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Author Topic: Really bad card ideas  (Read 609398 times)

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Marcory

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5050 on: October 12, 2017, 09:07:35 am »
0

Bitcoin Treasure

Reveal the top two cards of your deck. + equal to the cost of one of the cards you revealed. Discard that card and put the other one back on your deck.



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hypercube

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5051 on: October 12, 2017, 10:22:50 am »
+1

Ruined Outpost
$0 — Action-Ruins

If this is the first time you played a Ruined Outpost this turn, and the previous turn wasn't yours, then take a turn after each other player has taken one.

Possessed Witch
$5P — Action

The player to your left takes an extra turn after this one, in which you can see all cards he can and make all decisions for him. Any cards of his that are trashed are set aside and returned to his discard pile at end of turn.
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Minotaur

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5052 on: October 12, 2017, 02:26:20 pm »
+1

Bitcoin Treasure

Reveal the top two cards of your deck. + equal to the cost of one of the cards you revealed. Discard that card and put the other one back on your deck.

Bitcoin
Treasure
Cost: $4

+$1
Flip your Journey token over.
If it is face up, +$1 and flip over your second-order Journey token.
If you do and that token is face up, +$1 and flip over your third-order Journey token.
If you do and that token is face up, +$2 and +1 Buy.
(All Journey tokens of all orders begin face up)

Simpsons did it!
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silverspawn

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5053 on: October 13, 2017, 03:53:39 pm »
+1

Housing Crisis – Action – 2$
Put your hand on top of the Province pile in any order.

silverspawn

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5054 on: October 13, 2017, 04:14:38 pm »
0

Shooting Gallery – Action – 4$
Gain a Gunpowder.

Marcory

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5055 on: October 13, 2017, 04:23:40 pm »
+3

Shooting Gallery – Action – 4$
Gain a Gunpowder.

In theory such a card could be successful, but in practice it would probably bomb.
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silverspawn

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5056 on: October 15, 2017, 05:55:43 am »
+1

Hey now that the card automater exists we can do these as images!

 

(That's of course from the OP)

silverspawn

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5057 on: October 15, 2017, 06:01:33 am »
+5

LibraryAdventurer

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5058 on: October 17, 2017, 11:26:00 pm »
0

Quote
Slurker
$3 - Action - Reserve
+1 Action
+1$ for each action card on the tavern mat of the player to your left.
You may gain a Slurker from the trash. If you do, put it in your hand.
-
When you gain this, put it on your tavern mat.
-
When you buy a card, you may call this to trash it.
If you took 'it' to mean the card you bought, gain a curse and trash this.
-
When you trash this, look at the top card of your deck. You may trash it.

Quote
It
Look at the top card of the first pile in the game box nearest to you. Play it.
-
When this is in the game, whenever a card refers to 'it', it refers to this card.

Minotaur

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5059 on: October 18, 2017, 10:56:45 am »
0

Quote
Slurker
$3 - Action - Reserve
+1 Action
+1$ for each action card on the tavern mat of the player to your left.
You may gain a Slurker from the trash. If you do, put it in your hand.
-
When you gain this, put it on your tavern mat.
-
When you buy a card, you may call this to trash it.
If you took 'it' to mean the card you bought, gain a curse and trash this.
-
When you trash this, look at the top card of your deck. You may trash it.

Quote
It
Look at the top card of the first pile in the game box nearest to you. Play it.
-
When this is in the game, whenever a card refers to 'it', it refers to this card.

Flip your Journey token over.  If It is face up......
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singletee

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5060 on: October 18, 2017, 07:19:00 pm »
+2

Ok I'll explain the joke really bad card idea. When played, It just plays itself over and over forever. What the top card of the first pile in the game box nearest to you is is irrelevant, because the instruction "Play it" always causes you to play It again.

jonaskoelker

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5061 on: October 21, 2017, 06:15:13 am »
0

Ok I'll explain the joke really bad card idea.

Oh hey, I heard that explaining jokes and really bad card ideas is a thing in this Forum. I wanna have a go at that.

Jack, master salvager
$4 — Action
Trash any number of non-treasure cards from your hand.

