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[2.71828.....]

help me realize more how your statement (as ridiculous as I thought that it was) can be used as a part of a plan to garner reactions and get reads from there.

I don't have a plan to garner reactions... I am just trying to get reads based off what is given. I am not all that sure what you are saying here....

Oh... I think you are talking to sudgy here... Is that right? Sorry I thought you were addressing me as you had quoted my post... It was rather confusing.

yeah, i was responding to sudgy.  didn't make it abundantly clear

[2.71828.....]

I was hoping to see more from lio/Archetype. Huge FoS to you two.

What does everyone make of the fact that, theoretically, scum should be scumhunting just as much as town yet this town is lurksville?

When it comes to scum teams, I don't experience here but there seem to be four options.
1) Player A posts, Player B lurks
2) Player A lurks, Player B posts
3) Player A and Player B post
4) Player A and Player B lurk

I really doubt (4) is going to happen, but the other three are all real options.  Since 2/3 of those options include one of the mafia lurking, I think it is fair to suspect at least one of our lurkers as mafia.  However, since they are lurking it is hard to know who it might be....

Our current "10 or fewer posts" club:
liopoil- 10
archetype- 5
sudgy- 9
gveoniz- 6
NHS- 1

Now, I realize that going strictly of the number of posts does not take into account the quality of those posts, but the numbers don't lie.

[ashersky]

I was hoping to see more from lio/Archetype. Huge FoS to you two.

What does everyone make of the fact that, theoretically, scum should be scumhunting just as much as town yet this town is lurksville?

When it comes to scum teams, I don't experience here but there seem to be four options.
1) Player A posts, Player B lurks
2) Player A lurks, Player B posts
3) Player A and Player B post
4) Player A and Player B lurk

I really doubt (4) is going to happen, but the other three are all real options.  Since 2/3 of those options include one of the mafia lurking, I think it is fair to suspect at least one of our lurkers as mafia.  However, since they are lurking it is hard to know who it might be....

Our current "10 or fewer posts" club:
liopoil- 10
archetype- 5
sudgy- 9
gveoniz- 6
NHS- 1

Now, I realize that going strictly of the number of posts does not take into account the quality of those posts, but the numbers don't lie.

And Robz888 is reborn!

[Voltgloss]

So vote: voltgloss for voting faust for finding something scummy that there should be no reason to find scummy.

Why do you say "there should be no reason to find [faust] scummy"?

[Voltgloss]

Kinda... it is more that I expect scum to be somehow involved in this whole exchange... I don't see what sudgy did to be scummy nor do I see how faust reacted to be scummy and I have more of a town read on you than voltgloss from other posts and reads.

So yeah what you said is correct to an extent, but it is more that I don't think scum ignores this situation and I see voltgloss's reaction as the one to be most likely to be from scum.

I agree with you that scum is likely involved in this exchange. 

How about the L-2 wagon on Robz?  Do you think scum was likely involved in that exchange as well? 

[Voltgloss]

I think with 4 scum in the game, all situations will likely have scum involved.

Yes.  This.

[Voltgloss]

What does everyone make of the fact that, theoretically, scum should be scumhunting just as much as town yet this town is lurksville?

I think scum may be playing defensively, being more interested in protecting each other.

[Voltgloss]

What does everyone make of the fact that, theoretically, scum should be scumhunting just as much as town yet this town is lurksville?

I think scum may be playing defensively, being more interested in protecting each other.

And by "each other" I mean each scumpair is more interested in keeping the two of them alive.  I certainly don't mean the Fire scum are interested in protecting the Ice scum or vice versa. 

[Voltgloss]

I was hoping to see more from lio/Archetype. Huge FoS to you two.

What does everyone make of the fact that, theoretically, scum should be scumhunting just as much as town yet this town is lurksville?

When it comes to scum teams, I don't experience here but there seem to be four options.
1) Player A posts, Player B lurks
2) Player A lurks, Player B posts
3) Player A and Player B post
4) Player A and Player B lurk

I really doubt (4) is going to happen, but the other three are all real options. 

