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AdamH

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Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« on: March 29, 2014, 01:59:23 pm »
+7

This topic is meant to be a compilation of resources for those who want to start making Dominion videos or live streaming Dominion.

Maybe this thread should be stickied? EDIT: oh yeah, maybe the title of the subforum should be changed to something like "Dominion Videos" or something that includes live streams? It seems to have taken off enough that it won't be going away in the near future (I hope!  :) )

Video recording software
CamStudio (for Windows, I don't know of any free recording software for Linux)
   video tutorial
      Don't worry about codecs, it will almost certainly work right away
      Gives you a lot of flexibility on audio inputs and such
Will likely not require any editing for most of your video recording needs

Streaming software
Open Broadcasting Software (OBS)
   You can also use this to save videos instead of (or in addition to) streaming them if you want
   libav text tutorial for Windows
   OBS text tutorial for Linux
   OBS video tutorial for Windows
      I've never had trouble with my stream key like this guy has
The only setting you should use that isn't what Twitch prefers is to uncheck "Use CBR" -- if not you're going to get terrible lag on lots of things, including Goko (it's not Goko's fault, don't worry)
   Setting up IRC clients to capture Twitch chat
      I've had issues before when streaming tournament matches: I want to read the chat after the match is over, but I don't want to look at it while I play (so people can talk freely about the kingdom without risk of helping me). The Twitch chat interface doesn't keep very many messages before it just forgets about them, so connecting to chat with IRC is a good way to make sure you can save off the entire chat easily.
   Widget for Twitch to display chat live on stream (Thanks to Seprix)
      I've found this useful for tournament matches especially, I can't see the chat, but when I review my videos to see what people said, there's no more wondering what they were talking about because I can see when things were said and get good context.

Video Tutorial for streaming to Twitch on Mac OS

Twitch allows cropping ("highlighting") videos, and can upload directly to YouTube.
Twitch doesn't save your past broadcasts by default, you'll want to enable this on your account.

Video editing software
Windows Movie Maker (comes with Windows)
   v2.6 for Vista/Win7
   video tutorial
CamTasia Studio
   Costs money to use, but there's a 30-day free trial. CamTasia is more powerful if Windows Movie Maker isn't doing what you want (like split-screen videos, most notably)
   Comes with its own video capture software as well, which is quite nice.

Hear about other people Live Streaming Dominion
« Last Edit: April 09, 2015, 10:35:27 pm by AdamH »
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SCSN

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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #1 on: May 13, 2014, 02:01:38 pm »
+3

I did some test streaming yesterday using OBS and Twitch and it was super easy to setup.

I do have a question about the Max Bitrate setting. Twitch recommends something like 2500 kb/s for 720p and 3500 for 1080p. They also say that it's best not to go beyond 3500. Why is that? According to speedtest.net my connection has an upload speed of 93Mbps. Can't I just put the Max Bitrate on, say, 10.000 and thereby decrease the amount of downsampling my system has to do before uploading the data? Or is it that twitch will just forward the data literally to the viewers, so that if I stream at a ridiculously high rate people with a slower connection will suffer severe lag or high buffering times. If that's the case, what setting would work for most people? Is 3500 fine or should it be lower?
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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #2 on: May 13, 2014, 02:23:25 pm »
0

Based on my experience, there was quite a bit of lag/dropped frames when I tried streaming at the maximum bitrate, and going to 1/2 of the default made it really smooth.  Might matter more in an action game or something.
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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #3 on: May 13, 2014, 02:45:16 pm »
0

IIRC, your bit rate determines the minimum download speed people need to watch your stream, so people with slow internet won't be able to view your stream.
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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #4 on: May 13, 2014, 11:03:27 pm »
0

Any recommendations for video settings to use in the technologically backwards USA?  SCSN may have an upload speed of 93 Mbps, but I'm limited to 5 Mbps.  That is literally the fastest that anyone sells in my area.

