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[ashersky]

Oh well, all good things...

Was not a high quality match, but very tense, think 0-0 was an appropriate result.
Too bad we couldn't win this shootout.

Has been an exciting couple of weeks, all thanks to the guys in orange.
They did their country proud, but it wasn't meant to be.

Sounds like neither team took any risks?  (I only saw the last half of extra and the shootout.).  At least, that's what the Australian commentators were saying.

[Teproc]

That's a good description of it yes. Both teams refused to play.

[Davio]

I think both teams tried, but also didn't want to give anything away given the quality of the opposing side's attackers.

So we got to see two teams who mostly had their defense in order and indeed, didn't take a lot of chances to go on an all out attack.

[Teproc]

I think both teams tried, but also didn't want to give anything away given the quality of the opposing side's attackers.

So we got to see two teams who mostly had their defense in order and indeed, didn't take a lot of chances to go on an all out attack.

That's what I call not trying

[soulnet]

I agree, it was a pretty defensive game. Even then, the attackers are so good that we saw some situations.

Teproc, do you believe the Netherlands deserved to go to the finals? I am totally expecting myself to be biased at this point, but I think they play way more horrible than Argentina today, and more durty, which is totally not their style. They were fouling in every Argentinian attack and we saw no yellow card for continuous fouling.

[Teproc]

I don't think Netherlands played worse than Argentina... they've been pretty bad in these elimination rounds, but I can at least point to their groups game (second halves against Spain and Australia, whole match against Chile was also fairly good), which I can't with Argentina.

So they're not super deserving either, but a little moreso. Overall it feel like the upper bracket was so much tougher than the lower one (I think France would have had a good shot at beating any of these two, same with Colombia).

I'm also a little scared that Argentina will win this World Cup on some incredible thing Messi does if they manage to neutralize Germany somehow. That would pretty much disgust me.

That said, I understand it must be annoying for you to have me bashing Argentina the whole World Cup. Enjoy the victory still, I wouldn't care a second if France had gone to the finals in this way

[MarkowKette]

I think 0:0 was a deserved result after 120mins. Argentina had slightly more and slightly better chances so they deserved to win.
But i agree that the Netherlands played a better tournament so far so i was still rooting for them and if they won it wouldn't have been undeservingly.
France was actually my favourite to win the world cup.

Germany-Argentina will be a very tough and tactical final i would be astonished if we see 3 or more goals in the regular time,
but well i guess i will never be able to be more astonished than after this semi final yesterday. And after that game i certainly have to favor our national team for the final.

[Teproc]

I realized I didn't adress soulnet's point about the Dutch fouling. I don't think it was that bad. There were a few unpunished fouls in the first half, but not really in the second half. One of the Argentinian players actually got spared a yellow card too when he did the exact same thing Thiago Silva did in the Colombia match. I would say the refereeing was slightly advantageous to the Netherlands, but not really by much. The guy you're saying could have gotten a red card could have, but an Argentinian made the exact same foul 5 minutes earlier and got nothing so...

[soulnet]

Regarding cards: The whole cup I felt there were less cards than deserved. I just think Argentina is taking less advantage than other teams, because is not fouling as badly. Demichelis got a yellow card for a single regular foul that at least Kuyt and one other player whose last name I don't remember know deserved as well. I don't like the rough game, especially when it interrupts attacks constantly. It also made the game closer to 0-0.

I mostly agree that it was an even game, and I feel Argentina produced a little more offense, but not a lot. And I was surprised that we won, I was expecting we would loose on penalties.

I must say the Netherlands substitutions were a lot better than Argentina's. A lot better. That's probably the reason the game was a lot more even in the second half, after a first half in which Argentina could have deserved some goal.

BTW, Argentina did score and as far as the repetition I have seen goes, it seemed Higuain was not offside.

Teproc, I don't mind you bashing Argentina, so keep it up. But, there is no way France was a strong match for either (that does not mean they could not win, of course). France has no real defense to face really good attackers.

Regarding the cup, I think Germany is the strongest overall so far, though not by as much as the 7-1 in the semifinal says. However, for the final, I don't know, I feel like Argentina has some shot. And now, I hope it goes to Penality shoot-outs. However, I am worried that Mascherano and Biglia are too tired and the Germans will be too well rested, so I don't know if the defense is going to hold its ground. I totally expect Argentina to play more defensive than today, especially at the beginning, to stop any inertia Germany carries from the semi-final. I would say getting through the first 30 mins at 0-0 is good for Argentina.

