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[liopoil]

I don't really like either the ichimaru or lekkit lynches. lekkit feels like the archetype mislynch in toy story - heavy lurking but doesn't indicate alignment. In regard to ichimaru, we've had many new players over the games who have emphasized their newbieness and also have done some of the classic scummy things people are talking about. again, I'm not seeing how it indicates alignment.

This is true to a point. But I feel like in both situations the frustrating for me has been the unwillingness of people to even explore the lynch as a possibility... like today (and yesterday) to an extent as well has seen an extreme absence of wagon building... today's biggest wagon was what? three people?

I am not suggesting that we need to get a bunch of players to L-1, but rather that part of building to a lynch is gauging reactions to that sort of pressure (and I am not talking about just voting for pressure, but voting because of something scummy and then seeing where the wagon leads), but that hasn't happened today, people have been so hesitant to vote, but rather have been very quick to dismiss potential wagons from the get-go. Why? Obviously this can't all be mafia because nearly everyone is doing it to an extent. Instead people have voted and then sat on that vote all by their lonesomes all day long...

Is this something that mafia would be more prone to do? Again I am sure there are town examples of this because multiple players are doing it, but is this an area where mafia is more likely to be? I kinda feel like I am grasping at straws and that this is just a day1 all over again...

I don't see what this has to do with my post... yes I sort of dismissed both of those lynches, but I'm not going to vote for people I don't suspect...

So I think that's all I could find about teproc, and so it's not much. However, yuma's point about that one post is enough for him to be a better lynch than most other people, so he goes sort of in between 'want to lynch' and 'not opposed to lynching'.

Pretty much I want to lynch from the pool of ash, robz, chairs, and teproc. The farther to the left, the more I prefer to lynch them.

Now, yuma has a decent point about getting more wagons going, so I'll Vote: Robz888 to see if there's more support for it that ashersky.

[2.71828.....]

I am too tired (travel+long night last night+travel back home) to really go back through and get more reactions from what has transpired since I was on last, but I will be available a majority of tomorrow, but not right at the deadline.  I should be on up until around 4:00-4:30 or a little longer if a bunch of stuff is happening.  I have company coming over for dinner and will need to be getting ready for them.  I will get on first thing in the morning to get my reads.

[Ichimaru Gin]

I'm going to be working tomorrow in the morning. But I should be around at least a couple hours before the deadline--and up until the deadline, to see where the various wagons are and change my vote if needed.
I'm willing to vote: Ash, Teproc, Lekkit--possibly chairs, but I don't think that's happening.

[ashersky]

vote: Robz

That's 3 on Robz and 4 on Teproc.  2 on ashersky.

[Robz888]

I don't really like either the ichimaru or lekkit lynches. lekkit feels like the archetype mislynch in toy story - heavy lurking but doesn't indicate alignment. In regard to ichimaru, we've had many new players over the games who have emphasized their newbieness and also have done some of the classic scummy things people are talking about. again, I'm not seeing how it indicates alignment.

This is true to a point. But I feel like in both situations the frustrating for me has been the unwillingness of people to even explore the lynch as a possibility... like today (and yesterday) to an extent as well has seen an extreme absence of wagon building... today's biggest wagon was what? three people?

I am not suggesting that we need to get a bunch of players to L-1, but rather that part of building to a lynch is gauging reactions to that sort of pressure (and I am not talking about just voting for pressure, but voting because of something scummy and then seeing where the wagon leads), but that hasn't happened today, people have been so hesitant to vote, but rather have been very quick to dismiss potential wagons from the get-go. Why? Obviously this can't all be mafia because nearly everyone is doing it to an extent. Instead people have voted and then sat on that vote all by their lonesomes all day long...

Is this something that mafia would be more prone to do? Again I am sure there are town examples of this because multiple players are doing it, but is this an area where mafia is more likely to be? I kinda feel like I am grasping at straws and that this is just a day1 all over again...

I don't see what this has to do with my post... yes I sort of dismissed both of those lynches, but I'm not going to vote for people I don't suspect...

So I think that's all I could find about teproc, and so it's not much. However, yuma's point about that one post is enough for him to be a better lynch than most other people, so he goes sort of in between 'want to lynch' and 'not opposed to lynching'.

Pretty much I want to lynch from the pool of ash, robz, chairs, and teproc. The farther to the left, the more I prefer to lynch them.

Now, yuma has a decent point about getting more wagons going, so I'll Vote: Robz888 to see if there's more support for it that ashersky.

I see that you've said a couple times that you like my lynch. Have you ever said why? I know why ash wants to lynch me; he wants to lynch everyone who calls him out.

[ashersky]

I see that you've said a couple times that you like my lynch. Have you ever said why? I know why ash wants to lynch me; he wants to lynch everyone who calls him out.

What, exactly, have you called me out for?  I've done nothing to be called out for.  Basically all I've done this game is have a wrong read on Faust.  If that makes me scum, then everyone to ever play forum mafia ever is scum, because no one has ever been right 100% of the time.