(4) could absolutely happen.  We've seen entire scumteams lurk into the bottom of the post count in multiple games. 

[ashersky]

What does everyone make of the fact that, theoretically, scum should be scumhunting just as much as town yet this town is lurksville?

I think scum may be playing defensively, being more interested in protecting each other.

And by "each other" I mean each scumpair is more interested in keeping the two of them alive.  I certainly don't mean the Fire scum are interested in protecting the Ice scum or vice versa.

I think, on the bigger question from our IC, that with scum actively scumhunting, it makes it harder to pick out scum based on an individual's scumhunting.  That's because, usually, even with bussing, scum tend NOT to call out their teammates unless they make a clearly scummy mistake.  Here, they will happily pounce on others, given that they could be hitting rival scum.

It also makes wagon anaylsis and voting pattern analysis worse.  If you think about it, finding a 2-man team in a 13-player game is tough.  Team interaction is literally only two players.  So unless it is two active players, you might not see much of anything between them and it isn't odd at all.

[Robz888]

I don't really follow sudgy's plan, or much of the posturing that came out of it, but between sudgy and faust, I am quite sure sudgy is and should come off as the scummier one.

[Robz888]

Of our lurkers... NHS isn't actually a lurker, just someone who probably needs to be replaced.

Archetype is very often mislynched, and pretty lurky is town.

Sudgy is lurking and fits some scum criteria for me, so cool.

As for liopoil, I have no idea what liopoil's meta is, except I think I've seen him lurk as town but try to have good content, sort of like theorel but less extreme. Do the vets agree/disagree with me here?

Gveoniz is just getting into the game I think and I try not to lynch newbies on Day 1 without exceptionally strong reasons.

[ashersky]

I don't really follow sudgy's plan, or much of the posturing that came out of it, but between sudgy and faust, I am quite sure sudgy is and should come off as the scummier one.

Are you sure that's not just regular sudgy bias?  It's a thing now.

[ashersky]

Of our lurkers... NHS isn't actually a lurker, just someone who probably needs to be replaced.

Archetype is very often mislynched, and pretty lurky is town.

Sudgy is lurking and fits some scum criteria for me, so cool.

As for liopoil, I have no idea what liopoil's meta is, except I think I've seen him lurk as town but try to have good content, sort of like theorel but less extreme. Do the vets agree/disagree with me here?

Gveoniz is just getting into the game I think and I try not to lynch newbies on Day 1 without exceptionally strong reasons.

As someone who has been working hard to define metas, I agree that liopoil's is hard to define.

Your take matches mine though.  He's a Theolite, for sure.  A bit stronger in his wording, and shorter in his posting.  I do think he tends to lighten up a bit on his beliefs as scum.

[Robz888]

I don't really follow sudgy's plan, or much of the posturing that came out of it, but between sudgy and faust, I am quite sure sudgy is and should come off as the scummier one.

Are you sure that's not just regular sudgy bias?  It's a thing now.

I'm really really sure it's not bias, because I actually have a bias toward not wanting to lynch him, since he was lynched Day 1 in his last game. I'm voting for mail-mi because I don't believe his thing having to do with me was actually for pressure, that was a cover explanation. this further thing with faust is not like ironclad but I think it paints him scummier than faust.

[sudgy]

but what I find scummy is what I see as revisionist history concerning the post

Well, I guess I'll just have to be fine with you not agreeing with me.  I wanted it to look like it wasn't a plan at first, or else it wouldn't have worked.

Sudgy is lurking and fits some scum criteria for me, so cool.

Have you ever played with me before?  Because from you this is extremely surprising to me.

[Robz888]

Sudgy is lurking and fits some scum criteria for me, so cool.

Have you ever played with me before?  Because from you this is extremely surprising to me.

I have, and in 2 of the 3 times I can recall best, you were scum.

[sudgy]

Sudgy is lurking and fits some scum criteria for me, so cool.

Have you ever played with me before?  Because from you this is extremely surprising to me.