[soulnet]

BTW, I started thinking what the ideal 11 could look like (though what happens in the last two games matters a lot).

I imagine both Mascherano and Messi in there (unless Messi is horrible again in the finals). Probably Robben from the Netherlands. I also liked Kuyt overall. Van Persie and Sneijder really disappeared after the first phase. From Germany, Kroos and Khedira should be in for sure. Muller is possible, though I am not impressed so far (not that he is playing badly, he just seems regular). I liked Boateng a lot. Maybe Neuer as well? Thought they probably put Navas as goalkeeper, to have more diversity, and he did play a strong quarterfinals match. From Brazil they will rescue someone. Maybe David Luiz or Thiago Silva, though is possible they just get someone that plays well on the 3rd place match.

[Davio]

My World Cup 11 (not looking too strictly at their positions):

Neuer
Lahm - Hummels - Vlaar - Blind
Neymar - Mascherano - Müller - J. Rodriguez
Robben - Messi


I think Vlaar really played a terrific and solid World Cup, it was sad to have him miss the first penalty. Neuer is not necessarily the best goalkeeper (I think it's close with Navas, Ochoa and perhaps Howard), but he is super solid. Hummels has been quite important and Blind I don't known, could put Boateng here I guess..

Messi hasn't been stellar, but he has been important and that's good enough.

[Teproc]

I don't think I would put Blind in there. Not sure who else though, so maybe you're right.

Might be my bias but I would put Varane instead of Vlaar, although Vlaar was certainly very good in the semifinals. Didn't quite notice him before, but that can happen with good defenders.

Soulnet, I find it interesting that you say France has no defense... to me it seems that our problam against Germany was an offense one, not defense.

[Davio]

I don't think I would put Blind in there. Not sure who else though, so maybe you're right.

Might be my bias but I would put Varane instead of Vlaar, although Vlaar was certainly very good in the semifinals. Didn't quite notice him before, but that can happen with good defenders.

Soulnet, I find it interesting that you say France has no defense... to me it seems that our problam against Germany was an offense one, not defense.

Blind was definitely dubious, but likewise, I couldn't find anyone who really stood out to replace him with, so obviously a little biased there. Boateng perhaps, but meh. Marcello would have been a good one if they didn't get that 7-1 spanking. I could live with putting Rojo there, Robben certainly had a tough time against Argentina's defense.

[ashersky]

Some sour grapes from the Dutch here:

The Netherlands midfielder missed in a 4-2 shoot-out defeat and accused the South Americans of a lack of ambition during their road to the final on Wednesday night

Wesley Sneijder is convinced Argentina were content to play for penalties after Netherlands were knocked out of the World Cup semi-finals 4-2 on spot-kicks.

Neither side could break the deadlock over 120 minutes of action, with Arjen Robben denied by a last-ditch tackle from Javier Mascherano, before Rodrigo Palacio and Maxi Rodriguez went close for the Albiceleste.

That mean the lottery of a penalty shoot-out, where Sergio Romero saved from Sneijder and defender Ron Vlaar for Argentina to clinch a place in the World Cup final, much to the dismay of the Galatasaray midfielder.

"We deserved more," the 30-year-old insisted.

"Argentina gambled on deciding the game on penalties, while we always tried to win. I missed my penalty, I am sorry, but we could also have scored one of our opportunities in the 120 minutes."

Dirk Kuyt was in similarly despondent mood after the game and in no mood to congratulate Argentina on their victory, claiming he was not impressed with Alejandro Sabella's side.

"Argentina have not impressed, despite having players the calibre of [Lionel] Messi," he added.

"We have expressed a great defensive game, but we did struggle to find [Arjen] Robben and [Robin] Van Persie.

"I'm disappointed, we came so close to reaching a second successive final."

Netherlands face Brazil in the third place play-off on Saturday as they bid to round off the competition on a high note.

[Teproc]

Yeah, it's not like they tried a lot more than Argentina... Kuyt was doing some stuff early on but when he was moved to the left side he started playing backwards like everyone else.

[soulnet]

Yeah, it's not like they tried a lot more than Argentina... Kuyt was doing some stuff early on but when he was moved to the left side he started playing backwards like everyone else.

I mean, a tie (if possible) would have probably been deserved, given that there were no huge advantages. Public declaration is never a football player strong suit, especially right after a game, especially when the game is long and tense, and especially if you are on the loosing end. Luckily, I did not hear Argentinians saying we sooo deserved to win that what happened in the penalties was only fair, or anything stupid like that.

