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Author Topic: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs(Town wins!)  (Read 202102 times)

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EFHW

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #900 on: December 18, 2013, 06:49:02 pm »

I'll be back in ~30 min
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Teproc

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #901 on: December 18, 2013, 06:53:28 pm »

I guess it depends on what Robz was asking you... mafiascum is still down, if that matters
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #902 on: December 18, 2013, 07:00:22 pm »

I wanted to make sure my line of inquiry against faust, which relies on a web page being down, is legal, though I assume it is.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #903 on: December 18, 2013, 07:06:37 pm »

I wanted to make sure my line of inquiry against faust, which relies on a web page being down, is legal, though I assume it is.

I personally think it is legal, but am not fully comfortable with it.

This is because I think full setups should be included in the game f.ds thread itself... PMs, details, everything, but that is just a personal preference... I mean... there isn't a rule about withholding information that isn't already given... so I guess there shouldn't be anything wrong with it, but I would encourage future mods to put full setup info--or at least quite a bit of it--into the second page of the thread beforehand (again just a suggestion, not a requirement)
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Lekkit

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #904 on: December 18, 2013, 07:08:03 pm »

I leave you guys alone for a couple of hours and claims and stuff happens. I'm actually happy I left my vote on faust. I'm off for the night. One thing to note is that it's really werid for faust to claim and then just disappear. There's no way you'd do that. Regardless of the honesty of the claim. Especially if you thought you were going to get lynched.

Also, I agree with yuma regarding the mafiascum wiki thing.
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Teproc

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #905 on: December 18, 2013, 07:09:22 pm »

He specifically said in his claim that he was doing it now because he didn't want to be lynched with no chance to respond during the night, which happened to him in both GoT and Toy Story.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #906 on: December 18, 2013, 07:11:45 pm »

I am going to withhold judgement on faust until/if we hear from him. I will not be online during the deadline. I will be at work and unable to post, so hopefully we will hear from him soon.

i will get online before leaving for work--something I generally don't, but I'll get up early just for you guys...

I think I am still comfortable with my vote on 2.7, but want to go through my list of people not excluded from my town list.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #907 on: December 18, 2013, 07:17:16 pm »

and your point is?

it was only semi-serious.

then why mention it at all? the fact that you mentioned it means that you felt it serious enough to include it.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #908 on: December 18, 2013, 07:19:12 pm »

11. 2.7 - 10

but I wouldn't vote for anyone that's below 25, which is yuma, me and 2.7.

If this hasn't been explained I would love one. That is an extremely strong town read if I am to believe your numbers... what is that all about?
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yuma

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #909 on: December 18, 2013, 07:20:34 pm »


Sorry, yuma.  I got in trouble at work so I can't work-post as much anymore, and my live-in ladyfriend is still... awkward, when it comes to having me-doing-my-stuff time.  I'm used to a schedule that I haven't been able to really find again because she wants to, you know, actually have me pay attention to her.  Silly, I know!

don't get in trouble at work or with the ladyfriends, just let us know (in advance preferably!)
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yuma

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #910 on: December 18, 2013, 07:22:49 pm »

Is what 2.7 is doing pro-town ? Figuring out who is lynchable is very valuable to scum. I guess it can be pro-town when we're close to deadline but confirmation bias makes me find it scummy, so I'd like to know what others think.

it is pro-town, but that doesn't make him town. Compiling data the way he is is certainly something scum can do to make themselves look useful and productive. People don't often want to lynch the guy doing all the heavy lifting... and for good reason. It does make me hesitant to lynch him because I know I am not going to be able to do all of that work that he is doing.

There is certainly a town narrative for him doing it as well I should add... he compiled similar data in toy story as town.
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EFHW

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #911 on: December 18, 2013, 07:32:51 pm »

The Day 1 deadline is now 2:20 pm December 19th (instead of 2)  This is so one of us can be present to lock the thread.
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EFHW

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #912 on: December 18, 2013, 07:37:57 pm »

I wanted to make sure my line of inquiry against faust, which relies on a web page being down, is legal, though I assume it is.

That's an interesting question.  I'm sorry, but I don't think I can clarify that issue.  I can consult a more experienced mod if you would like.
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EFHW

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #913 on: December 18, 2013, 07:53:38 pm »

Ok, since the most experienced mods are already playing the game, and Archetype is not around, I looked at the rules and thought about this some more.  1.  The wiki outage affects everyone.  2.  Players are under no obligation to share information they might have.  3.  Guaranteed access to the wiki is not part of the game.  So continue as you are.  If there are issues I haven't considered, I'm willing to revisit the issue.
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liopoil

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #914 on: December 18, 2013, 08:12:17 pm »

faust was active again at 17:22 forum time...