PS: I'm using OBS, but could change if there's something better out there for streaming Dominion.  It seems obvious that 1 keyframe 2 seconds is outrageous overkill for a mostly-static game screen, and I'm sure there are codec efficiency issues too.
« Last Edit: May 13, 2014, 11:06:05 pm by ragingduckd »
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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #5 on: May 14, 2014, 12:03:55 am »
0

Any recommendations for video settings to use in the technologically backwards USA?  SCSN may have an upload speed of 93 Mbps, but I'm limited to 5 Mbps.  That is literally the fastest that anyone sells in my area.

PS: I'm using OBS, but could change if there's something better out there for streaming Dominion.  It seems obvious that 1 keyframe 2 seconds is outrageous overkill for a mostly-static game screen, and I'm sure there are codec efficiency issues too.

Not too well-versed in OBS settings, but the internet I'm using right now is upload speed of around 0.9 Mbps, and using 750 kb/s as my bit rate seems okay.
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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #6 on: May 14, 2014, 01:57:24 am »
0

Any recommendations for video settings to use in the technologically backwards USA?  SCSN may have an upload speed of 93 Mbps, but I'm limited to 5 Mbps.  That is literally the fastest that anyone sells in my area.

PS: I'm using OBS, but could change if there's something better out there for streaming Dominion.  It seems obvious that 1 keyframe 2 seconds is outrageous overkill for a mostly-static game screen, and I'm sure there are codec efficiency issues too.

I stream with OBS on a 1Mbps link, and it's been fine quality. I've got my max bitrate set at 1kb/s, 30fps, and keyframe interval at 2. You can see an example of the video quality this produces at http://www.twitch.tv/amalloy/b/528069401 - no noticeable frame drops, animations only a tiny bit choppier than when actually playing.
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ragingduckd

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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #7 on: May 14, 2014, 02:05:40 am »
0

Any recommendations for video settings to use in the technologically backwards USA?  SCSN may have an upload speed of 93 Mbps, but I'm limited to 5 Mbps.  That is literally the fastest that anyone sells in my area.

PS: I'm using OBS, but could change if there's something better out there for streaming Dominion.  It seems obvious that 1 keyframe 2 seconds is outrageous overkill for a mostly-static game screen, and I'm sure there are codec efficiency issues too.

I stream with OBS on a 1Mbps link, and it's been fine quality. I've got my max bitrate set at 1kb/s, 30fps, and keyframe interval at 2. You can see an example of the video quality this produces at http://www.twitch.tv/amalloy/b/528069401 - no noticeable frame drops, animations only a tiny bit choppier than when actually playing.

Cool.  Is that 720p?
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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #8 on: May 14, 2014, 02:20:38 am »
0

Any recommendations for video settings to use in the technologically backwards USA?  SCSN may have an upload speed of 93 Mbps, but I'm limited to 5 Mbps.  That is literally the fastest that anyone sells in my area.

PS: I'm using OBS, but could change if there's something better out there for streaming Dominion.  It seems obvious that 1 keyframe 2 seconds is outrageous overkill for a mostly-static game screen, and I'm sure there are codec efficiency issues too.

I stream with OBS on a 1Mbps link, and it's been fine quality. I've got my max bitrate set at 1kb/s, 30fps, and keyframe interval at 2. You can see an example of the video quality this produces at http://www.twitch.tv/amalloy/b/528069401 - no noticeable frame drops, animations only a tiny bit choppier than when actually playing.

Cool.  Is that 720p?

I run my screen at 1600x900, so I think that's the resolution that gets streamed. Is that better or worse than 720p? Beats me.
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ragingduckd

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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #9 on: May 17, 2014, 02:58:33 am »
+3

Any recommendations for video settings to use in the technologically backwards USA?  SCSN may have an upload speed of 93 Mbps, but I'm limited to 5 Mbps.  That is literally the fastest that anyone sells in my area.

PS: I'm using OBS, but could change if there's something better out there for streaming Dominion.  It seems obvious that 1 keyframe 2 seconds is outrageous overkill for a mostly-static game screen, and I'm sure there are codec efficiency issues too.