This is classic lazyscumrobz pushing the easy mislynch.  You do it all the time, especially when you've got a stagnant game where it's easily brushed off the next day as a necessity lynch.

[Robz888]

I see that you've said a couple times that you like my lynch. Have you ever said why? I know why ash wants to lynch me; he wants to lynch everyone who calls him out.

What, exactly, have you called me out for?  I've done nothing to be called out for.  Basically all I've done this game is have a wrong read on Faust.  If that makes me scum, then everyone to ever play forum mafia ever is scum, because no one has ever been right 100% of the time.

This is classic lazyscumrobz pushing the easy mislynch.  You do it all the time, especially when you've got a stagnant game where it's easily brushed off the next day as a necessity lynch.

No, I'm just not letting you get away with this again. You've fooled me before with your whole routine--where you essentially act too scummy to be scum, and badly formed, weirdly strong reads are part of it--and I'm just not falling for it this time. And you are coming after the two people calling you out for it, me and Voltaire, because that's part of your whole attempt, too.

This all started not because you had a wrong read on faust, but because you had an indefensible read. It didn't make you seem scummy until it 1) turned out wrong, and 2) you couldn't explain what caused it without defaulting to the reason everyone else had given for lynching faust, AFTER your 100% read.

That's my case on you. No, you're not the easy mislynch. How could you be--your lynch isn't easy, like no one is in favor of it and it doesn't even look like it's going through.

I know town ashersky does some legit crazy stuff, but I know that scum ashersky knows that too, and you've been caught faking before, and this is exactly that.

[Robz888]

I totally got you, and you know it, and your partners know it too, which is why this isn't going anywhere.

[ashersky]

I totally got you, and you know it, and your partners know it too, which is why this isn't going anywhere.

This is going in my signature line, after this game is over.

[Teproc]

I don't think I relied on WIFOM at all in my response to Ichimaru. I said his post made good points about how my behaviour kn o could be seen as scummy, even though I know his case to be wrong. I'm not buddying him by any stretch of the imagination, I'm just observing this because I believe it makes him more likely to be town.

I'll be around tonight and should be able to finish rereading afew hours before deadline.

[Lekkit]

My reads haven't changed that much since the 23rd. I'm more willing to lynch ashersky now than before, but that's about it. I get the feeling that he doesn't really want to find scum, but he seems kind of willing to stay in the game.

One thing I'm concerned about is the Teproc thing. I haven't really understood the case on him. I'll look into that today.

[Robz888]

My reads haven't changed that much since the 23rd. I'm more willing to lynch ashersky now than before, but that's about it. I get the feeling that he doesn't really want to find scum, but he seems kind of willing to stay in the game.

One thing I'm concerned about is the Teproc thing. I haven't really understood the case on him. I'll look into that today.

We're running out of time, so if you are getting more willing to lynch ash I would encourage you to actually vote for him.

[Lekkit]

Rereading the day quickly has made me realize that I don't really support the Teproc lynch. Also I'm not entirely sold on the Robz lynch. I really prefer ash over Robz or Teproc. Vote: ashersky

[yuma]

Sorry guys I had planned on having a bit more time, but woke up late and need to run to catch the bus. I see from the whole ~ 7 posts since last night nothing has really changed, teproc is still the best lynch most likely to go through so I am leaving my vote there.

[ashersky]

Sorry guys I had planned on having a bit more time, but woke up late and need to run to catch the bus. I see from the whole ~ 7 posts since last night nothing has really changed, teproc is still the best lynch most likely to go through so I am leaving my vote there.

Vote Robz, man.  Always a safe bet.

[liopoil]

Now, yuma has a decent point about getting more wagons going, so I'll Vote: Robz888 to see if there's more support for it that ashersky.

I see that you've said a couple times that you like my lynch. Have you ever said why? I know why ash wants to lynch me; he wants to lynch everyone who calls him out.

Well, there's this, which was my initial reason for suspecting you:

Ashersky: Still my preference, I've said repeatedly that I think having a ridiculous read on faust was his scum strategy that backfired after faust committed game suicide on Day 1. The fact that practically no one else likes this case as much as I do makes me especially confident in it. But, you know, this is the sort of thing town ash COULD have done, unfortunately.

Liopoil: I know what the case is now. Basically, it's that he's pretty much a lurker until called out, and then he actually does work sort of hard to not be a lurkers (harder than, say, Eevee in this game for example). I guess that's fairly scummy. Like ash, it could just be the case that this is how lio just is.

I find both of these suspicious. Both are disclaimed at the end saying that it might be town!ash or town!lio. ash first:

I agree with the case on ashersky, and I don't think I'm voting for him. I should be. Vote: Ashersky. anyway, the bit that makes me suspicious of robz is that he says it could be town!ash. town!robz is always fairly sure that this is town ash when he does the town ash thing. I can pull quotes from multiple games if necessary. Should ash flip town, I think it really makes robz suspicious.

I really find it weird that robz isn't totally sold on the reason for suspecting me like he was before. Reads to me like it was an attempt to get me mislynched yesterday, but today there's more viable mislynches like ashersky. I remember he sort of did that in the B2B game that got reset, so when robz was scum and I was still town.

