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Author Topic: Northern Lands - Viking  (Read 9814 times)

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maduka

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Re: Northern Lands - Viking
« Reply #25 on: November 05, 2013, 02:12:05 pm »
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that what i meent earlyer.. what if there where no attack cards. then this card only does the first thing.

and yes thats probobly a hole new difrent card.

needs some thinking about thats 4 sure :D
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Minotaur

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Re: Northern Lands - Viking
« Reply #26 on: November 05, 2013, 02:14:14 pm »
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true.. could be that it searchd the deck also until it found an attack to play.. but then its more like 100% chance that it will get playd..
so play an attack from hand sounds best. then we just need to hope there will be an attack card in the supply :D

You could have a card that searches for and plays an Attack card, but that's more like an improved Sage before you even add anything else to it. If all it did was that, it'd probably be worth at least 4. If you wanted to have something like that with a bonus, it would probably have to cost more and the bonus probably shouldn't be that strong. We're probably talking about a totally new card at this point.

What if there are no attacks in the kingdom?

Free deck shuffle.
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Storyteller/Crown is Donald's Vietnam Watergate.  Alchemy is Donald's Vietnam.  Scout is the time Donald choked on a pretzel.

Minotaur

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Re: Northern Lands - Viking
« Reply #27 on: November 05, 2013, 02:16:57 pm »
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that what i meent earlyer.. what if there where no attack cards. then this card only does the first thing.

and yes thats probobly a hole new difrent card.

needs some thinking about thats 4 sure :D

Oh, right. Hmmm. Yeah, that card would be really bad without attack cards out there. Your v.2 doesn't have that problem.

If I were playing house rules, I would never allow that kind of Kingdom in the first place, but I can understand why it's a good design rule generally. Before you know it, cards only affect Kobolds and you're playing Magic: The Gathering...
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maduka

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Re: Northern Lands - Viking
« Reply #28 on: November 05, 2013, 02:26:38 pm »
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i guess this is my brain taking me on a walkabout. couse now im pritty sure ive mixed up the cards we are talking about..
kinda typical me. but there are no attack on viking conquest. in that case it can be solved with play another action. to get the bonus. so if you dont have a hand with action or draw a new action then its buy buy duration...

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Minotaur

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Re: Northern Lands - Viking
« Reply #29 on: November 05, 2013, 02:34:00 pm »
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i guess this is my brain taking me on a walkabout. couse now im pritty sure ive mixed up the cards we are talking about..
kinda typical me. but there are no attack on viking conquest. in that case it can be solved with play another action. to get the bonus. so if you dont have a hand with action or draw a new action then its buy buy duration...

Oh, true enough. It's possible to whiff that too, probably will happen at least once in a game. So it can be used to justify overall card strength tweaks.

(If you did want a Sage variant for Attack cards, it could cost 3, give +1 action, and put the Attack card in hand. Then it's a 3-cost deck shuffler on other boards. Not weaker than Chancellor necessarily because of the +1 action.)
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maduka

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Re: Northern Lands - Viking
« Reply #30 on: November 05, 2013, 02:38:19 pm »
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yup :D new card is allways welcomed :D
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Minotaur

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Re: Northern Lands - Viking
« Reply #31 on: November 05, 2013, 02:50:20 pm »
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Oh. Now that I think of it, a cost of $3 for a Sage who looks for attacks would be kind of low in a Goons game, for example. The only way I can think to stabilize it is to make it cost $5 (maybe just $4) and do something a bit more. But it has to be balanced so that it's not too strong with a good Attack card on the board, but not too overly weak without one... maybe it's a lost cause.
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sudgy

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Re: Northern Lands - Viking
« Reply #32 on: November 05, 2013, 02:53:50 pm »
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Oh. Now that I think of it, a cost of $3 for a Sage who looks for attacks would be kind of low in a Goons game, for example. The only way I can think to stabilize it is to make it cost $5 (maybe just $4) and do something a bit more. But it has to be balanced so that it's not too strong with a good Attack card on the board, but not too overly weak without one... maybe it's a lost cause.

"*dig for attack* If not, some bonus."
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   Quote from: sudgy on June 31, 2011, 11:47:46 pm

Minotaur

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Re: Northern Lands - Viking
« Reply #33 on: November 05, 2013, 03:28:38 pm »
+1

Viking Conquest Version 18 Or So
Cost: 5
Action-Duration

+2 cards
You may play an Attack card from your hand
At the start of your next turn, +1 card and +1 action

(This is sort of similar to a Wharf in power either way.)

I don't know. This has gone in a lot of circles.

"*dig for attack* If not, some bonus."

I like this too. My version was of the "if there are no attacks on the board, so much other stuff is going on that it might still be worth buying this card" variety.
« Last Edit: November 05, 2013, 03:33:57 pm by Minotaur »
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ConMan

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Re: Northern Lands - Viking
« Reply #34 on: November 05, 2013, 05:24:18 pm »
+1

The easiest way to guarantee an Attack in a Kingdom is to make the card itself an Attack. In which case, you could go the Minion route and have choices. So our hypothetical card becomes:

This Card 1
Cost $?
Action - Attack
Choose one: <Attack effect>; or +1 Action and <dig for Attack>.

Possibly for maximum usefulness, give it a plain vanilla bonus no matter what you do. So depending on the attack, maybe put the +1 Action up the top. But then you lose the Duration-ness of it. Alternatively,

This Card 2
Cost $?
Action - Duration - Attack
<Attack effect>
At the start of your next turn, <dig for Attack>.

Except that it has the nasty effect of letting you essentially attack every single turn once you have two of these in your deck, which severely cripples opponents in a very un-fun way. So maybe the free-play from hand isn't too bad, and then it just becomes a second-turn Village for Attacks only:

This Card 3
Cost $?
Action - Duration - Attack
<Attack effect>
At the start of your next turn, you may play an Attack card from your hand.

I think this could be reasonably balanced - you won't always have another Attack card in hand, it's still ok without other Attacks in the kingdom (depending on the attack effect), but it does get better with any half-way decent Attack. And it might be enough to incentivise buying Attack cards that otherwise aren't quite so fantastic - even something as bad as Spy becomes like a Village.
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Warfreak2

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Re: Northern Lands - Viking
« Reply #35 on: November 06, 2013, 04:29:14 am »
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If the only attack to dig for is another copy of it, why would you dig? It has to give some other bonus besides just +1 Action for it to be worth digging.
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ConMan

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Re: Northern Lands - Viking
« Reply #36 on: November 06, 2013, 04:52:28 pm »
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If the only attack to dig for is another copy of it, why would you dig? It has to give some other bonus besides just +1 Action for it to be worth digging.
Good point. So it needs to provide a small but useful bonus when played for dig, and a decent but non-spammable attack on the other side.
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