Regardless, Argentina had a bit more clear situations, more shots on goal, more corner kicks and subbed in two forwards ! How can someone say that is trying to go to penalties?

I think the feeling for the second half of the overtime or so may have truly been that, but it looked like the Dutch had a lot more energy left than the Argentinians. Argentinian players always seem to have a physical disadvantage. I don't get this, given that nowadays almost all of them train in the same European teams from an early age. Maybe there is some extreme early-age development of PE that we have wrong here.

[Davio]

The players were obviously emotional as they felt they had a decent chance to go through, it's not that often that you can get that close. Robben was at least very sportive and proud of the team, despite being clearly disappointed.

To be honest, the best chances were for Argentina, with Higuin's slider just past the post and into the wrong side of the net, the soft header by (don't remember) and the volley by Maxi Rodriguez.

I don't think Argentina gambled on the penalty shootout. They did play more defensively in the end, but maybe they were just tired and Netherlands was building up some pressure, so I don't blame them for holding out.

I also think a lot of nuance is lost in translation here. I saw the interviews in Dutch and the players were disappointed for sure, but not very arrogant.

[soulnet]

I also think a lot of nuance is lost in translation here. I saw the interviews in Dutch and the players were disappointed for sure, but not very arrogant.

That's good to know.

[Davio]

I also think a lot of nuance is lost in translation here. I saw the interviews in Dutch and the players were disappointed for sure, but not very arrogant.

That's good to know.

Well, just put yourself in their shoes, you just suffered a heartbreaking penalty shootout not 5 minutes ago, get pulled in front of the camera and have to say something about the game. It's not like we don't wish Argentina the best of luck in the final, we just wanted to be there ourselves very badly!

[soulnet]

Well, just put yourself in their shoes, you just suffered a heartbreaking penalty shootout not 5 minutes ago, get pulled in front of the camera and have to say something about the game. It's not like we don't wish Argentina the best of luck in the final, we just wanted to be there ourselves very badly!

I know. I have been badly disappointed after playing some official basketball game myself, and it was only Argentinian 3rd division. What I do no understand is why do they put these people, winners or losers, that never say anything interesting and most times just embarrass themselves, in front of a camera.

Unrelated fun fact: Today's trend in Argentina is using Mascherano as a Chuck-Norris like character in memes and twits. A particularly fun one is that they can send him to negotiate with NML Capital and he will get some change back to Argentina.

[hvb]

My World Cup 11 (not looking too strictly at their positions):

Neuer
Lahm - Hummels - Vlaar - Blind
Neymar - Mascherano - Müller - J. Rodriguez
Robben - Messi


I think Vlaar really played a terrific and solid World Cup, it was sad to have him miss the first penalty. Neuer is not necessarily the best goalkeeper (I think it's close with Navas, Ochoa and perhaps Howard), but he is super solid. Hummels has been quite important and Blind I don't known, could put Boateng here I guess..

Messi hasn't been stellar, but he has been important and that's good enough.

This is my World Cup 11 so far:

Navas
Boateng - Hummels - Thiago Silva - van Buyten
Mascherano- James - Cuadrado
Robben - Benzema - Neymar

Bench: Neuer - Sokratis, Maza, Garay, Vlaar - de Jong, Valbuena, di Maria- Müller, Messi, Alexis Sanchez

[soulnet]

This is my top 11/22, though I am not including players that did not make it to the quarterfinals (mainly because I have not seen enough of them), and I am giving more weight to more important/recent matches. Still missing a 4 for the bench. I am so sad about Maicon and Dani Alves playing horribly in the cup, they are both great players overall.

Navas

Boateng, Vraal Vlaar, Thiago Silva, Evra

Khedira, Mascherano, Kroos

Robben, Messi, James Rodriguez

Bench: Neuer, Garay, David Luiz, Hummels, Rojo, Valbuena, Muller, Cuadrado, Di Maria, Neymar, Campbell

[ipofanes]

You mean Vlaar? He is pronounced "vla" by German commentators.

Khedira had a weak performance against Ghana. Kroos was more consistent.

[soulnet]

Really cool video (I had to post it before Sunday):

[MarkowKette]

 my World Cup Allstars looks like this

Neuer
Höwedes - Hummels - Thiago Silva - Varane
Mascherano- Kroos - Cuadrado
Robben - Messi - Neymar

Bench: (Navas/Ochoa) - Lahm , Rojo , Van buyten, Vlaar - Valbuena, Khedira, James Rodriguez, Müller - Benzema, Alexis Sanchez