Jack, master scavenger
$4 — Action
Look at the top card of your deck. You may discard it. You may repeat this any number of times.

Jack, master minter
$4 — Action
Gain any number of silvers.

Jack, master librarian
$4 — Action
Draw cards until you have 5 cards in hand. Repeat this any number of times.
Obviously the theme is turning Jack of all Trades into four different "Jack, master of a single trade" by letting you do the effect any number of times.

Draw-to-x multiple times is the same as doing it once, hence Master Librarian's "Repeat this any number of times" is superfluous—and since most card text isn't, this would probably lead to confusion and avoidable rules questions. But the foolish consistency that is the hobgoblin of little minds is excellent fun ^^. Also, on 5-card hands, Master Librarian = Ruined Library.

Master Minter is CRAZY swingy: whoever gets it on turn 3* plays the infinite Silver deck and single provinces every** turn starting turn 5. **Unless enough junk collides, in which case it's not in any of your other hands. *Actually it's p1 t3 > p2 t3 > p1 t4 > p2 t4, so it has a MASSIVE first player advantage as well. Good with: Feodum. Bad against: Militia.

Master Salvager is a little better at trashing estates than Salvager, but not a lot (Best case: Master Salvager is as good as a Steward for one turn only). It's a lot worse at being virtual money. Maybe it can trash multiple Ruins/Curses, but... meh? On the whole, what makes this card a bad idea is that it's extremely weak.

Master Scavenger, my favorite. Here's approximately what it does: "Put you deck in your discard pile. Look through your discard pile and shuffle any number of cards into your deck. Look through your discard pile; you may put a card from it on top of your deck." — they way you get that effect is by discarding from the top of your deck until by chance all the cards you want to discard are at the top of your shuffle, all the shuffled-into-deck are at the bottom, and the topdecked card is topmost among those you want to keep (or you can stop after having discarded those you want to discard and not look at the card on top, hence the reworded topdecking is optional). Recall when I said "by chance"? It's going to take FOREVER for that to happen (or maybe ~n! shuffles); which means that if you're a decent human being you don't actually play this out, you just... meh, I dunno? Chancellor yourself without the money?

TL;DR: very meh card, unnecessary rules questions, extreme imbalance, effect resolution that's slow as molasses. All important ingredients in a well-designed game ;D
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Minotaur

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5062 on: October 21, 2017, 11:58:58 am »
0

Master Scavenger, my favorite. Here's approximately what it does: "Put you deck in your discard pile. Look through your discard pile and shuffle any number of cards into your deck. Look through your discard pile; you may put a card from it on top of your deck." — they way you get that effect is by discarding from the top of your deck until by chance all the cards you want to discard are at the top of your shuffle, all the shuffled-into-deck are at the bottom, and the topdecked card is topmost among those you want to keep (or you can stop after having discarded those you want to discard and not look at the card on top, hence the reworded topdecking is optional). Recall when I said "by chance"? It's going to take FOREVER for that to happen (or maybe ~n! shuffles); which means that if you're a decent human being you don't actually play this out, you just... meh, I dunno? Chancellor yourself without the money?

TL;DR: very meh card, unnecessary rules questions, extreme imbalance, effect resolution that's slow as molasses. All important ingredients in a well-designed game ;D

There are (n choose m) ways to get your m "good cards" on the bottom of the deck.  For each of these, there m cards which could have been the top card.  For each of these cases, you must go through your deck of n cards.  The asymptotics are probably closer to (n choose m)*m*n cards discarded, times or divided by a constant C>1 to account for variation from the expected value.  (I think you could be more specific with some other Geometric distribution estimate or something, but whatever...)

I think I did that right-ish?  Sort of?
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navical

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5063 on: October 21, 2017, 12:36:15 pm »
0

Master Scavenger, my favorite. Here's approximately what it does: "Put you deck in your discard pile. Look through your discard pile and shuffle any number of cards into your deck. Look through your discard pile; you may put a card from it on top of your deck." — they way you get that effect is by discarding from the top of your deck until by chance all the cards you want to discard are at the top of your shuffle, all the shuffled-into-deck are at the bottom, and the topdecked card is topmost among those you want to keep (or you can stop after having discarded those you want to discard and not look at the card on top, hence the reworded topdecking is optional). Recall when I said "by chance"? It's going to take FOREVER for that to happen (or maybe ~n! shuffles); which means that if you're a decent human being you don't actually play this out, you just... meh, I dunno? Chancellor yourself without the money?