I have, and in 2 of the 3 times I can recall best, you were scum.

I jump around a whole bunch in post counts, regardless of alignment.  It all depends on rl factors, which I can definitely tell it is this game.  I've posted here every time I've been on.

[ashersky]

I don't really follow sudgy's plan, or much of the posturing that came out of it, but between sudgy and faust, I am quite sure sudgy is and should come off as the scummier one.

Are you sure that's not just regular sudgy bias?  It's a thing now.

I'm really really sure it's not bias, because I actually have a bias toward not wanting to lynch him, since he was lynched Day 1 in his last game. I'm voting for mail-mi because I don't believe his thing having to do with me was actually for pressure, that was a cover explanation. this further thing with faust is not like ironclad but I think it paints him scummier than faust.

Are you sure you aren't blending mail-mi and sudgy into one?

[Robz888]

I don't really follow sudgy's plan, or much of the posturing that came out of it, but between sudgy and faust, I am quite sure sudgy is and should come off as the scummier one.

Are you sure that's not just regular sudgy bias?  It's a thing now.

I'm really really sure it's not bias, because I actually have a bias toward not wanting to lynch him, since he was lynched Day 1 in his last game. I'm voting for mail-mi because I don't believe his thing having to do with me was actually for pressure, that was a cover explanation. this further thing with faust is not like ironclad but I think it paints him scummier than faust.

Are you sure you aren't blending mail-mi and sudgy into one?

Ugh, no I'm really not, I don't know why I wrote mail-mi there.

[faust]

So sudgy, you've been around, but didn't bother answering this:

I don't think what I said was scummy, but that it was controversial.

Okay then, why do you think it's scummy to react to a controversial statement?

and this:

help me realize more how your statement (as ridiculous as I thought that it was) can be used as a part of a plan to garner reactions and get reads from there.

Maybe you just don't have good answers to these questions?

[Voltgloss]

Am I right that the only time sudgy has been mafia is LOTR1?  (He was SK in Dynasty Warriors, but that's rather a different animal than the type of scum we're dealing with here.)

Robz:  I get the sense your read on sudgy is informed by your experiences with him in LOTR1.  Mine is definitely informed by my experiences with him in LOTR2, where he was town and I was scum, and he was lynched Day 1 for - among other things - voting specifically (and admittedly) for pressure reasons in order to get interactions going.  I and my scumpartners (mail-mi, shraeye) argued this was scummy and he was lynched.  We, of course, were lying.

Now, I've never read LOTR1, so perhaps you're seeing parallels there to scum!sudgy that are not obvious to me - same way as I'm seeing a parallel to town!sudgy in LOTR2 that are not obvious to you.  I'll make a deal with you:  you read LOTR2 sudgy, and I'll read LOTR1 sudgy.  Sound good?  You only have one day of activity to read while I have three, so you've got the easier end of the bargain. 

Actually, LOTR1 is probably a good game for us all to look over, being a recent multiball game with two scumteams of two players each. 

[faust]

Our current "10 or fewer posts" club:
liopoil- 10
archetype- 5
sudgy- 9
gveoniz- 6
NHS- 1

Well, saying at least one of these 5 is scum isn't really saying all that much. The expected number of scum in 5 people is 5*(4/11)=1.8 anyway, so we don't really get higher odds of hitting scum when we reduce our lynch pool to the lurkers.

[liopoil]

Apologies, I have thoughts about things, will post this afternoon

[Eevee]

Kinda... it is more that I expect scum to be somehow involved in this whole exchange... I don't see what sudgy did to be scummy nor do I see how faust reacted to be scummy and I have more of a town read on you than voltgloss from other posts and reads.

So yeah what you said is correct to an extent, but it is more that I don't think scum ignores this situation and I see voltgloss's reaction as the one to be most likely to be from scum.

I agree with you that scum is likely involved in this exchange. 

How about the L-2 wagon on Robz?  Do you think scum was likely involved in that exchange as well?

At least my vote was quite obviously a joke there. I wouldn't have let that wagon go through.