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Author Topic: Debasement  (Read 2176 times)

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Diving Pikachu

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Debasement
« on: July 01, 2013, 11:21:18 pm »
0

Debasement ($5)
Action-Attack

+$2
Each other player reveals a treasure from his hand costing from $2 to $5, and puts it on his deck (or reveals a hand with no such cards). Then each other player gains Coppers into his hand until he has 6 cards in hand.
***


Here I use "debasement" in terms of currency; ie, the lowering in quality of a coin.

Although it has an immediate effect on opponents' hands, oftentimes it won't negatively affect their next play. It usually targets Silvers, Bureaucrat-ing them and replacing them with two coppers. If the attack "misses" a $2-5 treasure, then it actually adds $1 to the opponent's hand. If the opponent has previously been the victim of a hand-reducing attack, Debasement might actually give them $3 on their next turn (but gum up their deck with a whopping 3 coppers). I guess this will be stronger against special treasures like Venture, Loan, Fools Gold, and Quarry, as the delay of their use can be more hurtful than the delay of a silver.
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RTT

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Re: Debasement
« Reply #1 on: July 02, 2013, 04:54:47 am »
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The potential of giving 6 coppers (after a torturer pin for example) is just to strong in my opinion.

You could also play militia + Debasement and then again militia and so on if you have the right engine for it.
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Warfreak2

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Re: Debasement
« Reply #2 on: July 02, 2013, 05:28:22 am »
+1

Here's a similar card from my private supply:

Recession, Action/Attack, $?
+$2
Each other player trashes a Treasure card from their hand (or reveals a hand with no Treasures), and gains a Copper in their hand.


Like most trashing attacks, it's not very strong - normally, it will just turn Copper into Copper. Like Masquerade, though, its presence is a bigger deal than its "attacking" effect: you want to keep a bunch of Coppers around so you have a defense. It's also idempotent (until the Coppers run out).
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If the only engine on the board is Procession->Conspirator, I will play it.

jbrecken

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Re: Debasement
« Reply #3 on: July 02, 2013, 10:29:25 pm »
+1

That "until" clause means that if a player has a Trader in his hand and Debasement is played on him, he can choose to move the entire Silver pile to his discard before filling his hand with Coppers, or even causing the turn to go on forever by repeatedly revealing the Trader instead of gaining Coppers, even after the Silver pile is empty, so his hand will never reach 6 cards.  It probably also needs to say "...gains Coppers into his hand until he has 6 cards in hand or until the Copper pile is empty, whichever comes first."
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Just a Rube

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Re: Debasement
« Reply #4 on: July 03, 2013, 12:41:51 am »
+2

It's also idempotent (until the Coppers run out).
+1 for teaching me a new word.
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Warfreak2

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Re: Debasement
« Reply #5 on: July 03, 2013, 04:25:39 am »
+2

That "until" clause means that if a player has a Trader in his hand and Debasement is played on him, he can choose to move the entire Silver pile to his discard before filling his hand with Coppers,
Yes, that is true, a significant bug!
or even causing the turn to go on forever by repeatedly revealing the Trader instead of gaining Coppers,
Well, this is hardly a problem, it's already possible to make the game go on forever by just, you know, revealing Moat again and again until the cows come home. You can even reveal a Trader to gain a Silver instead of the Silver you would gain by revealing Trader, ad infinitum. DXV has said the game rules don't need to stop people from just wasting everybody's time, because you shouldn't do that anyway, and you don't have to play with people who do.
« Last Edit: July 03, 2013, 04:27:04 am by Warfreak2 »
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If the only engine on the board is Procession->Conspirator, I will play it.

Asper

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Re: Debasement
« Reply #6 on: July 03, 2013, 03:30:46 pm »
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Trying to change as few things as possible, a rewording:

Debasement
Action-Attack, 5$
+2$
Each other player reveals a treasure from his hand costing from $2 to $5, and puts it on his deck (or reveals a hand with no such cards). Then each other player gains a number of Coppers equal to 6 minus the number of cards in his hand, putting them in his hand.

A similar card by me:

Soup Kitchen
3$, Action - Attack
+1 Card
+1$
Each other player gains a Copper. If he has no more then 5 cards in hand, he puts it in his hand.

Edit: I don't claim either card is balanced.
« Last Edit: July 03, 2013, 04:21:27 pm by Asper »
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Diving Pikachu

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Re: Debasement
« Reply #7 on: July 05, 2013, 05:59:04 pm »
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Each other player gains a Copper. If he has no more then 5 cards in hand, he puts it in his hand.

That achieves more or less what I was going for. A bit of stackability, but it runs into none of the exploits that others have brought up. Brilliant!

Debasement ($5)
Action-Attack

+$2
Each other player reveals a treasure from his hand costing from $2 to $5, and puts it on his deck (or reveals a hand with no such cards). Then each other player gains a Copper. If he has no more then 5 cards in hand, he puts it in his hand.

***

Anyways, can anyone comment on the balance of this card?
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