TL;DR: very meh card, unnecessary rules questions, extreme imbalance, effect resolution that's slow as molasses. All important ingredients in a well-designed game ;D

There are (n choose m) ways to get your m "good cards" on the bottom of the deck.  For each of these, there m cards which could have been the top card.  For each of these cases, you must go through your deck of n cards.  The asymptotics are probably closer to (n choose m)*m*n cards discarded, times or divided by a constant C>1 to account for variation from the expected value.  (I think you could be more specific with some other Geometric distribution estimate or something, but whatever...)

I think I did that right-ish?  Sort of?
You have to search all the orderings of your deck for one that puts your good gards on the bottom, not go through all the orderings with the good cards on the bottom.

Each time you go through your deck, there is an
Code: [Select]
(n choose m) * m / n! = m / (m!(n-m)!)chance that your deck is in a perfect order. So you're looking at around
Code: [Select]
n*(m-1)!*(n-m)!)discards before you stop.

For n = 30, m = 10 this is about 2*10^25.
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Minotaur

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5064 on: October 21, 2017, 01:09:46 pm »
0

Master Scavenger, my favorite. Here's approximately what it does: "Put you deck in your discard pile. Look through your discard pile and shuffle any number of cards into your deck. Look through your discard pile; you may put a card from it on top of your deck." — they way you get that effect is by discarding from the top of your deck until by chance all the cards you want to discard are at the top of your shuffle, all the shuffled-into-deck are at the bottom, and the topdecked card is topmost among those you want to keep (or you can stop after having discarded those you want to discard and not look at the card on top, hence the reworded topdecking is optional). Recall when I said "by chance"? It's going to take FOREVER for that to happen (or maybe ~n! shuffles); which means that if you're a decent human being you don't actually play this out, you just... meh, I dunno? Chancellor yourself without the money?

TL;DR: very meh card, unnecessary rules questions, extreme imbalance, effect resolution that's slow as molasses. All important ingredients in a well-designed game ;D

There are (n choose m) ways to get your m "good cards" on the bottom of the deck.  For each of these, there m cards which could have been the top card.  For each of these cases, you must go through your deck of n cards.  The asymptotics are probably closer to (n choose m)*m*n cards discarded, times or divided by a constant C>1 to account for variation from the expected value.  (I think you could be more specific with some other Geometric distribution estimate or something, but whatever...)

I think I did that right-ish?  Sort of?
You have to search all the orderings of your deck for one that puts your good gards on the bottom, not go through all the orderings with the good cards on the bottom.

Each time you go through your deck, there is an
Code: [Select]
(n choose m) * m / n! = m / (m!(n-m)!)chance that your deck is in a perfect order. So you're looking at around
Code: [Select]
n*(m-1)!*(n-m)!)discards before you stop.

For n = 30, m = 10 this is about 2*10^25.

Oh, right.  Whoops.  That's closer to right.

But I think the m in your first blue box is against you, not for you.  That is, the next card has to be exactly that one out of the m.  So (n choose m)/(m*n!) probability, or roughly (m*n!)/(n choose m) expected trials.

m*m!*(n-m)! shuffles, or nm*m!*(n-m)! discards (times C approx 1).
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Minotaur

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5065 on: October 21, 2017, 05:53:56 pm »
0

Actual Fool's Gold
Treasure
Cost: $4

+$3
The next time you play a copy of this card or a Gold, trash this card, take your -$1 token, and gain a Curse.

EDIT:  Crap, mixed this up with my RBCI tab.  Not deleting, two upvotes already!
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King Leon

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5066 on: October 22, 2017, 03:43:49 pm »
0

Jack, master salvager
$4 — Action
Trash any number of non-treasure cards from your hand.

Uh, this is the worst Chapel variant I have ever seen.
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Awaclus

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5067 on: October 22, 2017, 03:55:58 pm »
+3

Jack, master salvager
$4 — Action
Trash any number of non-treasure cards from your hand.