I'll go ahead and Vote: faust now. Worst case scenario his explanation is good and I unvote, so yeah, why not vote now.
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Eevee

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #915 on: December 18, 2013, 08:22:32 pm »

Okay, so the wiki being offline really sucks and honesty I'd prefer if someone just posted all the info. The current situation just feels very unfair to scum.

However, while faust's inactivity could be real life-infused, it clearly is scummy here. I approve of the lynch, all the while knowing my jumping on the wagon will look suspicious to some.

Holding off voting until faust gets a chance to react, because I'll surely be on before the deadline, so why not.

/kickball
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liopoil

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #916 on: December 18, 2013, 08:28:24 pm »

/kickball
?

I know about ehunt's kickball moment thing, but what does this mean?
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ashersky

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #917 on: December 18, 2013, 08:40:39 pm »

/kickball
?

I know about ehunt's kickball moment thing, but what does this mean?

I think it means Eevee is drunk.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #918 on: December 18, 2013, 08:58:23 pm »

Ok, I am not going to have as much time to spend on this as I thought, but will do my best on it specifically focusing on the first four (as well as faust)

From this point I want to try to find scummier players out of: liopoil, eevee, 2.7 and mail-mi and maybe faust, lekkit.

liopoil: started off really slow, picked up the pace after hitting L-2 for lurking. People have said his response was townie? What was townie about it. He started posting to save his own hide. At most that is a null tell and worst a scumtell. I still think that he remained calm and composed indicates kinda scumminess... has anyone checked how he responded in moderncommunity (I haven't yet)... but realize he has a valid point in explaining why he did.... His votes have also felt very self preserving (once he voted) and he doesn't really give reads (he does give some town reads, voltaire for example) until he gives the % post after ash calls everyone out for not doing it (once again, only doing something after being called out) and is mostly defending himself when he does come back

eevee: less posting than liopoil lately, pretty even a while back though, so while liopoil amped up his posting eevee has just kinda maintained the status quo. He was one player I thought started off with the PoE way too early and really hasn't done so since then. Interesting! There is nothing here. Nothing, especially of late he said he chimed in everytime he thought he had something to offer, but I dont' believe that. town!Eevee has more to say on these subjects. Based off this I would vote for eevee before I would vote for liopoil vote: eevee

2.7: up until now I was voting for him. The main point against him was that he lurked until called out and then majorily amped up his posting. And not just a bit like liopoil, but by a lot! If he is scum that takes a tremendous effort and had it happened before being called out would have been worthy of being taken off the potential lynch list. Other stuff he has done has been weird: sheeping ashersky in a way, voting for chairs recently, voting and unvoting lekkit a few days ago. So there is stuff I am concerned about here, but I am beginning to think that his substance and posting will help us learn his alignment better on a later day. This does set a precident for scum, if he is scum. if you are called out for lurking and triple or quadruple your posts afterward you probably won't get lynched... I am fine with this sort of a precident and don't think scum will successfully be able to get away with it. If 2.7 is scum, I am impressed.

mail-mi: only a few more posts than eevee: Also started PoEing too early I think, but has posted similar posts throughout the thread.... Pretty typical mail-mi early on. I am not sure what voltaire was pinpointing as being different. This isn't to say that mail-mi looks town, but rather that that last few times he has been scum he looked the same as when he was town and by that I mean, willing to vote just about anybody that came up for a lynch, sheepy, lurky and just plain old scummy (his bias/stats post especially and voting for chairs just after 2.7 did)

I am not going to look at lekkit right now. Instead I'll look at faust:

faust: (note that this doesn't include talking about his claim or posts postclaim only stuff before), I'll talk more about his claim stuff if/when after he responds to the questions pending for him... was very active early, but has tapered off into the late game. if I remember correctly I pointed this out about him in GoT and started a wagon on him because of it. I still think it is a scummier trait, but since that sample didn't indicate he was scum I am not sure it is in regard to him.... Again I just don't see the significance of what ash pointed out in the early game.... (does this change with his claim, that I guess is something to think about, but again I'll look at that later), also had the early PoE thing going on, but has also continued to post in similar manner throughout... He reads ash as scum, something I am beginning to disagree with more and more (and hope that he doesn't shoot ash if he is town and is lynched). His whole day really has been focused on conversing with ash and 2.7 and is kinda hard to get a read on...

