics cards affect the opening.  For example, if you draw Prosperity on your second turn, that seems to give you quite an unfair advantage.

4. Is it even necessary to shuffle the politics cards?  Shuffling four cards seems pointless.  Maybe just flip the discard pile, or put used cards on the bottom.

5. The politics cards you buy should in general be buffed.  Compare to kingdom cards of similar cost.  If you buy just one politics card, you only get its bonus once every five turns.  In practice this means playing it about 3 times in a game.  And you're also missing out on the bonus you could have gotten from some other politics card.
Logged

Haddock

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 725
  • Shuffle iT Username: Haddock
  • Doc Cod
  • Respect: +553
    • View Profile
Re: New idea: Secondary deck
« Reply #4 on: March 09, 2016, 05:39:31 am »
0

This is a really cool idea.  Without commenting on specific cards, here are my general thoughts:

1. You should think of the starting politics deck the same way you think of the starting deck of 7 copper and 3 estates.  The starting deck should be basically junk.  After all, you want to encourage players to buy new politics cards, not stick to their starting deck.

2. Along those lines, the starting shuffle should only take two turns to get through a shuffle.  Four turns (five turns if you skip the first one) is way too long to wait.

3. Think hard about how the starting politics cards affect the opening.  For example, if you draw Prosperity on your second turn, that seems to give you quite an unfair advantage.

4. Is it even necessary to shuffle the politics cards?  Shuffling four cards seems pointless.  Maybe just flip the discard pile, or put used cards on the bottom.

5. The politics cards you buy should in general be buffed.  Compare to kingdom cards of similar cost.  If you buy just one politics card, you only get its bonus once every five turns.  In practice this means playing it about 3 times in a game.  And you're also missing out on the bonus you could have gotten from some other politics card.
This was all pretty much my thinking.  Without a way to cycle it faster you actually need the cards to be stronger, not weaker, than your average kingdom card, to be worth it (and perhaps fewer starting cards, or some sort of easy way to "trash down").
Not shuffling has the added benefit of removing some of the swinginess of putting potentially powerful cards in there - but relied on good deck-tracking of course.  It then opens up a "reorder your deck" design space, a much more meaningful one than the main deck equivalent since the cards stay put.
Logged
The best reason to lynch Haddock is the meltdown we get to witness on the wagon runup. I mean, we should totally wagon him every day just for the lulz.

M Town Wins-Losses (6-2, 75%): 71, 72, 76, 81, 83, 87 - 79, 82.  M Scum Wins-Losses (2-1, 67%): 80, 101 - 70.
RMM Town Wins-Losses (3-1, 75%): 42, 47, 49 - 31.  RMM Scum Wins-Losses (3-3, 50%): 33, 37, 43 - 29, 32, 35.
Modded: M75, M84, RMM38.     Mislynched (M-RMM): None - 42.     Correctly lynched (M-RMM): 101 - 33, 33, 35.       MVPs: RMM37, M87

King Leon

  • Witch
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 459
  • Respect: +371
    • View Profile
Re: New idea: Secondary deck
« Reply #5 on: March 10, 2016, 03:00:00 pm »
0

Thank you for all those nice suggestion.

I really like the idea of having a deterministic deck. This would require some changes. I tested some games and found out, that dropping Prosperity and New Year would be okay. Removing the first turn lock also worked well, after Prosperity has been dropped. I realized that Printery is a way too strong, especially with Gardens or other alternative VP strategies. So, Printery is now a regular Politics card costing $2.

Instead of Printery I created a new card for the starting deck: Trade Fair. It costs $0 and gives +1 Buy

Other cards needed small updates. Church is too strong compared to Junk Dealer, so I changed its costs to $4. Cloister now costs $4, but discards the top card of your deck and puts the Silver on top. Palace costs $4 now and it is no Victory card more, but gives +1 VP instead.

Because my time is limited I will post the changes some other day.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2016, 04:23:22 pm by King Leon »
Logged

Seprix

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5599
  • Respect: +3619
    • View Profile
Re: New idea: Secondary deck
« Reply #6 on: March 10, 2016, 05:31:50 pm »
+1

Having some 'world deck' every round of turns would be cool, based on this idea, where every time everyone has their turn, a different card is drawn with a special effect for everybody. Everyone can discard 2 cards for +$1 or something, for example. Maybe there is even an attack card that block the effect of the 'world deck' for one round for everyone else. After all the cards have gone through, obviously you'd reshuffle. Having it set up this way also gets rid of the luck factor for individual players, because everybody gets the effect instead.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2016, 05:33:40 pm by Seprix »
Logged

BlackHole

  • Scout
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 44
  • Respect: +45
    • View Profile
Re: New idea: Secondary deck
« Reply #7 on: March 27, 2016, 12:54:03 pm »
0

Yup, a world deck sounds cool too, and caused by the fact that its fixed for the entire game (i think paying money for a card that some other guy is profiting of isn't that popular :D ), you could play every time with it. :)

But apart from that, i really appreciate the idea oft a politics deck for each player!
Maybe we can say that when playing with that deck, at the beginning of a turn, you draw one card from the politics deck, and can decide whether to play. Otherwise you put it aside and can trash it when a played action or an bought event reads "trash ... cards from your hand". That would solve the problem with the bad starting cards. 8)
Logged
Pages: [1]
 

Page created in 0.074 seconds with 20 queries.