So I'm thinking that most likely one of robz and ashersky is scum, but ashersky is still more likely.

and then e added this, some of which I agree with:
 

In fact, Robz? Here is some stuff on him- Opens up the liopoil case that "scum!lio struggles early but plays better late."  Gets a bunch of sheep.  He originally gives slight credence to my Faust case, but then is turned off the case by Ashersky.  He throws out his vote for sale here saying he is concerned about a bad D1.  Jumps to Lekkit for a lurker lynch temporarily before realizing Lekkit wasn't really lurking just posting less frequently but still with content, then moves to Eevee as his lurker lynch after I point out that Eevee is more of a lurker.  Throws his vote out for sale again.  Has the whole episode of "wait no one post info about the setup because it might help scum!faust with a fakeclaim." (starting here)  He then jumps onto the little wagon against me for a bit here before Faust reveals that he was lying about his fakeclaim.  Robz then ends the day with his vote on me, after unvoting Faust to avoid ending the day before some people could comment.  I recognize his "D1s are famously lacksadaisical" (to quote Ash from BM14 since he put it so nicely in the role PM) but putting his vote up for sale? twice?  His D2 has not been great but no one has really stood out too much as being amazing, and I think he can probably (safely) trust that his meta will carry him through and avoid a lynch.

So this has been long and winding and a bunch of people posted while I was typing this, but I think it lands me at vote: Robz.  I am not comfortable with the way he went through D1, and he has not done anything today to shake that feeling.

I see lekkit voted for ash, and with my vote, that would be 4 people... are there two more who would vote for ash? at this point I really prefer that over robz.

oh, and CHAIRS! how did that get forgotten. We should lynch chairs if we can't get ashersky. maybe over robz even.

teproc is behind all three of those above. I'll vote there to get a lynch, but I think we can get a better one.

[liopoil]

I guess vote: ashersky for now

it'd be nice if we could get vote counts fairly regularly as we approach the deadline in a bit over 8 hours.

[liopoil]

Vote Count 2.lio

ashersky (4): Robz, Voltaire, Lekkit, Liopoil [L-2]
Robz888 (2): 2.7..., ashersky
Teproc (4): Ichimaru Gin, chairs, mail-mi, yuma [L-2]

Not Voting (1): teproc

Deadline: Thursday, January 2nd at 6 pm. To account for holidays

[liopoil]

e, which lynch do you prefer, ashersky or teproc? Not that you necessarily need to choose one now (I think there is still time for a third wagon to emerge), but at the end that's what it could come down to, if ash and teproc vote for each other in an attempt to save themselves.

too soon to say anything now, but just by that vote count, it looks plausible that we've caught two scum.

[Voltaire]

I don't really like either the ichimaru or lekkit lynches. lekkit feels like the archetype mislynch in toy story - heavy lurking but doesn't indicate alignment. In regard to ichimaru, we've had many new players over the games who have emphasized their newbieness and also have done some of the classic scummy things people are talking about. again, I'm not seeing how it indicates alignment.

Would much rather lynch ash or robz. teproc, eh, maybe, I need to look at whatever the case on him is closer.

So I am currently ^this if it read "lynch ash, maybe teproc, not robz" but I agree with the opinions about ichi and lekki. Actually, I want to go back and look at the ichi voters. That's one hell of a scummy wagon.

[2.71828.....]

e, which lynch do you prefer, ashersky or teproc? Not that you necessarily need to choose one now (I think there is still time for a third wagon to emerge), but at the end that's what it could come down to, if ash and teproc vote for each other in an attempt to save themselves.

too soon to say anything now, but just by that vote count, it looks plausible that we've caught two scum.

Right now I lean on the side of lynching Ash (between those two).  Although, I agree with you from a few posts ago when you mention lynching chairs.  I do think that he could very well be scum.  In my last reads post I put Ash over chairs in my order of lynching, but after thinking some more I would prefer  Robz>=Chairs>>Ashersky.  Have to head in to work for a bit, but will be back at least by 1-2pm.  I will leave my vote where it is for now because I definitely don't want to put someone like Ash at L-1 yet. 

[Voltaire]

vote: Robz

That's 3 on Robz and 4 on Teproc.  2 on ashersky.

Subtle.

[liopoil]

Have to head in to work for a bit, but will be back at least by 1-2pm.  I will leave my vote where it is for now because I definitely don't want to put someone like Ash at L-1 yet. 

for once I have no problem putting people at L-1, because we are near the deadline and we need to deal with potential claims.

[Voltaire]

I will be around for the deadline starting at least half an hour beforehand, if not more.

[mcmcsalot]

Vote Count 2.6

ashersky (4): Robz, Voltaire, Lekkit, Liopoil
Robz888 (2): 2.7..., ashersky
Teproc (4): Ichimaru Gin, chairs, mail-mi, yuma

Not Voting (1): teproc

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.

Deadline: Thursday, January 2nd at 6 pm. To account for holidays