I stream with OBS on a 1Mbps link, and it's been fine quality. I've got my max bitrate set at 1kb/s, 30fps, and keyframe interval at 2. You can see an example of the video quality this produces at http://www.twitch.tv/amalloy/b/528069401 - no noticeable frame drops, animations only a tiny bit choppier than when actually playing.

Cool.  Is that 720p?

I run my screen at 1600x900, so I think that's the resolution that gets streamed. Is that better or worse than 720p? Beats me.

Okay, here's what I've been able to work out:

The number in 720p or 1080p is just the number of horizontal scan lines (from top to bottom).  Both are common standards for commercial media.  So 1600x900 would be "900p," which is better than 720p and worse than 1080p.  That said, there's no point in broadcasting at a higher resolution than your native content.  So if your monitor is spitting out 900 horizontal scan lines, it's actually much worse to upsample and broadcast at 1080p.  You'll end up with higher bandwidth and worse quality, as every scan line of input gets stretched to cover 1.2 scan lines of output and the results get averaged together.

Actually, Goko does this same thing natively when you resize your browser window or use Ctrl-<plus> or Ctrl-<minus> to zoom.  Edit: Or maybe it only does it when you first load the page.  It may be browser-specific.  I get best results when I start with a maximized browser window, then resize it as necessary later.

So the best thing you can possibly do for your broadcast is:
1. Put Goko into a mode with none of this stretching: use 100% browser zoom (Ctrl-<zero>) and then resize your browser window until it looks as crisp as you can get it.
2. Broadcast exactly the game area in exactly its native resolution.  OBS can do a sub-region of a window, so select that sub-region and then broadcast exactly that size, even if it happens to be something weird like 1365x783.

Finally, the OBS default keyframe rate is incredibly wasteful for Dominion.  Change it from 2 sec/keyframe to at least 20 sec/keyframe.

In video encoding, most frames as stored as just a set of changes from the previous frame.  Since two successive frames usually look a lot like each other (e.g. two frames of the same person talking), this saves a ton of space.  Every now and then, you still have to send a complete new frame (a keyframe), but you only want to do it when it's really warranted (e.g. when the camera cuts to a different shot).  For Dominion, the camera never cuts to a different shot.  The game board and 90% of its information is static throughout the entire game.  Keyframes are therefore extremely wasteful.

By reducing the frequency of the keyframes, you can either send the same quality in less bandwidth (by also reducing the max kbps) or send higher quality in the same bandwidth (by leaving max kbps unchanged).  I reduced my keyframe rate to once every 20 seconds and dramatically improved the quality.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2014, 03:38:42 am by ragingduckd »
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SCSN

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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #10 on: May 17, 2014, 03:10:10 am »
0

Any recommendations for video settings to use in the technologically backwards USA?  SCSN may have an upload speed of 93 Mbps, but I'm limited to 5 Mbps.  That is literally the fastest that anyone sells in my area.

PS: I'm using OBS, but could change if there's something better out there for streaming Dominion.  It seems obvious that 1 keyframe 2 seconds is outrageous overkill for a mostly-static game screen, and I'm sure there are codec efficiency issues too.

I stream with OBS on a 1Mbps link, and it's been fine quality. I've got my max bitrate set at 1kb/s, 30fps, and keyframe interval at 2. You can see an example of the video quality this produces at http://www.twitch.tv/amalloy/b/528069401 - no noticeable frame drops, animations only a tiny bit choppier than when actually playing.

Cool.  Is that 720p?

I run my screen at 1600x900, so I think that's the resolution that gets streamed. Is that better or worse than 720p? Beats me.

Okay, here's what I've been able to work out:

The number in 720p or 1080p is just the number of horizontal scan lines (from top to bottom).  Both are common standards for commercial media.  So 1600x900 would be "900p," which is better than 720p and worse than 1080p.  That said, there's no point in broadcasting at a higher resolution than your native content.

Can you actually choose the resolution in which you broadcast (I can't check right now)? I thought you just broadcast what you tell it to in whatever resolution it happens to be, with the bandwith determining the amount of compression that will be applied before uploading.
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ragingduckd

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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #11 on: May 17, 2014, 03:32:48 am »
+3

Can you actually choose the resolution in which you broadcast (I can't check right now)? I thought you just broadcast what you tell it to in whatever resolution it happens to be, with the bandwith determining the amount of compression that will be applied before uploading.