Uh, this is the worst Chapel variant I have ever seen.

Uh, this is the really bad card ideas thread.
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Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

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Minotaur

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5068 on: October 22, 2017, 04:06:30 pm »
0

Jack, master salvager
$4 — Action
Trash any number of non-treasure cards from your hand.

Uh, this is the worst Chapel variant I have ever seen.

Uh, this is the really bad card ideas thread.

I just realized that I've never posted to RGCI.  I don't even know if RGCI exists...   :'(
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Storyteller/Crown is Donald's Vietnam Watergate.  Alchemy is Donald's Vietnam.  Scout is the time Donald choked on a pretzel.

jonaskoelker

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5069 on: October 22, 2017, 04:42:20 pm »
0

Jack, master salvager
$4 — Action
Trash any number of non-treasure cards from your hand.

Uh, this is the worst Chapel variant I have ever seen.



;)
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Asper

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5070 on: October 22, 2017, 06:29:57 pm »
0

Jack, master salvager
$4 — Action
Trash any number of non-treasure cards from your hand.

Uh, this is the worst Chapel variant I have ever seen.

Uh, this is the really bad card ideas thread.

I just realized that I've never posted to RGCI.  I don't even know if RGCI exists...   :'(

It's a matter of perspective and preference.

Dylan32

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5071 on: October 23, 2017, 12:51:15 am »
+3

Jack, master salvager
$4 — Action
Trash any number of non-treasure cards from your hand.

Uh, this is the worst Chapel variant I have ever seen.

Uh, this is the really bad card ideas thread.

I just realized that I've never posted to RGCI.  I don't even know if RGCI exists...   :'(

RGCI
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Minotaur

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5072 on: October 23, 2017, 01:37:44 am »
0

Jack, master salvager
$4 — Action
Trash any number of non-treasure cards from your hand.

Uh, this is the worst Chapel variant I have ever seen.

Uh, this is the really bad card ideas thread.

I just realized that I've never posted to RGCI.  I don't even know if RGCI exists...   :'(

RGCI

Gunpowder could work, but the cards you buy with it would have to be strong.  Pay-$2-but-then-it-takes-a-while-to-see-the-payoff was done with Travelers, and alternate currency was done with Alchemy.  But Gunpowder doesn't feel that much like a Treasure card when you trash it on play, so it's closer to a Traveler in practice the way I see it.  Also, it could feel really bad to have a $ and GP mix with no +buy, but yeah, Alchemy is sort of hated anyway because you know.

Anyway, Bomb lives on as a joke.  Obviously that one wasn't play-tested much if at all...
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Minotaur

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5073 on: October 23, 2017, 12:16:28 pm »
+2

Haunt
Event/Online Only
Cost: $8

Put your Ghost token on an Action Supply pile of your choice.  While owned by you, cards from this pile:
  * are invisible to other players except when you play them
  * do not count toward your handsize
  * are not eligible to be revealed
  * go into your hand before you would draw them, prompting you to draw your next card instead
« Last Edit: October 23, 2017, 04:52:56 pm by Minotaur »
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Asper

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Re: Really bad card ideas
« Reply #5074 on: October 23, 2017, 06:10:20 pm »
+1

Jack, master salvager
$4 — Action
Trash any number of non-treasure cards from your hand.

Uh, this is the worst Chapel variant I have ever seen.

Uh, this is the really bad card ideas thread.

I just realized that I've never posted to RGCI.  I don't even know if RGCI exists...   :'(

RGCI

Gunpowder could work, but the cards you buy with it would have to be strong.  Pay-$2-but-then-it-takes-a-while-to-see-the-payoff was done with Travelers, and alternate currency was done with Alchemy.  But Gunpowder doesn't feel that much like a Treasure card when you trash it on play, so it's closer to a Traveler in practice the way I see it.  Also, it could feel really bad to have a $ and GP mix with no +buy, but yeah, Alchemy is sort of hated anyway because you know.

Anyway, Bomb lives on as a joke.  Obviously that one wasn't play-tested much if at all...

Oh wow. I never realized my Homunculus is a Bomb variant. What about that.
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