Conclusion:

2.7 and Lekkit I think are out of my lynch pool. Faust is back in it (w/o the claim at least). I think I prefer eevee over mail-mi over liopoil. and I will continue to vote: eevee. w/o faust's claim I think I would put faust between mail-mi and liopoil... with it... I am not sure.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #919 on: December 18, 2013, 09:03:48 pm »

Vote count yuma.1
2.7... (1): Teproc
mail-mi (2): Voltaire, faust
Eevee (2): Robz888, yuma
liopoil (4): Eevee, chairs, Ichimaru Gin, mail-mi
faust (4): ashersky, Lekkit, 2.7, liopoil

Not Voting (0):

An official vote count would be nice!
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liopoil

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #920 on: December 18, 2013, 09:07:55 pm »

oh, I will not be online at deadline either! my last check in will be tomorrow morning,  maybe also at noon, but if I check in at noon, all I'll have time to do is move my vote if necessary. If we aren't lynching faust for some reason, then I suspect we will be lynching eevee or mail-mi or myself. I will be voting eevee over mail-mi, and mail-mi over myself should this happen.
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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #921 on: December 18, 2013, 09:17:46 pm »

I think earlier yuma thought the time I started doing PoE was the first non-too early time. Quite whatever on that though, could be interpreted as yuma trying to paint me as scummy, though.
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ashersky

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #922 on: December 18, 2013, 09:24:34 pm »

The Day 1 deadline is now 2:20 pm December 19th (instead of 2)  This is so one of us can be present to lock the thread.

That's 6:20 a.m. here, so I probably will NOT be around for deadline, and definitely not the hours leading up to deadline.  Just FYIing everyone on the time zone issue.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #923 on: December 18, 2013, 09:25:49 pm »

Ok, went and looked at lio in moderncommunity and thought I would also look and see if eevee got pressure for lurking in GoT and toystory

so liopoil:

he lurked pretty heavily there... at one point he was 300 post behind and I think he did respond more aggressively....

Yes, my latest posts are defensive, because I am defending myself. What did you expect?? Defending myself isn't scummy, if that's what you're saying. I've heavily defended myself every game I've had a wagon on me in, which is like, all of them.

IIRC, mcmc didn't start posting more in KCGM when he got accused... he lurked the whole way.

and you say "so in the end, liopoil looks a little more scummy to me". Which of shraeye's/robz's/dsell's bad points are you agreeing with?

Dsell, that's not all I've contributed. I had that thing with EFHW's case on mcmc, I defended nkirbit a bit... look, I don't have a TON of content, but it's more than a lot of other people. And I don't know about saying it in a lot of words, I'm just saying what I have to say. And I was  gone when a lot of stuff happened!

and you may think my case is weak, but it isn't total crap - IIRC voltaire and TA agreed with it. So I'm not just making stuff up.

As for trying to blend in D1, look at what I did with the secondary wincon thing! I think town is much more likely to jump in saying "I've got a secondary wincon" when it isn't known that everyone does.

faust is right, I really should put a vote down. Well, when it comes down to it, I'm willing to vote for anyone to save myself, simply because I know I'm town and I don't know anyone else's alignment. I'll be around at the deadline, and will also hopefully look at some other people and find someone I actually want to lynch, and am not just trying to save myself.

liopoil - first to dive into secondary win-con.  i disagree with 'getting it out of the way'.  just ignore it, and focus on the game, which will be tough enough with our large numbers.  wordy explanation that basically adds nothing new to the Galz-discussion, behind which he hides his vote; that be scummy.  says that we shouldn't think too much of the lurking arguments, but IS interested in lynching mcmcs for lurking.  I don't like this stance at all.  Hiding behind Voltgloss's list; trying to attack EFHW's day1 case for 'stretching'.
Look, if I can get the secondary win, why not do it? I really doubt it had much of any effect on the real game. I'd rather do it then than in the middle of D6 while massclaiming or something.

NOTHING NEW to the galz discussion?? Nonsense. At the time everyone was just talking about how he wasn't leading town. My post had only things that hadn't been mentioned yet.

I am potentially willing to lynch mcmc for lurking, yes, but am far from sold that it's the best lynch. Don't see what's wrong with this.

Hiding behind VG's list? I assume this is the same thing as robz. look, that was a POST COUNT. I was not voiceing ANY of my personal beliefs in that post!

yeah, I didn't like EFHW's case. because it was bad. so?

So I think I stand by my belief that town lio reacts more aggressively toward pressure while scum lio keeps his cool as lio was town in this game...

Eevee I dont' think received any pressure Toy Story early... yeah he had one vote the whole game...

GoT.... received one vote for lurking, but no heavy pressure day1... so can't really glean anything from this....
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yuma

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Re: Mafia XXXVI: Dynasty Warriors Mafia 2 The Battle of Red Cliffs
« Reply #924 on: December 18, 2013, 09:27:23 pm »

I think earlier yuma thought the time I started doing PoE was the first non-too early time. Quite whatever on that though, could be interpreted as yuma trying to paint me as scummy, though.

I did say that, I had forgotten in the context of reading your post alone. But I dont' think it really changes how I feel about you... that the one post I noticed of yours was a PoE midday and since then and before then kinda nothing....
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