Yes, first right-click the source ("Window Capture" for me) and select the sub-region you want to broadcast:


Then use the Video tab in the Settings dialog to broadcast at exactly that resolution:
« Last Edit: May 17, 2014, 03:34:03 am by ragingduckd »
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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #12 on: June 10, 2014, 08:03:03 am »
0

So I just decided to learn how to do this.  Apparently, there is a constant tornado in my home and I type like somebody's dropping anvils on my keyboard.  Any idea how to quiet those background noises?
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AdamH

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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #13 on: June 10, 2014, 08:11:09 am »
0

So I just decided to learn how to do this.  Apparently, there is a constant tornado in my home and I type like somebody's dropping anvils on my keyboard.  Any idea how to quiet those background noises?

Sounds like you might be using the integrated mic/webcam on a laptop? Having a headset really helps with your audio quality, and the nicer of a headset you get, the better your quality is going to be.

If you've never shopped for a headset, I'd recommend getting a cheap wired one to start out so you can learn what you want in a headset.

I personally recommend Logitech headsets, I've used a lot of them and I've been really satisfied with them.
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shraeye

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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #14 on: June 10, 2014, 08:21:40 am »
0

i've got an old headset that I can dig up somewhere...until then, any tips?  something with audio threshholds?
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AdamH

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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #15 on: June 10, 2014, 08:27:52 am »
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I mean, I know how you can get rid of background noise when you're editing audio/video but I imagine that's not what you want. A little bit of background noise is something people can deal with while you figure out other things about who you are while broadcasting, how it interacts with how you play, things you care about, etc. At least that's my opinion. As long as people can hear what you're saying I think you're OK to get started.
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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #16 on: June 10, 2014, 08:29:20 am »
0

Thanks! I'll test it out a bit, and then perhaps start doing this stuff.
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« Last Edit: June 17, 2014, 12:11:47 pm by michaeljb »
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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #18 on: September 28, 2014, 06:46:05 am »
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When uploading videos to Youtube, is there a way for the videos to be longer than 15 minutes? Youtube would only let me upload videos in 15 minute sections, which is annoying.
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AdamH

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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #19 on: September 28, 2014, 12:51:04 pm »
+1

When uploading videos to Youtube, is there a way for the videos to be longer than 15 minutes? Youtube would only let me upload videos in 15 minute sections, which is annoying.

Your channel has to be approved for uploading videos that are longer than 15 minutes. I remember this happened to me before I ever started making Dominion videos and I don't remember ever asking for it. After some searching it looks like you can ask to have your account verified which should help you out...
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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #20 on: November 12, 2014, 10:32:03 am »
+1

Maybe this could be added here? Connecting with IRC chat to Twitch.
http://help.twitch.tv/customer/portal/articles/1302780-twitch-irc
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AdamH

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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #21 on: November 12, 2014, 12:01:53 pm »
+1

Maybe this could be added here? Connecting with IRC chat to Twitch.
http://help.twitch.tv/customer/portal/articles/1302780-twitch-irc

Good call. I've edited it into the OP.
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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #22 on: February 11, 2015, 12:09:04 am »
+1

   OBS text tutorial for Linux
This is actually a link to using libav for streaming, not OBS. libav is a fork of ffmpeg, which is what I use to stream on Linux. ffmpeg and libav can also do video recording and duration cropping.
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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #23 on: February 15, 2015, 11:17:57 am »
0

https://www.rechat.org

You can use this to record your chat during a game if you want to see it in context later.
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Re: Resources for Dominion videos and live streams
« Reply #24 on: February 15, 2015, 02:59:33 pm »
0

https://www.rechat.org

You can use this to record your chat during a game if you want to see it in context later.

So this app only records the top 800 most popular Twitch channels' chat at any given moment and there doesn't appear t be any way to configure it to record your own channel's chat  :(
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